Well, to me, PVP serves no reason other than 1000 AD every day. So, I wouldn't really care if they got rid of it to be honest... think they said in the metrics study that the vast majority of the players play PVE exclusively. So it seems I'm not alone either...
If this is their claim its very likely suspect or perhaps you read their data wrong.
Almost every breakdown I've ever seen of games that offer both goes something to the effect of slightly more people solely play pve versus those who purely pvp but the vast majority participate at least somewhat in both.
I think the problem mostly is a player problem and not a game problem...and perhaps problem is not the proper word. Players that are competitive have different expectations of the game than those that are purely cooperative. Its different to try to play solely say to have fun versus trying to be the best or win.
And generally I'd argue though this is going more into the realm of opinion is that skilled players are going to come from and be from a more PVP oriented background. Whether its from making a cleaner UI or min maxing skillsets character performance is pushed over other goals like personal preference or roleplaying and this means of playing rubs some people the wrong way.
1) Every MMO that I have played that tried to mix pvp with pve ended up an unbalanced mess.
There's a very good solution that other games have been using for years, which is to have separate values for powers in PVP and PVE. Not separate powers, just separate values. For example, let's say you have a fireball spell. In PVE that spell does damage X, while in PVP it does damage Y. There are two copies of the values for damage, duration, etc. so they can be tweaked separately and balancing one doesn't affect the other at all.
Cryptic seems to have a strong resistance to using solutions that already exist and are known to be good. It's absurd that they have a ninja-friendly bare bones NBG for loot when it is known to be problematic, and people have already solved those problems. Likewise, it's silly not to use the simple measure described above so that PVP and PVE can be tuned separately and no one gets hurt.
One boggles.
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lasto33Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 13Arc User
edited May 2013
Even in the first days of the first edition of D&D--for some Chainmail--there were times when, usually some thief, because of alignment would turn on one or more players in the group and kick his/her butt or kill them in their sleep. Of course that's what people got for grouping with a Chaotic Evil thief. So, what this game truly is missing as far as D&D--the true D&D--goes is alignment. We also had a mini-game later on that included arena fights, so PvP is part of D&D remembering that true D&D was whatever the people playing--Dungeon Master--wanted to add into the mix. [ah, for the sweet days of actually using your own imagination rather than fixating on these so-called cannons.] Let the game evolve.
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calaminthaMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
It's their metrics, not mine. I'm not sure why they would lie about something like that. They stated pretty plainly that the vast majority of the playerbase is exclusively PVE.
I bet that has nothing to do with how "awesome" PvP is in Cryptic's games.
Its Dungeons and Dragons not LOL its all about adventuring as a team I dont even understand why PvP is in this game in the first place >.> The dev time used on PvP could be used to fix stuff like the AH and GWF.
Dont get me wrong I play things like Dota2 and TF2 I like a good player vs player fight now and then but I think its just wasted time here.
Of course this is just my opinion.
Your right they should let it be open pvp that way it be more dd its just friendly fire... enjoy trying to queue while a 15k gf is hitting you... in town..
FearITsSelf#1 GF From #1 Guild Pve/Pvp [ Lemonade Stand ]
It's their metrics, not mine. I'm not sure why they would lie about something like that. They stated pretty plainly that the vast majority of the playerbase is exclusively PVE.
Then to be honest I'd question their measure. Since it would be different than almost every MMO that I've seen data on. As well as their data with the game being truly open hasn't had much time to be measured. Once you get most characters to cap and geared people will play competitive PVP if its rewarding in some fashion whether it be fun or prestige.
I'd say that PVE has significantly more class balance issues than PVP currently it can be fun to even play a GF in PVP but that class is almost a waste of space in PVE for example and thats not the fault of any PVP system.
As well its an impossible people problem to fix that the quickest lowest effort path to result will always be taken. If its foundry quests for xp then that will be, if its PVP it will be that, if its running two clerics and no tank in PVE its that. This is why people feel at some points compelled to play pvp even though its self created compulsion.
And far be it from me to criticize making a buck because profit certainly isn't a dirty word but if making the credit card server run fluidly for microtransactions is a priority one issue and class balance to at least making the classes somewhat comparable is not then there will likely never be balanced gameplay and competitive players will take the stongest class of the moment no matter what for both PVP and PVE.
I thought I'd completed a pretty big challenge when I finished my 52 week baking marathon earlier this year, but that seems like a walk in the park compared to this weekends creation! I first came across a Patience Cake on the blog Confections of a (Closet) Master Baker. It's written by Gesine Bullock-Prado who as well as being a whizz with all things sugar, also happens to be Sandra Bullock's sister! I remember being in awe of it, promising myself I would have a go at it at some point so I took the plunge...
It's an American recipe so I've converted the quantities from cups, I also changed the flavours from pomegranate & key lime to blueberry & vanilla. I just wanted to share a few highlights of my experience. This is not a cake you can just 'knock up', it took me around 4 hours from start to finish, so you do need an awful lot of patience & when you read the ingredients list, your own chicken could also prove useful!
So deep breath, are you ready? Here goes....
First off you need to make the cakes, you need 2 layers of each flavour so you'll need double the quantities of ingredients listed here.
For the vanilla layers you'll also need 125ml milk & 125ml water mixed with the seeds from a vanilla pod.
For the blueberry layer I made a puree by gently heating 250g blueberries in a pan with 1tbsp sugar & a dash of water until they mush down. Pass it through a sieve to get rid of the bits, which should give you around 150ml, then top it up to 250ml with milk. It was a beautiful purple colour, then I added it to the cake mix & the cake mix was the colour of cement...not good! But I rescued it to something that looks edible with some red food colouring.
So by this point I had 4 layers of sponge cake, 2 vanilla & 2 blueberry, I left them to cool while I got on with making an epic quantity of frosting! Ingredients are...
600g caster sugar
250ml water
15 egg whites
Pinch of salt
900g butter
Few drops of red food colouring
So if you've been counting so far, that's 2 x 8 eggs for each batch of cakes plus 15 egg whites for the frosting, a massive 31 eggs in total, hence the chicken comment!
By this point, I'll be honest it was starting to turn into a 'I'm losing Patience Cake!' But no turning back, had to push on to construction & I did pick up a really helpful hint on how to evenly slice a cake into layers. Use a ruler to measure up the cake & pop in a cocktail stick at regular intervals so you end up with something looking like a UFO. Guide your knife using the markers & you'll be amazed at how even they end up!
With each layer sliced into three, I had twelve layers in total. The top layers I left to nibble on as they were too uneven to use, then I picked the four neatest & sandwiched them together alternately using the frosting. The cake went into the fridge for about an hour to allow the frosting to set.
To get a puzzle effect you would cut a crater out the middle, spread a thin layer of frosting inside the crater & over the top, add an extra layer to cover the hole, invert the whole cake, invert the chunk You've taken out & squish it back in the hole. Sounds simple doesn't it, but by this point it had turned into the 'I don't have the Patience for this Cake!'
Anyway, I'd got this far, had to get to the end....final thing was to cover the rather bashed looking cake with the remaining frosting.
I was frazzled & was now referring to it as 'this bl***y cake!' Anyway, I had a moment, drank a large glass of Rose & took another look at it. I was quite chuffed I'd done it! But I guess the final test was how it looked when I cut into it & most importantly how it tasted. So, did it look like Gesine's? No, but it didn't collapse into a heap of crumbs & I was quite pleased that I'd managed to create the general effect intended. It tasted nice, but if I'm honest considering the amount of time & ingredients that went into it I was expecting to be blown away. It's not as sweet as it looks, particularly the frosting which is a good thing, but I'm sorry to say I found it a bit on the bland side :-(
Anyway, mission accomplished, I have made a Patience Cake, it wasn't to my taste, but that's not to say you might love it! I'm going for a lie down to recover!
its stupid that you can farm so much glory in 1h to buy a few equipment parts that make T1 complete useless...
Remove the lvl 60 Epic Glory items or remove PvP i would be happy with both :P
So you want to remove a quick in game pathway to starter epic gear.
However its ok that you can spend real money without ever setting foot in a dungeon to kit out in the best gear in the game in less time?
I don't see how PVP is worse than that. Arguably its better in that no matter how much you hate it or suck you eventually will get your epics from merely participating.
Could require a certain winning percentage or rating to get the epic PVP gear and that would knock out anyone that was merely playing to get gear and not trying, but I am sure there'd be quite a bit of crying about that solution.
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jpnoleMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Its Dungeons and Dragons not LOL its all about adventuring as a team I dont even understand why PvP is in this game in the first place >.> The dev time used on PvP could be used to fix stuff like the AH and GWF.
Dont get me wrong I play things like Dota2 and TF2 I like a good player vs player fight now and then but I think its just wasted time here.
Of course this is just my opinion.
Thank GOD it's just your opinion! The reason I do PVP is because you level WAY faster. I think it's right around 5 matches per level, win or lose. Plus you can take the earned glory and buy a purple PVP set when you hit 60. It's about as good as the T1 sets, some even say it's better. You can actually earn enough glory to get the full set if you only PVP from 40 on. Also, if you really want to learn to play a class, try honing your skills against a fellow human. There's no challenge like it!
All that said, I love my PVE, always have and always will. It's just that I'm crunched for gaming time in RL and I need the best XP bang for my buck.
OP:Everyone has the right to express his/her opinion.In this case my opinion is the opposite of yours.I never was a great PvP fighter in MMO games which i played.Always focused on the PWE content but for some reason i can honestly say this is the first MMO which gives me fun when i play PvP.First my approach was the same as usual:-meh PvP i won't even touch it,and to be honest still this would be the case if i wouldn't get my first daily PvP quest.
I was:-oh d*** great i have to PvP just to get more money.First i was thought i'll just drop PvP but ofc money is a great motivator (and also greed ).So i started my first match as a complete n*** with the mentality: no problem i'll be everyone's punch bag i'm only here for the money anyway .As the match started i just jumped into the arena with the losers calm.It happend what was expected,got butchered fast lol.It was a bit boring to jump in and get killed so just for fun and to avoid boredom i started to fight back.First just smaller attacks without any logic but slowly i got the feeling of it,even the fact that i still got killed in every encounter.Imagine my surprise when i won my fisrt encounter in a 1vs1 situation,when it wasn't even my intention .
This immediately changed my viewpoint and i said to myself:-hey if i could beat this guy maybe i can beat others too.I don't have to mention since then i'm having a blast in PvP matches.I'm enjoying it with or without the daily money,despite the fact that my lose ratio is still higher than my win ratio lol.I don't really care if i lose or win the point is to have fun and enjoy the match .So no i don't think they should remove it.
Thx for listening
A valid point. BUT being a long term D&D player I think in my opinion that PvP has no place here. Remember PvP wont be cut this is all theoretical it just seems to me this game should be the last place for PvP.
Of course many others will think differently.
I simply ignore the existence of the PvP part. It does not interest me in the slightest.
This will work out on itself. It simply depends later, from which corner of the game they will get more replies, to add or change something.
Thank GOD it's just your opinion! The reason I do PVP is because you level WAY faster. I think it's right around 5 matches per level, win or lose. Plus you can take the earned glory and buy a purple PVP set when you hit 60. It's about as good as the T1 sets, some even say it's better. You can actually earn enough glory to get the full set if you only PVP from 40 on. Also, if you really want to learn to play a class, try honing your skills against a fellow human. There's no challenge like it!
That's right. This is even an old saying in pen & paper Ad&D. There is no worse enemy, than a second player party.
Its Dungeons and Dragons not LOL its all about adventuring as a team I dont even understand why PvP is in this game in the first place >.> The dev time used on PvP could be used to fix stuff like the AH and GWF.
Dont get me wrong I play things like Dota2 and TF2 I like a good player vs player fight now and then but I think its just wasted time here.
Of course this is just my opinion.
I don't think it should be removed, Nepht, but I don't also think it's a core element of this game. People should accept this game being PvE oriented, at least in it's current state.
I don't mind some PvP options, but let's not demand the game to be completely PvP centric or even make it a core mechanic, as many players (I'd like to think I speak for many, feel free to digress) such as myself who are D&D fans didn't came to this came expecting a Smite, a League of Legends or a GW2 Arena. No open world PvPs, no PvP centric balance changes (I think it could be awesome if some changes for PvP only affected PvP, but I don't know if it's technically possible).
It's only my opinion though.
Characters: - Titania Silverblade, the Iron Rose of Myth Drannor (Lvl 60 GWF, Destroyer) - Gwyneth, the Cowardly Cat Burglar Drowling (Lvl 60 TR, Saboteur) - Lady Rowanne Firehair, Heartwarder of Sune (Lvl 33 DC) - Satella, Sensate (LvL 44 CW, Renegade, Non-Active)
I have to say I also think as a D&D title, PvP should not be a priority. I understand that it is included because people expect MMOs to have it, and it certainly expands the player base... but I think trying to balance D&D classes makes them feel very un-D&D-like. That said, its not just PvP that causes these not-very-D&D-like design choices to be made... it's also that when trying to create content for the diverse player base a MMO requires to be financially viable, inevitably even the PvE content is ultimately designed to at least provide some challenge to even the most optimally built character. These design choices also mean that characters must be limited in what powers and equipment are available to them, because otherwise player balance is wildly unpredictable.
In a lot of pencil and paper D&D, characters are vehicles for telling stories (in my opinion). Customisation and building your character's powers to reflect their personality and back story are all part of the rich and immersive experience. A wizard might choose only fire-based powers, even if ice powers would actually have been more useful to the party, or perhaps a fighter who chooses to use a quarterstaff rather than a sword because they fight for defense rather than to kill, or a cleric who only chooses powers that are thematically related to their deity (or equipment, a good cleric would never use equipment sacred to a deity they opposed, no matter how much better it was than their current equipment). But creating an interesting (and flawed) character is a higher priority to me than being the most efficient. In an MMO, such a character is likely to be ridiculed by other players as not knowing "how to play the game" and also probably not be able to compete in areas such as PvP or (far more importantly to me) high-end PvE content.
I'm not complaining about it, as I recognise the genre has certain standards and expectations. But there is always a part of me that will be disappointed about the parts of this game that just don't feel like D&D.
Reading this I thought about a situation I had in Pen & paper AD&D. A new player to my group, thought, he could be do all what he wants, because group don't fight with themselves. What he did not realised was, that he had to roleplay properly to be accepted by the others, or they would roleplay the conflict with all their possibilties at hand.
To make a long story short, the elven bard really annoyed the human barbarian of the group. They had a "discusion" in the game envirement, and after that, the barbarian had a new pair of elven skin gloves. He thought it would give him resistance against ghoul touches.
The new player quit after that, and said "Groups should not fight themselves in AD&D". I thought about that too, and said. "It's all about roleplaying."
Sometimes I wish, you can have such attitute adjustment tools in Neverwinter, too. As example for the player who always select need instead of greed. A little PvP session from the rest of the group, to change their minds about being unpolite and greedy. A learning through pain experience could not hurt in these cases.
If there was no PvP. I wouldn't play this game. PvP in the end is what keeps me in games. There has to be some. Not only that I am loving the PvP so far. Have 2 toons I am lvling. Both builds are strictly geared for PvP and killing. PvE is fun and love groups but its 2nd for me. I only get gear to PvP with in any game I play. No point in great gear if you can't kill someone with it.
Reading this I thought about a situation I had in Pen & paper AD&D. A new player to my group, thought, he could be do all what he wants, because group don't fight with themselves. What he did not realised was, that he had to roleplay properly to be accepted by the others, or they would roleplay the conflict with all their possibilties at hand.
Yeah this is where I actually think PvP makes sense in D&D - where there are in-character reasons for them to fight. That doesn't however mean that their classes should be balanced for it to be "fair". A barbarian hacking into a bard is very likely to win, unless the bard happens to be a higher level. Cooperative storytelling does not have to equal everyone always getting along, and in many ways it is more interesting if they do not!
Well, to me, PVP serves no reason other than 1000 AD every day. So, I wouldn't really care if they got rid of it to be honest... think they said in the metrics study that the vast majority of the players play PVE exclusively. So it seems I'm not alone either...
It was said in STO. Devs responded to PVP complaints by calling the community "insignificant" and only about 1% of the total population. Now, granted, this was a year into the game. And after Cryptic drove off most of the PVPers to begin with. There was even talk about removing PVP all together, or at the very least most of the zones and battlefields that were the source of majority of the problems. I believe the only reason they decided against that, was they realised it was simply less work to do absolutely nothing and let it die on its own.
I would chalk this up as a one off incident, but similar statements where made in CO as well. And its own PVP was left to rot in a half finished state. The "On Alert" expansion removed all the purchasable items from their version of the glory vendor. To date, over a year later, there are currently only two items available to buy with their version of glory. With no plans, at all, of ever returning rewards for PVP back to the game. You cant even earn Questionite (Astral Diamonds) via PVP over there.
So yes, Cryptic has, in fact, stated that the PVP population is tiny. But it could be argued they engineer it to be that way. By driving the PVP population off.
I have never understand why so many people in the gaming community feel it is their place to trash talk others. Why can posters not respond respectfully to someone's opinion?
I am not really into PVP either, nepht. I probably will do some PVP in this though since it is group. I just never 1v1 people. There is too much of the "I'm so awesome in a video game (that proves nothing in real life" attitude. Also, everyone starts yelling "hacker!!" when someone wins.
Its Dungeons and Dragons not LOL its all about adventuring as a team I dont even understand why PvP is in this game in the first place >.> The dev time used on PvP could be used to fix stuff like the AH and GWF.
Dont get me wrong I play things like Dota2 and TF2 I like a good player vs player fight now and then but I think its just wasted time here.
Of course this is just my opinion.
"Opinions are like <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. Everybody's got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks."
Its Dungeons and Dragons not LOL its all about adventuring as a team I dont even understand why PvP is in this game in the first place >.> The dev time used on PvP could be used to fix stuff like the AH and GWF.
Dont get me wrong I play things like Dota2 and TF2 I like a good player vs player fight now and then but I think its just wasted time here.
Of course this is just my opinion.
from my PoV, it have only have "PvP domination" mode which is 5v5 and one more mode at lvl 60, CMIIW, plus you loose but you still got the Glory Point, so this is not the main feature, you can go through the game without touching it, so it's ok so far.
Yeah this is where I actually think PvP makes sense in D&D - where there are in-character reasons for them to fight. That doesn't however mean that their classes should be balanced for it to be "fair". A barbarian hacking into a bard is very likely to win, unless the bard happens to be a higher level. Cooperative storytelling does not have to equal everyone always getting along, and in many ways it is more interesting if they do not!
I had a similar experience in my group. The group was faced with a very tough choice. On one hand they could take the hard choice that would most likely spell a heroic death for everyone involved. On the surface it seemed to be suicide and they'd be putting their lives and success in the hands of those they've helped before. Still, it would not be easy and they were in a jam on how to successfully pull it off. Then there was the easy rode which would surely enable them to survive and succeed at the cost of thousands of innocent's lives. Two players were neutral on the decision made. The other two.. were at completely different ends. One didn't want to put innocent lives at risk, he wanted to put his faith in the people they've helped in the past just as they put their faith in the group.
He felt that it was their duty to try and if it meant dying then so be it. They'd die fighting well. The other player on the other hand was of the opinion that "They've done enough as is" for the world at large. They've done so much for the city, the people, and the world itself they were able to make at least one harsh choice. He pointed out the amount of lives saved would offset the amount of lives lost and that through their ensured survival they could do more for the world. He believed that he was making the most logical choice.
After a heated in character argument (it didn't spill over OOC this group knew each other well) his character decided he was going to do it with or without the approval of the group. Which resulted in the barbarian (the guy who wanted to save all lives if possible) beating said player's character to an inch of his life. Good example of pvp in D&D.
Comments
Almost every breakdown I've ever seen of games that offer both goes something to the effect of slightly more people solely play pve versus those who purely pvp but the vast majority participate at least somewhat in both.
I think the problem mostly is a player problem and not a game problem...and perhaps problem is not the proper word. Players that are competitive have different expectations of the game than those that are purely cooperative. Its different to try to play solely say to have fun versus trying to be the best or win.
And generally I'd argue though this is going more into the realm of opinion is that skilled players are going to come from and be from a more PVP oriented background. Whether its from making a cleaner UI or min maxing skillsets character performance is pushed over other goals like personal preference or roleplaying and this means of playing rubs some people the wrong way.
There's a very good solution that other games have been using for years, which is to have separate values for powers in PVP and PVE. Not separate powers, just separate values. For example, let's say you have a fireball spell. In PVE that spell does damage X, while in PVP it does damage Y. There are two copies of the values for damage, duration, etc. so they can be tweaked separately and balancing one doesn't affect the other at all.
Cryptic seems to have a strong resistance to using solutions that already exist and are known to be good. It's absurd that they have a ninja-friendly bare bones NBG for loot when it is known to be problematic, and people have already solved those problems. Likewise, it's silly not to use the simple measure described above so that PVP and PVE can be tuned separately and no one gets hurt.
One boggles.
I bet that has nothing to do with how "awesome" PvP is in Cryptic's games.
Your right they should let it be open pvp that way it be more dd its just friendly fire... enjoy trying to queue while a 15k gf is hitting you... in town..
From #1 Guild Pve/Pvp [ Lemonade Stand ]
Then to be honest I'd question their measure. Since it would be different than almost every MMO that I've seen data on. As well as their data with the game being truly open hasn't had much time to be measured. Once you get most characters to cap and geared people will play competitive PVP if its rewarding in some fashion whether it be fun or prestige.
I'd say that PVE has significantly more class balance issues than PVP currently it can be fun to even play a GF in PVP but that class is almost a waste of space in PVE for example and thats not the fault of any PVP system.
As well its an impossible people problem to fix that the quickest lowest effort path to result will always be taken. If its foundry quests for xp then that will be, if its PVP it will be that, if its running two clerics and no tank in PVE its that. This is why people feel at some points compelled to play pvp even though its self created compulsion.
And far be it from me to criticize making a buck because profit certainly isn't a dirty word but if making the credit card server run fluidly for microtransactions is a priority one issue and class balance to at least making the classes somewhat comparable is not then there will likely never be balanced gameplay and competitive players will take the stongest class of the moment no matter what for both PVP and PVE.
Remove the lvl 60 Epic Glory items or remove PvP i would be happy with both :P
It's an American recipe so I've converted the quantities from cups, I also changed the flavours from pomegranate & key lime to blueberry & vanilla. I just wanted to share a few highlights of my experience. This is not a cake you can just 'knock up', it took me around 4 hours from start to finish, so you do need an awful lot of patience & when you read the ingredients list, your own chicken could also prove useful!
So deep breath, are you ready? Here goes....
First off you need to make the cakes, you need 2 layers of each flavour so you'll need double the quantities of ingredients listed here.
420g plain flour
300g caster sugar
8 eggs
150ml vegetable oil
1 tsp salt
4tsp baking powder
For the vanilla layers you'll also need 125ml milk & 125ml water mixed with the seeds from a vanilla pod.
For the blueberry layer I made a puree by gently heating 250g blueberries in a pan with 1tbsp sugar & a dash of water until they mush down. Pass it through a sieve to get rid of the bits, which should give you around 150ml, then top it up to 250ml with milk. It was a beautiful purple colour, then I added it to the cake mix & the cake mix was the colour of cement...not good! But I rescued it to something that looks edible with some red food colouring.
So by this point I had 4 layers of sponge cake, 2 vanilla & 2 blueberry, I left them to cool while I got on with making an epic quantity of frosting! Ingredients are...
600g caster sugar
250ml water
15 egg whites
Pinch of salt
900g butter
Few drops of red food colouring
So if you've been counting so far, that's 2 x 8 eggs for each batch of cakes plus 15 egg whites for the frosting, a massive 31 eggs in total, hence the chicken comment!
By this point, I'll be honest it was starting to turn into a 'I'm losing Patience Cake!' But no turning back, had to push on to construction & I did pick up a really helpful hint on how to evenly slice a cake into layers. Use a ruler to measure up the cake & pop in a cocktail stick at regular intervals so you end up with something looking like a UFO. Guide your knife using the markers & you'll be amazed at how even they end up!
With each layer sliced into three, I had twelve layers in total. The top layers I left to nibble on as they were too uneven to use, then I picked the four neatest & sandwiched them together alternately using the frosting. The cake went into the fridge for about an hour to allow the frosting to set.
To get a puzzle effect you would cut a crater out the middle, spread a thin layer of frosting inside the crater & over the top, add an extra layer to cover the hole, invert the whole cake, invert the chunk You've taken out & squish it back in the hole. Sounds simple doesn't it, but by this point it had turned into the 'I don't have the Patience for this Cake!'
Anyway, I'd got this far, had to get to the end....final thing was to cover the rather bashed looking cake with the remaining frosting.
I was frazzled & was now referring to it as 'this bl***y cake!' Anyway, I had a moment, drank a large glass of Rose & took another look at it. I was quite chuffed I'd done it! But I guess the final test was how it looked when I cut into it & most importantly how it tasted. So, did it look like Gesine's? No, but it didn't collapse into a heap of crumbs & I was quite pleased that I'd managed to create the general effect intended. It tasted nice, but if I'm honest considering the amount of time & ingredients that went into it I was expecting to be blown away. It's not as sweet as it looks, particularly the frosting which is a good thing, but I'm sorry to say I found it a bit on the bland side :-(
Anyway, mission accomplished, I have made a Patience Cake, it wasn't to my taste, but that's not to say you might love it! I'm going for a lie down to recover!
So you want to remove a quick in game pathway to starter epic gear.
However its ok that you can spend real money without ever setting foot in a dungeon to kit out in the best gear in the game in less time?
I don't see how PVP is worse than that. Arguably its better in that no matter how much you hate it or suck you eventually will get your epics from merely participating.
Could require a certain winning percentage or rating to get the epic PVP gear and that would knock out anyone that was merely playing to get gear and not trying, but I am sure there'd be quite a bit of crying about that solution.
Thank GOD it's just your opinion! The reason I do PVP is because you level WAY faster. I think it's right around 5 matches per level, win or lose. Plus you can take the earned glory and buy a purple PVP set when you hit 60. It's about as good as the T1 sets, some even say it's better. You can actually earn enough glory to get the full set if you only PVP from 40 on. Also, if you really want to learn to play a class, try honing your skills against a fellow human. There's no challenge like it!
All that said, I love my PVE, always have and always will. It's just that I'm crunched for gaming time in RL and I need the best XP bang for my buck.
I was:-oh d*** great i have to PvP just to get more money.First i was thought i'll just drop PvP but ofc money is a great motivator (and also greed
This immediately changed my viewpoint and i said to myself:-hey if i could beat this guy maybe i can beat others too.I don't have to mention since then i'm having a blast in PvP matches.I'm enjoying it with or without the daily money,despite the fact that my lose ratio is still higher than my win ratio lol.I don't really care if i lose or win the point is to have fun and enjoy the match
Thx for listening
I simply ignore the existence of the PvP part. It does not interest me in the slightest.
This will work out on itself. It simply depends later, from which corner of the game they will get more replies, to add or change something.
That's right. This is even an old saying in pen & paper Ad&D. There is no worse enemy, than a second player party.
I don't think it should be removed, Nepht, but I don't also think it's a core element of this game. People should accept this game being PvE oriented, at least in it's current state.
I don't mind some PvP options, but let's not demand the game to be completely PvP centric or even make it a core mechanic, as many players (I'd like to think I speak for many, feel free to digress) such as myself who are D&D fans didn't came to this came expecting a Smite, a League of Legends or a GW2 Arena. No open world PvPs, no PvP centric balance changes (I think it could be awesome if some changes for PvP only affected PvP, but I don't know if it's technically possible).
It's only my opinion though.
- Titania Silverblade, the Iron Rose of Myth Drannor (Lvl 60 GWF, Destroyer)
- Gwyneth, the Cowardly Cat Burglar Drowling (Lvl 60 TR, Saboteur)
- Lady Rowanne Firehair, Heartwarder of Sune (Lvl 33 DC)
- Satella, Sensate (LvL 44 CW, Renegade, Non-Active)
Check Steppenkat's Foundry Quest Reviews!
GWF is not broken.
CW and TR are broken.
The game is extremely easy, almost to the point of LFR in WoW. Nerfing their absurd damage or ability to knock stuff off cliffs is only a start.
PvP is also absurd when a TR can do over 25k damage in less than 3 second with nothing but throwing knives.
In a lot of pencil and paper D&D, characters are vehicles for telling stories (in my opinion). Customisation and building your character's powers to reflect their personality and back story are all part of the rich and immersive experience. A wizard might choose only fire-based powers, even if ice powers would actually have been more useful to the party, or perhaps a fighter who chooses to use a quarterstaff rather than a sword because they fight for defense rather than to kill, or a cleric who only chooses powers that are thematically related to their deity (or equipment, a good cleric would never use equipment sacred to a deity they opposed, no matter how much better it was than their current equipment). But creating an interesting (and flawed) character is a higher priority to me than being the most efficient. In an MMO, such a character is likely to be ridiculed by other players as not knowing "how to play the game" and also probably not be able to compete in areas such as PvP or (far more importantly to me) high-end PvE content.
I'm not complaining about it, as I recognise the genre has certain standards and expectations. But there is always a part of me that will be disappointed about the parts of this game that just don't feel like D&D.
To make a long story short, the elven bard really annoyed the human barbarian of the group. They had a "discusion" in the game envirement, and after that, the barbarian had a new pair of elven skin gloves. He thought it would give him resistance against ghoul touches.
The new player quit after that, and said "Groups should not fight themselves in AD&D". I thought about that too, and said. "It's all about roleplaying."
Sometimes I wish, you can have such attitute adjustment tools in Neverwinter, too. As example for the player who always select need instead of greed. A little PvP session from the rest of the group, to change their minds about being unpolite and greedy. A learning through pain experience could not hurt in these cases.
Yeah this is where I actually think PvP makes sense in D&D - where there are in-character reasons for them to fight. That doesn't however mean that their classes should be balanced for it to be "fair". A barbarian hacking into a bard is very likely to win, unless the bard happens to be a higher level. Cooperative storytelling does not have to equal everyone always getting along, and in many ways it is more interesting if they do not!
It was said in STO. Devs responded to PVP complaints by calling the community "insignificant" and only about 1% of the total population. Now, granted, this was a year into the game. And after Cryptic drove off most of the PVPers to begin with. There was even talk about removing PVP all together, or at the very least most of the zones and battlefields that were the source of majority of the problems. I believe the only reason they decided against that, was they realised it was simply less work to do absolutely nothing and let it die on its own.
I would chalk this up as a one off incident, but similar statements where made in CO as well. And its own PVP was left to rot in a half finished state. The "On Alert" expansion removed all the purchasable items from their version of the glory vendor. To date, over a year later, there are currently only two items available to buy with their version of glory. With no plans, at all, of ever returning rewards for PVP back to the game. You cant even earn Questionite (Astral Diamonds) via PVP over there.
So yes, Cryptic has, in fact, stated that the PVP population is tiny. But it could be argued they engineer it to be that way. By driving the PVP population off.
I am not really into PVP either, nepht. I probably will do some PVP in this though since it is group. I just never 1v1 people. There is too much of the "I'm so awesome in a video game (that proves nothing in real life" attitude. Also, everyone starts yelling "hacker!!" when someone wins.
"Opinions are like <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. Everybody's got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks."
from my PoV, it have only have "PvP domination" mode which is 5v5 and one more mode at lvl 60, CMIIW, plus you loose but you still got the Glory Point, so this is not the main feature, you can go through the game without touching it, so it's ok so far.
I had a similar experience in my group. The group was faced with a very tough choice. On one hand they could take the hard choice that would most likely spell a heroic death for everyone involved. On the surface it seemed to be suicide and they'd be putting their lives and success in the hands of those they've helped before. Still, it would not be easy and they were in a jam on how to successfully pull it off. Then there was the easy rode which would surely enable them to survive and succeed at the cost of thousands of innocent's lives. Two players were neutral on the decision made. The other two.. were at completely different ends. One didn't want to put innocent lives at risk, he wanted to put his faith in the people they've helped in the past just as they put their faith in the group.
He felt that it was their duty to try and if it meant dying then so be it. They'd die fighting well. The other player on the other hand was of the opinion that "They've done enough as is" for the world at large. They've done so much for the city, the people, and the world itself they were able to make at least one harsh choice. He pointed out the amount of lives saved would offset the amount of lives lost and that through their ensured survival they could do more for the world. He believed that he was making the most logical choice.
After a heated in character argument (it didn't spill over OOC this group knew each other well) his character decided he was going to do it with or without the approval of the group. Which resulted in the barbarian (the guy who wanted to save all lives if possible) beating said player's character to an inch of his life. Good example of pvp in D&D.