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Please do some class balancing ASAP - it's killing the game!
ioannides5
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
I just read the "state of the game article" (found here: http://nw.perfectworld.com/news/?p=896631), and could not be more disgusted or disappointed.
Class balance should be the #1 topic you should be addressing! Hell, 2 out of the 5 current classes in the game, are utterly useless. Just read your own forums, at least 50% of the posts are people blowing up in disappointment over the horrible class balance, and even extremely thought out suggestions on how to fix the situation.
As if you haven't heard it enough, here it is again, MAKE THE GF AND GWF VIABLE PLEASE!!!
GF- suppose to be the tank of the game, yet they can't hold threat if their life depended on it, and get out-performed tremendously by running double cleric.
GWF- apparently suppose to be a damage-dealing class, yet the damage they produce is well.. less then useful. Seriously, they are NOT an offtank, so people really need to stop saying they are, the whole goal of a GWF is to deal damage, just like the rogue, yet we can't. What I don't understand is, the GWF wields 2-handed weapons; isn't the whole purpose of a 2h class to deal STRONG, hard-hitting attacks? I understand that the idea of a rogue generally should produce more "DPS", otherwise know as damage over a period of time, compared to a 2-hand user, but shouldn't the 2-hand user hit harder PER attack?... IS THAT NOT THE WHOLE PURPOSE OF A 2-HANDED WEAPON? Rogues should be producing more dps with more frequent attacks, but on here they not only attack incredibly faster, but are also hitting incredibly harder per attack.. totally defeats the **** purpose of a 2-handed class and leads to incredibly imbalance.
The worse part is, there's been so many suggestions, that will make class balance incredibly better, already posted on these forums.. EASY to fix ones too, yet still nothing has been done. In case you need yet ANOTHER reminder, here they are:
1)Improve GF threat. This 1 speaks for it's self, GF not only cannot hold threat from clerics, but also from rogues due to their outrageous damage.. kind of makes the class useless, no?
2)Reduce threat from healing. It's next to impossible to take threat from a cleric, it's actually pretty broken and stupid. No, not "hard" or "challenging", just stupid.
3)The biggest issue for GF's currently (and I would say for pvp also), MAKE PRIEST'S CIRCLES NOT STACK!!. Who ever was the Einstein that thought letting circles stack was fair or a good idea, should really reconsider their role in game design. Whether it be ANY pve dungeon, or pvp for that matter, it's basically a "meta" to role with 2 clerics... Let me ask you, what kind of game design is that? Requiring to stack up on 1 particular class? In no way shape or form should the cleric circles stack at all with each other. Period.
4)This one may seem a shocker to a few people, but DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT reduce TR damage (from PvE standpoint, they're really quite ridiculous in PvP currently), all this will do is bring up a sea full of tears from the rogue community because they may actually have to "try" just to bring in that incredibly high damage. On the flip-side, the change you DO need to make, is increase GWF damage. That's all there is to it. GWF's are a damage-dealing class that deal absolutely <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> damage. 2 biggest issues seem to be a) their at-wills dealing next to no damage at all (this is the biggest issue towards GWFs being useless, IMHO), and b) the over-all power conversion on all their abilities. Like previously mentioned, they wield a flipping 2-h weapon.. they SHOULD hit like a truck, not a wet-noodle covered in the softest feathers you've ever seen. Should rogues deal more DPS then GWF? Yes, of course. Should rogues deal more DAMAGE PER ATTACK then GWF? Absolutely not. Their dps should come from frequent attacks, get it right please. CW's are in a good spot right now.. they do decent damage, but strength comes from the huge CC capabilities they have.. GWFS ONLY deal damage.. yet they can't even do that effectively.
Now, why is all this a big issue? Play a GF or GWF and you'll understand. Currently no GFs or GWFs are being invited to dungeon groups... the only thing you see are 2DC/2TR/1CW, or 2DC/1TR/2CW. The only way you'll do dungeons as a GF or GWF, is if 1) you're doing it with a group of friends/guildies who are kind of enough to tag you along, or 2) you start the group yourself.. which still can be so much hassle as no one wants to party with a GF or GWF. These issues should have been addressed and taken care of already, but they're not... and it's killing your game.
Class balance should be the #1 topic you should be addressing! Hell, 2 out of the 5 current classes in the game, are utterly useless. Just read your own forums, at least 50% of the posts are people blowing up in disappointment over the horrible class balance, and even extremely thought out suggestions on how to fix the situation.
As if you haven't heard it enough, here it is again, MAKE THE GF AND GWF VIABLE PLEASE!!!
GF- suppose to be the tank of the game, yet they can't hold threat if their life depended on it, and get out-performed tremendously by running double cleric.
GWF- apparently suppose to be a damage-dealing class, yet the damage they produce is well.. less then useful. Seriously, they are NOT an offtank, so people really need to stop saying they are, the whole goal of a GWF is to deal damage, just like the rogue, yet we can't. What I don't understand is, the GWF wields 2-handed weapons; isn't the whole purpose of a 2h class to deal STRONG, hard-hitting attacks? I understand that the idea of a rogue generally should produce more "DPS", otherwise know as damage over a period of time, compared to a 2-hand user, but shouldn't the 2-hand user hit harder PER attack?... IS THAT NOT THE WHOLE PURPOSE OF A 2-HANDED WEAPON? Rogues should be producing more dps with more frequent attacks, but on here they not only attack incredibly faster, but are also hitting incredibly harder per attack.. totally defeats the **** purpose of a 2-handed class and leads to incredibly imbalance.
The worse part is, there's been so many suggestions, that will make class balance incredibly better, already posted on these forums.. EASY to fix ones too, yet still nothing has been done. In case you need yet ANOTHER reminder, here they are:
1)Improve GF threat. This 1 speaks for it's self, GF not only cannot hold threat from clerics, but also from rogues due to their outrageous damage.. kind of makes the class useless, no?
2)Reduce threat from healing. It's next to impossible to take threat from a cleric, it's actually pretty broken and stupid. No, not "hard" or "challenging", just stupid.
3)The biggest issue for GF's currently (and I would say for pvp also), MAKE PRIEST'S CIRCLES NOT STACK!!. Who ever was the Einstein that thought letting circles stack was fair or a good idea, should really reconsider their role in game design. Whether it be ANY pve dungeon, or pvp for that matter, it's basically a "meta" to role with 2 clerics... Let me ask you, what kind of game design is that? Requiring to stack up on 1 particular class? In no way shape or form should the cleric circles stack at all with each other. Period.
4)This one may seem a shocker to a few people, but DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT reduce TR damage (from PvE standpoint, they're really quite ridiculous in PvP currently), all this will do is bring up a sea full of tears from the rogue community because they may actually have to "try" just to bring in that incredibly high damage. On the flip-side, the change you DO need to make, is increase GWF damage. That's all there is to it. GWF's are a damage-dealing class that deal absolutely <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> damage. 2 biggest issues seem to be a) their at-wills dealing next to no damage at all (this is the biggest issue towards GWFs being useless, IMHO), and b) the over-all power conversion on all their abilities. Like previously mentioned, they wield a flipping 2-h weapon.. they SHOULD hit like a truck, not a wet-noodle covered in the softest feathers you've ever seen. Should rogues deal more DPS then GWF? Yes, of course. Should rogues deal more DAMAGE PER ATTACK then GWF? Absolutely not. Their dps should come from frequent attacks, get it right please. CW's are in a good spot right now.. they do decent damage, but strength comes from the huge CC capabilities they have.. GWFS ONLY deal damage.. yet they can't even do that effectively.
Now, why is all this a big issue? Play a GF or GWF and you'll understand. Currently no GFs or GWFs are being invited to dungeon groups... the only thing you see are 2DC/2TR/1CW, or 2DC/1TR/2CW. The only way you'll do dungeons as a GF or GWF, is if 1) you're doing it with a group of friends/guildies who are kind of enough to tag you along, or 2) you start the group yourself.. which still can be so much hassle as no one wants to party with a GF or GWF. These issues should have been addressed and taken care of already, but they're not... and it's killing your game.
Post edited by ioannides5 on
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But then again, it assigned me as group leader first haha.
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
If we're supposed to be tanks, even offtanks, we need to be able to stand up to incoming damage without moving away. If we can't stand in the middle of the mobs and AoE them, our ability to draw them in is devalued. We need some kind of parry maneuver, I think, to replace the 'run away' mechanic. If you've successfully surrounded yourself with mobs it doesn't work anyways.
While a small buff to aoe damage would be nice, buffing a few single target abilities (sure strike) by a moderate amount would give us more use in most fights, while not encroaching on the TR's role. It would also smooth out the lower level struggle a bit.
We also lack in our off-tanking abilities, because of the current threat system, peeling anything off a cleric is rare. Im sure that will change in the future, at the cost of our survivability. I say that because while we have a statistically higher defenses, we lack any real way to mitigate damage.
Sprint is our main active defense and is highly ineffective when used as such. It grants a comparable amount of distance traveled as other dodge mechanics, but lacks any damage immunity and takes longer to move out of the way of attacks. Couple this with latency, and you end up getting lag-smacked around even when you are far out of range client side.
Trading Sprint for Punishing Charge would help significantly. Punishing charge gives the GWF everything that sprint does, and is superior in doing the job that sprint should in every way. We just should not have to waste an encounter slot for an ability that every other class gets for free. The pittance of damage it does would be a bonus.
too much aoe and constant dodging for the melee classes.
i'm definitely gonna shelf my tr and go ranged dps till they fix it.
Why on earth would u shelf a TR? Even playing only 1/2 the dungeon, TRs can easily out dps any class.
All you did was prove my point. Point is, all this **** should have been looked at weeks ago.
You are to blame. Quit playing the victim.
I want this class in NW.
Why on earth would you bring a GWF for add duty? you know they have a 5 hit max with abilities... with diminishing returns, add in the fact that they do pitiful damage and have to be hit to use their mechanic just grab a CW and aoe/cc it up.
At least caveat it with "He's our friend" or "We like to punish ourselves".
Its a huge pain when you played your GF from day 1 and you reach a certain degree where you just need to get those final weapon sets at the moment but end up feeling totally USELESS due to the imbalance on classes.
And yeah, dual astral shield stacking is just STUPID.
Also, from what I remember of 4e rules Mark was supposed to have all these punishment aspects attached (fight me or else type stuff), I mean where is the baseline damage reduction? (-2 attack rolls) or the Attacks of Opportunity?
Without that stuff mark is an extremely lackluster version of itself. I have no problems with adjusting to the 4e model of threat, but they need to follow the rules and not toss out all the stuff that makes it work.
According to what I remember of the 4e rules of marks, the marked target should basically take 100% weapon damage when it performs an attack that doesn't include the defender as long as the defender is relatively close. So mark itself reduces damage output of the target by 10% or so, and when they hit stuff other than defender they are asking to get plowed.
Biggest thing is they need to make the mark stop going away the second they do damage to the defender, or give a way to make the mark a bit more sticky. Targets need to actually be scared of not attacking the defender. In pvp a rogue gets marked and is still attacking the wizard instead of swapping to the defender? He just dug his own grave.
sorry for my english guys but i'm on phone and i'm not english XP
And trying to protect your Cleric in Dungeons is a mini game in itself.
In dungeons I have been to top of damage with every class so it seems to me that some people just haven't realized the full potential of their class.
Whenever I get in a group that are all very well experienced in their classes the dungeons are too easy.
pretty much nailed it
lol...no comment
Sigh you're only level 20, therefor you have absolutely no idea what the hell you are talking about. Get to level 60, start doing T2s, and watch as you will never be invited to a group as a GWF or GF. Then come back to this thread, and revise your post please.
I have been involved with game design and developement for over thirty years ...
I have play tested games with TSR and NES ...
no offense but ... devs have more important things to do than to sift through 30,000+ posts for one or two good ideas
most people think their idea is good or even great ... without even thinking on the impact of the game ...
i see most of the complaints about the fighter classes ... simply making them more resistant to damage and adding knockdown effects to their attacks, would bring them back into the game ...
increasing their damage only causes a need to scale everything up even more ...
which causes a cheesing effect on game play ...