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Event Discussion: 'Wonders of Gond'

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  • akemnosakemnos Member Posts: 597 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    yeah the losers are f2p players who actually want a doohickey.
  • flambridgeflambridge Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 191 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    This event is great for new and old players.

    New players:
    1) Farm Grommets and sell them for great AD.
    2) Do Level 1 crafting for great AD.
    3) Get some of the other event items.

    Old players
    1) Sell Doohickey's for great AD
    2) Get some of the other event items.

    It's all perception. I choose to look at the event as a win for everyone.

    Dude, I'm old player and stuck in the middle.
    The theory is very beautiful, but the practice is very ugly for those not various "workers".

    Do not remember having spoken it is "obligatory to play with many characters," and this is a mistake that starting to annoy.

    I repeat, the event is not bad. Only that is poorly adjusted, yes. U.U
  • radtatatradtatat Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 201
    edited August 2014
    This event is great for new and old players.

    New players:
    1) Farm Grommets and sell them for great AD.
    2) Do Level 1 crafting for great AD.
    3) Get some of the other event items.

    Old players
    1) Sell Doohickey's for great AD
    2) Get some of the other event items.

    It's all perception. I choose to look at the event as a win for everyone.

    Yes, it is all about perception, or what I prefer to call it "deceiving yourself especially if you are at the losing end". I'm pretty sure most new players don't see it the way you do.

    I play a game and participate in events to have fun, and a shot at the best rewards. If you take away the fun factor and the rewards from me, why do I want to play the game anymore? I would rather spend my time making real life money and playing the real life stock market and treat myself to a nice meal at the end of the day with the real money I have earned, than playing a virtual market, earning virtual money and feeling tired, unsatisfied and have nothing to show for except a truck load of virtual diamonds.
  • loboguildloboguild Member Posts: 2,371 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    I gotta give degraaf that all players can benefit off the event.

    I still think getting the grand price should be more in reach for everyone, not only those that own ZEN or can somehow grind for 20+ hours. Has anybody gotten Grommits in DDs and/or HEs? Because right now it looks like I not only have to grind for them, but also completely abandon what I would normally do to get them. Horrible.
  • somenewnoob1somenewnoob1 Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    I'm a new player (2 weeks) and I've made what I consider a fortune in AD by selling low level crafting junk and grommets. Probably 20X what I had accumulated in 2 weeks of play.

    I've been liking the event!
  • ambisinisterrambisinisterr Member, Neverwinter Moderator Posts: 10,462 Community Moderator
    edited August 2014
    I already sent in a bit of feedback about the event privately but I'm going to put a shorter bit of my two cents here...

    I love the premise of this event. It's exactly the type of event I enjoy because it allows people to participate in nearly every action they do and really allows the players to set how much they want to farm as well as how they want to farm. It's this type of go as you want farm/grinds which I feel Neverwinter is so lacking in to begin with.

    As I've said before, the reason I don't particularly enjoy the way the professions is set up is because it takes away the between content grinds which I always found so casual friendly and relaxing in other games. I like that calm between the combat. While the way this event is set up may be combat related it's still more of a leisure than gear grinds.

    However despite how much I enjoy the premise of the grind I feel the costs are way off.

    As others have noted there does seem to be a 30 second or so internal cooldown between drops. This, I suppose, is to make the event more fair for single target classes but the ultimate effect was putting a 28-29 hour requirement to get a single doohickey. For a short term event this is just asking for far too much grinding in a short period. Many people I know threw up their hands and ignore the event.

    Which leads into the second issue, the Blueprints. Pay to avoid the grind...not a fan in general but if done right I don't mind it too much. However when the price point makes it so that $9 saves 29 hours of grinding I am sorry but this crosses the boundary of convenience to me. This feels very much to me like a paid event which you have an option to grind instead of a free event with an option to pay due to the extreme difference in effort.

    And that last sentence segways into two additional gripes I have.

    First of all, I hate gambling. Arguably the majority of the players in general don't want to gamble. RNG is fine for non-paid and permament grinds, but when my wallet comes out I want guarantees. I don't pay for a chances. Sorry. So I'll be paying for this doohickey because the grind isn't worth my time but I do not like a random chance on anything my wallet is tied to. Yes I know lockboxes are big sellers to a minority of people but I seriously wish more faith was put into lower costs and mass purchases without RNG.

    And finally...the ZAX...
    It's been hurting...and this event comes along and many players were hoping this would ease the strain on the ZAX. It did the opposite. I think it's a safe bet there are not only currently many players flooding the ZAX trying to buy Zen for blueprints not only for themselves but to also put them on the AH so they can make more AD to buy more Zen. These blueprints, last I checked, were selling for double Zen value. We really needed an AD sink and not more reasons for people to be using the ZAX to buy Zen or sell Zen Items on the AH.


    I like this event. It's got the potential to be my favorite event. And I am sad it fell so short for me and others due to the overly long grind, lockbox style rewards and high incentives for zen use.

    And the saddest part of all was that, yet again, if AD was not treated as an inferior currency this event would have been perfect even with the overly long grind.

    This is just my honest two cents put as respectfully as possible. It's a great event on paper but it didn't get properly executed.
  • dantesinferno76dantesinferno76 Member Posts: 22 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Totally agree with you Ambisinisterr. My addon to everything already stated is that this is a very disturbing trend I'm seeing develop and if it continues I will move onto another game that is better executed and mark my words, I will not be the only one to do so.
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  • mconosrepmconosrep Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Which leads into the second issue, the Blueprints. Pay to avoid the grind...not a fan in general but if done right I don't mind it too much. However when the price point makes it so that $9 saves 29 hours of grinding I am sorry but this crosses the boundary of convenience to me. This feels very much to me like a paid event which you have an option to grind instead of a free event with an option to pay due to the extreme difference in effort.

    Well I am glad a mod said this as this bit is pretty much the same as practically all the feedback I have heard from other players.

    Requiring a minimum of 30 hours of grinding in a 4 day event and then putting a ZEN item in the store to bypass this leads to the sort of comments that don't seem to be appreciated on this forum...
  • cheesegromitcheesegromit Member Posts: 540 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    RNG is fine for non-paid and permament grinds, but when my wallet comes out I want guarantees. I don't pay for a chances.

    I cannot echo this comment enough. It's a plague in this game as far as I'm concerned.
  • ambisinisterrambisinisterr Member, Neverwinter Moderator Posts: 10,462 Community Moderator
    edited August 2014
    mconosrep wrote: »
    leads to the sort of comments that don't seem to be appreciated on this forum...

    It's all in the presentation. I didn't say it's pay to win because it's not. If I don't get a doohickey or a mount it is not like I am in some unfair advantage. And if I do, although it will be nice to have it is in no way a requirement.

    However to me there is an inherent expectation when there's an event is released. That expectation is that every player wants a shot at getting the rewards in some way. That shot needs to be a realistic shot. A four day event requiring thirty hours of constant grinding is not a realistic shot to me no matter if you are a new or old player. Casual or Hardcore. I play a lot and even to me I don't see myself able to farm that up even though I am off of work for the entirety of the event.

    And this is completely disregarding the fact there is a random chance to take that thirty hours and walk away with a fifty cent reward if you want the mount. Sadly the mount is something I had to advise every member of my guild against because not one of them were expecting to only have the time to maybe get one shot at the mount within the event time frame.

    This isn't a pay to win issue...but it certainly does beg the question regarding realistic expectations both from the companies and the players. I personally do not feel expecting thirty hours of grinding within four days is realistic especially when RNG is thrown on top.

    So I am not saying this even is pay to win...
    But it's certainly hugging the border on pay to play the event...
  • bioshrikebioshrike Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,729 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    If they wanted to eat up all the ADs floating around, then they should have added the blueprints to the Wondrous Bazaar and make the doohickey something that is bought w/ the R7 item and make it BtA.
    <::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::)xxxxxxxx(:::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::>
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  • iambecks1iambecks1 Member Posts: 4,044 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    *snipped to save space*

    I must say , very well put and exactly what I have been thinking about this event , the rewards are great and it could be a great event but the need to grind such a insane amount to get the top reward is just too much . I would have had no problem with the bag of wonders being available using zen or whatever as long as everything else from the Doohikey downwards was available and achievable in a reasonable way/amount of time for everybody else , I would love the Blacksmith outfit but as it stands I'll probably finish my Doohikey and call it quits dissapointed and that isn't how a event should be.
    YourSecretsAreOurSecrets.gif
  • shunterinoshunterino Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    i think it's pretty obvious Cryptic made a deliberate business choice to run this event in this particular way. I'm sure they crunched numbers and made their decision to make it incredibly difficult for non Zen-users to receive any of the top tier rewards. This is their right. It's their game and if they feel it's a good business move to act like this, so be it. I'm sure they've made a lot of money so far already and are very pleased with themselves for being so savvy.

    I could make all sorts of claims about how terrible it all is and how it will ruin the game etc., but what do I know? All I know for sure is that now I've had a chance to get to grips with the event and have worked out what it would take to get the stuff that interests me, the initial excitement has turned into a miserable sense of disappointment and the best thing is to probably sell my gizmo and forget the event is even happening.

    Not fun.
  • jrfbrunetjrfbrunet Member Posts: 388 Arc User
    edited August 2014

    And the saddest part of all was that, yet again, if AD was not treated as an inferior currency this event would have been perfect even with the overly long grind.

    100% agreement.

    What is so wrong with selling the blueprints for AD?

    The ZAX would have benefited tremendously, and there would even be some players buying more Zen to sell for AD, so they could buy more blueprints and other things.
    It's as if PW/Cryptic wants players to forget about the ZAX completely.
    By forcing players to use the Zen store, they have made all currency problems even worse, and dropped player morale even more.
    Where'd my blinky-blinky path go?
  • anharmonanharmon Member Posts: 175
    edited August 2014
    ^This

    This was a four day event, i.e. short. If they took this opportunity to sell blueprints for AD, I think this could have really helped the ZAX backlog (or at least, prevented it from growing). No doubt they'd lose some profit, but again, the event is only four days long anyway.

    Instead, placing blueprints in the Zen store has caused the backlog to grow quickly. Even faster than before, that is.
  • zebularzebular Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 15,270 Community Moderator
    edited August 2014
    . . . Just have to say, me and Ambi are on the same page here. We've given our opinions, positive, negative and neutral a-like, in private correspondence with PWE/Cryptic.

    . . . In short: I love events like these that allow me to just play the game, keep advancing my characters, while at the same time being able to seamlessly participate in the event. (Plus, I am a sucker for anything FR God related!)

    . . . What makes it unenjoyable for me is when events like this become a chore to do and the rewards become unobtainable without having to either spend a great deal of time to have a single chance at the best item, forgoing all else, else spend Zen to still be presented with a chance to not get what you really want.
  • lindsaylowhandlindsaylowhand Member Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    akemnos wrote: »
    yeah the losers are f2p players who actually want a doohickey.
    Not at all.
    I'm a new player who made 300 k yesterday grinding on my level 60 toon in 5 hrs.
    How is making 300 k a bad thing?
    Plus if I wanted to grind I COULD have a doohickey...
    yeah the long grind sucks for people with no resources. But of course people with more resources who have been playing longer will be able to get the materials easier. If it was easier this thread would be about rich players getting ten while you are stuck with just one doohickey. I would just take it easy grinding and make a cool million or so AD and not worry about the doohickey (That can do 8 k crits every 30 secs or so ...who cares?)

    This is a very very effective AD sink. Millions of AD are being removed by people buying and selling grommets and refine components on the AH at -10%. Millions more AD are being transferred from 'whales' to newer players who are grinding grommets.

    Sure as an event goes it is hard to feel great about the prizes being so stupidly ridiculously overpriced for just a chance to get a mount or refine something so you can buy some fashion gear...
    But as an AD sink this is one hell of a sink and wealth transfer back down to f2p players. +1 to the devs for that at least.
  • oicidrazoicidraz Member Posts: 627 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Not at all.
    I'm a new player who made 300 k yesterday grinding on my level 60 toon in 5 hrs.
    How is making 300 k a bad thing?
    Plus if I wanted to grind I COULD have a doohickey...
    yeah the long grind sucks for people with no resources. But of course people with more resources who have been playing longer will be able to get the materials easier. If it was easier this thread would be about rich players getting ten while you are stuck with just one doohickey. I would just take it easy grinding and make a cool million or so AD and not worry about the doohickey (That can do 8 k crits every 30 secs or so ...who cares?)

    This is a very very effective AD sink. Millions of AD are being removed by people buying and selling grommets and refine components on the AH at -10%. Millions more AD are being transferred from 'whales' to newer players who are grinding grommets.

    Sure as an event goes it is hard to feel great about the prizes being so stupidly ridiculously overpriced for just a chance to get a mount or refine something so you can buy some fashion gear...
    But as an AD sink this is one hell of a sink and wealth transfer back down to f2p players. +1 to the devs for that at least.

    Yestarday 9M Zen requested in the ZAX, now more than 10M, I guess the AD sink is not working so good :).
  • ambisinisterrambisinisterr Member, Neverwinter Moderator Posts: 10,462 Community Moderator
    edited August 2014
    This is a very very effective AD sink. Millions of AD are being removed by people buying and selling grommets and refine components on the AH at -10%. Millions more AD are being transferred from 'whales' to newer players who are grinding grommets.

    This bit is inaccurate. ;)

    While AD is being removed so is Zen. Coupled with an increased demand for Zen...it's caused the complete opposite of an AD sink.

    For an AD sink to be effective the AD being removed can't drive additional demand for Zen. This event does.

    Just removing AD isn't enough.

    To give you an example, an effective AD sink would put a hole at the bottom of a bucket of water so it leaks. Well that's what we have now...except the faucet is putting more water into the bucket then the hole leaks. And this event more or less did cause the hole to expand but also caused the faucet to pump more water into the bucket...and as the ZAX changes show, the faucet has a bigger increase in flow than the hole.
  • oicidrazoicidraz Member Posts: 627 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    After seeing how much it cost to get a mount or a Doohickey I wonder when they are going to make a event aimed to free/casual players, before you could buy a Epic mount for 500K AD or Perfect Enchantments for 3M-6M (P.Feythoched, P.Vorpal, etc..), but now everything is atleast 3x times more expensive and they are not helping us... if you see the prices of the zen store I guess this is the real face of this "f2p" game, if it will be like this I guess NWN won't last so long.

    Not to mention all the balance problems, lack of high end content and bug fest that this game have since forever.
  • frishterfrishter Member Posts: 3,522 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    oicidraz wrote: »
    Yestarday 9M Zen requested in the ZAX, now more than 10M, I guess the AD sink is not working so good :).

    We'll have to see at the end of the event. People may be trying to exchange their ad for zen for the event, but they probably won't get it so may cancel their orders. However less people will probably be putting zen into the system. I for one have doubled the exchange rate value after material costs and taxs for the zen I already saved up. I am one to try and make AD out of events, though sometimes it doesn't go quite so flawless. I have 50 elminster juggling emotes for example and didn't expect them to add tokens which crashed the price down to cheaper than I bought them for.
  • charononuscharononus Member Posts: 5,715 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    frishter wrote: »
    We'll have to see at the end of the event. People may be trying to exchange their ad for zen for the event, but they probably won't get it so may cancel their orders. However less people will probably be putting zen into the system. I for one have doubled the exchange rate value after material costs and taxs for the zen I already saved up. I am one to try and make AD out of events, though sometimes it doesn't go quite so flawless. I have 50 elminster juggling emotes for example and didn't expect them to add tokens which crashed the price down to cheaper than I bought them for.

    I don't know I've been farming then selling and pouring ad directly into the ZAX to get Zen for mod4 so if there are a lot of people like me there won't be many canceled orders.
  • flambridgeflambridge Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 191 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    It's all in the presentation. I didn't say it's pay to win because it's not. If I don't get a doohickey or a mount it is not like I am in some unfair advantage. And if I do, although it will be nice to have it is in no way a requirement......

    So I am not saying this even is pay to win...
    But it's certainly hugging the border on pay to play the event...



    Not P2W (since even people with ZEN have problems).
    But time is very short, making the event something bad planned.
    To the middle player, four days is absurd.
    However it is not difficult for anyone who has "500 workers", or even for those who have full epic profession.
    I'm conscience that if I was with a Full Epic Alchemist, this event it would be truly vanilla sky.

    Also, I had to leave and now I'm stuck with several green and no blue. Not even altar looks like I'll get hold. And I'have 9 epic alchemists, even so gave way.
    I only wish the event was extended and green drops be placed, thus giving a chance to all catch something valuable.
  • mstrssihrmstrssihr Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 545 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    zebular wrote: »
    Update:
    . . . I just got word of the following which may help to better understand things:

    . . .
    Higher level grommets can only be crafted or upgraded to. Rank 1s are the ones that drop from monsters.

    Safe travels,
    Archmage Zebular of Mystryl

    PWE Community Moderator


    So... pretty much some members of the Dev team just completely dropped the ball here
    !!


    Thank you Zeb for asking them. Hehe, now would you please kindly go back to them and point out the event masters wording I've posted in the screen shot below?

    The Wondermaker of Gond is a liar.


    . eq14ro.jpg
    - Major Peachy Bottom * Gutbuster's Brigade -

    "Last request - microtransactions for alllll old skins for zen/weapon appearance changes, 500 zen to make ur wep glow the color/enchant you want it... You will make more off that one item than any other zen item ever made." freshour

    "beckylunatic" Gateway AH should have column headers to sort by buyout, bid, end time, quantity, etc. These disappeared iirc with the module launch. It's obnoxious.
  • ghoulz66ghoulz66 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,748 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    I thought the Lliira's Bell was ludicrously priced. Was sadly proven wrong with this...
  • alkemist80alkemist80 Member Posts: 957 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Just turned in my doohicky for a massive load of HAMSTER. Very disappointed, bought 5 blueprints from the zen store. Granted I got some free zen from peanutlab suverys and some from out of pocket but still. The "high chance" wasn't high enough :mad:
    Banshee (Devotion Justice Oathbound Paladin) - Crueladevil (Soulbinder Damnation Scourge Warlock) - Sindania Balefire (Master Infiltrator Trickster Rogue)

    werewolf.jpg
  • wimpazoidwimpazoid Member Posts: 504 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    flambridge wrote: »
    Not P2W (since even people with ZEN have problems).
    But time is very short, making the event something bad planned.
    To the middle player, four days is absurd.
    However it is not difficult for anyone who has "500 workers", or even for those who have full epic profession.
    I'm conscience that if I was with a Full Epic Alchemist, this event it would be truly vanilla sky.

    Also, I had to leave and now I'm stuck with several green and no blue. Not even altar looks like I'll get hold. And I'have 9 epic alchemists, even so gave way.
    I only wish the event was extended and green drops be placed, thus giving a chance to all catch something valuable.
    Another thing to consider, the high investment and short duration may be aimed to clear out AD and ZEN (AD to ZEN hording)
    Readily paying customers will continue to pay real ZEN so they simply continue to contribute to earnings. And the event is likely more an AD sink than for casual players to earn any of the top rewards.

    I'm not even doing the event, but that's just a personal preference to spend my time and money.
  • mstrssihrmstrssihr Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 545 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    I haven't seen a single Forgehammer of Gond Artifact in the AH, has anyone seen or heard anything about someone getting one?
    - Major Peachy Bottom * Gutbuster's Brigade -

    "Last request - microtransactions for alllll old skins for zen/weapon appearance changes, 500 zen to make ur wep glow the color/enchant you want it... You will make more off that one item than any other zen item ever made." freshour

    "beckylunatic" Gateway AH should have column headers to sort by buyout, bid, end time, quantity, etc. These disappeared iirc with the module launch. It's obnoxious.
  • oicidrazoicidraz Member Posts: 627 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    mstrssihr wrote: »
    I haven't seen a single Forgehammer of Gond Artifact in the AH, has anyone seen or heard anything about someone getting one?

    I was wondering about that too, I haven't see this, what it does or what stats give and I've searched for it a couple of times in the AH too...
This discussion has been closed.