hi im making a new TR with your build i just started today and just wonder is your build still usefull after nerf ? and can we use all at wills power in stealth ? i mean they cant see me when i attacking they in pvp ? And sorry for my bad english
Hello and thank you for your interest in playing the build. Yes, this TR build is mainly untouched by the recent patch. If anything, we just became more powerful because of the buff to Gloaming Cut. It's a useful skill now that it deals extra damage. It's slow, but a well-placed Gloaming Cut will net high rewards for players who use it without putting themselves at risk much. If you're fine with getting abusive messages from opponents, or threats that you'll get reported for being a hacker who exploits stealth, the build is definitely up to working standards in PVP. As for your question, the answer is yes and no. When you're in stealth, you hide your presence in plain sight and enemies will not be able to see you. But when you get close enough your targets will be able to see your silhouette and are able to attack and CC you. This is why I like having Impossible to Catch slotted while I attack. Using this build in PVP requires a careful play style. This is the main reason why Cloud of Steel, our ranged at-will got severely nerfed.
Was just coming to ask the same thing.. I have a halfling rogue who's a damage heavy rogue, but with the release of the drow I decided to roll a new one and try your build. Has the nerf affected it much?
Hello, melanie2781. The build is still up to working standards and its core elements have been mainly untouched by the recent patch. The drow is definitely a good race to use with this build in terms of offensive play. But halflings are also just as useful thanks to their 10% resistance to control effects and the +3% to deflect.
Hello, like week ago I starded playing Neverwinter, I'm rolling a rogue, now I'm close to hit the 60 and leveled using your build and I want to ask few questions about the end-game gameplay. How do this build work in 5-man pve groups? Or maybe it's made for doing those dungeons solo? (But God, it must take ages!) Why am I asking about that - using Gloaming Cut to get killing blow may be just hard with some CW or GWF in party. While fighting bosses I feel alright, I feel just useless when we are killing trash mobs. And the last question. I have some friends playing, so I would do many dungeons in party - will this build be viable then or would you recommend more dps based build? I mean, I find stealth build fun to play but I want to do my role: deal some right damage.
Hello, like week ago I starded playing Neverwinter, I'm rolling a rogue, now I'm close to hit the 60 and leveled using your build and I want to ask few questions about the end-game gameplay. How do this build work in 5-man pve groups? Or maybe it's made for doing those dungeons solo? (But God, it must take ages!) Why am I asking about that - using Gloaming Cut to get killing blow may be just hard with some CW or GWF in party. While fighting bosses I feel alright, I feel just useless when we are killing trash mobs. And the last question. I have some friends playing, so I would do many dungeons in party - will this build be viable then or would you recommend more dps based build? I mean, I find stealth build fun to play but I want to do my role: deal some right damage.
Hi, Kapitanfak. Welcome to the thread and I'm glad to hear that you're having fun using this build. To answer your questions, this build can be flexible and its roles can be changed for stealth jobs or DPS jobs based on what armor set you have. It'll cost you, but it's always good to have an alternative armor set so you can switch roles whenever needed. For instance, changing your armor set to a Swash set will give you a more DPS feel to your play style as you will not have the 25% increased stealth from Skulkers, but instead will be replaced with a near constant 1k+ Recovery/Power which is a good boost in DPS. By changing your encounters to better suit DPS, you will be able to do the job of a cookie-cutter Executioner since this build is also using most of the feats DPS executioners have, only we have heroic feats specced towards stealth. However for the Executioner Feats Tree, you'll find that the only difference we have for feats would be that most Executioners will have Deadly Momentum slotted as well, where as we do not have the extra feat points for that. It's not much of a loss though since we tend to be flexible simply by changing armor sets.
This is mainly used as a solo build for people who aren't too keen on grouping up with people whom they do not know, and excels especially well in the new Campaign area. For 5-man PVE groups, it's best if you switch powers around to better suit your party's needs. While you won't be doing much DPS against trash mobs without a Swash, what you can do is provide your party with other valuable forms of support such as utility CC skills like Smoke Bomb. Smoke Bomb is really good for controlling trash mobs. Another good skill is Dazing Strike, which provides damage and a bit of a CC cone. Lastly, you can never go wrong with Lashing Blade. But when up against bosses, you'll want to equip the usual. Bait and Switch, Shadow Strike, ITC. Our damage goes higher the more we are in stealth. Not to mention Bait and Switch gives us access to Lurker's Assault much faster. It's possible to have this up in every rotation thanks to BaS against bosses that likes to spam melee range AoE's.
You can try to read guides that focus more on high DPS like Luna's or Metzli's. Both are equally good PVE guides that any TR player should read!
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ufoalienMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 30Arc User
edited August 2013
Hi man, awesome build thanks...
3 things please:
I alrdy have 3k crit and 2k armpen and 2.5k power with skulker set without enchanting the gear yet but i have stone... Could you advise the soft caps on armpen and crit and what to focus on next, what about power... by soft cap i mean where diminishing returns kick in...
I rolled a human when i wanted to do the intellect build (which i didn't like) and my stats are 21 dex 21 str 15 cha... should i respec for it to work properly?
What about armor and weapons enchants.... whats best?
If any of my questions has an answer in your post let me know to look over again... Thanks
Also where can i find a cookie cutter build for pve dps? Thanks a lot
Inspired by this thread I used my free respec to get Gloaming Cut, which I had deemed useless before and I must say I'm disappointed. The extra time I get in Stealth for killing an enemy with it is about as much as the animation for Gloaming Cut takes, 2 seconds at best, usually not enough to kill even the weaker next monster. It seems pointless.
I alrdy have 3k crit and 2k armpen and 2.5k power with skulker set without enchanting the gear yet but i have stone... Could you advise the soft caps on armpen and crit and what to focus on next, what about power... by soft cap i mean where diminishing returns kick in...
I rolled a human when i wanted to do the intellect build (which i didn't like) and my stats are 21 dex 21 str 15 cha... should i respec for it to work properly?
What about armor and weapons enchants.... whats best?
If any of my questions has an answer in your post let me know to look over again... Thanks
Also where can i find a cookie cutter build for pve dps? Thanks a lot
Hello, ufoalien. I must say you got some solid raw stats without unenchanted gear. Here are a couple of things I can advise you with regarding the soft caps. I'm not an expert in these sort of things because I'm no min/max-er, but from my limited knowledge about this topic, the following soft caps are as follows.
Crit: 50%. Once you reach this percentage, it's best to start stacking more power.
ArPen: 24%. Mobs have an average damage mitigation of this amount. 24% almost completely nullifies their defenses.
Power: Power has no diminishing returns. I'm not sure about the power:damage ratio, however. But this is your go-to stat once you max out crit and arpen. You may also opt to go for Recovery. The RSI you can get from recovery are as follows.
If you rolled a human with 14 INT, then you can definitely use the new alternative stealth-build I'll be releasing after some more testing. I rolled a wood elf for it though to gain 20 STR, 20 DEX, 20 INT. It has a better room for error in PVE settings and only needs Shadow Strike in order to maintain permastealth, making room for other utility skills in place of BaS. But BaS works just as well for this build.
For armor enchantments, Soulforged is by far the best for us. 3 seconds (or more) of immunity does a lot for survival. Weapon enchants, hands down, it has to be Vorpal. Any DPS-based build in general will be able to benefit from Vorpal's ability to further increase the damage of our critical strikes. And as a class that concentrates on getting as much critical strikes as possible, Vorpal definitely has a solid place for any and all TR builds. But this build is pretty flexible. If you feel like running other weapon enchantments it would also be okay. I for one like using Plague Fire as it is able to reduce the defenses of our opponents below 0%. It's something the whole party will be able to benefit from.
If you're interested in reading more about the cookie cutter DPS builds, I highly recommend you read Metzli's and Luna's guides which are in this archived master list of builds.
You'll see them under the TR section. I hope this somehow helped! And if you've got any other questions please feel free to lay them down in another post!
Inspired by this thread I used my free respec to get Gloaming Cut, which I had deemed useless before and I must say I'm disappointed. The extra time I get in Stealth for killing an enemy with it is about as much as the animation for Gloaming Cut takes, 2 seconds at best, usually not enough to kill even the weaker next monster. It seems pointless.
I'm sorry to hear that it's not working out for you. Getting Gloaming Cut to working conditions is heavily reliant on Sneaky Stabber, Improved Cunning Sneak and Battlefield Skulker's set effects. It's also impossible to maintain maximized stealth with just Gloaming Cut alone, which is why I like to have Shadow Strike and Bait and Switch slotted in order to get other sources of stealth refills. If by any chance you had all those feats, encounters and gear, then something else must be wrong.
But anyway, I'll be posting videos up very soon. I haven't found the time for it recently but tomorrow will be a holiday for me, and I'll be using some of my time tomorrow in recording vids of rotations and strategies using this build and it might also include a video of me running Gnarlroot Caves solo using this build if I have enough time. I know it's not too much of a feat to solo that minor dungeon but it should serve as a good example as to how this build works.
I rolled a wood elf for it though to gain 20 STR, 20 DEX, 20 INT. It has a better room for error in PVE settings and only needs Shadow Strike in order to maintain permastealth, making room for other utility skills in place of BaS. But BaS works just as well for this build.
I read through this lengthy (and awesome) thread and plan on doing a build of it and come to the end to find out it looks like you might have something even better on the way. Can you give any tips/hints as to how the build starts out for anyone who would like to get one going?
If you rolled a human with 14 INT, then you can definitely use the new alternative stealth-build I'll be releasing after some more testing. I rolled a wood elf for it though to gain 20 STR, 20 DEX, 20 INT. It has a better room for error in PVE settings and only needs Shadow Strike in order to maintain permastealth, making room for other utility skills in place of BaS. But BaS works just as well for this build.
I really want to see this new build too! "It has a better room for error in PVE settings" sounds wonderful! I'm the first to admit I'm not the best player, so this type of build sounds great!
As Marc5iver said above me, any hints/tips to get one started? Such as starting stat rolls?
One last request, when you can, can you post the new build in a new thread of its own? This one is getting a bit long and I'm worried the new build might get buried or lost in it.
The TR is the most fun class I've played I'm really looking forward to trying your new build!
Inspired by this thread I used my free respec to get Gloaming Cut, which I had deemed useless before and I must say I'm disappointed. The extra time I get in Stealth for killing an enemy with it is about as much as the animation for Gloaming Cut takes, 2 seconds at best, usually not enough to kill even the weaker next monster. It seems pointless.
with the buff its actually quite easy to perma with lower health mobs with just gloaming cut, the ones u can one-two shot. its a slow farming skill but enhances stealth duration a ton. But u need to know how to use it.
couple tips:
stealth up and engage mobs from weakest to strongest so u get the most stealth duration.
if some mobs need 2 hits, start with the first flurry atack which has a fast animation and then gloaming, as u want to execute with gloaming for the stealth and bonus dmg.
u dont need to constantly be using gloaming as u just really need to land a couple death blows with it to extend stealth a few secs in between shadowstrike and bait n switch cds for the rotation.
with invisible infiltrator, ur dailies can be ur oh **** button to refill ur stealth
this build really makes pve pretty easy to solo as long as u dont screw up the rotations, and im even thinking of respecing out the stealth on dodge for more dmg as the gloaming cut buff is pretty big.
Inspired by this thread I used my free respec to get Gloaming Cut, which I had deemed useless before and I must say I'm disappointed. The extra time I get in Stealth for killing an enemy with it is about as much as the animation for Gloaming Cut takes, 2 seconds at best, usually not enough to kill even the weaker next monster. It seems pointless.
Have you also fully feated Sneaky Stabber? It makes GC much more effective. When solidly geared, GC shreds enemies. My TR can one-shot Witherers and Powries, and 2-4 shot Thorns and Giantsouls.
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
hey i just started today with a TR and i will use your build but i think i cant use gloaming cut and i gonna change sneaky stabber to deadly momentum and i gonna use duelist flurry. Like this will be good too with your build ?
hey i just started today with a TR and i will use your build but i think i cant use gloaming cut and i gonna change sneaky stabber to deadly momentum and i gonna use duelist flurry. Like this will be good too with your build ?
Don't need to swap anything out. The build doesn't shine till 39+ when you get Gloaming and the feat to recharge stealth per hit. I've used this build to level solo, and just finished Helms Hold at 39, minus the dungeon.
Gear is no where near optimal and a lot is almost 10 levels below me if not more.
with the buff its actually quite easy to perma with lower health mobs with just gloaming cut, the ones u can one-two shot. its a slow farming skill but enhances stealth duration a ton. But u need to know how to use it.
couple tips:
stealth up and engage mobs from weakest to strongest so u get the most stealth duration.
if some mobs need 2 hits, start with the first flurry atack which has a fast animation and then gloaming, as u want to execute with gloaming for the stealth and bonus dmg.
u dont need to constantly be using gloaming as u just really need to land a couple death blows with it to extend stealth a few secs in between shadowstrike and bait n switch cds for the rotation.
with invisible infiltrator, ur dailies can be ur oh **** button to refill ur stealth
this build really makes pve pretty easy to solo as long as u dont screw up the rotations, and im even thinking of respecing out the stealth on dodge for more dmg as the gloaming cut buff is pretty big.
Solid tips, Ximae. That's how I work out the order in which I kill mobs. We may be slow but we're sure to kill things even when the party is out cold. I also considered speccing out out Twilight Adept and Swift Footwork since we most usually have enough Stealth time from Gloaming Cut alone. But then I thought the room for error will be lower without those 2 feats. Still, if by any chance you manage to work it out, tell us about your experiences if it's possible! I'm curious to hear how effective this will be.
Have you also fully feated Sneaky Stabber? It makes GC much more effective. When solidly geared, GC shreds enemies. My TR can one-shot Witherers and Powries, and 2-4 shot Thorns and Giantsouls.
Have you tried the Quickling Den in the Dark Fey Enclave area? It's just so fun to smack the Quicklings and not lose any stealth thanks to their HP being inherently low. It's practically possible to not use any stealth refill skills until you reach the boss where you'd have to use Lurker's Assault to burst her down quick with DF.
hey i just started today with a TR and i will use your build but i think i cant use gloaming cut and i gonna change sneaky stabber to deadly momentum and i gonna use duelist flurry. Like this will be good too with your build ?
Hello, Kisssslive. I'll have to say that Sneaky Stabber + Gloaming Cut is pretty much the defining feature of this build. Not taking it would probably net you results of what a cookie cutter executioner should be. But if you insist on forgoing Sneaky Stabber + GC, I recommend you get a Swashbuckling set, stack up on ArPen until you get 24%, stack up on crit until you get 50%, and finally Recovery. Cookie cutter executioners are solid and a well proven build, however it requires some high end enchants such as Greater Vorpal, R7+ Darks/Azures, in order to take to competitive levels. But they work real well. They however do not work anywhere near how Stealth-based executioners do. While we get increased stealth, cookie-cutter executioners have increased DPS and moderate stealth. I hope this somehow answered your question.
Don't need to swap anything out. The build doesn't shine till 39+ when you get Gloaming and the feat to recharge stealth per hit. I've used this build to level solo, and just finished Helms Hold at 39, minus the dungeon.
Gear is no where near optimal and a lot is almost 10 levels below me if not more.
BUT to each his/her own.
Very true, mkjns. Pre-45 (before getting Shadow Strike), it can be a struggle to use this build. I've had an easier time with my Oppressor CW with boss areas as compared to my experiences in leveling Stealth-Based Executioners. But once Sneaky Stabber + GC has been filled up with points, things get a whole lot easier. I hope the rest of your leveling goes smoothly.
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
edited August 2013
Hihi, my TR Silverjon is also on Mindflayer server. I actually started him down the super-stealth path without having read this build thread (and it's a lot to catch up on now). He was totally viable but still missing something.
I tried Gloaming Cut when I first had access to it, and - like many players - hated it because it seemed so slow and awkward of an attack. So I basically abandoned that skill while levelling. I progressed SJ very slowly due to trying to get all the skirmishes done while still not missing any invocation coins (which basically means very little questing except when comfortably between skirmishes), so I ended up hitting 60 and using his free respec right before the Feywild launch, even though I started playing him back in May. I opted to give GC another chance, and now I love it. That's my LMB attack, with Duelist's on RMB for use on anything that can't be one-hit killed by GC. It is entirely possible to never leave stealth as long as I don't screw up and don't run out of things to hit.
I am liking Twilight Adept not just in combat, but out of combat to refill faster between mobs when I have to let stealth run down. But it's also useful for top-ups when you need to dodge away from your B&S dummy because you've placed it to draw AoE and need to circle around behind a target before you can comfortably start attacking again.
I have never ever been in the Lair of the Mad Dragon before at all, but soloed it yesterday. I really am an explorer at heart, and my biggest problem with the 5-player dungeons is not getting to go poke around in all the corners and behind everything. And of course, I feel my general lack of knowledge of the non-epic dungeons makes even thinking about trying the epic versions a non-starter. I am very happy to have an opportunity to go check them out in relative safety, at my own pace.
I think Mad Dragon is probably also currently suffering from boss hitboxes being too big, as SJ seemed to be getting wing-buffeted when I think he should have been out of the path of it, based on the red areas (but I have no experience to which to compare yesterday's fight). So the fight might have taken more potions than otherwise, what with getting dazed and randomly thrown into acid pools and all. Still, zero deaths and it felt very heroic and everything. I found it interesting how the imp spawns actually helped, not just with the boss fight but through the entire dungeon, since they are ideal GC fodder. Better if at all possible to leave them alive until you need a stealth refill, then take out a few in quick succession. Likewise with the zealots and a few other monster types. I was trying to avoid using B&S except in emergencies or when I needed the rapid AP gain because the dummy would cause things to start throwing around fire, and even with Tenacious Concealment slotted, fire was bad.
Really fun build and it suits my style very well, so thanks to everyone who has put the work into it already and I'll try to contribute what I can.
Sort of a side question. If you solo a dungeon during the Dungeon Delve events, does it count towards a daily so you can get AD from Rinx?
Yes, of course.
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
edited August 2013
Completing the dungeon at any time will qualify for Rhix's daily. Even months later. I try to remember to check with him after every level-up on every character, even if I know I'm likely to outlevel them, because they can be turned in later. It might mean I'll only do a "daily" dungeon once, but diamonds is diamonds.
I am loving this build. I respec'd my TR recently to this build only changing Shocking Execution for Courage Breaker. I want to test out how well the debuff from that daily works on boss mobs. I may have opted for another feat instead of critical teamwork to spice things up also. My TR had been on the backburner while leveling my DC and waiting for the fallout from the balancing the devs were proposing so I have just taken him out for some wet work after module 1 dropped.
Running around Sharrandar with this build is a blast. The redcaps don't know what hit them before taking a dirt nap and they fill up the stealth bar nicely with GC. The larger mobs with more HP pose a challenge but not much of one. Using Duelist Fury while rotating Shadow Strike and B&S I can usually take them down in short order. If I see there are several mobs clustered together run into the middle and hit Whirlwind of Blades then go into stealth. This takes down the weaker mobs and gives me a modest power boost which helps with mowing down the biggers mobs quickly.
I also purchased the Battlefield Skulker's set off the AH and it didn't cost me as much as I thought it would. My DC's T2 miracle gear is more expensive. I've slotted a couple of dark enchantments in the utility slots because it's what I had handy. Coupled with Sneak Attack and Skillful Infiltrator when stealthed, my movement speed is amazing! I can reposition myself so quickly now I that using dodge is an afterthought.
In closing, this build is so much fun. I do plan on tweaking things as I continue to gain more experience playing my TR. I enjoy trying new things so I may change some feats here and there to see if I can get more bang for my buck. Thank you for putting up this build. i don't know if I would have discovered the joy of taking down a mob with GC without it
Have you tried the Quickling Den in the Dark Fey Enclave area? It's just so fun to smack the Quicklings and not lose any stealth thanks to their HP being inherently low. It's practically possible to not use any stealth refill skills until you reach the boss where you'd have to use Lurker's Assault to burst her down quick with DF.
Haven't unlocked it on my TR yet, but it was a lot of fun on my GF. Looking forward to unlocking it on my TR, DC, CW...
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
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kingculexMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited August 2013
I respecced my TR to the Crit/Stealth build I was testing on the preview shard and the results are good. I can easily one man run dungeons and still be in the top with kills in pvp. I switch to stealth for the dungeons like in shandar and switch to crit in pvp. Your build adjusted to work with my crit setup made my TR to be viable even after the nerfs. Thank you.
Every class has advantages and disadvantages. Learn the disadvantages of you class to overcome them. Learn the advantages of your class and the disadvatages of other classes to use them in pvp to win.
There is no point to whine for nerfs because you win some and loose some. Crying just makes a player look like a crier and no one, especially the devs, should take them seriously. Have a nice day!:)
Solid tips, Ximae. That's how I work out the order in which I kill mobs. We may be slow but we're sure to kill things even when the party is out cold. I also considered speccing out out Twilight Adept and Swift Footwork since we most usually have enough Stealth time from Gloaming Cut alone. But then I thought the room for error will be lower without those 2 feats. Still, if by any chance you manage to work it out, tell us about your experiences if it's possible! I'm curious to hear how effective this will be
well i actually built a bit differently than u, i already didnt take the stamina increase so im not getting as many dodge rolls as u. Im also not using sneak attack but invisible infiltrator which is a stealth fillup on daily use and with proper bns usage the dailies are up in a breeze, so that is basically my margin of error. I do like that little dodge stealth fillup as it gives me that little boost to end up filling the bar in certain situations, specially just in between combat. Id have to test without it and see if there is something else worth getting in that tier instead.
I also took deadly momentum instead of critical team work as i thought cc u can stack on gear but not severity, but its gona make me not be able to hit 50% crit chance, at 46% atm. but not too sure on this one as im having to stack a ton of crit chance that could be something else like more power or arp, i feel like i hit like a puzy in the t2 dungeons( still on scavenger and rank5s and no vopral though). I really need to figure out what will be giving me more damage 1000 power or 15% severity on stacks.
I respecced my TR to the Crit/Stealth build I was testing on the preview shard and the results are good. I can easily one man run dungeons and still be in the top with kills in pvp. I switch to stealth for the dungeons like in shandar and switch to crit in pvp. Your build adjusted to work with my crit setup made my TR to be viable even after the nerfs. Thank you.
im pretty interested in that, as i feel i need a bit more dps many times, how did u feat it up? guessing first 2 tiers of saboteur + executioner, but what feats.
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kingculexMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited August 2013
Xlimae,
The feats are basically the same that are in this build guide. My abilities choices were strength and dex. The only real difference is my gear which is the gear that gives bonus to crit and power. I use a mix of the master assassin set and the sinister shade set. That is 450 bonus to power and 450 bonus to crit. I also use the ancient daggers set to add another 450 bonus to crit. My enchantments are also setup to add to power/crit as well.
Every class has advantages and disadvantages. Learn the disadvantages of you class to overcome them. Learn the advantages of your class and the disadvatages of other classes to use them in pvp to win.
There is no point to whine for nerfs because you win some and loose some. Crying just makes a player look like a crier and no one, especially the devs, should take them seriously. Have a nice day!:)
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mithycaenMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 1Arc User
Hihi, my TR Silverjon is also on Mindflayer server. I actually started him down the super-stealth path without having read this build thread (and it's a lot to catch up on now). He was totally viable but still missing something.
I tried Gloaming Cut when I first had access to it, and - like many players - hated it because it seemed so slow and awkward of an attack. So I basically abandoned that skill while levelling. I progressed SJ very slowly due to trying to get all the skirmishes done while still not missing any invocation coins (which basically means very little questing except when comfortably between skirmishes), so I ended up hitting 60 and using his free respec right before the Feywild launch, even though I started playing him back in May. I opted to give GC another chance, and now I love it. That's my LMB attack, with Duelist's on RMB for use on anything that can't be one-hit killed by GC. It is entirely possible to never leave stealth as long as I don't screw up and don't run out of things to hit.
I am liking Twilight Adept not just in combat, but out of combat to refill faster between mobs when I have to let stealth run down. But it's also useful for top-ups when you need to dodge away from your B&S dummy because you've placed it to draw AoE and need to circle around behind a target before you can comfortably start attacking again.
I have never ever been in the Lair of the Mad Dragon before at all, but soloed it yesterday. I really am an explorer at heart, and my biggest problem with the 5-player dungeons is not getting to go poke around in all the corners and behind everything. And of course, I feel my general lack of knowledge of the non-epic dungeons makes even thinking about trying the epic versions a non-starter. I am very happy to have an opportunity to go check them out in relative safety, at my own pace.
I think Mad Dragon is probably also currently suffering from boss hitboxes being too big, as SJ seemed to be getting wing-buffeted when I think he should have been out of the path of it, based on the red areas (but I have no experience to which to compare yesterday's fight). So the fight might have taken more potions than otherwise, what with getting dazed and randomly thrown into acid pools and all. Still, zero deaths and it felt very heroic and everything. I found it interesting how the imp spawns actually helped, not just with the boss fight but through the entire dungeon, since they are ideal GC fodder. Better if at all possible to leave them alive until you need a stealth refill, then take out a few in quick succession. Likewise with the zealots and a few other monster types. I was trying to avoid using B&S except in emergencies or when I needed the rapid AP gain because the dummy would cause things to start throwing around fire, and even with Tenacious Concealment slotted, fire was bad.
Really fun build and it suits my style very well, so thanks to everyone who has put the work into it already and I'll try to contribute what I can.
Hey, Silverjon! I'm glad to hear you're having fun with the build and that you are able to explore the game at a pace comfortable for you. Lair of the Mad Dragon (and other dragon fights) can be hard without the use of ITC. But then again, recently ITC doesn't negate knockbacks which is sad.
I think I saw you in action once on one of my alt. characters in Sharandar. I'm not sure but the name is awfully familiar. Anyway if ever you're feeling like running some dungeons with other Stealth-based TR's, feel free to send me a PM in the game. We usually run them from time to time.
Looking forward to hearing more about your experiences, SJ!
Sort of a side question. If you solo a dungeon during the Dungeon Delve events, does it count towards a daily so you can get AD from Rinx?
Provided that the dungeon he specified is the one you soloed, yes it counts as a Daily and you can get Rough AD's from Rhix. Just as Javiberna2 and Beckylunatic has mentioned. Thanks for the clarifications, guys.
I am loving this build. I respec'd my TR recently to this build only changing Shocking Execution for Courage Breaker. I want to test out how well the debuff from that daily works on boss mobs. I may have opted for another feat instead of critical teamwork to spice things up also. My TR had been on the backburner while leveling my DC and waiting for the fallout from the balancing the devs were proposing so I have just taken him out for some wet work after module 1 dropped.
Running around Sharrandar with this build is a blast. The redcaps don't know what hit them before taking a dirt nap and they fill up the stealth bar nicely with GC. The larger mobs with more HP pose a challenge but not much of one. Using Duelist Fury while rotating Shadow Strike and B&S I can usually take them down in short order. If I see there are several mobs clustered together run into the middle and hit Whirlwind of Blades then go into stealth. This takes down the weaker mobs and gives me a modest power boost which helps with mowing down the biggers mobs quickly.
I also purchased the Battlefield Skulker's set off the AH and it didn't cost me as much as I thought it would. My DC's T2 miracle gear is more expensive. I've slotted a couple of dark enchantments in the utility slots because it's what I had handy. Coupled with Sneak Attack and Skillful Infiltrator when stealthed, my movement speed is amazing! I can reposition myself so quickly now I that using dodge is an afterthought.
In closing, this build is so much fun. I do plan on tweaking things as I continue to gain more experience playing my TR. I enjoy trying new things so I may change some feats here and there to see if I can get more bang for my buck. Thank you for putting up this build. i don't know if I would have discovered the joy of taking down a mob with GC without it
Deaththroe, welcome to the thread and I'm glad to hear you're playing your TR again. The build shines best in solo scenarios like in Sharandar, which makes the overall process of the campaign whole lot funner and easier. It's been my pleasure to have been able to share this build and if you've got any experiences and/or discoveries to share, please don't hesitate to tell us more! I for one like hearing the stories of the users of this build.
I'm also curious about how Courage Breaker is working out for you as a stealth-based TR. As well as the right opportunities to use em. I've also been wondering if this Daily works with Perfect Feytouched enchant that reduces the opponent's attacking strength by 12% and siphons it to you. Would be fun to hit a Dracolich with a -102% Attack Strength debuff that effectively halves his damage potential.
I respecced my TR to the Crit/Stealth build I was testing on the preview shard and the results are good. I can easily one man run dungeons and still be in the top with kills in pvp. I switch to stealth for the dungeons like in shandar and switch to crit in pvp. Your build adjusted to work with my crit setup made my TR to be viable even after the nerfs. Thank you.
It's my pleasure to have been able to assist you Kingculex. Dungeon runs are fun in solo huh? Takes time and careful play but the experience one gets from being able to challenge a monstrosity like a dungeon boss alone is worth it. And I gotta admit, PVP is still a struggle for me. I can get out of matches without dying but getting a decent amount of kills without 1 vs. 1 scenarios (without your beefy teammates taking the kill from you once they find you) is pretty hard unless I slot LB, Shadow Strike and ITC. Which makes me prone to being turned into a pingpong ball by GF's. I really need to work on my strategies and shape up.
If you have the time, please feel free to lay down some of your experiences and discoveries! I personally am curious as to how you are faring with the combination of your crit setup + stealth setups.
I dont have any MC experience yet but I was wondering if you (or any of your TR friends) tried soloing some of it. Any result available?
p.s.: I should be quite a bit online this weekend and next weekend so if you want to try some shenanigans just give me a shout (even if I am on my DC).
Ciao
Fab
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
Hey, Silverjon! I'm glad to hear you're having fun with the build and that you are able to explore the game at a pace comfortable for you. Lair of the Mad Dragon (and other dragon fights) can be hard without the use of ITC. But then again, recently ITC doesn't negate knockbacks which is sad.
I think I saw you in action once on one of my alt. characters in Sharandar. I'm not sure but the name is awfully familiar. Anyway if ever you're feeling like running some dungeons with other Stealth-based TR's, feel free to send me a PM in the game. We usually run them from time to time.
Looking forward to hearing more about your experiences, SJ!
No doubt that fight would have been easier with ITC slotted. I have points in it, but never think to use it. Maybe I should be extra proud for having got by without?
It's very likely you have seen SJ in Sharandar, as it's where I'm spending the majority of my gaming time of late unless soloing a dungeon or playing Foundry. If you spot me again, feel free to send a tell or a friend request. I'd be down for some stealthy group dungeon-running at some point. Though I think I'm liable to be obsessed with the Midsummer Festival for the next few weeks. Still, I love dungeons, and I really do want to tackle the Epic versions at some point, which I know many players are going off of because they don't see a point to doing them for fun (as opposed to profit).
Provided that the dungeon he specified is the one you soloed, yes it counts as a Daily and you can get Rough AD's from Rhix. Just as Javiberna2 and Beckylunatic has mentioned. Thanks for the clarifications, guys.
Even better, you can accept all of Rhix's daily dungeons as they come up, and just keep them in your journal until you feel ready to tackle a particular dungeon, then turn them in when you get around to it, even if it's many levels later. This didn't occur to me until after I had outlevelled a few dailies I didn't bother to pick up, but it actually works very well.
Comments
Hello and thank you for your interest in playing the build. Yes, this TR build is mainly untouched by the recent patch. If anything, we just became more powerful because of the buff to Gloaming Cut. It's a useful skill now that it deals extra damage. It's slow, but a well-placed Gloaming Cut will net high rewards for players who use it without putting themselves at risk much. If you're fine with getting abusive messages from opponents, or threats that you'll get reported for being a hacker who exploits stealth, the build is definitely up to working standards in PVP. As for your question, the answer is yes and no. When you're in stealth, you hide your presence in plain sight and enemies will not be able to see you. But when you get close enough your targets will be able to see your silhouette and are able to attack and CC you. This is why I like having Impossible to Catch slotted while I attack. Using this build in PVP requires a careful play style. This is the main reason why Cloud of Steel, our ranged at-will got severely nerfed.
Hello, melanie2781. The build is still up to working standards and its core elements have been mainly untouched by the recent patch. The drow is definitely a good race to use with this build in terms of offensive play. But halflings are also just as useful thanks to their 10% resistance to control effects and the +3% to deflect.
Hi, Kapitanfak. Welcome to the thread and I'm glad to hear that you're having fun using this build. To answer your questions, this build can be flexible and its roles can be changed for stealth jobs or DPS jobs based on what armor set you have. It'll cost you, but it's always good to have an alternative armor set so you can switch roles whenever needed. For instance, changing your armor set to a Swash set will give you a more DPS feel to your play style as you will not have the 25% increased stealth from Skulkers, but instead will be replaced with a near constant 1k+ Recovery/Power which is a good boost in DPS. By changing your encounters to better suit DPS, you will be able to do the job of a cookie-cutter Executioner since this build is also using most of the feats DPS executioners have, only we have heroic feats specced towards stealth. However for the Executioner Feats Tree, you'll find that the only difference we have for feats would be that most Executioners will have Deadly Momentum slotted as well, where as we do not have the extra feat points for that. It's not much of a loss though since we tend to be flexible simply by changing armor sets.
This is mainly used as a solo build for people who aren't too keen on grouping up with people whom they do not know, and excels especially well in the new Campaign area. For 5-man PVE groups, it's best if you switch powers around to better suit your party's needs. While you won't be doing much DPS against trash mobs without a Swash, what you can do is provide your party with other valuable forms of support such as utility CC skills like Smoke Bomb. Smoke Bomb is really good for controlling trash mobs. Another good skill is Dazing Strike, which provides damage and a bit of a CC cone. Lastly, you can never go wrong with Lashing Blade. But when up against bosses, you'll want to equip the usual. Bait and Switch, Shadow Strike, ITC. Our damage goes higher the more we are in stealth. Not to mention Bait and Switch gives us access to Lurker's Assault much faster. It's possible to have this up in every rotation thanks to BaS against bosses that likes to spam melee range AoE's.
You can try to read guides that focus more on high DPS like Luna's or Metzli's. Both are equally good PVE guides that any TR player should read!
3 things please:
I alrdy have 3k crit and 2k armpen and 2.5k power with skulker set without enchanting the gear yet but i have stone... Could you advise the soft caps on armpen and crit and what to focus on next, what about power... by soft cap i mean where diminishing returns kick in...
I rolled a human when i wanted to do the intellect build (which i didn't like) and my stats are 21 dex 21 str 15 cha... should i respec for it to work properly?
What about armor and weapons enchants.... whats best?
If any of my questions has an answer in your post let me know to look over again... Thanks
Also where can i find a cookie cutter build for pve dps? Thanks a lot
Hello, ufoalien. I must say you got some solid raw stats without unenchanted gear. Here are a couple of things I can advise you with regarding the soft caps. I'm not an expert in these sort of things because I'm no min/max-er, but from my limited knowledge about this topic, the following soft caps are as follows.
Crit: 50%. Once you reach this percentage, it's best to start stacking more power.
ArPen: 24%. Mobs have an average damage mitigation of this amount. 24% almost completely nullifies their defenses.
Power: Power has no diminishing returns. I'm not sure about the power:damage ratio, however. But this is your go-to stat once you max out crit and arpen. You may also opt to go for Recovery. The RSI you can get from recovery are as follows.
- 1160 - 10%
- 2500 - 20%
- 2750 - 21%
- 3200 - 23%
- 4100 - 26%
- 5000 - 28%
If you rolled a human with 14 INT, then you can definitely use the new alternative stealth-build I'll be releasing after some more testing. I rolled a wood elf for it though to gain 20 STR, 20 DEX, 20 INT. It has a better room for error in PVE settings and only needs Shadow Strike in order to maintain permastealth, making room for other utility skills in place of BaS. But BaS works just as well for this build.
For armor enchantments, Soulforged is by far the best for us. 3 seconds (or more) of immunity does a lot for survival. Weapon enchants, hands down, it has to be Vorpal. Any DPS-based build in general will be able to benefit from Vorpal's ability to further increase the damage of our critical strikes. And as a class that concentrates on getting as much critical strikes as possible, Vorpal definitely has a solid place for any and all TR builds. But this build is pretty flexible. If you feel like running other weapon enchantments it would also be okay. I for one like using Plague Fire as it is able to reduce the defenses of our opponents below 0%. It's something the whole party will be able to benefit from.
If you're interested in reading more about the cookie cutter DPS builds, I highly recommend you read Metzli's and Luna's guides which are in this archived master list of builds.
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?182621-gt-Master-List-of-Class-Builds-lt
You'll see them under the TR section. I hope this somehow helped! And if you've got any other questions please feel free to lay them down in another post!
I'm sorry to hear that it's not working out for you. Getting Gloaming Cut to working conditions is heavily reliant on Sneaky Stabber, Improved Cunning Sneak and Battlefield Skulker's set effects. It's also impossible to maintain maximized stealth with just Gloaming Cut alone, which is why I like to have Shadow Strike and Bait and Switch slotted in order to get other sources of stealth refills. If by any chance you had all those feats, encounters and gear, then something else must be wrong.
But anyway, I'll be posting videos up very soon. I haven't found the time for it recently but tomorrow will be a holiday for me, and I'll be using some of my time tomorrow in recording vids of rotations and strategies using this build and it might also include a video of me running Gnarlroot Caves solo using this build if I have enough time. I know it's not too much of a feat to solo that minor dungeon but it should serve as a good example as to how this build works.
I read through this lengthy (and awesome) thread and plan on doing a build of it and come to the end to find out it looks like you might have something even better on the way. Can you give any tips/hints as to how the build starts out for anyone who would like to get one going?
I really want to see this new build too! "It has a better room for error in PVE settings" sounds wonderful! I'm the first to admit I'm not the best player, so this type of build sounds great!
As Marc5iver said above me, any hints/tips to get one started? Such as starting stat rolls?
One last request, when you can, can you post the new build in a new thread of its own? This one is getting a bit long and I'm worried the new build might get buried or lost in it.
The TR is the most fun class I've played
with the buff its actually quite easy to perma with lower health mobs with just gloaming cut, the ones u can one-two shot. its a slow farming skill but enhances stealth duration a ton. But u need to know how to use it.
couple tips:
stealth up and engage mobs from weakest to strongest so u get the most stealth duration.
if some mobs need 2 hits, start with the first flurry atack which has a fast animation and then gloaming, as u want to execute with gloaming for the stealth and bonus dmg.
u dont need to constantly be using gloaming as u just really need to land a couple death blows with it to extend stealth a few secs in between shadowstrike and bait n switch cds for the rotation.
with invisible infiltrator, ur dailies can be ur oh **** button to refill ur stealth
this build really makes pve pretty easy to solo as long as u dont screw up the rotations, and im even thinking of respecing out the stealth on dodge for more dmg as the gloaming cut buff is pretty big.
Have you also fully feated Sneaky Stabber? It makes GC much more effective. When solidly geared, GC shreds enemies. My TR can one-shot Witherers and Powries, and 2-4 shot Thorns and Giantsouls.
Don't need to swap anything out. The build doesn't shine till 39+ when you get Gloaming and the feat to recharge stealth per hit. I've used this build to level solo, and just finished Helms Hold at 39, minus the dungeon.
Gear is no where near optimal and a lot is almost 10 levels below me if not more.
BUT to each his/her own.
Solid tips, Ximae. That's how I work out the order in which I kill mobs. We may be slow but we're sure to kill things even when the party is out cold. I also considered speccing out out Twilight Adept and Swift Footwork since we most usually have enough Stealth time from Gloaming Cut alone. But then I thought the room for error will be lower without those 2 feats. Still, if by any chance you manage to work it out, tell us about your experiences if it's possible! I'm curious to hear how effective this will be.
Have you tried the Quickling Den in the Dark Fey Enclave area? It's just so fun to smack the Quicklings and not lose any stealth thanks to their HP being inherently low. It's practically possible to not use any stealth refill skills until you reach the boss where you'd have to use Lurker's Assault to burst her down quick with DF.
Hello, Kisssslive. I'll have to say that Sneaky Stabber + Gloaming Cut is pretty much the defining feature of this build. Not taking it would probably net you results of what a cookie cutter executioner should be. But if you insist on forgoing Sneaky Stabber + GC, I recommend you get a Swashbuckling set, stack up on ArPen until you get 24%, stack up on crit until you get 50%, and finally Recovery. Cookie cutter executioners are solid and a well proven build, however it requires some high end enchants such as Greater Vorpal, R7+ Darks/Azures, in order to take to competitive levels. But they work real well. They however do not work anywhere near how Stealth-based executioners do. While we get increased stealth, cookie-cutter executioners have increased DPS and moderate stealth. I hope this somehow answered your question.
Very true, mkjns. Pre-45 (before getting Shadow Strike), it can be a struggle to use this build. I've had an easier time with my Oppressor CW with boss areas as compared to my experiences in leveling Stealth-Based Executioners. But once Sneaky Stabber + GC has been filled up with points, things get a whole lot easier. I hope the rest of your leveling goes smoothly.
I tried Gloaming Cut when I first had access to it, and - like many players - hated it because it seemed so slow and awkward of an attack. So I basically abandoned that skill while levelling. I progressed SJ very slowly due to trying to get all the skirmishes done while still not missing any invocation coins (which basically means very little questing except when comfortably between skirmishes), so I ended up hitting 60 and using his free respec right before the Feywild launch, even though I started playing him back in May. I opted to give GC another chance, and now I love it. That's my LMB attack, with Duelist's on RMB for use on anything that can't be one-hit killed by GC. It is entirely possible to never leave stealth as long as I don't screw up and don't run out of things to hit.
I am liking Twilight Adept not just in combat, but out of combat to refill faster between mobs when I have to let stealth run down. But it's also useful for top-ups when you need to dodge away from your B&S dummy because you've placed it to draw AoE and need to circle around behind a target before you can comfortably start attacking again.
I have never ever been in the Lair of the Mad Dragon before at all, but soloed it yesterday. I really am an explorer at heart, and my biggest problem with the 5-player dungeons is not getting to go poke around in all the corners and behind everything. And of course, I feel my general lack of knowledge of the non-epic dungeons makes even thinking about trying the epic versions a non-starter. I am very happy to have an opportunity to go check them out in relative safety, at my own pace.
I think Mad Dragon is probably also currently suffering from boss hitboxes being too big, as SJ seemed to be getting wing-buffeted when I think he should have been out of the path of it, based on the red areas (but I have no experience to which to compare yesterday's fight). So the fight might have taken more potions than otherwise, what with getting dazed and randomly thrown into acid pools and all. Still, zero deaths and it felt very heroic and everything. I found it interesting how the imp spawns actually helped, not just with the boss fight but through the entire dungeon, since they are ideal GC fodder. Better if at all possible to leave them alive until you need a stealth refill, then take out a few in quick succession. Likewise with the zealots and a few other monster types. I was trying to avoid using B&S except in emergencies or when I needed the rapid AP gain because the dummy would cause things to start throwing around fire, and even with Tenacious Concealment slotted, fire was bad.
Really fun build and it suits my style very well, so thanks to everyone who has put the work into it already and I'll try to contribute what I can.
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Yes, of course.
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Running around Sharrandar with this build is a blast. The redcaps don't know what hit them before taking a dirt nap and they fill up the stealth bar nicely with GC. The larger mobs with more HP pose a challenge but not much of one. Using Duelist Fury while rotating Shadow Strike and B&S I can usually take them down in short order. If I see there are several mobs clustered together run into the middle and hit Whirlwind of Blades then go into stealth. This takes down the weaker mobs and gives me a modest power boost which helps with mowing down the biggers mobs quickly.
I also purchased the Battlefield Skulker's set off the AH and it didn't cost me as much as I thought it would. My DC's T2 miracle gear is more expensive. I've slotted a couple of dark enchantments in the utility slots because it's what I had handy. Coupled with Sneak Attack and Skillful Infiltrator when stealthed, my movement speed is amazing! I can reposition myself so quickly now I that using dodge is an afterthought.
In closing, this build is so much fun. I do plan on tweaking things as I continue to gain more experience playing my TR. I enjoy trying new things so I may change some feats here and there to see if I can get more bang for my buck. Thank you for putting up this build. i don't know if I would have discovered the joy of taking down a mob with GC without it
Haven't unlocked it on my TR yet, but it was a lot of fun on my GF. Looking forward to unlocking it on my TR, DC, CW...
There is no point to whine for nerfs because you win some and loose some. Crying just makes a player look like a crier and no one, especially the devs, should take them seriously. Have a nice day!:)
well i actually built a bit differently than u, i already didnt take the stamina increase so im not getting as many dodge rolls as u. Im also not using sneak attack but invisible infiltrator which is a stealth fillup on daily use and with proper bns usage the dailies are up in a breeze, so that is basically my margin of error. I do like that little dodge stealth fillup as it gives me that little boost to end up filling the bar in certain situations, specially just in between combat. Id have to test without it and see if there is something else worth getting in that tier instead.
I also took deadly momentum instead of critical team work as i thought cc u can stack on gear but not severity, but its gona make me not be able to hit 50% crit chance, at 46% atm. but not too sure on this one as im having to stack a ton of crit chance that could be something else like more power or arp, i feel like i hit like a puzy in the t2 dungeons( still on scavenger and rank5s and no vopral though). I really need to figure out what will be giving me more damage 1000 power or 15% severity on stacks.
im pretty interested in that, as i feel i need a bit more dps many times, how did u feat it up? guessing first 2 tiers of saboteur + executioner, but what feats.
The feats are basically the same that are in this build guide. My abilities choices were strength and dex. The only real difference is my gear which is the gear that gives bonus to crit and power. I use a mix of the master assassin set and the sinister shade set. That is 450 bonus to power and 450 bonus to crit. I also use the ancient daggers set to add another 450 bonus to crit. My enchantments are also setup to add to power/crit as well.
There is no point to whine for nerfs because you win some and loose some. Crying just makes a player look like a crier and no one, especially the devs, should take them seriously. Have a nice day!:)
Hey, Silverjon! I'm glad to hear you're having fun with the build and that you are able to explore the game at a pace comfortable for you. Lair of the Mad Dragon (and other dragon fights) can be hard without the use of ITC. But then again, recently ITC doesn't negate knockbacks which is sad.
I think I saw you in action once on one of my alt. characters in Sharandar. I'm not sure but the name is awfully familiar. Anyway if ever you're feeling like running some dungeons with other Stealth-based TR's, feel free to send me a PM in the game. We usually run them from time to time.
Looking forward to hearing more about your experiences, SJ!
Provided that the dungeon he specified is the one you soloed, yes it counts as a Daily and you can get Rough AD's from Rhix. Just as Javiberna2 and Beckylunatic has mentioned.
Deaththroe, welcome to the thread and I'm glad to hear you're playing your TR again. The build shines best in solo scenarios like in Sharandar, which makes the overall process of the campaign whole lot funner and easier. It's been my pleasure to have been able to share this build and if you've got any experiences and/or discoveries to share, please don't hesitate to tell us more! I for one like hearing the stories of the users of this build.
I'm also curious about how Courage Breaker is working out for you as a stealth-based TR. As well as the right opportunities to use em. I've also been wondering if this Daily works with Perfect Feytouched enchant that reduces the opponent's attacking strength by 12% and siphons it to you.
It's my pleasure to have been able to assist you Kingculex. Dungeon runs are fun in solo huh? Takes time and careful play but the experience one gets from being able to challenge a monstrosity like a dungeon boss alone is worth it. And I gotta admit, PVP is still a struggle for me.
If you have the time, please feel free to lay down some of your experiences and discoveries! I personally am curious as to how you are faring with the combination of your crit setup + stealth setups.
Oh sorry! I'll make some space now! Feel free to send me a PM once you see this or, or you can also post your queries here in this thread.
I dont have any MC experience yet but I was wondering if you (or any of your TR friends) tried soloing some of it. Any result available?
p.s.: I should be quite a bit online this weekend and next weekend so if you want to try some shenanigans just give me a shout (even if I am on my DC).
Ciao
Fab
No doubt that fight would have been easier with ITC slotted. I have points in it, but never think to use it. Maybe I should be extra proud for having got by without?
It's very likely you have seen SJ in Sharandar, as it's where I'm spending the majority of my gaming time of late unless soloing a dungeon or playing Foundry. If you spot me again, feel free to send a tell or a friend request. I'd be down for some stealthy group dungeon-running at some point. Though I think I'm liable to be obsessed with the Midsummer Festival for the next few weeks. Still, I love dungeons, and I really do want to tackle the Epic versions at some point, which I know many players are going off of because they don't see a point to doing them for fun (as opposed to profit).
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Even better, you can accept all of Rhix's daily dungeons as they come up, and just keep them in your journal until you feel ready to tackle a particular dungeon, then turn them in when you get around to it, even if it's many levels later. This didn't occur to me until after I had outlevelled a few dailies I didn't bother to pick up, but it actually works very well.
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