Bm loosing its awsomeness

IDaun - Dreamweaver

Whats the problem with that ? Aslong as they are a nice person to have in the Faction who care's how they build or play their character.
Its a game, so its all about having fun. If thats how they choose to have fun good luck to them

There's a fine line between 'having fun' and 'ruining the game for others'. A robe bowbarian going in as the only tank (for example) is going to waste the rest of the squad's time. A FAC going into a group as the only cleric is wasting the rest of the squad's time if she doesn't tell anyone. Of course, anything, say, level 80 in a low level FB is going to work... I'm talking about close to the same level BH/FBs.

And how they play their character... would you like to squad with a wizzie or archer 10 levels above you (if you were tanking) that don't know how to manage damage? Or a barb that doesn't know flesh ream? Do you /want/ to hear, "Oops, I crited 5 times before you got the boss' HP down blow 95%."?

Kupuntu - Sanctuary

Conavar - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I think you misunderstood since I cant really see where anyone has mentioned "Helping the helper"

What I ment, to make it clear is :

If they are half decent they will form the squad from within their own ranks to help any class out

Ie: If a Wiz/Bm/Bowbarian etc needed a TT, a decent faction would form a Squad to help him/her. Regardless of what people view as the "norm needed" classes for TT

Yeah but then again, the one who is being helped has nothing to do with the actual run other than being there. So, if I make a Bowbarian and some ppl help me with my fb19, they don't care what I do. Might be different in TT, but still.

In the topic: awesomeness? Yeah right. Being a group controller is really funny and AOE grinding is so funny (and easy) that I almost laugh. Almost. But not quite.

_ShOt_ - Lost City

DeathX - Lost City wrote: »

Ok i want to discuss something about bms. The expansion is coming soon and it kinda pisses me off now that thier is a new race and to tell u why is because when the new race is out what is the point of a Bm now. i looked at al the tideborns skills and now that i see them bms are toataly useless now.Every class in PWI IS NoW OVERPOWERING THEM. the tideborns now have longer stuns and awsome aoes along with fast DD skills and on top of that we have a new mag dmg class and thats the last thing we need if ur a bm. i just want ur opinion on this topic.

b:nosebleed I smelled someone QQing, and my nose led me to this thread, which yet again proves my nose is always right...

...or is it my 6th sense? b:question

Anyways, don't QQ about this new expansion until you know what the effect of it is. I don't think the BM will be useless, since the Assassin is mainly a DD class, and the Psychic is mainly focused on DD/assisting in combat.

I believe the new race will be actually good for BMs, since the Psychic can make them almost as hard to kill as a barb, while they can still preserve their DD qualities, making the barbs actually get worth less (mind you, I'm not saying worthless, just worth less), because they might be hard to kill, but have the lowest damage output in-game.

Conavar - Heavens Tear

IDaun - Dreamweaver wrote: »

There's a fine line between 'having fun' and 'ruining the game for others'. A robe bowbarian going in as the only tank (for example) is going to waste the rest of the squad's time. A FAC going into a group as the only cleric is wasting the rest of the squad's time if she doesn't tell anyone. Of course, anything, say, level 80 in a low level FB is going to work... I'm talking about close to the same level BH/FBs.

It doesnt ruin the game for others. Since if they had any sense they wouldnt join a squad as the tank.

If someone wants to play an arcane Bowbarian thats fine... you wouldnt expect him to be the tank, whoever does would be a fool.

Ofc Im not saying they wouldnt nerf themselves as a class or to what they can do, thats pretty much a given. Aslong as they are upfront about their adnormal build then I cant see a problem tbh

And how they play their character... would you like to squad with a wizzie or archer 10 levels above you (if you were tanking) that don't know how to manage damage? Or a barb that doesn't know flesh ream? Do you /want/ to hear, "Oops, I crited 5 times before you got the boss' HP down blow 95%."?

That can and does happen with people who have built their characters to the norm. Building a char to a guide doesnt mean they know how to play it.

IDaun - Dreamweaver

Conavar - Heavens Tear wrote: »

It doesnt ruin the game for others. Since if they had any sense they wouldnt join a squad as the tank.

If someone wants to play an arcane Bowbarian thats fine... you wouldnt expect him to be the tank, whoever does would be a fool.

Ofc Im not saying they wouldnt nerf themselves as a class or to what they can do, thats pretty much a given. Aslong as they are upfront about their adnormal build then I cant see a problem tbh



That can and does happen with people who have built their characters to the norm. Building a char to a guide doesnt mean they know how to play it.

Oh, I wasn't connecting playstyle and build-- I was saying that if people play stupidly (or weird), or build weird and don't tell anyone, they ARE ruining the game for others...

You gotta know how to play like others expect of you. Everything else, all the fun, can come after you've done your BH/FBs/Whatever. If you can't be even close to what others expect, don't expect to get a good squad.

And ones that aren't upfront was more what I was saying. I've seen several Clerics on the forums that don't tell anyone that they're a FAC-- they seem to hold some contempt that people can't guess their build (even though we can't see what skills they've leveled). That's more like what I was saying. And I know that I don't check out people's gear when they join-- I expect them to be half decent and what I was asking for. If I want a barb, I want a tank. If I want a cleric, I want a healer. It's commonly accepted that those are the roles...

But yeah, people that will tell everyone that they aren't playing their class the way it's commonly accepted, I don't really care. *shrugs*

Favu - Heavens Tear

Lol. "loosing its awsomeness"



Do that over a toilet. Please.

Noob - Heavens Tear

The way I see it, BM is a mix between Barb and Assassin. Not quite as strong as an Assassin but better defense. Not quite as a tank as a barbarian is, but higher attack power.

vbarbie

B M s S U C K ! nothing new... just don't roll that lame class // end of discusion.

IDaun - Dreamweaver

vbarbie wrote: »

B M s S U C K ! nothing new... just don't roll that lame class // end of discusion.

I've been in plenty of squads with BMs that I'd take over a barb any day. Guess I could say "B A R B s S U C K !", could I not? b:chuckle

btw, I fell for the troll bait. Want a cookie?

Austin_Power - Heavens Tear

that made me lol.

SilverCleric - Lost City

You really got to think about what lvl the skills need to be before they use the skills and also about what the channeling, casting, and cooldown times for each skill.

Lastly, I believe that in the first few weeks after the new TideBorn class is release GM's and Mod's will check the forms and maybe in-game to see if there skills are OP and maybe nerf the skills to make the game more balance.

I think that BM's,, Archer's and Wizzies, will still be "alive" because of how well the DD/Tank and how easy they help us in Rebirth Order's (Witch I never did one) FB/BH and more.

Every class is useful in there own way but I still think some classes still need a bit more improvements so more people will play as them.

b:victoryb:laugh

MagicHamsta - Lost City

SilverCleric - Lost City wrote: »

Lastly, I believe that in the first few weeks after the new TideBorn class is release GM's and Mod's will check the forms and maybe in-game to see if there skills are OP and maybe nerf the skills to make the game more balance.

won't happen

Both GM's and Mods don't has teh powah to change skills and stuff. b:shocked
only teh chinese developers can.
xD
and me don't think they look at the PWI forums. b:surrender

Kupuntu - Sanctuary

I also wanna say something about the classes. There are no really needed classes, just roles:

Tank: (physical: barb or BM) (magical: wizard, veno or cleric)
Healer: Cleric (wizard healing ftw)
Lurer: Veno or someone with Zeal (?) genie
Group controller: BM
DD: Wizard, Archer or BM (also in some cases all other classes)

Then of course, as long as those roles (or at least tank and healer, DD is also preferred) are on their places, it doesn't matter what the other players are. If you say: "BH squad wants a healer and a tank, 3 spots" and you already have a BM and DDs, it really doesn't matter who is on the last spot. Be it another cleric, an offtank or just someone who needs that BH. As long as that is remembered, ppl can play as they want.

Kitsuneh - Lost City

Kupuntu - Sanctuary wrote: »

I also wanna say something about the classes. There are no really needed classes, just roles:

Tank: (physical: barb or BM or veno) (magical: wizard, veno or cleric)
Healer: Cleric (wizard healing ftw)
Lurer: Veno or someone with Zeal (?) genie
Group controller: BM
DD: Wizard, Archer or BM (also in some cases all other classes)

Fixedb:victory
To the OP, nothing can replace bms' aoe skills when doing instance runs. It took 15 min to run Stygean with 3 bms^^

WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary

Ursa - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I'd say:
1) noobs like you
2) ppl that know how to play their class and know other classes inside out too.

By why take my word for it?

Feel free to go ahead and Google "Tank Healer DPS", and then go and start working through the thousands of web pages of discussion about the well-known, over-used, holy-trinity of MMORPG class balancing.

You can go ahead and get your nose out of joint all you want, I'm just pointing out a design decision that every RPG designer of the past 15 years has had to wrestle with.

Some try to innovate, other just give in and embrace the holy-trinity. PWI is a game that absolutely chose to embrace it, and it's obvious which classes are which.

Kupuntu - Sanctuary

Kitsuneh - Lost City wrote: »

To the OP, nothing can replace bms' aoe skills when doing instance runs. It took 15 min to run Stygean with 3 bms^^

So basically your saying that an Axe BM is needed, but if you have pole/sword/fists, bad luck for you?

Kitsuneh - Lost City

Kupuntu - Sanctuary wrote: »

So basically your saying that an Axe BM is needed, but if you have pole/sword/fists, bad luck for you?

I'm saying bms with good aoe skills makes things much faster. I am not saying any other bm is useless than axe bm because I have less experience about fist/sword/pole bms.

Kuponata - Sanctuary

Kitsuneh - Lost City wrote: »

I'm saying bms with good aoe skills makes things much faster. I am not saying any other bm is useless than axe bm because I have less experience about fist/sword/pole bms.

Well, as I know a bit about the other BMs, fist is for cancelling enemy skills, sword is DD and pole is somewhat AOE but as a pole BM I know linear aoe isn't that good.

EDIT: so the character changing really worked. Gotta change it back.

Cernunnosx - Heavens Tear

Kitsuneh - Lost City wrote: »

I'm saying bms with good aoe skills makes things much faster. I am not saying any other bm is useless than axe bm because I have less experience about fist/sword/pole bms.

A good Bm is multi path anyway, should always have axes of one level or another for the aoe skills/stuns.

@ OP

I wouldnt worry about Bm's to much, due to the shear scope of the role's they can do.
Pretty much only role in a squad they cant fill is healing others.

Yes other classes can do the job better ie: DD, Tank but on most (not all) bosses those classes cant do both( Veno's not included since being a solo class they can do both with a pet ).

Ie: You would take a Barb as a Tank but you wouldnt take one as a DD, where as a BM, you can take him as a Tank and/or as a DD

Kupuntu - Sanctuary

Cernunnosx - Heavens Tear wrote: »

A good Bm is multi path anyway, should always have axes of one level or another for the aoe skills/stuns.

Okay I'll keep this in mind. So guys, always use axes. If not, have fun soloing the game.

Cernunnosx - Heavens Tear

Kupuntu - Sanctuary wrote: »

Okay I'll keep this in mind. So guys, always use axes. If not, have fun soloing the game.

As a Bm yes there are somethings having axes are either a great benifit for or a must have item.

RB, FFspring to mind straight away.

FF isnt a must have, but it makes the runs quicker if you do.

But things like TT/FB/BH axe's are not a MUST have item.

IDaun - Dreamweaver

Kupuntu - Sanctuary wrote: »

Okay I'll keep this in mind. So guys, always use axes. If not, have fun soloing the game.

People like you are why flame wars start whenever someone mentions the benefits of a weapon OTHER than axes.

I've played all the paths, and, while I'm not very high level on my BM, I have a use for all of the weapons-- and my axes end up the weapon most frequently gathering dust.

Axes are not automatically the only choice just because they require the least skill to manage. Learn2play. Every weapon path is useful in one way or another.

Oh, and btw, I know several spear BMs that are pretty good in squads. The most skilled BM I know is, yes, Axe-- but I know plenty of skilled ones that are other weapon paths. In fact, a bad axe is worse than any other 'bad' weapon path-- they tend to rush into mobs more than other weapon paths.

Oneshotu - Lost City

BMs lost their awsomeness a longggg time ago. BMs have always failed. Assasin is an upgraded BM.PW should just replace all bms and make them into Assasins.

Cernunnosx - Heavens Tear

Oneshotu - Lost City wrote: »

BMs lost their awsomeness a longggg time ago. BMs have always failed. Assasin is an upgraded BM.PW should just replace all bms and make them into Assasins.

Sins high dex DD's with good DPS, hmmm remind you of any class ?

TBH its archers who should worry about their place in squads, specially if Sin's bring good party buffs to the table.

AlbireoTwo - Lost City

Cernunnosx - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Sins high dex DD's with good DPS, hmmm remind you of any class ?

TBH its archers who should worry about their place in squads, specially if Sin's bring good party buffs to the table.

Unless they're close range and you've got a sucky cleric with you.

Cernunnosx - Heavens Tear

AlbireoTwo - Lost City wrote: »

Unless they're close range and you've got a sucky cleric with you.

Doesnt really make that much differance tbh for a lot of bosses.
Since if they have aoe to hit more than the tank, depending on the boss its normally party heal after aoe or BB.. so range isnt really a factor

MagicHamsta - Lost City

Oneshotu - Lost City wrote: »

BMs lost their awsomeness a longggg time ago. BMs have always failed. Assasin is an upgraded BM.PW should just replace all bms and make them into Assasins.

Cernunnosx - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Sins high dex DD's with good DPS, hmmm remind you of any class ?

TBH its archers who should worry about their place in squads, specially if Sin's bring good party buffs to the table.

b:chuckle
you is being teh replaced!
LOLSSS~~!!!
*stares at psychic.*
aw darn me am being replaced too. b:surrender

mayhaps we should start a Archer, Wizard, Cleric union?
(^.^)'
send those fishies back where they came from~~!

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Dev. are not morons. Nobody won't be OP. And tideborns will also have their weakness. If dev. made them OP lot of people would leave or switch=less money, less attractivity of game.
Don't have big expectation. You will be dissapointed.

King_Arthur - Harshlands

Well........I wouldn't say that, no class can overpower another class, its more like another player able to overpower another player. It really depends on your skillz and gear. Bm's can stun lock using three skills, I can stun lock for a short time since I'm a sword bm, but even then, i can still stun, atk atk stunatk, lower atk mag and phy, then heal myself if needed and stun again. It really depends how good your character is. For me, its not that hard to take down a barb my lvl, and I can even beat one in a duel or pvp, assuming neither one of is charmed. Only barb I probably cant beat is the kind that "kites" or "runs away cause he's losing and needs to refill on potions". It's embarrassing if a barb or bm kites because we are the "In yo' face" type of class.


Point is, Doesn't matter what class you are, it only depends on your skills and gear, if you know what your doing, then you'll be ok.

MagicHamsta - Lost City

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Dev. are not morons. Nobody won't be OP. And tideborns will also have their weakness. If dev. made them OP lot of people would leave or switch=less money, less attractivity of game.
Don't have big expectation. You will be dissapointed.

b:shocked
in this one game me played.....well actually about 5 games me has played....the devs were complete morons.
b:shocked

in one they completely broke about 2 and a half classes by introducing a magic immunity item.....
in another they uber nerfed a single class and actually introduced **** new content...(well for like 3 games.)
in another....they just turned frigging greedy and charged for uber unbalanced CS gear making it truly impossible to stand a chance against CS users.
b:cry