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CDP Topic: Rewards & Progression

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  • mystar#5733 mystar Member Posts: 168 Arc User
    Rewards vs. crafting
    Overview
    Storage for crafting....mainly shared.
    Give each profession a quest where it opens a hotspot in different areas of the workshop with a certain number of slots to store shared profession items. The areas can be upgraded like the shared bank slots to maybe a max of 32 slots.
    Masterwork crafting for storage could be a recipe to craft chests and upgrade them through crafting...maybe to a max of 64.
    Also, masterwork storage bags that can hold small jewelry type items, enchants or runestones...small stuff like that. Bags holding these items could be closed with those items in them and stored in the bank or in standard bags and swapped to other characters if nothing in them is bound to character.

    Goal
    The main goal is to provide a way for adventurers to store and share profession resources and small items they acquire throughout their adventuring and give them the opportunity to craft such quality items for themselves or to sell.

    Functionality
    The current design of Neverwinter has shared bank slots...the shared profession resources, tools and other items in the profession tabs could be more easily shared than using email. The mastercraft chest can be made from a recipe and i can imagine it being extremely difficult to succeed...but not impossible...and could also be profitable.
    The bags to store jewelry and such...giving bags permission to close with certain sized items seems like it could work in the design of Neverwinter. For loadouts the items would have to be taken out of the bags to be used.

    Risks & Concerns
    I've talked to some people about the bags that can be closed with small items in them and some have said it would cut the need for bank slots. Making something like this a masterwork item might boost some interest and sales for profession development. I'm sure there's a lot of players whose emails are full of small stuff that could be better stored in banks or bags. I guess the only thing I can think about the risks & concerns relates to how easy or how difficult it is to reach the profession level to craft such items...to use or sell.

    Personal Note
    Hope I followed the guideline enough.
  • lassorlassor Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 60 Cryptic Developer


    I agree with the idea that chase items should be much rarer than the ToMM rings and I do believe it was something I raised, as well as other people raised when ToMM first came out. The point was more about the fact that if you are farming something that drops, it should be unbound because there is no sense of progression when you are fighting against RNG. It is a binary system, you either have it (it drops) or you don't, there is no way to measure your progress and that causes frustration. An example of this is the Shadowstalker Ring, I did weeklies for this ring on 3 characters from the release of Omu until the end of M16, the only time I skipped farming this was when I took a break in M15. I did not get the ring I wanted. I did not enjoy the grind and the only pleasure I got out of this was when the ring was finally obsolete, because I never felt like I made any progress. All of the time I spent farming this item was a complete waste.

    In a system where you are dropping shards and there are say for example 1000 shards of an item it is fine for the item to be bound, because you always know how far you have progressed. Halaster's Whirlwind is a good example of the shard system.

    I also was not necessarily talking about the chase items coming from the hardest content, but rather a variety of places. For example, in the system I was proposing, there would exist items with chase crafted bonuses which would be exceptionally difficult to obtain, but the grind would be the fight against the crafting system and not a fight against content.

    ToMM rings are much more common due to reroll tokens. With the current chest setup, we either need to set drop rates with the expectation of using reroll tokens or not. The decision was made to view reroll tokens as a bonus, thus the players with massive stockpiles of them benefited from significantly increased drop rates. My preference is that we will be addressing this situation in some way to prevent our rare items in the future from dropping at these accelerated rates. Perhaps this could be accomplished by either reducing the number of available rerolls down from the 10 that are currently available or coming up with a more creative solution such as limiting the amount of times per week the "top" chase item is available through rerolling. These are just ideas in my head, it is up to our Systems team to make any adjustments.

    Personally, I'm on the fence about overusing systems in which you are guaranteed the item you seek after X completions. I think it works well for items such as the Lionheart weapons because they are a pivotal upgrade to equalize players among that tier. Bad rng resulting in someone not getting their Lionheart weapon would have a significant effect on their ability to compete with their peers. For other items I'm happy to leave those as a luck of the draw, but to your point if there are potency ranges for that item and it is unbound then you can sell off the version you don't want and feel good that you at least got something out of your time. I would hope that we would also have other systems in place that made you feel like you progressed in some way as well as you chased after the item you seek.

    I think the two of us are aligned as to our thoughts on propagating chase opportunities throughout the game, if not on the exact implementation.
  • cwhitesidedev#9752 cwhitesidedev Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 253 Cryptic Developer
    Hi All,

    I am up to date and will be engaging from tomorrow. Great conversation and ideas so far. Also big props for your formatting and discipline in this CDP.

    Thanks

    Chris
  • fluffy6977fluffy6977 Member Posts: 291 Arc User
    lassor said:


    Snip

    Reclaiming items from Collections is something that I've advocated for on the team for quite some time, but it would be a significant amount of work and require a lot of failsafes to be put in place to avoid exploitation. For example, you could rank up an artifact to legendary to unlock it, break it down for refinement points, and then reclaim it through collections for free. There's many potential land mines that we would need to design around to make it work.

    Collections is something I've wanted to expand upon in many additional ways, some being much more ambitious than others! For example:

    • Making the points valuable in some way.
    • Titles/Achievements/Rewards for completing a Category.
    • Physical location in game to display module Collections such as in a museum or placed as a housing decoration.
    • Collection challenges to promote expanding your library.
    Excellent point about potential exploitation, I didn't even think about that.

    In regards to your specific example though, in my proposal you pay for the unlock, so even if you broke down the first one for RP you wouldn't just be earning another for free. And you could add a flag to the reclaimed items so that they cannot be broken down/sold for gold/or have anything done with them other than discard. This is not a new idea for the game either, an example of proper implementation for reclaimed Artifacts already exists, i.e. I have the Dragonborn pack on my account with an Epic level artifact available to all my characters that is already set up to be unsellable and un-break down-able. Only thing I can do to get rid of it is discard.

    I do understand it would be a lot of work and would not expect it any time soon, if ever, but it would drastically improve the game for players like me. Especially in terms of rewarding hard work.

    Thanks for championing the idea and your response!
  • greywyndgreywynd Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 6,210 Arc User


    the chest rerolls were a compensation for not being allowed to peek and choose as we had been doing before. I personally don't see what was so wrong with that system. I also don't think there is a problem with the rerolls. it has made something that everyone wants accessible.

    The reroll tokens were compensation for the piles of epic dungeon keys VIP piled up on characters, that with the changes to the chests were no longer needed. Nothing more.
    I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
  • admiralwarlord#3792 admiralwarlord Member Posts: 486 Arc User
    When reading this topic I remembered when I made my first EGWD and to my surprise came what was the best shirt in the game. It made me really happy when a much more experienced friend told me how rare it was. Whenever I do ECC and MSP I hope that I will drop the Pirate King's Hat or the Smoke Armor, incredible as it may seem in 3 years playing this game they are still missing from my collection. Bring the keys to the game around, eliminate the re-rolls tokens, if someone wants something that seeks these items by running the dungeon countless times. Who didn't like it when they dropped that Shard of Orcus on CN that was worth 900k at the time?

    About Fane's rings, it took me almost 3 modules to get the pair, it was strange because I had 3 chances a week (I play on 3 accounts), and there was nothing I could do to be able to acquire them. Special items must come in Dungeons where it is possible to at least try, and not in quests.
  • josephskyrimjosephskyrim Member Posts: 356 Arc User
    lassor said:

    I'm on the fence about overusing systems in which you are guaranteed the item you seek after X completions. I think it works well for items such as the Lionheart weapons because they are a pivotal upgrade to equalize players among that tier. Bad rng resulting in someone not getting their Lionheart weapon would have a significant effect on their ability to compete with their peers.

    Would the same apply to the Undermountain alabaster weapons? I only ask since those never dropped for me so now I'm doing Infernal Descent with Tyrant weps which makes combat per mob group ... lengthy.

    Do drop rates improve for older weapons when newer campaigns come out? If not, it might be something to talk about.
    If you can't stand on a chest, it is a mimic!
  • thefiresidecatthefiresidecat Member Posts: 4,486 Arc User
    edited February 2020
    greywynd said:


    the chest rerolls were a compensation for not being allowed to peek and choose as we had been doing before. I personally don't see what was so wrong with that system. I also don't think there is a problem with the rerolls. it has made something that everyone wants accessible.

    The reroll tokens were compensation for the piles of epic dungeon keys VIP piled up on characters, that with the changes to the chests were no longer needed. Nothing more.
    that is true of the vip ones we get, but not true of the mechanic itself. what I said is true of the mechanic itself.
  • arkai#8115 arkai Member Posts: 172 Arc User
    edited February 2020
    Reward feedback items drop.sometime rng make difference from think yu need.in zok box or similiar sometime a item yu really need 4 yur build make months 4drop.like the ring +5 from serpent temple in past... I just have endgame toons with bad rng i really appreciate a way for have my item garantee in x day if i keep doing think ... More need specific pet equip from zok they are keep search after x run make zok or every1 else have this kind of reward bta offer us the choise.

    4 masterwork is easy until yu dont put new item yu have to put in line mc1 mc2 mc3 ecc with new iteml mc 150 under max item lev mc 2 100 item lev und ecc ecc
    So ppl keep craft masterwork think will be on demand ppl farm for matss ecc ecc.the key is upgrade masterwork item... Yes if yu should do this ....give bk mc3 weapon to ppl have in collection and no in inventory same for armor ... The key is always make tyem valuable.

    Ive lot alt with reroll token i no use cuz i run with main there in future can we have a way to use or turn in someting usefull if is possible want???
  • thefabricantthefabricant Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 5,247 Arc User
    lassor said:


    I agree with the idea that chase items should be much rarer than the ToMM rings and I do believe it was something I raised, as well as other people raised when ToMM first came out. The point was more about the fact that if you are farming something that drops, it should be unbound because there is no sense of progression when you are fighting against RNG. It is a binary system, you either have it (it drops) or you don't, there is no way to measure your progress and that causes frustration. An example of this is the Shadowstalker Ring, I did weeklies for this ring on 3 characters from the release of Omu until the end of M16, the only time I skipped farming this was when I took a break in M15. I did not get the ring I wanted. I did not enjoy the grind and the only pleasure I got out of this was when the ring was finally obsolete, because I never felt like I made any progress. All of the time I spent farming this item was a complete waste.

    In a system where you are dropping shards and there are say for example 1000 shards of an item it is fine for the item to be bound, because you always know how far you have progressed. Halaster's Whirlwind is a good example of the shard system.

    I also was not necessarily talking about the chase items coming from the hardest content, but rather a variety of places. For example, in the system I was proposing, there would exist items with chase crafted bonuses which would be exceptionally difficult to obtain, but the grind would be the fight against the crafting system and not a fight against content.

    ToMM rings are much more common due to reroll tokens. With the current chest setup, we either need to set drop rates with the expectation of using reroll tokens or not. The decision was made to view reroll tokens as a bonus, thus the players with massive stockpiles of them benefited from significantly increased drop rates. My preference is that we will be addressing this situation in some way to prevent our rare items in the future from dropping at these accelerated rates. Perhaps this could be accomplished by either reducing the number of available rerolls down from the 10 that are currently available or coming up with a more creative solution such as limiting the amount of times per week the "top" chase item is available through rerolling. These are just ideas in my head, it is up to our Systems team to make any adjustments.

    Personally, I'm on the fence about overusing systems in which you are guaranteed the item you seek after X completions. I think it works well for items such as the Lionheart weapons because they are a pivotal upgrade to equalize players among that tier. Bad rng resulting in someone not getting their Lionheart weapon would have a significant effect on their ability to compete with their peers. For other items I'm happy to leave those as a luck of the draw, but to your point if there are potency ranges for that item and it is unbound then you can sell off the version you don't want and feel good that you at least got something out of your time. I would hope that we would also have other systems in place that made you feel like you progressed in some way as well as you chased after the item you seek.

    I think the two of us are aligned as to our thoughts on propagating chase opportunities throughout the game, if not on the exact implementation.
    You could introduce a chest which cannot be rerolled, which would resolve the issue present with ToMM.
  • rikitakirikitaki Member Posts: 773 Arc User
    Feedback Overview
    Players are scaled down, rewards are not scaled up.
    Feedback Goal
    If you strive to make every dungeon/skirmish to take roughly the same time via scaling, you should make the drop on roughly same level. That goes for both what is found in final chest, and how hard is to get the key to the final chest (I am talking especially about SKT SVA in this case).
    At the same time, the drop in zones - if you are scaled down, the dropped treasures and refining items should scale up.
    Feedback Functionality
    If you force the player to match map level, you should force the drop to match the player's unscaled level. The goal should not be "maintain the same level of effort", but "maintain the same reward/effort ratio".
    Risks & Concerns
    The biggest risk is that all the tuning might be wasted time - the real issue lies within the scaling system itself, so you would be treating symptoms instead of disease.

    A little off-topic:
    I know that I might be a special case, but I avoid challenges that require to be "experienced with scrolls". I do not step into any new dungeon or trial till it is tuned down (or outgrown). Simply said, I am more casual - and, within the way the scaling system works, it might take another year (if ever!) to make me consider to move from the last pieces of 70lvl gear.
    The rewards from new zones have significantly negative effect on your performance in the scaled content. From the long-term perspective of your game, this is a terrible situation.
  • cor26cor26 Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    Reward quality and time spent to obtain:
    1.Well for me it's been 6 years and still no leg mount I just refuse to buy one on auction.
    2.what must be done is a rewards table dungeon list with possible rewards and maybe even go as far as to put down the drop rate on it maybe then people would not get so frustrated specially seeing as neverwinter wiki has nothing useful anymore.

    Existing and new reward categories:
    I feel this is doing well maybe some more designs would be great, you could even host some comps for your player base to share there designs with you for the chance to receive a little reward pack and have their design added to the game.


    Rewards throughout the progression of the
    game (leveling) vs. endgame rewards:
    Leveling goes pretty fast but maybe a gear set that levels with you to level 70 would be a great addition to the zen market for them new players.

    Rewards via crafting (especially Masterwork):
    To be honest I have not focus on master crafting because it requires a stronghold to be a certain level making it almost impossible to for a lot of people to do specially if you just wanted to start up your own guild for your friends and enjoy the game rather than having to gring a guild as well as a character or 5 just to get boons and master crafting
  • geminisky59#9345 geminisky59 Member Posts: 68 Arc User
    Feedback overview:
    Mastercrafting rewards upgrades should provide alternative BIS or close to BIS items as possible. One option could be the creation of customizable gear or gear slots. These gear slots could be used on current gear / weapons/ jewelry etc as well as items created by mastercrafters. Insignia mods and companion jewelry could also be part of the new crafting recipes.

    Feedback goal:
    The goal of this new system would be to provide customizable gear or slot items to players which would be not only on opportunity for more levels of character customization but to also allow an ability for mastercrafters to make viable/sellable items for each mod or game update.

    Feedback functionality:
    Mod items or enchants craftable by mastercrafters would be added to profession recipes for each new module or update. There could be an option for mastercrafters to do quests to receive these items. New professions lines for pet gear and insignias could also be incorporated in these new recipes. For example there could be a gear slot item to increase encounter powers by 5% or perhaps even mod slots to increase amplitude of an encounter or give additional stat bonuses. These new enchants would be sellable on the AH as BOE.
  • ecrana#2080 ecrana Member Posts: 1,654 Arc User
    lassor said:

    Reclaiming items from Collections is something that I've advocated for on the team for quite some time, but it would be a significant amount of work and require a lot of failsafes to be put in place to avoid exploitation. For example, you could rank up an artifact to legendary to unlock it, break it down for refinement points, and then reclaim it through collections for free. There's many potential land mines that we would need to design around to make it work.

    Collections is something I've wanted to expand upon in many additional ways, some being much more ambitious than others! For example:

    • Making the points valuable in some way.
    • Titles/Achievements/Rewards for completing a Category.
    • Physical location in game to display module Collections such as in a museum or placed as a housing decoration.
    • Collection challenges to promote expanding your library.
    I would be more concerned with how this affects the game economy yet again. There aren't many artifacts that actually sell anymore.

    If this collections idea was a thing than someone buys a Staff of Flowers and they're all set on any toon.

    That could affect pricing on items where a seller may decide to raise the price from 500k to 2M (just examples) to compensate for the fact that fewer will be needed.

    To players that have 10 toons that's a steal. To a player with one toon that's highway robbery.

    Regardless, I would love it if the collections were account-wide versus per toon though. I'm not one for passing items around to all my toons just to unlock it in collections.
  • quickfoot#7851 quickfoot Member Posts: 488 Arc User
    edited February 2020
    In regards to RNG loot, I'm kinda for and against it; RNG loot is a big part of D&D, but I do feel the pain of not being lucky. So yeah, I would agree perhaps that chase items locked behind RNG should be unbound, that way you can always buy one from someone else who stole your rng karma, and saving those AD/tradeables for it is your way of progressing. I haven't thought too much about it.

    Also, trading with the game for chase items might something, for example the Mysterious Merchant. You could implement a rare merchant that spawns in random locations throughout the game and who has a limited number of random chase items (bound or unbound I don't care) to sell to the world for a limited amount of time, kinda like the merchant in barovia that you get items for your undead hunter HAMSTER-pack .

  • unknowndramaunknowndrama Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 101 Arc User
    edited February 2020
    Campaign weekly progression

    1-Feedback Overview
    New weekly progression on campaigns.

    2-Feedback Goal
    Giving players incentives to returne to old content and fealing rewarded for playing it and allowing players to advance beyond campaign boons.

    3-Feedback Functionality

    Weekly campaign bonuses will work close how Tiamat weekly bonus for donation is but whit the difrence that we have to compleat campaigns.
    Compleat campaigns and get bonus to stats and utility bonuses(earn more astral diamonds,bonus refining stones)and bonus damage
    to difrent type of monsters like sharandar bonus to fey,dread ring bonus to thayans and so on.

    4-Risks and Concerns
    Some campaigns like Storm King will be ignored becose of how boring they are maybe
    the format of them should be changed to be like recent camapaign format(Chult,Ravenloft,Avernus).

    Return of Dungeon Delves hourly event.

    1-Feedback Overview

    Dungeon Delves hourly event whas a great motivation for players to team up and farm dungeons for one hours whitout using theyr chest keys.

    2-Feedback Goal
    Keeping your players engaged in game and promoting social interaction betwin them.

    3-Feedback Functionality

    This need to work difrent then whas before when in this event opening chest where free and
    wasn't needed a key to open add some bonus refined astral diamonds and bonus seals during that time for one hour.

    4-Risks and Concerns
    Dungeon Delves event become too rewarding if not balanced properly you can reward depending what is
    played for example trials and dungeons can reward more depending of dificulty.

    Weekly Contests


    1-Feedback Overview

    New type of contest for playing the game and being rewarded that will motivated and engage players.

    2-Feedback Goal

    Giving players a choise to do something else for a week and wining something for that.

    3-Feedback Functionality

    Each week there will be difrent task whit difrent tiers of rewards and categorys:

    -one category can be dungeons or skirmishes or weekly campaigns compleated and you have to do a certain amount to qualify for rewards

    4-Risks and Concerns

    Rewards need to be balanced properly to create an incentive for players to compeat for them.


    Guild content rewards

    1-Feedback Overview

    The gear and artifacts from stronghold merchants is very outdated and doesnt motivate players to do guild content and earn guild curency also there is not much to spend on it becose of how outdated merchant intems are.

    2-Feedback Goal
    At its best a guild helps members meet their fundamental human needs and intentional community is the first benefit that a guild can offer and experience reciprocal relationships with other people,
    relationships such as camaraderie, friendships this will keep new and old players in game and potential being long time customers for company. That being said having guild content that can be done together is very important.

    3-Feedback Functionality
    Events and merchants need to be updated whit new items whit same item level that are curent best in slot.
    The Greed of the Dragonflight Guild curency fang of the dragonflight seal still sell 3 years old outdated armor and artifacts and they need to be updated whit every expansion/mod.
    Stronghold Marauders Guild Event is unrewarding for the time invested and is used just for weekly it should be changed.

    4-Risks and Concerns

    Rewards need to be balanced properly so guild members have incentives to play together guild content.



    Neverwinter Season Pass

    1-Feedback Overview
    A new system used in many other games for company to get additional income and players to get some rewards.

    2-Feedback Goal
    A way of introducing players to the new system and to access new rewards and activities and purchasing a season pass will unlock all the new content and activities.

    3-Feedback Functionality

    Season Pass could start on each month or on each two months and it can have like 100 levels depending when next
    one will start.Season pass could have new quests and activitys for players to do and they could give experience to level up.
    There can be a free season pass and a premium pass and each have difrent rewards.
    Players can earn mounts,pets difrent old transmutes like shadow wolf skins and more..

    4-Risks and Concerns
    .
    Rewards need to be balanced properly to create an incentive for players to buy the Season Pass.

    Hourly or Daily Class challenge

    1-Feedback Overview

    A way to fix the lack of support classes like healers and tank in queque and also add a new daily or hourly challenge for players.

    2-Feedback Goal

    We know for long time there is a lack of healers and tank in random que and how hard is to find them to compleat ours trial groups or partys.
    3-Feedback Functionality

    This can be somehow fixed by adding a hourly/daily challenge to play certain class for example:play 10 dungeons as a healer or do 5 trials as a tank..
    this can also be done like play as a warlock or play as a barbarian ..
    Rewards will be something like "neverember coins" and it will be spended in a new Challenge Market for mount skins..pets...armor and weapons transmutes,marks..

    4-Risks and Concerns
    Rewards need to be balanced properly to creat the hype for this kind of event.

    I think beside having a rewarding most important is to have something to fill your game time not just login maybe do a random dungeon..get your daily vip key and log of ...we need stuff to do that we can aim for and be hyped about.



    Post edited by unknowndrama on
  • swizz#5552 swizz Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    Hi all
    So first i want say that english isnt my native language, so sry.
    A big deal is rly the Balance in this game.

    Feedback Overview :
    Leveling, Character individuality, Chest Rewards/Lockbox, Masterwork, Boons

    Feedback Goal :
    Better exp. by leveling and Older Kampagnes push , More individuality by skilling n Equip ur Toon, Rewarded loot/Lockbox Loot, Masterwork balance, Boons Rework

    Feedback Functionality :
    Leveling:
    So firstly i think there r too much zones whn u leveling a char, remove some cuz there r rly not or no more needed. Make it a bit more compact.

    Make the older Zones where u get next lvl 70 more usefull, like with Mw:Charts (Problem with that is it will be only good so long The mats in this charts r needed.) The best thing how some zones get back to life r things like Dragonflight in WoD (The Problem with that atm is that RP have no worth atm so its "Dead", there r still sometimes ppls who doing this but of course no more that big like b4).

    I imagine this so that the Cut zones where u play till Lvl 70 or so, r just here to level n explain some game mechanics. At lvl70+ or 80 idk rly, u do the zones where u get points for boons + there r events like some zones alrdy have like Sharandar or the most « Leveling » zones. Example : killing any monster typ for a time n at the end u get rewarded depending on ur rank.
    So Dread Ring is at a good point with this idea. U can farm there enchanting stones r5 or "some"potencys where r needed.

    Adding events on some zones with balanced rewards.

    (Problem with this is, its easy sayd "hey do some nice stuff" of course its need time. Alot of things need to be balanced cuz atm There isnt rly alot of things u could add. Enchantingstine r5, wards, potencys thats the things ppls need, want, the rest is just "worthless")

    Character individuality :

    We need more feats

    So i would like more individuality by firstly more feats,with the 10/20 feats for each class u cant rly skill individuality.
    I dont rly have mmo experience to come with some nice feats or ideas from other mmos.

    What u could use r that things we have to build around.
    For example : Cooldown, Duration, Dmg , range, etc
    Something like, increase the dmg but the cooldown is longer, u could do hundreds of combos.

    Add heroic feats (b4 mod16) again, where u can skill from 1to5 n in those r that stat increase n dmg boost vs specific mobs etc etc from the boons.

    The other point is the current system with the counter stats.
    I dont think its a bad idea or better sayd i would have no other ideas cuz of no mmos experience.
    I just can say what i would like to see.

    The Stats. Next u get the stats everything goes into power. Of course if the counter gets higher n higher we have to replace some items who give power but i can imagine that there will just come new pet gear etc etc n thn everything goes into power again.

    So its would be nice the rest of the Items gets more usefull + more diffrent stat combination on the armor then just 2.
    In my opinion there is alot of various Enchantments or pet gear but they r not needed.
    With that there will come more individuality to building a character.
    I rly dont like the word BiS (Best in Slot) cuz at the end its that piece n everything or the most is trash.

    Rewarded Loot
    So this is rly easy. Who out there like to play Tomm to get a Flawless Saphire at the end? I hope no one…
    How some alrdy written the idea with the currency where u get one at the end i tomm is a good idea.
    What i rly hate is what everything can drop.

    The chance to get a mount, Companion, Tokens etc etc is nice but that everywhere can drop artefacts or artefacts eqiup like the orcus shard as example is dumb. Why ?
    Since thy changed it (i think it was in mod13 ?) no dng had rly a point anymore to play it.
    B4 u played CN to get the shard u played Lostmouth to get those Items Valindra for there items etc etc.
    Of course some r outdated but with this u just maked these dng’s pointless to play
    A dng need a point to playing it, No one would play Tomm if there would drop 2 Flawless Saphire.
    Make the rewards of a dng «Unique».

    Lockbox Loot
    I dont want an increase of anything but the boxes need some changes.
    There shouldnt drop Rank 9and10 Weapon/armor/Enchantments
    I rly ask myself why tha hell does Ranks between 1-8 even exist?
    It makes thm worthless and Enchantments n Rp have so or so no worth atm.

    Masterwork
    For future Masterwork updates i would like that not always a handfull mats are usefull.
    Make all or much more thn now more usefull.

    Boons
    The Boons need a rework.
    @thefabricant pointed that perfectly n there is no more much to say about that.

  • greywyndgreywynd Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 6,210 Arc User



    that is true of the vip ones we get, but not true of the mechanic itself. what I said is true of the mechanic itself.

    A mechanic that was stated to be a bug from the get-go. Just an exploit they didn't close for entirely too long.
    I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
  • lassorlassor Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 60 Cryptic Developer
    rikitaki said:


    A little off-topic:
    I know that I might be a special case, but I avoid challenges that require to be "experienced with scrolls".

    It's a deviation from the topic but I've seen this mentioned enough times in various places that I wanted to comment.

    There are no situations in the game that require a player to die/scroll in order to succeed. Any instances of this are either due to incorrect stats or strategy. Of course, there's always the possibility that a bug has caused something to malfunction.

  • thefiresidecatthefiresidecat Member Posts: 4,486 Arc User

    lassor said:

    Reclaiming items from Collections is something that I've advocated for on the team for quite some time, but it would be a significant amount of work and require a lot of failsafes to be put in place to avoid exploitation. For example, you could rank up an artifact to legendary to unlock it, break it down for refinement points, and then reclaim it through collections for free. There's many potential land mines that we would need to design around to make it work.

    Collections is something I've wanted to expand upon in many additional ways, some being much more ambitious than others! For example:

    • Making the points valuable in some way.
    • Titles/Achievements/Rewards for completing a Category.
    • Physical location in game to display module Collections such as in a museum or placed as a housing decoration.
    • Collection challenges to promote expanding your library.
    I would be more concerned with how this affects the game economy yet again. There aren't many artifacts that actually sell anymore.

    If this collections idea was a thing than someone buys a Staff of Flowers and they're all set on any toon.

    That could affect pricing on items where a seller may decide to raise the price from 500k to 2M (just examples) to compensate for the fact that fewer will be needed.

    To players that have 10 toons that's a steal. To a player with one toon that's highway robbery.

    Regardless, I would love it if the collections were account-wide versus per toon though. I'm not one for passing items around to all my toons just to unlock it in collections.
    they need to bring in ways to gobble up overstock in artifacts and enchantments. it used to have utility in refining artifacts and enchantments. there is just too much in the game and too much that is flat out obsolete. dropping out some old artifacts from the loot tables would probably help. Refinement needs to drop less. we all want more mastercrafting and crafting utility. maybe if they made some kind of temp vendor that you summoned with old artifacts and enchantments and surplus equipment. it would help siphon off some of this overstock. it would also be nice to add some utility to some of the old sets in modern form. maybe have it all work towards giving a new bonus and stats to an old artifact set. right now there is almost no way to have different playstyles among the classes. there is no variety. no way to do a unique AND effective build. it would be nice if maybe the artifact sets could have some more utility. some for healers some for tanks some for strong dps and some sort of support type utility for weaker dps.

    the other thing that needs to be addressed is the way that with the current builds have changed that ONLY radiants, empowered, bonding tacticals and tenebrous have any room in anyone's build. it seems like those enchants have become one size fits all for everyone. heals and tanks should use something else imo to give variety to the market. maybe even different depending on the class of healer you play. something synchronous with heals and tank for pally. something synchronous with dps and tank for barb etc. to help avoid it being a very expensive situation to use both sides of your path.
  • thefiresidecatthefiresidecat Member Posts: 4,486 Arc User
    edited February 2020
    greywynd said:



    that is true of the vip ones we get, but not true of the mechanic itself. what I said is true of the mechanic itself.

    A mechanic that was stated to be a bug from the get-go. Just an exploit they didn't close for entirely too long.
    an exploit that has a button added to it for our convenience of exploiting that poor old chest? that was there for as long as I was playing the game? even if it wasn't wai.. (which I really don't believe) then if you leave something in for multiple years and it can be done just by hitting a button that has been put there for your convenience, then it is no longer something you can call an exploit. it is a feature.

    ask yourself, why would there be a decline button on the chest if they didn't intend to give you away to say no, for this I will not use my key... if they intended to use your key no matter what why put a decline button on there? it would just give you the stuff and take your key. not let you "decline to do so" and take your key. why would it do that? is the kool aid good where you are? I find it to be rather blase myself. I'd rather have fresh juice.


    Imo the rerolls are nice. they are a good utility. the peek feature was taken away and given the spin of exploit to force people to buy legendary keys. I'd be interested in knowing how that actually worked out for them? are people actually spending real life money on the keys that they weren't then? ( I doubt it) I know I never have. I just exchange ad for them. and if they took that away I'd leave the game. I'd never pay cash money for what's in the chest. (that honestly is Pay to win)
    if the rerolls are really a problem with the market, I would be more than happy just to go back to the peak chest model. i think it worked. (and it would be even better if you could still do like one reroll on it because imo the chest odds are still pretty bad)
    Post edited by thefiresidecat on
  • rev#7881 rev Member Posts: 343 Arc User
    I will keep it short or try to

    Dungeons

    Aside from random q's no one in their right minds will q for a old dungeon, unless they are feeling nostalgic, showing someone or are a new player themselves, why you ask? well spending 15+ mins (in some cases more others less) just to get 6k ad, 1 mod 6 piece of gear and 200/300 refinement points its really not worth it.

    It used to be worth it when you could salvage gear into ad and refine that ad on different characters now its just a waste of time (who remembers 5 min etos farming, oh good old days!!)
    (and for @cwhitesidedev#9752 who wasn't here before the conversion from rough to normal astral diamonds wasn't account capped like it is now, it was character capped so if you had 100+ chars you could refine 35k per day on each of them)


    People in the thread gave the idea of making a certain dungeon drop a certain piece of gear, well a year ago i gave the idea of giving exclusive companions/mounts or transmutes to old dungeons to incentive players, even said the latest dungeon/trial should have a small chance of a leg mount like day of the dungeon master has (i ran Artificers Workshop more than 1000 times at least over the years for that and will still run it)

    *and yes there shouldn't be a chest re-roll option in my opinion but who cares

    ------------------------------------------


    Campaigns

    The only sense of progression they have is the fact that in some you need to complete them to unlock the dungeon or the rank 14 enchant in acquisition incorporated because boons post mod 16 suck... a lot...

    People already gave good ideas about a boon rework in the thread no point in giving more.

    (I saw someone talking about campaigns and alts well easy fix for that, remove daily/weekly caps if you have at least 1 lvl 80 toon with all campaigns completed or even a crazier idea remove the caps of the 3 oldest campaigns to everyone including new players and every time a new one comes out, another loses the caps.)



    ------------------------------------------

    Good old post mod 16 scaling Scaling

    The current scaling doesn't make sense in terms of progression . You spend a lot of time and money upgrading your enchants/character and then you have all of that them scaled down in 90% of the game

    Either revert/remove or rework current scaling

    (side note i really don't understand the fixation of reducing all content to lvl 70 every couple mods but that's for another thread...)

    ------------------------------------------


  • thefiresidecatthefiresidecat Member Posts: 4,486 Arc User
    edited February 2020
    lassor said:


    I agree with the idea that chase items should be much rarer than the ToMM rings and I do believe it was something I raised, as well as other people raised when ToMM first came out. The point was more about the fact that if you are farming something that drops, it should be unbound because there is no sense of progression when you are fighting against RNG. It is a binary system, you either have it (it drops) or you don't, there is no way to measure your progress and that causes frustration. An example of this is the Shadowstalker Ring, I did weeklies for this ring on 3 characters from the release of Omu until the end of M16, the only time I skipped farming this was when I took a break in M15. I did not get the ring I wanted. I did not enjoy the grind and the only pleasure I got out of this was when the ring was finally obsolete, because I never felt like I made any progress. All of the time I spent farming this item was a complete waste.

    In a system where you are dropping shards and there are say for example 1000 shards of an item it is fine for the item to be bound, because you always know how far you have progressed. Halaster's Whirlwind is a good example of the shard system.

    I also was not necessarily talking about the chase items coming from the hardest content, but rather a variety of places. For example, in the system I was proposing, there would exist items with chase crafted bonuses which would be exceptionally difficult to obtain, but the grind would be the fight against the crafting system and not a fight against content.

    ToMM rings are much more common due to reroll tokens. With the current chest setup, we either need to set drop rates with the expectation of using reroll tokens or not. The decision was made to view reroll tokens as a bonus, thus the players with massive stockpiles of them benefited from significantly increased drop rates. My preference is that we will be addressing this situation in some way to prevent our rare items in the future from dropping at these accelerated rates. Perhaps this could be accomplished by either reducing the number of available rerolls down from the 10 that are currently available or coming up with a more creative solution such as limiting the amount of times per week the "top" chase item is available through rerolling. These are just ideas in my head, it is up to our Systems team to make any adjustments.

    Personally, I'm on the fence about overusing systems in which you are guaranteed the item you seek after X completions. I think it works well for items such as the Lionheart weapons because they are a pivotal upgrade to equalize players among that tier. Bad rng resulting in someone not getting their Lionheart weapon would have a significant effect on their ability to compete with their peers. For other items I'm happy to leave those as a luck of the draw, but to your point if there are potency ranges for that item and it is unbound then you can sell off the version you don't want and feel good that you at least got something out of your time. I would hope that we would also have other systems in place that made you feel like you progressed in some way as well as you chased after the item you seek.

    I think the two of us are aligned as to our thoughts on propagating chase opportunities throughout the game, if not on the exact implementation.

    I fail to see the problem with the commonality of the tomm rings. the legendary tomm rings are going between 800k and 1.3 mil on the ah still on xbox at least. the pooh ones are cheaper. that seems like a reasonable price point. there are 129 total on the ah right now. Everyone I know who stuck with it on tomm for earlier completion is multi millionaires now. so rich they have no idea what to do with it all. Less drops they wouldn't be so rich. and the rings wouldn't be so common on the market. True. but on the other hand considering that this stuff is good and would create a have and have not situation if it was otherwise... it seems ok to me. what about giving high value items like this a trade only thing like the hunt drops had. less would end up on the market and the wealth would require a little more work to obtain.
    Post edited by thefiresidecat on
  • josephskyrimjosephskyrim Member Posts: 356 Arc User
    cor26 said:


    Leveling goes pretty fast but maybe a gear set that levels with you to level 70 would be a great addition to the zen market for them new players.

    Just want to add, such gear does (or did) exist - see here.
    If they still exist and function that way, they certainly aren't advertised enough.

    For example the ones in the vault of piety have no indication that they scale, so lower lever players won't get them because they think they can't use them and high level players won't get them because by that time they have better gear.
    If you can't stand on a chest, it is a mimic!
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