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Worth coming back to my GF?
sphen5117
Member Posts: 5 Arc User
I simply have a quick question: Has there been any word from the devs about changes to GF?
I played for a handful of months after release, in hopes that the buffs and tweaks that were promised to my beloved GF class would actually come and be meaningful. I still check forums and the subreddit for this game every now and then to see if the situation has changed, yet sadly it seems either the devs are in denial of the state of the GF, or are happy with how gimped it seems to be late game.
I would like to come back, but not to a broken class. I just want proof of hope. I quit when I realized how ****ty the devs had been to tank classes in City of Heroes, etc, and the lack of interest in our class. I want to have hope.
I played for a handful of months after release, in hopes that the buffs and tweaks that were promised to my beloved GF class would actually come and be meaningful. I still check forums and the subreddit for this game every now and then to see if the situation has changed, yet sadly it seems either the devs are in denial of the state of the GF, or are happy with how gimped it seems to be late game.
I would like to come back, but not to a broken class. I just want proof of hope. I quit when I realized how ****ty the devs had been to tank classes in City of Heroes, etc, and the lack of interest in our class. I want to have hope.
Post edited by sphen5117 on
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for pvp... imo GF's is still useful. Having a skilled GF can troll a gwf long enuff.
Michael -- 21.1k PvP Sent GWF
morePewPewlessQQ -- 20k Pvp/PvE HR
If the state of the Guardian Fighter is so important to you, why then do you rely on the personal, albeit unauthoritative opinions of the very tiny percentage of players who actually frequent the forums, the subset of which who actually see and even then reply to this thread to be more important than just logging-in and giving it a go for an hour?
If you want genuine, honest, truthful, authoritative and *accurate* information on the state of your chosen class after so much time away, you'll have to just play it for a bit to see if all the updates and changes appeal to you. Only you, no one else, can make such a decision that is accurate enough for your own satisfaction. Everything else is pure speculation.
Just thought I'd mention that.
The new buffs to it seem to help a bit, and if you enjoy it I say go for it!
If you want to PvP you will have to have friends to keep you alive.
Overpowered 60 CW ~ Thaumaturge 14.5k
==========================================
~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
Obviously, as with any discussion, I hope that if someone is to respond with an answer, they would also have reasons. If they say "No, GF's are not needed in PvE and you will feel useless", the idea is that they would also have examples to back it up. Perhaps explaining how small of a percentage of dungeons use them, let alone require one as a tank. Perhaps observations about the state of tanking. It is hard to make a matter of numbers "personal". Anyone who just says no or yes without much evidence isn't really a solid reply, now is it? I do appreciate the opinion, but playing for myself is what led me to believe that the devs did not care for the class nearly as much as others, or were simply ignorant of how their game was actually being played out. These are literally the only two possibilities I can see for the state of them being as they are.
The fact that multiple people (I did not come here and ask this question without first running multiple searches on forums and the subreddit, checking the reasoning each time). My question was not "Are they needed?", as the answer is nearly unanimous everywhere I go, but whether or not the devs have even said anything worth giving us hope, etc. When the game came out, I stuck out the ****ty situation because I gave them the benefit of the doubt that they would do SOMETHING about it EVENTUALLY, since it was a new game and that obviously brings a couple months of turmoil to any game developer.
Sorry if I am coming across a bit short here, but your response borders on implying that any response thrown at my question would be taken with equal consideration, the ones that have points to support their claims as well as the uninformed, inexperienced opinions.
I am not asking if I will enjoy the game or class. Clearly that is up to me. I am asking if there is hope for improvement to the state of GF's, as the general consensus among people who articulate their responses well from personal experience (for example, seeing that the only way they can get a group is if it is with friends or a guild) is that we are in a significantly subpar situation.
To reiterate my first post: "I simply have a quick question: Has there been any word from the devs about changes to GF?"
When I started typing this reply, there were six replies to me. Two state that I will only be able to find a group if I am with friends or a guild. That may be fun to some, but not myself. That is not what I am asking.
Practically all comments and threads I've been seeing in the forums are whiners and crybabies bushing about how bad the GF is. Yet, I also know of others who absolutely love the class, but they aren't posting in the forums. And any thread this is positive about the forum often gets the whiny replies, which get all the "L2P" replies and it can degenerate into a chaotic mess, where an answer to a question such as yours is involved.
I was just trying to help you out. Simple advice. But it's only advice until you act on it then it becomes a decision. Whether you make the decision or not is no skin off my nose. How you take my original comment in this thread is entirely up to you, if you feel it was meant in mean or malicious way, then perhaps you may want to consider your current social outlook on things.
It wasn't meant to be mean or malicious. it is what it is.
Since you want specific answers to your question, okay, here it is - and this is my genuine truthful opinion on GF from my own personal play experience as of about two weeks ago: GF sucks. Not because it does too much, or because no one wants to play with one in group play, but rather because it's SLOW. Does so little DPS that it takes forever just to handle solo content, too squishy to be called "Guardian" or "Fighter". I've deleted my GF character and no intention to create a new one unless major changes are made to it. The short answer to my whining abut is: "L2P" - my answer to which is" BS. It's not about learn to play, it's about having *fun*, which this class does not offer."
But this is *MY* perspective. Now, because it's *my* perspective and belief, did *my* answer to your question, based entirely on *my* personal perspective and belief help you in your decision-making process as to whether or not *you* should give *your* GF another go?
I certainly hope not.
And with that, I rest my case.
The fact that no one has been able to point me to any word from developers about the future of the class is the silent answer to my actual question. I appreciate the help, and again I hope I did not sound too snotty, but the fact that my question seems to be unanswerable is an answer in itself. I do honestly wish you all fun with the game. I have loved many MMO's, DDO, and DnD itself. I want this game to be more enjoyable for me, but the lack of any concern shown by the developers sours *my* fun significantly. I appreciate your willingness to talk about this, but sadly my original question has now been answered negatively: No, the developers have not given us anything to look forward to in these areas. I consistently checked the forums and subreddit every month since release in hope, but I can only hold on to this hope for so long.
Good luck, and thanks again.
They're going to be patched in on Thursday, so most people haven't experienced them yet. Which means your question comes at an awkward time.
Neverwinter Census 2017
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The closest answer I can give is from Panderus post #5:
Meaning, they RECOGNIZE that there are inherent problems with the GF class, but when/what will be done is yet unknown.
I have enjoyed GF since Alpha and will continue to enjoy the class, but unless you have a guild with members that can appreciative what the class can offer still, it is hard to play.
For a start, GFs are not broken. They are a little clunky so they could be sped up a tad and they need a new TAB, but as a class there is nothing wrong with it. The problem is the game at the high end which is simply geared towards CWs and GWFs; crowd control + nuke = I won the game.
/10chara
The rest still up-and-coming!
They are in fact going to be making GFs a bit more powerful in the next module, which I guess is coming out soon (I didn't know about this Thursday). Lunging strike will have AoE, Bull Rush will have a longer range, Anvil of Doom and Gryffin's Wrath will hit faster, Enforced Taunt will be able to hit more targets, etc etc.
The developers aren't stupid. They've known that GFs were underpowered for a while. I think they will also be nerfing GWFs slightly.
Basically just wait a bit longer.
The problem is this has been the state of the class for a very, very long time. Literally since release, in one form or another. You say they aren't stupid, but then why the hell has it taken so long? They've known they were underpowered not just for a while, but for a VERY LONG while. "Waiting a bit longer" is what I've been doing since release.
Could you at least point me to some sort of patch notes? Something more concrete than their acknowledgement? Because simply put, their "acknowledgement" of a problem has proven to mean jack ****.
Edit: I know I keep sounding frustrated in this thread, but I want to be clear that it is never with the playerbase. I genuinely thank you guys for engaging me on the topic, and if anything you guys have shown this community to be a notch above many others. I understand that what is "fun" always comes down to personal preferences. As someone who's played many similar games and game types for a long time, I just become sort of picky, because I know which small problems in a game will grow in to big ones that burn me out later, and this is definitely one of them. My frustration is simply with the devs. I want so badly to love this game more, but It's important to me to cut my losses when so much hope and waiting has turned up fruitless.
This is the patch that is currently on our preview shard and should go live tomorrow
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?616691-Shadowmantle-Preview-Patch-Notes-NW-14-20140224a-1
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
I have seen GF using knee breaker... just saying... It is actually a decent skill to use. Once landed the slow is really devastating.
Thank you. Very helpful and uplifting, and I believe this will cause me to hop back on in the coming week or so to try things out.
Overpowered 60 CW ~ Thaumaturge 14.5k
==========================================
~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
I was actually referring to myself, in a subtle way...
GF is fine. Today, it may get even better. It MAY even cross the OP line again, assuming the user is clever, willing to work for it, and able to see past the negativity that is most common.
My suggestion? Wait a few hours, see if the update includes the "slated" GF changes, and if so, play it.
You gotta be kidding me?
Overpowered 60 CW ~ Thaumaturge 14.5k
==========================================
~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
My prediction if GF class will have to go full threat generation build to stay relevant and be picked up by parties
Then put a nail in the coffin of this class, because that is an absolutely unnecessary function in Neverwinter.
They should give an extreme OP buff for to the GF, test it for a while and later nerf if necesary, at least it will give a new perspective to the class' role.
Enforced Taunt = more targets = more aggro and more damage
Griffon's Wrath = much faster strikes = more dps, aggro, and more reliable stun (also synergizes well with Trample the Fallen and the Timeless Hero armor set)
Knight's Challenge = lower cooldown = more single target damage and aggro depending on personal skill level
(Knight's Challenge and Griffon's wrath, both being augmented, make the Staggering Challenge paragon feat more useful.)
Lunging strike = One of the few abilities that didn't even need improvement, got turned into an AoE. (It takes practice to use though.)
I use all of these skills and Timeless Hero, so I'm happy as a clam.
Not to mention Bull Rush and Knee Breaker are more reliable in PvP.
I still think Anvil of Doom could use some work. And I'm not happy that they nerfed the damage of Frontline Surge. I don't really use Supremacy of Steel, but I guess it was nerfed too. Still, over all I think the GF class is more powerful and more fun to play than before.
As for Fighter's Recovery being indirectly nerfed, again I have to disagree. Lunging Strike can be used to activate it now, and Enforced Taunt, being more powerful, makes better use of it when it counts (when you're knee deep in mobs).
I've played the GF a long time and seen the good and bad times. This is still part of the bad times for PvP GF's. The Frontline Surge nerf of 25% damage and cutting the Feat for it so that it gives 1/2 of the additional prone time ... plus crit and control mitigation of Tenacity, we're doing less damage. That hurts.
But, the increase in cap from 3 to 5 for Frontline Surge helps a little ... rarely can you get more than 3 in a Frontline Surge where none of them are GWF's currently Unstoppable or Rogues in Impossible to Catch (the two most tanky powers in the game by far and quite superior to any tanky power the GF has). So the utility is low, but when it happens it's fun.
The increased range to Bull Charge is awesome. That's exactly what that power needed. It's still a short to medium range ability, but with our vulnerability to range we need it. The improvement to Griffon's Wrath is nice ... but it's still very situational because we need Lunging Strike, Bull Charge and the control of Frontline Surge ... but we could swap it in when we know it's going to be a 1v1 encounter for a while.
All in all, we have less damage and less survivability than a GWF ... which is odd. What we do have is mele controls. That's where we can be useful in PvP. We're distinctly inferior to GWF's and high geared stealth-heavy rogues. We're easy targets for Rangers, but if we can go against them without too much interference, we have a decent chance. We have a fair chances against a Mage or Cleric. We work best with a partner, where we are the control setup and decoy and the other guy is the DPS.
We still definitely need a buff.