The AD from Caturday was from negative bids or something like that, that was blatantly obvious that is was unintended, and those that did it knew they were exploiting and should have expected to have it taken away. Not that they removed even close to all of it IMO but that's a different story.
No one knew that the chance was so high until someone told them, so the people opening those boxes had every intention of doing so without having any clue about increased % drop chance. They opened the boxes and much to their surprise got super lucky and found multiple nightmares. There is a big difference between blatantly exploiting something that is obviously broken, and opening a couple lockboxes legitimately only to find "holy <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> I won 3 horses from those 10 boxes!!!"
As I said I didn't benefit from this at all, but I wouldn't tell someone that had no clue about any higher % chance drop rate that he is a cheating exploiting jerk b/c he won a couple nightmares. How is cryptic going to differentiate between the first 100 boxes opened that had no clue whatsoever and then any of their friends that they told "Hey maybe you should open some boxes, I got like 3 nightmares guys..."
Let us see it this way: there is a new expansion just out you log in and what do you do? See what is new? Pray to get some AD? Do some quest? No the first thing you do is open a lockbox. Okay. Surprise a nightmare Mount. Do you rush to try out your new mount? No you open another box. Another Mount. You are incredibly lucky. Do you decide to try out one Mount and later to sell the other ? No you open another box. Another Mount. At this point the more "differently intelligent" person in the world would have understood that something is wrong...
And that was not done by only one player...
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sarranspMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Lol people actually thought that the high % in preview shard was going to be EXACTLY the same on live servers? Come on... apparently that is what actually happened, but no one would bank on cryptic "forgetting" to make such a huge change.
Based off some on the problems people run into whilst reporting bugs, yes I think it's reasonable to think it was expected. While we can't expect the developers to be able to handle every bug instantly it seems that many bugs are overlooked.
Did it ever occur to people that they turned the rate up for a purpose with testing on the Preview and just forgot to turn it back down when it went to Live.
Unlikely , and even if that was the case it was reported on the test shards bug forum 6 days before it went live , there's no excuse for it ever making it through to live if that was the case , plus the bug itself isn't really the issue , it is the way that Cryptic decided to handle the aftermath that angers most people here .
Players took advantage of a known bug , that is also known as exploiting the bug ( granted a few just got lucky because they had no knowledge of the bug ) however it's quite obvious that many many players knew about the bug , exploited it and all that happened was that they got called 'lucky' by cryptic and patted on the back .
Cryptic have set themselves up for a crapload of problems in the aftermath of future exploits because they have now set a precedence for how they will be expected to deal with future exploits by letting this happen.
Ok from what I've heard the market is flooded and nightmares are worth very little right? So in the end the people who bought all the boxes made very little AD as the mounts sell for so little now. So they didn't gain some huge advantage right? So this isn't even an issue, and if you want a nightmare awesome news for you! You can find one cheap on AH lol =P
Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
Ok from what I've heard the market is flooded and nightmares are worth very little right? So in the end the people who bought all the boxes made very little AD as the mounts sell for so little now. So they didn't gain some huge advantage right? So this isn't even an issue, and if you want a nightmare awesome news for you! You can find one cheap on AH lol =P
But the market is not flooded. The nightmares mounts will be sold few at time so the price of them will not fall
Yeah, because nothing ever ends up going directly from the test server to live without any QA....yeah.
As far as people not realizing it was a bug, sure it would be bad to lump them in with the exploiters. But the solution for both is the same:
Remove all drops gotten from nightmare lockboxes during the short period of time. God help Cryptic if they don't even have timestamps on their items.
Reverse any trades or auctions of said items.
Reverse all item consumption, particularly keys and lockboxes.
Tada, everyone who didn't exploit gets another legitimate shot at a mount. Anyone who benefited from the bug loses said benefit, but regains any costs. Anyone who intentionally set out to exploit potentially gets a little boned, but that is as it should be. It won't even cost Cryptic any sales.
Why is this so hard?
Don't Panic.
Okay, Panic.
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ranncoreMember, Moderators, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 2,508
But the market is not flooded. The nightmares mounts will be sold few at time so the price of them will not fall
Moreover, the real winners here aren't the people playing the game and selling these items in game, but the spammers who flood zone chat who are now advertising cheap Nightmares.
Sigh a Few words...Get over it **** happens. The game is new and I am sure most of you *****ing can afford them in the AH. The prices of the things are going down very dramatically. Just buy one and be happy if you want it that badly. There will be plenty of other shiny things for you to get. I don't like exploits either but it was obvious most people did not know. Those who did weren't likely even thinking it was an exploit they probably went oh maybe the box just has a high roll chance hurrah. I should get another one to try and sell it. And so that's what it turned into. I wish I had gotten one to but oh well. There will be plenty of other mounts to chose from in the future.
0
tripsofthrymrMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,624Community Moderator
Did it ever occur to people that they turned the rate up for a purpose with testing on the Preview and just forgot to turn it back down when it went to Live.
That is entirely possible, but irrelevant.
People were prepared for the launch in case the behavior was still there on the live server. Whether the rate was intentionally high on preview or not is beside the point.
No it's both and insulting one's intelligence does not mean you are more brilliant then anyone else. I am fully aware of why they are upset and what cryptic chose to do. Again I say the game is new get over it. If this were happening a couple months at a time for a full year then you have every right to complain and I would probably quit as well. But from what I have been reading most of the time the issue was handled. Maybe because this was only for 1 week, it could have been a test on roll %'s like someone mentioned before, so they just let people have them. It's not like it went on for a month. So good day to you I am done.
You, sir, miss the point entirely. It's about making a stand against exploits (no matter what that means) instead of cheering them on.
And if there wasn't a message spammed to the ENTIRE game telling them one someone got 5 mounts in a row, you might actually have a point. But within only a couple of minutes no one was clueless.
Sigh a Few words...Get over it **** happens. The game is new and I am sure most of you *****ing can afford them in the AH. The prices of the things are going down very dramatically. Just buy one and be happy if you want it that badly. There will be plenty of other shiny things for you to get. I don't like exploits either but it was obvious most people did not know. Those who did weren't likely even thinking it was an exploit they probably went oh maybe the box just has a high roll chance hurrah. I should get another one to try and sell it. And so that's what it turned into. I wish I had gotten one to but oh well. There will be plenty of other mounts to chose from in the future.
No it's both and insulting one's intelligence does not mean you are more brilliant then anyone else. I am fully aware of why they are upset and what cryptic chose to do. Again I say the game is new get over it. If this were happening a couple months at a time for a full year then you have every right to complain and I would probably quit as well. But from what I have been reading most of the time the issue was handled. Maybe because this was only for 1 week, it could have been a test on roll %'s like someone mentioned before, so they just let people have them. It's not like it went on for a month. So good day to you I am done.
So how long do we give a game after it is out of BETA to stop getting free passes then? And how many free passes does one game get?
Point of importance IS that the game is NEW. It is NOW that they have to take a responsible and respectful stance on cheating, exploits, or rule enforcement now, not later when its been around for years. We don't care if they let them keep them, but we DO care if they also get cheers and thumbs up for doing something they WEREN'T allowed to do, even if they didn't know.
No it's both and insulting one's intelligence does not mean you are more brilliant then anyone else. I am fully aware of why they are upset and what cryptic chose to do. Again I say the game is new get over it. If this were happening a couple months at a time for a full year then you have every right to complain and I would probably quit as well. But from what I have been reading most of the time the issue was handled. Maybe because this was only for 1 week, it could have been a test on roll %'s like someone mentioned before, so they just let people have them. It's not like it went on for a month. So good day to you I am done.
You, sir, miss the point entirely. It's about making a stand against exploits (no matter what that means) instead of cheering them on.
Probably he was "lucky" himself, so he approves of the Cryptic's way to handle this situation. There's not a lot to discuss or argue about here, really, Cryptic's representatives announced in public that exploits are the way to go, so supporting this decision shows exactly which side one picked.
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sarranspMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Sigh a Few words...Get over it **** happens. The game is new and I am sure most of you *****ing can afford them in the AH. The prices of the things are going down very dramatically. Just buy one and be happy if you want it that badly. There will be plenty of other shiny things for you to get. I don't like exploits either but it was obvious most people did not know. Those who did weren't likely even thinking it was an exploit they probably went oh maybe the box just has a high roll chance hurrah. I should get another one to try and sell it. And so that's what it turned into. I wish I had gotten one to but oh well. There will be plenty of other mounts to chose from in the future.
Good lord, it's like words go into one of your ears and straight out the other. It has been said many times the mounts are not the problem. Seriously let me reiterate it for you, the mounts are NOT the ISSUE. It's about the developers not dealing with an exploitation and patting the exploiters on the back by calling them "lucky". You've completely missed it, the mounts mean nothing, the exploitation of a bug is the issue and how it was handled.
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kantazo1Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Good lord, it's like words go into one of your ears and straight out the other. It has been said many times the mounts are not the problem. Seriously let me reiterate it for you, the mounts are NOT the ISSUE. It's about the developers not dealing with an exploitation and patting the exploiters on the back by calling them "lucky". You've completely missed it, the mounts mean nothing, the exploitation of a bug is the issue and how it was handled.
Indeed, since this mess my desire to play this game has gone down to the trash, I have lost the respect for a company that endorses cheating and abuse of exploits.
It's not the devs, but the person in charge of communication strategy at Cryptic, that could do something to address the concerns being voiced here.
The devs (software developers) made a mistake. That happens. The issue most seem to have is that the communication on the issue seemed to explicitly approve of people exploiting the game.
slayorianMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited August 2013
All it would have taken to avoid this whole mess in a 20 minute roll back. Seriously, such a no-brainer. Too late now, though. The damage has been done. Prices are going up and up and up due to AD shifting into the hands of mount exploiters. Now they can buy up all the vorpals and other end game desirables they want.
Considering it wasn't an exploit just a mistake as the servers were brought back down shortly after. If this had been gone on for hours after the servers came up then you would have a right to complain. But that isn't the case here. So grow up and get over it.
Considering it wasn't an exploit just a mistake as the servers were brought back down shortly after. If this had been gone on for hours after the servers came up then you would have a right to complain. But that isn't the case here. So grow up and get over it.
funny, you claim it isn't a exploit, when ppl had 6 days prior knowledge about it and stocked up and prepared for it, and even i who was clueless about it, with in the first 5 mins of FOF being live, the VERY FIRST thing any one said to me when i logged on was "get boxs, buy keys" and by this point i didn't even need to ask them why as the server spam was going nut's over the amount it was throwing out there.
seriously, the 6 days prior knowing about it, is the icy on the cake here, no excuses what so ever to justifie them selfs not fixing it before it went live.
Considering it wasn't an exploit just a mistake as the servers were brought back down shortly after. If this had been gone on for hours after the servers came up then you would have a right to complain. But that isn't the case here. So grow up and get over it.
Considering it wasn't an exploit just a mistake as the servers were brought back down shortly after. If this had been gone on for hours after the servers came up then you would have a right to complain. But that isn't the case here. So grow up and get over it.
Considering it wasn't an exploit just a mistake as the servers were brought back down shortly after. If this had been gone on for hours after the servers came up then you would have a right to complain. But that isn't the case here. So grow up and get over it.
The players took unfair advantage over an unintended malfunction in code to gain an item in game. In video game vernacular, that's called "cheating" or "exploiting." The way I described it there is almost IDENTICAL to the way it's described in the Terms of Service.
10. User Conduct
You must observe these Terms, all Rules of Conduct, all applicable laws and all basic rules of etiquette and common courtesy when using the Website and the Service. Any conduct that violates the law in an offline, real world community is also a violation of these terms. PWE will not tolerate any illegal or offensive conduct.
Without limiting the foregoing, in addition to the User Content rules set forth in Section 10 above, you agree not to take any of the following actions:
(k) Cheat or utilize unauthorized exploits in connection with the Games or the Service;
(l) Using or exploiting any bugs, errors, or design flaws to obtain unauthorized access to the Service or to gain an unfair advantage over other players
Not condemning players for using an exploit that gives you a serious advantage in obtaining a (dozen or hundred) million AD item(s) is seriously detrimental to fostering a community of integrity.
When I first started playing I was seriously impressed that Cryptic had enough integrity to ban exploiters. It was quite refreshing, knowing that if I, as a player, took the time to contribute to a healthy game by NOT using exploits and reporting them, that Cryptic would make a better game. I guess those days are over. The messages I took from this fiasco are A.) Don't bother reporting exploits, they are intended to be used B.) Don't spend any money on this game, everything you want can be obtained by exploiting and C.) Cryptic doesn't care about this game as much as their paying players do.
This game went from my primary source of entertainment to just another time waster within a matter of hours. I went from "dedicated player" to "time waster waiting for the next game."
The players took unfair advantage over an unintended malfunction in code to gain an item in game. In video game vernacular, that's called "cheating" or "exploiting." The way I described it there is almost IDENTICAL to the way it's described in the Terms of Service.
10. User Conduct
You must observe these Terms, all Rules of Conduct, all applicable laws and all basic rules of etiquette and common courtesy when using the Website and the Service. Any conduct that violates the law in an offline, real world community is also a violation of these terms. PWE will not tolerate any illegal or offensive conduct.
Without limiting the foregoing, in addition to the User Content rules set forth in Section 10 above, you agree not to take any of the following actions:
(k) Cheat or utilize unauthorized exploits in connection with the Games or the Service;
(l) Using or exploiting any bugs, errors, or design flaws to obtain unauthorized access to the Service or to gain an unfair advantage over other players
As this thread has been pruned multiple times for off-topic and inflammatory commentary, and it would seem that no further purpose can be served for this thread other than to continue to be open as troll/flame bait (whether towards PWE or individual posters), we have no choice remaining but to close this thread.
If staff has any further commentary they will add it in a future thread but, unfortunately, this thread has outlived its usefulness. Sorry.
ROLL TIDE ROLL
Great Weapon Fighter: Because when is today not a good day to die?
PC and PS4 player. Proud Guildmaster for PS4 Team Fencebane. Rank 5 Officer for PC Team Fencebane. Visit us at http://fencebane.shivtr.com
Comments
That's true I haven't, well congrats to those that know cryptic, let me in on the secret next time hehe
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
And that was not done by only one player...
Based off some on the problems people run into whilst reporting bugs, yes I think it's reasonable to think it was expected. While we can't expect the developers to be able to handle every bug instantly it seems that many bugs are overlooked.
Players took advantage of a known bug , that is also known as exploiting the bug ( granted a few just got lucky because they had no knowledge of the bug ) however it's quite obvious that many many players knew about the bug , exploited it and all that happened was that they got called 'lucky' by cryptic and patted on the back .
Cryptic have set themselves up for a crapload of problems in the aftermath of future exploits because they have now set a precedence for how they will be expected to deal with future exploits by letting this happen.
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
But the market is not flooded. The nightmares mounts will be sold few at time so the price of them will not fall
As far as people not realizing it was a bug, sure it would be bad to lump them in with the exploiters. But the solution for both is the same:
Tada, everyone who didn't exploit gets another legitimate shot at a mount. Anyone who benefited from the bug loses said benefit, but regains any costs. Anyone who intentionally set out to exploit potentially gets a little boned, but that is as it should be. It won't even cost Cryptic any sales.
Why is this so hard?
Okay, Panic.
Moreover, the real winners here aren't the people playing the game and selling these items in game, but the spammers who flood zone chat who are now advertising cheap Nightmares.
That is entirely possible, but irrelevant.
People were prepared for the launch in case the behavior was still there on the live server. Whether the rate was intentionally high on preview or not is beside the point.
Sci-fi author: The Gods We Make, The Gods We Seek, and Ji-min
And if there wasn't a message spammed to the ENTIRE game telling them one someone got 5 mounts in a row, you might actually have a point. But within only a couple of minutes no one was clueless.
So how long do we give a game after it is out of BETA to stop getting free passes then? And how many free passes does one game get?
Probably he was "lucky" himself, so he approves of the Cryptic's way to handle this situation. There's not a lot to discuss or argue about here, really, Cryptic's representatives announced in public that exploits are the way to go, so supporting this decision shows exactly which side one picked.
Good lord, it's like words go into one of your ears and straight out the other. It has been said many times the mounts are not the problem. Seriously let me reiterate it for you, the mounts are NOT the ISSUE. It's about the developers not dealing with an exploitation and patting the exploiters on the back by calling them "lucky". You've completely missed it, the mounts mean nothing, the exploitation of a bug is the issue and how it was handled.
Indeed, since this mess my desire to play this game has gone down to the trash, I have lost the respect for a company that endorses cheating and abuse of exploits.
It's not the devs, but the person in charge of communication strategy at Cryptic, that could do something to address the concerns being voiced here.
The devs (software developers) made a mistake. That happens. The issue most seem to have is that the communication on the issue seemed to explicitly approve of people exploiting the game.
Sci-fi author: The Gods We Make, The Gods We Seek, and Ji-min
funny, you claim it isn't a exploit, when ppl had 6 days prior knowledge about it and stocked up and prepared for it, and even i who was clueless about it, with in the first 5 mins of FOF being live, the VERY FIRST thing any one said to me when i logged on was "get boxs, buy keys" and by this point i didn't even need to ask them why as the server spam was going nut's over the amount it was throwing out there.
seriously, the 6 days prior knowing about it, is the icy on the cake here, no excuses what so ever to justifie them selfs not fixing it before it went live.
You must be lucky.
It wasn't an exploit dude, they were just lucky.
The players took unfair advantage over an unintended malfunction in code to gain an item in game. In video game vernacular, that's called "cheating" or "exploiting." The way I described it there is almost IDENTICAL to the way it's described in the Terms of Service.
10. User Conduct
You must observe these Terms, all Rules of Conduct, all applicable laws and all basic rules of etiquette and common courtesy when using the Website and the Service. Any conduct that violates the law in an offline, real world community is also a violation of these terms. PWE will not tolerate any illegal or offensive conduct.
Without limiting the foregoing, in addition to the User Content rules set forth in Section 10 above, you agree not to take any of the following actions:
(k) Cheat or utilize unauthorized exploits in connection with the Games or the Service;
(l) Using or exploiting any bugs, errors, or design flaws to obtain unauthorized access to the Service or to gain an unfair advantage over other players
Not condemning players for using an exploit that gives you a serious advantage in obtaining a (dozen or hundred) million AD item(s) is seriously detrimental to fostering a community of integrity.
When I first started playing I was seriously impressed that Cryptic had enough integrity to ban exploiters. It was quite refreshing, knowing that if I, as a player, took the time to contribute to a healthy game by NOT using exploits and reporting them, that Cryptic would make a better game. I guess those days are over. The messages I took from this fiasco are A.) Don't bother reporting exploits, they are intended to be used B.) Don't spend any money on this game, everything you want can be obtained by exploiting and C.) Cryptic doesn't care about this game as much as their paying players do.
This game went from my primary source of entertainment to just another time waster within a matter of hours. I went from "dedicated player" to "time waster waiting for the next game."
But the devs said they were just lucky.
If staff has any further commentary they will add it in a future thread but, unfortunately, this thread has outlived its usefulness. Sorry.
Great Weapon Fighter: Because when is today not a good day to die?
PC and PS4 player. Proud Guildmaster for PS4 Team Fencebane. Rank 5 Officer for PC Team Fencebane. Visit us at http://fencebane.shivtr.com