How do Archers beat sins 1v1?

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  • U_Sasuke - Sanctuary
    U_Sasuke - Sanctuary Posts: 643 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    lol the thing is, YOU DON'T.
    or should i say 'you (archer) can't beat a good sage sin end-game in 1on1.
    infact archer can't kill pretty much most classes end-game geared in 1on1.

    I think i've mentioned that before too, you cannot beat a really decent sage sin in a 1on1 end-game geared, and that was pre-r999. Now with purify only Wizards have a good chance of beating a sin in 1on1, or a sin has a chance of beating a sin, only.

    Edit: A special note, this game is just unbalanced big time regarding pvp perspective, not sure why people still discuss pvp on forums haha
  • Walpurga - Dreamweaver
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,028 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Bide your time. Come TW, NW, hunt him down and stun-QS faceroll him when he isn't looking b:chuckle
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  • DionDagger - Dreamweaver
    DionDagger - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,140 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Bide your time. Come TW, NW, hunt him down and stun-QS faceroll him when he isn't looking b:chuckle

    >.> You don't even have the gear ro do something like that Wal. Get geared first, then try it, only works in theory XD.
  • Walpurga - Dreamweaver
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,028 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Get me into more warsong then; I still need bow, boots and cape molds and freaking clerics refuse to try to solo fire and I can't comfortably do metal yet
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  • DionDagger - Dreamweaver
    DionDagger - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,140 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Get me into more warsong then; I still need bow, boots and cape molds and freaking clerics refuse to try to solo fire and I can't comfortably do metal yet

    Fire is easiest to solo for archers >.>. Most clerics and barbs on DW don't solo **** these daysb:chuckle. And you could get more WS if you weren't in a catshop selling chi stones all dayb:chuckle, I barely do WS and my r9 is almost finished :p.


    Buying molds isnt a bad idea either.
  • Walpurga - Dreamweaver
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,028 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    I can comfortably solo fire and have been for a while.

    Had a freaking g16+5 cleric insist on having barb for fire lol.

    And all my gear is TT nirvy, except for chest which I made before 2x made illusion stones go under 10mil
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  • Decus - Dreamweaver
    Decus - Dreamweaver Posts: 5,033 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    If you can solo fire, you can probably solo metal. At least, that's what I would imagine, given I always found metal to be the easiest pavilion. >.>
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  • XShadowshotx - Heavens Tear
    XShadowshotx - Heavens Tear Posts: 278 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Well the majority of the sins I face in PvP, NW, or TW just tend to be aps ******* and in most cases this doesn't work with a simple AD, Blessing of the Condor, or an anti stun and kiting. There aren't too many sage sins on the HT server rolling around in gears that I come into contact that often. BUT one case I remember I was pking out at west arch and this sin _Easy_ came out, I delt with him with difficulty I will not deny this fact in 1v1's. I had been using Spirit of Defense's for buffs and in 3 of 4 1v1's he and I had I came out on top. Just by kiting, keeping myself anti-stunned and DDing my best. He was unbuffed and didn't want to use stealth, not sure why but w/e. Up until the last fight where he got mad enough to go get buffs then I lost, lol. The one thing I was supremely surprised at was the fact that my demon thundershock proc'd twice through his sage tidal protection. I was like dis O.O lol.

    But yeah his gears, full r9s3 daggers +12 armors +10 with a few other +11/12s all DoTs in his armors.

    I am currently and was at the time a full r9s3 archer, all +10 with immac citrines.
  • DionDagger - Dreamweaver
    DionDagger - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,140 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    XShadowshotx - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Well the majority of the sins I face in PvP, NW, or TW just tend to be aps ******* and in most cases this doesn't work with a simple AD, Blessing of the Condor, or an anti stun and kiting. There aren't too many sage sins on the HT server rolling around in gears that I come into contact that often. BUT one case I remember I was pking out at west arch and this sin _Easy_ came out, I delt with him with difficulty I will not deny this fact in 1v1's. I had been using Spirit of Defense's for buffs and in 3 of 4 1v1's he and I had I came out on top. Just by kiting, keeping myself anti-stunned and DDing my best. He was unbuffed and didn't want to use stealth, not sure why but w/e. Up until the last fight where he got mad enough to go get buffs then I lost, lol. The one thing I was supremely surprised at was the fact that my demon thundershock proc'd twice through his sage tidal protection. I was like dis O.O lol.

    But yeah his gears, full r9s3 daggers +12 armors +10 with a few other +11/12s all DoTs in his armors.

    I am currently and was at the time a full r9s3 archer, all +10 with immac citrines.

    Tidal protection isn't 100%.
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Clerics should solo wood! 100k+ metal hits all day on those wood mobs!
    DionDagger - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Tidal protection isn't 100%.

    but Demon Thundershock is 10% to proc...making it even less likely to proc with Tidal on.
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  • XShadowshotx - Heavens Tear
    XShadowshotx - Heavens Tear Posts: 278 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    DionDagger - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Tidal protection isn't 100%.

    Not sure if you fail to realize the possibility of a 10% proc going off twice through sage tidal protection. I realize it isn't 100%, its 66%. Its why I was quite surprised.
  • DionDagger - Dreamweaver
    DionDagger - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,140 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    XShadowshotx - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Not sure if you fail to realize the possibility of a 10% proc going off twice through sage tidal protection. I realize it isn't 100%, its 66%. Its why I was quite surprised.

    Meh, it happens, but yea highly unlikely
  • Bhavyy - Raging Tide
    Bhavyy - Raging Tide Posts: 1,083 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    The same way archers kill everything else.
    Stunning arrow, quickshot, auto attack.
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  • PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver
    PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,507 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    DionDagger - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    And you could get more WS if you weren't in a catshop selling chi stones all dayb:chuckle

    +1 to this idea, less competition ftw
    you only purge once #yopo
  • DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver
    DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,355 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Getting this thread back on track here's a few suggestions.

    TL:DR - kite better, fly helps

    When fighting sins (and bm's) they have a butt tonne of control skills, the only way you're going to stand a chance is if you can kite them effectively, and annoyingly the best way to do this is to fly.

    Getting that window of opportunity when their skills to close the gap are on cd is near impossible on the ground where they can use run skills on top of tele skills. In the air they can only use the tele's whereas you have range so you can kite in 3 dimensions.

    Even when you get aforementioned opportunity you have to do this multiple times in succession to get their genie on CD and apo on CD.

    Archers are not built to tank hits, and possess pathetic control skills so it all comes down to kiting and countering, not getting shut down and a good defensive genie is a key part of that too I'm sure you know all the skills (fortify/will surge/badge/remove paralysis etc)

    Imo archer vs sin is hard, its a contest of kiting vs locking down.

    Good luck.
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  • Kittysama - Raging Tide_1432680721
    Kittysama - Raging Tide_1432680721 Posts: 651 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Kitty's way to beat sins on archer: Demon spark -> Occult Ice -> fist sin to death

    This has been working pretty well. Kitty's also heard sins like to use similar tactic much.     f:hush
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  • Walpurga - Dreamweaver
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,028 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    APS on a sin is pretty much useless from G16 upwards

    for one thing you can't lock a tidal'd dex genie sin down
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  • Zsw - Dreamweaver
    Zsw - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,087 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Problem is, as an end game archer, you can't out DPS a sin's charm if you're rib striked and you can't charm bypass unless you spark. But yet if you spark they can counter spark and tank you longer. The difference is, they can keep sparking, but you can't.

    So, the two fundamental ways to kill someone in pvp is completely negated.

    Charm out DPS - Negated By Ribstrike
    Charm Bypass - Negated by lack of chi/damage

    It's a really bad match up.

    Hmm, maybe full deities can bypass. But yeah, idk why pwi made deities. As if people don't die fast enough already in mass pk.
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  • Bhavyy - Raging Tide
    Bhavyy - Raging Tide Posts: 1,083 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    At the end of the day, sins beat us in CC, damage, buffs and chi.
    There's not much else to say, even their range attack can zerk crit and hit harder than anything we have.
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  • Sint - Harshlands
    Sint - Harshlands Posts: 579 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »
    I've never even seen this kid outside of safezone so I'm gonna take a wild shot in the dark and say that he's never PVP'd.

    He does pvp, and he even thinks he's good at it. I've killed him, uncharmed, using my r8 bow. Then again, he's in Mayhem.

    On topic: Pray they're stupid and unbuffed.
  • Pwnallagain - Heavens Tear
    Pwnallagain - Heavens Tear Posts: 206 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    RankNine - Momaganon wrote: »
    if we talk about endgame (r9.3+12, nw items refined) then its almost impossible to beat the sin. especially when its full buffed.

    Lmao dumbest thing I have ever read. In fully buffed endgame pvp, archer, veno, and bm (with purge pole) are 3 classes that should always win unless you are clueless. Their purges basically make fighting them in fully buffed 1v1 ridiculous. You get purged and die. How fun.

    Also, you forgot will surge on your genie. That would make a big difference. If you anti stun, then they literally have no CC on you if you hit will surge.
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  • DionDagger - Dreamweaver
    DionDagger - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,140 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Pwnallagain - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Lmao dumbest thing I have ever read. In fully buffed endgame pvp, archer, veno, and bm (with purge pole) are 3 classes that should always win unless you are clueless. Their purges basically make fighting them in fully buffed 1v1 ridiculous. You get purged and die. How fun.

    Also, you forgot will surge on your genie. That would make a big difference. If you anti stun, then they literally have no CC on you if you hit will surge.

    Freeze, sleep, seal, and channel increase >.>
  • Unholly - Morai
    Unholly - Morai Posts: 292 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    DionDagger - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Freeze, sleep, seal, and channel increase >.>

    Your joking, right?
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  • Zsw - Dreamweaver
    Zsw - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,087 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Pwnallagain - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Lmao dumbest thing I have ever read. In fully buffed endgame pvp, archer, veno, and bm (with purge pole) are 3 classes that should always win unless you are clueless. Their purges basically make fighting them in fully buffed 1v1 ridiculous. You get purged and die. How fun.

    Also, you forgot will surge on your genie. That would make a big difference. If you anti stun, then they literally have no CC on you if you hit will surge.

    No one would do a respectable 1v1 full buffed vs a purge class. At least, I don't know anyone that would.
    I believe the OP is fighting unbuffed and unstealthed.
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  • Eoria - Harshlands
    Eoria - Harshlands Posts: 6,118 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Pwnallagain - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Lmao dumbest thing I have ever read. In fully buffed endgame pvp, archer, veno, and bm (with purge pole) are 3 classes that should always win unless you are clueless.

    Full buffed 1v1s are something that shouldn't be done unless both people can purge. Also, archers are possibly the weakest 1v1 class.
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  • Pwnallagain - Heavens Tear
    Pwnallagain - Heavens Tear Posts: 206 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »
    Full buffed 1v1s are something that shouldn't be done unless both people can purge. Also, archers are possibly the weakest 1v1 class.

    That's what I am saying. The person was saying sin would beat a purge class in a fully buffed 1v1 and I called that dumb lol. Also, if you know how to play your archer right and have some serious luck on your side you could pull out a win or two.
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  • Bhavyy - Raging Tide
    Bhavyy - Raging Tide Posts: 1,083 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    The skills it takes to control a sin as well as the rate of proc on an archers weapon makes purge mostly useless compared to a zerk crit that can happen on any attack
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  • Eoria - Harshlands
    Eoria - Harshlands Posts: 6,118 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Pwnallagain - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    The person was saying sin would beat a purge class in a fully buffed 1v1 and I called that dumb lol.

    A sin can win that though very very easily regardless of buffs. They are the ultimate 1v1 class.
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  • DionDagger - Dreamweaver
    DionDagger - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,140 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Unholly - Morai wrote: »
    Your joking, right?

    b:chuckleYes. Depends on which anti stun you use tho. Some only block stun+will surge, which means you can still be slept and frozen. Then there's others that allow you to still be slowed. Even purify proc allows you to be slept and frozen while its activeb:pleased.
  • DionDagger - Dreamweaver
    DionDagger - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,140 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »
    A sin can win that though very very easily regardless of buffs. They are the ultimate 1v1 class.

    You haven't played a sin lately have you?

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