Petition to remove Defense Charms from the game

aphrodita

Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms

i have the feeling these new 2 tick def charms arent being used on the american servers, otherwise people would react differently in this thread. or they dont have enough melee class users. cross server wars will be funny for them^^

limonazza

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

eirghan wrote: »

I don't think I told you to learn to play mystic. I just disagreed with you when you said they had slow channeling then demonstrated why I thought the way I did. Then you proceeded to tell me that my opinion on the matter was invalid because of a prejudice you hold against my class. Now you are suggesting another mystic is laughable for his strategies.

Here's the way it is:
A high geared wizard can use a variety of skills and one shot me. I am +11 full jades. I didn't start a thread on the forum petitioning to get spark removed because its unfair advantage to wizards who already have a really high DPH, and then attack anyone who disagreed. It's silly that you are doing similarly here.

If this is a poll: Accept that other people have different ideas about the game than you do and enjoy agreeing with people who do.

If this is a petition and you are only accepting signatures of those who agree with you: this thread should be closed and sunk.

somewhere there are a couple of "do you even mystic" and then "Absorb Soul in pvp is bad"

prejudice against your class? seeker is one of my fav classes, if not my most favourite one

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8e5xqpCU7w <-me playing it

seeker is the most versatile class on the game, he is good on any shards, can pass from spike ele DPH into nice phys DPS even w\o blade aff, can pass from being a squishy cannon into an hp wall

there are plenty of ways for a seeker to deny fire combo (variety of skills? XD):

first of all are you purged? because if you are full buffed, you and wiz have equal gears i am quite sure you can facetank a fire combo
else:

qpq his debuffs
demon unfetter
rewinding demon unfetter
voidstep the wiz after the sutra effect
faith
soul of fire
2spark
3spark
apothecary
switch into r8r weapon and omalley

if you are getting onehit by a wizard and you did none of the above i recommend you to practice more

and for instance genie spark is nerfed by its 80% since NH patch and primal passives
and for instance qpq ss fortify debuff + ion spike debuff has a very similar damage amp if not even better respect genie spark
+ you have goddamn zerkcrits...
so lets nerf qpq combos aswell shall we?


add double tick defense charms and you see how these charms are breaking some classes skillsets (arcane classes)

while giving advantages to the classes that can deliver a multiple number of hits in a short lapse of time (sin seeker db archer(but archer atm is meh) bm barb cleric in violet dance cyclone(but cleric dding is getting his team rekt))

i am not telling my opinion is more factor than yours,

i am debating points with valid thesis,

if you have more valid counterthesis i am happy to hear them, as long as those are valid ones starting with doe ​​

capnk

Leave defense charms as they are

limonazza said:

AHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA WAAAAAAAAAAT

you know that you can zero the channelling time (and the cooldown) of AS in 2-3 different ways?



and for instance i played demon mystic in mass pvp on private servers
​​

Okay, I'm curious. Please enlighten me. If you're referring to Zooming Thunder Powder, you can only get a maximum of two AS off during it due to AS cooldown. I am not aware of any effect in the game that lowers AS cooldown. And I have better things to use apoth for than ZTP.

limonazza

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

capnk wrote: »

AHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA WAAAAAAAAAAT

you know that you can zero the channelling time (and the cooldown) of AS in 2-3 different ways?



and for instance i played demon mystic in mass pvp on private servers


Okay, I'm curious. Please enlighten me. If you're referring to Zooming Thunder Powder, you can only get a maximum of two AS off during it due to AS cooldown. I am not aware of any effect in the game that lowers AS cooldown. And I have better things to use apoth for than ZTP.

ΣStorm Dance

Range　27　Meters
Mana　900
Channel 　2.0　seconds
Cast　1.0　seconds
Cooldown　10.0　seconds
Chi Gained　20
Weapon　Unarmed, Magic instrument

Required Cultivation　Celestial Demon
Blast your enemy with the power of a raging
hurricane, dealing base magic damage plus 250%
of weapon damage plus 8776 as Wood damage. Lowers
the target's maximumHealth by 8% for 8 seconds. Has
a chance to reduce the cooldown of your next Absorb
Soul within 6 seconds by 50%. The chance to reduce
the cooldown is up to 50%, based on your Soulforce.


Demon Spark (25% chann) +

○Rapid Growth

Mana　500
Channel　0.54　 seconds
Cast　0.8　 seconds
Cooldown　35.0　 seconds
Weapon　Unarmed, Magic instrument

Required Cultivation　Master of Discord
Infuse yourself with nature's power, increasing
your channeling speed by 20% and your Magic Attack
by 125% of your weapon's magic damage. Lasts 8 seconds.

Costs 30 Chi.

Demon version reduces the channeling time by 10%.




are you telling me that you never tried demon spark, rapid growth, nv, as, storm dance, as, as ?


and this goes off in a 3spark lapse of time

but i can understand that if you aren't r9, since the channelling buffs won't be that good unless you have some other channelling adds like ring cape and\or wpn shards


but my point is to land this you need a 3,30 sparks combo,
similar DPS combos from other classes are chi-free such as blade aff combos or sin skill spam etch

#balance​​

eirghan

Leave defense charms as they are

This is getting so convoluted that i dont see any point in debating it anymore. Youve argued mystic is slow channel (which is at best secondary to your op) and then denonstrated several situations in which you think the same class with the same skills is fast channel. What...
youve completely ignored the original point which is there are other passives that negate the charms as well. So. Have fun debating the finer aspects of mystic play x)

dingo488

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

''seeker is the most versatile class on the game, he is good on any shards, can pass from spike ele DPH into nice phys DPS even w\o blade aff, can pass from being a squishy cannon into an hp wall''


Yet your video perfectly shows that seekers are probably the least versatile class in the game. Its a class that 100% focusses on damage and nothing else. And to make it worse its extremely limited in the methods it can apply damage. The DPS is extremely weak. I would say near ignorable. And the DPH has too long of a cooldown to have any real impact in a large scale battle. Not to mention its very easy to counter. I dont wanna be a jerk, but in ur whole 30 minute video, you dont really do an awful lot.

Now ofcourse my view on seekers is a little biased, since im a blademaster, and seeker literally have 0 kill potential on blademasters. But I cant help but feel seekers are currently amongst the weakest 3 classes in the game. Its a needlessly tanky wizard without the utility, mobility and AoE of one.

chary

Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms

I feel like seekers are really useless outside of transposition bugging catas in tw and would literally rather have any other DD class instead of them generally.

keihan007#7641

chary said:

I feel like seekers are really useless outside of transposition bugging catas in tw and would literally rather have any other DD class instead of them generally.

As an archer w/o endgame shards, I generally just facetank any seeker unless I get SS comboed. Their damage is pretty weak outside of SS combo and ZCs.

Still seekers play large part in TWs, they are the point to rally around your squishier DDs as seekers are extremely tanky and require quite a bit of focus to drop. Point isnt to kill enemy on seeker, its to create room so your real DDs can. If one plays their seeker like a mage they are doing it wrong.

limonazza

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

eirghan wrote: »

This is getting so convoluted that i dont see any point in debating it anymore. Youve argued mystic is slow channel (which is at best secondary to your op) and then denonstrated several situations in which you think the same class with the same skills is fast channel. What...
youve completely ignored the original point which is there are other passives that negate the charms as well. So. Have fun debating the finer aspects of mystic play x)

mystic is slow channelling
to be fast channelling therefore overcome clever double tick def charms it needs to force 3 and a half sparks
wizard needs to force 2 sparks
clerics needs violet dance
veno is fcked
psy is fcked
storm can get fcked eventually

sin seeker db blablabla are "fast channelling" naturally, they pop the double tick charms w\o needing to force 3 or 2 sparks

@dingo488 that was one of the first times i was playing seeker, i clearly got better after few months of playing it, seeker can touch 200atk lvl and dispose of zerkcrits, while can safely go back to 180 def levels in case
he is HA and can purify himself twice + genie

as i said seeker can spam the basic skills very fastly to pop def charms then SS qpq combo when the charms are in cooldown

wizard cant do that, psy cant do that, mystic cant do that...

i mean, they can but at what cost? forcing resources you would never force to just pop def charms ticks

it's unbalanced -> remove def charms or increase their cooldown.​​

capnk

Leave defense charms as they are

limonazza said:

Required Cultivation　Celestial Demon

Blast your enemy with the power of a raging

hurricane, dealing base magic damage plus 250%

of weapon damage plus 8776 as Wood damage. Lowers

the target's maximumHealth by 8% for 8 seconds. Has

a chance to reduce the cooldown of your next Absorb

Soul within 6 seconds by 50%. The chance to reduce

the cooldown is up to 50%, based on your Soulforce.

Okay, there's your problem. You're looking at the text description, which is wrong. It reduces channeling time, not cooldown. Nothing reduces cooldown. Also the chance of the reduced AS channeling is pretty bad. Even with a high soulforce you're only going to see it about a third of the time.

And yes I am aware of the channeling speed reducers, as I mentioned earlier:

capnk said:

Absorb Soul is **** at high gear levels. It is almost never worth the casting time unless comboed with other skills (Storm Dance lucky proc, Demon spark+rapid growth).

chary

Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms

saxroll said:

Still seekers play large part in TWs, they are the point to rally around your squishier DDs as seekers are extremely tanky and require quite a bit of focus to drop. Point isnt to kill enemy on seeker, its to create room so your real DDs can. If one plays their seeker like a mage they are doing it wrong.

A BM, db, or barb would be 100 times more useful than a seeker would in that situation while bringing a lot more CC to the table.

Seekers really don't have anything to differentiate themselves from other better DD classes in tw outside of transposition.

blazerboy

Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms

Honestly by this statement I'm guessing you don't work with any experienced seeker frequently, seekers offers a variety of uses outside transposition because of the simple fact in the DD aspect it can be pretty flexible, when a physical class needs to be focused it can help sustain fire, when its a magic class needing physical damage they can sustain fire. Seeker damage is not too poor either seeing as if you read some skills the damage is pretty good (NOT the freaking AOE since some idiots cant see past "Seeker job in TW is to AOE" <--- this prehistoric way of thinking is what maked seekers considered useless. Also sacrificial slash is very useful tw wise idk about other seekers but as soon I hear "focus this person" if its not an AA (or Sin with tidal on) as soon I throw SS that thing is dead jsod/full buffs w.e it just dies because of the sheer difference a spike difference in defense level makes

Our fatal flaw may lie in the fact we can be easily controlled and we lack an ability to debuffs a squad on a mass scale like DB,bm or a barbs rediculous berserkers rath but we offer a flexible way to direct fire and surely focus fire a target down because if a seeker works with his squad weather he/she uses SS,Windblade (40% chance reduce target def lvl by 20 for 8 sec with a 2 sec CD vertually spamable each time it procs the time resets) A ion spike debuff (Im sorry how many classes in this game do metal damage? lmfao yeah 4) hell even edge blur bypasses a barbs invoke so they cant try that stupid 2k hp Invoke HA I LIVED (how many times I got barbs with this lmfao). If a seeker properly supports his squad they can be invalueable

Everyone entitled to thier oppinion but im sorry a seeker is far from just transposition... @chary

limonazza

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

besides that, seekers are close to the 50k hp mark

how is any arcane class supposed to kill it with the double tick def charms? you will hit that 50k hp for 2k-4ks 4 times every 10 seconds....

pls nerf.​​

shade13

Doesnt matter i am an archer

limonazza wrote: »

how is any arcane class supposed to kill it with the double tick def charms? you will hit that 50k hp for 2k-4ks 4 times every 10 seconds....

You need to control him for long time and very neatly, so he can't use def charm again after 10 sec. Longer charm cooldown should theoretically help to deal dmg close to 50k. Theoretically. In practice it's way harder because target is smarter than mob and surely resists.​​

dingo488

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

Thats the beauty of it all...

A seeker has next to no CC, and next to no presence...u dont need to kill a seeker, u can just let it stay alive, its not like its gonna kill you, and its not like its gonna protect its allies, simply because it doesnt have the tools to do so.

So you can have close to 50k hp and you can have close to 100k hp, it doesnt matter.


Compare that to a Blademaster, also 50k hp. If you ignore a blademaster you're gonna get AoE stunned for days and you'll basically be screwed.

Thats where a Seeker just becomes a confusing class, generally tank classes are what you would call ''enablers'', they generally lack the tools to be a force that can solo-kill everything, but they can enable other classes to more safely do so.

A Seeker not only lacks the tool to be a force that can solo-kill everything (due to extremely high cooldown on the only combo with proper kill potential), but it also lacks the tools to enable allies to do so. Its just a thing thats there...not really doing a whole lot, I would probably prefer any other class to be there instead. That said they do have a presence in TW now, because if you dont deal with them they'll glitch the **** out of your cata-barbs...so although its a ''glitch'' and apparently its highly frowned upon, its something the class most definately needs to be relevant, so we should just shut up about the glitch and pretend its a much needed buff to seekers

shade13

Doesnt matter i am an archer

dingo488 wrote: »

A seeker has next to no CC, and next to no presence...u dont need to kill a seeker, u can just let it stay alive

What if it's 1v1 confrontation? Do you have to just run away encountering a seeker? WTB balance in this game

​​

blazerboy

Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms

@limonazza first of all no seeker who hits 50k hp is nearly tanky enough to survive that long because its likely a vitstone or vitbuild maybe both. Vit sharded Seeker? you're telling you have issues with those when just about all of them I'll zerk crit them in full buffs for 22k after fully procing thier defense charm.. And heres an idea to get past that 50k hp SO OP maybe gank the target the way you're talking its like you 1v1 your target not assist target kill if you honestly are not assist target killing in tw then GG seekers easily die focus fire by mag dds worth a damn

@shade13 longer cool down on def charms honestly wouldnt bother me but then AA classes will insta die due to ganks or a diety sin spam lifehunter OR Really skilled/geared Duskblade like they did before which is probably the main reason for these charms in the first place its really not hard to kill a endgame seeker with current defense charms

@dingo488 you clearly know absolutely nothing about seekers in terms of damage or you base your perseception on non developed seekers if you literally sit there and say we have no tools to supplement good damage maybe not in 1v1 but who actually even does that at this point in the game with class imbalances? Maybe ppl who like 20-45min 1v1 for what to expend a ton of resources until one person gets tired of it and just allows the other to win or just says **** it? Our ability to support damage with debuffs, disarms is very useful hell edge blur got the job done when a barb tried to invoke to survive at the tailend of thier hp.. Yes we get CC easily but thats thier balance seeing as we can range and hit magic, we cant harass a squad as effectively as a bm or maybe db but if a seeker properly supports his team most things that NEED to die quickly can be subjected to thier demise

dingo488

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

''@dingo488 you clearly know absolutely nothing about seekers in terms of damage or you base your perseception on non developed seekers if you literally sit there and say we have no tools to supplement good damage maybe not in 1v1 but who actually even does that at this point in the game with class imbalances? Maybe ppl who like 20-45min 1v1 for what to expend a ton of resources until one person gets tired of it and just allows the other to win or just says **** it? Our ability to support damage with debuffs, disarms is very useful hell edge blur got the job done when a barb tried to invoke to survive at the tailend of thier hp.. Yes we get CC easily but thats thier balance seeing as we can range and hit magic, we cant harass a squad as effectively as a bm or maybe db but if a seeker properly supports his team most things that NEED to die quickly can be subjected to thier demise''

See and everything you say is true! And ye I dont value 1v1s, that is like playing pokemon on my GBA. But what a Seeker does, every single other class in the whole game, does better.

You say stuff like:

''Our ability to support damage with debuffs''
and
if a seeker properly supports his team most things that NEED to die quickly can be subjected to thier demise

BM -> HF, lockdown
Barb -> lockdown
Duskblade -> lockdown + debuffs
Venomancer -> Purge
Archer -> Purge
All DD classes simply provide more damage than a seeker ever will in a constant scenario, while providing more CC, stuns/freezes...and all of this with AoEs instead of single target skills
Mystic/Cleric have the option to heal.

--------------------------------------

Im not sure what to do with your argument, its not like you are wrong...but...

Its like Im saying that 100 bucks is more than 25 bucks, and you strike the argument that I know nothing about 25 bucks, 25 bucks is money too! I know 25 bucks is money, but 100 bucks is more. I know a seeker can support and deal damage, its just that they are the 25 bucks, and every other class is 100 bucks.

limonazza

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

blazerboy wrote: »

@limonazza first of all no seeker who hits 50k hp is nearly tanky enough to survive that long because its likely a vitstone or vitbuild maybe both. Vit sharded Seeker? you're telling you have issues with those when just about all of them I'll zerk crit them in full buffs for 22k after fully procing thier defense charm.. And heres an idea to get past that 50k hp SO OP maybe gank the target the way you're talking its like you 1v1 your target not assist target kill if you honestly are not assist target killing in tw then GG seekers easily die focus fire by mag dds worth a damn

@shade13 longer cool down on def charms honestly wouldnt bother me but then AA classes will insta die due to ganks or a diety sin spam lifehunter OR Really skilled/geared Duskblade like they did before which is probably the main reason for these charms in the first place its really not hard to kill a endgame seeker with current defense charms

@dingo488 you clearly know absolutely nothing about seekers in terms of damage or you base your perseception on non developed seekers if you literally sit there and say we have no tools to supplement good damage maybe not in 1v1 but who actually even does that at this point in the game with class imbalances? Maybe ppl who like 20-45min 1v1 for what to expend a ton of resources until one person gets tired of it and just allows the other to win or just says **** it? Our ability to support damage with debuffs, disarms is very useful hell edge blur got the job done when a barb tried to invoke to survive at the tailend of thier hp.. Yes we get CC easily but thats thier balance seeing as we can range and hit magic, we cant harass a squad as effectively as a bm or maybe db but if a seeker properly supports his team most things that NEED to die quickly can be subjected to thier demise

50k hp vit seekers have also 130def levels which is pretty much what you need to negate atk level damage amp,
arcane classes can barely crit, can't zerkcrit,
arcane classes struggle to proc double tick def charms, thanks to these charms only way for arcane class X to kill any class Y with double def charms is a gank or channelling gears\apo

also you talk about TWs, arcane classes have the best AoE pressure, too bad double tick def charms negate even that

once again double tick def charms are game breaking. pls nerf

@AA classes will instadie cause of a def charm nerf, wrong, sins already pop all of our def charms with 2 life hunters in like 3 seconds, so it won't change **** for arcane classes

and seeker has tools like ranged skill spam to pop charms into 3spark blade aff SS fortify csp qpq ep ion spike glowing blade heartseeker glowing blade
and this **** onehits ppl

any arcane class with this tools?
or with something similar to life hunter spam?
or archer autos?
or barb mighty swing spam?
or db w.e. the heck they do they are gonna kill you
or bm HF zerkcrits ?

Arcane classes are already obsolete AF, double tick defense charms are the tombstone above them​​

blazerboy

Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms

Ive honestly never been our dd then any other class thats not a sin,db,wiz,psy,sb the rest of the other classes literally hit **** poor consistantly because of speed + the skill description itself isnt even that high index but lots of ppl dont read those descriptions so I'll let you have that assumption. In what world does a veno our dd a seeker w.o 0 p.def proc most venos on DawnsGlory are sage for aoe purge but thier channel is hella slow but that makes the other classes 100 bucks and a seeker 25 really... Barb lock down are you refering to berserk wrath here for knockout of sky or the paralyze skill which requires a barb to be in human form and if a cata barb in human form most of the time not sure whats going on there or is just just PVP we talking about... bm ill let you have that when technically dg is a aoe even though mathematically SS can match and exceed its amp value. Btw its our magic atks who hold the majority of the long CD for obvious reason thats why you assume we cant deal damage consistantly the physical hits recharge pretty decently and have good CD in respects to eachother we arent just good for magic hits ya know or are you saying HA phy dd is very low but then you said every other class deals alot more damage that would include bm. The only reason every other class seems alot better is because they benefited more from primal update and seeker got a short end of the stick probably because of all the constant bitching and moaning the class is op as **** cuz it 1 shots everything zerk magic and now that we cant because of 2 proc def charm we suddenly are worth 75% less then other classes wtf...

dingo488

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

The fact you went full ham on the defense charms kinda tells its own story. Defense Charms arent all that relevant in TW x)

And like I stated before, its not up to a damage class to proc these.

We go back to the previously mentioned Enablers, they will do the work for you

Not to mention, if ur faction properly uses assist attack that means AT LEAST 5 people are attacking the target you are attacking, I wouldnt worry about taking off defense charms on your own...

Matter of fact, if you are attacking someone completely by urself, thus being the one responsible for taking off the defense charms, you are doing something so very wrong...and then you are talking about triple sparking as a seeker in TW to take down a single target...what? have u ever done TW? at all

--------------------------

But fine, you are fishing for something positive, if TW -> 80v80 was played so poorly, by the absolute worst players in the world, that the 80v80 would basically be like in those medieval war movies where the 80v80 is basically 80 1v1s. Then yes!!! Seekers would be pretty decent, maybe even slightly above average.

But thats not how we do TW now is it? At least its not on Twilight Temple, here we just assist our enablers to quickly take down single targets or even groups of targets, which like I said is something every class does better than a seeker. Though perhaps the TWs on your server are like some Medieval battlefield where everyone is 1v1ing until the midget comes running in with a torch to blow up the wall. In which case, I apogilize, you have a valid argument.

limonazza

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

seekers in 80v80 tws are pretty good shotcallers with transpo + SS qpq, they can also front lane, and they can reach enemy back row to clear up squishies\support

in my opinion double def charms are still factors in TWs because they nerf aoe pressure,
you call target X which is in a cluster of players you AA and AoE it you might kill the target but if the enemies around him have def charms up, you won't really hurt the targets around him

so what's the point of aoe skills?

def charms breaking the meta once more​​

blazerboy

Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms

I officially quit even in a detail essay you cannot grasp the fact seekers arent as weak as you think but alright considering we arent the same server cant really show you

dingo488

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

limonazza said:

seekers in 80v80 tws are pretty good shotcallers ​​

To be a good target caller there's a few things that are extremely important:

1. You need to present targets in a proper condition -> For this u need to have CC, you cant call a target thats running all over the place as its impossible for allies to follow up on that. Sure transposition would work, but its too slow, cooldown too long, so its too inefficient.

2. The target needs to have an acceptable level of availability, which as the most tanky ranged class in the game you cant possibly measure. The position you are in is the most comfortable position there is. You can not possibly measure if its safe for a veno to purge your target, if its safe for a BM to paralyse your target. Generally a Seeker is the last class u want calling targets because of their comfortable position. Its highly likely that they will call targets that cause half your people to overextend and get themselves killed, because they are not seekers and they dont have 50k hp, range and 130 defense level, yet you are expecting them to put themselves in the same situation as you are.

3. When calling for AoE targets you need to be able to make sure your AoEs will land on said target, and actually have an impact. Like you yourself said, thats not really working out for you, because your class cant do that. You cant AoE stuns a group of people and you cant knock off all their defense charms by using Whirlwind and a quick follow-up AoE.



Now its true that most classes are really bad at calling targets and seeker is definately above the average when it comes to this, but they are very far from the actual good classes for calling targets.


And @blazerboy the format in which u present ur essay is completely unreadable to me

blazerboy

Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms

Its really not hard to read its keeping focus where you are or use your finger to keep online lmfao... seriously where are ppl seeing 50k seekers not one exist on my server and if you do see them thats vit build its squishy as paper.... btw calling targets isnt based on your class its based on your ability to make critical decisions thats like saying the char has a mind of its own... when I said aoe targets is not working it doesnt work in terms of providing a fatal blow because pretty much anyone besides magic classes any aoe atk u do rarely ganna hit 2k to each target better tofocus fire then randomly toss aoe

chary

Remove the double tick Defense charms, but keep the single tick Defense charms

qontroL, please never change your sig. It is a thing of beauty.

zoner112012

Leave defense charms as they are

What I find most amusing about this argument is.....it isn't going to happen. So keep arguing your reasons back and forth..this popcorn tastes great with your tears since they are so salty. Defense charms won't be going anywhere.

limonazza

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

who cares we are still free to complain about it and i am not expecting anything from devs that cannot even fix TWs, so meh

devs wake the heck up and @zoner1120012 who cares, your opinion is non factor since you have few to no knowledge of the game ^^​​

sylenthunder

Leave defense charms as they are

Guys, the continued circumvention of the language filter is going to get you in trouble.

Also, since this thread has basically turned into a bash-fest, I'm closing it down.​​

limonazza

Please remove Defense Charms from the game

there was a seeker in my faction with 42k hp before riptide passives

and this is a calc of what an endgame seeker can achieve http://mypers.pw/5/#243484

anyway point of the thread wasnt seeker or sylen needs for attention

but the fact that def charms are giving too many advantages to the already advantaged DPS classes above the already overnerfed DPH ones​​