And to add to the OP this will only further the need for botters as well as encourage them. They'll know darn well that a good portion of the player base won't spend the time to grind RP at a miserably slow rate. Cryptic, wasn't the issue with the HE's due to individuals starting up a HE and running off to the next rather than sticking it out and finishing it? The issue wasn't the amount of RP gained from small HE's, it was the method used to obtain RP for those small HE's. Large HE's on the other hand needed a rework. No one did them due to the time invested and RP gain; you didn't gain enough RP. Wow, this is pretty concerning if something so simple couldn't be understood. But then again, that's been the story of this company from the beginning.
All that needed to be done was to make it so you had to contribute a certain amount to get a prize (healing, damage dealt/taken) so the deadbeats you see littering the ground around HEs would get zip. To get a good prize you have to be within a certain distance when the HE ends to dissuade the opportunists who drop a few hits then move on to the next one when the action heats up.
Once again Cryptic doesn't understand what made this successful and has zero clue as to why what they have done here is overboard and unnecessary. I am disappoint..
I just got a peridot for great success from a normal HE on preview server.
Still have not done an epic HE. Not enough players currently on preview server.
4,074,000 / 198,000 = approx 20 hours for one item x 4 = approx 80 or more hours to grind items to legendary FROM epic.
THE NEW change of all removal of aquamarines, will make this grind go from 80 hours to APPROX 329 hours of grinding to get 4 items to legendary.
lol... I thought 80 hours to be ridiculously high...There's too many good games in the world that I want to play before spending more than 10 hours running in a circle...
For me, the problem was not so much the high drop rate, it's just that it made the game so 'small', and hence boring. Only one place to click around in and do something worth doing. Imo, they should have cut the drop rate by 30-50% maybe, but duplicate that level of reward everywhere in the game (dungeons, skirmishes, pvp, campaigns, etc). That way, I would log in and ask myself this question: "well, what to do today? There's so many choices, and they are basically the same as far as rewards...what's the guild up to? ... ah, k. count me in... blah blah". Relaxing, fun, I could have enjoyed that.
Who were the ones complaining? The whales that bought RP to get 8 artifacts up to orange on every character they play. So some bone-headed bean counter at Cryptic figures they need to nerf the HE drops to get everyone else to buy RP. That the rest of us weren't buying RP before was lost on them.
Dude listen to yourself... don't you think it benefits those "whales" to encourage free RP? Its easy to buy instead of grind. "Whales" don't want to grind and want the best gear when it comes out. That means they WANT cheap RP on the AH.
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urlord283Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,084Arc User
edited June 2015
Lots of folks on this very forum ask for this and now we have it
I just don't get it
So many complaining about IWD the lag caused by the extra folks, the big gain of RP how unfair it is to nerf Dragon Hoard gems....
Had another nerf on my mind but I would also chime in and say that's an unpleasant change. I thought maybe I could partial gear an alt this way but now perhaps not. I luckily got to where I needed to be but to the people who started from further back the rp marathon I feel nothing but sympathy. Obviously iwd heroics were painful and unfun but at least they could get you there in the the foreseeable future but as is too usual with our friends at cryptic the steep climb became a near horizontal barrier.
Lots of folks on this very forum ask for this and now we have it
I just don't get it
So many complaining about IWD the lag caused by the extra folks, the big gain of RP how unfair it is to nerf Dragon Hoard gems....
How bad it was for bots
So now they have listened and acted
So if you like it congrats
If not
Be careful what you say
Urord
The thing is, lag won't change, ppl will be still running it as before, simply because there is no alternative. Only that you'll need to run it much more to upgrade your gear. And yes, be careful what you wish for - those who asked for HE nerf mostly didn't get the consequences.
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,453Arc User
edited June 2015
I am not surprised they nerf it. I predicted they would have to after this patch came out. They have to. It hurt their bottom line, the blood ruby sale. Who would buy blood ruby when you can get as much RP in 3 cycles?
I was surprised they let us ran for 2 weeks though. I expected they would only give us one week for the "honey moon".
I am not saying I like the nerf. I am saying we should all know it is coming right from the beginning.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
Do you know anyone who ever admitted to buying a blood ruby? You get more bang for your buck buying the dropped rp. They should have seen an uptick in sales of zen that gets converted into ad to buy much higher quantities of rp. Unless the uptick in ad purchases wasn't with them .
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,453Arc User
Do you know anyone who ever admitted to buying a blood ruby? You get more bang for your buck buying the dropped rp. They should have seen an uptick in sales of zen that gets converted into ad to buy much higher quantities of rp. Unless the uptick in ad purchases wasn't with them .
In that case, for the Zen which is purchased for the purpose to buy RP from AH, in theory, it is dropping.
Reason 1: people can just farm the RP themselves.
Reason 2: You need to buy less Zen to get the same amount of RP now than before. The RP price in AH was above 2 AD per 1 RP. Now, it is close to 1 AD per 1 RP (last time I checked a week ago was around 1.4 AD per 1 RP).
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
Although I don't disagree that the time/amount to level artifacts and artifact equipment is excessive. I think that the general mentality of the players here is that nothing is ever going to be good enough for them. We all know 99% of you that threaten to quit aren't going to go anywhere. You all are just blowing smoke. News flash, empty threats do nothing. If you want REAL positive changes (realistic) to happen then show them with your actions.. Stop spending money and stop playing, and not just threaten those.
I know i'm probably going to get flamed for my comments so have at it.
Well this is bullcrap, plain and simple. Guess I should be grateful I managed to get my artefact gear up to blue where it's marginally better than random drops at least.
The availability of RP in IWD was the only thing keeping me playing, because it at least offered the possibility of progress in a sensible time frame. Now I don't know why I would bother logging on any more.
Do you know anyone who ever admitted to buying a blood ruby? You get more bang for your buck buying the dropped rp. They should have seen an uptick in sales of zen that gets converted into ad to buy much higher quantities of rp. Unless the uptick in ad purchases wasn't with them .
I bought blood rubies with the 50% off certificate you get when you hit 70. Of course I then put them up on the AH and make back more than the AD used to buy the zen for the rubies. Since it was zen bought with farmed AD, Cryptic still didn't make any money off the deal.
just got 2 aquamarines and HR Hammerstone gloves for doing Cleanse the Corruption (Hammerstone).
Since there are no other HR Hammerstone gloves on AH, I will sell them for 95k AD.
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silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
edited June 2015
Sadly,
there is literally nothing to do in game atm. Unless I just work on yet another alt to 70.
Finally had a reason to play again and wham.. take it away from us.
none of the DDS are worth farming, becuase nothing drops , you have to be lucky to get something and even if I did get a lostmouth or val item, it would just be used by me anyways.
There simply is nothing to play for.
How did we come to this state?
How is it fixed? You cant simply state, its anti bot measures, how CAN everything be a anti bot measure? THERE has to be something in game for us to play and progress on.
This is the sorriest state and the darkest moment I cant think of in the games history(exploits and cward bounding was close), after some encouraging changes the last couple weeks, they totally reversed everything.
Those rewards sound about the same as they had been.
The question is, as far as RP/time goes, are players going to consider the larger events worth doing? How long does it take? Can this group of players actually beat it in time, or are we going to fail and have wasted our efforts? Is it going to require many potions/injury kits? The reward has to be worthwhile with those factors taken into consideration.
We have a player base that never hesitates to look a gift horse in the mouth. Here we were handed an opportunity for rewards that simply required a small amount of effort, and all it was met with was complaint after complaint. Well by Crom they listened to your bullsh!t, and we're never getting that back. Thanks ever so much.
That crowd were just the sour apples crowd, who thought they won the lottery last year, when they got rp.. for like 9k a peridot stack, they bought dozens of them and used them later to get their artifact gear to legendary.
They hate the ideal that there was a avenue for us to catch up and be able to compete again against them.
Its bull HAMSTER , pull and simple.
80 hours of grind time was enough, over 300 isnt. Its not ok. They literally are driving people from the game, I know they can see the #s, I know it, but I think their hands are completely tied, some effing manager is diddling up there thinking they are loosing money on RP.. but they are not, they simply do not understand, no one buys their RP.. and.. no one will, or such a small percantage who cares.
Every mmo needs to look at its playerbase and market, you cant market EVERYTHING to whales, its ok to market SOME things to whales, but this is a overall game progression issue, not a market one.
Without this, I do not see how the game can continue. I really am at a loss for words atm.
Almost no one wants to start them.
But if you start them, more people will join.
So far, I started 3 epic HE's with at least 15 min on timer.
All 3 finished with at least a few minutes on timers.
I'm in Dwarven Valley where the epic HE's are easier.
Still waiting to do Beholder.
myles08807 said, "Back in my day, we didn't have any of this fancy Mulhorand gear while we were leveling . . . we walked uphill both ways while dying once every five seconds while leveling, and we liked it fine!" . . . Now, get off my lawn, you kids!" pointsman said, "I don't rue the game. In fact I don't feel any regret for the game at all." looomis said, "I don't like people changing to alts and then bragging about their mains like schizophrenic role players."
there is literally nothing to do in game atm. Unless I just work on yet another alt to 70.
Finally had a reason to play again and wham.. take it away from us.
This. Exactly this.
Sure, I can grind boons on my Pally but for what reason? My gear progress has just been brought to a shuddering halt so what's the point?
I may finish levelling my Archer HR to 70 just to explore the new powers but then he'll be in the same position as my Pally with no worthwhile gear progression path. And he has most of is boons already so what would I do with him.
I've never come across a game that so aggressively provides reasons NOT to play it. Bonkers.
So lets get into it, the shear vast amount of RP needed to get 1, yes 1 item from epic to legendary is a total of 4,074,000 RP , again this is just from EPIC to legendary.
Right now with one great success you get one aquamarine and one peridot.
Thats a total of 2k RP.
One stack of aquamarines = 148,500 rp
One stack of Peridot = 49500 rp
Total of 198,000.
It takes approx 1.5 hours to get a stack (+/-) depending on the day.
4,074,000 / 198,000 = approx 20 hours for one item x 4 = approx 80 or more hours to grind items to legendary FROM epic.
THE NEW change of all removal of aquamarines, will make this grind go from 80 hours to APPROX 329 hours of grinding to get 4 items to legendary.
DO YOU SEE that # APPROX over 320 hours!
That is not a acceptable grind rate, not at all.
Cryptic is no dummies, they created a fire storm of the CW changes on the same week, so this wouldnt be talked about at the rate it should be. I have a CW, and ya double nerfing same feat, is a little over the top.
BUT it is NOWHERE over the game reaching issue this RP is.
THEY shouldnt NERF minor HES, THEY SHOULDVE buffed Major ones, make Majors drop Black Opals and people wouldve run them.
THE shear and vast amount of RP needed in game is just ridicilous, they finally put a REASONABLE way to gain it and they remove it.
Frankly we are nearly back to square one.
IN addition my old standby of running dread ring lairs is now nearly worthless, as they do not drop peridots and aquamarines anymore.
Dilemma A... WHERE the heck to we get RP now and
Dilemma B... What do we play in game, there WAS almost no other rewarding thing to do other then IWD. It was literally the only thing I had left in game. Running DDS is not rewarding, running Tiamat isnt rewarding.
You have totally gimped rewards to the point of the game isnt even worth playing.
You need to fix this, its still the #1 issue in game, or maybe #2 right behind the bugs. But its HAS to be a top issue.
Running the zerg for peridots ISNT enough, it gets too boring to quickly if you are looking at over 300 hours of grind time.
For the love of everything.. dont destroy your own game, we HAVE to have real ways of earning REAL rp value.
Guys, your literally running out of time to keep players.
True my friend. This is why I don't run action content at all in this game anymore. I just craft and care about cosmetics. There is no progression feel at all with this game anymore, and massive one-shot difficulty. Grind 4million rp to upgrade artifact gear only to have it obsolete in a mod? Much more fun to just not play that part of the game at all, and wont, or spend money till they fix the game.
Comments
Can it be something like: if you don't finish the HE (i.e. leave early or way too early), you get a peridot instead of aquamarine?
no its been tested and from what im told its 1 peridot on a great success. thats the nerf. hasnt done epic yet.
Once again Cryptic doesn't understand what made this successful and has zero clue as to why what they have done here is overboard and unnecessary. I am disappoint..
What.
Surely not.
Still have not done an epic HE. Not enough players currently on preview server.
lol... I thought 80 hours to be ridiculously high...There's too many good games in the world that I want to play before spending more than 10 hours running in a circle...
For me, the problem was not so much the high drop rate, it's just that it made the game so 'small', and hence boring. Only one place to click around in and do something worth doing. Imo, they should have cut the drop rate by 30-50% maybe, but duplicate that level of reward everywhere in the game (dungeons, skirmishes, pvp, campaigns, etc). That way, I would log in and ask myself this question: "well, what to do today? There's so many choices, and they are basically the same as far as rewards...what's the guild up to? ... ah, k. count me in... blah blah". Relaxing, fun, I could have enjoyed that.
Dude listen to yourself... don't you think it benefits those "whales" to encourage free RP? Its easy to buy instead of grind. "Whales" don't want to grind and want the best gear when it comes out. That means they WANT cheap RP on the AH.
I just don't get it
So many complaining about IWD the lag caused by the extra folks, the big gain of RP how unfair it is to nerf Dragon Hoard gems....
How bad it was for bots
So now they have listened and acted
So if you like it congrats
If not
Be careful what you say
Urord
The thing is, lag won't change, ppl will be still running it as before, simply because there is no alternative. Only that you'll need to run it much more to upgrade your gear. And yes, be careful what you wish for - those who asked for HE nerf mostly didn't get the consequences.
I was surprised they let us ran for 2 weeks though. I expected they would only give us one week for the "honey moon".
I am not saying I like the nerf. I am saying we should all know it is coming right from the beginning.
In that case, for the Zen which is purchased for the purpose to buy RP from AH, in theory, it is dropping.
Reason 1: people can just farm the RP themselves.
Reason 2: You need to buy less Zen to get the same amount of RP now than before. The RP price in AH was above 2 AD per 1 RP. Now, it is close to 1 AD per 1 RP (last time I checked a week ago was around 1.4 AD per 1 RP).
I know i'm probably going to get flamed for my comments so have at it.
The availability of RP in IWD was the only thing keeping me playing, because it at least offered the possibility of progress in a sensible time frame. Now I don't know why I would bother logging on any more.
GG Cryptic. GG indeed.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
I bought blood rubies with the 50% off certificate you get when you hit 70. Of course I then put them up on the AH and make back more than the AD used to buy the zen for the rubies. Since it was zen bought with farmed AD, Cryptic still didn't make any money off the deal.
Since there are no other HR Hammerstone gloves on AH, I will sell them for 95k AD.
there is literally nothing to do in game atm. Unless I just work on yet another alt to 70.
Finally had a reason to play again and wham.. take it away from us.
none of the DDS are worth farming, becuase nothing drops , you have to be lucky to get something and even if I did get a lostmouth or val item, it would just be used by me anyways.
There simply is nothing to play for.
How did we come to this state?
How is it fixed? You cant simply state, its anti bot measures, how CAN everything be a anti bot measure? THERE has to be something in game for us to play and progress on.
This is the sorriest state and the darkest moment I cant think of in the games history(exploits and cward bounding was close), after some encouraging changes the last couple weeks, they totally reversed everything.
I dont see a bright future atm.
reward: 2 aquamarines + 2 rank 5 Black ice enchantments
Those rewards sound about the same as they had been.
The question is, as far as RP/time goes, are players going to consider the larger events worth doing? How long does it take? Can this group of players actually beat it in time, or are we going to fail and have wasted our efforts? Is it going to require many potions/injury kits? The reward has to be worthwhile with those factors taken into consideration.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
That crowd were just the sour apples crowd, who thought they won the lottery last year, when they got rp.. for like 9k a peridot stack, they bought dozens of them and used them later to get their artifact gear to legendary.
They hate the ideal that there was a avenue for us to catch up and be able to compete again against them.
Its bull HAMSTER , pull and simple.
80 hours of grind time was enough, over 300 isnt. Its not ok. They literally are driving people from the game, I know they can see the #s, I know it, but I think their hands are completely tied, some effing manager is diddling up there thinking they are loosing money on RP.. but they are not, they simply do not understand, no one buys their RP.. and.. no one will, or such a small percantage who cares.
Every mmo needs to look at its playerbase and market, you cant market EVERYTHING to whales, its ok to market SOME things to whales, but this is a overall game progression issue, not a market one.
Without this, I do not see how the game can continue. I really am at a loss for words atm.
Almost no one wants to start them.
But if you start them, more people will join.
So far, I started 3 epic HE's with at least 15 min on timer.
All 3 finished with at least a few minutes on timers.
I'm in Dwarven Valley where the epic HE's are easier.
Still waiting to do Beholder.
3 aquamarines + 1 sapphire
Same reward as before :cool:
I am not surprised. I am unhappy. I have absolutely no faith in this game anymore.
myles08807 said, "Back in my day, we didn't have any of this fancy Mulhorand gear while we were leveling . . . we walked uphill both ways while dying once every five seconds while leveling, and we liked it fine!" . . . Now, get off my lawn, you kids!"
pointsman said, "I don't rue the game. In fact I don't feel any regret for the game at all."
looomis said, "I don't like people changing to alts and then bragging about their mains like schizophrenic role players."
Sure, I can grind boons on my Pally but for what reason? My gear progress has just been brought to a shuddering halt so what's the point?
I may finish levelling my Archer HR to 70 just to explore the new powers but then he'll be in the same position as my Pally with no worthwhile gear progression path. And he has most of is boons already so what would I do with him.
I've never come across a game that so aggressively provides reasons NOT to play it. Bonkers.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
True my friend. This is why I don't run action content at all in this game anymore. I just craft and care about cosmetics. There is no progression feel at all with this game anymore, and massive one-shot difficulty. Grind 4million rp to upgrade artifact gear only to have it obsolete in a mod? Much more fun to just not play that part of the game at all, and wont, or spend money till they fix the game.