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Drow elf not available for at least 60 days after release, wizard future unsure

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    ruinedmirageruinedmirage Member Posts: 440 Bounty Hunter
    edited February 2013
    elminban wrote: »
    What he is saying is that there is a fallacy. What you can say however, is a strong argument, one that will probably happen. Example: 85% of the people a X college are republicans, so probably Fifi is a republican. Releasing the game with Drow on a 60 day or more timer will probably do more harm than good for the game.

    Actually, I wanted to test out the politician wording thing. I was gonna see how long it took for the usual suspects to raise their red flag because someone said the word "fact".

    But I still stand by my previous statement nonetheless, also.
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    jedidethfreak823jedidethfreak823 Member Posts: 223 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    Disagree 100%. This is a video game, not food, water or other life necessities. NO ONE has the right to play a game entirely for free nor should they. And they have even less of a right to expect others to financially support the game for them. People from a specific demographic that isn't inclusive of everyone that could play a game should not be exclusively targeted as the ones that get to carry the entire weight of financially supporting the game just so that leeches can get to play for free.

    But none of this really matters anyway because the guy does bring up STO ships in that video and STO ships aren't just fluff. They're functional--even if they're not more powerful than the strongest ships in the game they're still stronger than the regular ones and they do have functionality and power so Cryptic does NOT limit itself to just cosmetics or fluff alone regardless of anything they might say. Anyone that says otherwise is either fooling themselves or lying, and that includes any dev that claims that they only sell cosmetics--they don't, the sell power and additional features as well. And that's the way it should be (except for the part where they gate it behind lockboxes and such, but that's a different matter).

    I look at it this way - if they say they won't sell anything but fluff, they shouldn't sell anything but fluff, regardless of anyone's feelings on who's supporting the game or not.

    And Cryptic has officially taken STO into Pay-to-Win, thanks to the newest ship that has the most forward weapon slots and tactical consoles available in the game!
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    rohk007rohk007 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Silverstars Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    I like it. I wish they would add dragonborn also for a charge. I would pay for that also.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    keirkinkeirkin Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    I look at it this way - if they say they won't sell anything but fluff, they shouldn't sell anything but fluff, regardless of anyone's feelings on who's supporting the game or not.

    And Cryptic has officially taken STO into Pay-to-Win, thanks to the newest ship that has the most forward weapon slots and tactical consoles available in the game!

    I completely agree that they should keep their word whenever possible (Murphy is the cruelest god of all). I completely agree about the ship in STO, however both the words cosmetic and convenience as they apply to items in the cash shop mean different things to different people. If cryptic puts something in the cash shop that they see as a cosmetic or convenience and someone else sees it as pay to win they are not breaking their word. Opinion is opinion and everyone has one. For instance lets say they make something completely new. Oh like a starborn elf backround, it has all the exact same stats as oh lets say a drow except its special ability is sun burst but is yellow but in all other ways it functions like the Drow ability. Lets say they have blue skin and glowing blue eyes. Is that Cosmetic? I guarantee you that some people will say it is not. But it totally is to me and I would guess to Cryptic.
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    ysil6969ysil6969 Member Posts: 42 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    chili1179 wrote: »
    I am amazed that no one is throwing a single fit about the omission of halflings from that list of playable races.

    Racists, the lot of you.

    I'm still hoping that it's not out yet. Drow is confirmed, halfling will see it's thread whenever the last beta takes place and halfling still isn't available. That makes two races that were supposed to make it for launch that won't.
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    drudgydrudgy Member Posts: 39 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    I hope the wizard makes it in, I was hoping to run as one of those, but if not, I guess i'd roll a Cleric or something just for fun until it did come out.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Click my Sig to view our community website
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    rahverahve Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 35
    edited February 2013
    Don't care about the drow delay. Was gonna play human anyway. The cool kids that want to be drow from day one already paid 200$ for it.
    It matters not how strait the gate,
    How charged with punishments the scroll.
    I am the master of my fate:
    I am the captain of my soul.

    - W.E.H.
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    magicelzomagicelzo Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    Well, my original plan to start with a Drow Trickster Rogue just fell apart. :)
    Doesn't matter. Will play a Half-Orc Great Weapon Fighter or a Dwarven Guardian Fighter then. Most likely will play them both.
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    lemonkingilemonkingi Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    FYI There are two types of Drow Entries for character creation. Not one.

    Drow Species Text:
    Drow are a decadent race of dark elves whose beauty and sophistication fail to mask hearts all too often stained in evil. The vast majority of dark elves base their behavior and attitudes on the worship of the chaotic evil goddess Lolth, also known as the Spider Queen.

    Drow society is organized into houses. The heads of the most powerful houses occupy leadership position in the various cities of the Underdark, the subterranean realm beneath Faerun that the dark elves call home.
    Menzoberranzan Renegade aka Drow Renegade Text:
    Drow from the city of Menzoberranzan are raised in a world of lies and treachery. The noble houses of these dark elves are in constant conflict, vying for power and the favor of their evil goddess, Lolth the Spider Queen.

    Sometimes a drow tires of the constant strife. Others see through the corrupt dogma of the Way of Lolth and seek a better way. There is no place within Menzoberranzan society for such drow and when discovered are branded as renegades, outcast from their house, and exiled from the city.

    I've been rooting through the client for sometime now.
    http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?59811-Some-Neverwinter-Datamined-Info-%28Race-Class-Art-and-Text%29


    Defs/Species/Dragonborn_Female.Species
    Defs/Species/Dragonborn_Male.Species
    Defs/Species/Drow_Female.Species
    Defs/Species/Drow_Male.Species
    Defs/Species/Drowrenegade_Female.Species
    Defs/Species/Drowrenegade_Male.Species

    Defs/Species/Dwarf_Female.Species
    Defs/Species/Dwarf_Male.Species
    Defs/Species/Elf_Female.Species
    Defs/Species/Elf_Male.Species
    Defs/Species/Halfelf_Female.Species
    Defs/Species/Halfelf_Male.Species
    Defs/Species/Halfling_Female.Species
    Defs/Species/Halfling_Male.Species
    Defs/Species/Halforc_Female.Species
    Defs/Species/Halforc_Male.Species
    Defs/Species/Human_Female.Species
    Defs/Species/Human_Male.Species
    Defs/Species/Tiefling_Male.Species
    Defs/Species/Tiefling_Female.Species
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    falleniciclefallenicicle Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 36
    edited February 2013
    chili1179 wrote: »
    I am amazed that no one is throwing a single fit about the omission of halflings from that list of playable races.

    Racists, the lot of you.

    Wait.... WHAT?

    They removed Halflings? WTH? They're in the beta and look just fine. Why would they remove them now?
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    thecainthecain Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    lemonkingi wrote: »
    FYI There are two types of Drow Entries for character creation. Not one.

    I think this proves outright that this is just a cash grab then. Clearly, the Renegades are a race in and of themselves, but they're still taking Drow from everyone else. I seriously don't see why they had to do this, then, if they have the race in there and all ready to go. So not only do they get the Renegades, they get exclusivity to the Drow for 2 months.

    http://youtu.be/kNRFsk49Hxc <--- Describes all my feelings at this point.
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    shaudiusshaudius Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    thecain wrote: »
    I think this proves outright that this is just a cash grab then. Clearly, the Renegades are a race in and of themselves, but they're still taking Drow from everyone else. I seriously don't see why they had to do this, then, if they have the race in there and all ready to go. So not only do they get the Renegades, they get exclusivity to the Drow for 2 months.

    http://youtu.be/kNRFsk49Hxc <--- Describes all my feelings at this point.

    Why? What in your opinion is the fundamental difference between two separate entries on the race page and an additional selection once you clicked the drow race.
    Neverwinter Foundry Fansite with IRC Chatroom - http://www.tavernugc.com. Chatroom also available through IRC on irc.geekshed.net, #tavernugc.
    Neverwinter Official Wiki - http://neverwinter.gamepedia.com/
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    visionstorm01visionstorm01 Member Posts: 561 Bounty Hunter
    edited February 2013
    keirkin wrote: »
    Oh me too. I think I would give mine to hmm visionstorm01 I think, he/she/it seems like someone deserving. Not a crazy zealot. Sometimes a little over the top but I respect that :) The table flipping thing was funny ;)


    Unfortunately I doubt it will happen :(


    Hey, can you buy a founders pack as a gift?

    I'm not a crazy zealot, YAY! \o/

    *dances, then trips over the flipped table*

    (answer underlined)
    I look at it this way - if they say they won't sell anything but fluff, they shouldn't sell anything but fluff, regardless of anyone's feelings on who's supporting the game or not.

    And Cryptic has officially taken STO into Pay-to-Win, thanks to the newest ship that has the most forward weapon slots and tactical consoles available in the game!

    I still maintain my position that they shouldn't limit themselves to just fluff, but explore ways to provide products and/or services that would be appealing and desireable to players of every demographic and preference. Not only because it's fair, but because it provides the means for all players to contribute financially, which should provide the company with increased profits and help ensure the game's continuous growth. Its also interesting to note that the sole reason (some) game companies try to stay away from so called Pay to Win is because of people's feelings on it, and ironic that the feelings of the ones that wouldn't pay in such scenarios are the ones that are taken into consideration.

    But things like the STO ships, freeform slots in CO and more feel me with confidence that regardless of anything they say or anyone that defends them: 1) Cryptic WILL sell power and features other than just fluff, and 2) You cannot trust anything that Cryptic says*.

    That being said, on the P2W subject in particular, I have no problem with it as long as 1) we are also able to get comparable gear/power through regular gameplay as normal to what we can get from the store and 2) they never lock the best gear/power exclusively through the store (which apparently in STO they already did, but I hope they add an equivalent ship optainable through in-game means as well).

    *this last part being unfortunate and not the best position to be with a company you may want to support, but it does feel me with a tiny bit of "I told you so" feeling any time someone contradicts me on this and Cryptic proves me right
    ____________________________
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    wulfster42wulfster42 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 183 Bounty Hunter
    edited February 2013
    Wait.... WHAT?

    They removed Halflings? WTH? They're in the beta and look just fine. Why would they remove them now?

    I'm with you. I'm not going to go crazy and moan and complain, but I'm a fan of halflings myself and thought they were fine (although seemed like the best choice for all 3 classes to be honest to me). They might have been out of balance a bit because of that.

    The Dex/Con combo was probably the best for all melee types (rogue/guardian/GWF) and the Con/Wisdom was the best for cleric (think you could go Con/Wisdom but it might have been Dex/Wisdom whatever). The racial bonuses where good as well (don't remember them off the top of my head but might have been +1 crit/+1 parry and something else).

    Anyway, I don't have a "favorite" race (as in I only play that race) but I do love playing haflling characters. I'll certainly miss having them as a race at launch if they are not there.
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    elminbanelminban Member Posts: 187 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    Mr. Andre the Giant gave you the Cryptic Shuffle, I give you their song and dance that follows it:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOwhrCkMiKA

    Don't get rid of Halflings!
    2.jpg
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    infrasoundxinfrasoundx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 33
    edited February 2013
    So much qq by people starting these threads. You get Drow FREE after 60 days!!!! you're just not from Menzo so the 1 pager with the background and some mandatory racials will differ.? Big deal?

    People cried about the borg playable race in STO all the same and guess what they all have borg now anyway.
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    kadlenakadlena Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 298
    edited February 2013
    wulfster42 wrote: »
    ... If I could transfer my right to play a drow to someone else, I would do so in a second.

    Me too.

    I usually just roll with changes like this, especially when a game is still in Beta. But the way in which it was chosen to reveal this "clarification"......about all I can say is Ick!!--bad taste in my mouth!!

    I guess my definition of "FAQ" is different from PWE/Cryptic's definition. Before this whole issue boiled over, I never saw one person negatively answer the question (in any thread that I read, anyway.....) "If I don't buy a Founder's Pack, can I still play a regular drow?"

    Lesson learned....I'll be checking the FAQ more often for other "quiet" updates.

    I can even live without halflings for the time being. (Don't want to sound racist, really I don't. :confused: )

    But please, somebody officially, please, PLEASE tell me that having (at least some type of...) wizard at launch is not still needing "clarification???"
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    gwenzelthargwenzelthar Member Posts: 138 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    Very odd that the wizard is off the list, yet its still on the cards for beta2?...i confused, guess ill just roll with the punches and see what we are given to play with. Im sure ill enjoy which ever race/class combo i end up with anyway!

    :)
    jonforgottenrealmssmall.jpg
    "I cannot be caged! I cannot be controlled! Understand this as you die, ever pathetic, ever fools!"
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    viaxusviaxus Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 66
    edited February 2013
    Think it is because the wizard has been sent back several times in beta to be remade...they are just covering their bases in case its not ready for launch...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    zylaxxzylaxx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 591 Bounty Hunter
    edited February 2013
    So much qq by people starting these threads. You get Drow FREE after 60 days!!!! you're just not from Menzo so the 1 pager with the background and some mandatory racials will differ.? Big deal?

    People cried about the borg playable race in STO all the same and guess what they all have borg now anyway.

    Great how would you like it if you had to wait 60 days to play the game. Or spend 60 days playing a class/race only to have to start all over because now they released a race more to your liking.

    Please ask yourself, what is your plan for a race/class combo? Now imagine if you couldnt played it even though its been announced on the front pages for over an year but to appease someone else you are now forced to wait to play what you originaly had hoped too.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Character is what a man is in the dark
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    bedroomjesusbedroomjesus Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 0
    edited February 2013
    zylaxx wrote: »
    Great how would you like it if you had to wait 60 days to play the game. Or spend 60 days playing a class/race only to have to start all over because now they released a race more to your liking.

    Please ask yourself, what is your plan for a race/class combo? Now imagine if you couldnt played it even though its been announced on the front pages for over an year but to appease someone else you are now forced to wait to play what you originaly had hoped too.

    Wow, you really are upset aren't you? I don't think overreacting, crying, and boycotting the company will do anything in your favor. Good luck with that though.
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    torskaldrtorskaldr Member Posts: 559 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    I think it's a really poor marketing choice on their part, but of course it's their game and they can do what they want. Public perception is huge and doing things that make you look bad is just, well, bad.

    I plan on playing a half-elf to start, but I still think it was bad choice to lock this sort of thing.
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    keirkinkeirkin Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    zylaxx wrote: »
    Great how would you like it if you had to wait 60 days to play the game. Or spend 60 days playing a class/race only to have to start all over because now they released a race more to your liking.

    Please ask yourself, what is your plan for a race/class combo? Now imagine if you couldnt played it even though its been announced on the front pages for over an year but to appease someone else you are now forced to wait to play what you originaly had hoped too.

    I wouldn't care. I would make up my mind at the time of the release to see what is available and play that. If something came along 60 days later and I wanted to change to that because I liked it more I would. You can most likely level up and gear up to max 2 characters in 60 played hours (1 hour a day for 60 days) days the way this game is going. Murphy happens, that is why I don't put all my eggs in one class/race basket so to speak I wait to see that is actually available at launch, not what the hope is will be available at launch. Yeah yeah I know, they said <insert "promise" here>......If i had a dollar for everytime a game developer said something and it didn't happen I could retire.
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    tazrakunetazrakune Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 55
    edited February 2013
    It is just like any game that adds new races during expansion packs. Yah, it's a bummer to start from scratch after working on a different character, but players do it anyway.

    I feel this is really a minor issue that is being blown out of proportion.
    JerroldNeverwintersig_zps8ecd4397.jpg
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    torskaldrtorskaldr Member Posts: 559 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    tazrakune wrote: »
    It is just like any game that adds new races during expansion packs. Yah, it's a bummer to start from scratch after working on a different character, but players do it anyway.

    I feel this is really a minor issue that is being blown out of proportion.

    Would it be a minor issue if you couldn't play the race and/or class that you envisioned when you start the game? By the time an xpac comes around players are ready to try something new. That is most likely why new races or classes are added, to give a fresh feel to the the game.

    It is a minor issue and a total first world problem, but then again this is entertainment and perception is everything. They have one single chance to make the right first impression. It's not the end of the world if they don't, but it's sitting there and they only get one shot.

    If it's truly a minor issue then that logic spins both ways and it should be a big deal to reconsider how they're presenting the game.
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    angryspriteangrysprite Member Posts: 4,982 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    torskaldr wrote: »
    Would it be a minor issue if you couldn't play the race and/or class that you envisioned when you start the game? By the time an xpac comes around players are ready to try something new. That is most likely why new races or classes are added, to give a fresh feel to the the game.

    It is a minor issue and a total first world problem, but then again this is entertainment and perception is everything. They have one single chance to make the right first impression. It's not the end of the world if they don't, but it's sitting there and they only get one shot.

    If it's truly a minor issue then that logic spins both ways and it should be a big deal to reconsider how they're presenting the game.

    Impressions are relative and subjective, meaning you are saying your impression is more important than my impression if my impression is not the same as yours. The fact is most people couldn't care any less. Anyone who takes this whole scenario so seriously as to actually become angered needs to step back and reevaluate their priorities.

    This is a game. A toy. A diversional entertainment. 1) Cryptic are not charging money for the thing, 2) all they're doing is delaying it's availability 3) it is now and always will be worth every penny you paid for it. So get a grip, get a clue, and seriously, get a... no, no I will not insult you or anyone else by bringing the "life" word into it. But I'm sure by now you get my meaning.

    Not having a cartoon that you play games with for a couple months after the game starts is not the end of the world.
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    bruddajokkabruddajokka Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 447 Bounty Hunter
    edited February 2013
    You know all they said was that it'd be a launch race when they announced it. Which it is. Nothing was said about availibilty at the time.
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    torskaldrtorskaldr Member Posts: 559 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    Impressions are relative and subjective, meaning you are saying your impression is more important than my impression if my impression is not the same as yours. The fact is most people couldn't care any less. Anyone who takes this whole scenario so seriously as to actually become angered needs to step back and reevaluate their priorities.

    This is a game. A toy. A diversional entertainment. 1) Cryptic are not charging money for the thing, 2) all they're doing is delaying it's availability 3) it is now and always will be worth every penny you paid for it. So get a grip, get a clue, and seriously, get a... no, no I will not insult you or anyone else by bringing the "life" word into it. But I'm sure by now you get my meaning.

    Not having a cartoon that you play games with for a couple months after the game starts is not the end of the world.

    I'm not saying my impression is more important than yours. YOU said that. I'm saying general public perception is more weighty than facts. Those who are informed might not care one way or the other, but the perception of the public and how a game is viewed weighs heavier. For example there is a perception that sub-free games with a cash shop are "pay to win". Pay to win is a subjective nonsense propaganda term, but that perception colors the view of outsiders and potential customers. In the same way, there is a perception that cash shops equate to a more costly gaming experience. I don't believe either of those and my gaming cost has gone down since I've stop funding sub-locked games. However, my truth doesn't sway public perception.

    You made a claim that "most people couldn't care any less". Prove it. First you put words in my mouth, then you make an outlandish claim you can't support. Can you prove that most people don't care?

    You've already been insulting, but your juvenile ranting still won't change public perception. It's not going to bother me since I'm playing a half-elven DC. I get your meaning but in your myopic need to be right and make sure everyone agrees with you, you're missing the point. I'll put it short and sweet so you can wrap your head around it: It's bad PR.
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    syberghostsyberghost Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 2,474
    edited February 2013
    IMHO, the thread title is misleading; more like "Wizard timing uncertain". Nobody doubts there will be wizards.
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    fmstalkerfmstalker Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 3 Arc User
    edited March 2013
    You know, if they come tomorrow and say, "Okay. Here's the Drow. We'll make it free for everyone on launch day. Founders Pack Purchases still get a unique version, but we are also including the Half-Orc race exclusive for 60 days as a bonus."

    You'll see a ton of people come in here and whine about that. It's like, "We don't care that these people made a hefty investment into a game in which I will play without spending a dime, we want everything they get too...for free."

    People buy things all the time and don't have to share with you. You have to buy your own. Instead of feeling lucky that you ever get to touch the Drow, people want to whine that they don't get it right now. If it's really that important to you, you'd pony up the cash too. They could easily just make it Founder's Pack Exclusive forever, so if you miss out you can never get it.

    People who paid for it should get it first. In my opinion, it should be exclusive for a lot longer than 60 days.

    The first thing I hear people say is, "I can't afford 200 bucks."

    To that I can only reply, "Then you realize what was spent by those who bought the pack. That should show you that getting the Drow exclusively for a while is acceptable considering the money that was spent."

    It's not like someone won a contest and you weren't lucky enough to win it. They bought something you didn't. That is the way life works.
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