No one wants to see trade spam on Zone chat. If you want to sell your stuff, go do it on the auction house. Use it, it's there.
Totally agree with this. I would rarely put spammers on /ignore because it's too much work but there are other ways to sell your stuff without bothering everyone. Auction house or if you don't want to pay commission, etc, the trade channel.
Zone chat in Protector's Enclave scrolls so fast because dozen of unique snowflakes feeling more important than everyone else abuse it to spam WTT/WTS stuff. Sorry to say but I've got little sympathy for people who abuse so badly that they'll get themselves banned for 24 h. OP got caught and punished having admitting spamming. Sounds to me like everything is working as intended.
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ashrox10Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, SilverstarsPosts: 0Arc User
You and I have a different definition of 'common sense'. What you describe is more like a small town in Wyoming printing an ad in every newspaper in the country about a weekend sale.
We have a trade channel, thus common sense says that is where people will look to buy/sell. Granted this does assume all of the interested players are aware of the channel (if you were unaware, others surely are as well sadly) and make that extra effort to use it. If you were actually one of the few who did not spam the zone channel (that is you waited x minutes instead of waiting for your advert to be blown off screen) then I do feel sympathy for your mute. But most of the people who buy and sell in the zone channel do not follow such courtesies and really do spam the channel. Person A says their advert then persons B-G have to throw theirs up immediately after.
When I said common sense, I was talking about how to sell items, not where to sell items. I completely agree that if there was an allocated, and populated, trade channel then all trade discussions should be put in there. However, as far as I'm aware, there is no official trade channel, or I'm not being placed in it instantly, or it isn't populated. If I have to join it, that, to me, seems like a custom channel. In which case, mutes shouldn't occur because I didn't join a custom channel as that's unfair. Yes, I waited a few minutes per advert.
I understand what you're saying and I agree that spammers in the chat should be reported. I just feel that Zone isn't specific enough to what should and shouldn't be put in there. On top of this, if players are being muted for saying the 'wrong things' then there needs to be a list of 'right things'. When so people ever discuss Protectors Enclave as a Zone? They don't. So why should they talk in 'Zone' for example. LFG isn't 'Zone' as people don't look for Protectors Enclave runs. This is another example.
I just feel that there isn't any specifics on what is, or isn't, acceptable for Zone chat and until there is, people having the 'power' to hand out 24 hour mutes (or partially contribute to them) isn't really fair.
And, this is my point. People are being muted for using common sense. Which is the point of this thread. How hard is it to understand -.-
When my general chat tab is spammed with trade that isn't supposed to be there I will do my best to mute those who contribute to it. How's that for common sense?
Don't trade in zone chat, and don't post guild recruitment stuff, some people don't like that and they will put you on ignore. If enough people add you to their ignore list you get an automatic temporary ban.
Your not singled out. I report/ignore every one of you guys when Im waiting for my party to do stuff. There's a place for trading. And when peoples questions go unanswered because 40 WTT WTS WTB message go flying by its ridiculous. I wish there was a filter, or people would use other means of spamming zone chat.
I agree completely. You cite that you wish to appeal to a mass audience; well, you're doing nothing more than spamming. You're no better than the countless ads that plague the internet.
OP, you seem to display an over-inflated sense of self-worth. You're not special. Many of us will quickly do all that is within our power to see you gone.
Okay. Cryptic's wonderful players-police-themselves chat system works like this:
If someone /report spams you....it puts a demerit on you. Get five or more demerits with this feature, and you'll be silenced for 24 hours.
If someone /ignores you...it puts a demerit on you. These take more, and nobody's sure exactly how many, but catch enough people /ignoring you and you'll get silenced for 24 hours.
And this is the very same chat system for all three of Cryptic's games. Working as intended and so deeply imbedded into the chat system that it cannot be changed without a total rework of all three games chat.
Welcome to Cryptic games. Enjoy your stay, however brief or long it may be.
Exactly. Welcome to the player run Mafia based chat ban system. With ZERO repercussions.
Also, the /ignore and /report_spammer functions add into one global pool, with /report_spammer giving more demerits. Just not sure how many /ignores it takes before you get banned.
Common sense says the TRADE channel is for TRADES. You guys just think you're special and want to SPAM everyone with the garbage you are selling whether they are interested or not. And as many this generation have been taught...it's EVERYONE else's fault but yours.
excuse my ignorance but where is the trade channel cos at least in Dragon server there isn't such channel or tab in the chat. Mind if you enlighten me? There is Say, Zone, Party, System, Guild... i really found none that can resemble a Trade chat or channel.
This really is tragic design, clearly based on work avoidance and imminently abusable.
Whether you agree with what chat goes where or not, the basic system is sublimely flawed.
Eventually someone is going to decide to do a little chat system judo and then all the GMs will have to scour the chat logs anyway, and bounty hunt the perpetrator anyway and ban his dime-a-dozen free account anyway. And 24 hours is plenty of time to get a lot done if one is possessed of a vindictive heart.
Given the basic fact thathe chat system is designed to keep the GMs from having to do any of that how long do you think it will take them to actually get roused from their lairs for the duty? How many truly innocent people will be de-facto kicked out of the game before any action is taken at all?
Its a sad and deeply unfortunate design and I cant say I hope it turns out well.
I just hope it doesn't implode near me
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asakochanMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 3Arc User
edited May 2013
Practically what Cryptic did here was giving power to trolls to mute whoever they want when they want if they want so with or w/o reason, and to normal people that maybe even don't use the chat for days, that single time they really need it for finding a group or something, they must fear to use it because at the first post sent through they might be banned in a blink of an eye.
And seems that many people really enjoy it and find it awesome. I'm speechless how people can be that biotch!
So, a bunch of people are being jerks by ignoring other players to "teach them a lesson" that they should restrict sales to a channel that was created by players for two other games four years ago?
And their reasoning is that players should use the "right channel?" Guess what geniuses: If the company doesn't have a sanctioned channel then there is no "right."
Exactly. Welcome to the player run Mafia based chat ban system. With ZERO repercussions.
Also, the /ignore and /report_spammer functions add into one global pool, with /report_spammer giving more demerits. Just not sure how many /ignores it takes before you get banned.
A "mafia"? Tell me, what's spam? Getting advertisement you don't want to see. What did OP do? :rolleyes:
excuse my ignorance but where is the trade channel cos at least in Dragon server there isn't such channel or tab in the chat. Mind if you enlighten me? There is Say, Zone, Party, System, Guild... i really found none that can resemble a Trade chat or channel.
That is what I wanted to know. With only the one channel, I thought it was a melting pot for all activity and with the game in beta..I just assumed it was that way for a reason. I don't think that a trade channel people are unaware of is going to help much.
Sister Vanity knows if you've been naughty or nice...and heals accordingly.
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kahmffMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 1Arc User
edited May 2013
I think what the OP is missing is the fact that, even in today's world, advertisers do not have a god-given right to an audience.
You can "discuss" the issue here all you like but the bottom line is every player who posts trade in zone chat takes a chance of getting a 24 hours mute. If you are ok with being muted, then do it. If not, then don't do it.
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jnaathraMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
Working as intended. Have a nice day.
Scout Tragold - "I haven't lived this long by being brave... it's just another word for stupid."
I really hope so. I hate "Special Snowflakes" who are too important to use the trade channel because they are afraid someone may miss their important sales/trades. (This goes for every online game I have ever played)
Indeed. Not only do people in so many games avoid the trade channel when it exists (which is the only appropriate place to try and sell things) but most of the shouts I see are from people that are trying to buy at very low prices or sell at very high prices. We have the auction house for a reason. If you want to sell something, use the auction house. If you want to buy something, use the auction house. If you want to buy something and there are none available on the auction house (which almost never seems to happen with all the people playing this game) then you can shout that you want to buy a particular item just to encourage people to go post it on the auction house.
A "mafia"? Tell me, what's spam? Getting advertisement you don't want to see. What did OP do? :rolleyes:
You know, I and everyone else in this game have the right to put anyone on ignore. What if I and a bunch of like-minded individuals absolutely hate when people use zone chat for anything other than telling jokes. When you're asking where to get ID scrolls or where your sparkly trail went, we can all put you on ignore, and we're not even doing anything wrong. Sound good?
Sure that's an extreme case, but there are clear signs of abuse, players being constantly muted for days and weeks, and even developer confirmation that the chat ban system gets abused. Still sound good? Everyone always says it sounds like a decent system until they get smacked with a chat ban.
Indeed. Not only is there a trade channel (which is the only appropriate place to try and sell things) but most of the shouts I see are from people that are trying to buy at very low prices or sell at very high prices. We have the auction house for a reason. If you want to sell something, use the auction house. If you want to buy something, use the auction house. If you want to buy something and there are none available on the auction house (which almost never seems to happen with all the people playing this game) then you can use the trade channel to shout that you want to buy a particular item just to encourage people to go post it on the auction house.
You should have read the thread before backing up the poster you're quoting. The "trade channel" is a player creation for two other games. So no, that is not an "appropriate place" to conduct trades for Neverwinter.
I report for gold spammers, anyone sending out the same message 3 or more times in a row, inappropriate language (racist etc), inappropriate names (again derogatory or inflammatory)
Just to add, I was in Protectors Enclave where 90% of the Zone chat is people trading. I don't know why people would single me out to report if literally the majority of Zone chat is Buying and Selling. However, I was unaware of this 'Trade' chat.
I was one of the people who reported you. People don't want to read over and over buy my <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> please buy my <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> cheep. There is an AH use it.
And enjoy your chat ban
p.s. you were not singled out I report everyone spams zone with trade <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> and I know lots of people do also.
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xantrisMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Autobans with no moderation from GM's is a bad idea. Anyone having a bad day can simply report/ignore someone just to be a ****** and get someone chat banned for 24 hours. I don't know how to call attention to this terrible design concept except for report and ignore everyone you see until no one can talk at all. Perhaps then they will see the folly in this design.
It's fine, it's the lesser of two evils. It has worked perfectly fine for years in their other games.
It is a lose-lose situation. It is either a situation where the report feature can be mis- or abused, or one where spamming or trolling has no consequences. There are downsides to either approach.
I don't think that ignoring someone should lead to that person getting blocked from posting. For spamming, yes, but I ignore annoying people (e.g. endless arguments about whether the game is p2w or not) without wanting to restrict their channel privileges. I just don't want to see their stuff on my screen.
It's fine, it's the lesser of two evils. It has worked perfectly fine for years in their other games.
Since you decided to edit your post to make it seem like you're being logical: Your follow up statement is a lie. Players in CO and STO have been ganging up on other players for years and getting them chat banned for kicks or to ruin player-run events.
Long term, if enough people get hit with the chat-ban hammer for trolling the channels, they will stop (some only after whining on the forums perhaps). Then it will still be available to deal with chatbotting tradespammers and the rest of us 'humans' will be fine.
Yes, there is opportunity for abuse and inevitably some guild will gang up to get someone chat-banned. Hopefully the GMs will be competent and interested enough to investigate and take appopriate steps. I like the idea of the tool and if managed wisely by the devs, it is probably a much better way to manage poor game behavior than reporting and waiting weeks for a "we're investigating it but we wont' tell you the outcome" message.
I report spam all the time if the person is copy pasting and ..literally spamming
WHERE DO I FIND THE MAILBOX!!
WHERE DO I FIND THE MAILBOX!!
WHERE DO I FIND THE MAILBOX!!
WHERE DO I FIND THE MAILBOX!!
WHERE DO I FIND THE MAILBOX!!
WHERE DO I FIND THE MAILBOX!!
Comments
Totally agree with this. I would rarely put spammers on /ignore because it's too much work but there are other ways to sell your stuff without bothering everyone. Auction house or if you don't want to pay commission, etc, the trade channel.
Zone chat in Protector's Enclave scrolls so fast because dozen of unique snowflakes feeling more important than everyone else abuse it to spam WTT/WTS stuff. Sorry to say but I've got little sympathy for people who abuse so badly that they'll get themselves banned for 24 h. OP got caught and punished having admitting spamming. Sounds to me like everything is working as intended.
When I said common sense, I was talking about how to sell items, not where to sell items. I completely agree that if there was an allocated, and populated, trade channel then all trade discussions should be put in there. However, as far as I'm aware, there is no official trade channel, or I'm not being placed in it instantly, or it isn't populated. If I have to join it, that, to me, seems like a custom channel. In which case, mutes shouldn't occur because I didn't join a custom channel as that's unfair. Yes, I waited a few minutes per advert.
I understand what you're saying and I agree that spammers in the chat should be reported. I just feel that Zone isn't specific enough to what should and shouldn't be put in there. On top of this, if players are being muted for saying the 'wrong things' then there needs to be a list of 'right things'. When so people ever discuss Protectors Enclave as a Zone? They don't. So why should they talk in 'Zone' for example. LFG isn't 'Zone' as people don't look for Protectors Enclave runs. This is another example.
I just feel that there isn't any specifics on what is, or isn't, acceptable for Zone chat and until there is, people having the 'power' to hand out 24 hour mutes (or partially contribute to them) isn't really fair.
PvE Enthusiast.
When my general chat tab is spammed with trade that isn't supposed to be there I will do my best to mute those who contribute to it. How's that for common sense?
I agree completely. You cite that you wish to appeal to a mass audience; well, you're doing nothing more than spamming. You're no better than the countless ads that plague the internet.
OP, you seem to display an over-inflated sense of self-worth. You're not special. Many of us will quickly do all that is within our power to see you gone.
Exactly. Welcome to the player run Mafia based chat ban system. With ZERO repercussions.
Also, the /ignore and /report_spammer functions add into one global pool, with /report_spammer giving more demerits. Just not sure how many /ignores it takes before you get banned.
excuse my ignorance but where is the trade channel cos at least in Dragon server there isn't such channel or tab in the chat. Mind if you enlighten me? There is Say, Zone, Party, System, Guild... i really found none that can resemble a Trade chat or channel.
Whether you agree with what chat goes where or not, the basic system is sublimely flawed.
Eventually someone is going to decide to do a little chat system judo and then all the GMs will have to scour the chat logs anyway, and bounty hunt the perpetrator anyway and ban his dime-a-dozen free account anyway. And 24 hours is plenty of time to get a lot done if one is possessed of a vindictive heart.
Given the basic fact thathe chat system is designed to keep the GMs from having to do any of that how long do you think it will take them to actually get roused from their lairs for the duty? How many truly innocent people will be de-facto kicked out of the game before any action is taken at all?
Its a sad and deeply unfortunate design and I cant say I hope it turns out well.
I just hope it doesn't implode near me
And seems that many people really enjoy it and find it awesome. I'm speechless how people can be that biotch!
And their reasoning is that players should use the "right channel?" Guess what geniuses: If the company doesn't have a sanctioned channel then there is no "right."
A "mafia"? Tell me, what's spam? Getting advertisement you don't want to see. What did OP do? :rolleyes:
That is what I wanted to know. With only the one channel, I thought it was a melting pot for all activity and with the game in beta..I just assumed it was that way for a reason. I don't think that a trade channel people are unaware of is going to help much.
Indeed. Not only do people in so many games avoid the trade channel when it exists (which is the only appropriate place to try and sell things) but most of the shouts I see are from people that are trying to buy at very low prices or sell at very high prices. We have the auction house for a reason. If you want to sell something, use the auction house. If you want to buy something, use the auction house. If you want to buy something and there are none available on the auction house (which almost never seems to happen with all the people playing this game) then you can shout that you want to buy a particular item just to encourage people to go post it on the auction house.
You know, I and everyone else in this game have the right to put anyone on ignore. What if I and a bunch of like-minded individuals absolutely hate when people use zone chat for anything other than telling jokes. When you're asking where to get ID scrolls or where your sparkly trail went, we can all put you on ignore, and we're not even doing anything wrong. Sound good?
Sure that's an extreme case, but there are clear signs of abuse, players being constantly muted for days and weeks, and even developer confirmation that the chat ban system gets abused. Still sound good? Everyone always says it sounds like a decent system until they get smacked with a chat ban.
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
You should have read the thread before backing up the poster you're quoting. The "trade channel" is a player creation for two other games. So no, that is not an "appropriate place" to conduct trades for Neverwinter.
I was one of the people who reported you. People don't want to read over and over buy my <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> please buy my <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> cheep. There is an AH use it.
And enjoy your chat ban
p.s. you were not singled out I report everyone spams zone with trade <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> and I know lots of people do also.
It's fine, it's the lesser of two evils. It has worked perfectly fine for years in their other games.
I don't think that ignoring someone should lead to that person getting blocked from posting. For spamming, yes, but I ignore annoying people (e.g. endless arguments about whether the game is p2w or not) without wanting to restrict their channel privileges. I just don't want to see their stuff on my screen.
No it isn't. Do you even understand what that phrase means?
Since you decided to edit your post to make it seem like you're being logical: Your follow up statement is a lie. Players in CO and STO have been ganging up on other players for years and getting them chat banned for kicks or to ruin player-run events.
Yes, there is opportunity for abuse and inevitably some guild will gang up to get someone chat-banned. Hopefully the GMs will be competent and interested enough to investigate and take appopriate steps. I like the idea of the tool and if managed wisely by the devs, it is probably a much better way to manage poor game behavior than reporting and waiting weeks for a "we're investigating it but we wont' tell you the outcome" message.
WHERE DO I FIND THE MAILBOX!!
WHERE DO I FIND THE MAILBOX!!
WHERE DO I FIND THE MAILBOX!!
WHERE DO I FIND THE MAILBOX!!
WHERE DO I FIND THE MAILBOX!!
WHERE DO I FIND THE MAILBOX!!
within seconds. deserved.