Might be so. But like I sad I farm Bark from Master of the hunt. PK and SP does drops vorpals often. You might be right that they are random thought.
Barkshield and Elven Battle are the Sharandar armor enchants, which also drop in predictable locations (and randomly in MC). Other shards are random, although I tend to find some kinds more often than others (but that isn't a statistically significant sample).
chemboy613Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,521Arc User
edited September 2014
Maybe our DC playstyles are very different, but I can't keep up 3 stacks unless i stand there and beat on the mobs with at wills. The attack rate is way too slow.
yes, you should be focusing on bosses, but unless you use hardtargetlock (which isn't good for DC), you will hit other mobs for sure.
Thirdly, what about the time spent dodging? what about when you cast spells on your allies instead of the mobs?
Unless there are no adds, i don't see how anyone except a fighter can really keep 3 stacks up (maybe CW with icy terrain) on a boss. I think it's an optimistic delusion to think otherwise.
Of course, ACT doesn't let us measure enchant uptime % (i wish it did), so we don't know for sure, i just don't see how 3 stacks (or even two) up say, 70-80% of the time is realistic.
Maybe our DC playstyles are very different, but I can't keep up 3 stacks unless i stand there and beat on the mobs with at wills. The attack rate is way too slow.
Plague Fire procs from encounters too. So if you use Sunburst, Astral Shield and Divine Glow (as all debuffer DCs probably should) and stay close enough to the boss, you can easly keep 3 stacks up.
I think Archer HR are built to crit, if you read the feats you can see this is obvious.
I don’t personally play a combat HR, but i have seen them around.
I’d like to have some HR input here, as it’s a class i’m not great at, so please help me out. My current thoughts:
BIS: Vorpal (archer for sure).
Honorable mention: Plaguefire, Terror
As an archer HR, I find PF to be BiS - Our crit % tends to be 35-45%, true, but most of our damage is AoE, so we're hitting multiple people. Rain of Arrows and Split the Sky are excellent DPS powers and, with GPF, can stack debuffs very quickly.
I agree with the enchantment choice, but not quite with the gameplay you describe:
- Blitz.. honestly, a PvE TR using blitz has no idea what's expected from him. Same as PotB. It's mediocre at best, the cooldown is way too high for the damage it does (also true on PotB) and there are much better alternatives to kill faster. We're single target dps classes. Stick to what you're good at: mobility and 1o1 DPS.
as a PvE TR, the only reason I use blitz is because I'm a scoundrel build. Catspaw style is wonderful.
chemboy613Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,521Arc User
edited September 2014
my DC - i run Daunting light (nimbus of light), Astral Shield (because it's incredible), Divine Glow (it's awesome), then dot with seal and use blessing of battle (feated) to buff the team, and of course HG or anointed army, based upon situation.
Sure you can keep up 5 stacks if you have no aggro and you don't have to dodge all the time, and sure, we'd all like to be in that situation, what i'm saying is that there are many times that isn't true. The cast time on DL, DG, BoB, Astral SEAL, etc... are all about 1s and Astral Shield doesn't proc plaguefire, so any interruption to our rotation will cause us to lose a stack (or two).
The wonderful thing about terror is one hit and done, it's up for 5 seconds. Even with all the other difficulties of real fights, you can hit the mobs once every five seconds, right?
Another issue is target limits - DC abilities often have target caps of 5. How do we know we are hitting the same five mobs? I keep looking for a way the game decides which mobs to hit and not hit when we are over the target cap, but i have yet to find one. (any help on this point would be appreciated)
So what i'm trying to say is not that it's impossible to keep up three stacks of plaguefire, but anytime you are in a fight that matters, you likely just aren't standing still and smashing the bosses face, unless you are a fighter class. Therefore the reality it's not 3 stacks at all times, it is less. Once you add in targeting issues (hardtarget lock has limited uses), it becomes difficult, if not impossible, to maintain those stacks in many of the fights that matter, just due to the number of adds.
Secondly, at least from a CW perspective, if there is any noticeble difference of these two enchants, I haven't seen it, and I've poured over many CW logs in ACT and for CW, Plaguefire/Terror perform essentially the same, and we would think with higher target limits a CW should be able to maintain stacks better than a DC?
The theme is we have to caution ourselves against optimistic assumptions here - we all think we can keep up our stacks and should be able to, but that's because we are assuming situations better than they actually are. In fights where there are the NW custom of tons of adds, it's not realistic.
I'll take umbrage with the assessment of Terror and Plague Fire being on par with Vorpal for Spellstorm mage's. I do believe it is the best possible option when used correctly. As you acknowledged, Eye of the Storm complicates things in that it increases the crit rate. But I believe it complicates things more than you are accounting for. For example, I always save my Daily's for right after when Eye of the Storm procs. That means I'm getting close to 100% crits on my Daily's. My overall crit % is around 55%, but that is because low damage abilities like Icy Terrain and Conduit of ice damage ticks are critting below 45% of the time while high damage abilities are critting well above 55% of the time. When that is the case, doing the math with the assumption that crits are spread out equally among all abilities will badly underestimate the damage contribution of the Vorpal enchantment.
The other thing to mention is that Plague Fire and Terror enchantments quickly become redundant. They don't stack. Since that is the case, the ideal group composition will have debuffing enchantments on low damage members of the party and personal damage amplifying enchantments on the high damage members of the party. Having a DC with a Plague Fire enchantment and a CW with a Plague Fire is massively inferior to a DC with a Plague Fire and a CW with a Perfect Vorpal. If no one else in the group is using a Plague Fire, then a Plague Fire may help the group the most. But ideally, players who don't do as much damage as the CW should be the ones who shift over to Plague Fire/Terror. The CW should not.
It is true that CW's can hit more enemies at a time than the DC can but, frankly, most enemies will die very quickly with or without the Plague Fire debuff. The debuff is mainly useful on stronger enemies like bosses and elites. In those cases a DC is perfectly capable of keeping the debuff up.
I think Archer HR are built to crit, if you read the feats you can see this is obvious.
I don’t personally play a combat HR, but i have seen them around.
I’d like to have some HR input here, as it’s a class i’m not great at, so please help me out. My current thoughts:
BIS: Vorpal (archer for sure).
Honorable mention: Plaguefire, Terror
10 HR 10 set ups but here is my picks for weapon enchants
Archery :
1 pvorpal with over 60%(grand wardens) crit chance so very nice and a severity of ~80% base
2 pfire not sure why but lots of PvPers love this chant
3 pterror debuff + weapon damage
4 gpf debuff + weapon damage dot
5 plight no thanks no control over arcs at all and is agro magnet
Combat :
1 plightning 50% chance to arc with 3 possible arcs increases melee range to about 90' and you tic ALL the time CtG ~6 hits a second so you have good chance to arc every second
2 gpf debuff + weapon damage dot
3 pterror debuff + weapon damage
4 pfire not sure why but lots of PvPers love this chant
5 pvorp no thanks you probably have a crit chance in the teens so no good all around
-bunny-
Trapper :
this is the tricky one
massive dps mostly aoe (5caps) so do you go with gpf pterr vorp or a 'tick' like pflame or pbile or maybe something fun like a fey or Holy avenger
arpen shouldnt be a problem so no bronzewood
trapper depending on armor and jewels and augment can M5 sustain constant cast for inexess of 2 mins also have variable crit from mid teens to ~50% but can 'focus' on a single target keeping stacks on a primary target and hitting secondaries gpf should be up at least 2 stacks all the time terror should have debuff on main target constantly(have not measured how long terror debuff stays on a target{kaelac help}) ticks are nice
so depending on YOUR INDIVIDUAL trapper set up GW RG(why i dont know is redundant) FL Drac DT PC CBI PBI DL FI or any combination you need to look at your crit n recovery are you able to maintain 2 mins of constant cast ( i mean as soon as an animation is over you cast the next in rotation not counting dailies, as they are fillers to bridge next constant cast ) then you need to decide for your self taking into consideration price
vorp good personal dps (can beat any other class for sustained fights according to ACT like draco or lostmauth)
Gpf Pterror excellent debuff ok personal dps
Pfire Pbile or any other 'Tick' damage
Plight carefull is very dangerous if you cant handle the adds
or id suggest playing with another enchant and letting me know how you feel about it feytouched or Holy Avenger for example id love to test them on mimic
that said with M6 announced trapper can now sustain constant cast unlimited also mobs die with 1 swing of a root and you can move on and KNOW they are dead (has been tested by 'naked' trappers ie only main and off hand no other equipment or augments / active pets)
vorp
debuff
tick
light
others
0
chemboy613Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,521Arc User
10 HR 10 set ups but here is my picks for weapon enchants
Archery :
1 pvorpal with over 60%(grand wardens) crit chance so very nice and a severity of ~80% base
2 pfire not sure why but lots of PvPers love this chant
3 pterror debuff + weapon damage
4 gpf debuff + weapon damage dot
5 plight no thanks no control over arcs at all and is agro magnet
Combat :
1 plightning 50% chance to arc with 3 possible arcs increases melee range to about 90' and you tic ALL the time CtG ~6 hits a second so you have good chance to arc every second
2 gpf debuff + weapon damage dot
3 pterror debuff + weapon damage
4 pfire not sure why but lots of PvPers love this chant
5 pvorp no thanks you probably have a crit chance in the teens so no good all around
chemboy613Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,521Arc User
edited November 2014
Thread updated due to Bunny's assement.
Note:
I was not planning on updating this for mod 5 since the enchants haven't changed. However, if anyone else has helpful suggestions, please feel free to post.
I was not planning on updating this for mod 5 since the enchants haven't changed. However, if anyone else has helpful suggestions, please feel free to post.
How do you get the crit chance to 60% for grand warden i have 3k crit and 24 wisdom and its just 41%
0
chemboy613Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,521Arc User
gabrieldourdenMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,212Arc User
edited November 2014
What would you recommend for a Trapper?
Le-Shan: HR level 80 (main)
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
0
thefabricantMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 5,248Arc User
edited December 2014
I am going to ask about this here because whilst this isn't strickly related to weapon enchants, it is dealing with enchants that have conflicting information about them and I would like some clarification on. Is it possible to get a definate say on what the cooldown on the tenebrous, fey touched and dragon hoard enchants are, because in all cases I am finding I can't find substantial information on and in the case of the case of tenebrous, I know people who might be making alterations on their builds dependent on the cooldown.
I am going to ask about this here because whilst this isn't strickly related to weapon enchants, it is dealing with enchants that have conflicting information about them and I would like some clarification on. Is it possible to get a definate say on what the cooldown on the tenebrous, fey touched and dragon hoard enchants are, because in all cases I am finding I can't find substantial information on and in the case of the case of tenebrous, I know people who might be making alterations on their builds dependent on the cooldown.
recently tested tene chant its a proc not a icd fey hoard tymora ~30 seconds OUTSIDE of foundry inside ~2 min
Comments
They're random except Terror (Gnarlroot Cave) and Feytouched (Witch Fen). Only the Sharandar enchants can be predictably farmed.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
Might be so. But like I sad I farm Bark from Master of the hunt. PK and SP does drops vorpals often. You might be right that they are random thought.
- Coolest looking enchant, but useless.
Add that.
Thanks to kolbe11 for his efforts in testing this.
Frost & Frostburn Enchantment Analysis
We are searching for slave labor, will pay with food from our farm!
Barkshield and Elven Battle are the Sharandar armor enchants, which also drop in predictable locations (and randomly in MC). Other shards are random, although I tend to find some kinds more often than others (but that isn't a statistically significant sample).
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
yes, you should be focusing on bosses, but unless you use hardtargetlock (which isn't good for DC), you will hit other mobs for sure.
Thirdly, what about the time spent dodging? what about when you cast spells on your allies instead of the mobs?
Unless there are no adds, i don't see how anyone except a fighter can really keep 3 stacks up (maybe CW with icy terrain) on a boss. I think it's an optimistic delusion to think otherwise.
Of course, ACT doesn't let us measure enchant uptime % (i wish it did), so we don't know for sure, i just don't see how 3 stacks (or even two) up say, 70-80% of the time is realistic.
Everything you need to know about CW:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?780981-Chem-s-CW-Compendium-Everything-you-need-to-know
Plague Fire procs from encounters too. So if you use Sunburst, Astral Shield and Divine Glow (as all debuffer DCs probably should) and stay close enough to the boss, you can easly keep 3 stacks up.
As an archer HR, I find PF to be BiS - Our crit % tends to be 35-45%, true, but most of our damage is AoE, so we're hitting multiple people. Rain of Arrows and Split the Sky are excellent DPS powers and, with GPF, can stack debuffs very quickly.
Sharra Del'Armgo - SW Trapper Hybrid HR
Ogghra Bar'Ghuzumn - MI Scoundrel TR
Vænna Thrymskjöldr - IV Protector GF
as a PvE TR, the only reason I use blitz is because I'm a scoundrel build. Catspaw style is wonderful.
Sharra Del'Armgo - SW Trapper Hybrid HR
Ogghra Bar'Ghuzumn - MI Scoundrel TR
Vænna Thrymskjöldr - IV Protector GF
Sure you can keep up 5 stacks if you have no aggro and you don't have to dodge all the time, and sure, we'd all like to be in that situation, what i'm saying is that there are many times that isn't true. The cast time on DL, DG, BoB, Astral SEAL, etc... are all about 1s and Astral Shield doesn't proc plaguefire, so any interruption to our rotation will cause us to lose a stack (or two).
The wonderful thing about terror is one hit and done, it's up for 5 seconds. Even with all the other difficulties of real fights, you can hit the mobs once every five seconds, right?
Another issue is target limits - DC abilities often have target caps of 5. How do we know we are hitting the same five mobs? I keep looking for a way the game decides which mobs to hit and not hit when we are over the target cap, but i have yet to find one. (any help on this point would be appreciated)
So what i'm trying to say is not that it's impossible to keep up three stacks of plaguefire, but anytime you are in a fight that matters, you likely just aren't standing still and smashing the bosses face, unless you are a fighter class. Therefore the reality it's not 3 stacks at all times, it is less. Once you add in targeting issues (hardtarget lock has limited uses), it becomes difficult, if not impossible, to maintain those stacks in many of the fights that matter, just due to the number of adds.
Secondly, at least from a CW perspective, if there is any noticeble difference of these two enchants, I haven't seen it, and I've poured over many CW logs in ACT and for CW, Plaguefire/Terror perform essentially the same, and we would think with higher target limits a CW should be able to maintain stacks better than a DC?
The theme is we have to caution ourselves against optimistic assumptions here - we all think we can keep up our stacks and should be able to, but that's because we are assuming situations better than they actually are. In fights where there are the NW custom of tons of adds, it's not realistic.
Everything you need to know about CW:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?780981-Chem-s-CW-Compendium-Everything-you-need-to-know
The other thing to mention is that Plague Fire and Terror enchantments quickly become redundant. They don't stack. Since that is the case, the ideal group composition will have debuffing enchantments on low damage members of the party and personal damage amplifying enchantments on the high damage members of the party. Having a DC with a Plague Fire enchantment and a CW with a Plague Fire is massively inferior to a DC with a Plague Fire and a CW with a Perfect Vorpal. If no one else in the group is using a Plague Fire, then a Plague Fire may help the group the most. But ideally, players who don't do as much damage as the CW should be the ones who shift over to Plague Fire/Terror. The CW should not.
It is true that CW's can hit more enemies at a time than the DC can but, frankly, most enemies will die very quickly with or without the Plague Fire debuff. The debuff is mainly useful on stronger enemies like bosses and elites. In those cases a DC is perfectly capable of keeping the debuff up.
10 HR 10 set ups but here is my picks for weapon enchants
Archery :
1 pvorpal with over 60%(grand wardens) crit chance so very nice and a severity of ~80% base
2 pfire not sure why but lots of PvPers love this chant
3 pterror debuff + weapon damage
4 gpf debuff + weapon damage dot
5 plight no thanks no control over arcs at all and is agro magnet
Combat :
1 plightning 50% chance to arc with 3 possible arcs increases melee range to about 90' and you tic ALL the time CtG ~6 hits a second so you have good chance to arc every second
2 gpf debuff + weapon damage dot
3 pterror debuff + weapon damage
4 pfire not sure why but lots of PvPers love this chant
5 pvorp no thanks you probably have a crit chance in the teens so no good all around
-bunny-
Trapper :
this is the tricky one
massive dps mostly aoe (5caps) so do you go with gpf pterr vorp or a 'tick' like pflame or pbile or maybe something fun like a fey or Holy avenger
arpen shouldnt be a problem so no bronzewood
trapper depending on armor and jewels and augment can M5 sustain constant cast for inexess of 2 mins also have variable crit from mid teens to ~50% but can 'focus' on a single target keeping stacks on a primary target and hitting secondaries gpf should be up at least 2 stacks all the time terror should have debuff on main target constantly(have not measured how long terror debuff stays on a target{kaelac help}) ticks are nice
so depending on YOUR INDIVIDUAL trapper set up GW RG(why i dont know is redundant) FL Drac DT PC CBI PBI DL FI or any combination you need to look at your crit n recovery are you able to maintain 2 mins of constant cast ( i mean as soon as an animation is over you cast the next in rotation not counting dailies, as they are fillers to bridge next constant cast ) then you need to decide for your self taking into consideration price
vorp good personal dps (can beat any other class for sustained fights according to ACT like draco or lostmauth)
Gpf Pterror excellent debuff ok personal dps
Pfire Pbile or any other 'Tick' damage
Plight carefull is very dangerous if you cant handle the adds
or id suggest playing with another enchant and letting me know how you feel about it feytouched or Holy Avenger for example id love to test them on mimic
that said with M6 announced trapper can now sustain constant cast unlimited also mobs die with 1 swing of a root and you can move on and KNOW they are dead (has been tested by 'naked' trappers ie only main and off hand no other equipment or augments / active pets)
vorp
debuff
tick
light
others
Editing the guide to match your post, thank you
Everything you need to know about CW:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?780981-Chem-s-CW-Compendium-Everything-you-need-to-know
Note:
I was not planning on updating this for mod 5 since the enchants haven't changed. However, if anyone else has helpful suggestions, please feel free to post.
Everything you need to know about CW:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?780981-Chem-s-CW-Compendium-Everything-you-need-to-know
How do you get the crit chance to 60% for grand warden i have 3k crit and 24 wisdom and its just 41%
I have 60% real crit on my archer due to feats and playstyle.
I don't know how bunny gets 60% on GW, my guess is it's the archer feat. Only way that makes sense.
Everything you need to know about CW:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?780981-Chem-s-CW-Compendium-Everything-you-need-to-know
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
recently tested tene chant its a proc not a icd fey hoard tymora ~30 seconds OUTSIDE of foundry inside ~2 min
i have up dated HR suggested enchants to include trapper