so whats this age old BS about baning WF's for fb29/gouf?

Smexxyfox - Heavens Tear

try on the ground, not while flying.

And maybe just to be sure hit the GM button before you start and ask him to look properly

turtlewax

I disagree, on both counts. And you shouldn't have interfered, now you've positioned yourself rather poorly.

You should be able to play the game using the full range of tactics normally available within the game mechanics, without having to fear some ignorant sod interpreting it as abusing a bug.

Vapidia - Sanctuary

If the monster AI is bugged, they can only ask/beg the original authors to fix it. If they don't fix it, they can either disable the quest/raid or ignore people who use the bug.

Yes, abusing bugs is wrong, but so it heavy-handed GMing.

Ant BTW - I am not anywhere near high enough level to do this stupid quest, and I probably never will be, as the attitude here is more offputting than that of SGE players in regards to "I think ur rong so I'z rite" mentality.

GMs, either camp that room 24-7, or just accept that your game has a nasty flaw in the AI of this boss mob and leave it alone. If you can, annoy the original aothors into fixing the bug. If you can't annoy them into fixing the bug, then .....

Meelan - Heavens Tear

Twilyte - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Meelan, the admins have stated that luring IS part of the veno's arsenal, and is working as designed.

However, luring through a closed door (as in fb29 boss area) or a wall is not part of the design, and they have stated that.

Look, Smex, you yourself pointed out, and I quote:

Then you come back screaming that they shouldn't fix it.

You yourself say there is a legit way to do it, but it is more challenging because....here's the part everyone seems to hate....there is the risk of dying!

You argue that they shouldn't fix the veno w/ flying pet bug by pointing out they haven't fixed the archer/zehn bug.

Fine. Fix both bugs. But, as I stated before, everyone has their own priorities and depending on what those priorities are usually dictates their views on subjects such as these

If a character's skill is supposed to end when a mob dies, but they find a way around that by getting into a duel, that's finding a way around the intended game mechanics.

If mobs are supposed to have a fighting chance against all characters or heal fully if they can't hit or auto-path to the character, but players find a way to prevent mobs from attacking by using flying pets, then that's finding a way around the intended game mechanics.

You also said it's such a small portion of gameplay so that they might as well leave it in (referring to the veno issue). The same can be said that if it's not that important, why worry about it if they do fix it? Like you said, it's such a small part of gameplay. It's not like it will cripple venos.

We can rant back and forth continually. You are actually very civil in your points unlike many others that feel so strongly about subjects. I enjoy a good intellectual conversation, point for point. Unfortunately, no matter how strongly we feel on either side of this subject, ultimately, we need a CURRENT "official" word. ( I am starting to wonder if the old threads are hard to find because of the avatar changes or if they were deleted due to flames! I will post if I find them though b:laugh )

Thank you for clarifying that for me. I thought all luring was bad. I read all the rants about it and it had me so totally confused. I appreciate you taking the time to explain it to me. I've never been with anyone who did that wall thing so i've never seen it. Thats what had me so confused...I still can't ever seem to get on a squad but at least if i have to get major lvl and do them myself i know what is ok to do. I did have someone offer to help if they can so i'll send them a list of the 15 i still need and hopefully i can get some help and actually one day get them all cleared off my list. Thanks again b:pleased

Meelan - Heavens Tear

Geez seeing someone got banned in the gouf quest cause some stupid veno used the glitch and the other person didn't know about it makes me scared to even get on a squad. I'll be very careful..if i ever get on a squad to do it and see a veno put out a flying pet you can bet i'll be leaving squad and teleing out. I refuse to get banned cause someone else is being stupid. I just want to do the quest the way it was intended to be done and move on so i can reach my next lvl. If anyone wants to help me do gouf the correct way let me know. b:pleased i'm moving this weekend so maybe if someone can help me do it next week you can send me a private message.

turtlewax

Lol, you still don't get it, the bug involves a flying pet but it doesn't just simply occur whenever a flying pet is summoned, the veno has to fly herself and mess around with aggro. But hey, leave the squad and see if you can find another and unhatch your fly.

swiftlikeafox

turtlewax wrote: »

Lol, you still don't get it, the bug involves a flying pet but it doesn't just simply occur whenever a flying pet is summoned, the veno has to fly herself and mess around with aggro. But hey, leave the squad and see if you can find another and unhatch your fly.

Doesn't really matter either way, as appearently GMs are banning on the mere SIGHT of flying pets around gouf.

Klath - Sanctuary

If the monster AI is bugged, they can only ask/beg the original authors to fix it. If they don't fix it, they can either disable the quest/raid or ignore people who use the bug.

Yes, abusing bugs is wrong, but so it heavy-handed GMing.

Ant BTW - I am not anywhere near high enough level to do this stupid quest, and I probably never will be, as the attitude here is more offputting than that of SGE players in regards to "I think ur rong so I'z rite" mentality.

GMs, either camp that room 24-7, or just accept that your game has a nasty flaw in the AI of this boss mob and leave it alone. If you can, annoy the original aothors into fixing the bug. If you can't annoy them into fixing the bug, then .....

Agreed.
Why not just give Gouf a higher attack range? or a single ranged skill to use every a few seconds? Would solve this issue and im sure the GMs have the ability to modify a monster stats.

Kyou - Heavens Tear

Klath wrote:

Would solve this issue and im sure the GMs have the ability to modify a monster stats.

I wouldn't be so sure...

lillianavess

Gouf is not as hard as people make him out to be. I helped someone yesterday with the quest(Legit)... Only two people were above level 50 - a healer lvl 53 and myself (a veno) lvl 51 at the time. The tank was under lvl 50 and we had another low level to keep the mobs around him off of us, then the person who had just got the quest. Suck it up and do it right b:thanks

Edit: I do think that this should be fixed, since people aren't meant to do it... make it so they can't

turtlewax

swiftlikeafox wrote: »

Doesn't really matter either way, as appearently GMs are banning on the mere SIGHT of flying pets around gouf.

Maybe it's their new method to deal with overpopulation ...

Drussella - Sanctuary

I'm new and i'm confused. Didnt read the whole thing but from what i gather is that there are several non published bugs and exploits. If one happens to just play the game and thinks that attacking landmob with a airpet is just smart, and jumping into the water to shake off a lure is to, i'm guilty. But i dont know.. because i cant find any reliable info on it anywhere.

When i go over TOS all i can find is:

(l) Using or exploiting any bugs, errors, or design flaws to obtain unauthorized access to the Service or to gain an unfair advantage over other players.

However, how is someone who is new to the game to know what is designed and what is a glitch?
I searched the forum on "game rules" "exploits" etc. But other then talk of "the glitch" i coudnt find anything.

From what i read i understood most the times its Venomancers doing the "glitching" but what it is, and if i might even be doing it already isnt clear to me, because i am one.

Clearly i dont wanna break the rules, but if i only find out i done it _after_ i get banned, would make me less then happy.

So... banning ppl sure, but only after they know what is and what is not permitted please.

Where can i find the info?

If i cant, i'm off after the gold i bought is finished. No bad feeling

adra12

Its pretty simple, if u can get a mob to not attack you or your pet, its a bannable glitch.

Also if u can get any mob to walk thru a solid object so you can kill him without doing something to get into the said area, its also a bannable glitch.

Drussella - Sanctuary

adra12 wrote: »

Its pretty simple, if u can get a mob to not attack you or your pet, its a bannable glitch.

Also if u can get any mob to walk thru a solid object so you can kill him without doing something to get into the said area, its also a bannable glitch.

Ah ok, so THAT is the glitch. Tnx for that.

Now remains, i can attack landmob with a airpet? I can jump into a lake to shake off mob that gangbang poor me?

(sorry this is a bit off topic, but i dont feel important enough to start a whole new topic over it

Zoe - Heavens Tear

Yes you can attack land monsters with air pets, as long as the land monster is attacking your pet there is not a problem.

Jumping into a lake to escape a monster is just fine. Land/air monsters can't enter water so its a good way to get away before you die. Neither one is a glitch and is simply how the game normally plays.

sheonite4000

All this talk about taking advantage of glitches... >.<

No excuse they can just fix the bug... it HAS to be rumors, that would be idiotic and unreasonable. If a player is caught attacking it and it doesnt attack back then instead of blaming it on the venomancers they should take responsibility for their mistake and fix it. I mean c'mon its common sense, u sure this isnt a rumor? Im having trouble beleaving it. <(O__O)>

Zoe - Heavens Tear

sheonite4000 wrote: »

All this talk about taking advantage of glitches... >.<

No excuse they can just fix the bug... it HAS to be rumors, that would be idiotic and unreasonable. If a player is caught attacking it and it doesnt attack back then instead of blaming it on the venomancers they should take responsibility for their mistake and fix it. I mean c'mon its common sense, u sure this isnt a rumor? Im having trouble beleaving it. <(O__O)>

I've seen this bug in action many times and reported people for doing it. I've also stumbled upon the ability to use it on a boss I did not know you could bug myself (I quickly recalled my pet when I realized what was going on. Took me around 2 seconds to notice)

No rumors here, they are very real.

vydget

Well, I have not read this whole Thread (got to page 8) but I would like to share my experience. I am new to PW, this is the only one I have played on. I play a Veno, solo mostly, am level 39. I was not aware of the air pet bug until recently. I was flying to Gouf to check him out as i Just got the quest. Spotting a coal mine, I flew down to mine it, There was a level 49 mob nearby, so I attacked. I cast my spells, my pet was taking damage so I healed my pet (flying fox one). Killed it and looted. I flew up and continued on my way. Saw another mob and sent my pet in. Start my attack routine, and then noticed something funny, and tried to adjust my camera so I could see the mob. Next thing I saw was the bottom of Emerald Bay with a Message from GM saying I was banned a day for expoiting.
After the day was over, I went to Gouf and when the others suggested the exploit, I told them about my banning, so we used a Barb instead.
Should I have been Banned? I don't think I should have. A warning would have been better. I was not a repeat offender like their TOS says, but it does seem to be having an impact.

Zoe - Heavens Tear

vydget wrote: »

Well, I have not read this whole Thread (got to page 8) but I would like to share my experience. I am new to PW, this is the only one I have played on. I play a Veno, solo mostly, am level 39. I was not aware of the air pet bug until recently. I was flying to Gouf to check him out as i Just got the quest. Spotting a coal mine, I flew down to mine it, There was a level 49 mob nearby, so I attacked. I cast my spells, my pet was taking damage so I healed my pet (flying fox one). Killed it and looted. I flew up and continued on my way. Saw another mob and sent my pet in. Start my attack routine, and then noticed something funny, and tried to adjust my camera so I could see the mob. Next thing I saw was the bottom of Emerald Bay with a Message from GM saying I was banned a day for expoiting.
After the day was over, I went to Gouf and when the others suggested the exploit, I told them about my banning, so we used a Barb instead.
Should I have been Banned? I don't think I should have. A warning would have been better. I was not a repeat offender like their TOS says, but it does seem to be having an impact.

Well its for accidental reasons like that, that a warning is good first but to be honest here, nearly every single time said bug is used, it is very intentional and the person knows exactly what they are doing. Though if you think about it, a 1 day ban IS a warning. Its only a day so its not much, but it does warn you to never do it again or risk a much longer ban or even worse, perma-ban.

Seilen - Heavens Tear

Kyou - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I wouldn't be so sure...

I am quite sure of it. Mob and items are not normally stored in game engine, but instead of in database so changing any item or mob is just question to modify value in database.

Feraldreamzz - Sanctuary

vydget wrote: »

Well, I have not read this whole Thread (got to page 8) but I would like to share my experience. I am new to PW, this is the only one I have played on. I play a Veno, solo mostly, am level 39. I was not aware of the air pet bug until recently. I was flying to Gouf to check him out as i Just got the quest. Spotting a coal mine, I flew down to mine it, There was a level 49 mob nearby, so I attacked. I cast my spells, my pet was taking damage so I healed my pet (flying fox one). Killed it and looted. I flew up and continued on my way. Saw another mob and sent my pet in. Start my attack routine, and then noticed something funny, and tried to adjust my camera so I could see the mob. Next thing I saw was the bottom of Emerald Bay with a Message from GM saying I was banned a day for expoiting.
After the day was over, I went to Gouf and when the others suggested the exploit, I told them about my banning, so we used a Barb instead.
Should I have been Banned? I don't think I should have. A warning would have been better. I was not a repeat offender like their TOS says, but it does seem to be having an impact.

So we can get banned for attacking ground mobs with air pets even if they are taking damage. Hmm....interesting. I do this a lot, find it's the easiest way to level my air pet while doing quests.

Drussella - Sanctuary

Feraldreamzz - Sanctuary wrote: »

So we can get banned for attacking ground mobs with air pets even if they are taking damage. Hmm....interesting. I do this a lot, find it's the easiest way to level my air pet while doing quests.

Now who the heck are we suposed to believe? Was the monster vydget was attacking gouf or just any other monster? Cus i just asked and got told it was ok to use flying pets against land pets.

I realy wanna know before i get banned aswell. The monsters i attack, attack back. I dont even going near that Gouf dude on a flying mount thats for sure -_-


And i wouldnt have know ANYTHING about this of i hadnt stumbled upon it while searching for something else. Then to read about a no warning from a Venomancer my level is a bit..... errr.... Well, me no like.

markillian

It sounds like this is a bug that most new players don't know about and thus unknowkingly exploit.

I wonder how new players are supposed to find out about all the bugs that they're not supposed to exploit? Is there a list somewhere?

I wonder when the people in charge of fixing bugs are going to fix it so that innocent people stop getting banned.

sheonite4000

To ban innocent people for something that PW is to blame for. Its not a very well known glitch at all either way, if they are going to be so unreasonable they should atleast make an announcement about it.

surtr

Drussella - Sanctuary wrote: »

I realy wanna know before i get banned aswell. The monsters i attack, attack back.

The exploit involves using a flying pet to attack ground-based enemies in a way that prevents them from attacking back, so you should be fine.

I dont even going near that Gouf dude on a flying mount thats for sure -_-

Using a flying mount shouldn't trigger this bug, as monsters react somewhat differently to player targets than to pets.

Feraldreamzz - Sanctuary

surtr wrote: »

The exploit involves using a flying pet to attack ground-based enemies in a way that prevents them from attacking back, so you should be fine.

Using a flying mount shouldn't trigger this bug, as monsters react somewhat differently to player targets than to pets.

So, just to be clear....if we are using our flying mount with our pets attacking ground based mobs, we're ok as long as the mob is attacking our pet (and not attacking us). Correct?

Zoe - Heavens Tear

Feraldreamzz - Sanctuary wrote: »

So, just to be clear....if we are using our flying mount with our pets attacking ground based mobs, we're ok as long as the mob is attacking our pet (and not attacking us). Correct?

As long as the monster you are attacking is hitting back, its fine. If it is attacking your pet or you, does not matter as long as the monster IS fighting back.

tsukia

There is way too many WF's in this thread saying they report players or Venomancers for whatever exploit(s) but they use the pulling exploit theirself

Yea, I am targetting some people especially in this thread who keep saying: ''I report xxxx whenever I see them abusing xxxxxxxx (but when I get told I use pulling exploit, I simply ignore it)''.

That truly pisses and disgusts me off. You know who you are. Buzz off.

Blancheneige - Heavens Tear

surtr wrote: »

The exploit involves using a flying pet to attack ground-based enemies in a way that prevents them from attacking back, so you should be fine.

Using a flying mount shouldn't trigger this bug, as monsters react somewhat differently to player targets than to pets.

I already PMed you two times asking you for an answer about the way players glitch in zhen/aoe parties. You are still not answering this concern...

Why?

Drussella - Sanctuary

surtr wrote: »

The exploit involves using a flying pet to attack ground-based enemies in a way that prevents them from attacking back, so you should be fine.

Using a flying mount shouldn't trigger this bug, as monsters react somewhat differently to player targets than to pets.

Realy gratefull for someone with authority showing up this fast to clear this up.

tnx