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being restricted from informing the community of unpleasant players?

rickfrankrickfrank Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 13 Arc User
edited May 2013 in General Discussion (PC)
I think someone should look into this forum policy. Not having a community availible means of posting a blacklist of ninja lootes party droppers and group kickers is bad for the community.

Awareness is the number one tool players have to combatt these poor behaviors in mmos and having these forums restricted in that manner is,and will continue to hurt the community.

Please allow us to police our servers using these forums.
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Post edited by rickfrank on
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    edge1986edge1986 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 647 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    Then what stops me from lying and saying you are a ninja looter and should be blacklisted?

    That's why it isn't allowed.
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    elessymelessym Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    edge1986 wrote: »
    Then what stops me from lying and saying you are a ninja looter and should be blacklisted?

    That's why it isn't allowed.

    Indeed, he has the death sentence on twelve systems!
    "Participation in PVP-related activities is so low on an hourly, daily, weekly, and monthly basis that we could in fact just completely take it out of STO and it would not impact the overall number of people [who] log in to the game and play in any significant way." -Gozer, Cryptic PvP Dev
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    kiralynkiralyn Member Posts: 1,440 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Pretty much every official MMO forum I've been on in the last decade has had a "no shaming" policy. It's nothing new. /shrug
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    mconosrepmconosrep Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    edge1986 wrote: »
    Then what stops me from lying and saying you are a ninja looter and should be blacklisted?

    Yes, I seem to remember playing with someone with a similar name who was a ninja.

    That's all the proof we need - burn him!
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    nauonenauone Member Posts: 11 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Hey everyone just to inform you do not group with rickfrank, he stole a my little pony from my desk and he does not even have the hands to use it!
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    morbicmorbic Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Easier to just submit a ticket on behavior and move on...
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    rickfrankrickfrank Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 13 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    You can tell if a post is a single flame post or if it is a consistent series of posts complaining of a persons actions whether the complaints are justified or not. or you can assume everyone is lying and ignore the posts.

    if the fact that complaints can be faked and so they should be ignored is all the justification you need to remove a reporting system in it's entirety than you can eliminate any reporting system in existence for those same reasons.

    Since chaos if obviously not the answer we have to use good judgement. I'm just asking that those of us who wish to exercise judgement in determining whether claims are true or not, and in so doing improve our chances of avoiding an unpleasant experience, have the opportunity to share our information with like minded individuals.

    I'm not forcing you to pay any attention to the complaint posts, and furthermore i would recommend the server forums perhaps have a separate section for player complaints or blacklists recommendations. You could entirely ignore that section and be fine, but those of us that want to improve our experience could instead use the section to better the community, or at least the portion of the community we interact with.
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    gsundered11gsundered11 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 135 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    rickfrank wrote: »
    I think someone should look into this forum policy. Not having a community availible means of posting a blacklist of ninja lootes party droppers and group kickers is bad for the community.

    Awareness is the number one tool players have to combatt these poor behaviors in mmos and having these forums restricted in that manner is,and will continue to hurt the community.

    Please allow us to police our servers using these forums.

    The game permits ninja looting and the economy encourages it. You and i might not like the practice but PWE does. It drives us to need huge amounts of AS to buy Bind on Equip loot and that in turn drives Zen sales for cash. That's why the Loot system is as it is. The people you want to name and shame are playing the game as it is intended they should play it. People like us, playing by older more civilised rules, are just being mugs to ourselves.
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    katbozejziemikatbozejziemi Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 856 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Yeah, you should report them to the GMs instead. Oh wait, you can't, because the system is not working.

    And even if it was, your ticket would probably just get "lost".
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    edge1986edge1986 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 647 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    rickfrank wrote: »
    You can tell if a post is a single flame post or if it is a consistent series of posts complaining of a persons actions whether the complaints are justified or not. or you can assume everyone is lying and ignore the posts.

    if the fact that complaints can be faked and so they should be ignored is all the justification you need to remove a reporting system in it's entirety than you can eliminate any reporting system in existence for those same reasons.

    Since chaos if obviously not the answer we have to use good judgement. I'm just asking that those of us who wish to exercise judgement in determining whether claims are true or not, and in so doing improve our chances of avoiding an unpleasant experience, have the opportunity to share our information with like minded individuals.

    I'm not forcing you to pay any attention to the complaint posts, and furthermore i would recommend the server forums perhaps have a separate section for player complaints or blacklists recommendations. You could entirely ignore that section and be fine, but those of us that want to improve our experience could instead use the section to better the community, or at least the portion of the community we interact with.

    Yeah, never gonna happen.
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    rickfrankrickfrank Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 13 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Both of these comments reinforce my opinon that we should have a place on the forums to police the community ourselves. We could improve the community and they wouldn't need GM's to do so.
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    rictrasrictras Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 239 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    rickfrank wrote: »
    if the fact that complaints can be faked and so they should be ignored is all the justification you need to remove a reporting system in it's entirety than you can eliminate any reporting system in existence for those same reasons.

    The people investigating the complaint can find out if the report is legitimate. We on the forums cannot.
    The meaning of life, is to give life meaning.
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    kiraliakiralia Member Posts: 383 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Usually games do have this policy. Also usually games end up having a community forum other than the official one that the majority of players frequent that will allow that kind of thing. Just takes time.
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    imivoimivo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 1,682 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    Just walk away from the whole concept of bringing down "justice" on other players. There is no gain in that, just further agitation. Add nice and pleasant players to your friends list and form parties with them, and let poor behavior of others slide off your back. You can't change other people, just how you react to them.

    If they allowed naming and shaming, it would turn into nothing but mutual flaming, real and fake accusations flying around, and what may have started with good intention would become just another harassment tool. If you posted someone's name, nothing would stop them and their friends smearing your name in response. Then you'd try to defend yourself, which then would make you an even better target from their perspective, and in the end it would all just blow up spectacularly.

    The game gives you the tools to avoid unpleasant people: ignore, report spam, form your own parties (and be the leader), create or join guilds, and so forth. Make use of that and you will probably have a better time with the game. People can't get to you unless you allow them to. Sounds easier than it is, admittedly.
    Unsure about skills and feats? Check the Master List of Class Builds!
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    starkaosstarkaos Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    The only thing necessary is having public queues set up so that you can't group up with ignored players and need is only available for players of the right class. If a Orb drops, then only Control Wizards should be able to click need on it.
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    hereticshamanhereticshaman Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    step1) find a decent guild that you can play with
    step2) ?=profit
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    thaliffthaliff Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 180 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    You have your proof, but you will have no way to provide that proof to the community as a whole. And seeing as the game loot design allows this, ninja looting to you is using a game mechanic to the supposed ninja looter. (not that I agree with the current system, but it's the ruleset we are dealing with)

    Your best bet is to keep the player(s) in question on your ignore list and move on.
    On the other side of the screen, it all looks so easy.
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    humbuginspacehumbuginspace Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    rickfrank wrote: »
    I think someone should look into this forum policy. Not having a community availible means of posting a blacklist of ninja lootes party droppers and group kickers is bad for the community.

    Awareness is the number one tool players have to combatt these poor behaviors in mmos and having these forums restricted in that manner is,and will continue to hurt the community.

    Please allow us to police our servers using these forums.

    why not, they already let us essentially moderate the in-game chat, dont see what the problem is with this.
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    sockmunkeysockmunkey Member Posts: 4,622 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Yeah, you should report them to the GMs instead. Oh wait, you can't, because the system is not working.

    And even if it was, your ticket would probably just get "lost".

    Report them for what? There is no rule, expressed or implied, concerning looting. Technically ninja looting is not against any Cryptic rule. Sure its rude, anti-social, and selfish. But unless it violates a rule, reporting is useless. And naming and shaming is, more likely then not, going to get the namer in more trouble then the looter.
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    sparhawksparhawk Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    sockmunkey wrote: »
    Report them for what? There is no rule, expressed or implied, concerning looting. Technically ninja looting is not against any Cryptic rule. Sure its rude, anti-social, and selfish. But unless it violates a rule, reporting is useless. And naming and shaming is, more likely then not, going to get the namer in more trouble then the looter.

    Thread winner.
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    lewstelamon01lewstelamon01 Member Posts: 7,415 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    sockmunkey wrote: »
    Report them for what? There is no rule, expressed or implied, concerning looting. Technically ninja looting is not against any Cryptic rule. Sure its rude, anti-social, and selfish. But unless it violates a rule, reporting is useless. And naming and shaming is, more likely then not, going to get the namer in more trouble then the looter.

    This. Unfortunately, there is no rule against stupidity in ToS. As a mod for other forums, I've run into threads which were started while I was staring at the back of my eyelids...and those turned into massive blowups quickly.
    ROLL TIDE ROLL

    Great Weapon Fighter: Because when is today not a good day to die?

    PC and PS4 player. Proud Guildmaster for PS4 Team Fencebane. Rank 5 Officer for PC Team Fencebane. Visit us at http://fencebane.shivtr.com
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    katbozejziemikatbozejziemi Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 856 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    sockmunkey wrote: »
    Report them for what? There is no rule, expressed or implied, concerning looting. Technically ninja looting is not against any Cryptic rule. Sure its rude, anti-social, and selfish. But unless it violates a rule, reporting is useless. And naming and shaming is, more likely then not, going to get the namer in more trouble then the looter.
    Without limiting the foregoing, in addition to the User Content rules set forth in Section 10 above, you agree not to take any of the following actions:
    (n) Take any action that disrupts the Service or that negatively affects or may prohibit other users from enjoying the Website, the Games or any other aspect of the Service.
    Checkmate.
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    incunabulumincunabulum Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    rickfrank wrote: »
    I think someone should look into this forum policy. Not having a community availible means of posting a blacklist of ninja lootes party droppers and group kickers is bad for the community.

    Awareness is the number one tool players have to combatt these poor behaviors in mmos and having these forums restricted in that manner is,and will continue to hurt the community.

    Please allow us to police our servers using these forums.

    Well there's absolutely nothing stopping you from creating your own website to host a blacklist on. Blogspot offers free blogging and commenting software.
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    reilz1981reilz1981 Member Posts: 512 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    lets make an ingame channel for reporting them then we can add the worst offenders to our ignore no rule against that is there?
    Actual Join date: Dec 2007
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    flowsharianflowsharian Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 34
    edited May 2013
    edge1986 wrote: »
    Then what stops me from lying and saying you are a ninja looter and should be blacklisted?

    That's why it isn't allowed.

    People pointing out that person that is reporting incorrectly, it's not hard.
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    flowsharianflowsharian Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 34
    edited May 2013
    Checkmate.

    ...And being able to report someone for spam whether they have or not, effectively silencing them globally on the game, yeah, uh Double Chec-Chec-Check Mate?
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    rictrasrictras Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 239 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    People pointing out that person that is reporting incorrectly, it's not hard.

    It would be one persons word versus another. We would usually not know which person is telling the truth.
    The meaning of life, is to give life meaning.
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    grtaylorgrtaylor Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 35
    edited May 2013
    mconosrep wrote: »
    That's all the proof we need - burn him!

    She's a witch, can we burn her?
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    elessymelessym Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    People pointing out that person that is reporting incorrectly, it's not hard.

    You have to realize that something like 90% of players never go to the forums. That means that in the vast majority of cases players aren't going to know that they have to come here to defend themselves.
    "Participation in PVP-related activities is so low on an hourly, daily, weekly, and monthly basis that we could in fact just completely take it out of STO and it would not impact the overall number of people [who] log in to the game and play in any significant way." -Gozer, Cryptic PvP Dev
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