Gold prices steadily increasing

Kinjeto - Raging Tide

Sarrafeline - Sanctuary wrote: »

I'll say this.

The cheaper gold is in AH, the less likely people are to put gold into the system.

Yeah, gold used to be 200k years ago. But, at the same time, it would take you weeks, or even months, to buy or sell gold at that price, because nobody charged zen to exchange it for gold via AH.

If you think a cap will work, then you are very stupid.

A gold cap in AH (say, at 1 mil like everyone seems to want, if they want a cap) would be the exact same thing as simply removing the gold exchange feature from PWI.

Also the guild base is designed to be a gold sink as well.

Sarrafeline - Sanctuary

Kinjeto - Raging Tide wrote: »

Also the guild base is designed to be a gold sink as well.

If there is one painfully obvious thing...

The devs that make this game don't have a ****ing clue how to make a coin sink.

endlesstorture

BH Lunar is a Fail coin sink because nobody does bh lunar because BH gives crappy rewards.

also i believe there is dupe coins/gold in this game.

truekossy

Sarrafeline - Sanctuary wrote: »

I'll say this.

The cheaper gold is in AH, the less likely people are to put gold into the system.

Yeah, gold used to be 200k years ago. But, at the same time, it would take you weeks, or even months, to buy or sell gold at that price, because nobody charged zen to exchange it for gold via AH.

This is far beyond highly exaggerated. During the first battle pet pack sale, for instance, I went through a good few hundred gold both on the buy and sell side in just the hour it lasted.

There was no shortage of gold and if you knew what you were doing, it was always fairly easy to stock up or sell it.

StormHydra - Sanctuary

i miss when gold prices were 110 000. Then perfect iron hammer and chest of coins came out and it was 200 000.
Then ani packs made it 500 000 and any F2P player is screwed in competitive scene imo.

Yuniryu - Raging Tide

Not worried, gold will be 2mil soon.b:bye

Wait till rank 9 seeker comes and rep sale = The end of pwi.
2mil +....b:laugh

angellicdeity

If they want a real coin sink all they need to give features which are clearly advantageous to players without a cash-shop component:


1) Transferring gems from the sockets of 1 armor to another for 3M+ depending on the shard and the gear grade difference.

2) Change refine transfer to require large amounts of coin only.

Etc.

SPlFFY - Raging Tide

The problem will be, that they will never do anything against this as long as they gain enough money.
This way they force more and more ppl to spend real money when they want to reach something in this game.

XxZavxX - Raging Tide

Have no clue why anyone would feel the need to whine about gold prices. Players set the prices... if there were not players that bid 1.3mil (current RT price) on gold than gold prices would not be that high. It's the players' fault for the way gold prices are. Why ask PWE to regulate players' crackheaded tendencies to inflate the economy?

WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary

NatureLover - Harshlands wrote: »

Like Michael_Dark said in point 2, if PWI places an NPC that sells gold at 1m each, 1m becomes the immediate cap for gold.

It's true that would cap Gold prices at 1m, but it would also hurt the game's real-life income, so it's very unlikely they'd do it.

Besides, if they wanted to lower Gold price at the cost of giving up some real-life income, there's already a simple way to do it: eliminate cash-shop sale prices.

Sarrafeline - Sanctuary wrote: »

Yeah, gold used to be 200k years ago. But, at the same time, it would take you weeks, or even months, to buy or sell gold at that price, because nobody charged zen to exchange it for gold via AH.

Um.... no.

Back when Gold was 200k, I was buying about 50 Gold every day, easy. I've been cash-shop merchanting non-stop ever since Gold was 125k, and there's never been a shortage of sellers that I can remember.

XxZavxX - Raging Tide wrote: »

Have no clue why anyone would feel the need to whine about gold prices. Players set the prices... if there were not players that bid 1.3mil (current RT price) on gold than gold prices would not be that high. It's the players' fault for the way gold prices are. Why ask PWE to regulate players' crackheaded tendencies to inflate the economy?

Because PWI directly controls supply and demand via the prices that they set in the cash-shop.

While many players think Gold prices are set by mysterious market forces that are beyond human comprehension, the reality is that it's pretty easy to predict what they're going to be simply by doing a direct calculation of what's on-sale at what price in the cash-shop.

Ahira - Lost City

Dont really know much about economics etc (sorry i didnt go for your +10 orb plan Oisb:surrender) but there does seem to be a detachment between the real in game economy (mats, herbs, books) where there is little inflation, and the CS boutique economy which as a few have said is hyper inflating.

I have to agree with WarrenWolfy- a gold cap just would not work, exactly for the reasons he's described. PW coin sink attempts are also laughable but then again the coin sink idea is flawed to begin with.

From my (limited b:surrender) viewpoint the main reason for the increasing gold price is not just the increasing number of sales (though it does play a large role), but its really the general pricing plus the higher discounting that they've slowing started to do during the sales.

Every boutique sale the gold cost of the items is getting progressively cheaper. For example dragon orb 1* are now 90 silver for 10 whereas most can remember when on sale they'd be 1.8 gold for 10 or something like that. Or maybe packs- you can get for 36 silver now (in bulk) but they started off 1 gold each. As the accepted in game price of most items tends to stay the same increased discounting might be because PW are keeping an eye on gold prices and so are trying to keep within purchasable range- but it seems to be both cause and effect. I guess thats why there are more and more sales- its not PWI just wanting more profits (okie actually maybe it is a little b:chuckle), but without constant offers, non-sale boutique items are just way too expensive to buy.

So from my understanding of it- the simplest way to solve this would be to just increase the gold price of certain boutique items/sale offers. This would be in effect a coin sink and the gold rate should decrease to levels determined by hammer/pack/rank price. Any other way would have to be extremely clever to work and get right (PWI doesnt really have the best reputation in that regard tho!).

LenieClarke - Heavens Tear

Ois - Lost City wrote: »

Wasn't there a gold cap of 1 mil in this version before? I swear there was...maybe I'm wrong though.

there was, and it got raised to (IIRC) four million when gold prices began to seriously approach one million. this cap is there as a safeguard against typos when you're buying/selling gold, to save gold traders from the worst of their own misclick ****-ups, and for no other reason.

SPlFFY - Raging Tide

XxZavxX - Raging Tide wrote: »

Have no clue why anyone would feel the need to whine about gold prices. Players set the prices... if there were not players that bid 1.3mil (current RT price) on gold than gold prices would not be that high. It's the players' fault for the way gold prices are. Why ask PWE to regulate players' crackheaded tendencies to inflate the economy?

Maybe think about, who bids such high prices.
The ones who get enough money do this, but not the average player with maybe a few millions ingame money.
I`d guess that the big majority would never bid that high.

Zenzell - Dreamweaver

That's a facist voting sytem ya got thar.

Elenacostel - Heavens Tear

WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary wrote: »

So why don't people do it this way? Because it's more convenient to trade through the AH due to the concentration of buyers/sellers all in one place.

Yeah, I was hoping that player stupidity would out-weigh player greed.

Pyrostormz - Raging Tide

until token of best luck are removed from packs, nothing else will work

the coin that generates is astronomical

Angel_Spawn - Sanctuary

1,8 - 2m atm on Sanct. b:shocked

LenieClarke - Heavens Tear

no need to remove best luck tokens altogether. just remove the option of trading a pair of them for ten million coin. (i still need to sit down with the game client and figure out what their value would be absent that option...)

Pyrostormz - Raging Tide

fair enough.... i mean, i doubt many people have grinded 10 million coins on all their accounts combined, and pwi just gives it out

8.25 billion coins per 100k packs opened.... no wonder gold is crazy, there has been a pack sale for 6 weeks running, with tigers tossed in the middle as well

FrozenPhire - Lost City

Ois - Lost City wrote: »

Put a fking gold cap at 1-1.2mil...this 1.4-1.6mil gold price is getting old. b:surrender

if u can afford, 1-1.2mil gold, whats the extra 200-400k gonna do to you? lol

fail post./

endlesstorture

FrozenPhire - Lost City wrote: »

if u can afford, 1-1.2mil gold, whats the extra 200-400k gonna do to you? lol

fail post./

kitchen pls

XxZavxX - Raging Tide

WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary wrote: »

Because PWI directly controls supply and demand via the prices that they set in the cash-shop.

While many players think Gold prices are set by mysterious market forces that are beyond human comprehension, the reality is that it's pretty easy to predict what they're going to be simply by doing a direct calculation of what's on-sale at what price in the cash-shop.

PWE does not control demand. They don't force anyone to bid on gold. Players/Merchants are the one who bid on gold. And they aren't patient, so they bid higher and higher to get gold as fast as they can. Sure, there might be products in the boutique that players want and merchants want to sell. However, no one is holding a gun to their head and telling them to inflate gold prices by constantly bidding over the price the guy before them set.

If players wanted lower gold prices they could easily bid smarter. Instead of outbidding, they could just bid the same as the last person. It might take longer, but it would prevent gold prices to soar like they have.

I think the only thing PWE has done wrong is state Riders would be on sale for X-amount of time, found out they were popular, and left them in the boutique. But players certainly are more responsible for setting bids so high.

_Perses_ - Lost City

Ois - Lost City wrote: »

Put a fking gold cap at 1-1.2mil...this 1.4-1.6mil gold price is getting old. b:surrender

Nuuuu


If gold price is capped at that it means people will QQ and not buy as many big room/solo frosts !!!!

endlesstorture

gold cap is good.

SashaGray - Heavens Tear

XxZavxX - Raging Tide wrote: »

PWE does not control demand. They don't force anyone to bid on gold. Players/Merchants are the one who bid on gold. And they aren't patient, so they bid higher and higher to get gold as fast as they can. Sure, there might be products in the boutique that players want and merchants want to sell. However, no one is holding a gun to their head and telling them to inflate gold prices by constantly bidding over the price the guy before them set.

If players wanted lower gold prices they could easily bid smarter. Instead of outbidding, they could just bid the same as the last person. It might take longer, but it would prevent gold prices to soar like they have.

I think the only thing PWE has done wrong is state Riders would be on sale for X-amount of time, found out they were popular, and left them in the boutique. But players certainly are more responsible for setting bids so high.

Just because you dont understand how, or refuse to accept that pwi controls gold prices, doesnt mean that they dont. Prices are manipulated both directly (chests of coins, token>wine>coin) and indirectly (building up demand for rank 9, releasing high demand items immediatly after or even while another high demand item is on sale) you can also be sure that they employ a statistical analysis to determine what sells the most gold.

There are also systemic flaws leading to the increase in gold price, such as a lack of a significant coin sink to compete with the rate coins are added, most notably from TOBLS

XxZavxX - Raging Tide

SashaGray - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Just because you dont understand how, or refuse to accept that pwi controls gold prices, doesnt mean that they dont. Prices are manipulated both directly (chests of coins, token>wine>coin) and indirectly (building up demand for rank 9, releasing high demand items immediatly after or even while another high demand item is on sale) you can also be sure that they employ a statistical analysis to determine what sells the most gold.

There are also systemic flaws leading to the increase in gold price, such as a lack of a significant coin sink to compete with the rate coins are added, most notably from TOBLS

They don't control gold prices. People shelling out 1.3mil coins for 1gold control gold prices.

Player X wants something PWE supplies =/= setting prices

Player X bidding 1.3mil on gold for certain amounts of gold to purchase whatever they want sets the price.

It's not macroeconomics....

SashaGray - Heavens Tear

I can't stop you from being willfully ignorant.

WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary

XxZavxX - Raging Tide wrote: »

If players wanted lower gold prices they could easily bid smarter. Instead of outbidding, they could just bid the same as the last person. It might take longer, but it would prevent gold prices to soar like they have.

Fortunately for me, most players are "smart", and would agree with you. b:chuckle

But unfortunately for them, an idiot like me then comes along. b:laugh

"Smart" players refuse to raise their bid prices in hopes that their resolve will result in Gold prices slowly going down. They feel very strongly that their reasoning makes perfect sense, and inevitably are upset that the rest of PWI doesn't do things according to what they think everyone ought to do.

I'm an idiot, though, so I let basic math do my thinking for me instead.

First, I let Excel add up the value of all the rewards that come out of Easy Rider Packs, and I find that they pay out about ~375k per Pack.

Next, I add 20% to that price because people love to gamble, so they're willing to pay more than they're actually worth in hopes of getting lucky. That brings us to ~450k.

Now this is where I ignore all that highfalutin' nonsense about supply and demand, and how the players set Gold prices, and about greed, and about being smart/stupid, etc..., etc..., etc... Those explanations are for "smart" people, and I prefer to stay as stupid as possible and let brainless, objective, opinion-less math do all the work instead.

So I just do a straight-forward division based on whatever PWI is selling Packs for: 450k per Pack / 0.36 Gold per Pack = 1.25 million per Gold.

Ta da! I now know the base-line price for Gold, as set by PWI's current 0.36 Gold per Pack exchange rate. Which is why back when Gold was selling for 1.1 million and the "smart" people were refusing to buy for such a "high" price, I was furiously buying as much as I could, knowing that it was actually under-priced.

Of course, 1.25 million is just the base-line. The current price is higher than that because of the Rep/Badge sale followed by the Dragon Orb sale.

Ultimately, "smart" players who refuse to pay "high" prices are actually just clueless about how easily and predictably Gold prices are controlled, and about how powerless players are to do anything about it. They can argue with idiots like me all they want, but meanwhile the idiots are scooping up all the profits.

Elenacostel - Heavens Tear

I think I came to a similar conclusion, but through different means.

However, Sir WarrenWolfy, I unsure as to your stance on the following: should the average player be required to arrive to such conclusions if they simply want to buy items from the Item Mall?

I feel they should not. The average player just wants to play an MMORPG. Not become an connoisseur of MMORPG economics. Thus, I do not really fault the average player for wanting things that they cannot realistically get.

Insisting a method that won't work, now that's a different story.

ResMePls - Heavens Tear

If you wanted to play and MMO where you basically **** slash and not have to worry about economy, PWI is definitely not for you.