Petition to remove Defense Charms from the game

limonazza said:

mystic is **** slow

Do you even mystic bro?

I'd say the new charms are balanced by the new charm debuff passive.
Class balance is a much bigger issue at the moment. There is no real way to compete against new classes with a class from 2008.​​

dingo488 said:

A lot of people think sitting back and not dying a lot makes them good, but in reality they are wasting 90% of the class' potential by not using their tank stats to shield their allies.

QTF
not dying a lot =/= using class full potential and being a good team player

asterelle said:

I'd say the new charms are balanced by the new charm debuff passive.

Class balance is a much bigger issue at the moment. There is no real way to compete against new classes with a class from 2008.​​

Also true

-Having played a seeker for 4yrs since the class came out I had to settle this, this part is 100% wrong. While its true seekers can be tanky at endgame shards (full JSOD sorry Vit stone seekers are completely Err????? Considering they instant die from maybe 1 or 2 zerk crit hahahah) Anyways, seekers only only anti stun is in sage and it last what 4 seconds thats really a short window of oppertunity as opposed to other physical classes with anti-stun kinda smack in the face when SB have a longer one hahah. Anyways a seeker whos always in the front melee is subject to easily lock down by any control class once the rest of the DDs focus on that seeker its completely over while you spared your allies you also became a scapegoat because no matter how tanky you are jsod,+12, vit stone ect as a seeker once that pure procs you're done via control skills leaving you defenseless and DD atks this can happen in a instant assuming you are facing good opponents. Idk about you guys but venos love to insta purge my **** when they see me truck on the battlefield so why just run in the middle just simply die almost instantly for nothing.

-I take advantage of my ranged ability because it allows me to do decent damage while also being effective in compared to running in getting perm stun and dying being of no use or another issue the cleric must deal with why make thier skills range in the first place if the intended purpose wasnt for range and melee applicability. Any seeker full jsod, vit stone, +12 w.e who I have watched full melee bms,sins,DB, hell barbs (full str) were insta murdered because they stood there and let thier enemy control them with almost no defenses outside genie/pots lol
- Also people QQing about blade affinity magic us a speed related class news flash its 6 seconds get over it at most in that window you will cast 2 or 3 long channel skills maybe 4 if your really fast but no more which in all honesty with the ratio of skills and types doesn't add completely up for some serious stuff for ex: Blade Affinity + Ion spike + Battosai(Glowblade) + Heart Seeker, 3 Commonly used magic skills but only 1 of them will do full damage through def charm if you try that combo in any order assuming you arent ganking that target not so OP as people seem to be claiming almost the same would fall under the phy skills but you might get 2 full damage with phy skills but at this point in game nobody worth a damn in pvp or tw gets 2 shotted. (not counting edge blur because thats 2 sparks)

-So many Tank stats? You mean 1 or are you also refering to the 5 def lvl we can give to anyone still thats 2 lmfao last I check thats not that big a deal lol....

I think the definition of "slow" and "fast" vary so much here .-.

Defense charms always existed, it's just now that everyone is able to get them more easily.
Anyways, I vote keep all aspects of the game....​​

38 sins voted no.

I thought this thread was about how fast you can channel skills to proc a defense charm, not if those skills can kill your target. Youve just said mystic has 1 sec cast skill, but it cant kill anyone with those skills, it has to use long channel skills.

But then you say seeker is a dps class with short cast skills. But mystic and seeker have very similar skill set up. Natures vengeance has similar casting time to the three single target spammable seeker skills, rapid growth speeds up channel (like blade affinity, though yes not as effective) and they have a few long channel skills that are necessary to really kill a target (ion spike, gemini slash, absorb soul). But you are saying one is slow cast class and one is quick cast.

To me it sounds more a matter of learning the class. Dont try to proc a def charm by going in with an absorb soul if you can do it by a few good 1 second natures vengeances. Even wizard, notoriously the slowest caster in the game, will be able to proc def charms with a few undines or a genie.

limonazza wrote: »

you know right that the auto-def charm activation is % hp based

so only if you set the first one @ 99% and the second one at 98% hp you will have a scenario like that

but who cleverly does that? none

you'd rather set first charm 90% second charm 70% hp so you prevent mere debuffs skills to pop all of your charms...

but yea its more a metter of learning the class, proc def charms with genie right...

Right, it is percent based. But not knowing at what percent your opponent has their defense charms set at is a challenge whether you are a toon who casts quick or slow. Basically, it comes down to skill and observation, no matter what class you roll.

In summary it isn't as unbalanced as it seems. People don't like them because they are a new angle that people aren't used to and they go "EW, CHANGE. GET IT OFF."​​

limonazza wrote: »

it is unbalanced since it messes up arcane classes, but i can get your bias you are a seeker np

Do you realise removing charms will mess them up even more, since they also will be unprotected? Removing is the easiest solution, but not always the best one.​​

limonazza wrote: »

it is unbalanced since it messed up arcane classes, but i can get your bias you are a seeker np

Well. Okay, then if you don't want to read... But just for fun so I can see:


Comparing Level 10 skills:

Absorb Soul:
Cast: 0.8
Channel 5.0
Total time: 5.8

NV
Cast: 1.0
Channel 1.0
Total Time: 2.0

Battousai
Cast: 1.5
Channel: 0.2
Total Time: 1.7

Gemini Slash:
Cast: 2.0
Channel: 3.3
Total Time: 5.3

So... 0.8 second benefit to seeker. and let's not mention that there's a 1 second all in insa full heal on the magic class. Yep. they are really hurting.

Honestly think you should rethink which kind of bias you're accusing me of. I play many toons, most often also a venomancer which is one of the slowest casting classes with no channel skill.
There are talks of 2 hit skills being what makes this broken (DB and sin) IIRC Seeker has one double hit skill. It's called vortex and it's a big shiney immobile blender that screams INTERRUPT ME that you can just walk out of...
​​

Absorb Soul is **** at high gear levels. It is almost never worth the casting time unless comboed with other skills (Storm Dance lucky proc, Demon spark+rapid growth). If mystics on your server stand around casting AS no wonder you think they're slow.

Mystic speed comes primarily from Nature's Vengeance but also using it in conjunction with the other attack skills (Swirling Mist, Gale Force, etc.).

Also being a caster a mystic will typically have a better channeling speed than a seeker. So just comparing skill numbers doesn't give you the whole picture.