Should I charge to go and Res people?

MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

You managed to try and make something of an argument despite still relying on disqualification.

Yes, a cleric's main role is to heal but you're not the only class capable of doing so (even if you're by far the most effective). It is one of the reasons you're in squad. It's not because you can heal that you're protected at all costs. If barb goes down then give me a good reason other than res i should protect the cleric? Maybe it would make sense for melees since they're more effective with heals behind them, but why would i sacrifice myself? Heals are no good to me if i'm dead and trust me when i say it would be way easier for me to escape. Just use bramble hood and summer sprint to get away and keep genie skills like holy path and ToP on reserve in case the boss gets close. Nine times out of ten i could escape party wipes with ease. Except that if i save the cleric i basically help not just myself but the whole squad. Why? because of res. I owe it to everyone else to stand between danger and the cleric even if it would be easy for me to escape. And you better believe i always do my best to spare the cleric having to go to town.

It's arrogance on your part that you think healing alone makes you important enough that we should all sacrifice ourselves for you. It doesn't. Res it's not just another skill like what other classes get. You can bet squad mechanics would be different if clerics weren't able to res. A veno might become much more a priority than the cleric if able to handle the tanking. Res is the only reason this isn't so. Not just your heals, a lot of us handle ourselves with pots through AoE because we understand BB has a heavy cost on you guys. I trust that if the cleric decides not to use it he has a good reason. In fact i usually trust the cleric with most tough calls and always back him up if the barb disagrees. It's cleric that should always have the last say as to what a squad as a whole can do, tanks only speak for themselves as to wether they can handle something or not.

Tanking only goes ahead when both cleric and tanker agree.

This is a leadership role, i feel sorry for people you squad with if you treat them with the same arrogance and disrespect you've demonstrated throughout this thread. Leadership means you put others ahead of yourself, if you can't do that you shouldn't be playing cleric in the first place. And yes, this also impacts your skilling choices. And when i spoke of benefits i meant you guys finding it much easier to set up squads or get invited for runs. I was talking about picking mats or loot. Your class is wanted or welcome by the overwhelming majority of people and you find it easier to access content.
That's a benefit only you and barbs get. Yes, it does come at a cost. Go qq about it somewhere else, you'll get no sympathy from me if you can't concede res is important to the rest of us. And the least we deserve is for you to take care of it if you'll be demanding that we guard your life more closely than ours.

*Sigh*
I didn't try and make an argument its a very valid point you have no experience as cleric so therefore you have no idea.

I'd like to see another class keep tank alive solo and the rest of the squad on bosses so you see that is the main reason we are in a squad and not because of revive.
One good reason? How about if the cleric isn't alive they cant heal your sorry **** or anyone else for that matter, if you all die you all lose xp, rather simple really.
Thanks for pointing out with your awesome common sense that heals are no good to you when your dead, i think they pretty much applies to every single person that has ever played PWI, so yeah thanks for that i really needed to be reminded.
Ofcourse its easier for you to escape you MANray_ right? The fountain of all knowledge and all the right answers. Its just as easy for you to get away as it is for a cleric plume shell + IH + Holy Path + ToP. Obviously 9/10 you will escape from the party wipes with ease right?
With the way you are talking tonight and the things you are saying im not sure you could ever save a cleric because your to damn slow mentally to realise what people are saying before you go off on your little rants. If the cleric is alive he can heal those who need to be healed its as simple as that and if it doesn't go well we can ress sure, however, that isn't our main role as people SHOULD NOT be dieing in the first place.
Stand between the danger? What are you a super hero?

Hmmm the fact that we heal you is enough to make us important because once again if we die we cant heal you, so in turn you will die and lose xp (except ofcourse you MANray_ because you escape 9/10 right?). Veno more of a priority than a cleric if we didnt have revive? Please say your being sarcastic, for one who would buff, seal, heal, bb, rb? Would every veno then have to be charmed and potted out to help cope with the sudden lack of clerics and their new found glory, cause come on no-one needs just a healing cleric do they, only one that can heal and revive are off any significance.
The cleric does what they think is best given the current situation and the damage the barb is taking per hit (we notice the difference between each single barb) so we don't really need an opinion and not from someone such as your lovely self. The only time a good cleric needs advice is when they are in a new place and they have no knowledge of damage that will be done and even then we will usually talk to the cleric or barb about it or someone who has experience with those classes in this instance.
See you have that wrong its not down to the cleric to decide as a whole even though i do and so do most clerics, we ourselves know what we are capable with and what we will need another cleric for or different squad choice.

I have never had any complaints about how i perform in a squad and i always get offers for FB/BH/TT/FF/Luna because im a reliable cleric that knows what im doing. Ya'see here is the thing, you have got it into your head that us clerics or myself is a selfish person when infact your wrong again, just to make a change. Im the cleric that will just go to town, no complaints and the revive the other cleric, ive lost the amount of times ive sacfaficed myself to save the squad in TT so no-one apart from myself dies, so once again please don't judge people by your own mind as its clearly flawed.

When it comes to TT we have a much higher cost rate and a more difficult role that's why we get 3rd pick after subber and tank not because we have glorious revive. We are wanted because we can heal it is that simple. i mean you have got to be listening by now right? Saying that i never had any trouble getting squads with my veno or barb so idk.

I wasn't QQ'ing i was saying some of the s*it us clerics go through on a daily basis, so once again if you had read what was before your eyes you would of understood this.
Sympathy? Its not me that needs sympathy and i ask for no sympathy because infact i do have a small amount of pitty for you, i mean it cant be easy being as awesome as you and looking around at all us idiots, who argue back even though you know we are wrong.

Revive is important for you guys but no me personally, i cannot revive myself.

If your an idiot, you screwed up, you didn't listen, you purposely killed members the you deserve absolutely nothing. I don't demand anything fool, i'm capable of looking after myself i don't need a babysitter watching me like some idiot.

Hunter_PT - Heavens Tear wrote: »

*Sigh*
I didn't try and make an argument its a very valid point you have no experience as cleric so therefore you have no idea.

I'd like to see another class keep tank alive solo and the rest of the squad on bosses so you see that is the main reason we are in a squad and not because of revive.
One good reason? How about if the cleric isn't alive they cant heal your sorry **** or anyone else for that matter, if you all die you all lose xp, rather simple really.
Thanks for pointing out with your awesome common sense that heals are no good to you when your dead, i think they pretty much applies to every single person that has ever played PWI, so yeah thanks for that i really needed to be reminded.
Ofcourse its easier for you to escape you MANray_ right? The fountain of all knowledge and all the right answers. Its just as easy for you to get away as it is for a cleric plume shell + IH + Holy Path + ToP. Obviously 9/10 you will escape from the party wipes with ease right?
With the way you are talking tonight and the things you are saying im not sure you could ever save a cleric because your to damn slow mentally to realise what people are saying before you go off on your little rants. If the cleric is alive he can heal those who need to be healed its as simple as that and if it doesn't go well we can ress sure, however, that isn't our main role as people SHOULD NOT be dieing in the first place.
Stand between the danger? What are you a super hero?

Hmmm the fact that we heal you is enough to make us important because once again if we die we cant heal you, so in turn you will die and lose xp (except ofcourse you MANray_ because you escape 9/10). Veno more of a priority than a cleric because if we didnt have revive? Please say your being sarcastic, for one who would buff, seal, heal, bb, rb? Would every veno then have to be charmed and potted out to help cope with the sudden lack of clerics and their new found glory, cause come on no-one needs just a healing cleric do they, only one that can heal and revive are off any significance.
The cleric does what they think is best given the current situation and the damage the barb is taking per hit (we notice the difference between each single barb) so we don't really need an opinion and not from someone such as your lovely self. The only time a good cleric needs advice is when they are in a new place and they have no knowledge of damage that will be done and even then we will usually talk to the cleric or barb about it or someone who has experience with those classes in this instance.
See you have that wrong its not down to the cleric to decide as a whole even though i do and so do most clerics, we ourselves know what we are capable with and what we will need another cleric for or different squad choice.

I have never had any complaints about how i perform in a squad and i always get offers for FB/BH/TT/FF/Luna because im a reliable cleric that knows what im doing. Ya'see here is the thing, you have got it into your head that us clerics or myself is a selfish person when infact your wrong again, just to make a change. Im the cleric that will just go to town, no complaints and the revive the other cleric, ive lost the amount of times ive sacfaficed myself to save the squad in TT so no-one apart from myself dies, so once again please don't judge people by your own mind as its clearly flawed.

When it comes to TT we have a much higher cost rate and a more difficult role that's why we get 3rd pick after subber and tank not because we have glorious revive. We are wanted because we can heal it is that simple. i mean you have got to be listening by now right? Saying that i never had any trouble getting squads with my veno or barb so idk.

I wasn't QQ'ing i was saying some of the s*it us clerics go through on a daily basis, so once again if you had read what was before your eyes you would of understood this.
Sympathy? Its not me that needs sympathy and i ask for no sympathy because infact i do have a small amount of pitty for you, i mean it cant be easy being as awesome as you and looking around at all us idiots, who argue back even though you know we are wrong.

Revive is important for you guys but no me personally, i cannot revive myself.

If your an idiot, you screwed up, you didn't listen, you purposely killed members the you deserve absolutely nothing. I don't demand anything fool, i'm capable of looking after myself i don't need a babysitter watching me like some idiot.

STFU dog. I've had it with your lame and sorry pathetic insults. You've never had complaints? Ofc you have, you're just too much of a ****** to read between the lines. You have trouble keeping tank and rest of squad alive at bosses? Yea, keeping BB up must be taxing. I have respect for clerics but you've shown yourself to be nothing but a heal monkey. Feel self assured? I dare you to come on my server you coward, try leveling up a cleric TELLING PEOPLE YOU DON'T CARE ABOUT LEVELING RES BEFORE YOU SQUAD WITH THEM. See where that gets you, you lying weasel. Ofc, we should all feel sorry for you. Oh, the endless abuse of people trying to get resses... To think you actually have to deal with other players in an MMO. You're so pathetic no doubt you cried whenever someone failed to thank you after you ressed them.

You don't demand anything? And what is this feeling of entitlement then? If you can't discuss things as a person, then you don't deserve to be treated as one. You probably only play cleric because you like being needed you pathetic ****. And FYI, I HAVE PLAYED CLERIC so stop making assumptions about people you know nothing about.

Just in case it isn't clear, I'M CALLING YOU A COWARD AND A LIAR. You stupid SOB, wanna jump to conclussions off what people write in forums? What do you think you're overcompensating for? That's right, you D...less FREAK.

MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

STFU dog. I've had it with your lame and sorry pathetic insults. You've never had complaints? Ofc you have, you're just too much of a ****** to read between the lines. You have trouble keeping tank and rest of squad alive at bosses? Yea, keeping BB up must be taxing. I have respect for clerics but you've shown yourself to be nothing but a heal monkey. Feel self assured? I dare you to come on my server you coward, try leveling up a cleric TELLING PEOPLE YOU DON'T CARE ABOUT LEVELING RES BEFORE YOU SQUAD WITH THEM. See where that gets you, you lying weasel. Ofc, we should all feel sorry for you. Oh, the endless abuse of people trying to get resses... To think you actually have to deal with other players in an MMO. You're so pathetic no doubt you cried whenever someone failed to thank you after you ressed them.

You don't demand anything? And what is this feeling of entitlement then? If you can't discuss things as a person, then you don't deserve to be treated as one. You probably only play cleric because you like being needed you pathetic ****. And FYI, I HAVE PLAYED CLERIC so stop making assumptions about people you know nothing about.

Just in case it isn't clear, I'M CALLING YOU A COWARD AND A LIAR. You stupid SOB, wanna jump to conclussions off what people write in forums? What do you think you're overcompensating for? That's right, you D...less FREAK.

Awww im sorry did i hit a nerve somewhere b:thanks.

Lmfao, thank you for that, really i mean it thank you.

Now i dont have to reply to you again because you have shown yourself to be a little kid.

Goodbye Manray_, make sure you have a bath before you go to school tomorrow and good luck with your exams, i wish you all the best b:cute.

Hunter_PT - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Awww im sorry did i hit a nerve somewhere b:thanks.

Lmfao, thank you for that, really i mean it thank you.

Now i dont have to reply to you again because you have shown yourself to be a little kid.

Goodbye Manray_, make sure you have a bath before you go to school tomorrow and good luck with your exams, i wish you all the best b:cute.

That's right, tuck tail and run you dog. You obviously can dish it but you can't take it. You coward...

Name calling is neither called for nor needed.

But I am still open to a good discussion.
Up till now it seems most of your arguments are dismissed by more then just me.

Come with a good one and I will review it.

I can't believe these thread already has these many reply and still active. b:laugh

Are we discuss about sincerity here ?
Are we discuss about cleric true purpose ? (to be slave ?)
Are we discuss about player behind the cleric ?

I was going to come back here and review posts.

However, it would appear that it's turning into a flame war.

So all I have to say is

inb4thelock unless you guys stop firing off names at one another as if that helps you prove some kind of a point at all.

I always feel bad when I ask my Cleric buddies to fly half way across the world to res me.
My solution: Buy them Tiger smilies b:laugh
Charging per res probably isnt the best idea, a lot of people wouldn't like it (me included). But if your going to ask for a clerics help all the time, be prepared to return the favour.

Where did all the flaming come from O.o

Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »

However, it would appear that it's turning into a flame war.

The flames are mainly 1 or 2 people.

The rest of us are talking about waffles and juice.

Zanryu - Dreamweaver wrote: »

We didn't start the flame war!

Oh by the way I finished my juice, may I have more Teddy?

+1. I lol'd.

For civility's sake, i'll restate my case.

i. On the thread's original subject i agreed that clerics are to free to charge for res. I also said i consider such attitude to be petty and cheap. This is a matter of personal opinion and therefore not a matter for debate.

ii. I also stated my view that clerics should keep their res at as high a level as they can reasonably manage. This because a) It seems to me would show courtesy and respect towards people risking themselves to keep clerics alive, and b) Revive is a unique skill whose importance determines to a great degree squad dynamics.

iii. Clerics are a highly specialized class that would find it difficult to fulfill the roles of the other classes. I don't consider them to be jack of all trades.

That's it, sweet and short and in rational terms.

Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »

these days xp is so abundant, as long as it's not a bad TT run usually it's easy to make back that xp. i mean what you get from BH and FCC is so huge that the xp hit from deaths is kind of irrelevant in the long run lol. i've died while grinding and ported many times, buy guardian scrolls or take the hit seriously.

although if there is a cleric in the area then i do ask for a ress occasionally.

^^ This.

I have died many times on all my toons and I will port back to town. The highest exp lost till date is 16% in a single day.

I do not ***** about it because it's my own fault for dying. If a cleric happens to ress me, I would offer something in return.

@all: You grind, you die, it's your own fault. If cleric is nice to ress you for nothing, give them at least a thank you.

If the cleric ask for something in return, it's also fair. Different people have different expectations. Just ress and tell yourself to be careful.

MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

iii. Clerics are a highly specialized class that would find it difficult to fulfill the roles of the other classes. I don't consider them to be jack of all trades.

You clearly know little to nothing about clerics. At least not good clerics.

VenosRop - Lost City wrote: »

MANray_ is like the general forum's Mystimonk.

You might be right.

Sylvani - Raging Tide wrote: »

You might be right.

VenosRop - Lost City wrote: »

lol @ thread. MANray_ is like the general forum's Mystimonk.

So, what is it your actually trying to say people b:question.