Is this considered a scam?

124

Comments

  • truekossy
    truekossy Posts: 7,021 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    And with that, you've also addressed the footnote in my post. 1.280 is indeed different from 1280 as an advertisement ingame so copying that would make it a scam. Since I didn't look for it, I was assuming it was using the typical no digit separation and the like many do (IE: b/s xyz > 450/300). Inclusion of that combined with what was earlier mentioned about how the name has changed before with price changes screams deliberation.

    So yeah. I was wrong, and started rambling this post, so feel free to ignore my earlier posts. b:surrender
  • Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear
    Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear Posts: 879 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    It's not a scam. If my title states what im buying for, and is setup for that price in my shop, thats what im buying for. You can't tell me what I should be paying for an item. But If I purposely setup my title for a set peice and it's differant in my shop, thats a scam. Or saying im selling an item and it's a differant item that looks the same, thats a scam. No one has the right to tell me what i should buy and sell for. If I want to sell a cube stamp for 300m, thats my business. Doesn't mean someone will buy it, and if they do, it's on them. Thats the price im selling for. You can buy from me, or go somewhere else. My price may be double what it normally sells for, but it's the price I want for it. If I want to buy an item that people normally buy for 500k, for the amount of 5k, thats my price in my shop. You can look before buying. It's not my resposibility to make sure that you pay attention, it's yours. But thats the price I want
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  • Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear
    Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear Posts: 879 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    If my title states what im buying and selling for correctly, it's not scamming. If I purposely decieve in my title compared to what im doing in shop, it's a scam. Like someone said, plenty of shops say donation, and sell for 50k, and item thats 1 coin. Or buy items that are 50k for one coin. If you consider the other a scam, then you have to consider this a scam too, even if it says donation.
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  • VenusArmani - Dreamweaver
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,009 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    If my title states what im buying and selling for correctly, it's not scamming. If I purposely decieve in my title compared to what im doing in shop, it's a scam. Like someone said, plenty of shops say donation, and sell for 50k, and item thats 1 coin. Or buy items that are 50k for one coin. If you consider the other a scam, then you have to consider this a scam too, even if it says donation.

    BZZZ wrong. 1.4 is the common used title for 1.4 mil. It is not used for 1400. The person is making it look like its saying 1.4mil and that's what makes it a scam. He is stealing the title name and look in order to con people who aren't paying attention into selling to the shop. Donation is different because it makes it very clear that it's a donation.

    Again, and it seems that I cannot say it enough. DECEPTION IS WHAT MAKES IT A SCAM.

    And if you're one of the people scamming people in this way, then I hope they ban you. ::shrug:::
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  • augustfinknottle
    augustfinknottle Posts: 276 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    BZZZ wrong. 1.4 is the common used title for 1.4 mil. It is not used for 1400. The person is making it look like its saying 1.4mil and that's what makes it a scam. He is stealing the title name and look in order to con people who aren't paying attention into selling to the shop. Donation is different because it makes it very clear that it's a donation.

    It's not a scam. If I say "High Mats 1.4" noone will assume it's 1.4mil, unless they think I'm crazy. Something being common doesn't make them necessarily true always. If you take all possible interpretations into account, people saying "All you need" in their shops are scamming because, obviously, their shop doesn't have all I need. Or if they say "You can afford it" and sell something for more than I have. Also a scam?

    The point being, it's just as common for people to make mistakes typing extra 0s as it is typing fewer. Many times I've bought stuff for 1/10th their price from catshops that forgot a 0. What is that, reverse scam?

    How hard is it to just look the numbers you're buying/selling stuff for? No, seriously, just how terribly hard is it? Especially when selling stuff worth over 1mil. Especially now, that numbers are color coded. Why do people just assume others are scamming instead of just really wanting to get "donations"? Why is it you can open a catshop to get donations from faction members, but can't get donations from random strangers? Double standards much?

    There's no point to make on saying it is scam that doesn't involve assumption of whatever kind. If you can't be sure, don't put the blame on them. Innocent till proven guilty, etc.
  • VenusArmani - Dreamweaver
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,009 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    It's not a scam. If I say "High Mats 1.4" noone will assume it's 1.4mil, unless they think I'm crazy. Something being common doesn't make them necessarily true always. If you take all possible interpretations into account, people saying "All you need" in their shops are scamming because, obviously, their shop doesn't have all I need. Or if they say "You can afford it" and sell something for more than I have. Also a scam?

    The point being, it's just as common for people to make mistakes typing extra 0s as it is typing fewer. Many times I've bought stuff for 1/10th their price from catshops that forgot a 0. What is that, reverse scam?

    How hard is it to just look the numbers you're buying/selling stuff for? No, seriously, just how terribly hard is it? Especially when selling stuff worth over 1mil. Especially now, that numbers are color coded. Why do people just assume others are scamming instead of just really wanting to get "donations"? Why is it you can open a catshop to get donations from faction members, but can't get donations from random strangers? Double standards much?

    There's no point to make on saying it is scam that doesn't involve assumption of whatever kind. If you can't be sure, don't put the blame on them. Innocent till proven guilty, etc.

    You apparently didn't read the post. He is constantly changing his prices to match that of the catshops, he's made his catshop look exactly the same as all the catshops. But his differs in a very specific way. He's trying to trick people into selling to him. No, it's not the same as a shop that says "all you need," because there isn't any deception there. Nobody can predict what every last person in the world needs and there is no reasonable expectation that they can. It isn't a scam. It's the DECEPTION. It doesn't matter if it wouldn't be deceptive other places. Those XBOX flyers wouldn't be deceptive at a school fair that doesn't mean they were okay for EBAY.

    The intent to deceive is what makes it a scam. I don't know why I have to keep writing this and why people keep listing things that are obviously not scams because there was no intent to deceive as examples. They aren't proving your point at all.

    As for the donations things. You are free to get donations from anyone. But they HAVE TO KNOW IT"S A DONATION. You cannot trick them into donating or it's a scam. It's not a double standard.


    DECEPTION=SCAM.

    NO DECEPTION=NO SCAM.

    Simple.
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  • FayHumming - Dreamweaver
    FayHumming - Dreamweaver Posts: 325 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    You apparently didn't read the post. He is constantly changing his prices to match that of the catshops, he's made his catshop look exactly the same as all the catshops. But his differs in a very specific way. He's trying to trick people into selling to him. No, it's not the same as a shop that says "all you need," because there isn't any deception there. Nobody can predict what every last person in the world needs and there is no reasonable expectation that they can. It isn't a scam. It's the DECEPTION. It doesn't matter if it wouldn't be deceptive other places. Those XBOX flyers wouldn't be deceptive at a school fair that doesn't mean they were okay for EBAY.

    The intent to deceive is what makes it a scam. I don't know why I have to keep writing this and why people keep listing things that are obviously not scams because there was no intent to deceive as examples. They aren't proving your point at all.

    As for the donations things. You are free to get donations from anyone. But they HAVE TO KNOW IT"S A DONATION. You cannot trick them into donating or it's a scam. It's not a double standard.


    DECEPTION=SCAM.

    NO DECEPTION=NO SCAM.

    Simple.

    b:chuckle what happen if someone give you contract to sign it and he talk alot lies. You just sign the contract without reading it or you going read it first?
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  • VenusArmani - Dreamweaver
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,009 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    b:chuckle what happen if someone give you contract to sign it and he talk alot lies. You just sign the contract without reading it or you going read it first?

    I have never been scammed. Not in real life, not in game. I'm very cautious. That doesn't make scamming okay. Don't blame the victims, everyone makes mistakes sometimes. Be glad that yours hasn't been one in which you were scammed.

    And don't assume that everyone is the same as you either. Some people don't have good eyesight. They would be easy to take advantage of in the situation the OP describes. They could easily over look a zero. And it would be the scammers fault, not their own.
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  • thumbs
    thumbs Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    In-game: Press O; Select Shop; Select Pets; Buy Arcane Book Pets. -Now tell me that's any better.

    If it's ok for PW; it should be ok for shops. While people will buy ABP for lack of knowledge; people sell for lack of care.

    Yes; sellers should take responsibility. Not making them will result in them selling to their own low ball shops and making their squad eat it. The whole banking system is designed to scam by scammers to begin with and is a root cause of the issue.

    We're also talking a very grey area here. There's been shops in 1k for a long time buying cheap herbs for faction donations.

    Lastly: if you don't allow these shops; people will become lax and sell to the much rarer ones that pop up because they'll cease to be on guard. (it would make the situation worse)
  • VenusArmani - Dreamweaver
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,009 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    thumbs wrote: »
    In-game: Press O; Select Shop; Select Pets; Buy Arcane Book Pets. -Now tell me that's any better.

    It's definitely better. The arcane pet books are explained thoroughly in the boutique. If someone buys it that's on them. It does exactly what it says it will do. I'm not saying that they should be selling them. Because they do suck. They are a bad product. And PWI should feel bad for peddling that garbage.

    But they are being upfront and honest about what is and how long it lasts. So no, it's not a scam. It isn't deceptive.


    You guys keep just listing bad deals as scams. They aren't. You don't have to like the purchase, the seller simply has to be honest. If they attempt to deceive you to trick you into making a purchase you didn't want, it's a scam. If they sell you a piece of garbage but tell you what they are selling, then it's your fault for not doing your homework before purchasing.

    It's on the buyer to do their homework.
    It's on the seller to be honest so that the buyer can do their homework.
    And that's it. Really. Crappy products? Okay! Donations? Okay! High prices? Okay! Low prices? Okay! Tricking someone? Not okay.
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  • Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear
    Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear Posts: 879 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    BZZZ wrong. 1.4 is the common used title for 1.4 mil. It is not used for 1400. The person is making it look like its saying 1.4mil and that's what makes it a scam. He is stealing the title name and look in order to con people who aren't paying attention into selling to the shop. Donation is different because it makes it very clear that it's a donation.

    Again, and it seems that I cannot say it enough. DECEPTION IS WHAT MAKES IT A SCAM.

    And if you're one of the people scamming people in this way, then I hope they ban you. ::shrug:::



    Your obviously an idiot and didn't read clearly. I said that if I purposly word my title to decieve and have a differant price in my shop, IT IS A SCAM. I can buy/sell for any price I want, whether you like it or not. If I want to buy an item for 1 dollar, I can. you have no say so whatsoever in what I want to buy and sell at. I can put that I want to buy a cube neck for 1 dollar, I can do it if I want to. If I want to sell it for 900m, I can do that. Like I said, if someone puts in a title buying 350 and inside the shop, they are actually buying for 350, THATS NOT SCAMMING. Thats the price they want to buy for. If the next person doesn't pay attention, not the sellers fault. This is why there is a confirm before you buy or sell, to check and recheck. If after, you don't check before confirming, your an idiot. Maybe for people like you, they should have a SELL.....CONFIRM......ARE YOU SURE?........REALLY REALLY SURE?.........DON'T BE STUPID.......FINE, THEN SELL.
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  • VenusArmani - Dreamweaver
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,009 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Your obviously an idiot and didn't read clearly. I said that if I purposly word my title to decieve and have a differant price in my shop, IT IS A SCAM. I can buy/sell for any price I want, whether you like it or not. If I want to buy an item for 1 dollar, I can. you have no say so whatsoever in what I want to buy and sell at. I can put that I want to buy a cube neck for 1 dollar, I can do it if I want to. If I want to sell it for 900m, I can do that. Like I said, if someone puts in a title buying 350 and inside the shop, they are actually buying for 350, THATS NOT SCAMMING. Thats the price they want to buy for. If the next person doesn't pay attention, not the sellers fault. This is why there is a confirm before you buy or sell, to check and recheck. If after, you don't check before confirming, your an idiot. Maybe for people like you, they should have a SELL.....CONFIRM......ARE YOU SURE?........REALLY REALLY SURE?.........DON'T BE STUPID.......FINE, THEN SELL.


    I've said several times that it's not the pricing, it's the title of the shop that is the problem here. You obviously didn't read my post clearly because I've said it several times. I'll say it once more for you though.

    DECEPTION=SCAM
    NO DECEPTION= NO SCAM

    The person is using a deceptive shop title to trick people into selling to him. It's not about the price.

    I really don't know how much more clear I can make myself.
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  • augustfinknottle
    augustfinknottle Posts: 276 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    You guys keep just listing bad deals as scams. They aren't. You don't have to like the purchase, the seller simply has to be honest.

    There's no deception. Nowhere in the world does 1.4 mean exactly 1.4mil. Idc if he thinks the price of raptures is constantly overpriced by a 10x factor. You can't prove that person doesn't think like that. Moreover, the catshop doesn't say 1.4mil. He's not even lying. As I said, "High mats, 1.4" doesn't mean "High mats, 1.4mil", so why would "Raps 1.4" mean NECESSARILY 1.4mil? Answer: it doesn't. There's no deception.

    There's no deception on the price tag either. It says "1,400 coins". So, when you click a catshop to buy something, you should probably just READ THE PRICE. The title of the catshop does not necessarily reflect the prices.

    One could, for instance, so that he's not fooling people (according to you), buy 2 different stacks of raptures: 1 rapture for 1.4mil and then 1000 for 1.4k. "Ooops, I already bought my 1.4mil one, now only the 1.4k is left". So, in that case, there's no scam? Because the guy clearly bought a rapture for 1.4mil, and then he went afk and oops, he bought all the raps he thought were worth 1.4mil, now he only wants to pay 1.4k for them. You know, the price of stuff is not constant. If too many people sell, price falls, etc.

    He can buy/sell WHATEVER HE WANTS for WHATEVER PRICE HE THINKS FIT. People are not supposed to sell stuff without reading what they're getting for it. The whole point you make of deception is the point I'm making that you can't prove it. He is not lying, he is not cheating. All he's doing is, according to you, "looking like other catshops", which is such a ridiculous reason to assume people are using of deception.

    Now, if someone had a hax to make his 1.4k coins look like 1.4mil on someone else's screen, or if he had a way of getting the coins without giving the items/vice-versa, then that would be a scam.

    It's a terrible act, and a very common one these days, to assume everyone else is the bad guy, instead of innocent till proven otherwise.

    My whole point is: if you can't prove that person doesn't simply have some friends who sell them their raptures for 1/10 market price, or that he doesn't have a faction that sell him their crystals for cheap because they simply love him so much, or that he just doesn't really think they're worth 1.4mil, but 1.4k instead. You can't prove it's a scam, you just assume. You provide no valid point, sorry.
  • VenusArmani - Dreamweaver
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,009 Arc User
    edited October 2012

    My whole point is: if you can't prove that person doesn't simply have some friends who sell them their raptures for 1/10 market price, or that he doesn't have a faction that sell him their crystals for cheap because they simply love him so much, or that he just doesn't really think they're worth 1.4mil, but 1.4k instead. You can't prove it's a scam, you just assume. You provide no valid point, sorry.

    He is obviously copying the other catshops. Did you even read all the posts?
    It's not a typo, its a scam, plain and simple. That guy has been there for most of this x2, prices changing to look like the best deal at the time. Just because he's not technically lying doesn't make it any less deceptive and wrong.

    When they change their price, he changes his own, just to keep up the charade. If he actually believed it was worth 1.4k he wouldn't need to hide it. He wouldn't be changing them to match the other shop titles. The faction mates in your example would be still selling them to him for 1.4k. Did you read the XBOX link that Asterelle provided? He's doing the same thing. He's copying the look of another advert to make his seem like it's one thing when it's not. It's a scam.

    And the location makes all the difference in the world. If I were selling fake louis vuitton bags ouside a shop that sells bag that were inspired by louis vuitton with the the title "handbags" I wouldn't be scamming anyone. If I sold those same bags outside the louis vuitton store with the same banner, then I'm relying on Louis Vuitton's advertising to sell my bags and make think i'm selling authentic ones when I"m not. I'd be arrested. If the designer handbag's owner was in on the scam and I had permission to be there, that person would be fired. And possibly charged as an accessory.

    You can't just ignore the facts of the case such as the shop titles surrounding him or the location. And then call it not a scam. If you have to change the facts of the case to make it innocent, then you provide no valid point, sorry.
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  • augustfinknottle
    augustfinknottle Posts: 276 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    He is obviously copying the other catshops. Did you even read the original posts? When they change their price, he changes his own, just to keep up the charade. If he actually believed it was worth 1.4k he wouldn't need to hide it. He wouldn't be changing them to match the other shop titles. The faction mates in you're example would be still selling them to him for 1.4k. Did you read the XBOX link that Asterelle provided? He's doing the same thing. He's copying the look of another advert to make his seem like it's one thing when it's not. It's a scam.

    And the location makes all the difference in the world. If I were selling fake louis vuitton bags ouside a shop that sells bag that were inspired by louis vuitton with the the title "handbags" I wouldn't be scamming anyone. If I sold those same bags outside the louis vuitton store with the same banner, then I'm relying on Louis Vuitton's advertising to sell my bags and make me people think i'm selling authentic ones when I"m not. I'd be arrested.

    You can't just ignore the facts of the case such as the shop titles surrounding him or the location. And then call it not a scam. You provide no valid point, sorry.

    As I said, he could also think they're worth 1/10 their market price at any given time. Yes, I did read the OP posts. And yes, I did read the xbox thing. I don't remember it right now, but if I'm not wrong, those ads lied by giving the specs of the videogame and providing pics not only of the box.

    I see no problem with people selling xbox boxes for 500 dollars, even. If someone is dumb enough to buy them KNOWING they are empty boxes (as in, if the information is given to them, but they're just too stupid/lazy to read it thoroughly), their fault, not the sellers. It like some soda brands that look like coke (red/black colors). If you can't see it's not coke and buy it, your problem - as long as they don't have the coke brand on them.

    And why couldn't I open a handbag store of the Luois Viutton brand, with similar logo, in front of the Louis Vuitton one? Why can't I use the same colors? As long as I don't claim that they are Louis Vuitton, all fine by me. It's not counterfeiting, and, as long I'm not breaking any patent/copyright, my business is legal and fine.

    Back to the catshop, you just can't compare the space he has to write his prices/ads to the many other identifications possible on an ebay ad or a store in 5th avenue.

    Ofc, I can't say that that guy is absolutely innocent and that I'm sure of it. The whole point is there being a doubt - reasonable, possible doubt.

    But I guess I'll stop this discussion here. You don't want to change your mind, and I'm damn sure you can't change mine on that subject, so let's agree to disagree and leave it at that.
  • thumbs
    thumbs Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    It's definitely better. The arcane pet books are explained thoroughly in the boutique. If someone buys it that's on them. It does exactly what it says it will do.

    No; pets can go hungry from dying with it. It's also no better than a tome which is permanent and cheaper.
    But they are being upfront and honest about what is and how long it lasts. So no, it's not a scam. It isn't deceptive.

    The shops being discussed are far more upfront and honest.

    If they sell you a piece of garbage but tell you what they are selling, then it's your fault for not doing your homework before purchasing.

    It's much simpler to look at the price you're selling for (homework) than find out there's a much better cheaper alternative. You make no sense.

    In the example I gave; the buyer has no clue that there may be a better alternative so they're not likely to search for one. They shouldn't have to do homework in that case.

    Another example of PW being worse is the hidden fee attached to the AH.
  • Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear
    Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear Posts: 879 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    [QUOTE=
    DECEPTION=SCAM
    NO DECEPTION= NO SCAM

    [/QUOTE]

    Thanks for stating the obvious.. We all know he's being deceptive. The thing is, you can't tos for doing this. He didn't title his shop falsly, his prices are exactly as stated. This comes in the line with someone that accidentally puts a wrong price, and leaves the shop up overnight. In our eyes, we would think he's trying to scam, but maybe he didn't realize he did it. How are we to decide that? We know this is not accidental, but should we tos anyone that prices wrong? What and who is to say what price is wrong and what price is right? Like I said, people can price the way they want. So would it be wrong if he took the amounts out of the title? If he puts BUYING RAPS/CANNIES, then you go in the shop and he buys for 330 cans 1567 raps. How is this considered deception, just because his price is similar yet lower to benefit him to be able to buy more per the amount of coins he can afford. Now he's not advertising a price, you actually have to hover over the item to get the price. If someone still sells to the shop, is that the sellers fault or the buyers fault? It's not really scamming, but deceptive. I say non bannable.

    Also, I bet no one complains when they find a shop with items for sale that sellers make mistakes on. A few months ago I found a shop selling 200 anni packs and forgot to set the price. Paid about 30k for all. Of course I bought it, it's to my benefit. Let all the liars now say, I can't believe you didn't give it back to them. How many would give it back? Go ahead and act like an angel. If you found a cube neck in a shop accidentally priced to sell at 10k or so, tell me you wouldn't buy it? It's ok as long as it benefits. If it's non benefitial, it's a scam.
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  • VenusArmani - Dreamweaver
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,009 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    As I said, he could also think they're worth 1/10 their market price at any given time. Yes, I did read the OP posts. And yes, I did read the xbox thing. I don't remember it right now, but if I'm not wrong, those ads lied by giving the specs of the videogame and providing pics not only of the box.

    I see no problem with people selling xbox boxes for 500 dollars, even. If someone is dumb enough to buy them KNOWING they are empty boxes (as in, if the information is given to them, but they're just too stupid/lazy to read it thoroughly), their fault, not the sellers. It like some soda brands that look like coke (red/black colors). If you can't see it's not coke and buy it, your problem - as long as they don't have the coke brand on them.

    And why couldn't I open a handbag store of the Luois Viutton brand, with similar logo, in front of the Louis Vuitton one? Why can't I use the same colors? As long as I don't claim that they are Louis Vuitton, all fine by me. It's not counterfeiting, and, as long I'm not breaking any patent/copyright, my business is legal and fine.

    Back to the catshop, you just can't compare the space he has to write his prices/ads to the many other identifications possible on an ebay ad or a store in 5th avenue.

    Ofc, I can't say that that guy is absolutely innocent and that I'm sure of it. The whole point is there being a doubt - reasonable, possible doubt.

    But I guess I'll stop this discussion here. You don't want to change your mind, and I'm damn sure you can't change mine on that subject, so let's agree to disagree and leave it at that.


    You can't sell the handbags outside louis vuitton because it's illegal. It's considered scamming because you're relying on people thinking that it's Louis Vuitton. There is very clear and concise laws on selling knockoff handbags in the USA. US law matter here because PWI would likely act on the catshop based off their interpretation of US law, as that is where the company is located. And that is where the server is located. It has to be absolutely clear that the bag is not louis vuitton. You can't just say handbags and use a similar look as louis vuitton and sell them outside their store. People will think they are louis vuitton and they shouldn't have to check the label and see it's actually knockoff brand usa. They have a reasonable expectation that only authentic Louis Vuitton handbags will be sold at the Louis Vuitton store.

    And no, the assistant attorney general made it clear that the XBOX boxes were scams. The sellers did not lie about a single thing when selling the boxes. They didn't lie about the specs, they didn't lie about what you were getting. If you read the advertisement carefully, you'd be well aware that they are only selling the box.

    But they copied the look of the advertisement. That's all. They copied the look of actual advertisements for used XBOXes on EBAY to make it seem that they were selling them. But if you looked carefully you'd realize that it wasn't an XBOX it was only the box. They did basically the same exact thing this person is doing. They used commonly accepted advertisement to make it look like people were getting one thing, when they were actually getting another.

    And if this were ever taken to court, it would be a civil matter due to the individual nature of the scam and the small amount of money taken. And in civil court the standard isn't "beyond a reasonable doubt," it's based on the preponderance of the evidence. And based on the preponderance of the evidence, it's obvious that this person was attempting to scam people.

    thumbs wrote: »
    No; pets can go hungry from dying with it. It's also no better than a tome which is permanent and cheaper.



    The shops being discussed are far more upfront and honest.




    It's much simpler to look at the price you're selling for (homework) than find out there's a much better cheaper alternative. You make no sense.

    In the example I gave; the buyer has no clue that there may be a better alternative so they're not likely to search for one. They shouldn't have to do homework in that case.

    Another example of PW being worse is the hidden fee attached to the AH.


    The pet tomes do exactly what they say they are going to do. And yes it is more work to research the best option for feeding your pet. And yeah, even that guys **** deal is better than the pet tomes. But the pet tomes are not scams, simply distasteful. Because they do exactly what they say they are going to do. It doesn't matter if there are better deals.
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  • Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear
    Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear Posts: 879 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Another question.


    A shop wants to buy Cannies 320 instead of 320k. Titles it accordingly Buying Cannies 320, you say it's wrong.

    A shop owner puts his shop up and leaves the computer. Puts the shop up Buying Cannies 350k. Accidentally puts 3.5m each in the shop, doesn't realize it.

    Your looking to sell 100 cannies and find this shop with this mistake, is he scamming, or are you?

    Of course your going to sell your cannies, to benefit from his mistake. It's ok to sell to a shop thats overpriced, but not underpriced. Isn't this how economies run, buy low, sell high? Wouldn't you be considered a scammer, if your taking advantage of someones unfortunate mistake?

    yes, he knows what he's doing, but weight the options. He's titled according to his pricing. His prices are exactly as stated. So what if he's priced similar. It's how he wants to price it. If he stated in the title Buying cannies 350k, and inside the shop, it was set at 350, then there would be a reason to complain. And yes, I guess I would be considered a scammer since i purchased items that took advantage of someones unfortunate mistake. Should I be banned for buying packs that were not priced properly, or were they priced properly. Who would know, except the seller. I don't need to know the answer as long as it benefits me.
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  • VenusArmani - Dreamweaver
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,009 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Another question.


    A shop wants to buy Cannies 320 instead of 320k. Titles it accordingly Buying Cannies 320, you say it's wrong.

    A shop owner puts his shop up and leaves the computer. Puts the shop up Buying Cannies 350k. Accidentally puts 3.5m each in the shop, doesn't realize it.

    Your looking to sell 100 cannies and find this shop with this mistake, is he scamming, or are you?

    Of course your going to sell your cannies, to benefit from his mistake. It's ok to sell to a shop thats overpriced, but not underpriced. Isn't this how economies run, buy low, sell high? Wouldn't you be considered a scammer, if your taking advantage of someones unfortunate mistake?

    yes, he knows what he's doing, but weight the options. He's titled according to his pricing. His prices are exactly as stated. So what if he's priced similar. It's how he wants to price it. If he stated in the title Buying cannies 350k, and inside the shop, it was set at 350, then there would be a reason to complain. And yes, I guess I would be considered a scammer since i purchased items that took advantage of someones unfortunate mistake. Should I be banned for buying packs that were not priced properly, or were they priced properly. Who would know, except the seller. I don't need to know the answer as long as it benefits me.



    I've answered this already. But no, you can't scam yourself. Because in order for it to be a scam, it has to be deceptive. So if you make a pricing error, that's your fault. The seller would not be scamming simply because they sold you those cannies to their advantage. Because they didn't do anything to deceive you. They didn't tell you that it was only worth that much. They didn't tell you go afk. They didn't deceive you. Is it a bad transaction? Yes! Is it distasteful? Yes! Should they feel bad? Yes! Is it unfair? Yes! But it's not a scam.

    If he titled buying cannies 320=no scam. He titles it buying cannies 3.20 and sets it next to a shop also titled 3.20 buying it for 3.2 mil in the hopes of tricking people into thinking that the shops are buying for the same amount. It's a scam.


    The key word here is deception, deception, deception.
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  • Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear
    Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear Posts: 879 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    I've answered this already. But no, you can't scam yourself. Because in order for it to be a scam, it has to be deceptive. So if you make a pricing error, that's your fault. The seller would not be scamming simply because they sold you those cannies to their advantage. Because they didn't do anything to deceive you. They didn't tell you that it was only worth that much. They didn't tell you go afk. They didn't deceive you. Is it a bad transaction? Yes! Is it distasteful? Yes! Should they feel bad? Yes! Is it unfair? Yes! But it's not a scam.

    If he titled buying cannies 320=no scam. He titles it buying cannies 3.20 and sets it next to a shop also titled 3.20 buying it for 3.2 mil in the hopes of tricking people into thinking that the shops are buying for the same amount. It's a scam.


    The key word here is deception, deception, deception.


    but it's deceptive to be a buyer, that finds the mistake, doesn't tell the seller, and buys it anyway. Knowing that your doing something wrong by buying and not saying anything, to help the sellier fix his mistake, is also being deceitful. Which would fall under the catagory of a scammer, even though it was a mistake on the sellers part, it's decietful under the buyers part to not say anything and still take advantage of the mistake the seller clearly made.
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  • VenusArmani - Dreamweaver
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,009 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    but it's deceptive to be a buyer, that finds the mistake, doesn't tell the seller, and buys it anyway. Knowing that your doing something wrong by buying and not saying anything, to help the sellier fix his mistake, is also being deceitful. Which would fall under the catagory of a scammer, even though it was a mistake on the sellers part, it's decietful under the buyers part to not say anything and still take advantage of the mistake the seller clearly made.

    No, it' isn't deceptive on the buyers part. You're not giving them any sort of false impression. You're not convincing them something is true when it's not. You're not making it appear that something is one way, when it is in fact another. You're not lying, creating a deceptive environment, or tricking the person into selling you items for a price that they shouldn't. And that's why it's not deceptive, and not a scam.

    You're just taking advantage of their mistake. A mistake that they made through no fault of your own.

    Morally speaking, should you attempt to let the person know that they made a mistake instead of taking advantage of them? Most people would probably agree that it would be the honorable thing to do. When I see mistake, first I attempt to let the buyer know they made a mistake. I wait a small amount of time for them to respond to me. If they haven't responded, I assume that they were afk and someone else is going to buy it anyway. And buy it myself. Because I'm nice, not stupid. As a matter fact though, some people think the honorable thing to do is to teach them a lesson by taking the item so that they won't keep making the same mistake when it really matters. Everyone's morals are different.

    So, buying the item would be a moral issue. But it is not a scam. Because you didn't deceive them. They set that price on their own accord.
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  • krisnda
    krisnda Forum cat Posts: 4,655 Community Moderator
    edited October 2012
    Twelve pages.

    Twelve pages of half the people saying that the catshops trying to deceive people by placing bogus slogans and false prices are scammers, and the other half saying it's the buyers fault for not looking twice.

    I'm seriously lost here, why is this type of thing even being argued against? To me, it's wrong for the catshops that are trying to deceive buyers by trying to trick them by making it seem like your selling one item when it's a different item for a crazy price. (of whatever variant) Are the buyers at fault as well, yes because they should have double-checked what they were buying, but it's sad that there are dishonest people like the people doing this on PWI, or in real life (which is illegal).

    But again, I'm lost as to the fact that people would even defend these type of people, and if you do see shops like this, I urge you to report them.
  • augustfinknottle
    augustfinknottle Posts: 276 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Krisnda wrote: »
    Twelve pages.

    Twelve pages of half the people saying that the catshops trying to deceive people by placing bogus slogans and false prices are scammers, and the other half saying it's the buyers fault for not looking twice.

    Except that in this specific case there's no bogus slogan nor false prices. Prices are as stated, ans slogans as well.
  • krisnda
    krisnda Forum cat Posts: 4,655 Community Moderator
    edited October 2012
    Except that in this specific case there's no bogus slogan nor false prices. Prices are as stated, ans slogans as well.

    Catshop has "BestToken1.5m"
    buying for 1.5k.

    How is that not a false price/bogus slogan?
  • augustfinknottle
    augustfinknottle Posts: 276 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Krisnda wrote: »
    Catshop has "BestToken1.5m"
    buying for 1.5k.

    How is that not a false price/bogus slogan?

    From OP:
    There's a catshop in Sanctuary that buys cannies/raptures for 286 / 1.280 when the normal prices are around 280k and 1,25M.

    Yes you did read right,286 NOT 286k he literally buys cannies for 286 coins and raps for a lil more than 1k coins.
    He's obviously trying to bait some idiot to sell his Nirvana drops for a price that's apparently very good while its in fact very close to nothing.

    Now,its catshop states " buy 286 / 1.280 " he didn't wrote "k" so APPARENTLY he's being honest and not liyng while in the other hand he's obviously trying to make people fell into it.

    So, not a false price/bogus slogan.
  • Xainou - Sanctuary
    Xainou - Sanctuary Posts: 5,369 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Just because they state the 'correct price' doesn't make it any less of a scam. They are using the environment of peoples expectations to trick people into losing cash if they're not careful. That bs should be banned.
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  • VenusArmani - Dreamweaver
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,009 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Krisnda wrote: »
    Catshop has "BestToken1.5m"
    buying for 1.5k.

    How is that not a false price/bogus slogan?

    They left out the m. And that's why they are arguing to keep the catshop up. Even though they are buying the cannies. Even though the catshop is copying all of the people next to them. Even though it's easier to type 150 instead of 1.5. Even though the catshop has proven that it's not about donations or wanting that specific price, by constantly changing their price to match the other catshops. So that it shows a clear and willful attempt to mislead anyone who stops at their catshop. Even though the assistant attorney general has said something that is pretty much the same thing in the case of the XBOX box sellers is indeed a scam. And so there is precedence for this kind of thing IRL and thus a video game company would be well within it's rights to make a player stop the deception.

    But you know, it doesn't have an "m," and that makes it okay.
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  • krisnda
    krisnda Forum cat Posts: 4,655 Community Moderator
    edited October 2012
    From OP:



    So, not a false price/bogus slogan.

    Oh I see, your one of "those guys".


    You know as well as I do that this is a simple phishing scam.

    PHISHING SCAMS

    THE SETUP: You get an official looking e-mail from a reputable site such as your bank or an online auction or payment site. The email informs you the information on your account is outdated and provides a link to a page where you can update your information.

    THE ZINGER: The link will take you to a webpage that looks identical to the reputable site, but in reality has been set up by a scammer to collect your personal information. The result can range from charges on your credit card to identity theft.

    So they are putting that "price" to look like they are buying/selling, whatever, however that "price" is so they can get gullible people to just buy it without looking.
  • Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear
    Mr_Swiss - Heavens Tear Posts: 879 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Krisnda wrote: »
    Twelve pages.

    Twelve pages of half the people saying that the catshops trying to deceive people by placing bogus slogans and false prices are scammers, and the other half saying it's the buyers fault for not looking twice.

    I'm seriously lost here, why is this type of thing even being argued against? To me, it's wrong for the catshops that are trying to deceive buyers by trying to trick them by making it seem like your selling one item when it's a different item for a crazy price. (of whatever variant) Are the buyers at fault as well, yes because they should have double-checked what they were buying, but it's sad that there are dishonest people like the people doing this on PWI, or in real life (which is illegal).

    But again, I'm lost as to the fact that people would even defend these type of people, and if you do see shops like this, I urge you to report them.

    So if I decide to buy tokens at a low price of 1k coins, but they selling for 10k, im wrong? If I put in my title buying 1k and in my shop buying at 1k, im wrong? So basically, so that money can keep flying around PWI, I HAVE to be buying at what everyone else is buying for. I'm a scammer for trying to buy low, sell high hahahaha. Too funny. I wouldn't report it if I saw a shop doing it. I would if I saw they had a differant price on the title, then what they had in the shop. but if they clearly stating they are buying for a certain price, and thats what they have it for in the shop, im not reporting it. They can buy at whatever price they feel like buying for. Just because the economy says, tokens are 10k, doesn't mean I have to buy tokens at 10k. I can buy them for 1k if someone decides to sell them to me at that price. I may not get anyone selling me them, but it's my choice to have my shop sit there for days not buying any. Freadom of choice.
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