New "physical and magical piercing" stats

it seems to be a percentage. I think I have 66 magic penetration and on our stat screen at the bottom it says I mitigate .66% defenses.

koudelkamorgan wrote: »

it seems to be a percentage. I think I have 66 magic penetration and on our stat screen at the bottom it says I mitigate .66% defenses.

ya i noticed the same, so going by this value, you would need 100 penetration to equal 1% acutal penetration. So presumably with 1500 penetration you would have 15% defense/resistince ignored. That means you won't really be seeing the acutal value of penetration until you have quite a bit of it.

missinin17 wrote: »

Does physical penatration work with venomancer's fox skills? (I'm asking because some ppl say physical penatration won't have effect on casters)

Physical penetration would still apply to a caster to who has it, but your physical damage is likely to be **** anyway so you won't notice the difference regardless.

Yes physical penetration will apply to foxform skills because they are doing physical damage.

I did a pretty good test and can confirm the tooltip is accurate. The measured effective defense of a target when I had 61 penetration was 0.613% lower than their actual defense regardless of their buffs/debuffs. This was within the margin of error for the measurement.

def.effective = defense.actual * (1 - penetration / 10000)

So if you get 10000 penetration somehow than you will be able to ignore defense/resistance.​​

asterelle wrote: »

I did a pretty good test and can confirm the tooltip is accurate. The measured effective defense of a target when I had 61 penetration was 0.613% lower than their actual defense regardless of their buffs/debuffs. This was within the margin of error for the measurement.

def.effective = defense.actual * (1 - penetration / 10000)

So if you get 10000 penetration somehow than you will be able to ignore defense/resistance.​​

So it's a multiplier and not a subtraction? Bummer.
Was hoping it would subtract from enemies %reduction, would be more beneficial against mega end game players

eirghan wrote: »

so.... For the leypeople since yknow. I suck at math. Does this mean that it "penetrates" through or ignores multipliers like def levels and spirit to take a chunk off your basic ele/phys defenses?

And if so is this penetration amplified by levels/spirit?

Sorry for being dense like i said i suck at this math stuff -waves flag-

this was just explained on the last page:

tictic99999 wrote: »

You guys have it all wrong. Defense levels and spirit are both modifiers, amplifiers if you would of your current stats. They are both nothing without a large amount of physical and magical resistance. If your resistance is lowered, your total defense is lowered and the lowering is then amplied, the same way if you gain more resistance your damage is reduced. (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

mosz wrote: »

eirghan wrote: »

so.... For the leypeople since yknow. I suck at math. Does this mean that it "penetrates" through or ignores multipliers like def levels and spirit to take a chunk off your basic ele/phys defenses?

And if so is this penetration amplified by levels/spirit?

Sorry for being dense like i said i suck at this math stuff -waves flag-

this was just explained on the last page:

tictic99999 wrote: »

You guys have it all wrong. Defense levels and spirit are both modifiers, amplifiers if you would of your current stats. They are both nothing without a large amount of physical and magical resistance. If your resistance is lowered, your total defense is lowered and the lowering is then amplied, the same way if you gain more resistance your damage is reduced. (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

Yes, I see that it was mentioned but I don't see any one agreeing or disagreeing or any hardcore proof. Was asking for clarification. Thank you.

demansfairy wrote: »

I'm still a bit confused, let's say my opponent has 90 % m def and I have 1k mag pen. So does that mean their new m def is 81% now and I'm dealing 90% more damage? Or is it 90% of their actual n7mber (which would be around 40k m def) and then it runs that new number (36k) through the def percentage formula agian?

Take actual numbers. For example, I have 40k mdef (my real approximate mdef), according to Asterelle's formula, it will be

40 000*(1-1 000/10 000)=36 000

Like cleric mdef debuff. Not too OP, but adds up a bit. Especially if it stacks with other debuffs (I suppose it does).​​

asterelle wrote: »

You never can reach 100% penetration.

Ah, how the internet could pervert that statement. Btw @asterelle the link for pwe forum enhancement extensions is not working properly right now.​​

83 mag peircing = reducing tagret mag def by.82% wierd math not like 100 stat =1% reduction. so stat of 830 would reduce targets mag def by 8.2% same if have pshy peircing stats

Can seekers and archers take advantage of the magic penetration with their lightning attacks or would it just count for physical pen?

asterelle said:

@limonazza Common debuffs go off the equipment defense so casting undine on a bm in magic marrow doesn't do much (even less after primal passives). Penetration goes off the total defense though after buffs and debuffs so it will take away more defense from a buffed target.

I'll ask again since you didn't seem to notice, but if as a BM I use buddhas guard and have about 130k P.Def, since around like, what, 78k defense is cap reduction, would that physical penetration be cutting through the 40-50k P.Def I'm not using or would it be cutting through the actual 95% and ignoring the unused defenses?

So does that mean Physical Penetration isn't the same as 'Subtract X Pdef' from the target ? I'm not familiar with the new equation since where I play haven't gotten the update. Is it a NEW modifier put into damage formula ?

I have a 99.999% accurate damage calculator which is not user friendly, I'd like to test it if anyone can provide the needed variables, preferably a cleric as the attacker and any class for the target.

Here is how I usually test my character's damage output against others, it's quite accurate.
[url=http://i520.photobucket.com/albums/w323/smurfin88/Forums/Spiritpvp.jpg~original[/url]


Oh, and does it have any effect on Monsters too ?

mistressmuerta wrote: »

I started a build on the veno forums playing around with stacking % reduction on the r8r stats...Atm my veno has 40% pdmg reduction and 10% magic...r8rr would have offered more stats but it has an abysmal chance of getting the 40%pdef 40%mdef i was seeking initially and potentially could cost more than maxing out r9rr.

Problem of r8r is lack of attack/def lvl. Even with such stats maxed out, r9r won't be a match for it. And since r9 is quite obtainable for most (unlike China version for example), r8r is not competitive. You don't want to spend tones of money, more than r9r would cost, refine it to +12, full josd, get a bit closer to survivability probably, but be hopelessly left behind in terms of damage. That's what I'm talking about.

Attack is the best defense.​​