i want to meet whoever though they would be fun ... and punch him in the face. it was a stupid idea and im running through it a second time and am regretting every second of it. i got to 64 through the original 1-60 campaign.just grrrrr.
dragoness10Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 780Arc User
edited May 2015
It's designed to make you take time and put in effort to help stop all those botters that run through content superfast, and make it more fair for the f2p people so players cannot just buy their way through the game with RL money to the point none of the f2p people can keep up.
" I tried to figure out the enigma that was you, and then I realized mastering Wild Magic was easier." - Old Wizard in Waterdeep
"Why is it dragons only use ketchup? I'd like a little wasabi please. Us silvers like a variety of condiments."
"Don't call them foolish mortals. One, they don't learn from it. Two, It just ticks them off." - An Ancient Red Dragon
It's designed to make you take time and put in effort to help stop all those botters that run through content superfast, and make it more fair for the f2p people so players cannot just buy their way through the game with RL money to the point none of the f2p people can keep up.
I and several people I know kind of like the Vigilance Quests, it's kind of like watching a movie or reading a book more than once where there is something new to discover if you don't just run through it, some of us still believe the journey and not necessarily the destination is the best part of going somewhere.
After all someone took a lot of time to program the scenery, the traps, the opponents and conversations in these areas so why not take a little time to appreciate the work they did?
I feel sorry for people who run through quests and dungeons to max out on leveling, only to set back and ask themselves "now what?", unless endless grinding for loot and gear is really what you're into.
Maybe I'm strange but I didn't mind Drowned Shore because it was new (I realise the landscape was recycled) and I kinda liked the crabs. There was some sense of progression as I moved from the first section to the last section. And I don't mind recycled landscapes if the content is good.
But then Reclamation Rock became tedious almost immediately. Third zone (name forgotten) was the worst because there wasn't even a real sense of moving on; just racing back to same hub over-and-over and trying to remember which NPC gave the correct quests; although soloing some of the landscape bosses was fun/challenging. Things improved again at Spinward owing to the new landscape and the air-tome quests; although in retrospect there wasn't much more to it than that; the daily that ended 5 mins early didn't help. At least at SR one could see the light at the end of the tunnel and taste that free main hand artifact - along with the bitter taste of the grind to upgrade it that was to follow.
And having got to l.70 I can now return to the same WoD quests I was already doing at l.60 but with more lag and higher difficulty - "Certainty of death, small chance of success - what are we waiting for?"
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
edited May 2015
Vigilance quests overall appear to have been specifically designed to waste players' time, which really bothers me. Forcing people to spend more time on content by putting so many limits on it smacks of desperation at not understanding how to engage players willingly, so you trap them instead.
They have abysmal drop rates for items you need to collect from monster drops, which wouldn't be so bad except that carrying that quest with the horrible drop rate prevents you from taking other quests due to the limitation of 4 at once, making you choose between dropping the quest to replace it with another that might not HAMSTER-block you from completing it, thus losing all your hard-won macguffins, or attempting to grit it out long enough to get the remaining macguffins so you can finally turn it in and resolve that you will NEVER take that quest again.
Quests with objectives that stack easily are almost invariably offered in alternating hours, so dealing with them efficiently requires extra hoop-jumping on the part of the player. There are some exceptions, but as a rule, you need to take quests 1 and 2 before the hour and then take quests 3 and 4 after the hour, and then you've got a nice quick planned round that minimizes boredom and frustration.
The answer is simple, there is no content now out there and by prolonging the players suffering through leveling, you will get some sort of content.
Imagine, if those vigilant tasks weren't there, what would most people do? There are only 3-3 dungeons left, no real motivation to do dungeons, no AD can now be gained back from game.
So yeah, vigilant quests are a substitute for overall content.
The real honest man is honest from conviction of what is right, not from policy.
Robert E. Lee
I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself.
Winston Churchill
The human race is a herd. Here we are, unique, eternal aspects of consciousness with an infinity of potential, and we have allowed ourselves to become an unthinking, unquestioning blob of conformity and uniformity. A herd. Once we concede to the herd mentality, we can be controlled and directed by a tiny few. And we are.
David Icke
I actually quite liked the vigilance quests and all the new stuff in mod 6. It was a bunch of new content that I could play along with my missus levelling together. We were in no mega rush to hit 70 during the first week of mod 6, we did equipped about 60% xp bonus on utility, which made it just about right to hit 70 right before you need to finish the last few vigilance quests to get the free main hand.
I've only went thru vigilance quests to level up 2 chars, and just like levelling up new chars, it's fun the first 1 or 2 times, but I'm not gonna do it again, and don't see the need to when all my other chars are level 70 by invoking etc.
Have the gear and skills, but lack the friends to play with? Come and apply for Essence of Aggression. We have been here and strong since beta. (Immature, rude, and arrogant people will not be accepted)
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instynctiveMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,885Arc User
edited May 2015
I've taken my two mains through EE and helped countless guildmembers with their EE quests. Good chance I'm not going to be taking my alts through it as well.
I was excited about Spinward Rise. Completely new area, completely new monsters, completely new everything! But all the time and effort the artists put into that area has been wasted on me, because I have to run everything on minimum graphics settings. :-(
"...I grab my wiener and charge!" - ironzerg79
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silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
edited May 2015
The biggest issue, is that they MISSED a chance to implement a great storyline, they stopped abruptly then didnt really continue it at all.
There is no way what was giving to us was what was on thier design board from the start, something clearly happened, which they will never discuss, do not know if it was part of the shakeup or not.
But I think anyone can tell , there was zip after the minsc and boo part of it, nada, nothing, just recycled quest items and they didnt even have to put thought in the first three zones at all.
Sadly, ALMOST every preview post in testing was competely ignored about bugs/feats and powers not working (lets just point to the DC preview testing, THEY didnt even get ONE pass through to fix feats that WILL literally never work on the lines they were giving) it was pointed out over and over and over and over again, without ONE reply, not one! )
Its that sort of stuff that GREATLY discourages future testing.
Something got effed up.. I mean really effed up here and they are slowly putting it back together, but at the SAME time they are also adding other negative factors against the playerbase (IE dragon hoard nerfing)
There is so much negative being added, that the positives, never seem to make a dent into it all.
0
plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,456Arc User
I was excited about Spinward Rise. Completely new area, completely new monsters, completely new everything! But all the time and effort the artists put into that area has been wasted on me, because I have to run everything on minimum graphics settings. :-(
Hmmm! Why? I did not see any graphic that is taxing. There is no dragon run in that area.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
IMHO SpinRise was nice enough - eye candy, flair, new creats, new quest type, and the some of the fights were really challenging - not due to overboosted mobs or OSKs, but due to new mechanics, e.g. the Slaad cloudkill. And the amount of recycling was... ...acceptable.
Drowned Shore: Tedious, overstuffed map, horrible fighting, especially with those chars that need dodging space (HR, DC), confuddled quests, quests where the drop rates and/or the number to gather were meh, and the Crabby HE was going on eternally and thus often made the whole beach area a no-go-minefield...
RecRock: Tedium absolute. Only fun part were the Bulettes in the middle segment. "Kill 15 Whatnots" - where Whatnots spawn max 5 at a time with a 15 minute respawn cycle? Sup...
Fiery Pit: Only went there once, and only for one level, so my judgement here is less founded. I liked the lair quests in part 1 - the Fardelver's map thing: Story-inteegrated, somewhat innovative, with those water bucket attacks :^) Had some fun there. Also, that zone had some atmosphere, and an upbeat spirit after the first two gloom orgies...
On the global view:
It wouldn't hurt to cut down the number of vigilance quests per cycle 12. Neither would allowing players to pick up 6 quests at a time. Nor would it be too much bother to at least find new places for skill nodes when you recycle old lair maps...
I'm happy I won't have to go through the first three maps ever again... ...with the possible exception of Fiery Pit, I won't go there deliberately, either...
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,456Arc User
Fiery Pit: Only went there once, and only for one level, so my judgement here is less founded. I liked the lair quests in part 1 - the Fardelver's map thing: Story-inteegrated, somewhat innovative, with those water bucket attacks :^) Had some fun there. Also, that zone had some atmosphere, and an upbeat spirit after the first two gloom orgies...
.
Finding the crystal (or whatever they call it) was "different". Need to go to certain odd places to find them like walking on the roof and outside of the wall. Once is enough though. I missed a section of the map and took me forever to locate the last few. My mistake, not the game.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
0
silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
edited May 2015
Skip the first three.. they are HAMSTER.
Spinward is nice and if THEY only put spinward into the game and PUT real experience back , then they wouldve made most of happy.
Also they shouldve MADE real minsc and boo story all the way to the end.
They missed so much chance to make this a good mod its not even funny.
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lirithielMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 2,482Arc User
Wasn't graphics issues for me, more the lag. I would have slaughtered 100's of giants if not for all that lag.
I don't think turn down the graphic will help the lag. May be by a little bit but not enough to be material (unless you are in something like dragon run).
On the other hand, I did not experience the lag when I was in new area.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
0
darkstarcrashMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,382Arc User
edited May 2015
If you experience lag in Spinward Rise, switch to a low-pop instance -- that solved the lag for me everytime.
0
beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
If you experience lag in Spinward Rise, switch to a low-pop instance -- that solved the lag for me everytime.
Me too, although some of their changes seem to have made the game better able to support the 30-player Spinward instances because I don't see the same performance issues there that I used to, without switching.
khimera906Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 898Arc User
edited May 2015
So what's the point of threads like this anymore? Everyone knows vigilance quests suck. I have 12 characters. Am I supposed to make a thread for each of them? It won't change a thing.
To everyone defending this bs of a campaign- please shut up.
I hate dancing with Lady Luck. She always steps on my toes.
0
beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
edited May 2015
When the best thing that can be said about the campaign is that you don't have to do the campaign.... Ahem.
I'm a (generally) patient soul with a lot of tolerance for repetition and doing things slowly, so it's actually no big deal for me to chip away at vigilance tasks as much as I feel like, skipping all the ones I don't want to do, and if I run out of bearable quests, I can switch alts. But just because my personal habits make something (kinda sorta) ok for me doesn't mean I think it's good design. It's more that I have my own ways of working around things that are badly designed.
silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
edited May 2015
Skip it all.. only do spinward. thats still the best advice for this terri-bad design.
I also skipped spinward on one alt.. just made the effing thing myself. IF IF they gave us ToD back (and they should) we could just do those over and over for almost a level a day and SKIP it all.
I dont think they totally get how boring content, makes game boring.
Plus, their tooltip is deceptive. When you see "vigilance quest" in the tooltip, it has to be counted in your 16-quest goal. As is, you complete a supposed vigilance quest and your counter goes from 3/16 to 3/16 because, well, not the right realm, or not the right phase of the moon, oi it's the 13th of the month, or whatever reason.
ToD = ..........
Tired of Dailies/Tyranny of Dailies/Timers of Doom/Tricked Or Duped/Tremendously Obnoxious Dailies/Try Otherwise, Devs
Extensive grind is to time-sink players while developers continue to match the license deadlines of new content riddled with bugs and exploits. Can you imagine the amount of HAMSTER piling up with poor coding by the time they reach Mod 12, or 20 even.
Yup, its as if we bought what we thought was a home (with our attention, time and for many, money) but instead it was a hotel room, and mod 6 was checkout day.
Also they shouldve MADE real minsc and boo story all the way to the end.
That reminds me - do the repeatable Minsc and Boo quests actually have a purpose? They're repeatable so I repeated them! At the end you give a seed to the tree and there's a glowing animation but it's the same every time. Is something ever supposed to happen? If I give the tree 100 seeds does it get bigger or something? Have I missed something obvious or is it just - pointless?
Comments
"Why is it dragons only use ketchup? I'd like a little wasabi please. Us silvers like a variety of condiments."
"Don't call them foolish mortals. One, they don't learn from it. Two, It just ticks them off." - An Ancient Red Dragon
lol cause botters dont have unlimited time right?
After all someone took a lot of time to program the scenery, the traps, the opponents and conversations in these areas so why not take a little time to appreciate the work they did?
I feel sorry for people who run through quests and dungeons to max out on leveling, only to set back and ask themselves "now what?", unless endless grinding for loot and gear is really what you're into.
ive already done it once. i like the grinding more than these quests XD
But then Reclamation Rock became tedious almost immediately. Third zone (name forgotten) was the worst because there wasn't even a real sense of moving on; just racing back to same hub over-and-over and trying to remember which NPC gave the correct quests; although soloing some of the landscape bosses was fun/challenging. Things improved again at Spinward owing to the new landscape and the air-tome quests; although in retrospect there wasn't much more to it than that; the daily that ended 5 mins early didn't help. At least at SR one could see the light at the end of the tunnel and taste that free main hand artifact - along with the bitter taste of the grind to upgrade it that was to follow.
And having got to l.70 I can now return to the same WoD quests I was already doing at l.60 but with more lag and higher difficulty - "Certainty of death, small chance of success - what are we waiting for?"
They have abysmal drop rates for items you need to collect from monster drops, which wouldn't be so bad except that carrying that quest with the horrible drop rate prevents you from taking other quests due to the limitation of 4 at once, making you choose between dropping the quest to replace it with another that might not HAMSTER-block you from completing it, thus losing all your hard-won macguffins, or attempting to grit it out long enough to get the remaining macguffins so you can finally turn it in and resolve that you will NEVER take that quest again.
Quests with objectives that stack easily are almost invariably offered in alternating hours, so dealing with them efficiently requires extra hoop-jumping on the part of the player. There are some exceptions, but as a rule, you need to take quests 1 and 2 before the hour and then take quests 3 and 4 after the hour, and then you've got a nice quick planned round that minimizes boredom and frustration.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
Imagine, if those vigilant tasks weren't there, what would most people do? There are only 3-3 dungeons left, no real motivation to do dungeons, no AD can now be gained back from game.
So yeah, vigilant quests are a substitute for overall content.
Robert E. Lee
I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself.
Winston Churchill
The human race is a herd. Here we are, unique, eternal aspects of consciousness with an infinity of potential, and we have allowed ourselves to become an unthinking, unquestioning blob of conformity and uniformity. A herd. Once we concede to the herd mentality, we can be controlled and directed by a tiny few. And we are.
David Icke
I've only went thru vigilance quests to level up 2 chars, and just like levelling up new chars, it's fun the first 1 or 2 times, but I'm not gonna do it again, and don't see the need to when all my other chars are level 70 by invoking etc.
Have the gear and skills, but lack the friends to play with? Come and apply for Essence of Aggression. We have been here and strong since beta. (Immature, rude, and arrogant people will not be accepted)
I was excited about Spinward Rise. Completely new area, completely new monsters, completely new everything! But all the time and effort the artists put into that area has been wasted on me, because I have to run everything on minimum graphics settings. :-(
"...I grab my wiener and charge!" - ironzerg79
There is no way what was giving to us was what was on thier design board from the start, something clearly happened, which they will never discuss, do not know if it was part of the shakeup or not.
But I think anyone can tell , there was zip after the minsc and boo part of it, nada, nothing, just recycled quest items and they didnt even have to put thought in the first three zones at all.
Sadly, ALMOST every preview post in testing was competely ignored about bugs/feats and powers not working (lets just point to the DC preview testing, THEY didnt even get ONE pass through to fix feats that WILL literally never work on the lines they were giving) it was pointed out over and over and over and over again, without ONE reply, not one! )
Its that sort of stuff that GREATLY discourages future testing.
Something got effed up.. I mean really effed up here and they are slowly putting it back together, but at the SAME time they are also adding other negative factors against the playerbase (IE dragon hoard nerfing)
There is so much negative being added, that the positives, never seem to make a dent into it all.
Hmmm! Why? I did not see any graphic that is taxing. There is no dragon run in that area.
Drowned Shore: Tedious, overstuffed map, horrible fighting, especially with those chars that need dodging space (HR, DC), confuddled quests, quests where the drop rates and/or the number to gather were meh, and the Crabby HE was going on eternally and thus often made the whole beach area a no-go-minefield...
RecRock: Tedium absolute. Only fun part were the Bulettes in the middle segment. "Kill 15 Whatnots" - where Whatnots spawn max 5 at a time with a 15 minute respawn cycle? Sup...
Fiery Pit: Only went there once, and only for one level, so my judgement here is less founded. I liked the lair quests in part 1 - the Fardelver's map thing: Story-inteegrated, somewhat innovative, with those water bucket attacks :^) Had some fun there. Also, that zone had some atmosphere, and an upbeat spirit after the first two gloom orgies...
On the global view:
It wouldn't hurt to cut down the number of vigilance quests per cycle 12. Neither would allowing players to pick up 6 quests at a time. Nor would it be too much bother to at least find new places for skill nodes when you recycle old lair maps...
I'm happy I won't have to go through the first three maps ever again... ...with the possible exception of Fiery Pit, I won't go there deliberately, either...
Finding the crystal (or whatever they call it) was "different". Need to go to certain odd places to find them like walking on the roof and outside of the wall. Once is enough though. I missed a section of the map and took me forever to locate the last few. My mistake, not the game.
Spinward is nice and if THEY only put spinward into the game and PUT real experience back , then they wouldve made most of happy.
Also they shouldve MADE real minsc and boo story all the way to the end.
They missed so much chance to make this a good mod its not even funny.
Wasn't graphics issues for me, more the lag. I would have slaughtered 100's of giants if not for all that lag.
The most important thing in life is to be yourself. Unless you can be Batman. Always be Batman.
I don't think turn down the graphic will help the lag. May be by a little bit but not enough to be material (unless you are in something like dragon run).
On the other hand, I did not experience the lag when I was in new area.
Me too, although some of their changes seem to have made the game better able to support the 30-player Spinward instances because I don't see the same performance issues there that I used to, without switching.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
To everyone defending this bs of a campaign- please shut up.
I'm a (generally) patient soul with a lot of tolerance for repetition and doing things slowly, so it's actually no big deal for me to chip away at vigilance tasks as much as I feel like, skipping all the ones I don't want to do, and if I run out of bearable quests, I can switch alts. But just because my personal habits make something (kinda sorta) ok for me doesn't mean I think it's good design. It's more that I have my own ways of working around things that are badly designed.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
I also skipped spinward on one alt.. just made the effing thing myself. IF IF they gave us ToD back (and they should) we could just do those over and over for almost a level a day and SKIP it all.
I dont think they totally get how boring content, makes game boring.
Tired of Dailies/Tyranny of Dailies/Timers of Doom/Tricked Or Duped/Tremendously Obnoxious Dailies/Try Otherwise, Devs
That reminds me - do the repeatable Minsc and Boo quests actually have a purpose? They're repeatable so I repeated them! At the end you give a seed to the tree and there's a glowing animation but it's the same every time. Is something ever supposed to happen? If I give the tree 100 seeds does it get bigger or something? Have I missed something obvious or is it just - pointless?