Petition to remove Defense Charms from the game

limonazza
limonazza Posts: 332 Arc User
edited October 2015 in General Discussion
Ok i am opening this thread to promote the removal of a certain game breaking feature that severely affects PVP, and will be even gamebreaking when everyone will have their Riptide passives done

With the new HP passives and charm debuff passives, we faced a severe and in my opinion unnecessary nerf to DPH,

The overall tankiness of players increased while we didnt have yet a proportional increase in damage dealt, instead top DDs spike damage got nerfed aswell thanks to duskblade buffs.

Some classes, mainly Arcane classes, rely a lot (if not just) on DPH, this charms make them incapable of dealing consistent damage to any target even if they heavily overgear it, which is absolute nonsense

What i am asking to PWI devs is to remove from the game:

http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/47234 Lost Incantation Amulet
http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/47234 Lost Giant's Amulet
http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/12387 Superior Charm of Defense
http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/12390 Superior Mystic Armor Charm

Petition to remove Defense Charms from the game 84 votes

Please remove Defense Charms from the game
14%
hockey57demonakirahbacyraxzodiusufopdingo488commisso202kashatityghbfrostdienerlimonazzajosemaria12 12 votes
Leave defense charms as they are
63%
clokey#3498bloodedone87fpld5e1fingerevan45345cvb604nbreakingtricksiesylenthunderballenatomrmusiheerohex#3018eirghancapnkastralwalkchazkrazzzzazentfamilyshimarralagunal8 53 votes
Make a level requirement for defense charms lvl 0-80, like for other defense charms
1%
manbaby 1 vote
Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms
13%
aphroditablazerboyjsxshadowcharykittyempressatek1nigxeloquenzparise09darkdementerryumeallmenothingbu 11 votes
Doesnt matter i am an archer
8%
shade13kaiserzoltarbizzahtirus21lapute232dayk0udarkonome 7 votes
«134

Comments

  • dblazen1
    dblazen1 Posts: 1,177 Arc User
    *something about china and needing to send the petition to them and it won't happen anyway*

    To be honest, it's debatable if that "nerf" was needed or not, because PvP was a oneshot fest.​​
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  • prancing
    prancing Posts: 143 Arc User
    How about just remove the free ones we get from the invite a friend. Those block 2 shots vs the ones we had before only blocked one. However these charms to help promote team play and not solo play.
    m5arXCN.png
  • chary
    chary Posts: 850 Arc User
    Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms
    Just remove the two tick ones from Invite a Friend. p; I don't see the normal ones as that game-breaking at all.
  • kyoske
    kyoske Posts: 163 Arc User
    nerf SB and DB
  • blazerboy
    blazerboy Posts: 1,673 Arc User
    Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms
    Personally I think mainly classes w.o insane casting speed or fast CD spamable skills (hahaha Barbs and Sins DB) really were injured by this but at the same time if we remove the x2 proc Sins and DB especially DB eat you alive more then they already do well played pwi well played
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  • mulier
    mulier Posts: 305 Arc User
    fight a barb w arcane without charms .... terk crit dead
  • eirghan
    eirghan Posts: 1,912 Arc User
    Leave defense charms as they are
    Except that in addition to bolsters for defense (HP passive) we also saw two nerfs to it (the introduction of charm tick passive and penetration stats).

    Once HP passive reaches end game so will everyone's charm tick passive and eventually, higher level penetration stats on star charts. It's basically impossible to survive without defense charms mitigating damage for a portion of the time you are attacked. As Asterelle mentioned, you can almost wait out an entire IG and your charm still will not tick due to the charm tick passive.

    Defense charms are probably going to be somewhat necessary for open world PVP and TW. Anyway, nothing is finished yet, no one has even close to "end game" star charts (will they ever?), very few have level 5 charm tick passive, no one has completed both passives... And who knows, maybe there will be level ten of those passives as well.
    ​​
  • darkonome
    darkonome Posts: 253 Arc User
    Doesnt matter i am an archer
    I am an Archer, and I approve of these charms. :#
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  • limonazza
    limonazza Posts: 332 Arc User
    Please remove Defense Charms from the game
    eirghan wrote: »
    Except that in addition to bolsters for defense (HP passive) we also saw two nerfs to it (the introduction of charm tick passive and penetration stats).

    Once HP passive reaches end game so will everyone's charm tick passive and eventually, higher level penetration stats on star charts. It's basically impossible to survive without defense charms mitigating damage for a portion of the time you are attacked. As Asterelle mentioned, you can almost wait out an entire IG and your charm still will not tick due to the charm tick passive.

    Defense charms are probably going to be somewhat necessary for open world PVP and TW. Anyway, nothing is finished yet, no one has even close to "end game" star charts (will they ever?), very few have level 5 charm tick passive, no one has completed both passives... And who knows, maybe there will be level ten of those passives as well.

    no? and slow channelling classes won't really have any benefit from the charm debuff passive, and 50k hp seekers do really need def charms that reduce elemental damage down to 2-3ks per hit?​​
  • blazerboy
    blazerboy Posts: 1,673 Arc User
    edited October 2015
    Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms
    limonazza said:



    eirghan wrote: »

    Except that in addition to bolsters for defense (HP passive) we also saw two nerfs to it (the introduction of charm tick passive and penetration stats).



    Once HP passive reaches end game so will everyone's charm tick passive and eventually, higher level penetration stats on star charts. It's basically impossible to survive without defense charms mitigating damage for a portion of the time you are attacked. As Asterelle mentioned, you can almost wait out an entire IG and your charm still will not tick due to the charm tick passive.



    Defense charms are probably going to be somewhat necessary for open world PVP and TW. Anyway, nothing is finished yet, no one has even close to "end game" star charts (will they ever?), very few have level 5 charm tick passive, no one has completed both passives... And who knows, maybe there will be level ten of those passives as well.


    no? and slow channelling classes won't really have any benefit from the charm debuff passive, and 50k hp seekers do really need def charms that reduce elemental damage down to 2-3ks per hit?​​



    Uhm bro 50k hp seekers? Most Ive seen a seeker who mattered (jsod) was like 42k 50k maybe with vit stone of which I say gooday to to you sir your seeker is pretty much fake barbs gg. Seriously though seekers can easily be controlled via stunlock/paralyze not a viable class to really birng in the mix lol

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  • dingo488
    dingo488 Posts: 936 Arc User
    Please remove Defense Charms from the game
    I would want them to be removed...
    Just like I want:

    hp/mp charms to be removed;
    hp/mp potions to be removed;
    mp regen to be a significant stat (basically u cant random spam all ur skill but have to manage ur mana);
    balance to damage and especially healing.

    and then maybe we'd have a game where u actually have to be a skilled player, where frontline is frontline, backline is backline and everyone that doesnt play by those rules just gets destroyed.


    BUT, thats never gonna happen now is it ^,^ So I think its best to just keep stuff the way it is, and we can all have our casual fun, you cant just simply jump into a discussion about PvP balance by starting on such a specialized topic, but ull have to approach the broad view first.

    That said this is also not the right place for such a discussion.

    A see seekers that think they need the def charms, while seekers are probably the class most countered by these def charms (along with wizards) due to their slow attack rates and reliance on the damage of a single attack.

    -----------------------------------------

    Free tip for people that really want them to be gone and that are sad that they are still in game. When something is OP, try to counter it. Genie skills like Whirlwind knock off a charm proc, while the skill itself doesnt cost much energy to use. Its an effective way to work around def charms



  • bloodedone87
    bloodedone87 Posts: 1,883 Arc User
    Leave defense charms as they are
    Let me correct the title of this thread:
    Petition to remove Defense Charms from game. Charms that only matters in PVP cause in PVE you can survive without them. Therefor charms that only 10% of pwi players care about cause thats your PvP atm in PWI.
    BTW this is just a poll not a petition. Petition is something else.
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  • lagunal8
    lagunal8 Posts: 48 Arc User
    Leave defense charms as they are
    defense charms are a life saver >.> removing it is stupid as saying lets remove token HP/MP food. Cause years ago there wasnt any to begin with anyways​​
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  • chary
    chary Posts: 850 Arc User
    Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms

    Let me correct the title of this thread:
    Petition to remove Defense Charms from game. Charms that only matters in PVP cause in PVE you can survive without them. Therefor charms that only 10% of pwi players care about cause thats your PvP atm in PWI.
    BTW this is just a poll not a petition. Petition is something else.

    Def charms are actually useful in pve. I used to use them on my cleric with Emperor in 3-3 before I just got tanky enough to faceroll it. I imagine lower geared people would probably find them the most useful atm in surviving toad's AOE in fsp. But ofc, most probably won't use them period.
  • limonazza
    limonazza Posts: 332 Arc User
    Please remove Defense Charms from the game
    defense charms fill the gap between non endgame and endgame players, make anyone tanky AF against certain classes
    and give a huge advantage on DPS classes against non-DPS ones

    it's not right that with this charms you hit the same inconsistent damage upon a g16 as well as on a r9r3 josd​​
  • jabq
    jabq Posts: 821 Arc User
    dingo488 wrote: »
    mp regen to be a significant stat (basically u cant random spam all ur skill but have to manage ur mana);
    balance to damage and especially healing.

    and then maybe we'd have a game where u actually have to be a skilled player, where frontline is frontline, backline is backline and everyone that doesnt play by those rules just gets destroyed.

    I like the mp regen idea, it will shift the balance back towards aps slightly in pvp. In d2 i never used pots, just waited on mp to recover.

    In pve charms do help though.​​
  • razzzza
    razzzza Posts: 456 Arc User
    edited October 2015
    Leave defense charms as they are
    This will not happen anyway. i like those things and just because you dont like them they should be removed? i think after everyone has the charm cd passive on max thee will play a more important role because charms will tick not as often and you need some kind of defensive to not exlode at nuke hits later on.​​
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  • limonazza
    limonazza Posts: 332 Arc User
    Please remove Defense Charms from the game
    razzzza wrote: »
    This will not happen anyway. i like those things and just because you dont like them they should be removed? i think after everyone has the charm cd passive on max thee will play a more important role because charms will tick not as often and you need some kind of defensive to not exlode at nuke hits later on.

    some classes do not have fast channelling+cast skills enough to both outdamage def charms + hp charm sustain

    hp charm was nerfed BUT, we received the HP passives that basically canceled that nerf

    at least double tick def charms need a nerf

    my class for example needs in average 3 seconds to land a skill which means it will take a whole 12 seconds for me to tick your def charms, def charms has like what, 10 seconds cooldown?

    u have a def charm equipped

    second 0: first charm tick, second charm activates, 10 secs charm cooldown starts, damage reduced

    second 3: second tick of first charm, 7 secs on charm cooldown, damage reduced

    second 6: first tick of second charm, 4 secs on charm cooldown, damage reduced

    second 9: second tick of second charm, 1 secs on charm cooldown, damage reduced

    second 12: -2 secs on charm cooldown, refreshes, first tick of third charm, damage reduced

    anything that has chann+cast higher than 2,5 - 3 secs is theorically uncapable of bypassing defense charms

    not game breaking?

    but well i guess this thread is full of DPS players like seekers or sins f.e. that they will simply tick all your def charms in 2 seconds with a cursed jail, 2 life hunters or 1 elimination while they can sit comfortably on their unnecessary tankiness... like if tidal isn't enough

    this thing needs to be rebalanced, because it's game breaking, like if game isn't broken enough already

    at least increase the defense charms cooldown​​
  • eirghan
    eirghan Posts: 1,912 Arc User
    Leave defense charms as they are
    Seeker is dps? Actually most common build is dph.
  • wingdeath6
    wingdeath6 Posts: 61 Arc User
    Leave defense charms as they are
    ~breaks out my tiny red violin for this thread~ This wont happen your thread was closed previously because its a pipe dream sorry
  • koudelkamorgan
    koudelkamorgan Posts: 140 Arc User
    Personally I'd be fine with removing ALL charms (hp/mp/attack/def), spirit coins, and apoth from the game. Then I'd sit back and watch everything burn down while I go on unphased. I'd say remove genies too but that is substantially more complicated to cut out, and I like my holy path/ad/cloud eruption.
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  • limonazza
    limonazza Posts: 332 Arc User
    edited October 2015
    Please remove Defense Charms from the game
    eirghan wrote: »
    Seeker is dps? Actually most common build is dph.

    are there even diff builds for seeker? egg-2.gif

    how can you consider seeker a DPH class when you have most of the skills with chann + cast times of 1 second AND you have blade affinity? egg-10.gif you know wizard's equivalent of blade aff costs 2 sparks? #balance

    wind blade gravel blade wind blade glowing blade and in 4 seconds you popped enemy def charms, egg-33.gif
    still not like sins that do that in 2 seconds, but yet better than AA classes egg-32.gif

    i still keep my point at least the def charm cooldown needs to be longer...

    and i see Private Server developers are able to modify things like genie skills, war avatar card stats, class skills, they are able to modify instances and items

    i really don't get why PWI devs are not able to do this... egg-44.gif

    it's just stupid egg-6.gif​​
  • doods00
    doods00 Posts: 106 Arc User
    edited October 2015
    limonazza said:



    eirghan wrote: »

    Seeker is dps? Actually most common build is dph.

    and i see Private Server developers are able to modify things like genie skills, war avatar card stats, class skills, they are able to modify instances and items



    i really don't get why PWI devs are not able to do this... egg-44.gif



    it's just stupid egg-6.gif​​

    __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________




    They can , they aren't allowed too, literally. Everything they are allowed comes from china. Not sure if they translate it here or they get a rough translation and then do some clean up. there was more independence in the past with there being more differences but they have half attempted to line them up over the years.
  • shade13
    shade13 Posts: 633 Arc User
    edited October 2015
    Doesnt matter i am an archer
    doods00 wrote: »
    They can , they aren't allowed too, literally. Everything they are allowed comes from china. Not sure if they translate it here or they get a rough translation and then do some clean up. there was more independence in the past with there being more differences but they have half attempted to line them up over the years.

    Even if they were allowed to, it's a big responsibility to change such things because they can affect balance in a way devs didn't forsee. And the farther you go the harder to fix it without taking options away. And they are always reluctant to take something away. Instead they tend to implement numerous fixes to let ppl keep what they obtained, but make it useless in time.
    ​​
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  • dingo488
    dingo488 Posts: 936 Arc User
    edited October 2015
    Please remove Defense Charms from the game
    People are just randomly throwing arguments at eachother that dont even relate to eachother, and it feels to me people have a very poor understanding what Def Charms do in the bigger picture. Saying stuff like ''Defense charms are probably going to be somewhat necessary for open world PVP and TW' as a seeker and ''defense charms are a life saver'' are very much invalid arguments as your opponent has this ''live saver'' aswell. To explain what Defense Charms really do, there are 2 situations we need to take into account. 1v1 and large scale PvP.

    ----------------------------------------

    As its easiest to start with the 1v1 scenario Ill start there. Ill give classes +1 point for any positive factor and -1 point for anything negative. As defense charm ticks are completely based on time (cooldown) their effectiveness is dependant entirely on who you are fighting. Its all about how many of your hits (%) get cut by the defense charm which is tied to the interval between your hits.

    Classes that have a short interval between hits are: Archers/Assassin/Duskblade ( + 1 )
    Classes that have a long interval between hits are: Wizard/Seeker/Cleric ( - 1 )

    The other classes are kinda in the middle

    Now another factor is how reliant are these classes on the damage of a single skill or combo with a high cooldown. And need this combo to actively apply kill pressure.

    Classes that are highly reliant on this: Wizard/Seeker/Blademaster ( - 1 )
    Classes that dont depend on this at all: Archers/Assassin ( + 1 )

    The other classes are kinda in the middle

    As you can see its very similar to the previous category, but that makes sense due to balancing classes -> DPS vs DPH

    Now another factor is the way to block charm usage thru stuns/paralysis. Since this can basically lock the opponent out of using their charms completely, no casters will be listed here since I feel purify proc helps this exact point to your own benefit.

    Classes that have a lot of CC to do this: Assassins/Blademaster/Barbarian/Duskblade ( + 1 )
    Classes that have next to no CC: Seeker/Archer ( - 1 )


    ----------------------------------

    I feel these are the 3 main factors that come into play when it comes down to a 1v1 scenario. Most magic classes are left out due to the nature of our magic classes, most our magic classes are DPS classes tho their DPS isnt fast enough to stand out amongst all the classes in the game. Adding the scores paints a pretty good picture on how Defense Charms affect classes in a 1v1 Scenario.

    Assassin: 3 points
    Duskblade: 2 points
    Archer: 1 point
    Barbarian: 1 point
    Wizard: -2 points
    Seeker: -3 points


    all classes that got no mention are on 0 points as I feel the defense charms dont give them an advantage/disadvantage over the average of all the classes in 1v1 scenario.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------

    Now the second category is large scale PvP. For this scenario I wont make a point system as its very easy to explain who benefits here and who doesnt. I want to compare how tanky someone is to how rich someone is to make it clear. We have 5 people:

    Billy (seeker) is a millionaire (because seekers are really tanky)
    Johnny (BM) is also a millionaire
    Greg (Archer) is pretty poor
    Sally (Wizard) is doing alright for herself
    Dmitry (Cleric) is pretty poor

    Now adding Defense Charms is like giving all 5 of these people 1 million bucks.

    Billy and Johnny are still millionaire's.

    but suddenly Greg, Sally and Dmitry are millionaire's too, and Billy and Johnny are like...wtf please

    ''But its nice that everyone is a millionaire right?''

    No, its not. Billy and Johnny need to be millionaire's as they are frontline classes. (Tho Billy sometimes is a bit of a wuss and plays like he's a backline class, thats just Billy being a bad Billy -> Good Billy's are frontliners) And as frontliners Billy and Johnny have a hard life, they lose a lot of their wealth each second they are in the frontline. Greg, Sally and Dmitry are never in the frontline, they dont lose any of their money and suddenly they are in a more comfortable position than Johnny and Billy.

    Billy and Johnny have a huge bulls-eye on their forehead, they get hit 20 times per second and their Defense charms will only block 8 of those hits! So 12 hits per second dont get blocked.

    Greg, Sally and Dmitry are back out in a nice place, they get hit 5 times per second and their Defense Charms block all 5 of those! So 0 hits per second dont get blocked.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------

    Le Conclusion.

    When it comes to 1v1 PvP, the classes that are highly reliant on DPH and have a low amount of CC get absolutely shafted (RIP Wizard/Seeker)

    When it comes to large scale PvP, all frontline classes get shafted by Defense Charms as ranged classes gain an unfair amount of Defense.

    Because everyone loves winners and losers, the biggest winner from Defense Charms are Archers.

    Is this fair?
    Yes, Archer have been a pretty weak class for a while now, so they definately need some love.

    The biggest loser from Defense Charms are Seekers.

    Is this fair?
    No, Seekers used to be OP, but since cards came out the class was very much balanced, if not on the weaker side of the scale. These Defense Charms pretty much render them useless.
  • zoner112012
    zoner112012 Posts: 943 Arc User
    Leave defense charms as they are
    Pretty sure thanks to the move of forums they added a list of new rules, one of which says you are not allowed to make petitions on the forums. I am shocked this hasn't been shut down yet as I have seen other petitions before. People were told if they want to petition change they have to go through the Support Center (lol).
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  • sylenthunder
    sylenthunder Posts: 3,061 Community Moderator
    Leave defense charms as they are
    Pretty sure thanks to the move of forums they added a list of new rules, one of which says you are not allowed to make petitions on the forums. I am shocked this hasn't been shut down yet as I have seen other petitions before. People were told if they want to petition change they have to go through the Support Center (lol).

    well technically it's a poll not a petition.​​
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  • kittyempressa
    kittyempressa Posts: 268 Arc User
    Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms
    dingo488 wrote: »
    People are just randomly throwing arguments at eachother that dont even relate to eachother, and it feels to me people have a very poor understanding what Def Charms do in the bigger picture. Saying stuff like ''Defense charms are probably going to be somewhat necessary for open world PVP and TW' as a seeker and ''defense charms are a life saver'' are very much invalid arguments as your opponent has this ''live saver'' aswell. To explain what Defense Charms really do, there are 2 situations we need to take into account. 1v1 and large scale PvP.


    As its easiest to start with the 1v1 scenario Ill start there. Ill give classes +1 point for any positive factor and -1 point for anything negative. As defense charm ticks are completely based on time (cooldown) their effectiveness is dependant entirely on who you are fighting. Its all about how many of your hits (%) get cut by the defense charm which is tied to the interval between your hits.

    Classes that have a short interval between hits are: Archers/Assassin/Duskblade ( + 1 )
    Classes that have a long interval between hits are: Wizard/Seeker/Cleric ( - 1 )
    The other classes are kinda in the middle

    Now another factor is how reliant are these classes on the damage of a single skill or combo with a high cooldown. And need this combo to actively apply kill pressure.

    Classes that are highly reliant on this: Wizard/Seeker/Blademaster ( - 1 )
    Classes that dont depend on this at all: Archers/Assassin ( + 1 )
    The other classes are kinda in the middle

    As you can see its very similar to the previous category, but that makes sense due to balancing classes -> DPS vs DPH

    Now another factor is the way to block charm usage thru stuns/paralysis. Since this can basically lock the opponent out of using their charms completely, no casters will be listed here since I feel purify proc helps this exact point to your own benefit.

    Classes that have a lot of CC to do this: Assassins/Blademaster/Barbarian/Duskblade ( + 1 )
    Classes that have next to no CC: Seeker/Archer ( - 1 )


    I feel these are the 3 main factors that come into play when it comes down to a 1v1 scenario. Most magic classes are left out due to the nature of our magic classes, most our magic classes are DPS classes tho their DPS isnt fast enough to stand out amongst all the classes in the game. Adding the scores paints a pretty good picture on how Defense Charms affect classes in a 1v1 Scenario.

    Assassin: 3 points
    Duskblade: 2 points
    Archer: 1 point
    Barbarian: 1 point
    Wizard: -2 points
    Seeker: -3 points

    all classes that got no mention are on 0 points as I feel the defense charms dont give them an advantage/disadvantage over the average of all the classes in 1v1 scenario.


    Now the second category is large scale PvP. For this scenario I wont make a point system as its very easy to explain who benefits here and who doesnt. I want to compare how tanky someone is to how rich someone is to make it clear. We have 5 people:

    Billy (seeker) is a millionaire (because seekers are really tanky)
    Johnny (BM) is also a millionaire
    Greg (Archer) is pretty poor
    Sally (Wizard) is doing alright for herself
    Dmitry (Cleric) is pretty poor

    Now adding Defense Charms is like giving all 5 of these people 1 million bucks.

    Billy and Johnny are still millionaire's.

    but suddenly Greg, Sally and Dmitry are millionaire's too, and Billy and Johnny are like...wtf please

    ''But its nice that everyone is a millionaire right?''

    No, its not. Billy and Johnny need to be millionaire's as they are frontline classes. (Tho Billy sometimes is a bit of a wuss and plays like he's a backline class, thats just Billy being a bad Billy -> Good Billy's are frontliners) And as frontliners Billy and Johnny have a hard life, they lose a lot of their wealth each second they are in the frontline. Greg, Sally and Dmitry are never in the frontline, they dont lose any of their money and suddenly they are in a more comfortable position than Johnny and Billy.

    Billy and Johnny have a huge bulls-eye on their forehead, they get hit 20 times per second and their Defense charms will only block 8 of those hits! So 12 hits per second dont get blocked.

    Greg, Sally and Dmitry are back out in a nice place, they get hit 5 times per second and their Defense Charms block all 5 of those! So 0 hits per second dont get blocked.


    Le Conclusion.

    When it comes to 1v1 PvP, the classes that are highly reliant on DPH and have a low amount of CC get absolutely shafted (RIP Wizard/Seeker)

    When it comes to large scale PvP, all frontline classes get shafted by Defense Charms as ranged classes gain an unfair amount of Defense.

    Because everyone loves winners and losers, the biggest winner from Defense Charms are Archers.

    Is this fair?
    Yes, Archer have been a pretty weak class for a while now, so they definately need some love.

    The biggest loser from Defense Charms are Seekers.

    Is this fair?
    No, Seekers used to be OP, but since cards came out the class was very much balanced, if not on the weaker side of the scale. These Defense Charms pretty much render them useless.

    Just a question: Do you even play seeker? Probably not. You seem to have completely forgotten seeker's basic skills that cast at lightning speed. And Blade Affinity that makes even slower skills channel in less than a sec. Excluding non-BA Gemini, seekers are at medium-channeling speed at worst.
    Not to forget that they have melee-to-long range skills to make them effective both in melee and ranged combat. True, that range's slightly shorter than casters, just slightly. If you go melee against melees as seeker, you're just giving free hits instead of taking advantage of your range. There's a reason why all metal-skills (except EB) are ranged.
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    Kitty's gone. She gave up on PWI. And she's a black metal Kitty naow.

    Kitty's Youtube-channel("Kitty does eet"-series and much moar): KittysamaRT
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  • heerohex#3018
    heerohex#3018 Posts: 4,795 Community Moderator
    Leave defense charms as they are
    to the point.

    The game will change its up to the players to keep up with the changes. You will not alywaz like what happens. BUT like life we change everything changes...​​
  • dingo488
    dingo488 Posts: 936 Arc User
    edited October 2015
    Please remove Defense Charms from the game
    @Kittysama

    Yes I know how seekers work. And yes I know they are ranged. The most important line to focus on is:

    When people are hitting you, they arent hitting your squishy allies.

    If you are a seeker and u have a lot of tank stats u should be in people face to force them to hit you. Most seekers are just playing their class like a wizard, which is basically wasting a lot of potential since seekers have so many tank stats. Thats why Im saying...if you play your seeker like a wizard, you are a terrible seeker. If your hp charm is not permanently on cooldown you're a terrible seeker.

    A lot of people think sitting back and not dying a lot makes them good, but in reality they are wasting 90% of the class' potential by not using their tank stats to shield their allies.

    So this line '' If you go melee against melees as seeker, you're just giving free hits instead of taking advantage of your range. '' is the philosophy that makes it that 90% of the seekers is awful at their class. You are not just fighting to keep yourself alive, you are fighting and taking damage to keep your allies alive, most seekers dont think about that.

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    On another point, blade affinity is a skill that lasts for 6 (or 8) seconds with the cooldown of a full minute. You cant tell me a class specializes on ''Lightning speed'' attacks when it can only do that for 10% of their combat time.

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    Your view on the seeker class, although 100% right (nothing of what u said isnt true) is at the same time completely wrong since you only look at the upsides, but dont take the downsides into account. Being Heavy Armor isnt a convenience, its a tool that u need to use

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    Also please dont click the ''Quote'' button, I know its easier but itll basically destroy the lay-out of the forum page xD