Everyone has given you their accounts, I'm not sure what else you want.
what else I want is to find out when someone says they did something- and I see something 100% the opposite in front of my very eyes., how on earth they managed it.
There is a lot of I did this without any details whatsoever. I don't in any way promote chargebacks. let that be said asap. if someone wants to /msg me with how they did it feel free.
Because PayPal will refund digital purchases if there is fraud involved, and most people who ask for refunds from PayPal invoke some colourful wording to imply that PWE was fraudulent in some way involving these digital purchases. Also PayPal doesn't say anything about not issuing refunds on digital purchases, it just says that there is no buyer or seller's insurance, you can still chargeback or demand a refund.
As to the 30 day waiting period, I have never actually heard of this, and have indeed had chargebacks go through in one business day. I think whoever you asked was lying to you, or you should rethink your bank of choice.
quote from paypall t+c
What’s not eligible? Buyer Protection does not cover certain kinds of purchases. These include: digital goods (intangible items), services, property, vehicles (of any kind), custom made items, airline travel, or items that violate our policies (stuff that’s usually prohibited by law anyway). Purchase Protection also does not cover items that you purchase in person, or money you send to friends and family.
that's what was quoted over the phone to my friend
I dunno why you are trying to start an argument- you said all you would generaly have to do is contact your cc company- that's fine and dandy.
I have already explained that wasn't the case with this credit card and linked paypalls policy when people are saying the opposite. I don't know how to make myself clearer here. Please tell me how you did this if you got money back on paypall or visa.
that's it!
Many countries, especially European countries, have better consumer protection laws than the "have to wait 30 days" stipulation you just mentioned. If something is dubbed not fit for purpose, they can have their credit card company directly do a chargeback.
Change is coming though in the US... The last few years has seen a sharp spike in consumer unhappiness with faulty software that doesn't perform as advertised and poor/unacceptable customer support channels... There is a lot of legislation in the works.... Most of the ire, well the ire that is catching the eyes of Washington is big business purchases but any laws will apply to consumer level purchases as well.
We need it bad... Look at some of the releases lately.. like Sim City.. hands down the worst release in the history of the computer chip... so bad their CEO got outed and now there are rumors of all kinds of legal actions being taken because they kept selling and advertising the game after the were completely aware of the problems... and they kept advertising... some ads read stuff like 'The best Sim City ever" and other completely false statements.
I am having a hard time to understand this. For all the people who have replied saying they did claim money back by paypall. eh?
I am asking as one of my friends in the Uk is trying to get money back on founders pack. Paid by paypall and when they rang paypall were told in no uncertain terms- impossible read your t+C FROM PAYPALL. NEVER ever protect against online goods.
...
so again I ask you..... Eh? how on earth are you saying you did it when I heard on loudspeaker my friend 100% turned down. Are you just lying?
This is incorrect. Paypal Purchase Protection is the only thing which the digital goods exclusion applies to. That's an "instant refund, no questions" process which guarantees they simply give you back the money and work out the rest from their side, instantly as possible.
However, if any item you purchase is SNAD (significantly not as described), you have a right to dispute the charge. That's quite different (although with the same outcome). You do have to attempt a dispute within 45 days after the purchase, however.
If a rep is lumping these into one category, I suggest arming you with the TOC specifically point 13.5.
To the OP: Basically if you charge back you get perma banned by PWI.
Well that makes sense... Its not a "ban" its them removing your account because you got your money back. Why are people distorting this into something its not.
Charge backs have been around for decades.. Its the protection that credit card companies give you. Hell its why I put certain purchases on my credit card.
So yea, its like returning something to the store.. you get your money back but you don't walk back out with the item. duh.
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lanessar13Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, SilverstarsPosts: 8Arc User
Well that makes sense... Its not a "ban" its them removing your account because you got your money back. Why are people distorting this into something its not.
Charge backs have been around for decades.. Its the protection that credit card companies give you. Hell its why I put certain purchases on my credit card.
So yea, its like returning something to the store.. you get your money back but you don't walk back out with the item. duh.
It's a ban. Your account isn't just restricted from NWO, it's banned from CO and STO or any other PWE games you might have linked that account with.
So, it's more like getting a refund from Outback and not being allowed into Red Lobster, Olive Garden or Mancinelli's (all owned by the same company).
Well that makes sense... Its not a "ban" its them removing your account because you got your money back. Why are people distorting this into something its not.
Ehhh no.
Do a chargeback for neverwinter and you get your perfectworld account banned. NOT just neverwinter, Raiderz, Blacklight, Star Trek
It's a ban. Your account isn't just restricted from NWO, it's banned from CO and STO or any other PWE games you might have linked that account with.
Well if that's the case I'd run, not walk, to the nearest attourney. That would constitute fraud. If they take away something you previously bought, which is what they are doing by disabling your account which provided you the access tot he service/product you purchased, and did so without you violating anything in the license of terms of use -- FRAUD.
This is incorrect. Paypal Purchase Protection is the only thing which the digital goods exclusion applies to. That's an "instant refund, no questions" process which guarantees they simply give you back the money and work out the rest from their side, instantly as possible.
However, if any item you purchase is SNAD (significantly not as described), you have a right to dispute the charge. That's quite different (although with the same outcome). You do have to attempt a dispute within 45 days after the purchase, however.
If a rep is lumping these into one category, I suggest arming you with the TOC specifically point 13.5.
aye ive been reading through all the t+c and ive seen 13.5 - that still isn't anything to do with them telling you that doesn't apply as its an untangable item. (my friend just rang once more and quoted some t+c- was told exactly the same once more)
Yes, they have a refund policy through the vendor. You are basically asking for a refund from PWE through PayPal, and since PayPal is an intermediary, things get expedited.
This why I was saying I feel like im being stupid here. I am not trying to argue. I just cannot understand people saying its not such a big deal and then to hear on loudspeaker my friend being told twice by 2 different paypall employees it cannot ever be done as its an online intangible good
Well if that's the case I'd run, not walk, to the nearest attourney. That would constitute fraud. If they take away something you previously bought, which is what they are doing by disabling your account which provided you the access tot he service/product you purchased, and did so without you violating anything in the license of terms of use -- FRAUD.
Yeah. Well, if they don't give me my account back after this is settled with Neverwinter. I will chargeback every single purchase i have ever bought from Perfect World International.
Going back some years, this might not be possible, but eh, I will think of something lol
Likely because you are saying the wrong things. How you ask for a refund is very important.
what was said over the phone was (I paraphrase)
I bought 2 items for insert price of two founders packs here. I entered into a contract stating that these would get me ahead in the game. Within a day of purchase due to exploits in the game thiese packs were worthless. I (my friend) feels defrauded
What is more not everything that was advertised in the pack was included. The respect token worth .. each were not included and each time contact was attempted to cusomter services numbers- neither had answered at any stage of day. also e-mails were ignored. Fraud has clearly been commited and even though it was an online service/items. it was in no way as advertised.
After that it was simply *employee takes a breath* we cannot help you. we don't deal with online products only phyisacil products
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lanessar13Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, SilverstarsPosts: 8Arc User
aye ive been reading through all the t+c and ive seen 13.5 - that still isn't anything to do with them telling you that doesn't apply as its an untangable item. (my friend just rang once more and quoted some t+c- was told exactly the same once more)
Ask to talk to a manager, but make sure you state your request correctly. You're not reading 13.5 correctly, and it has nothing to do with whether it's an intangible item or not.
If your friend is clearly stating his case and getting this response, escalate it to a manager. Because that's not what the T&C mean. However, I suspect that this is a case of misunderstanding, a language barrier, or something, because this was not an issue whatsoever in instances I've observed (and apparently, several others here as well) regarding digital downloads.
I bought 2 items for insert price of two founders packs here. I entered into a contract stating that these would get me ahead in the game. Within a day of purchase due to exploits in the game thiese packs were worthless. I (my friend) feels defrauded
What is more not everything that was advertised in the pack was included. The respect token worth .. each were not included and each time contact was attempted to cusomter services numbers- neither had answered at any stage of day. also e-mails were ignored. Fraud has clearly been commited and even though it was an online service/items. it was in no way as advertised.
After that it was simply *employee takes a breath* we cannot help you. we don't deal with online products only phyisacil products
I'll let another poster deal with the wording help on this. But "fraud" isn't correct. Read the SNAD points and re-phrase the next conversation. You're not going to get a refund going in that direction.
Ask to talk to a manager, but make sure you state your request correctly. You're not reading 13.5 correctly, and it has nothing to do with whether it's an intangible item or not.
I don't understand how you mean- please be a little clearer if I may ask. All my friend got when quoting 13.5 was quoted back 13.3 stating rules about intangible items
Yeah. Well, if they don't give me my account back after this is settled with Neverwinter. I will chargeback every single purchase i have ever bought from Perfect World International.
Going back some years, this might not be possible, but eh, I will think of something lol
But lets hope it doesn't come to that.
I'd advise you not to listen to askopdkapok, his knowledge of "fraud" and "legality" are grossly overstated
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lanessar13Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, SilverstarsPosts: 8Arc User
I don't understand how you mean- please be a little clearer if I may ask. All my friend got when quoting 13.5 was quoted back 13.3 stating rules about intangible items
Ok. Well, first of all, your reason for the dispute is not a valid reason. It's not even SNAD. Second, your friend is attempting to activate paypal purchase protection (which does not apply).
Simply put: Request a refund through PWE first, and be VERY clear in how the game is currently SNAD. Then, if there isn't a timely resolution, go through the paypal dispute center, and follow the steps there.
Ok. Well, first of all, your reason for the dispute is not a valid reason. It's not even SNAD. Second, your friend is attempting to activate paypal purchase protection (which does not apply).
Simply put: Request a refund through PWE first, and be VERY clear in how the game is currently SNAD. Then, if there isn't a timely resolution, go through the paypal dispute center, and follow the steps there.
Thanks, although I would have said not receiving items in the founders pack such as the reset spec relic in each missing is quite SNAD. as in you are prompted to pay 20pound? for either char respeccing when it is sposed to be free. I would have thought that was SNAD?
They get around it by using the TOS for the Perfect World service, as a blanket for all the games. So if you break the TOS you are breaking it for the Perfect World Entertainment service, not Neverwinter Terms of Service.
Well just because someone drafts a "TOS" doesn't mean its legally binding and worth anything in a legal proceeding. Quite the opposite.
Comments
what else I want is to find out when someone says they did something- and I see something 100% the opposite in front of my very eyes., how on earth they managed it.
There is a lot of I did this without any details whatsoever. I don't in any way promote chargebacks. let that be said asap. if someone wants to /msg me with how they did it feel free.
I want to understand
quote from paypall t+c
What’s not eligible? Buyer Protection does not cover certain kinds of purchases. These include: digital goods (intangible items), services, property, vehicles (of any kind), custom made items, airline travel, or items that violate our policies (stuff that’s usually prohibited by law anyway). Purchase Protection also does not cover items that you purchase in person, or money you send to friends and family.
that's what was quoted over the phone to my friend
I have already explained that wasn't the case with this credit card and linked paypalls policy when people are saying the opposite. I don't know how to make myself clearer here. Please tell me how you did this if you got money back on paypall or visa.
that's it!
they don't have a refund policy separate than that to my knowledge- that' is what they quoted over the phone
Change is coming though in the US... The last few years has seen a sharp spike in consumer unhappiness with faulty software that doesn't perform as advertised and poor/unacceptable customer support channels... There is a lot of legislation in the works.... Most of the ire, well the ire that is catching the eyes of Washington is big business purchases but any laws will apply to consumer level purchases as well.
We need it bad... Look at some of the releases lately.. like Sim City.. hands down the worst release in the history of the computer chip... so bad their CEO got outed and now there are rumors of all kinds of legal actions being taken because they kept selling and advertising the game after the were completely aware of the problems... and they kept advertising... some ads read stuff like 'The best Sim City ever" and other completely false statements.
Then look at this release.
This is incorrect. Paypal Purchase Protection is the only thing which the digital goods exclusion applies to. That's an "instant refund, no questions" process which guarantees they simply give you back the money and work out the rest from their side, instantly as possible.
However, if any item you purchase is SNAD (significantly not as described), you have a right to dispute the charge. That's quite different (although with the same outcome). You do have to attempt a dispute within 45 days after the purchase, however.
If a rep is lumping these into one category, I suggest arming you with the TOC specifically point 13.5.
Well that makes sense... Its not a "ban" its them removing your account because you got your money back. Why are people distorting this into something its not.
Charge backs have been around for decades.. Its the protection that credit card companies give you. Hell its why I put certain purchases on my credit card.
So yea, its like returning something to the store.. you get your money back but you don't walk back out with the item. duh.
It's a ban. Your account isn't just restricted from NWO, it's banned from CO and STO or any other PWE games you might have linked that account with.
So, it's more like getting a refund from Outback and not being allowed into Red Lobster, Olive Garden or Mancinelli's (all owned by the same company).
Ehhh no.
Do a chargeback for neverwinter and you get your perfectworld account banned. NOT just neverwinter, Raiderz, Blacklight, Star Trek
Assholish move
Well if that's the case I'd run, not walk, to the nearest attourney. That would constitute fraud. If they take away something you previously bought, which is what they are doing by disabling your account which provided you the access tot he service/product you purchased, and did so without you violating anything in the license of terms of use -- FRAUD.
aye ive been reading through all the t+c and ive seen 13.5 - that still isn't anything to do with them telling you that doesn't apply as its an untangable item. (my friend just rang once more and quoted some t+c- was told exactly the same once more)
This why I was saying I feel like im being stupid here. I am not trying to argue. I just cannot understand people saying its not such a big deal and then to hear on loudspeaker my friend being told twice by 2 different paypall employees it cannot ever be done as its an online intangible good
Yeah. Well, if they don't give me my account back after this is settled with Neverwinter. I will chargeback every single purchase i have ever bought from Perfect World International.
Going back some years, this might not be possible, but eh, I will think of something lol
But lets hope it doesn't come to that.
what was said over the phone was (I paraphrase)
I bought 2 items for insert price of two founders packs here. I entered into a contract stating that these would get me ahead in the game. Within a day of purchase due to exploits in the game thiese packs were worthless. I (my friend) feels defrauded
What is more not everything that was advertised in the pack was included. The respect token worth .. each were not included and each time contact was attempted to cusomter services numbers- neither had answered at any stage of day. also e-mails were ignored. Fraud has clearly been commited and even though it was an online service/items. it was in no way as advertised.
After that it was simply *employee takes a breath* we cannot help you. we don't deal with online products only phyisacil products
Ask to talk to a manager, but make sure you state your request correctly. You're not reading 13.5 correctly, and it has nothing to do with whether it's an intangible item or not.
If your friend is clearly stating his case and getting this response, escalate it to a manager. Because that's not what the T&C mean. However, I suspect that this is a case of misunderstanding, a language barrier, or something, because this was not an issue whatsoever in instances I've observed (and apparently, several others here as well) regarding digital downloads.
I'll let another poster deal with the wording help on this. But "fraud" isn't correct. Read the SNAD points and re-phrase the next conversation. You're not going to get a refund going in that direction.
Just to clarify, merchant insurance usually only applies to fraudulent payments, not those where a legitimate customer is dissatisfied with the goods.
I'd advise you not to listen to askopdkapok, his knowledge of "fraud" and "legality" are grossly overstated
Ok. Well, first of all, your reason for the dispute is not a valid reason. It's not even SNAD. Second, your friend is attempting to activate paypal purchase protection (which does not apply).
Simply put: Request a refund through PWE first, and be VERY clear in how the game is currently SNAD. Then, if there isn't a timely resolution, go through the paypal dispute center, and follow the steps there.
Thanks, although I would have said not receiving items in the founders pack such as the reset spec relic in each missing is quite SNAD. as in you are prompted to pay 20pound? for either char respeccing when it is sposed to be free. I would have thought that was SNAD?
But aye thanks for reply
Well just because someone drafts a "TOS" doesn't mean its legally binding and worth anything in a legal proceeding. Quite the opposite.