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Dungeon system completely broken
girty1
Member Posts: 2 Arc User
The dungeon system and the way party leaders can just kick anyone when loot drops is ridiculous. Also, the glitching is WAY OUT OF HAND. All's I want to do is run a regular non-glitch/shortcut (sounding like a complete moron when I don't know the glitch) dungeon run, but is almost impossible with the way people shortcut the game and totally ruin the fun for me. I JUST WANT TO PLAY THE RIGHT WAY and get chastised when I don't. I have 3 60's with almost 11k GS on each, and doing it the right way is fun for me NOT GLITCHING. FIX IT OR I AM DONE.
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Devs please fix exploits. Neverwinter is great game but it suffer because of glitches and rotten community.
As to the broken dungeon problem, it has been dissected ad nauseum by this forum. Many solutions have offered and quite a few have valid fixes, however there does not some to be any implementation on the horizon.
You do realize that failboating around taking hours to complete a single dungeon is not fun to the other 4 people in your group, and you not knowing how to run a dungeon ruins the fun for them, right? so why don't you join a guild of like minded people or quit. cus they obviously aren't fixing anything.
I am one of those who enjoy playing this game the right way without glitching, bugging or exploiting. To me, if dungeons are done the previous ways then the question should be asked, "Why are you running the dungeon then?" or better yet, "why are you even playing this MMO in the first place?" And yes, you don't need to reply with, "To get geared up, duh."
It might be useless in the context he stated it in but it is still valid if and I stress "IF" you can find the right guild who are mature, want to play the game the correct way and have fun at the same time.
In my personal experience, the guild I am in right now has all those characteristics and wow, does it make a difference. You enjoy the game even more when there are people out there to help you gear up properly and not just the high level ones only, the lower ones too. No drama is attached, no requirements or quotas to reach. We are just here for FUN, the only way to play a game.
That's my 2 cents on the matter.
Strawman argument. There is nothing about players that want to do things THE RIGHT WAY that implies that they are either unskilled or unknowledgeable about the instances.
And can we quit with the "find a guild" argument already. So cheaters and exploiters can just dominate the queues but legitimate players are the ones that need to find these rare "likeminded" players? Really? What poor logic.
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
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The dungeons do need some major repairs, any hint of these happening would be nice. Good start with the dragon breath weapons being fixed next week.
Anyhow back to the original topic. I think one of the big problems is that there just so many fixes required that making a priority list is a challenge. Looking at the latest patch notes on the preview server, it seems they are attempting to fix too many things in too many different areas. I would say they need to focus on one area at time. There are a number of bugs with the characters at the moment, but I think concentrating on dungeon fixes would satisfy a larger portion of the community. Then work on the character bugs. Once those are done then you have individuals start attacking the other bugs, such as visuals, foundry issues, and quest related bugs.
Now keep in mind, these are too many things required just to make dungeon runs enjoyable the legit way. WAY TOO MANY. If you are not geared, correctly specced, with 2/3 "correct" classes with correct gear set stacked, you will move through mobs at a snail pace. Trash is trash, should not take that long. That's why many skip it.
Now, another issue with epic dungeon trash. I'll make a comparison with WoW's trash packs from raids. So what drops do you get from trash in NWO's dungeons, hmm? Maybe some unique gear? Crafting components not available anywhere else? NO. Trash in epics is the same as trash in Sharandar, maybe worse, when it comes to drops. Now this is LAME.
OK, now WoW. Raid trash drops, over the ages:
- BoE epics
- unique epic crafting patterns
- unique epic crafting materials
- epic gems
- all kinds of USEFUL other drops I have forgotten about now
This gives people a reason to even farm trash, instead of skipping.
So in conclusion, the speedrunners - you shouldn't blame. They adapted to a situation and are making the most of the good parts of the game. However, skipping is not OK. So who to blame then for the situation? Well, you already know the answer... it's the guys who designed the dungeons and the rewards.
Just for Spider I have to say that fighting the end boss is way too complicated and glitching her seems the only valid way to beat her. We hit her like 20 mins last time only to see that our DPS were not fast enough to burn the healing spiders, then we gave up. THAT really needs to be redone. Final boss fight needs adjustments or it forces glitching it more and more.
At the moment I really think they should change the way a dungeon works and implement some sort of kill counter. 1st boss will only spawn when 90% of the mobs before were killed. 2nd boss will only spawn when 90% of the mobs before were killed and 3rd boss will only spawn when 1st boss and 2nd boss were killed. Maybe this would finally remove the cheating. At the moment you could run some dungeons and avoid all trash mobs until you are at first boss and so forth.
It really is no fun lately, hardly any dungeon without someone speedrunning or glitching it (and how creative some people are in finding glitches is just amazing). I really wonder why people want to gear up when all they do is avoid any fight in a dungeon anyway.
Even worse that even in pugs people only want to glitch the dungeon nowadays. If people want to speedrun or shortcut a dungeon please make a premade and don't join pugs. Lately I really only laugh when people advertise dungeon parties in LFG chat with "xped only". "xped" is just another word for "know all the glitches, bring a lot of kits and don't remove your finger from the 'w' key").
Our group manages to push 3 Spiders into a DD event, all legit kills. 2 CWs around 12K GS but without good enchants (I still don't have any weapon ench. for example), 15K GF, TR. CW setup: EF on Tab, Icy Terrain, Steal Time, Ice Storm daily. Everybody hugs the boss, and unloads on boss like crazy. CWs Ice Storm the adds away, and CC them with Steal Time/Icy Terrain constantly. It's basically zerging the boss through and ignoring the heals. And we're just guys from /lfg, so I'm sure other teams with voicechat and better gear do much better.
All in all, killing the final Spider boss legit might take less time than glitching it. Sadly, I'd say you need at least moderately decent gear and experience with your class, as the boss seems unrealistic for pugs and /queue groups (which should be able to kill the boss with 8300 GS, but that won't happen...).
The BoE (not even account wide) is why this behavior emerges... If you prevent players from making any AD, they will milk exploits to get that loot the quickest way possible. In this case, running to bosses and bypassing all adds that drop only <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>...
If they'd revert to BoP (or at least make it a % roll some of the time) this would get better... Also, that Need/Greed is a failure too now that chest stuff if BoP.
So when the entire group agrees to a greed run then whomever the drop is for wait until the last roll is made and then rolls Need, the party lead is still able to boot his *** (quite justifiably) so the rest of the party can share the loot as agreed upon before the run even started.
And you're argument goes out the window as you claim that your way is the right way, and any other way is bad. You want to force everyone to think exactly like you do just as you are claiming the person you quoted is doing. I personally am a casual player and I am so glad there are ways around an hour long (or more with lower geared group) dungeon run, that is one of the big things keeping me very interested in this game.
it took me ~15 runs of the 4 T2 dungeons to get my full T2 on my DC, all but 2 of which were pugged (lfg chat) So if I would have been forced to do things "THE RIGHT WAY" (ie your way) it would have taken me between 15-20 hours at the least. I was lucky to get it that fast, I am now working on a new set for my GF as well, and may even go back and get shadow weaver for my CW too. If I had to grind 20+ hours for each set of gear I probably wouldn't even bother.
So thank you cryptic for letting me get what I need quicker! The PvP is why I play end game anyway so if I didn't have to run these dungeons for my gear I wouldn't. PvE is just the same exact fights over and over with no challenge or evolving AI, which I why I don't understand the "we should have to kill every single trash mob every single run!!!" argument, it's the same exact **** thing every time, are you really there for anything other than loot?
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
What you call failboating, most people call playing the game. What you call "not knowing how to run" most people call "not entertained by exploiting". If not exploiting ruins it for them, then they arent even playing the game in the first place, and if exploiting is the only way to have fun, then it is the exploiters, and not the people who want to play the game as intended, who need to take your advice and quit.
In other games you would need to spend 20 hours (ingame time) to be lucky to get ONE item that you might need, most of the time even longer. Best gear drops on raid encounters only, now guess how long it might take when you run this with 12 people or more with a 1% drop rate or lower on a mob that has a lockout timer of 3-7 days.
20 hours to have a full set of armor is nothing! Compare that to the hours you need to spend to level ONE profession to 20 or compare it to the ingame time you need to grind for and build a rank 9 enchantment. The actual playing (doing the dungeon) is the shortest time in the whole calculation and if you find that boring already I really wonder why you "play" this game.
Lol which is why I don't play other games and do play this one.
professions can be leveled up easily without any effort, I just switched out my professions at work via the gateway, there is no "grind" aspect to professions in this game.
I have found it quite easy to get R8's and I will stick with those thanks, you can pay 16x more for 80 stat points if you wish but I'm good.
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
In months I have never seen any pug group or LFG group agree to a "greed" run upfront. This is just a lousy excuse to behave like a greedy child.
However yesterday I did join a LFG group that actually stated upfront that it was a non exploit run. Guildies laughed and said we'd never finish especially since no one was more than 10K (this was SP). 90 minutes later we had the satisfaction of completing SP with no exploits with 2 groupies that had no SP experience at all. We took our time on each boss and only had one wipe between the three. Have to say it was the most rewarding dungeon experience to date.
I like the cut of your jib.
Ancient Shadows: Mature. Sensible. Custard.
Recruitment info at: http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?462591-Ancient-Shadows-Become-a-Lion-Tamer-without-learning-Chartered-Accountancy-first!&highlight=ancient+shadows
Embers of the Phoenix is a fun guild that enjoys running dungeons without glitching. If you are on Dragon shard, you know how to communicate, and how to both teach and learn, look us up.
Sci-fi author: The Gods We Make, The Gods We Seek, and Ji-min
I suggest you find some guild or friends that would cater to your needs but dont drag the rest of the community on your whim.
Letting these things persist actually lets them grow and become entrenched.
Pay now or pay later, lots more later.
BS. Speed running/stealthing to the next campfire is fine. Using unintentional cracks in the architecture (e.g. running under the bridge in Fardelver's which is now fixed) is an exploit for which people should be first warned then banned for using.
i never mention exploit run, i said legal speed run and shortcut, if you havent notice exploit are being patch, but not the shortcut. LOL.
So to you out there, it is there to stay and it is legal, if it is exploit it will be patch, if it is not patch it is LEGAL.