Last, I think it could be a good idea to give a way to restore divinity faster, something like AP gain, that could be in companions or artifacts (called divinity gain for example)
this would be a paladin and a cleric specific artifact/companion, other classes don't have divinity what that arctifact would give them? i don't think it can work.
But the idea is nice, they could bound it to another stat like ap gain, or outgoing healing, or even critical strike ( i mean why not?) ; this way ap gain / outgoing healing will increase the ap gain / outgoing healing and it will give a perentage increase in the dinivity gain or whatever the warlock use (this has to be a class mechanics).
it can also give player peace of mind beacuse they can control their divinity gain , in the same way they can control ap gain and stamina regeneration.
I have two things I wish to bring up to you @asterdahl. I know it is too late for both, but I will waste my time to say them anyway.
The first is the overshield. It is a problematic, divisive mechanic and it needs to go away. Completly. For real. Overshields are a proactive form of preventing damage. That in itself negates the reason for a heal role to exist. If no one takes damage, no one needs heals, no one dies. Overshields are better than healing in every way because they prevent the need for healing entirely. If you are serious about healing existing in this game as an active, required role, then overshields need to go the way of powercreep. I don't want smurf bars added to cleric and sw. I want them removed entirely as a mechanic. Because only then will there actually be a need for heals. YOU said that's what you want. Smurf bars have become the new AA spam. They completely negate pretty much every mechanic you can ever throw at us aside from flat out killing us in the same way AA+powercreep did. What are you going to do about it? Secondly, there is a real definitive difference in how to build a character to run with a pallyheal as opposed to a healheal. Smurf bars can cover a deficiency in HP and defense. Clerics/SW cannot. People who are going to run with a healheal need to have capped defense and approximately 25k+ additional HP. People are not going to rebuild their character every time they switch healers. They simply won't won't run with the healers who can't smurf bar. You gave a baby shield to SW, yay for them right? Actually no. Since Pally still does it better, it's not going to change things much. So not only is your mechanic negating the intended role functionality, it's divisive and problematic for people. People are getting left out and not having fun because of it. And I'd like to remind you that this was pointed out in M16 beta that the overshield would be a problem going forward. Many of us pointed this out.
The second major point I'd like to make, knowing it's too late, is that console players have less precise aiming capability. This new precise, single target and heal-divided-by-targets paradigm is going to absolutely punish us. I'm a very unskilled PC player. I only play NW on PC to preview. But even I can notice the difference in ability to aim. Take ToMM as an example. Ask anyone on console how often they've wiped on Permafrost because the attacks hit Halaster instead of the ice even though the targeting recticle was highlighting the ice. It happens even in the best groups. And that's in a controlled environment. Everyone is standing still in predetermined spots. You take a chaotic environment like a heroic encounter, and it's impossible. There is quite literally no way to pick out a particular target effectively every time you need to. Sometimes I'm gonna get lucky and hit the person, but more often I'm not. People are going to die because heals are missed, and it won't be the player's fault. This precise targeting problem will also affect AoE heals since you've now made all AoE heals targeted as well. (This was the one shining star of SW in that Shatterspark did not target at all. Hit button, heals go. This functionality needs to be restored to SW.) Nine times out of ten I'm either going to miss someone with a heal because I have to err on the side of hitting fewer targets or I'm going to hit everyone because I don't have five minutes to finangle the circle to only hit the two people who need heals. In addition to hitting everyone who plays on console, this will hit especially hard people who have less than perfect fine motor skills. You will be removing three entire classes from being a possibility for some people to play. I actually know a few people who currently play heals because it's more forgiving on targeting things than the other roles, and they struggle to target because of fine motor problems. This is a MAJOR compatibility problem with your changes.
My point of view is exactly the same. Maybe if damage would less "one shot" and more over time..... example not one shot by 1.000.000 but 1.000.000 of dmage in 5 seconds... may be heals became importants.... but for now if you have an OP in party there is no sense to have other healers.... Blue bar is WIN WIN..... and not only affect 5 ppl but 10 or more.... is like bobble now if you have one OP heal can do Tomm with no problem...... why say 2 healers when one OP can do it in solo? I like every chanhes to upgrade healing system but the only way is to nerf bluebar or switch off them.
the only way is to nerf bluebar or switch off them.
if thing stay like this i agree, but if we have different ways to reach the same goal, maybe not. examples: palading give shield --> player has more HP can withstand damage. cleric give buff --> player has more damage resistance, the attack deal less damage, can withstand damage, warlock give debuff --> boss deal less damage, player can withstand damage.
now if we have the 'weakest combination' it could work pretty well (player more resistant to damage and weakened attack), surely it need adjustemnt for it to work, the buff and debuff can't be too weak or they will be useless and the shield sould not be enought alone; but it's a way to make all thing working and not nerfing the paladin.
( Firstly, you've got an error somewhere that makes the comment get deleted if someone else posts a comment while you edit)
As a warlock main, these are my two cents about the changes so far.
- Cleanse. The warlock needs a cleanse - any cleanse. A healer without a cleanse is an incomplete healer, and being the one class without a cleanse is going to guarantee we will not be picked for runs.
- Revitalize One of the major things that made the warlock fun and unique to me, was the strategical aspect of positioning and being more active in combat. The fact that positioning well could make or break the success of the role is very rewarding and where a difference in skill has a large impact. Having an aimed heal (and with a divinity bar to boot) makes the class feel much more like a point and click cleric, only with green colors.
Also, the cost of 200 is a bit too high. If something goes sideways, I'll only be able to cast 5 of them before running out of soulweave, and there is no good panic insta regen option here. I think 150 would be a better cost. That'd give me 6 of them with a little left over for some emergency ST healing.
-Shields. So far from what I have seen, the shield the warlocks can put up are tiny. Nowhere near where I'd expect a 450 magnitude heal from a player with all 5 outgoing heal companions and 150k+ power. And they don't stack, so no way of making the shield bigger by casting several times. This makes them feel quite redundant in their current form.
-The ST tab mechanic is interesting and quite practical. No need to find the tank in a huge pile of mobs if they're already tagged. I think this is a fun change. The slight delay when pressing tab and when the tank gets healed might be troublesome, but on the other hand, might teach players to anticipate, so I don't think it's a bad thing (yet).
sure, important thing is that NO one single healer can do 10 ppl activity alone. And the best would be if different healers are best in some situations not like now where OP is the best in everythings cause blue shields are like bubble of the past.... And i'm not speaking about if player "have hands" etc etc..... simply one healer can't be viable in 10 ppl activity.
sure, important thing is that NO one single healer can do 10 ppl activity alone. And the best would be if different healers are best in some situations not like now where OP is the best in everythings cause blue shields are like bubble of the past.... And i'm not speaking about if player "have hands" etc etc..... simply one healer can't be viable in 10 ppl activity.
Is something going to be done to randoms to compensate for that? Because the chances of getting a second healer that is completely incompetent or AFK right now is higher than acceptable.
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micky1p00Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,594Arc User
edited May 2020
Issues with current changes
1. The Tab mark is part of the character model, but the HP and name UI are rotated as billboard to align to the camera. It is fine when viewed from a low angle, but when viewed from higher angle (which most healers do, to see an better overview of the players) the hp and names cover the mark completely. It takes unproprtional amount of time to wiggle to see if the player is marked or not. Not good if need to use it as clutch healing.
2. The tab targeting is clunky, it will often mistarget and either mark self, or not mark or don't know. It just doesn't work well.
3. In general targeted skills do not work well in NW. It's extremely hard to hit the correct person among other players, pets and what not. It was apparent with older pre m16 buff skills that player often opted to target bind to names. It is often easier to target an AoE circle on one player than hit the same player with direct line targeted skill. For example I find it much easier to hit one person with old (current on live) divine touch (for example if I want to recast it for a chance at crit barrier without overrding other players) than to aim cure wound.
4. To add to the above, cure wound animation lock is extremely annoying, it rotates and locks, it will be, IMO much more fluid if the char could move during and it will not target lock. Also, cure wound doesn't barrier?
5. New divine touch and the split magnitude:
Numbers are from memory so there maybe a mistake, but the idea holds
Currently Divine Touch is 100% useless, due to the cut-off, which is about two people, for 1 person, I get 1k magnitude from it for 200 divinity or I can use my at-will and get 500 magnitude for 40 divinity or so.
So for one person, which needs healing this is a waste of divinity. If we want to barrier we can use the tab for better effect. So for one person it's a no go.
For two people I get 500 magnitude per person for 200 divinity. But I need to hit the exact two people I want, and this is harder than hitting one person. But the worse issue is that 2 people with Divine Shelter will be 450 magnitude each, for 220 dvinity, and I get the same for the whole up to 10 people group in a single cast. With only 3 encounters available there is just not room to slot Divine touch.
The split magnitude perhaps can work, but it needs to be balanced comparatively so perhaps non linear divide, or another option is to look at it as AoE skill with bonus to single for example to balance it with better magnitude / divinity ratio than divine shelter due to the lower area, for example 550 / 180 (3/1 vs DS 2/1) but with bonus for example 25% higher magnitude if hitting 2 players, and 50% more if hitting only one player. (numbers are just for example, could be 50% and 100% higher, whatever balanced)
6. The new tab mechanics:
As now, with cure wounds and Divine shelter covering both single target heals, and AoE wide heals and barrier, the main usage of this is single target barrier. IMO, this is very unsatisfying and not versatile for a class mechanics (I must say this is the case for other classes as well). More so with Divine Shelter overriding it and it takes 3 seconds channeling to get a better effect, aaaand it requires the mark to be set upfront. Very clunky, but still wouldn't justify usage of Divine touch instead of it. So we have this.
Assuming a tune to the mark and cure wound adds barrier, I would suggest the mark to have separate effect, for example the person under the mark will have forced crit. Or mitigation + DoT heal (that may take divinity). Or for example mitigation in form of damage to them reduces paladins divinity / stamina (like shared damage).
And the channeling tab can have different effect, for example an aura/AoE heal, that increases in size the longer it is held, but the cost overhead increases too. So a short hold will create a very small circle around the paladin that will generate 1200 magnitude heal for 130 divinity (~9 /1 ), holding longer increases the size but worsens the costs to for example 1100 magnitude heals for 150 (`7.3/1) divinity and so on, non linearly, and not in jumps but just a non linear function which I can provide examples but I don't wont to overly distract with math. (It will stop growing when not enough divinity)
This mechanics will create a better ratio at the very close ranges as the player costs of needing to get to the target and risk life and limb + channel near them, especially risky in case of tanks and the ratio will decrease per the wanted changes to create less potent AoE and better single (or lower number) target heals. It will encourage better group dynamics of staying close, and will create more engaging pliability for the paladin due to the need to constantly moving to get the best return on divinity.
Other possible options to tab mechanics can be mitigation aura at depleting divinity for example like the tank paragon enables tab mode.
Similarly it can be aura that buffs damage, or debuffs targets, or creates damage DoT, this can sinergyse with the auras that can be sloted (class feats, the yellow slots). For example slotting a mitigation aura will constantly mitigate 3%, switching to the "aura mode" with tab will mitigate 20% (for everyone in vicinity) at the constant cost of divinity ticks.
Or channeling tab can deplete divinity at some rate but force crit on all skills.
7. Still existing issues with dailies and class feats: The rework didn't change that the dailies are mostly dead, for example sanctuary, the heal aspect is completely useless due to the channeling effect, it's to weak to not heal at the same time, but we can't heal at the same time. Added to that that the mitigation must be activated before various dots, like heatwave in ToMM or this Hypo in Zariel or it will not take effect, so it just not good. Lay on hands, and entire daily that 3 clicks of at-will can do now.
Similar issue with class feats and slotable auras, most are just not viable and have no use, which is a shame.
Last, I think it could be a good idea to give a way to restore divinity faster, something like AP gain, that could be in companions or artifacts (called divinity gain for example)
this would be a paladin and a cleric specific artifact/companion, other classes don't have divinity what that arctifact would give them? i don't think it can work.
But the idea is nice, they could bound it to another stat like ap gain, or outgoing healing, or even critical strike ( i mean why not?) ; this way ap gain / outgoing healing will increase the ap gain / outgoing healing and it will give a perentage increase in the dinivity gain or whatever the warlock use (this has to be a class mechanics).
it can also give player peace of mind beacuse they can control their divinity gain , in the same way they can control ap gain and stamina regeneration.
You are right. It was an example but yes, It could come from other forms like class equip or something
I think that a pally with overshield will remain the best option and will be the only thing people want in their parties for tomm. As mentioned above, giving clerics better damage reduction for the party (astral shield is only 10%, that is too small to even be noticed) might be a good route rather than changing paladins. Warlock making the boss deal less damage is a great idea to let them bring something unique to the table, as long as it is a high enough percentage (using cleric again as example, geas reduces 5% boss damage and is useless). I'm specifically thinking of moments in tomm like fire phase and lightning where people use their griffons. Its really sad cleric still has abilities with no use. Astral Shield 10% not enough and the heal is not high enough to help, should be 25% damage reduction and restore people standing in it to full health if they drop below 20% health. Geas 5%? Remove it's damage dealing property, switch it to devout only and reduce boss damag by 25%. Cleansing touch was used back when we needed to remove damage over time poison in 1st fight of FBI and Svardborg, as well as those horrible runic debuffs in master expeditions that everyone hates. Outside of those 3 niche this encounter is well.. not useful.
Does any healer class have spell which can remove revive sickness? If not it then maybe cleric could get it instead of having temporary shields. It should obviously have quite a long cooldown, but i dont play healer roles so ill leave the balancing stuff to someone who understands it more.
After having done some dungeons with my DC on preview:
FEEDBACK: First of all, I absolutely agree with Janne's point: targeting in this game is bad. Switching the mark between the tanks or getting the at will to target the right player has been a terrible experience. Healing has become more difficult, not because of well designed complex mechanics, but due to clunky targeting. Also, the mark symbol is really hard to see. Please make it more visible, and make the marked person highlighted in the party member list (maybe some symbol near/around the aggro meter?).
FEEDBACK: I understand (and agree to some degree) with the motivation for nerfing the healing companions. However, 3% is too low, making power companions better for players with lower power. Even though this might be intended, it may be very upsetting to new players who just got and upgraded their healing companions but still haven't got to endgame power levels. Maybe consider making the companions give 4 or 5% at legendary. It probably won't be overpowered but may reduce general frustration with the change.
FEEDBACK: Cleric's main "feature" was big AoE heals. This isn't really the case anymore, as SW restoration will "recover" 3000 magnitude when paired with the barrier feat (for comparison, on live, current Cleric's bastion is 750, OP's Divine touch is 700 when combined with barrier, unless it crits). Even if SW wasn't stronger, the general nerf to AoE healing means that the Cleric's main advantage wouldn't be present anyway (so don't even think of nerfing the new SW please). This, coupled with the fact that Cleric is the only healing class without "temp HP" in M19, gives me the feeling we really got the short end of the stick this time. Will something be done to ensure Cleric has decent mitigation abilities, now that we can't "overheal" the damage we can't mitigate like we used to? Compared to the Barrier mechanics, Astral Shield feels absolutely inadequate. Hallowed Ground is decent but needing a daily for decent mitigation, while the other two can mitigate much more with an encounter, doesn't feel fair.
BUG: Battle Prayer completely disables the last feat choice from activating. Ideally, it would reduce the cast time and we could activate them faster. If that is considered "too overpowered", then at least we should be able to activate the last feat by holding tab for the default cast time.
> @sunshinehappy#2439 said: > I think that a pally with overshield will remain the best option and will be the only thing people want in their parties for tomm. As mentioned above, giving clerics better damage reduction for the party (astral shield is only 10%, that is too small to even be noticed) might be a good route rather than changing paladins. Warlock making the boss deal less damage is a great idea to let them bring something unique to the table, as long as it is a high enough percentage (using cleric again as example, geas reduces 5% boss damage and is useless). I'm specifically thinking of moments in tomm like fire phase and lightning where people use their griffons. > Its really sad cleric still has abilities with no use. Astral Shield 10% not enough and the heal is not high enough to help, should be 25% damage reduction and restore people standing in it to full health if they drop below 20% health. > Geas 5%? Remove it's damage dealing property, switch it to devout only and reduce boss damag by 25%. > Cleansing touch was used back when we needed to remove damage over time poison in 1st fight of FBI and Svardborg, as well as those horrible runic debuffs in master expeditions that everyone hates. Outside of those 3 niche this encounter is well.. not useful.
Exactly. Even with all these changing in healing, and their new mechanics, Palaheal still seem to be the best candidate in most situations.
If in an endgame trial, a specific class is needed for a certain role, that means it’s not balanced. Take it ToMM, for example, where Palaheal is a must. You can add then any other of the two classes left to fill the healing gap, or ditch them completely if you’re running with an experience group. Sometimes just healing is not enough, you want to protect your group from taking damage - something Clerics and Warlocks lack, in comparison to Palaheal blue shields.
As long as there is no change on this regard, the other two healing classes will most of the times be relegated.
Ugh, I hate that editing removes posts. Summary again @asterdahl
Instead of trying to make SW into a Cleric/Pallyheal mashup, do the opposite. You are admitting with these changes that your healing system is flawed and fundamentally not fun. There is too much down time standing around to pray. With the changes there's too much down time standing there doing nothing. Because attacking is just as pointless at standing there praying, let's be honest. This is true, as I said earlier. But I'd like to point out that this is NOT true on SW heals. (Disclaimer: I've mained a cleric for 5 years and hubby plays a Pally. I tried SW for the first time two months ago on the advice of a friend because I'm always bored playing cleric heals.) SW heals are smaller so I cast them more frequently. PoP recharges and needs to be placed again in 12 seconds. I'm constantly doing something that's actually important and necessary to healing, and it's AMAZING. (So yeah, put that CD back. We want to do more, not less. Stop making things take even longer.)
Playing SW heals they are underperforming in numbers, but you should be looking at adapting the SW playstyle into Cleric and Pally instead of wiping it out. The SW is actually fun to play if you'd just boost the mags a tiny bit so it can be competitive. (And remove Overshield from everyone so that heals can be a competitive market). Smaller, more frequent heals give me something to do with my time that is MEANINGFUL to fullfilling my role. I want that on my cleric. And more importantly, I want that to NOT BE TAKEN AWAY from SW.
I'd also like to reiterate that the soulspark spiral is a better design than a divinity bar. Instead of removing the soulspark spiral, I'd actually prefer to see the divinity bar reworked instead to be more like it. The soulspark spiral is more conducive to at-a-glance knowing how much "resource" I have and what I can do with it. It is incremented meaningfully into divisions which are the "cost" of a power. I can see the "resource" filling the bar to create a cirle. I know that the cirlce is one cast of a power. So I can immediately see I can cast shatterspark three times or bargain six times for example. I can immediately see how close I am to reganing enough "resource" to cast another power. Also, the fact that the numbers are small and instantly workable even in any brain, even my 7 year old can manage soulsparks because 6-30 are numbers she can work in her head and the fact that they are divided into the individual cost dots make it visually instantaneous, is WAY better than the amorphous 1000 divinity bar. The divnity bar is a guessing game that people have to play by feel. I have "about" 3/4 of a bar, which I "should" be able to cast Healing Word, then at least two(?) Bastions, but I'm probably gonna be tabbing and soothing, so how is that gonna add up...
Didn't even bother to test, but if the warlock shield is replacing the one from paladins there are only 2 options, make it so the bigger shield stays on the player and won't be replaced by a lower one or 2 - just don't pick the feet that gives a shield to warlock encounters and ignore the new at-will.
1) I honestly don't see the point of Souleater, if you are in a dung you will never use it cuz you will want all your soulwave to heal. And if you are soloing, most prolly you would go Hellbringer, and if you don't you would still save it as heal emergencie.
2) Take out the shield and let us give Temp HP. Our shields are so lame and overwrite the ones of the pallys, so we will get excluded and with the day 1 of the new mod on live, the forum might collapse with hate posts.
3) Warlock's Bargain should stay the same as in mod 18.
4) PoP cd its way too long and gives really little bufs, and a increase to 10% won't do anything.
5) Small shields and small heals make us a watered mix of pally and cleric. This will not change the fact of "lf1m heal OP/DC". No one would want us if they have a OP cuz we will screw their shields, and why would they want us when they can get a better shield from the OP?
6) The new soulwave bar it's not that good for us, we loved the spark one, was intuitive.
7) Don't hate the new tab, but i would love some active way to recover "soulwave". Cuz you might think that this way ppl will start to play it safe or smart, but no. Yolo players won't stop doing what they do and blaming the healers.
8) Souleater and Borrowed Spirit could be changed for team buffs. Souleater: Enemies close to you deal % less dmg. Borrowed Spirit: Share % of your power to the party or the new Life Bind. This way we could have a reason to be accepted in a party.
About feats:
Soultheft: Small gain-big CD, no one would choose it over Oversoul, and would never choose it if the use their shift correctly.
Hellpact: Make it Temp HP with more than just 50%, or just make a new feat. Right now its useless even tho the idea was good.
We soulweavers need love for real, if you want to make us a mix of them at least make us a great mix. I don't ask you to nerf the others, just to make us as good as them so we can run with anyone. Right now you only made stronger the division. Whats the point of having a soulweaver now? The buffs? They are smaller than the heals, won't last too much and takes nearly 25secs just to have them for 6secs. The shields? Why a warlock when you can get a OP?. Heals? Nah, really small, if you can't find a DC just get some stones. All thats left for us its to hope that they won't kick us from trials so they can get another OP or DC.
The meta it's just a guideline. And guidelines are boring.
Soulweaver: The Lovely Red Minstrel: The Rose Troubadour
My first message has been deleted. Great experience. And sorry for my bnad english.
I’m playing a cleric as healer. I’m playing with average players very well geared (as they invested many time in game). One of them is colorblind, another one-eyed. When can’t pretend epic instances such as TIC or ToMM. Actually we are enjoying ToNG and CoDG.
Without spell revamp. The personal heals : - Less heal bonus from companions (10% down to 3% each) - Less heal bonus from wisdom (0,5% down to 0,25% each 1 wis) Consequence heal score 161,5% down to 124,4% so 23% of loss.
Teams mates bonus healing : - Less received heal bonus from companions (10% down to 3% each) - Less received heal bonus from tactical enchant (6% down to 2% each) - Less received heal bonus from guild boon (15% down to 5%) It’s a major issue for tanks aiming at being easily refilled in HP. Generally they equipped guild boons and 5 tacticals. They are smashed down from 45% down to 15%. So it’s a 20,7% loss.
Combining the two losses we have a 234% heals received smashed down to 143%. So it’s a 39,1% loss in heals. I’m OK with this. Only this is a very heavy blow. Keep it in mind.
Let’s get in spells for the cleric.
Globally : The cleric have the best healing magnitude spells. But our heals are too powerfull and we overheals by far players HP. As consequence we spills some divinity. Overheal has no payback. The divinity shortage is very fast.
Tab : - Brief tab : the mark is hard to spot on the right player. Moreover, very difficult to see. - 2,4s tab : great heal and great magnitude - 3s tab : activate gathering light, but no reference to this mechanic. We just have righteousness. At-Wills : - Soothe : increased magnitude and divinity. So difficult to spot a player, especially those crazy ones for a loss of 5% HP… (Why do I think to rogues ?) Moreover the UI is polluted by all those crazy red numbers unavoidable because I want to see my healing scores. Seeing the players is so difficult.
Encounter : - BoH : increased magnitude 2200 divided so 440 for five players and 220 for ten downed from 750 for each. Divinty is increased. Only 5 spells available for a full divinity bar down from 10... - Healing word : increased divinity, same base heal, HoT slightly increased. Only 3 spells available for a full divinity bar down from 4… - Cleansing light : Increased divinity and reduced magnitude. It’s a bad blow. - Astral shield : no improvement so still not usable. - Intercession : unchanged, the unique unlimited heal (only cooldown). Used previously as emergency power… Less usefull as magnitude is low.
Dailies : To few magnitude compared to at-wills. Needs to be reworked.
Combining the fast divinity shortage and the healings bonus, it’s a huge blow for the cleric. This is emphasized by the spilled divinity in over heals of the players.
Knowing how works basics DPS (and some tanks), they prefer a full ever red bar and a blue bar to a red bar moving fast. As a cleric spills divinity we have to maintain HP of our players low (understand not full) in order to keep as much as we can our divinity available. It gives almost no secure experience for low geared players or low HP players. As consequence, the cleric becomes a third choice in healers choice.
So I would suggest four ideas designed to benefit a little bit from our overheals : - Convert overheals in divinity pay back : convert half the value of overheal in divinity payback. - Convert overheals in HoT : convert half the value of overheal in HoT divided in 3 times - Convert overheals in blue bar : convert half the value of overheal in blue bar - Blue bar penalty : place a penalty timer in received healing (exemple no heal during this time) or place a % penalty in received heal after the end of blue bar.
Hoping this will help.
In conclusion, if situation is the same, healing cleric are going to be ostracized.
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micky1p00Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,594Arc User
edited May 2020
Also a note specific to Paladins. Not exactly healing but due to those changes:
Paladins deal damage, and specifically AoE damage with attacking things, mostly with radiant slam, and bane, triggering prayer opportunity and using tab to proc it and animation cancel Bane. And repeat.
Now 2 parts of this process are missing, and with them the damage... And I don't see anything to compensate for this.
Dreadtheft is a pointless ability and has been since M16, when it lost the debuff effect. Please remove it or add some benefit to channeling it that makes it worth performing no other action for the duration.
Hello there! Trying to be brief while resuming the core points: - Tab: I overall like the idea of a mark rather than channelling, holding tab on content like Zariel's challenge would have been painful, I would get rid of the holding tab effect and let the mark as a debuff (like old paladin's bane) and/or an automatic heal each X seconds. As overall design, I mostly see the mark as an help to who's supposed to take the big hits aka the tank. Assuming the 3-1-1 meta and different marks not stacking, would make easier just mark the target outside of combat keeping its strategical relevance. - Shields, removing them would mean reworking all current endgame content (ToMM and Zariel's challenge on top) and I am not sure that's going to work somehow, that's why I would suggest to take the warlock 5th feat as an example, providing each class the possibility to going for shields or for an Healing over Time. Another option may be providing each healing class a different shield (blue/yellow/green for example) that may stack with the others. Tuning some shield strenght down may be needed in case. - AoE spells, the divine touch vs divine shelter case is the perfect example on how something went wrong while donig math, unless your design (I would greatly dislike) is "forcing" healing by tactical positioning (in other words: who needs heals stands X) lol. A possible solution could be increasing the magnitude or giving the splitting diminishing decreases (targets: 2:1/2, 3;1/2.5, ....) while increasing the target split to 10, in order to make them useless on a trial but still needed for solo/5-player content - Warlock specific: cleansing ability missing as many already remarked and I would ask for an healing spell not based on targets (like revitalise) or area (like soulstorm), an Heling Word / Divine Shelter clone to be more specific - Cleric specific: rework astral shield, removing the channelling please, increasing area may work as well. Have a nice day.
"Healing is general has been too easy" The is and always has been a shortage of healers in this game and I seriously doubt the reason behind that is that it's just been too darn easy..
"Addressing the major divide that exists between well geared healers/groups and players with more modest loadouts is one of our goals with the healing adjustments." That's utter and complete nonsense... Well geared players are well geared because they've taken the time, put in the work, and in some cases real money, to get there. So now you take that away because some people are just too darn lazy to put in the work themselves? That's about the equivalent of saying that you make disproportionately more money than I do and we should take some of your money away and give it to me to "address the major divide"....
- Shields, removing them would mean reworking all current endgame content (ToMM and Zariel's challenge on top)
And THIS right here is WHY they need to be removed. Content is being created and tuned to one power for one class. This is why Permabubble was removed. This is why AAspam was removed. This is why smurf bar needs to be removed. Furthermore that is why it needs to be done now while there is limited content that would need to be rebalanced instead of in another mod or two when there is even more. These things must happen more quickly not less.
"Healing is general has been too easy" The is and always has been a shortage of healers in this game and I seriously doubt the reason behind that is that it's just been too darn easy..
"Addressing the major divide that exists between well geared healers/groups and players with more modest loadouts is one of our goals with the healing adjustments." That's utter and complete nonsense... Well geared players are well geared because they've taken the time, put in the work, and in some cases real money, to get there. So now you take that away because some people are just too darn lazy to put in the work themselves? That's about the equivalent of saying that you make disproportionately more money than I do and we should take some of your money away and give it to me to "address the major divide"....
Welcome to socialist Neverwinter folks...
I get where this is coming from, but I have to admit that asterdahl isn't totally wrong.
On live, healing is brain-dead easy for those of us with the basic gear and the companions. Healing output is incredibly high with little concern for resource management to balance it out, and players have to mess up pretty badly to threaten those resource pools. As for a healing shortage, that's common to MMOs. Many more players want to be the DPS than want to be the Tank or the Healer, and the Healer role was nigh-irrelevant in NW game design for most of the years prior to M16.
Players who are trying to heal without the BiS equipment have a drastically different experience since the gap is tremendous, though this honestly isn't that different from the DPS paradigm. I suppose the issue is that a couple of DPS not operating at top efficiency is usually salvageable, while one healer with the wrong companions and mediocre stats can be a problem for the whole party.
One thing I've read here that I agree with wholeheartedly is that there is no meaningful difference between holding down Tab to generate your healing resource and standing around doing nothing while waiting for it to come back on its own. As others have said, what is the benefit of freeing up that time when there is a lack of productive actions to fill it? Damaging At-Wills are a joke unless each hit generates resource. Tagging something once every 5-6 seconds to improve passive regen rate is not the definition of engaging.
As a Paladin healer, I think changes are going in the right direction. It will be much harder to keep everyone alive, so a second healer will be needed for difficult trials.
I would like to see the changes also in daily powers. The sanctuary could increase the radius to 20, because it is difficult to accommodate 10 people at the current value
> @matii#4660 said: > As a Paladin healer, I think changes are going in the right direction. It will be much harder to keep everyone alive, so a second healer will be needed for difficult trials. > > I would like to see the changes also in daily powers. The sanctuary could increase the radius to 20, because it is difficult to accommodate 10 people at the current value
Yes but OP Is not alone.... In 10 persons acrivities minimum 2 healers MUST BE the rule. Not like now that thanks to bluebars you need only One OP and everythings Is allright.
... facilitate more engaging moment-to-moment gameplay...
...Healing is general has been too easy for well geared groups/healers; in particular group healing is simply too resource efficient for teams that manage to stay in close proximity. There hasn't really been a distinction between between focused healing on a tank or other ally and healing the group as a whole...
Good call, but your solution started badly when you threw away the most engaging healer (Warlock)... that actually preferred more efficient single target at-will heal than throwing sparks around...
I mean, if your ideal already exists, stands right in front of you and begs for your love,... you just throw everything away and start making chimeras of what you deemed bad? That does not make sense.
Comments
But the idea is nice, they could bound it to another stat like ap gain, or outgoing healing, or even critical strike ( i mean why not?) ; this way ap gain / outgoing healing will increase the ap gain / outgoing healing and it will give a perentage increase in the dinivity gain or whatever the warlock use (this has to be a class mechanics).
it can also give player peace of mind beacuse they can control their divinity gain , in the same way they can control ap gain and stamina regeneration.
I like every chanhes to upgrade healing system but the only way is to nerf bluebar or switch off them.
palading give shield --> player has more HP can withstand damage.
cleric give buff --> player has more damage resistance, the attack deal less damage, can withstand damage,
warlock give debuff --> boss deal less damage, player can withstand damage.
now if we have the 'weakest combination' it could work pretty well (player more resistant to damage and weakened attack), surely it need adjustemnt for it to work, the buff and debuff can't be too weak or they will be useless and the shield sould not be enought alone; but it's a way to make all thing working and not nerfing the paladin.
just a tohught.
( Firstly, you've got an error somewhere that makes the comment get deleted if someone else posts a comment while you edit)
As a warlock main, these are my two cents about the changes so far.
- Cleanse.
The warlock needs a cleanse - any cleanse. A healer without a cleanse is an incomplete healer, and being the one class without a cleanse is going to guarantee we will not be picked for runs.
- Revitalize
One of the major things that made the warlock fun and unique to me, was the strategical aspect of positioning and being more active in combat. The fact that positioning well could make or break the success of the role is very rewarding and where a difference in skill has a large impact. Having an aimed heal (and with a divinity bar to boot) makes the class feel much more like a point and click cleric, only with green colors.
Also, the cost of 200 is a bit too high. If something goes sideways, I'll only be able to cast 5 of them before running out of soulweave, and there is no good panic insta regen option here. I think 150 would be a better cost. That'd give me 6 of them with a little left over for some emergency ST healing.
-Shields. So far from what I have seen, the shield the warlocks can put up are tiny. Nowhere near where I'd expect a 450 magnitude heal from a player with all 5 outgoing heal companions and 150k+ power. And they don't stack, so no way of making the shield bigger by casting several times. This makes them feel quite redundant in their current form.
-The ST tab mechanic is interesting and quite practical. No need to find the tank in a huge pile of mobs if they're already tagged. I think this is a fun change. The slight delay when pressing tab and when the tank gets healed might be troublesome, but on the other hand, might teach players to anticipate, so I don't think it's a bad thing (yet).
Issues with current changes
1. The Tab mark is part of the character model, but the HP and name UI are rotated as billboard to align to the camera. It is fine when viewed from a low angle, but when viewed from higher angle (which most healers do, to see an better overview of the players) the hp and names cover the mark completely. It takes unproprtional amount of time to wiggle to see if the player is marked or not. Not good if need to use it as clutch healing.
2. The tab targeting is clunky, it will often mistarget and either mark self, or not mark or don't know. It just doesn't work well.
3. In general targeted skills do not work well in NW. It's extremely hard to hit the correct person among other players, pets and what not. It was apparent with older pre m16 buff skills that player often opted to target bind to names. It is often easier to target an AoE circle on one player than hit the same player with direct line targeted skill. For example I find it much easier to hit one person with old (current on live) divine touch (for example if I want to recast it for a chance at crit barrier without overrding other players) than to aim cure wound.
4. To add to the above, cure wound animation lock is extremely annoying, it rotates and locks, it will be, IMO much more fluid if the char could move during and it will not target lock.
Also, cure wound doesn't barrier?
5. New divine touch and the split magnitude:
Numbers are from memory so there maybe a mistake, but the idea holds
Currently Divine Touch is 100% useless, due to the cut-off, which is about two people, for 1 person, I get 1k magnitude from it for 200 divinity or I can use my at-will and get 500 magnitude for 40 divinity or so.
So for one person, which needs healing this is a waste of divinity. If we want to barrier we can use the tab for better effect. So for one person it's a no go.
For two people I get 500 magnitude per person for 200 divinity. But I need to hit the exact two people I want, and this is harder than hitting one person. But the worse issue is that 2 people with Divine Shelter will be 450 magnitude each, for 220 dvinity, and I get the same for the whole up to 10 people group in a single cast. With only 3 encounters available there is just not room to slot Divine touch.
The split magnitude perhaps can work, but it needs to be balanced comparatively so perhaps non linear divide, or another option is to look at it as AoE skill with bonus to single for example to balance it with better magnitude / divinity ratio than divine shelter due to the lower area, for example 550 / 180 (3/1 vs DS 2/1) but with bonus for example 25% higher magnitude if hitting 2 players, and 50% more if hitting only one player. (numbers are just for example, could be 50% and 100% higher, whatever balanced)
6. The new tab mechanics:
As now, with cure wounds and Divine shelter covering both single target heals, and AoE wide heals and barrier, the main usage of this is single target barrier.
IMO, this is very unsatisfying and not versatile for a class mechanics (I must say this is the case for other classes as well). More so with Divine Shelter overriding it and it takes 3 seconds channeling to get a better effect, aaaand it requires the mark to be set upfront. Very clunky, but still wouldn't justify usage of Divine touch instead of it. So we have this.
Assuming a tune to the mark and cure wound adds barrier, I would suggest the mark to have separate effect, for example the person under the mark will have forced crit. Or mitigation + DoT heal (that may take divinity). Or for example mitigation in form of damage to them reduces paladins divinity / stamina (like shared damage).
And the channeling tab can have different effect, for example an aura/AoE heal, that increases in size the longer it is held, but the cost overhead increases too. So a short hold will create a very small circle around the paladin that will generate 1200 magnitude heal for 130 divinity (~9 /1 ), holding longer increases the size but worsens the costs to for example 1100 magnitude heals for 150 (`7.3/1) divinity and so on, non linearly, and not in jumps but just a non linear function which I can provide examples but I don't wont to overly distract with math. (It will stop growing when not enough divinity)
This mechanics will create a better ratio at the very close ranges as the player costs of needing to get to the target and risk life and limb + channel near them, especially risky in case of tanks and the ratio will decrease per the wanted changes to create less potent AoE and better single (or lower number) target heals.
It will encourage better group dynamics of staying close, and will create more engaging pliability for the paladin due to the need to constantly moving to get the best return on divinity.
Other possible options to tab mechanics can be mitigation aura at depleting divinity for example like the tank paragon enables tab mode.
Similarly it can be aura that buffs damage, or debuffs targets, or creates damage DoT, this can sinergyse with the auras that can be sloted (class feats, the yellow slots). For example slotting a mitigation aura will constantly mitigate 3%, switching to the "aura mode" with tab will mitigate 20% (for everyone in vicinity) at the constant cost of divinity ticks.
Or channeling tab can deplete divinity at some rate but force crit on all skills.
7. Still existing issues with dailies and class feats:
The rework didn't change that the dailies are mostly dead, for example sanctuary, the heal aspect is completely useless due to the channeling effect, it's to weak to not heal at the same time, but we can't heal at the same time. Added to that that the mitigation must be activated before various dots, like heatwave in ToMM or this Hypo in Zariel or it will not take effect, so it just not good.
Lay on hands, and entire daily that 3 clicks of at-will can do now.
Similar issue with class feats and slotable auras, most are just not viable and have no use, which is a shame.
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Its really sad cleric still has abilities with no use. Astral Shield 10% not enough and the heal is not high enough to help, should be 25% damage reduction and restore people standing in it to full health if they drop below 20% health.
Geas 5%? Remove it's damage dealing property, switch it to devout only and reduce boss damag by 25%.
Cleansing touch was used back when we needed to remove damage over time poison in 1st fight of FBI and Svardborg, as well as those horrible runic debuffs in master expeditions that everyone hates. Outside of those 3 niche this encounter is well.. not useful.
FEEDBACK: First of all, I absolutely agree with Janne's point: targeting in this game is bad. Switching the mark between the tanks or getting the at will to target the right player has been a terrible experience. Healing has become more difficult, not because of well designed complex mechanics, but due to clunky targeting. Also, the mark symbol is really hard to see. Please make it more visible, and make the marked person highlighted in the party member list (maybe some symbol near/around the aggro meter?).
FEEDBACK: I understand (and agree to some degree) with the motivation for nerfing the healing companions. However, 3% is too low, making power companions better for players with lower power. Even though this might be intended, it may be very upsetting to new players who just got and upgraded their healing companions but still haven't got to endgame power levels. Maybe consider making the companions give 4 or 5% at legendary. It probably won't be overpowered but may reduce general frustration with the change.
FEEDBACK: Cleric's main "feature" was big AoE heals. This isn't really the case anymore, as SW restoration will "recover" 3000 magnitude when paired with the barrier feat (for comparison, on live, current Cleric's bastion is 750, OP's Divine touch is 700 when combined with barrier, unless it crits). Even if SW wasn't stronger, the general nerf to AoE healing means that the Cleric's main advantage wouldn't be present anyway (so don't even think of nerfing the new SW please). This, coupled with the fact that Cleric is the only healing class without "temp HP" in M19, gives me the feeling we really got the short end of the stick this time. Will something be done to ensure Cleric has decent mitigation abilities, now that we can't "overheal" the damage we can't mitigate like we used to? Compared to the Barrier mechanics, Astral Shield feels absolutely inadequate. Hallowed Ground is decent but needing a daily for decent mitigation, while the other two can mitigate much more with an encounter, doesn't feel fair.
BUG: Battle Prayer completely disables the last feat choice from activating. Ideally, it would reduce the cast time and we could activate them faster. If that is considered "too overpowered", then at least we should be able to activate the last feat by holding tab for the default cast time.
> I think that a pally with overshield will remain the best option and will be the only thing people want in their parties for tomm. As mentioned above, giving clerics better damage reduction for the party (astral shield is only 10%, that is too small to even be noticed) might be a good route rather than changing paladins. Warlock making the boss deal less damage is a great idea to let them bring something unique to the table, as long as it is a high enough percentage (using cleric again as example, geas reduces 5% boss damage and is useless). I'm specifically thinking of moments in tomm like fire phase and lightning where people use their griffons.
> Its really sad cleric still has abilities with no use. Astral Shield 10% not enough and the heal is not high enough to help, should be 25% damage reduction and restore people standing in it to full health if they drop below 20% health.
> Geas 5%? Remove it's damage dealing property, switch it to devout only and reduce boss damag by 25%.
> Cleansing touch was used back when we needed to remove damage over time poison in 1st fight of FBI and Svardborg, as well as those horrible runic debuffs in master expeditions that everyone hates. Outside of those 3 niche this encounter is well.. not useful.
Exactly. Even with all these changing in healing, and their new mechanics, Palaheal still seem to be the best candidate in most situations.
If in an endgame trial, a specific class is needed for a certain role, that means it’s not balanced. Take it ToMM, for example, where Palaheal is a must. You can add then any other of the two classes left to fill the healing gap, or ditch them completely if you’re running with an experience group. Sometimes just healing is not enough, you want to protect your group from taking damage - something Clerics and Warlocks lack, in comparison to Palaheal blue shields.
As long as there is no change on this regard, the other two healing classes will most of the times be relegated.
Instead of trying to make SW into a Cleric/Pallyheal mashup, do the opposite. You are admitting with these changes that your healing system is flawed and fundamentally not fun. There is too much down time standing around to pray. With the changes there's too much down time standing there doing nothing. Because attacking is just as pointless at standing there praying, let's be honest. This is true, as I said earlier. But I'd like to point out that this is NOT true on SW heals. (Disclaimer: I've mained a cleric for 5 years and hubby plays a Pally. I tried SW for the first time two months ago on the advice of a friend because I'm always bored playing cleric heals.) SW heals are smaller so I cast them more frequently. PoP recharges and needs to be placed again in 12 seconds. I'm constantly doing something that's actually important and necessary to healing, and it's AMAZING. (So yeah, put that CD back. We want to do more, not less. Stop making things take even longer.)
Playing SW heals they are underperforming in numbers, but you should be looking at adapting the SW playstyle into Cleric and Pally instead of wiping it out. The SW is actually fun to play if you'd just boost the mags a tiny bit so it can be competitive. (And remove Overshield from everyone so that heals can be a competitive market). Smaller, more frequent heals give me something to do with my time that is MEANINGFUL to fullfilling my role. I want that on my cleric. And more importantly, I want that to NOT BE TAKEN AWAY from SW.
I'd also like to reiterate that the soulspark spiral is a better design than a divinity bar. Instead of removing the soulspark spiral, I'd actually prefer to see the divinity bar reworked instead to be more like it. The soulspark spiral is more conducive to at-a-glance knowing how much "resource" I have and what I can do with it. It is incremented meaningfully into divisions which are the "cost" of a power. I can see the "resource" filling the bar to create a cirle. I know that the cirlce is one cast of a power. So I can immediately see I can cast shatterspark three times or bargain six times for example. I can immediately see how close I am to reganing enough "resource" to cast another power. Also, the fact that the numbers are small and instantly workable even in any brain, even my 7 year old can manage soulsparks because 6-30 are numbers she can work in her head and the fact that they are divided into the individual cost dots make it visually instantaneous, is WAY better than the amorphous 1000 divinity bar. The divnity bar is a guessing game that people have to play by feel. I have "about" 3/4 of a bar, which I "should" be able to cast Healing Word, then at least two(?) Bastions, but I'm probably gonna be tabbing and soothing, so how is that gonna add up...
Soulweaver player.
1) I honestly don't see the point of Souleater, if you are in a dung you will never use it cuz you will want all your soulwave to heal. And if you are soloing, most prolly you would go Hellbringer, and if you don't you would still save it as heal emergencie.
2) Take out the shield and let us give Temp HP. Our shields are so lame and overwrite the ones of the pallys, so we will get excluded and with the day 1 of the new mod on live, the forum might collapse with hate posts.
3) Warlock's Bargain should stay the same as in mod 18.
4) PoP cd its way too long and gives really little bufs, and a increase to 10% won't do anything.
5) Small shields and small heals make us a watered mix of pally and cleric. This will not change the fact of "lf1m heal OP/DC". No one would want us if they have a OP cuz we will screw their shields, and why would they want us when they can get a better shield from the OP?
6) The new soulwave bar it's not that good for us, we loved the spark one, was intuitive.
7) Don't hate the new tab, but i would love some active way to recover "soulwave". Cuz you might think that this way ppl will start to play it safe or smart, but no. Yolo players won't stop doing what they do and blaming the healers.
8) Souleater and Borrowed Spirit could be changed for team buffs.
Souleater: Enemies close to you deal % less dmg.
Borrowed Spirit: Share % of your power to the party or the new Life Bind.
This way we could have a reason to be accepted in a party.
About feats:
Soultheft: Small gain-big CD, no one would choose it over Oversoul, and would never choose it if the use their shift correctly.
Hellpact: Make it Temp HP with more than just 50%, or just make a new feat. Right now its useless even tho the idea was good.
We soulweavers need love for real, if you want to make us a mix of them at least make us a great mix. I don't ask you to nerf the others, just to make us as good as them so we can run with anyone. Right now you only made stronger the division. Whats the point of having a soulweaver now? The buffs? They are smaller than the heals, won't last too much and takes nearly 25secs just to have them for 6secs.
The shields? Why a warlock when you can get a OP?.
Heals? Nah, really small, if you can't find a DC just get some stones.
All thats left for us its to hope that they won't kick us from trials so they can get another OP or DC.
Soulweaver: The Lovely Red
Minstrel: The Rose Troubadour
My first message has been deleted. Great experience. And sorry for my bnad english.
I’m playing a cleric as healer. I’m playing with average players very well geared (as they invested many time in game). One of them is colorblind, another one-eyed. When can’t pretend epic instances such as TIC or ToMM. Actually we are enjoying ToNG and CoDG.
Without spell revamp. The personal heals :
- Less heal bonus from companions (10% down to 3% each)
- Less heal bonus from wisdom (0,5% down to 0,25% each 1 wis)
Consequence heal score 161,5% down to 124,4% so 23% of loss.
Teams mates bonus healing :
- Less received heal bonus from companions (10% down to 3% each)
- Less received heal bonus from tactical enchant (6% down to 2% each)
- Less received heal bonus from guild boon (15% down to 5%)
It’s a major issue for tanks aiming at being easily refilled in HP. Generally they equipped guild boons and 5 tacticals. They are smashed down from 45% down to 15%. So it’s a 20,7% loss.
Combining the two losses we have a 234% heals received smashed down to 143%. So it’s a 39,1% loss in heals. I’m OK with this. Only this is a very heavy blow. Keep it in mind.
Let’s get in spells for the cleric.
Globally :
The cleric have the best healing magnitude spells. But our heals are too powerfull and we overheals by far players HP. As consequence we spills some divinity. Overheal has no payback.
The divinity shortage is very fast.
Tab :
- Brief tab : the mark is hard to spot on the right player. Moreover, very difficult to see.
- 2,4s tab : great heal and great magnitude
- 3s tab : activate gathering light, but no reference to this mechanic. We just have righteousness.
At-Wills :
- Soothe : increased magnitude and divinity. So difficult to spot a player, especially those crazy ones for a loss of 5% HP… (Why do I think to rogues ?) Moreover the UI is polluted by all those crazy red numbers unavoidable because I want to see my healing scores. Seeing the players is so difficult.
Encounter :
- BoH : increased magnitude 2200 divided so 440 for five players and 220 for ten downed from 750 for each. Divinty is increased. Only 5 spells available for a full divinity bar down from 10...
- Healing word : increased divinity, same base heal, HoT slightly increased. Only 3 spells available for a full divinity bar down from 4…
- Cleansing light : Increased divinity and reduced magnitude. It’s a bad blow.
- Astral shield : no improvement so still not usable.
- Intercession : unchanged, the unique unlimited heal (only cooldown). Used previously as emergency power… Less usefull as magnitude is low.
Dailies :
To few magnitude compared to at-wills. Needs to be reworked.
Combining the fast divinity shortage and the healings bonus, it’s a huge blow for the cleric. This is emphasized by the spilled divinity in over heals of the players.
Knowing how works basics DPS (and some tanks), they prefer a full ever red bar and a blue bar to a red bar moving fast. As a cleric spills divinity we have to maintain HP of our players low (understand not full) in order to keep as much as we can our divinity available. It gives almost no secure experience for low geared players or low HP players. As consequence, the cleric becomes a third choice in healers choice.
So I would suggest four ideas designed to benefit a little bit from our overheals :
- Convert overheals in divinity pay back : convert half the value of overheal in divinity payback.
- Convert overheals in HoT : convert half the value of overheal in HoT divided in 3 times
- Convert overheals in blue bar : convert half the value of overheal in blue bar
- Blue bar penalty : place a penalty timer in received healing (exemple no heal during this time) or place a % penalty in received heal after the end of blue bar.
Hoping this will help.
In conclusion, if situation is the same, healing cleric are going to be ostracized.
Also a note specific to Paladins. Not exactly healing but due to those changes:
Paladins deal damage, and specifically AoE damage with attacking things, mostly with radiant slam, and bane, triggering prayer opportunity and using tab to proc it and animation cancel Bane. And repeat.
Now 2 parts of this process are missing, and with them the damage... And I don't see anything to compensate for this.
Contagion - Cleric
Testament - Wizard
Pestilence - Ranger
Dominion - Paladin
NIGHTSWATCH
Trying to be brief while resuming the core points:
- Tab: I overall like the idea of a mark rather than channelling, holding tab on content like Zariel's challenge would have been painful, I would get rid of the holding tab effect and let the mark as a debuff (like old paladin's bane) and/or an automatic heal each X seconds. As overall design, I mostly see the mark as an help to who's supposed to take the big hits aka the tank. Assuming the 3-1-1 meta and different marks not stacking, would make easier just mark the target outside of combat keeping its strategical relevance.
- Shields, removing them would mean reworking all current endgame content (ToMM and Zariel's challenge on top) and I am not sure that's going to work somehow, that's why I would suggest to take the warlock 5th feat as an example, providing each class the possibility to going for shields or for an Healing over Time. Another option may be providing each healing class a different shield (blue/yellow/green for example) that may stack with the others. Tuning some shield strenght down may be needed in case.
- AoE spells, the divine touch vs divine shelter case is the perfect example on how something went wrong while donig math, unless your design (I would greatly dislike) is "forcing" healing by tactical positioning (in other words: who needs heals stands X) lol. A possible solution could be increasing the magnitude or giving the splitting diminishing decreases (targets: 2:1/2, 3;1/2.5, ....) while increasing the target split to 10, in order to make them useless on a trial but still needed for solo/5-player content
- Warlock specific: cleansing ability missing as many already remarked and I would ask for an healing spell not based on targets (like revitalise) or area (like soulstorm), an Heling Word / Divine Shelter clone to be more specific
- Cleric specific: rework astral shield, removing the channelling please, increasing area may work as well.
Have a nice day.
"Healing is general has been too easy"
The is and always has been a shortage of healers in this game and I seriously doubt the reason behind that is that it's just been too darn easy..
"Addressing the major divide that exists between well geared healers/groups and players with more modest loadouts is one of our goals with the healing adjustments."
That's utter and complete nonsense...
Well geared players are well geared because they've taken the time, put in the work, and in some cases real money, to get there. So now you take that away because some people are just too darn lazy to put in the work themselves?
That's about the equivalent of saying that you make disproportionately more money than I do and we should take some of your money away and give it to me to "address the major divide"....
Welcome to socialist Neverwinter folks...
NOTHING MATTERS ABOUT THESE CHANGES
unless you address the BLUE BARS
you can rework feats and classes and tab mechanics all you want
ALL WE WANT IS 3 VIABLE HEALERS
pally should not be a requirement for content end of story
so until you get rid of the blue bars or nerf them into oblivion (something you do well)
these changes are pointless
as is -- rip cleric, i'll be switching my main to hr or just not playing
thats all the feedback you really need on healing
On live, healing is brain-dead easy for those of us with the basic gear and the companions. Healing output is incredibly high with little concern for resource management to balance it out, and players have to mess up pretty badly to threaten those resource pools. As for a healing shortage, that's common to MMOs. Many more players want to be the DPS than want to be the Tank or the Healer, and the Healer role was nigh-irrelevant in NW game design for most of the years prior to M16.
Players who are trying to heal without the BiS equipment have a drastically different experience since the gap is tremendous, though this honestly isn't that different from the DPS paradigm. I suppose the issue is that a couple of DPS not operating at top efficiency is usually salvageable, while one healer with the wrong companions and mediocre stats can be a problem for the whole party.
One thing I've read here that I agree with wholeheartedly is that there is no meaningful difference between holding down Tab to generate your healing resource and standing around doing nothing while waiting for it to come back on its own. As others have said, what is the benefit of freeing up that time when there is a lack of productive actions to fill it? Damaging At-Wills are a joke unless each hit generates resource. Tagging something once every 5-6 seconds to improve passive regen rate is not the definition of engaging.
Contagion - Cleric
Testament - Wizard
Pestilence - Ranger
Dominion - Paladin
NIGHTSWATCH
I would like to see the changes also in daily powers. The sanctuary could increase the radius to 20, because it is difficult to accommodate 10 people at the current value
> As a Paladin healer, I think changes are going in the right direction. It will be much harder to keep everyone alive, so a second healer will be needed for difficult trials.
>
> I would like to see the changes also in daily powers. The sanctuary could increase the radius to 20, because it is difficult to accommodate 10 people at the current value
Yes but OP Is not alone.... In 10 persons acrivities minimum 2 healers MUST BE the rule. Not like now that thanks to bluebars you need only One OP and everythings Is allright.
I mean, if your ideal already exists, stands right in front of you and begs for your love,... you just throw everything away and start making chimeras of what you deemed bad? That does not make sense.