It's simpler than even that - all they have to do is lock out the "Need" button when your class can't use the item (which they are already detecting). That's one line of code.
And like I said, the fact they didn't do that by default makes me suspect they want the situation as it is - for some sort of Zen payback down the line.
Here's the thing w/ that, though - if an item drops that is of your class, but is not as good as what you're using, why should you still be able to "need" it. It's not as good as what you have, so why are you any more entitled to it than anyone else? A Want/Pass setup simply avoids the semantics of saying "well I'm a rogue and there were more rogue drops this run, so cha-ching".
<::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::)xxxxxxxx(:::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> "Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
LOL, look at all the needers in this thread trying to justify their a-h actions. Unbelievable. It is simple, if it isn't for your class and it is a class item, either pass or roll greed. Stop being greedy SOBs, pug or preformed party when you are in a dungeon together you are part of a TEAM. To quote a phrase, there is no I in TEAM.
BTW, according to the State of the Game address, they are implementing a Class specific NEED roll system. The days of loot ninja's are numbered. Its about time.
Here's the thing w/ that, though - if an item drops that is of your class, but is not as good as what you're using, why should you still be able to "need" it. It's not as good as what you have, so why are you any more entitled to it than anyone else? A Want/Pass setup simply avoids the semantics of saying "well I'm a rogue and there were more rogue drops this run, so cha-ching".
Are you new to MMO's Bio? Do you not know the meaning of "Need, Greed, and Pass?" I mean, it only happens to be the same loot mechanic adopted by almost every MMO in existence nowadays. Why should this one be any different?
I am just left astounded by the mentality of players that chose "need" for an item that a fellow group member can use while doing a dungeon together, and yet for that player to continue doing the dungeon with their group mate while depriving them from an item they can use because its sitting idly in their inventory waiting to be sold. Do people have any conscience at all? I mean, it really is borderline patholocgical.
Are you new to MMO's Bio? Do you not know the meaning of "Need, Greed, and Pass?" I mean, it only happens to be the same loot mechanic adopted by almost every MMO in existence nowadays. Why should this one be any different?
I am just left astounded by the mentality of a player that chooses "need" for an item that a fellow group member can use while doing a dungeon together, and yet for that player to continue doing the dungeon with that player while depriving them from an item they can use because its sitting idly in your inventory. Don't you people have any conscience at all? I mean, it really is borderline patholocgical.
First of all, I am not new to MMOs.
Second, just because you are, let's say, a cleric, doesn't mean that you can actually "use" the item that drops. By that, I mean, if you currently have an item that is better than what has dropped, why should you still be able to need it? There is nothing that says that you must actually use it, so you just got a free pass at getting said item to sell it on the AH - no different than if it wasn't of your class.
This is why I'm of a mind that a want/pass system is best.
<::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::)xxxxxxxx(:::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> "Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
Until it directly affects you. The condescenders are always the loudest criers when things go bad for them in my online experience. Me, I don't mind either way because I'm not that invested in this game, but I understand the angst of those who are.
This is why I'm of a mind that a want/pass system is best.
Changing the word doesn't change the ability to take something you don't need. It's just semantics, and all you've done is remove a useful, meaningful option.
Nothing can ever prevent someone Needing on something they already have. I'm not sure the game should play Nanny to that extent. That is one of the reasons for joining a guild of like-minded people and playing with them. The issue of cross-class Needing is an easy fix though.
Honestly, WoW went through all this for months and solved it. I'm perplexed as to why PW have implemented an identical system and then turned off the entire point of the design of that system. PW are a very odd company.
Second, just because you are, let's say, a cleric, doesn't mean that you can actually "use" the item that drops. By that, I mean, if you currently have an item that is better than what has dropped, why should you still be able to need it? There is nothing that says that you must actually use it, so you just got a free pass at getting said item to sell it on the AH - no different than if it wasn't of your class.
This is why I'm of a mind that a want/pass system is best.
If an item drops that a class already has equipped or doesn't need, then that person should be clicking "greed" also. The system can also be adjusted to the point that if the system detects a class is already wearing a similar item, the need button will be greyed out for them as well. Really not rocket science.
In a PuG, the other people are not your friends. That's just a simple fact. Unlike a guild or static group, you're probably not going to group with them again. In such an environment, there is no reason for them to defer loot to you. That's not greed, that's just a fair allocation of rewards.
And this is what is wrong with most of the current F2P communities. Its the entitled feeling of "I put the time in, so I should get to roll for it". Of course, they don't even consider the fact that you also put the time in lol.
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bioshrikeMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,729Arc User
edited June 2013
One of the best suggestions I've seen is to have items given via need to be instantly bound to the character that got them, and to remain bind on equip only when obtained via greed.
<::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::)xxxxxxxx(:::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> "Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
Cryptic did this on purpose. You can buy that piece on the AH for AD. If you don't have enough AD trade zen for some if you don't have zen who cares free loader
^^^ this guy gets it, why cannot the rest of the pack understand it? Only reason I can see threads like this keep popping, is the likes of the OP and others have 2 problems : 1) Cannot use the search feature and 2) think this is a WoW clone, but are stupid cheap and play F2P. The system is tied straight to real world cash, they want you to spend real money to buy ZEN to convert to astral diamonds and buy the gear you want, cause you are sick and tired of getting it needed over you. System is better off with just Loot: Yes/Pass and rolls...who ever gets it gets it and it still sticks with the current them of AH/Zen/Convert to AD.
Still think a neutral drop for boss mobs is better, tokens which you turn in for the equipment you want...everyone gets the tokens, everyone turns in for the stuff they need, eventual they start turning in for other classes because not everyone wants to grind the tokens (system would probably have high cost requirements, requiring you to grind more). No more emo angst-angst raging on the forums, cause now everyone gets the same prize without the competition and with spare tokens spent, they can also put them on the AH (just like the current iteration where you got screwed over by someone else wanting to sell).
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markrush1978Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
There is a very simple way to fix this problem, items that your class can't use, shouldn't be allowed to be roll as ''need''. Point !
One of the best suggestions I've seen is to have items given via need to be instantly bound to the character that got them, and to remain bind on equip only when obtained via greed.
Griefers would still be able to need then give you HAMSTER they have an item they have to now sell as shop food since it's bound while giving you HAMSTER about "Let's see those bitter tears! lulz"
To be honest, this is what i'm doing at the moment:
I'm holding my me roll till everyone else has rolled, and if 3 guys who can't even equip the item roll need, i roll need aswell.
Why should i stick to the rules if they don't do it?
If you notice you are in a group with lootninjas, there is really nothing you can do but rolling need on everything if you don't want to go out of the dungeon with empty hands.
Then again, i see many guys rolling "need" on items because it is an item for their class, even if they have a WAY better item equiped.
I'm talking about CWs with shadow weaver or high vizer boots rolling need on some (nonset) trash purple boots dropping from the first boss in pirat king. And then calling out others for rolling need aswell, because this was a "CW item".
So many guys don't understand that "I NEED to put this on the AH" is no reason to roll "need", even if the item is for their class.
I put in the same time, I can sell an item for an item I actually need.
I don't really see the point in not needing or not greeding everything in a dungeon. Needing is better because then no one can ninja. At the end of the run, if I won a good item then I can sell it for something I need or use it myself. Same can be said for any of the 4 other people.
well i havn't reached max level and i don't know if the items in question display who they are ment for but my biggest issue in dungeons concerning loot (green loot that is) is it doesn't say what it does. So i have no idea if its better or worse then mine so i haven't got a choice but to need. I feel dreadful doing it but it's not like i have many options going
well i havn't reached max level and i don't know if the items in question display who they are ment for but my biggest issue in dungeons concerning loot (green loot that is) is it doesn't say what it does. So i have no idea if its better or worse then mine so i haven't got a choice but to need. I feel dreadful doing it but it's not like i have many options going
Purple Items (which you will use almost exclusively at lvl 60) show their stats when they drop. Which means everyone who rolls need on a shadow weaver armor as roque does 100% know he can't use this item.
I personally only need if the hero i am playing atm can use it....
if i play my DC i need every DC item and pass on everything else, if i play my GWF i need on all GWF items and pass everything else.
Havent exualy touched greed once in this game, i dont know i think this game is for fun not to get a second job.
But usualy i chat with people durring my dungeon runs, so i can easily tell if they are cool ore not .
Beanyundead i understand ure vision about this, but imagine it from a new players view, he has no hero with endgame gear yet and every single upgrade gets "needed" by the entire party that clearly cant use it on there current chars. How would he enjoy the game then? They should adress the way it works imo and fast. Greed is a bad motivator for people
You know, you've got a point. I think its because I talk to everyone in my dungeon runs and let them know what I'm doing that I have never had a problem. If I am about to select Need, I let my team know (although this happens very rarely) and if anyone has a problem, I listen to them and act accordingly. I once handed over a Blue to a fellow player when I won it on Greed just because he asked nicely. Anyway, I see your point about new players. Perhaps they should have the system and its ethics explained during the various tutorials.
I would understand this. But in 1 run i think we got 3 purple drops for 3 different classes, and he " needed them all " Makes perfect sense to NEED everything. Of course id understand if this guy was 1 in a bunch, but another 4 runs done ( 4 runs go fine, no dc drops so i have no issues, i pass on everything other than enchantments. This time i talk to my party. Everything going fine, we agreed at start who would get what, so one of our rogues dc's, so before final boss, i go for a quick HAMSTER. I come back, he reconnected and died, and screamed at me calling me everything he possible could. Boss drops a dc item. He needs it for and i quote " You let me die you ****ing **** " And what does the game do? Roll me a 5.
What we need is an incentive not to press 'need' all the time. Like 'teamwork tokens' which can be used to buy items or something, awarded when you don't 'need'. That way, if you are contantly missing out on items, you can trade in your tokens to get the item eventually. Just a thought.
Comments
Here's the thing w/ that, though - if an item drops that is of your class, but is not as good as what you're using, why should you still be able to "need" it. It's not as good as what you have, so why are you any more entitled to it than anyone else? A Want/Pass setup simply avoids the semantics of saying "well I'm a rogue and there were more rogue drops this run, so cha-ching".
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
Are you new to MMO's Bio? Do you not know the meaning of "Need, Greed, and Pass?" I mean, it only happens to be the same loot mechanic adopted by almost every MMO in existence nowadays. Why should this one be any different?
I am just left astounded by the mentality of players that chose "need" for an item that a fellow group member can use while doing a dungeon together, and yet for that player to continue doing the dungeon with their group mate while depriving them from an item they can use because its sitting idly in their inventory waiting to be sold. Do people have any conscience at all? I mean, it really is borderline patholocgical.
And the parents obliging.
"Do you really NEED that Barbie accessory? You rolled the Ken doll and your sister has the Malibu Barbie. Time for a patch!"
First of all, I am not new to MMOs.
Second, just because you are, let's say, a cleric, doesn't mean that you can actually "use" the item that drops. By that, I mean, if you currently have an item that is better than what has dropped, why should you still be able to need it? There is nothing that says that you must actually use it, so you just got a free pass at getting said item to sell it on the AH - no different than if it wasn't of your class.
This is why I'm of a mind that a want/pass system is best.
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
Until it directly affects you. The condescenders are always the loudest criers when things go bad for them in my online experience. Me, I don't mind either way because I'm not that invested in this game, but I understand the angst of those who are.
Changing the word doesn't change the ability to take something you don't need. It's just semantics, and all you've done is remove a useful, meaningful option.
Nothing can ever prevent someone Needing on something they already have. I'm not sure the game should play Nanny to that extent. That is one of the reasons for joining a guild of like-minded people and playing with them. The issue of cross-class Needing is an easy fix though.
Honestly, WoW went through all this for months and solved it. I'm perplexed as to why PW have implemented an identical system and then turned off the entire point of the design of that system. PW are a very odd company.
If an item drops that a class already has equipped or doesn't need, then that person should be clicking "greed" also. The system can also be adjusted to the point that if the system detects a class is already wearing a similar item, the need button will be greyed out for them as well. Really not rocket science.
And this is what is wrong with most of the current F2P communities. Its the entitled feeling of "I put the time in, so I should get to roll for it". Of course, they don't even consider the fact that you also put the time in lol.
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
^^^ this guy gets it, why cannot the rest of the pack understand it? Only reason I can see threads like this keep popping, is the likes of the OP and others have 2 problems : 1) Cannot use the search feature and 2) think this is a WoW clone, but are stupid cheap and play F2P. The system is tied straight to real world cash, they want you to spend real money to buy ZEN to convert to astral diamonds and buy the gear you want, cause you are sick and tired of getting it needed over you. System is better off with just Loot: Yes/Pass and rolls...who ever gets it gets it and it still sticks with the current them of AH/Zen/Convert to AD.
Still think a neutral drop for boss mobs is better, tokens which you turn in for the equipment you want...everyone gets the tokens, everyone turns in for the stuff they need, eventual they start turning in for other classes because not everyone wants to grind the tokens (system would probably have high cost requirements, requiring you to grind more). No more emo angst-angst raging on the forums, cause now everyone gets the same prize without the competition and with spare tokens spent, they can also put them on the AH (just like the current iteration where you got screwed over by someone else wanting to sell).
Griefers would still be able to need then give you HAMSTER they have an item they have to now sell as shop food since it's bound while giving you HAMSTER about "Let's see those bitter tears! lulz"
^^^
It is so very simple.
But the entitlement generation with the give meh give meh give meh want to be greedy sobs so keep trolling these threads.
I'm holding my me roll till everyone else has rolled, and if 3 guys who can't even equip the item roll need, i roll need aswell.
Why should i stick to the rules if they don't do it?
If you notice you are in a group with lootninjas, there is really nothing you can do but rolling need on everything if you don't want to go out of the dungeon with empty hands.
Then again, i see many guys rolling "need" on items because it is an item for their class, even if they have a WAY better item equiped.
I'm talking about CWs with shadow weaver or high vizer boots rolling need on some (nonset) trash purple boots dropping from the first boss in pirat king. And then calling out others for rolling need aswell, because this was a "CW item".
So many guys don't understand that "I NEED to put this on the AH" is no reason to roll "need", even if the item is for their class.
I don't really see the point in not needing or not greeding everything in a dungeon. Needing is better because then no one can ninja. At the end of the run, if I won a good item then I can sell it for something I need or use it myself. Same can be said for any of the 4 other people.
Purple Items (which you will use almost exclusively at lvl 60) show their stats when they drop. Which means everyone who rolls need on a shadow weaver armor as roque does 100% know he can't use this item.
Quest ID: NW-DPCZNUVQ7
You know, you've got a point. I think its because I talk to everyone in my dungeon runs and let them know what I'm doing that I have never had a problem. If I am about to select Need, I let my team know (although this happens very rarely) and if anyone has a problem, I listen to them and act accordingly. I once handed over a Blue to a fellow player when I won it on Greed just because he asked nicely. Anyway, I see your point about new players. Perhaps they should have the system and its ethics explained during the various tutorials.
What we need is an incentive not to press 'need' all the time. Like 'teamwork tokens' which can be used to buy items or something, awarded when you don't 'need'. That way, if you are contantly missing out on items, you can trade in your tokens to get the item eventually. Just a thought.
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