Genie Discussion

I_sage_i - Harshlands

hey guys i have a new genie that im building for PVP purposes only and im not exactly sure on what skills to get although i have a few a mind but still would like some advice guidence and or help!

Longevity (74/100)
FREE POINTS:20
STR:5
DEX:75
VIT:44(green 16pts from gears)
MAG:45
(JADE, CHARM, MIRRIOR, ORB ALL SPOTS ARE FILLED WITH +4 VIT STONES TO TOTAL 16)
Affinity:22
MT:4 WT:0 WD:5 ER:0 FR:3

Points left:10

Current skills:
extreme poison:10
Fortify:1
Spark:10
Badge of courage:10

notes:i have 20 attribute reset orders but i do not have a affinity reset stone. im pretty sure i could buy more attribute reset orders if need to be. im looking forward to using this as my pk/NW genie and nothing eisle but PK/NW. if you have any questions or advice or anything really that could help me or help you help me, then ask/answer away!

in reply to adorit's post on my thread:my gear right now is terrible! im currently awaiting a medal of glory and GST sale so i can get r9 ring+wep. ill post a pwcalc of what my gear will be once i obtain my ring and wep(which is when i planned on starting to pk anyway). http://pwcalc.com/e9d8cebb5c2a2e49

Adroit - Lost City

I_sage_i - Harshlands wrote: »

hey guys i have a new genie that im building for PVP purposes only and im not exactly sure on what skills to get although i have a few a mind but still would like some advice guidence and or help!

Longevity (74/100)
FREE POINTS:20
STR:5
DEX:75
VIT:44(green 16pts from gears)
MAG:45
(JADE, CHARM, MIRRIOR, ORB ALL SPOTS ARE FILLED WITH +4 VIT STONES TO TOTAL 16)
Affinity:22
MT:4 WT:0 WD:5 ER:0 FR:3

Points left:10

Current skills:
extreme poison:10
Fortify:1
Spark:10
Badge of courage:10

notes:i have 20 attribute reset orders but i do not have a affinity reset stone. im pretty sure i could buy more attribute reset orders if need to be. im looking forward to using this as my pk/NW genie and nothing eisle but PK/NW. if you have any questions or advice or anything really that could help me or help you help me, then ask/answer away!

in reply to adorit's post on my thread:my gear right now is terrible! im currently awaiting a medal of glory and GST sale so i can get r9 ring+wep. ill post a pwcalc of what my gear will be once i obtain my ring and wep(which is when i planned on starting to pk anyway). http://pwcalc.com/e9d8cebb5c2a2e49

Hmmm, you're probably going to be struggling quite a bit in pvp/nw with that gear.. but a good genie could help a bit. Just so I don't forget, in your calc it shows you dropped dex to 3, which is not possible in game (only possible for vit/mag to be 3 for some reason.. str/dex are minimum of 5).. and you can reduce your planned strength to 47 to get benefit from the str on your neck. There are actually a number of things I'd change in your build, but I'm going off on a tangent and it isn't what you asked about lol.

As for the genie, with 5k hp you'll almost certainly need to focus on defensive skills. I'd drop extreme poison, and add holy path and absolute domain for sure (both level 10). This would leave you with just one last genie slot, which is a little more difficult to decide on. I think you'd be better off with a skill like Aquaflame Armor (AFA) than wind shield, or maybe even better expel if you could level yourself + genie to 102. You aren't going to be able to soak up much damage (even reduced damage), so you are probably going to need to focus on not getting hit (fortify, badge, holy path) and immuning (domain/expel) through any damage coming your way. (If level 102 is out of the question, I'd probably try for AFA though)

On a dex genie (with badge/spark), I think it is good practice to have a MINIMUM of 90 dex (with gear).. and that means you'll probably want to get new gear for your genie. Ideally you'd get +4dex/+4(mag or vit) gear with medals, but if that is not possible you should at the very minimum get +4 dex gear. You can drop one point from dex to have it be 74 base (+16 from gear = 90), and I'd probably throw all of your remaining points into vit. You usually start fights with full genie energy, and having a larger energy pool is nice. If you were decked out in full r999 +10/+12 gear more points in magic might make sense because if you can stay alive for long periods of time you can benefit more from the faster regen.. but vit would probably be the better choice for you. You might even consider moving two points from mag to vit (its a 1:1 ratio, and imo vit would be more useful for you), but that is really minor stuff and not really a big deal either way.

_Raido - Archosaur

I_sage_i - Harshlands wrote: »

hey guys i have a new genie that im building for PVP purposes only and im not exactly sure on what skills to get although i have a few a mind but still would like some advice guidence and or help!

Longevity (74/100)
FREE POINTS:20
STR:5
DEX:75
VIT:44(green 16pts from gears)
MAG:45
(JADE, CHARM, MIRRIOR, ORB ALL SPOTS ARE FILLED WITH +4 VIT STONES TO TOTAL 16)
Affinity:22
MT:4 WT:0 WD:5 ER:0 FR:3

Points left:10

Current skills:
extreme poison:10
Fortify:1
Spark:10
Badge of courage:10

notes:i have 20 attribute reset orders but i do not have a affinity reset stone. im pretty sure i could buy more attribute reset orders if need to be. im looking forward to using this as my pk/NW genie and nothing eisle but PK/NW. if you have any questions or advice or anything really that could help me or help you help me, then ask/answer away![/url]

There isn't that much I can add that Adroit hasen't already said.
Ok, first off, with that gear you'll want defense skills as top priority, you can't do damage if you're DEAD. And in NW nowadays you'll be dying a LOT.
You'll definitely be struggling vs ranged classes, provided you can just dodge melees like Neo from The Matrix.

Fortify's always good, as is Badge, you'll be wanting a very high dex genie anyways.

You'll require AD, that's a given. I don't use windshield yet but from what Adroit's said it's pretty good and I'll be trying it soon. AFA and HolyPath's always good too.

Good luck out there.

I_sage_i - Harshlands

thank you both but im not looking for anymore defensive skills after i get AD the rest of the skill slots i want to be filled with dmg boosting skills. i have noticed in NW that my KDR is really really good. i tend to kill alot more than i die TBH i dont die that ofthen in NW idk why though....but ya im looking for ways to boost my dmg i was thinking of holy path but then i would defnetily have to keep my giene mag at 50 for recharge. also adorit that impression i got from your post is that id be doing alot of 1vs1 which is not true at all because 1vs1 does not exist on harshlands.

EDIT: ya 102 is out of the question lol im not really bent on leveling..only reason im 101 is because r9 requires 101

Adroit - Lost City

I_sage_i - Harshlands wrote: »

thank you both but im not looking for anymore defensive skills after i get AD the rest of the skill slots i want to be filled with dmg boosting skills. i have noticed in NW that my KDR is really really good. i tend to kill alot more than i die TBH i dont die that ofthen in NW idk why though....but ya im looking for ways to boost my dmg i was thinking of holy path but then i would defnetily have to keep my giene mag at 50 for recharge. also adorit that impression i got from your post is that id be doing alot of 1vs1 which is not true at all because 1vs1 does not exist on harshlands.

EDIT: ya 102 is out of the question lol im not really bent on leveling..only reason im 101 is because r9 requires 101

I was not assuming you'd be doing 1v1s, but it seems pretty silly to say 1v1s don't exist on HL.. I'd be willing to bet a very large sum of money that they do exist. Anyway, if you are already doing "really really good" in nw with your current gear, I'm confused as to why you are asking for help with your genie.. it doesn't sound like you need any (and you seem to already have a good idea of what you want on your genie anyway.. so lol). It almost sounds like you are playing an entirely different game, not much I can help you with.

Nurfed_You - Harshlands

dude has a tt99 green sword. i one hit him twice yesterday, while 3v1ing a few different people. 1v1's exist when you actually have some gear.

I_sage_i - Harshlands

Nurfed_You - Harshlands wrote: »

dude has a tt99 green sword. i one hit him twice yesterday, while 3v1ing a few different people. 1v1's exist when you actually have some gear.

pretty sure you have wrong person sir. i have actually never had a tt99 green sword i consider tt99 green just a little bit useless /sarcasm. i have seen your gear and you probably have one hit me(your r9t3+12 and im in r8 gear) lolz i mean did you expect something a bit different? just wondering. anywayz your right 1vs1 do exist only for r9t3 people because they are UTTERLY BORED AND HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO. they have beaten the game and all they do is sit at west or silver pool 1vs1ing the same people over and over again. so congratz you beat the gam along with the other 30+ people on our server. would you like chocolate chip or sugar? because clearly your asking for a cookie right?

I_sage_i - Harshlands

Adroit - Lost City wrote: »

I was not assuming you'd be doing 1v1s, but it seems pretty silly to say 1v1s don't exist on HL.. I'd be willing to bet a very large sum of money that they do exist. Anyway, if you are already doing "really really good" in nw with your current gear, I'm confused as to why you are asking for help with your genie.. it doesn't sound like you need any (and you seem to already have a good idea of what you want on your genie anyway.. so lol). It almost sounds like you are playing an entirely different game, not much I can help you with.

your advice was helpful i filled the other skill slots with AD and holy path. i suppose i wanted help on genie skills that would get me out of really bad binds(fortify, badge, holypath) and damage ampers (spark, extreme poison). its just in NW i dont die as much as i kill. and i got the idea to build my genie from yours that i see in your videos(with some modifcations ofcourse due to gear differnces)

Nurfed_You - Harshlands

you sir seem very butt hurt, and if it wasnt you that came out to west a couple times then it was some wizzie who had pretty much the exact same name. b:bye

I_sage_i - Harshlands

Nurfed_You - Harshlands wrote: »

you sir seem very butt hurt, and if it wasnt you that came out to west a couple times then it was some wizzie who had pretty much the exact same name. b:bye

and my reason to be butt hurt is?????? b:surrenderyour post confuse me

Adroit - Lost City

Another update!

Finally got my hands on a 91+ genie, ended up with a 93 LP level 105 discipline genie.. pretty close to the same as my old genie. It has 3str/100dex/55vit/60mag with gear, (base stats are 3/84/55/44).. and I decided to go with more magic rather than vit simply because my gear allows me to survive much longer.. and I find myself waiting on regen more often than wishing I could chain skills.

Skills are also pretty much the same

01 wind force
10 holy path
01 fortify
10 spark
10 badge of courage
01 wind shield
10 aquaflame armor
10 extreme poison

I'm thinking the last slot will be a variable slot, and I'll be able to add/remove skills depending on a situation. For example, if I were fighting a psy.. I could potentially remove poison and add will surge.. or if I 1v1ing a good ep I could put the immune to metal skill, etc etc. I'm trying poison right now because I am finding myself having to kill without spark more and more often (some people that I regularly fight are ninja fast with soul of fire.. or I agree not to use spark in a 1v1 so that they'll fight me etc) so having another way to boost my damage is pretty nice. The main skills I'd be considering for the last slot are..

poison, will surge, domain, heart of steel, expel?, frenzy possibly or anything else that comes to mind.

Anyway, gotta test it out for a bit.. see how it goes

XSonOfCircex - Sanctuary

Good luck and contrats

Alex_Gantz - Dreamweaver

OK pro wizzies.. I need your smexy help pls b:surrender
I`m building a genie whos main purpose will be pvp (mostly NW and maybe TW) and I want it as more offensive as possible, with maybe holy path and ToP, my genie will probably end with 71/100 or 81/100 I would like to know some skills I could add (i was thinking about Frenzy and genie Spark) and how to locate the points in order to get a good balance between str, mag, vit and dex.
Thks a lot for your help! b:pleased

Adroit - Lost City

Alex_Gantz - Dreamweaver wrote: »

OK pro wizzies.. I need your smexy help pls b:surrender
I`m building a genie whos main purpose will be pvp (mostly NW and maybe TW) and I want it as more offensive as possible, with maybe holy path and ToP, my genie will probably end with 71/100 or 81/100 I would like to know some skills I could add (i was thinking about Frenzy and genie Spark) and how to locate the points in order to get a good balance between str, mag, vit and dex.
Thks a lot for your help! b:pleased

Can you include a pwcalc of your gear? I can tell you right off the bat that I'd recommend not putting any strength on your genie, dex is going to be either 90 to 100 with gear.. and the rest will go into vit/mag (the amounts of both depend on the type of genie, the LP on the genie, and your gear). But yeah, it would be really helpful if you included a calc of your gear, a budget (what kind of genie gear you can afford, or a better idea what kind of genie.. i.e. 81+/100 clean discipline or 71+/100 clean zeal etc)

Alex_Gantz - Dreamweaver

Adroit, thks a lot for your help, for some reason the pw calculator seems to not be working, my gear ftm is full g16 with +5 refines on everything but hat (+6) cube necklace +8 and warsong belt +6 with ring of trauma and r8 ring , all sharded with flawless citrines since i m not planning to stay on g16, i will start to move to r9rr piece by piece, and my weap is the r9 weap +8 (i will get the requiem on a couple of weeks) .
Ftm the genie I have is a clean lvl 99 71/90 Zeal .. so I pray for 10 LP anyway i will keep trying to get an 81/100 , regarding the genie gear I think i can afford intermediate gear or maybe +4

Adroit - Lost City

Alex_Gantz - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Adroit, thks a lot for your help, for some reason the pw calculator seems to not be working, my gear ftm is full g16 with +5 refines on everything but hat (+6) cube necklace +8 and warsong belt +6 with ring of trauma and r8 ring , all sharded with flawless citrines since i m not planning to stay on g16, i will start to move to r9rr piece by piece, and my weap is the r9 weap +8 (i will get the requiem on a couple of weeks) .
Ftm the genie I have is a clean lvl 99 71/90 Zeal .. so I pray for 10 LP anyway i will keep trying to get an 81/100 , regarding the genie gear I think i can afford intermediate gear or maybe +4

It pains me to see people spend billions of coin on end game gear and then leaving it at poo refines (+5 costs what.. 6m?), refines give you way more "bang for your buck" than the actual gear (imo you'd be crazy to settle for anything below +10 on r9rr armor).. but again I'm going on a tangent that you didn't ask about.

For your genie, I think the bare minimum for a wizard genie should be...

spark, fortify, holy path.. if you don't have a purify wep then you'll almost certainly want badge (you may or may not want it with purify wep.. I still have it on my genie), and it is highly advisable to have some other defensive skills as well. The defensive skills you should probably be considering are..

wind shield
aquaflame armor
absolute domain
expel

You mentioned tree of protection, but ToP is really only effective with a high strength genie.. and even then it is for very tanky players. ToP costs a lot, works slow, and the effect is unlikely to save you if you are in a really tricky spot. I would suggest choosing from the skills I listed above, wind shield doesn't necessarily need to be level 10 (I keep mine at level 1.. it costs 35 energy for an 18% reduction.. level 10 would be 62 energy for 27% reduction, I like being able to spam it all the time). Aquaflame armor description is wrong, at 100 dex it is ~53% reduction for 10 seconds and then amps you for ~31% for the following 10 seconds (with a purify wep, the reduction will usually buy enough time/hits for a purify and then you kite while you are amped) and it is interesting to note that neither the amp nor reduction can be purified or purged from you. Absolute domain is nice for lesser geared players because you can obviously survive for 5 seconds regardless of gear, but you pay for that in energy cost and cooldown. Kinda the same deal with expel, it will keep you alive for a few seconds vs physical, but you pay in energy cost and being unable to attack for that period.

As for offensive skills (that you asked about), the only real ones to consider are..

spark (you DEFINITELY want this.)
extreme poison
frenzy

You'd be absolutely crazy not to have spark, I'm going to assume you already understand why. Extreme poison is kinda nice for single targets.. with a dex genie it lasts a long time and it helps your squad as well (and it's fairly cheap). I'm not a huge fan of frenzy, at end game you should have over 100 atk level, so the boost from frenzy isn't quite as noticable.. if your target had 0 defense levels it'd increase your damage by less than 10% (on someone with equal defense levels to your atk levels it'd increase your damage by 20%.. although most of the time it is less than that). The main problem I found with frenzy is just that it costs so much, and reducing your survival is obviously not a good thing. Without awesome gear it is like a beacon asking any ea to one shot you (and you probably won't have genie energy for defensive skills when you inevitably get targeted).

As for the stats on your genie, with a 7x genie you'd probably want to have 90 dex (with gear) because you are short on stats (and you don't sound like you are able to afford medal gear.. so you will be even more short on stats). So with +4 gear (super cheap, you should be able to afford this at the VERY minimum) you'd have 74 base dex.. and you'd want to put the rest of your points into vit and magic. You can add 40 to the base stats before it starts requiring 2 points per stat, so on a zeal you would probably want to up vit to 45, and throw whatever is left into magic. If you had a higher lucky point genie where you could fill out both (for a zeal that would mean 45vit and 55magic before gear), then you'd have to decide which you value more.. but I don't think you'll have this issue. If you can't max out both, you could also do some mix (i.e. put mag up to 40, put rest into vit.. or something of the like) just depends if you want to have a larger pool of genie energy (chain skills back to back) or regen energy faster (probably more useful for well geared chars that don't die often).

I know you said that you wanted offensive skills, but in my experience spark is all you need offensively on your genie. Killing people is the easy part, the trouble is that when you learn how to use spark effectively you become a very high priority target.. and you'll spend a lot of time trying to survive.. so I think you'd be better off with extra defensive skills (especially with your gear).. but it is ultimately up to you.

Putting it all together.. for a 75/100 zeal with +4 dex gear I'd probably make it something like the following for myself:

5str,90dex,45vit,47mag (with gear) and it'd have..
level 10 spark
level 10 holy path
level 1 fortify
level 10 badge (at least until you get purify wep)
level 10 aquaflame armor
level 10 absolute domain

If it were 81+ I'd probably throw wind shield in there for the extra skill. Sorry for the wall of text, I didn't mean to write this much.. I got the impression that we were thinking about genies in a different way, and tried to give you other info in case you didn't want to just go with what I'd do for myself (i.e. if you still want more offensive skills, it is generally accepted that the ones I mentioned are probably the only worthwhile ones for a wizard's dex genie.. so maybe it'd help you narrow your search a bit).. anyway just my 2 cents

Alex_Gantz - Dreamweaver

Thks a lot Adroit! what you have say is really useful and I will seriously take it into consideration.
Regarding my gear is nirvy g16 for the moment and I`m planning to move to r9rr that s why i m keeping the refines low, after I make it to r9rr i will of course aim for +10 refines.
I will have the Requiem on two weeks max so I will base my study of my next genie on the fact that i will have a purify weap.
A few questions..
Does Spark works on NW? do you use it often in NW?
Also and sorry for the nooby question I think AD doesn t works in NW either, is that right?
Thks again Adroit b:thanks

Adroit - Lost City

Alex_Gantz - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Thks a lot Adroit! what you have say is really useful and I will seriously take it into consideration.
Regarding my gear is nirvy g16 for the moment and I`m planning to move to r9rr that s why i m keeping the refines low, after I make it to r9rr i will of course aim for +10 refines.
I will have the Requiem on two weeks max so I will base my study of my next genie on the fact that i will have a purify weap.
A few questions..
Does Spark works on NW? do you use it often in NW?
Also and sorry for the nooby question I think AD doesn t works in NW either, is that right?
Thks again Adroit b:thanks

Ah, must have misunderstood you then :P Everything works the same in nw except tactical reversion (only works on the world map), although if you are carrying the flag you obviously can't use genie skills. I use spark mostly to take down flag carriers that are trying to run past, most people I come across in nw are very easy to kill w/o spark (+12 r9rr wep.. most targets take 5 digits without any debuffs.. so not really necessary most of the time :P), but anyone that gives me a little trouble I'll just drop them with a quick spark combo.

skaitavia

Adroit, you're quite helpful, and I like seeing that ;D

Saeidon - Heavens Tear

Sup Adroit, I haven't spoken to you here in over 2 years, genie discussion thread >> every other thread on forums!

I saw your new genie, and yah, I wish I had the gear to build mine like that (I used to be a wind shield user, buy my gear is out of date now so I'm back to AD/Expel) ... soon maybe, soon I'll be back there.

Quick question though... do you actually use Wind Force? 90 energy for 60% boost for 6.5 seconds seems like a lot, though I can certainly see the benefit.

Adroit - Lost City

Saeidon - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Sup Adroit, I haven't spoken to you here in over 2 years, genie discussion thread >> every other thread on forums!

I saw your new genie, and yah, I wish I had the gear to build mine like that (I used to be a wind shield user, buy my gear is out of date now so I'm back to AD/Expel) ... soon maybe, soon I'll be back there.

Quick question though... do you actually use Wind Force? 90 energy for 60% boost for 6.5 seconds seems like a lot, though I can certainly see the benefit.

Haha long time no see! This is also my favorite thread on forums

Wind force costs like 37 energy (energy cost drops by 1 for every 2 genie levels.. so 105 it is 90 energy - (105/2) = 37.. it's 40 energy for a level 100 genie).. and with fuel on your fly mount you max your air flight speed with wind force (can keep up with someone holy pathing on the ground, can catch ground mounts etc).. so I use it very frequently. I use it a lot going around arch to save time, use it a ton in NW to get to the other flag spawns or to chase down a flag carrier (or to get back to battle after capping a flag), or in pvp to get away from a large gank for a few seconds (give me time to rebuff after a purge + master li etc).. just overall a fantastic skill. I like to think about it like a half cost holy path that works in the air.. it's awesome moving around at holy path speeds and still having plenty of genie energy left when you get to your destination :P

@Skai - thanks b:cute

Alex_Gantz - Dreamweaver

SweetieBot please give Adroit 10 points for being awesome and help me a lot b:pleased

SweetieBot - Lothranis

Alex_Gantz - Dreamweaver wrote: »

SweetieBot please give Adroit 10 points for being awesome and help me a lot

Alex_Gantz - Dreamweaver awards 10 points to Adroit - Lost City!
Adroit - Lost City now has a total of 8 points and is in 65th place.
Alex_Gantz - Dreamweaver can still award another 20 points today.

Check this thread for the current high scores and to learn how to award points to others.

Saeidon - Heavens Tear

Adroit - Lost City wrote: »

Haha long time no see! This is also my favorite thread on forums

Wind force costs like 37 energy (energy cost drops by 1 for every 2 genie levels.. so 105 it is 90 energy - (105/2) = 37.. it's 40 energy for a level 100 genie).. and with fuel on your fly mount you max your air flight speed with wind force (can keep up with someone holy pathing on the ground, can catch ground mounts etc).. so I use it very frequently. I use it a lot going around arch to save time, use it a ton in NW to get to the other flag spawns or to chase down a flag carrier (or to get back to battle after capping a flag), or in pvp to get away from a large gank for a few seconds (give me time to rebuff after a purge + master li etc).. just overall a fantastic skill. I like to think about it like a half cost holy path that works in the air.. it's awesome moving around at holy path speeds and still having plenty of genie energy left when you get to your destination :P

@Skai - thanks b:cute

Oh wow, yes I remember now. That is definitely significant.

This might sound strange but when I came back to the game I found a lot of white genies in my bank and wondered why I hadn't been going for the dex. It has all started flooding back that I was working on trying to get a 91+ and having air holy path!

It's odd how much you can forget over the course of time. I might make a bunch more genies again later.

Adroit - Lost City

Saeidon - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Oh wow, yes I remember now. That is definitely significant.

This might sound strange but when I came back to the game I found a lot of white genies in my bank and wondered why I hadn't been going for the dex. It has all started flooding back that I was working on trying to get a 91+ and having air holy path!

It's odd how much you can forget over the course of time. I might make a bunch more genies again later.

haha yeah BTW, I don't know what strategy you use to go for a 91+ genie.. but I spent probably more time than I should have trying to determine the best way to do it. You can look at the thread http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1578851. As a quick summary, trying to get a 91+ genie.. I determined that the best method (or at least pretty close to optimal) is to continue when you have..

8+/10 LP
17+/20 LP
26+/30 LP
36+/40 LP
42+/50 LP
52+/60 LP
62+/70 LP
71+/80 LP
81+/90 LP

Dunno if that helps, but thought I'd mention it :P

Tsyn - Raging Tide

I know I'm not a wiz, but hey ho! I've got a couple of questions for the wiz next door.

1. Adroit - have you ever considered the skill Blade of Supreme Heat? (Level 2 skill). It's a bit of a strange choice, but I've found it to be most interesting when used in 1v1 in conjunction with Blade Tempest. Many people have a pdef and mdef charm up, esp arcane classes, while dealing with a wizard. At 30 energy, BoSH would be an efficient way to tick both the physical and magical charm of an opponent before BT hits. It wouldn't have the magical (pun intended) amp of Spark, but it might work out...

2. This is regarding a sin genie I have planned out for myself. It's going to be a vit/mag genie, with Medal gear and 110 vit/75 mag/base stats.

Currently, since I'm not 105 (or planning to reach it anytime soon) I'm looking at the following skills for an 81+ LP genie (so I need to select 7 skills).

AD 10
Expel 10
Whirlwind 1
Fortify 1

I'm definitely getting the above four skills, but I need to select three from the following list:

Tangling Mire 10
EP 10
Holy Path 10
Windforce
My precious elemental resists (SoF, HoS, NP, WillS, etc)

I'd like to select a definite combination of at least two of the above skills, and leave one slot as a variable (for Soul of Fire, to switch to Heart of Steel, to switch to Will Surge, etc).

Basically, the debate raging on in my head is whether I should get Wind Force or Holy Path + my usual amps, or get both and go without damage amps/a variable slot.

3. What do you think about the Longevity starter skill's purge proc?

Saeidon - Heavens Tear

Adroit - Lost City wrote: »

haha yeah BTW, I don't know what strategy you use to go for a 91+ genie.. but I spent probably more time than I should have trying to determine the best way to do it. You can look at the thread http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1578851. As a quick summary, trying to get a 91+ genie.. I determined that the best method (or at least pretty close to optimal) is to continue when you have..

8+/10 LP
17+/20 LP
26+/30 LP
36+/40 LP
42+/50 LP
52+/60 LP
62+/70 LP
71+/80 LP
81+/90 LP

Dunno if that helps, but thought I'd mention it :P

I'm very excited about reading that thread. The figures look surprising tbh, I wouldn't have continued with a 42/50 that's for sure! Although I guess that could be taking resale value and trade states in to account? I'll take a look as soon as poss.

Edit: From experience, with no data, and so horribly unscientific. It always seemed to me that rolling an extreme was more likely than rolling a midrange. So 1's, 2's, 9's and 10's were more likely than 5's and 6's. Any truth to that found?

Adroit - Lost City

@Tsyn - I don't think blade of supreme heat would be very effective, spark already gets rid of the mdef charm.. and so you'd be trading the possibility of knocking out a pdef charm for the huge amp effect of spark. You'd also lose another genie skill slot, and tbh I don't use BT all that often in a 1v1 (undine -> sutra + spark -> d.pyro will kill just about anyone if done at the right time.. and has several benefits such as being almost instant and having the ability to use several very fast finishing hits if necessary).

I'm not very familiar with sin genies, I feel a little uncomfortable suggesting anything because it is really just a shot in the dark for me. That said, I'd probably try to keep holy path + wind force and drop one of the amps.. I see them used frequently by sins and many of the uses that I use them for (especially wind force) would be applicable to any class (chasing down flag carriers in NW for example).. and they are just amazing skills. If you couldn't get by without both the amps, maybe you could reevaluate your skill choices later.

The purge chance on eruption fist is.. interesting. It is the only possible way for several classes (wiz included) to purge an opponent.. which really makes it attractive. The problem is that it costs a lot of energy, and you cannot have wind force with it The only time that I wish I had a skill like this is in an unofficial 1v1 where I'm fighting a tanky opponent that is full buffed (usually a bm).. but even in a case like this it'd be hard to justify the huge energy cost for such a low chance to purge. I'd be worried about using all my genie energy trying to purge and then not having my genie skills available if I need them. I had considered making a genie specifically for this with basically all points into magic that I could swap to in a 1v1 against a buffed tanky opponent.. but again it'd probably be easier to just kite around till both get bored and agree to a self buffed fight.

@Saeidon - You're exactly right that the chance to get the extremes of the lucky points are more likely. The probability of each LP is actually known (I've heard that it is in plain text in one of the files.. forget which one now) but you can find the values listed http://www.pwdatabase.com/items/23753 <-- there. The way I came up with the above values is I actually wrote a quick script to simulate making genies, and I basically tried a guess and check method where I guessed a strategy.. used it to make like 10k 91+ genies (every time a 91+ genie was made, I recorded the LP value, the number of mirages that were used, the total spirit, and number of 81+ genies created) and then ran another script to calculate a bunch of statistics based on the data (such as average SP used, standard deviation, proportion of genies that were made with less than the amount of SP I have in game.. etc). Some of the numbers were very similar.. like continuing with 42+/50 or 43+/50 yielded very similar mirage use and SP cost, so I just picked one (I went with 42+ mainly in the interest of time used to create genies). If you had anything you wanted me to try, I can try any method you might be curious about and tell you how it compares to the best method that I've found so far :P

Saeidon - Heavens Tear

Adroit - Lost City wrote: »

@Saeidon - You're exactly right that the chance to get the extremes of the lucky points are more likely. The probability of each LP is actually known (I've heard that it is in plain text in one of the files.. forget which one now) but you can find the values listed http://www.pwdatabase.com/items/23753 <-- there. The way I came up with the above values is I actually wrote a quick script to simulate making genies, and I basically tried a guess and check method where I guessed a strategy.. used it to make like 10k 91+ genies (every time a 91+ genie was made, I recorded the LP value, the number of mirages that were used, the total spirit, and number of 81+ genies created) and then ran another script to calculate a bunch of statistics based on the data (such as average SP used, standard deviation, proportion of genies that were made with less than the amount of SP I have in game.. etc). Some of the numbers were very similar.. like continuing with 42+/50 or 43+/50 yielded very similar mirage use and SP cost, so I just picked one (I went with 42+ mainly in the interest of time used to create genies). If you had anything you wanted me to try, I can try any method you might be curious about and tell you how it compares to the best method that I've found so far :P

Wow okay, its nice to have some actual numbers there! But yeah, it seems your method is good, I'm just very surprised about 42/50 being a continue as you are essentially saying 5/6 will be 10, can have a 9 in there somewhere, and the spirit costs could be very high.
I might look in to it a bit more another time, but for now tbh, I'm hapy following your guide.

One thing I would like to see is the probabilities to get to 36, 37, 38, 39 and 40, and tie them in with 91+ probabilities, simply because if it is optimal to continue a 36, but only just, I'd rather wait for a 37+ because of decomp times, make sense?

Adroit - Lost City

Saeidon - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Wow okay, its nice to have some actual numbers there! But yeah, it seems your method is good, I'm just very surprised about 42/50 being a continue as you are essentially saying 5/6 will be 10, can have a 9 in there somewhere, and the spirit costs could be very high.
I might look in to it a bit more another time, but for now tbh, I'm hapy following your guide.

One thing I would like to see is the probabilities to get to 36, 37, 38, 39 and 40, and tie them in with 91+ probabilities, simply because if it is optimal to continue a 36, but only just, I'd rather wait for a 37+ because of decomp times, make sense?

well you'd still have to wait a week to decomp any level 40 genie, but near the end of the thread there were a few people working to come up with a probability chart for different genies, don't know if they ever finished though.