Pack sellers are stupid

Khanderin - Lost City
Khanderin - Lost City Posts: 25 Arc User
edited August 2010 in General Discussion
They try to "compete" with each other but all they really do is gimp their own profits.

At one point, there was someone selling packs just fine for 455k. Then people came along and thought they would try to sell faster by undercutting him by 1k. Then other people come along and undercut them by 1k. Of course none of the sellers were going to let other people sell cheaper than them so they keep lowering the price until eventually no one can lower anymore or they would make a loss lol. A day later, everyone is selling at 445k when they could have all been selling at 455k or more.

The funny thing is, gold prices keep rising but none of them can increase their prices because there is always someone selling at 445k because he's the last one to get his packs sold. The ones who manage to restock don't want to mark up because that person will then be selling cheaper than them and the cycle continues.

And I thought merchanters were supposed to be smart.
Post edited by Khanderin - Lost City on
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Comments

  • Michael_Dark - Lost City
    Michael_Dark - Lost City Posts: 9,091 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    That's called competition. This is called a QQ thread.
    I post in forums. This one and others. That's why I post.
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Michael_dark - Lost City wrote: »
    That's called competition. This is called a QQ thread.

    ^(o.o) This.
    OP mayhaps should try to fail less.
    b:surrender
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  • Airyll - Dreamweaver
    Airyll - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,882 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Michael_dark - Lost City wrote: »
    That's called competition. This is called a QQ thread.
    MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »
    OP mayhaps should try to fail less.

    These.

    QQ more that you can't make as much money as them even while you THINK that they aren't making huge profit and even while you THINK they're being stupid.

    learn2merchant
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Clandore - Lost City
    Clandore - Lost City Posts: 180 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Elementary game theory
    /thread
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Clandore - Lost City wrote: »
    Elementary game theory
    /thread

    yesh yesh....
    Nicholas Economides
    Me has absorbed his works among other things in about 3 days when me was attempting to figure out the concept of "monies"
    o.o'

    Me still don't quite get it.
    Although me can manipulate it to a reasonable degree.
    >.<'
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
    Hawk:Do this. closing thread
    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
    Kantorek: Yeah.. you should try it. It's awesome.
    Sihndra: Nope- not currently possible under any circumstances. Sorry.
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    Konariraiden: You don't know what you are up against. You will lose.
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  • Khanderin - Lost City
    Khanderin - Lost City Posts: 25 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    These.

    QQ more that you can't make as much money as them even while you THINK that they aren't making huge profit and even while you THINK they're being stupid.

    learn2merchant

    Wow you people love to say QQ and fail a lot for no reason. Does it make you feel better about yourselves? I was just observing their merchanting and commenting on how they could all be making more money if they didn't try to compete with each other. I'm not even the one competing with them so why would I be QQing?
  • Knownase - Heavens Tear
    Knownase - Heavens Tear Posts: 6,959 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Most pack sellers on HT are pretty good about pricing. Its oddly not that competitive.....atleast I think it isnt....
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    b:flowerHave a Techno Rave Flower!b:flower

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  • Airyll - Dreamweaver
    Airyll - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,882 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Khanderin - Lost City wrote: »
    Wow you people love to say QQ and fail a lot for no reason. Does it make you feel better about yourselves? I was just observing their merchanting and commenting on how they could all be making more money if they didn't try to compete with each other. I'm not even the one competing with them so why would I be QQing?

    Because you're sitting here whining about how they're apparently losing out on profit and proving that you know next to nothing about competition and making money.

    If you don't learn2merchant, at least go read up on how economics works, please. A small and very basic bit of research would tell you why you're thread is beyond dumb and why, yes, it is exactly a QQ.

    Also, calling them stupid just because you don't know how to merchant and clearly don't know how competition in a market works just makes you look stupid. Good job.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Khanderin - Lost City wrote: »
    Wow you people love to say QQ and fail a lot for no reason. Does it make you feel better about yourselves? I was just observing their merchanting and commenting on how they could all be making more money if they didn't try to compete with each other. I'm not even the one competing with them so why would I be QQing?

    No, you be here because you do not understand the system and your Original Post be nothing but a QQ post me don't even require a mental reading to know that you be QQing.
    "Pack sellers are stupid
    They try to "compete" with each other but all they really do is gimp their own profits.
    And I thought merchanters were supposed to be smart."
    Yea....that be some obvious QQ from you.

    There always be a flow of monies, if it be completely stable and unmoving then that would probably be a problem for quite a few people.
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
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  • Malei - Sanctuary
    Malei - Sanctuary Posts: 281 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Khanderin - Lost City wrote: »
    And I thought merchanters were supposed to be smart.

    I think it was this that threw some off about the QQing and the Hating. Or whatever.

    But, you do make an amazing point. I've seen packs go now on Sanc for 395k and less and whatnot when the gold flux is between 400-420, rising and falling along that medium. It makes me wonder if people really are trying to make a profit...

    But eh, I'm no merchant.


    Also, I'm personally sick of seeing the "Quit QQing" responses all over these forums. Come up with something a bit more unique to comment with, or don't comment at all <_<
  • Airyll - Dreamweaver
    Airyll - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,882 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Ninja'd, Hamsta. Slightly, anyway. b:cute
    Malei - Sanctuary wrote: »
    But, you do make an amazing point. I've seen packs go now on Sanc for 395k and less and whatnot when the gold flux is between 400-420, rising and falling along that medium. It makes me wonder if people really are trying to make a profit...

    But eh, I'm no merchant.


    Also, I'm personally sick of seeing the "Quit QQing" responses all over these forums. Come up with something a bit more unique to comment with, or don't comment at all <_<

    1) The people selling packs are making huge profit. Again, you're somebody else who doesn't know or understand the system.

    This thread was a QQ thread because somebody who clearly doesn't have a clue what they're talking about decided to comment and call pack sellers stupid. It was a dumb move on the OP's part and maybe next time the OP can do a tiny bit of research into the market and how competition actually works before they decide to make a thread and call people names.

    2)If people can't come up with unique and/or smart threads (this certainly isn't one) then why should we come up with something a bit more unique to comment with?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Ninja'd, Hamsta. Slightly, anyway. b:cute

    Nope, me has seen your post lols.
    and Malei has ninja'd you.
    xD
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
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    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
    Kantorek: Yeah.. you should try it. It's awesome.
    Sihndra: Nope- not currently possible under any circumstances. Sorry.
    LokisDottir: I mean...not haunting the forums, nope nope..
    Konariraiden: You don't know what you are up against. You will lose.
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    58% chance to get tokens
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    1% chance to get ban hamstered with the message "Hamsters United!"
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  • Longknife - Harshlands
    Longknife - Harshlands Posts: 4,843 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    khanderin - Lost City wrote: »
    they Try To "compete" With Each Other But All They Really Do Is Gimp Their Own Profits.

    At One Point, There Was Someone Selling Packs Just Fine For 455k. Then People Came Along And Thought They Would Try To Sell Faster By Undercutting Him By 1k. Then Other People Come Along And Undercut Them By 1k. Of Course None Of The Sellers Were Going To Let Other People Sell Cheaper Than Them So They Keep Lowering The Price Until Eventually No One Can Lower Anymore Or They Would Make A Loss Lol. A Day Later, Everyone Is Selling At 445k When They Could Have All Been Selling At 455k Or More.

    The Funny Thing Is, Gold Prices Keep Rising But None Of Them Can Increase Their Prices Because There Is Always Someone Selling At 445k Because He's The Last One To Get His Packs Sold. The Ones Who Manage To Restock Don't Want To Mark Up Because That Person Will Then Be Selling Cheaper Than Them And The Cycle Continues.

    And I Thought Merchanters Were Supposed To Be Smart.

    Exkoose Me Purfekt Wurld,

    How do I Ekonawmics???
    I <3 AGOREY
  • Olba - Sanctuary
    Olba - Sanctuary Posts: 1,776 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    ... For all the sellers to put up the same price and actually succeed would require that all of the sellers, old and new alike, are in a league.

    And that's impossible, since there're new faces all over the place.

    And even if you established such a cartel, you'd end up in a situation where someone would deviate in secret to make the fast money.

    And besides, it's not always about the %, but the fact that they ARE selling. After all, it's much better than you MADE 25,000,000 profit than that you COULD make 50,000,000.

    And by the way, the undercutting wasn't in the amount of 1k, it was much more. Otherwise it would've taken quite long for them to drop to 380k from the original 450k-ish.

    Also, what influenced the drop in price was the bulk pricing, which places the packs at a healthy 91.8 silver each, which places the price of the packs to around 370-380k.
    If you disregard what I say because of who I am or because of the contents of what I said, you are a fool.

    Everyone wants to be different, but when you're different you wish you were normal.
  • Khanderin - Lost City
    Khanderin - Lost City Posts: 25 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    You guys who just find any excuse to flame someone and call them fail are pretty sad. And you're sitting here pretending you're an expert at merchanting when clearly you're not. If you read the situation carefully instead of jumping the gun and going straight to flame mode, you would notice that I never said they weren't making good profit nor that competition isn't a part of merchanting. Just that in this particular situation, competing is making them lose out on potential profit.

    If packs can be sold at 455k, then all the sellers would make more money selling at 455k. The minute one person starts undercutting, everyone starts to lower their price to compete until the price stabilizes at a value where the sellers can go no lower and are making minimum profit.

    Maximum profit comes at selling at the highest price people are willing to buy and in the case of packs, it's around just below the price of gold. If you're going to argue that less people are going to buy 455k packs than 445k packs then gtfo because buyers don't give a shxt about 10k difference on something like tiger packs. If they're given no choice because everyone is selling at 455k, then they will continue to buy at 455k.
  • Olba - Sanctuary
    Olba - Sanctuary Posts: 1,776 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Um... did you ever even consider that maybe the 380k pacsk are selling at dozens of times the pace that the 440k ones were?

    Or maybe that the bulk pricing allowed the sellers to make the same integer profit while offering lower prices?
    If you disregard what I say because of who I am or because of the contents of what I said, you are a fool.

    Everyone wants to be different, but when you're different you wish you were normal.
  • Khanderin - Lost City
    Khanderin - Lost City Posts: 25 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Olba - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Um... did you ever even consider that maybe the 380k pacsk are selling at dozens of times the pace that the 440k ones were?

    Or maybe that the bulk pricing allowed the sellers to make the same integer profit while offering lower prices?

    Yes I did and no it doesn't in this case considering the difference in price isn't as big as 440k vs 380k. Read my last paragraph.
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Khanderin - Lost City wrote: »
    You guys who just find any excuse to flame someone and call them fail are pretty sad. says the Khanderin who claims "Pack sellers are stupid" And you're sitting here pretending you're an expert at merchanting Well me personally never claimed to be an expert although 30 mil from trying me paw at selling just one item (which wasn't even worth as much as an anni pack) be a pretty decent achievement. when clearly you're not. If you read the situation carefully instead of jumping the gun and going straight to flame mode, you would notice that I never said they weren't making good profit nor that competition isn't a part of merchanting. Just that in this particular situation, competing is making them lose out on potential profit. but you obviously don't has much knowledge in the way the pack markets work.

    If packs can be sold at 455k, then all the sellers would make more money selling at 455k. The minute one person starts undercutting, which is why people can't sell at 455k...... everyone starts to lower their price to compete until the price stabilizes at a value where the sellers can go no lower and are making minimum profit. Better to has some profit then none, better for the buyers as they get a good deal, also me know this from personal experience as a seller who has employed this tactic (if done correctly it can be beneficial *to yourself* in the long run.)

    Maximum profit comes at selling at the highest price people are willing to buy and in the case of packs, it's around just below the price of gold. If you're going to argue that less people are going to buy 455k packs than 445k packs then gtfo because buyers don't give a shxt about 10k difference on something like tiger packs. If they're given no choice because everyone is selling at 455k, then they will continue to buy at 455k. yea....you has no idea how the gold market/pack market works at all...

    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
    Hawk:Do this. closing thread
    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
    Kantorek: Yeah.. you should try it. It's awesome.
    Sihndra: Nope- not currently possible under any circumstances. Sorry.
    LokisDottir: I mean...not haunting the forums, nope nope..
    Konariraiden: You don't know what you are up against. You will lose.
    Waiting for...Hamster Packs!
    58% chance to get tokens
    41% chance to get an all class pet hamster....but they has already been freed by the magic hamster.
    1% chance to get ban hamstered with the message "Hamsters United!"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Airyll - Dreamweaver
    Airyll - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,882 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Khanderin - Lost City wrote: »
    Stuff

    It's not about potential profit.

    In the merchanting world where pack sales are only around for a few weeks, you can do two things. (And you're really dumb not to have known this but to come along and act like you know what the hell you're talking about.)

    1) You can sell them in bulk at a lower price, competing with other sellers and then selling your packs first. It's not about potential profit - and if it was then things would never sell. Merchanting relies on the merchant being able to have some kind of liquidity, and this means you don't want to be sitting on packs for months and months because you're trying to make potential profit. It. Does. Not. Work.

    As has already been said, better to make an immediate 25 million which can go towards something else, then sit around and hope for 50 million which you never get because you can't be bothered to compete.

    2) Did you ever consider that if people sold packs at 455k while gold is generally 430k, sometimes slightly higher and sometimes slightly lower, people would just buy gold because it's the cheaper option?

    Durrrrrrr. This is point two. People can't sell packs for higher than gold, because nobody would buy them, and you're the stupid one for suggesting they could do otherwise. Please go get a clue.

    Did you ever consider that many of these people stockpiled hundreds and hundreds of gold while it was still cheap? They can afford to sell at 380k because they bought gold at 320k. It's still an absolutely huge profit in large quantities and they don't need to rely on gold during the actual pack sale. They got all the gold they needed before hand.


    Seriously. Get out, do a bit of research, and stop calling people stupid if you don't know what the hell they are doing and why. I just gave you three reasons out of a fair few as to why pack sellers can compete with each other and sell packs at 380k without needing to worry about 'potential' profit and without actually losing huge amounts of money.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Longknife - Harshlands
    Longknife - Harshlands Posts: 4,843 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Khanderin - Lost City wrote: »
    Just that in this particular situation, competing is making them lose out on potential profit.

    I'd love to hear one economical situation where competition does not equal a loss in profit.


    The point is you're coming here and saying something SO god damn basic and obvious that....well I mean it's human nature! Personally I'm baffled that you'd even bring it up. What do you want us to say?
    I <3 AGOREY
  • Kupuntu - Sanctuary
    Kupuntu - Sanctuary Posts: 3,008 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Everybody selling at the same, higher price = less profits since there are more packs for sale at that price.

    3k packs for 455k each

    Everybody undercutting the prices = more profits because there are temporarily less packs for sale for the best price.

    1k packs for 455k
    1k packs for 450k
    1k packs for 445k

    The seller who has his packs for sale for 445k will sell more packs since people will mostly buy from his catshop. When others see that he dropped his price so much, they will have to follow in order to sell more packs.


    (Yes it's a very simplified example. I just want it to be clear.)
    100% F2P player. Started PW: March 2007, Quit PW: March 2011.
    pwcalc.com/e7016929e7b204ae "Pure axe" 8k HP multipath BM, last one of my kind.
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Longknife - Harshlands wrote: »
    I'd love to hear one economical situation where competition does not equal a loss in profit.

    It happens all the time in Khanderin's world, where the janitor also tells the surgeon how to perform open heart surgery for the maximum cleanliness.
    b:chuckle

    Khanderin just be sad Khanderin because the reality of this human made construct be not up to ideal standards.
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
    Hawk:Do this. closing thread
    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
    Kantorek: Yeah.. you should try it. It's awesome.
    Sihndra: Nope- not currently possible under any circumstances. Sorry.
    LokisDottir: I mean...not haunting the forums, nope nope..
    Konariraiden: You don't know what you are up against. You will lose.
    Waiting for...Hamster Packs!
    58% chance to get tokens
    41% chance to get an all class pet hamster....but they has already been freed by the magic hamster.
    1% chance to get ban hamstered with the message "Hamsters United!"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Malei - Sanctuary
    Malei - Sanctuary Posts: 281 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    1) The people selling packs are making huge profit. Again, you're somebody else who doesn't know or understand the system.

    Please don't assume if I know the system or not. Merchanting's never been my style, but even I can see that if gold is being sold at 400k, and you're selling a Tiger pack for 390k, you're not making as much as you -could- be making. I think that is what OP is trying to say here, no? Like someone said, it seems that the pack sellers here aren't really trying to make a %marginalprofit above selling at Boutique price, that all they are trying to do is simply sell period.

    This thread was a QQ thread because somebody who clearly doesn't have a clue what they're talking about decided to comment and call pack sellers stupid. It was a dumb move on the OP's part and maybe next time the OP can do a tiny bit of research into the market and how competition actually works before they decide to make a thread and call people names.

    I agree to not insult anyone if you don't know the market well enough, but I don't believe this is counting as a QQ thread simply because she used the word stupid. She isn't Wangsting over the fact that these people are making more money than her, she's stating something she has noticed in the market, albeit SOME merchants might think that it isn't a problem.

    2)If people can't come up with unique and/or smart threads (this certainly isn't one) then why should we come up with something a bit more unique to comment with?

    Erm, no comment on that O-o

    All points are in red. I'm not here to argue, nor do I pretend to know so much about the system. But the hostile undertones are indeed noted, and shouldn't really be in this thread when its a discussion about pack sells.

    I, personally, never understood where the profit came from buying packs and selling them for lower than the gold market price. Unless you just decide to charge the money and instead of converting it into gold, buying packs and selling it straight out. Nor do I understand drastically lowering prices just to make sure something sells ahead of your competitors. It would be then that I would just find another market that works.

    Plus, it seems like the pack market is an awful time to try and utilize any real monetary gain since its 2 of them out. I would invest in something else if I was looking for actual profit.
  • Airyll - Dreamweaver
    Airyll - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,882 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Malei - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Stuff

    Would be nice if you could just hit the [/QUOTE] every now and then and respond properly, so I could quote your actual responses and comments to what I said.

    However, may I direct you to my last post. Or maybe the other posts that explain why it is not about potential profit.

    If it was about potential profit, nothing would ever sell at a decent rate, you would actually lose money because you weren't being competitive and everybody was selling their stuff first, and you then wouldn't have enough money after packs disappear to stockpile more gold for cheaper than you sold your packs so that when the next sale comes around you can buy even more, thus sell even more, thus make a better profit.

    If you seriously can't grasp the fact that people buy gold at 320k when there isn't a sale, then sell packs at 380k for profit, you need to stop posting here right now. Because it's not rocket science.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Malei - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Plus, it seems like the pack market is an awful time to try and utilize any real monetary gain since its 2 of them out. I would invest in something else if I was looking for actual profit.

    Keyword: "seems" there be a market, there be high competition, well then it be a decent conclusion that be that monies is being made.
    Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Would be nice if you could just hit the "/QUOTE" every now and then and respond properly, so I could quote your actual responses and comments to what I said.

    However, may I direct you to my last post. Or maybe the other posts that explain why it is not about potential profit.

    If it was about potential profit, nothing would ever sell at a decent rate, you would actually lose money because you weren't being competitive and everybody was selling their stuff first, and you then wouldn't have enough money after packs disappear to stockpile more gold for cheaper than you sold your packs so that when the next sale comes around you can buy even more, thus sell even more, thus make a better profit.

    If you seriously can't grasp the fact that people buy gold at 320k when there isn't a sale, then sell packs at 380k for profit, you need to stop posting here right now. Because it's not rocket science.

    ._.'
    Just let it go Airyll, humans be designed to has certain flaws that others of their kind excel at.
    Just need more time and me should be able to allow them to compensate for their deficiencies.
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
    Hawk:Do this. closing thread
    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
    Kantorek: Yeah.. you should try it. It's awesome.
    Sihndra: Nope- not currently possible under any circumstances. Sorry.
    LokisDottir: I mean...not haunting the forums, nope nope..
    Konariraiden: You don't know what you are up against. You will lose.
    Waiting for...Hamster Packs!
    58% chance to get tokens
    41% chance to get an all class pet hamster....but they has already been freed by the magic hamster.
    1% chance to get ban hamstered with the message "Hamsters United!"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Airyll - Dreamweaver
    Airyll - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,882 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »
    ._.'
    Just let it go Airyll, humans be designed to has certain flaws that others of their kind excel at.
    Just need more time and me should be able to allow them to compensate for their deficiencies.

    Apft. I saw that ninja edit, Hamsta.

    Still, it's so amusing to see people who have no idea about how a market works talk about it as if they have a clue, it really is. Like I said before, it's not rocket science. I suppose they're just living in the fairytale dreamland that if you sit and sell packs at an outrageous price while everybody else sells for cheaper and makes huge profit, you're... going to somehow make huge profit.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Malei - Sanctuary
    Malei - Sanctuary Posts: 281 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Would be nice if you could just hit the every now and then and respond properly, so I could quote your actual responses and comments to what I said.

    However, may I direct you to my last post. Or maybe the other posts that explain why it is not about potential profit.

    If it was about potential profit, nothing would ever sell at a decent rate, you would actually lose money because you weren't being competitive and everybody was selling their stuff first, and you then wouldn't have enough money after packs disappear to stockpile more gold for cheaper than you sold your packs so that when the next sale comes around you can buy even more, thus sell even more, thus make a better profit.

    If you seriously can't grasp the fact that people buy gold at 320k when there isn't a sale, then sell packs at 380k for profit, you need to stop posting here right now. Because it's not rocket science.

    You're quick to jump on someone you feel is a tad bit slower than you, aren't you Airyll? O-o Ease up, chika. I was in mid-post before you quickies posted your responses on page 2 and mine ended up on 3.

    I see your point about not desiring the potential profit. It makes a bit more sense now, but also take into the fact that our servers are drastically different. I have yet to see gold at 320k on Sanctuary so far, if the lowest it would hit 350 and teeter there and higher and higher. But, the process is still the same by your logic. I just never saw packs as a real money maker on the market since it seemed very risky, and its a want more than a need.

    Well, **** that. I need those tokens. Eh, your points have been made and accepted.

    Calm down on that firey tongue too, Airyll. You may not be trolling or whatnot, but its that prose of yours that makes me feel like you want to slam my head into the keyboard. Not trying to argue here, but no matter what good of a point you make, you can't get it across if your writing is screaming out "I'm so much smarter than you so shut the heck up and accept it!"
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Apft. I saw that ninja edit, Hamsta. but the forums didn't see it. xD and that edit was because you put that end quote command in there which confoosed the forums :<

    Still, it's so amusing to see people who have no idea about how a market works talk about it as if they have a clue, it really is. Like I said before, it's not rocket science. I suppose they're just living in the fairytale dreamland that if you sit and sell packs at an outrageous price while everybody else sells for cheaper and makes huge profit, you're... going to somehow make huge profit.
    Malei - Sanctuary wrote: »
    You're quick to jump on someone you feel is a tad bit slower than you, aren't you Airyll? O-o Ease up, chika. I was in mid-post before you quickies posted your responses on page 2 and mine ended up on 3. sowwy? O.o'

    I see your point about not desiring the potential profit. It makes a bit more sense now, but also take into the fact that our servers are drastically different. I have yet to see gold at 320k on Sanctuary so far, if the lowest it would hit 350 and teeter there and higher and higher. But, the process is still the same by your logic. I just never saw packs as a real money maker on the market since it seemed very risky, moar risk means moar chances to make a profit and its a want more than a need.

    Well, **** that. I need those tokens. Eh, your points have been made and accepted.

    Calm down on that firey tongue too, Airyll. Me didn't find it firey at all. O.o' but then again it wasn't direct at me. >.<' You may not be trolling or whatnot, but its that prose of yours that makes me feel like you want to slam my head into the keyboard. Not trying to argue here, but no matter what good of a point you make, you can't get it across if your writing is screaming out "I'm so much smarter than you so shut the heck up and accept it!" But.....eh? *sad hamster*

    odd.
    o.O'
    Logical bridges failing.
    x.x'
    Argument between humans be interesting but confoosing to me. (>.<)'
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
    Hawk:Do this. closing thread
    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
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    Waiting for...Hamster Packs!
    58% chance to get tokens
    41% chance to get an all class pet hamster....but they has already been freed by the magic hamster.
    1% chance to get ban hamstered with the message "Hamsters United!"
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  • Khanderin - Lost City
    Khanderin - Lost City Posts: 25 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    It's not about potential profit.

    In the merchanting world where pack sales are only around for a few weeks, you can do two things. (And you're really dumb not to have known this but to come along and act like you know what the hell you're talking about.)

    1) You can sell them in bulk at a lower price, competing with other sellers and then selling your packs first. It's not about potential profit - and if it was then things would never sell. Merchanting relies on the merchant being able to have some kind of liquidity, and this means you don't want to be sitting on packs for months and months because you're trying to make potential profit. It. Does. Not. Work.

    As has already been said, better to make an immediate 25 million which can go towards something else, then sit around and hope for 50 million which you never get because you can't be bothered to compete.

    2) Did you ever consider that if people sold packs at 455k while gold is generally 430k, sometimes slightly higher and sometimes slightly lower, people would just buy gold because it's the cheaper option?

    Durrrrrrr. This is point two. People can't sell packs for higher than gold, because nobody would buy them, and you're the stupid one for suggesting they could do otherwise. Please go get a clue.

    Did you ever consider that many of these people stockpiled hundreds and hundreds of gold while it was still cheap? They can afford to sell at 380k because they bought gold at 320k. It's still an absolutely huge profit in large quantities and they don't need to rely on gold during the actual pack sale. They got all the gold they needed before hand.


    Seriously. Get out, do a bit of research, and stop calling people stupid if you don't know what the hell they are doing and why. I just gave you three reasons out of a fair few as to why pack sellers can compete with each other and sell packs at 380k without needing to worry about 'potential' profit and without actually losing huge amounts of money.

    I don't know whether you don't know how to read, don't understand or just choose to ignore points.

    1) I never talked about potential profits. I wasn't saying go sell tiger packs at 600k because once no one else is selling them, you would make huge profits. I understand the concept of having fast turnovers. Make 1m a day by selling at 350k is better than waiting a month to make 15m selling at 600k. That is pretty obvious.

    There would be no decrease in amount of packs sold if they were to sell at 455k instead of 445k because the difference in price is only 10k. From a buyer's perspective, this is an inconsequential amount of money. From a seller's perspective who's selling 200 or 300 packs, this could mean an extra million or 2 million a day which is a lot.

    2) Where did I ever say they should sell packs more than gold lol. I specifically said they get best profits selling packs at slightly below gold value. You really need to stop making stuff up.

    3) Finally, yes I did consider they stockpile gold and no they did not. I watched their movements. If they stockpiled gold, their best option would have been to use all the gold to buy packs as soon as they came out and put them all in shop. Get them sold and buy more gold as soon as possible. More sales, faster turnovers, better profits. They did not do that. They put up a batch. Got it sold and went and bought more gold.
  • Paramedic - Dreamweaver
    Paramedic - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,801 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    OP is right but smarter merchants dont underprice each other if they dont have to.
    even let sometimes some nub sell stuff cheaper if he dont have big stock and let him gtfo after

    price wars are always unecessary and just stupid. we all buy gold for similar price and can do similar profit. nobody get packs from black market or steal gold..

    ijs.. common sense is always nice


    controling prices with few ppl that u even dont know isnt hard. i remember that from green mats market long time ago on DW


    but when dumbasses get their hands into market then it get screwed pretty fast. i cry when i see belial mats for 400-500k now
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