The GWF as far as I have played which is mid 30's is really starting to have an identity crisis. His dps is dropping far too low on all but weenie packs of monsters with no elites. You get a pack with an elite or two and its insane how much they punish you. Sure you can spec defensive but you still take hits like a champ and lose far too many hps and don't do enough damage back to get enemies down.
Not my experience at all this weekend from 31 to 42. Weaponmaster's Strike made wiping out the weenie mobs very easy and the packs of elites weren't much of a problem either given that I'd almost immediately have unstoppable up and could then set up a very fast debuff-kill cycle.
Then again I was running a pretty hefty single-target DPS build, taking restoring strike and flourish(?), the level 30 epic encounter power. That one would really shine in the rare times I was grouped up if I had combat advantage, I'm not sure what the crit scaling exactly is but I'd go from a normal 100, 125, 150, 175, 200, 250, 500 attack (numbers not exact) to a 300, 500, 800, 1,200, 1,600, 2,500 attack all crits with combat advantage. Again, numbers not exact but it was hitting like a mother trucker.
But I can see where there's a lot of pain in the leveling up game.
I started a thread over here for people to voice what changes they would like to see on the GWF in order to help/aid the devs contructively on what we would like to see with this class.
Many many people are unhappy with the changes done to the GWF and I think its a good place to list our concerns.
I started a thread over here for people to voice what changes they would like to see on the GWF in order to help/aid the devs contructively on what we would like to see with this class.
Many many people are unhappy with the changes done to the GWF and I think its a good place to list our concerns.
Thanks
Agreed, thanks for starting that thread. It has already generated some great feedback that will hopefully aid the developers in making our class even more enjoyable.
| Banners of the Light | Recruitment is open | End Game PvE and PvP |
| Lust | Level 60 Guardian Fighter 15.8k GS|
Chances are they have someone reading the forums but it's VERY rare for video game developers to open dialogue for specific classes.
I agree it is rare, but since they have commented in each of the other class forums, it is odd they have remained silent in this forum. Especially since it has two classes represented in it.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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locoxxiiMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 2Arc User
I don't know what it was like before as this is the first beta weekend I played in but I can say just doing a straight comparison the GWF is certainly dealing less damage than a control wizard. I rolled both and the difference is very noticeable, I had a much easier time as a control wizard compared to the GWF. As GWF I was very dependent on potions to stay alive, as control wizard I used them much more sparsely.
I tried out GWF mainly b/c of things I read about how great that class was but I guess that was before these nerfs b/c the GWF I played was just kind of frustrating in contrast to the wizard which was a much smoother experience.
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locoxxiiMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 2Arc User
edited April 2013
I think we need to wait some answer of cryptic people!
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sadistMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited April 2013
Definitely found my GWF lacking punch this Beta. And wicked strike is just way to slow.
There is definitely some need of reworking in the power system with certain encounters and what level they are obtained at.
I noticed that -
Crescendo - Daily
(30 Range)(4' Cylinder)(Physical Damage)
Stun your enemy with a flurry of attacks, and then attack from many angles simultaneously to send them Prone.
Isn't even available till lvl 50 now and in the sentinel tree,
Tier 2
Grim Promise 5/5
Crescendo reduces the damage your target deals to you by 3/6/9/12/15% for 10 seconds.
Grim Promise buffs your Crescendo ability, but the points could all potentially be wasted at a very early level till lvl 50...
They definitely need to tweak some of that stuff for sure, as far as buffs are concerned, there definitely is a need for at least dmg buffs at earlier levels because the damage is indeed far too low and potion chugging is way more apparent than it was before at earlier levels.
Maybe if Punishing Charge and Sure Strike were reverted back to their original form that would definitely help the problem at least a little bit.
"There are more things in heaven and earth,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy."
As a Sentinel, I couldn't justify spending 5 points for a minor debuff associated with a daily that only lasts for 10 seconds. That aside, Crescendo is very satisfying in its own right.
Back on topic - I completely agree that some tweaks are needed in regards to how feats and abilities are arranged in their respective trees. You presented a great example.
| Banners of the Light | Recruitment is open | End Game PvE and PvP |
| Lust | Level 60 Guardian Fighter 15.8k GS|
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micdarauMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited April 2013
Great post Hakarat! Personally I dont care about my GWF dmg, I just loved every minute playing this big sword thing, (lvled till 33) but all the points you are talking about are right. We need some improvements about our class.
As a Sentinel, I couldn't justify spending 5 points for a minor debuff associated with a daily that only lasts for 10 seconds. That aside, Crescendo is very satisfying in its own right.
Back on topic - I completely agree that some tweaks are needed in regards to how feats and abilities are arranged in their respective trees. You presented a great example.
Well if you're going PvP or even trying to take on a PvE tanking role that's a pretty significant level of debuff. Though I haven't really checked into what you'd be giving up. I'd really love some beta talent calculators put out. :-/
I plan on spending 20+ hours a week on this game for the next few monthsl
My perfect idea of a good end game: PVP
If GWF sucks end game pvp, I should just reroll now??
It doesn't suck at end game. They are just very late bloomers.
0
mannokMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 8Arc User
edited May 2013
Thanks for the great service of comparing the different editions. I made a GWF aka G. Nerfed F. aka G. Thrash F. in the open beta launch and had a instinctive feeling that the feats had been changed cause most of them seemed almost to weak. Deep Gash for instance and now I understand, it was designed at 1 point to actually do damage When I read the post it all made soo much more sense. Thanks alot.
It doesn't suck at end game. They are just very late bloomers.
Misinformation, the only thing that a GWF blooms into is a flashy bundle of mediocrity.
While you can still succeed as a GWF, there is a blatant difference in power between it and other classes. Properly equipped Rogues using AoE encounters can, and will, outdamage a GWF in AoE while maintaining significantly higher single target dps. The same can be said for both Guardian Fighters and Control Wizards. Guardian Fighters, in particular, can put GWFs to shame in both tanking and damage at the same time with the help of a few choice feats and ridiculous set bonuses.
The only time you will ever see a GWF come close to touching the numbers that every class (other than Cleric) can achieve is if the people they are partied with don't know how to slot their gear.
Please don't confuse this as an issue of learn to play, whenever I PuG or do a PvP round I'm always at or near the top of damage done or KDR but that is not because my class is good. It is because the people I am grouping with are bad. The difference between my two characters is night and day with my Guardian Fighter resoundingly being on top.
Until something is addressed I will continue to main my Guardian Fighter who excels in ways that my GWF can only dream of. If you don't believe what I'm saying you can cross reference it with any number of the Guardian Fighter DPS threads on these boards.
tl;dr
Roll a Guardian Fighter instead. They live much longer and do way more damage.
Daint's the name. Pizza's my game.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
0
astariadodfMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
Honestly I didnt get my GWF to 60 (not privilege to 2nd weekend) but the current GWF is not that off. What you have pay attention too is that there are other classes that are WAY O P. (edit: im 60 in live now)
Do i think we need a boost? Absolutely. Should it be a total rework? Absolutely not. Here is my proof:
So really, beyond the obvious overpowered other classes, the GWF in my perception just needs a flat DPS INCREASE. Possibly some tweaks in the line, but I doubt a rewrite. That said, feel free to not to roll a GWF - more gear drops for me :cool:
Honestly I didnt get my GWF to 60 (not privilege to 2nd weekend) but the current GWF is not that off. What you have pay attention too is that there are other classes that are WAY O P.
Do i think we need a boost? Absolutely. Should it be a total rework? Absolutely not. Here is my proof:
So really, beyond the obvious overpowered other classes, the GWF in my perception just needs a flat DPS INCREASE. Possibly some tweaks in the line, but I doubt a rewrite. That said, feel free to not to roll a GWF - more gear drops for me :cool:
Having played end game, the proposal of increased damage is a viable option sure. But the increase for it to be meaningful to the design of end game content has to be so substantial I don't see it happening.
that and lashing blade and shocking execution. basically the sustained dps are still there but the big bursts have been nerfed. also it looks like being hit while stealthed makes you lose more stealth meter than it used to.
lol really? didnt nerf SE enough. Shocking execution is still OP, you can literally 1 hit someone with that
Hmm, after reading so much here and playing my own GWF, Ive finally managed to overcome my stubbornness and perhaps its time to admit this is not the class for me at least as it is now. And that sucks! Do we have any information if a future class will make use of great weapons ?
Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
Hmm, after reading so much here and playing my own GWF, Ive finally managed to overcome my stubbornness and perhaps its time to admit this is not the class for me at least as it is now. And that sucks! Do we have any information if a future class will make use of great weapons ?
Well, Paladin, Barbarian and Avenger all have builds that make use of great weapons.
Comments
Not my experience at all this weekend from 31 to 42. Weaponmaster's Strike made wiping out the weenie mobs very easy and the packs of elites weren't much of a problem either given that I'd almost immediately have unstoppable up and could then set up a very fast debuff-kill cycle.
Then again I was running a pretty hefty single-target DPS build, taking restoring strike and flourish(?), the level 30 epic encounter power. That one would really shine in the rare times I was grouped up if I had combat advantage, I'm not sure what the crit scaling exactly is but I'd go from a normal 100, 125, 150, 175, 200, 250, 500 attack (numbers not exact) to a 300, 500, 800, 1,200, 1,600, 2,500 attack all crits with combat advantage. Again, numbers not exact but it was hitting like a mother trucker.
But I can see where there's a lot of pain in the leveling up game.
I started a thread over here for people to voice what changes they would like to see on the GWF in order to help/aid the devs contructively on what we would like to see with this class.
Many many people are unhappy with the changes done to the GWF and I think its a good place to list our concerns.
Thanks
Agreed, thanks for starting that thread.
| Lust | Level 60 Guardian Fighter 15.8k GS|
I have never seen anyone that works for cryptic make any comment on the forums in regards to the GWF. Kind of odd really.
I agree it is rare, but since they have commented in each of the other class forums, it is odd they have remained silent in this forum. Especially since it has two classes represented in it.
aawdwadadaw
I tried out GWF mainly b/c of things I read about how great that class was but I guess that was before these nerfs b/c the GWF I played was just kind of frustrating in contrast to the wizard which was a much smoother experience.
^^This +10
I noticed that -
Crescendo - Daily
(30 Range)(4' Cylinder)(Physical Damage)
Stun your enemy with a flurry of attacks, and then attack from many angles simultaneously to send them Prone.
Isn't even available till lvl 50 now and in the sentinel tree,
Tier 2
Grim Promise 5/5
Crescendo reduces the damage your target deals to you by 3/6/9/12/15% for 10 seconds.
Grim Promise buffs your Crescendo ability, but the points could all potentially be wasted at a very early level till lvl 50...
They definitely need to tweak some of that stuff for sure, as far as buffs are concerned, there definitely is a need for at least dmg buffs at earlier levels because the damage is indeed far too low and potion chugging is way more apparent than it was before at earlier levels.
Maybe if Punishing Charge and Sure Strike were reverted back to their original form that would definitely help the problem at least a little bit.
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy."
Back on topic - I completely agree that some tweaks are needed in regards to how feats and abilities are arranged in their respective trees. You presented a great example.
| Lust | Level 60 Guardian Fighter 15.8k GS|
Well if you're going PvP or even trying to take on a PvE tanking role that's a pretty significant level of debuff. Though I haven't really checked into what you'd be giving up. I'd really love some beta talent calculators put out. :-/
I plan on spending 20+ hours a week on this game for the next few monthsl
My perfect idea of a good end game: PVP
If GWF sucks end game pvp, I should just reroll now??
It doesn't suck at end game. They are just very late bloomers.
Misinformation, the only thing that a GWF blooms into is a flashy bundle of mediocrity.
While you can still succeed as a GWF, there is a blatant difference in power between it and other classes. Properly equipped Rogues using AoE encounters can, and will, outdamage a GWF in AoE while maintaining significantly higher single target dps. The same can be said for both Guardian Fighters and Control Wizards. Guardian Fighters, in particular, can put GWFs to shame in both tanking and damage at the same time with the help of a few choice feats and ridiculous set bonuses.
The only time you will ever see a GWF come close to touching the numbers that every class (other than Cleric) can achieve is if the people they are partied with don't know how to slot their gear.
Please don't confuse this as an issue of learn to play, whenever I PuG or do a PvP round I'm always at or near the top of damage done or KDR but that is not because my class is good. It is because the people I am grouping with are bad. The difference between my two characters is night and day with my Guardian Fighter resoundingly being on top.
Until something is addressed I will continue to main my Guardian Fighter who excels in ways that my GWF can only dream of. If you don't believe what I'm saying you can cross reference it with any number of the Guardian Fighter DPS threads on these boards.
tl;dr
Roll a Guardian Fighter instead. They live much longer and do way more damage.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Do i think we need a boost? Absolutely. Should it be a total rework? Absolutely not. Here is my proof:
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-sIwRYC_Sf8YVJrQURzaVB0Y0E/edit?usp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-sIwRYC_Sf8Q0ZiVGVJOTYyYm8/edit?usp=sharing
and
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-sIwRYC_Sf8VGpJT0owMGVLdVE/edit?usp=sharing
So really, beyond the obvious overpowered other classes, the GWF in my perception just needs a flat DPS INCREASE. Possibly some tweaks in the line, but I doubt a rewrite. That said, feel free to not to roll a GWF - more gear drops for me :cool:
Having played end game, the proposal of increased damage is a viable option sure. But the increase for it to be meaningful to the design of end game content has to be so substantial I don't see it happening.
Extinction - GWF
lol really? didnt nerf SE enough. Shocking execution is still OP, you can literally 1 hit someone with that
I have a level 60 TR and a level 60 GWF
Seze - Rogue - Necropolis -
lol yeah, Im 35 and maybe...maybe just seeing some light.
After reading the first post though the really stuck it on and broke it off on us though.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
Well, Paladin, Barbarian and Avenger all have builds that make use of great weapons.