Nirvana has been tested and PWI found wanting

Escorian - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Originally Posted by Kantorek View Post
You can transfer Refine Level and Socket/Gems when you re-forge Nirvana gear without the use of Chienkun stones (which was previously impossible since we have never released them.)

You will still need the requisite Uncanny / Rapture stones.

-.-; i thought this was pretty simple here. you guys just need to red stuff and not assume you have to make the weapon first THEN you can reforge it and keep all the stats on it.

We did read stuff and not assume.

It allows individuals to upgrade their existing gear into new gear, while still maintaining their original attributes, refinement level, and sockets. Essentially through the use of this system, players can take their existing high level equipment, and transform it into Palace of Nirvana gear, and without losing any of the hard work they've already invested into their gear.

The problem here is they initially announced a system as doing one thing which everyone really wanted. Then made a last-minute change which removed that thing which everyone really wanted, but didn't explicitly say they removed it. Then when people asked if the thing they really wanted was still there, they instead answered about a similar but different thing. Thus creating and fostering the mis-impression that the system still did the thing everyone really wanted, when it no longer does.

To be fair to the GMs, they've probably been working closely with this system for months, so the nuances of the terminology they've created to describe it are familiar to them. But to the players, the system is entirely new and much of the terminology meaningless until they've had some experience with it. Hence why everyone has been asking for clarification, a simple yes/no answer to "Can I transform my Lunar/TT gear into Nirvana while retaining the refines and sockets?"

All of this grief and bad publicity could have been avoided if they'd just answered, "No. But Nirvana gear will retain its refines and sockets when it's reforged." Instead they chose to answer it as, "Nirvana gear will retain its..." which is answering a question which was never asked. All this smells to me of marketing and PR gone amok. Like the fiasco with USB hi-speed vs. USB full-speed (one is 12 Mbps, the other is 480 Mbos, guess which is which).

Saitada - Sanctuary wrote: »

It is a shame karma hasn't encouraged you to step out in front of a moving vehicle then. You are REAL quick to bad mouth others. Seems to me that is the pot calling the kettle black WaffleChan. It is fine for you to be nasty and disrespectful to others as long as they have a reputation right Waffle? Yeah that is exactly what I thought. When you actually have a moral high ground to stand on, you might have the right to say something, but as you don't, you just need to shut your yap. Your breath stinks and you're smelling up the place.

Where I come from we call people like you Hypocrites.

~Saitada

Its as if you wrote this to yourself.. you are scary.

rofl you have to be the biggest hypocrite on earth for writing this... I dont think i ever read a post by you that wasnt bad mouthing someone lol. b:chuckle

"You can transfer Refine Level and Socket/Gems when you re-forge >>>>NIRVANA<<<<< gear without the use of Chienkun stones"

This def doesn't say you keep any refines or gems in a lunar weapon or any other for that matter. Tells me that the first upgrade = you lose everything. Though i will say i don't care who you are or what u have done still sucks to lose that weapon sorry to hear that. I hate to say it but def make sure you read more carefully in the future lol. Specially with those explanations they always leave things lacking when should have been just yes and no like others have said.

Starting to think people don't want obsessive wierdo's to lose their precious internet +'s, I despair I really do >.>

tbh they should keep it like this it's much funnier.

GM's are not PWE Execs or programmers, please forgive them for not using the correct wording and not knowing everything about the game before a new feature is out. And when nirvana gear came out I'm pretty sure the word, reforge, was in the blog about it.

Malayshion - Lost City wrote: »

GM's are not PWE Execs or programmers, please forgive them for not using the correct wording and not knowing everything about the game before a new feature is out. And when nirvana gear came out I'm pretty sure the word, reforge, was in the blog about it.

The only thing is, there were many that understood that what happened to Wiz's weapon would happen because we read how the new system worked and took it for literally what it said.

Those who got impatient and overinterpretated what was clearly stated are QQing now. So who's at fault? The one who posted an update on what would happen or the one that read it and decided to add more meaning to it than there was?

He did a brave thing in "testing" out the new system, but really, some of us already knew it would happen before he went ahead and did it

LMAO .............. im so glad That idiot finally got what he deserved , such anoying freaks shouldn't even be allowed to play a multiplayer game ANYWHERE......... OH Yeah and keep supporting the game please... Thank you for your 3000 Dollars.. Donate more soon!!

Background or reputation are unimportant to the subject at hand...

That Wizzeled did ask around forums for a clarification does show, however, that he was unsure about the outcome of upgrading lunar gear to nirvana. Yes, it was certainly unfortunate that he had to loose a +12 refine, but a system that uses RMT does require responsability from it's users. That he gambled on an upgrade whose end result was uncertain is no one's fault but his own, and while i can certainly simpathyze with his possition, it would set a troublesome precedent for PWI were they to restitute his loss.

MMOs are largely based on the concept of resource management. Experimentation is also an important part of character development in a persistent world. Both ideas are closely intertwined, and as this example shows, such interactions may sometimes lead to disastrous results. This however is a part of the game. Being the first at something usually comes at a price. It would've certainly been far more cost effective to either a) thoroughly research the subject and it's nuances b) wait for more data to become available c) attempt experimentation on a less valuable object.

The problem with taking a chance is it doesn't always work out.

Solandri - Heavens Tear wrote: »

No. Logically, it tells you nothing about what happens when you do the first upgrade.

I ask, "Are your pants blue?"
You answer, "My shirt is blue."

That tells me nothing about the color of your pants. They could be blue, they could be some other color. For your answer to tell me anything about the question I asked, you would have to have answered:
"ONLY my shirt is blue."

Likewise, for the sentence you quoted to logically mean what you're interpreting it to mean, it would have had to have been written:
"You can transfer Refine Level and Socket/Gems when you re-forge ONLY NIRVANA gear without the use of Chienkun stones"

Was it reasonable to assume as you did, that if they didn't explicitly say recasted old gear would retain refines, then you would lose them? If you haven't been following the development of this system, yes. BUT, in the intro to the nirvana gear system posted by Spoons, they did explicitly state that old gear could be turned into Nirvana gear without losing refines. So for anyone who read that, it was reasonable to assume that aspect of the system was in place since none of the GM statements I've seen thus far can logically be interpreted to mean it had been removed.

Ok. Let's just say it this way.

Spoons said that refines would be able to be transfered with the use of stones. What on earth made you think that without these you can do it for free? It isn't stated anywhere.

You asked what color the pants were and they told you the color of the shirt. Yes it wasn't fair but don't go QQing that you lost by assuming the color of the pants when they didn't answer you yet either (although it was pretty clearly stated that reforging would allow this option, I don't get what made you think that any other process would allow that).

Susylu - Heavens Tear wrote: »

They never said you get to keep them either for free (without ck stones).

k but then they said they would not realease those stones and still didnt say weather u lost refines or not....

Downed - Harshlands;6637971Susylu - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Susylu - Heavens Tear wrote: »

They never said you get to keep them either for free (without ck stones).

+1 they never actally said you would loose refines....

And this is why this argument is pointless.

Downed - Harshlands wrote: »

k but then they said they would not realease those stones and still didnt say weather u lost refines or not....

Actually, they HAVE said that they have no intention to release the Chienkun stones.

Konariraiden - Heavens Tear wrote: »

And this is why this argument is pointless.



Actually, they HAVE said that they have no intention to release the Chienkun stones.

did you even read the post?

Downed - Harshlands wrote: »

did you even read the post?

Can you even POST on your main? There's no Fifth Amendment for the Intarwebs.

Downed - Harshlands wrote: »

i am posting on my main poster you did not read the post all you did was restate something i had allready said.b:bye

PWI Forum Rule #69: "All opinions and statments made in a 'SRS BSNS' debate thread from any character that is under Level 30 is null and void."

PWI Forum Rule #70: "Please laugh at the number 69 whenever it is posted. LOL69."

Downed - Harshlands wrote: »

are these rules offcial? no. if they are post a link to all of the rules. untill thenb:bye

They are unwritten, just like Britain's constitution. You saying that these rules are unofficial is equivalent to saying you hate Britain's form of government...and you don't hate Britain, do you...?

b:scorn