Sage Archer or Demon Archer?

niiba
niiba Posts: 2 Arc User
edited February 2010 in Archer
So, I kinda want to know which path is better for an archer...and also, which skills are basically useless to get, depending of the path you choose?
Post edited by niiba on
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  • RedsRose - Lost City
    RedsRose - Lost City Posts: 12,354 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    inb4devoted
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  • TigerLily - Lost City
    TigerLily - Lost City Posts: 1,209 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    LOL Devoted must be sleeping.

    Demon is you want usefull skills for pvp.

    Sage if you play on pve server and just wanna do instances + be somewhat usefull in TW. Or if you can afford rank8 to cover up the lack of crit and attack speed.

    Sage is pretty gimped in pvp compared to demon, and im saying this being sage myself since i kinda picked the wrong culti 1 year ago. Demon archer has like 12-14% more crit and 30% more attack speed from skills. Sage just have more chi and slightly higher base dmg - which isn't even noticeable. Its kinda how sage barbs are gimped in pk compared to hell barbs, only better for pulling cata really. Devs kinda failed with making the 2 cultivation options equally good with certain classes.
  • Ussichu - Sanctuary
    Ussichu - Sanctuary Posts: 429 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    go sage if you want to tank bosses using barrage.........


    otherwise go demon.
    Navarre was your everyday veno, until she learned her true form. Now she's fox walloping and purging over and over again.. all for a deep stinging, head hunting, wind pushing Assassin. Will there be inner harmony and myriad rainbows? But of course! Yuri&Lemon Find it on Fanfiction XD "Discovering Sanctuary" Chapter 2 is up ^_^
  • AngleSnipe - Heavens Tear
    AngleSnipe - Heavens Tear Posts: 178 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    You know that sage barrage overrides BB right? GG for that lol
  • Orionis - Raging Tide
    Orionis - Raging Tide Posts: 19 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    AngleSnipe - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    You know that sage barrage overrides BB right? GG for that lol

    BB? GG? What they meanz?
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  • Ussichu - Sanctuary
    Ussichu - Sanctuary Posts: 429 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    AngleSnipe - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    You know that sage barrage overrides BB right? GG for that lol

    I saw a sage archer tank krimson with barrage and IH so i lol when i saw it and flew away.
    Navarre was your everyday veno, until she learned her true form. Now she's fox walloping and purging over and over again.. all for a deep stinging, head hunting, wind pushing Assassin. Will there be inner harmony and myriad rainbows? But of course! Yuri&Lemon Find it on Fanfiction XD "Discovering Sanctuary" Chapter 2 is up ^_^
  • AngleSnipe - Heavens Tear
    AngleSnipe - Heavens Tear Posts: 178 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    BB = magical blue ball that saves your butt :)
    GG = what you say to people when they are owned :p

    Anyways, back to the topic of fail sage archers, crimson can be tanked by any class at 9x, and in all respect, barrage of arrows for crimson sounds like fail. Why not just DPS normal/spark combo, a lot less damage and a lot faster of a kill. Also when crimson starts moving at low hp...barrage tends to fail
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    The all purpose ideal tanking setup to maximize survivability is to have 2 clerics with one doing BB and one doing IH. With that you get max healing at 50% less damage. A sage archer has an option of getting max healing and 30% less damage with only one cleric by using barrage.

    Thats not too shabby but there is a problem with the 30% from barrage interfering with 50% from BB during a full zhen (like in RB). I'm not sure if the increased survivability in the first case makes up for the decreased survivability while in a BB.

    Demon barrage has no such tradeoff and is superior to lvl 10 barrage. In delta the power from demon barrage is obvious. With level 10 barrage I had trouble getting agro from a wiz's zhen even when the wiz had a lower refined weapon. With demon barrage my TT90+7 out damaged a Wiz's TT99+8.

    With similar weapons demon barrage also outdamages demon dragon's breath.

    AngleSnipe - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    GG = what you say to people when they are owned :p

    Not really. GG you say after a well-played match has been finished without regard to who won. One shotting a lvl 30 would be owning them but does not merit GG unless meant sarcastically. The way you used it didnt make much sense to me.
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  • Lusca - Sanctuary
    Lusca - Sanctuary Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    niiba wrote: »
    So, I kinda want to know which path is better for an archer...and also, which skills are basically useless to get, depending of the path you choose?

    here =o

    http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=263481
  • DrkLordZ - Sanctuary
    DrkLordZ - Sanctuary Posts: 297 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    go demon if you wanna be an awesome DD. go sage if you wanna be a fail tank.
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  • Shadowvzs - Lost City
    Shadowvzs - Lost City Posts: 877 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    DrkLordZ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    go demon if you wanna be an awesome DD. go sage if you wanna be a fail tank.

    rofl, maybe once try something be4 say bs.
  • anwynd
    anwynd Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    sage rules *runs out of the archer forum as fast as i can*b:laugh
    Collector of pet eggs, armor, weapons, fashion, and mountsb:chuckle
  • Lusca - Sanctuary
    Lusca - Sanctuary Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    anwynd wrote: »
    sage rules *runs out of the archer forum as fast as i can*b:laugh

    feel free to try and argue that point =P
    but you won't do a better job than devoteds argument that heaven fails =o
  • Shadowvzs - Lost City
    Shadowvzs - Lost City Posts: 877 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Lusca - Sanctuary wrote: »
    feel free to try and argue that point =P
    but you won't do a better job than devoteds argument that heaven fails =o

    ofc everything holy/right what 1 ppl said b:thanks

    (maybe this was the dev. team goal too lol)
  • Cavalieri - Sanctuary
    Cavalieri - Sanctuary Posts: 94 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Check ecatomb and other database sites to compare sage/demon skills and make your own choice, considering the way you play your archer, instead of just going after the people that have that have the biggest mouth or that post the mot on these forums.
    If you've been bad, Lord I bet you have
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    You'd better close your eyes and bow your head
    And wait for the ricochet.
  • Shadowvzs - Lost City
    Shadowvzs - Lost City Posts: 877 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Cyanea - Lost City wrote: »
    Personally, I would call sages snipers, and I would not call them tanks:

    in this part i agree, this is why a bit heaven forced to skill useage instead nromal hit. non sense heaven is sucks because dont got +10% crit with stun/sharp and faster attack speed with luck playing or for 3rd spark.

    this lol another path thing u can see in any class thread, but mainly in wizz/archer threads have more fight with each other side.
  • gjkdjk
    gjkdjk Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    b:laughi think they are both good
  • Ursa - Dreamweaver
    Ursa - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,634 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    go demon if u want pure dmg.
    go sage if u want some survivability.

    Kinda' same for all classes. Prolly wizz at 99+ with all skills will have Sage doing more dmg than demon, but it's debatable.

    BTW, one archer in my guild has 10k HP unbuffed. With +11 lunar fists he's soloing TT 2-x and 3-x.
    A run for Belial takes about 200k from his charm. He's a sage archer. He's building chi so fast that basically he can spark (25% less dmg 700% weapon dmg - lol, lunar fists+11 then another 700% on top and 40% crit rate at 5hits/sec)well before the previous spark effect is off. I wanna see a demon archer do that.
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  • Buttworm - Dreamweaver
    Buttworm - Dreamweaver Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Well, sure that's fun, but not everyone can waste thousands of real $$$ on a pixel char, that after a while will be thrown away in server trash can and forgotten forever.
    So then another pixel dude will appear, only this time he will choose another culti and he will do fine as well with everything +10/+12.
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Ursa - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    go demon if u want pure dmg.
    go sage if u want some survivability.

    Kinda' same for all classes. Prolly wizz at 99+ with all skills will have Sage doing more dmg than demon, but it's debatable.

    BTW, one archer in my guild has 10k HP unbuffed. With +11 lunar fists he's soloing TT 2-x and 3-x.
    A run for Belial takes about 200k from his charm. He's a sage archer. He's building chi so fast that basically he can spark (25% less dmg 700% weapon dmg - lol, lunar fists+11 then another 700% on top and 40% crit rate at 5hits/sec)well before the previous spark effect is off. I wanna see a demon archer do that.

    girl that from his -interval gear. a demon can pull off 5 hits/s just as well with the same gear. it's got nothing to do with the path, and sage spark is not 700% damage, its 500% like demon. i can say that sage has advantages over demon, i can say Chezedude (if i spelled it right) is a good archer, but don't imply ignorant **** like hes pulling off 5hits/s and has 10k hp unbuffed cuz hes sage

    if anything demon spark gives an attack speed boost so its easier to achieve 5hit/s as a demon.
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  • Ursa - Dreamweaver
    Ursa - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,634 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »
    girl that from his -interval gear. a demon can pull off 5 hits/s just as well with the same gear. it's got nothing to do with the path, and sage spark is not 700% damage, its 500% like demon. i can say that sage has advantages over demon, i can say Chezedude (if i spelled it right) is a good archer, but don't imply ignorant **** like hes pulling off 5hits/s and has 10k hp unbuffed cuz hes sage

    if anything demon spark gives an attack speed boost so its easier to achieve 5hit/s as a demon.

    ok , now I was polite and u spread ****.

    For archers true, the demon/sage spark give 500% of weapon dmg.My bag here.
    How he got his interval I don't care, but what makes him really good and doing what he does is the 25% damage reduction for those 15 seconds. That's more profitable when playing tank with fists than any benefit a demon spark can give you. When u can be constantly sparked for the whole extent of the fight, that's what makes **** happen. And the max speed in the game is 5. So if the Sage has a 5 or close to 5, a demon increase in speed is just useless.
    and no I did not say that he' has 10k HP because he's sage, please quote me on that before posting something that makes you look like a ignorant that reads a text in diagonal and then posts a fail reply.
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  • Elenacostel - Heavens Tear
    Elenacostel - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,822 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Ursa - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    He's a sage archer. He's building chi so fast that basically he can spark...well before the previous spark effect is off. I wanna see a demon archer do that.

    Wait, you want to see a demon build chi so fast that he can spark well before the previous spark effect is off? That should be possible and independent of the demon / sage cultivation, as the gear has 5 attacks / sec from stacked interval.

    Note: I only snipped out the part in parentheses within your post.
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Really if you have obscene gear does it really matter how many charm ticks you are hitting?

    A demon archer doesnt need as much gear to do a constant 5attacks / sec sparked so could swap out TT99 ornaments or maybe event cape for added defense from Wings of Cloudcharger / cube neck / warsong belt. Since we're talking obscene refines these higher grade equips could make a significant difference in tanking abilitiy.

    Do we really need to justify cultivation by being able to tank TT bosses?
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  • Ursa - Dreamweaver
    Ursa - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,634 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    no, all I want to say is that due to the 25% incoming dmg reduction of the sage spark, it makes tanking a much easier job when u have enough speed to build the chi needed for 3 sparks before the previous spark effect wears off.
    I didn't say a demon can't hit faster, I said this archer can hit fast enough to build the amount of chi needed to be non-stop sparked while tanking.
    Dmg from boss being reduced with 25% is like half of BB. That's why what he does is possible and much more easy with a Sage culti than a Demon.
    I don't understand what's not clear here...
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  • Elenacostel - Heavens Tear
    Elenacostel - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,822 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    It is a miscommunication. If you read the following three sentences standalone:
    He's a sage archer. He's building chi so fast that basically he can spark...well before the previous spark effect is off. I wanna see a demon archer do that.

    It sounds like you are talking about attack speed, not the damage reduction. That is why everyone is commenting on it.
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Ursa - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    no, all I want to say is that due to the 25% incoming dmg reduction of the sage spark, it makes tanking a much easier job when u have enough speed to build the chi needed for 3 sparks before the previous spark effect wears off.
    I didn't say a demon can't hit faster, I said this archer can hit fast enough to build the amount of chi needed to be non-stop sparked while tanking.
    Dmg from boss being reduced with 25% is like half of BB. That's why what he does is possible and much more easy with a Sage culti than a Demon.
    I don't understand what's not clear here...

    What he does is not possible because of the culti but because of his amazing gear. It would not be possible for any sage archer on my server to do that exceptional feat so why cite that as a selling point for going sage? Keeping a constant demon spark going is much easier than a constant sage spark.
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  • Devoted - Lost City
    Devoted - Lost City Posts: 3,634 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Cavalieri - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Check ecatomb and other database sites to compare sage/demon skills and make your own choice, considering the way you play your archer, instead of just going after the people that have that have the biggest mouth or that post the mot on these forums.

    There is a difference between he who shouts the loudest and he who speaks the most truth. If you think I am wrong feel free to post a counter-point to any of my points in my thread. Just make sure to read the 30 pages so you don't bring up an argument that has already been dismissed. I highly doubt people are telling other people to go demon because there is an obnoxiously written article on the archer forums saying demon is win so it must be true. I'd rather think that people recommend demon due to the points I brought up, the points even sage archers bring up saying demon is better and the points from adamant sage archers that were proven inadequate. Hell, that article is outdated, with event packs demon is even more obvious of a choice.

    @shadowsvzasdasd


    LOL at you thinking heaven must be good or why would the dev's create such an imbalance. Are you playing the same game I am? There is no balance in this game and it's blatantly obvious. At some points I can't even call it a game. More like an online store with a cool arcade.


    @ursa Who cares if a cash shopper can cash shop 5 atk speed per second and 10k hp. Just the fact he wears lunar claws and bought rank8 on a pve server is more than enough information to deduce chezedude or what ever his name is wizzeled junior.


    EVERYONE GO SAGE, YOU CAN HEIRO TANK BELAIL AND KILL IT IN 6 MINUTES. WHO CARES ABOUT CLERICS, WHO CARES ABOUT WEREBEASTS. WHO CARES ABOUT ANYTHING IN THIS GAME BESIDES TANKING BELAIL WITH A HEIRO. YOU DO THIS, YOU ARE GOD. YOU ARE ENDGAME.

    btw no archer should ever have 5 attack speed so demon will always beat sages spark in pve because blue ball overwrites it anyways.






    /longday
  • Shadowvzs - Lost City
    Shadowvzs - Lost City Posts: 877 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Maybe u have right and this game have alot class who beat every others easily and never die.

    in pve the red ball overwrite the hell spark too.

    ok its maybe right sage get more profit from higher ++ weapon but few skill what totally luck depend dont do from hell stronger in every situation in pw.
  • Buttworm - Dreamweaver
    Buttworm - Dreamweaver Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    All these Demon/Sage/Chi/Tank/Kite and same kind of arguements are pointless.
    There are 7 classes in that game:
    Barbarian, Venomancer, Archer, Cleric, Wizzard, Blademaster and a Heavy Cash.
    Last one will always do much better, no matter what culti he is and how fast he can build chi.
    Sorry, edited - 9 classes, including Tideborns.
  • KedgeSniper - Lost City
    KedgeSniper - Lost City Posts: 733 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Demon will be better IF you get all your skills.

    Demon skills to look for:

    Quickshots
    Stuning arrow
    Aim Low
    Sharptooth
    Metal atacks
    Passive skills
    Blazing arrow
    Take aim
    Barrage
    Wings of protection
    Wingspan
    winged pledge


    ^ Any other skill is not required to get to 11.
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