Power swapping is always a bad idea. Its just gonna creates whole lots of drama on deciding which power to swap beside causing unfairness to any party.
1. Your opinion. I consider it wrong. 2. Who is going to start the drama? I prefer numbers to drama. What about you?
Therefore I m suggesting Binding arrow to be removed from the game and replaced with a new encounter. If I am the developer, I'll just remove the root mechanic from the binding shot and give it a new name to avoid all the controversy in this feedback thread. Maybe replace the root mechanic with electric damage?
Also like @artifleur said earlier and I do feel it too, Rain of Arrow and Rain of Sword felt underpowered. Hope developer could look into it.
That's anothet hidden suggestion to buff power, although you do not provide any argumentation.
I feel that you enjoy debating more than analyzing, I suggest you to provide numbers that prove your point. If you bring up actual numerical proof that RoA is more useful on Hunter than Binding, than we can continue our arguement.
Until then, I'm done arguing with you.
Regards
Like u said, everything isn't final in preview. Why would i need numerical proof to show anything when any of the value could change at anytime to make an argument invalid? Also, why am I the one that have to proof that RoA is more useful on hunter than binding when u are the one that are making the swap request? The reason that u posted earlier does not even convince me.
Why should RoA be the sacrificial lamb? So far u give me 2 reason. First, its because u feel RoA is an inferior encounter which its radius isn't big enough for it to be effective? If u feel that way, u can simply prompt it as a feedback like I did. ( No hidden suggestion like u say. I'm merely giving a simple feedback based on what u and artifleur evaluate ). Swapping RoA with binding has no contribution towards solving RoA being a weak encounter as RoA doesn't get any better if it were to shifted to warden path. 2nd reason u gave is RoS is better suit for melee build warden. That isn't a reason either since RoS has always been accessible by warden. The problem with your suggestion is that hunter are no longer able to access RoA. So u have to give me a reason based on that
If u say Binding arrow should not be in a warden paragon path and its more suitable for hunter because of root mechanic, I totally agree with the feedback. But that still doesn't explain why must it be RoA does it?
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arazith07Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,719Arc User
RoA/RoS is the weakest of the base ranger skills that doesn't apply root, IF there was a swap that one would affect the least amount of people.
The idea has been raised, let's leave it be. No since in wasting space in thread arguing with someone who just wants to keep telling us to stop giving feedback.
Just so others reading the spreadsheet from the USA, UK, or other parts of the world that use the decimal point instead of a comma don't get confused, the commas in that spreadsheet are decimal separators. The International System of Units recognizes both the point and the comma. In the USA, we use the comma as a thousands separator. All the encounter magnitudes per second are pretty lame and make rapid shot or electric shot your better magnitude per second option, depending on whether you're going single target or multi-target. I worry the Developers might be reading those calculations as commas and thinking everything is fine, or worse, thinking they need to nerf them. Surely they have their own charts, graphs, and formulas to make such decisions instead of relying on the community.
Thanks for that feedback. I added hint to the shpreadsheet about decimal places.
To be fair, multi-charge skills and long-duration skills don't quite translate as simply as other skills when it comes to magnitude per second. Rapid Volley is probably the most powerful encounter power Hunters have.
And here you are wrong, sorry. They translate to mps as simple as other skills due to mechanics of charges cooldowns (fire 5 charges of volley and you will have to wait 5x cooldowns to get those 5 charges back) and due to the fact that HR encounter powers have no dots which last longer than encounter cooldown (encounter powers, not roots, not at-wills). Charges are only good for burst. Mps as stat doesn't recflect burst. Volley capability to fire all 5 charges in 2 seconds is great, but it's a burst damage. Mps reflects sustained damage. Mps of volley is still rather high, though.
My two cents in on the power reassignment debate - the skills should stay where they are to avoid over-specializing and creating cookie-cutter BiS clone builds. Let's have some diversity in play style and builds, please!
If you read my suggestion again, you will see that I provide the short explanation why this will increase diversity on Hunter. Again, about which specialization we are talking? Hunter can choose to specialize in roots. He can choose it regardless of the swap. However, his output as specialist which has decided to specialize in roots will be higher if he gets this encounter. Hunter can also choose to go all way ranged. In this case he will get one more heavy hitting encounter which he can use to ditch nice single target damage. He then has a choice, either to use Binding or to use Commanding Shot for buff. He can select to play hybrid roots + ranged. And again he's not tied up to obvious choice of Hindering + Constricting + 3rd power. He can use Binding instead of Constricting in situations when it's better than Constricting. Lots of divercity in fact.
About cookie cutter BiS clone builds: are you serious about that? - people who care about the output will always look for the best build. Considering HR DPS on LIVE, there's exactly ONE build which provides the best output for all (except soloing dungeons, maybe). That build is good for whatever. And AoE vs single target on that build is switching one encounter for the other one. - New mod looks like it can provide more variety. E.g. I see the possibility to use at least 4 viable builds that are applicable to different situations and which reach maximum potential in those situations. - People who do not care about the output will always use *some* set of powers. I think it's obvious from my posts, but I do not care about the opinion of those people on output of the class which they do not care about. :-)
Since the beginning of the game, as of mod 15, we became the only class that has 3 playable feat trees. Archery, trapper and the most loved combat for sure.
I didn't care about the sub-par damage of archery or trapper, I used to play them for having fun. When I needed DPS, I'd go combat and have a race with other DPS classes.
I don't care about having low damage or anything. The class I used to play was fun, probably one of the hardest classes to master also one of the funnest of them all.
Right now as of 23.03.2019 on preview, I could give up on my efforts since Module 2 of this game. This class is bullshet. Period. Not that it has bad DPS, not that it has bugs or anything. IT IS NOT FUN TO PLAY ANYMORE.
Please pleeease think simple. We want, archery, combat, and hybrid build. The most effective one of course should be the hybrid one since it would require mastering, and timing and etc. etc. You get the point.
Combat at-wills, utter shet. Besides rapid shot, ranged at-wills utter shet. Encounter placements across the paths, utter shet. Class features, utter shet. Seriously, you guys think that the beeeeeeeeeest class feature should be the one that increases a 5% buff by another 5% ?????? Really ? Who thought of that ? Are u completely careless, or out of idea?
This mod supposed to be a plain white paper right ? We need, combatters, archers and a hybrid build that is fun to play. I don't care about DPS, games are supposed to be fun right ? If you can't give us a hybrid build which is the creation idea of this class, at least give us combat and archery. Simple as that.
Last but not least, Flurry, dealing twice the damage of a magnitude of 15-40 for 3 seconds with less than half of normal weapon damaged weapon? Good job. Just erase the weapon damage on the blades, go with ranged damage all the time, you guys clearly can't handle a double weapon damaged class.
Finally, if this goes live, good bye community, it was a pleasure to meet you!
My thoughts are: with warden make lightning powers arc out like the lightning enchant doing minor stun (.2 seconds ??) with a 10% chance of chaining. with hunter give them all the root power with living roots. Each DOT root attack drains minor HP for the hunter. Take away the 3 types of roots and just give one thorned root.
RoA/RoS is the weakest of the base ranger skills that doesn't apply root, IF there was a swap that one would affect the least amount of people.
So the whole goal isn't to prioritize on fixing underperformed power, but instead it is to take the advantage of the said power's unpopularity to have the least people affected by a swap? Thanks for clearing things up. I wonder how balance it would be in the coming mod if developer were to approve this idea.
I wanted to call out a bug that will be showing up with the next preview update, already being fixed for the following update.
Deft Strikes, Swiftness of the Fox, and Longshot won't function properly. This was caused by fixes to stop the 0 damage ticks when switching stances. Apologies for the inconvenience, these will all be working again on a future update to preview.
I can confirm that Longshot is not working... As well as I can confirm this:
Rain and Thorn Ward are still ticking 0 when I swap stances. Anyone else?
Split the Sky is giving 0 ticks as well.
ABSOLUTE
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arazith07Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,719Arc User
The goal was to give both paths access to a more useful power. Yes, Rain of Arrows needs a buff imo. But if they don't want to improve it what is wrong about moving it in favor of something more useful? The goal was to give Hunters access to another rooting power to work with their synergy and theme, but also not take it away from Warden. IF rain of arrows is going to stay the way it is, it wouldn't be the end of the world if only one path has access to it. No one has said that rain of arrows shouldn't be buffed. We just wanted to give more access to the skills that are doing well and avoid pigeon holing people into specific builds. This change would not affect warden either way, but could improve the performance of Hunters and give them more options. The proposal is to make Binding arrow accessible to both paths so Hunters can have another root ability and Wardens don't lose out, how would you suggest that be implemented instead? There would have to be some concession somewhere to fit the power in the core 5. None of the other powers really fits into the stormy, lightning theme of the warden, however swapping out plant growth, hindering shot, constricting arrow won't fix the original problem of Hunter not having access to rooting powers. We are then left with rain of arrows and marauder's escape. Swapping with marauder's would then limit access to a utility power (with decent damage) that provides excellent range dictation that both paths can make use of. We are then left with rain of arrows which only has a damage part of the skill. Which is why people are suggesting that it be the target of the original swap.
Verified all at-wills cast times today via Combatlog file
All cast times stated in the tooltips are wrong with only exception being: - Aimed Shot (cast time is indeed 1.65) - Storm Strike (cast time is indeed 0,6) So, the question pops up: are those values in tooltip intended values, so that actual values will be adjusted in future? Or vice versa are the tooltips wrong and will be updated? Please, clarify
Example for CtG:
Tooltip says 0,3 s cast time, but in combatlog you can observe that it's 0,6 (average value):
In case cast times remain in their currenty state (and only tooltips are updated in future), then magnitude on other at-wills is to be adjusted. If you look at the spreadsheet, you will observe that after Aimed Shot got buff, Rapid Shot and Rapid Strike become useless (due to inaccurate cast times that mismatch tooltips). That requires either adjustment of cast times or adjustment of magnitude of certain powers: In that case magnitude of Rapid Shot as combo should be {56;56;98} avg = 70; that allows the same output as if tooltip was ok. Average magnitude of Rapid Strike should be 47, combo = {47;28;38;75}, same here, same output. Split Shot uncharged should have magnitude 40 to be more useful that Aimed Shot when dealing with 5 targets. Split Shot charged should have magnitude 76 to reward player with extra damage for sitting still. Clear the Ground could get adjustment as well to something like magnitude = 16.
The goal was to give both paths access to a more useful power. Yes, Rain of Arrows needs a buff imo. But if they don't want to improve it what is wrong about moving it in favor of something more useful? The goal was to give Hunters access to another rooting power to work with their synergy and theme, but also not take it away from Warden. IF rain of arrows is going to stay the way it is, it wouldn't be the end of the world if only one path has access to it. No one has said that rain of arrows shouldn't be buffed. We just wanted to give more access to the skills that are doing well and avoid pigeon holing people into specific builds. This change would not affect warden either way, but could improve the performance of Hunters and give them more options. The proposal is to make Binding arrow accessible to both paths so Hunters can have another root ability and Wardens don't lose out, how would you suggest that be implemented instead? There would have to be some concession somewhere to fit the power in the core 5. None of the other powers really fits into the stormy, lightning theme of the warden, however swapping out plant growth, hindering shot, constricting arrow won't fix the original problem of Hunter not having access to rooting powers. We are then left with rain of arrows and marauder's escape. Swapping with marauder's would then limit access to a utility power (with decent damage) that provides excellent range dictation that both paths can make use of. We are then left with rain of arrows which only has a damage part of the skill. Which is why people are suggesting that it be the target of the original swap.
U mean improving the choice root base hunter while gimping non root based hunter? U do know that by removing RoA, Non root based Hunter are left with 3 aoe encounter to choose from ( hawkshot which has terrain hit box problem, cordon of arrow and rapid volley). While Root base hunter on the other hand, has binding arrow, constricting arrow and hindering shot to pick on top of cordon of arrow, hawkshot and rapid volley giving a total of 6 aoe encounter to choose from. I don't get why further gimp the already limited choice of non root base hunter in the aoe department? It doesn't make sense does it?
Anyway, that's why I m suggesting instead of power swapping, why not have a rework on binding arrow by getting rid of the root mechanic and replace it with a stormy feature that suit the lightning theme of a warden. For example, instead proccing root, it shoot out chain of lightning that continuously spread across the mob like lightning enchantment ( as inspired by Athena, just not that OP as he/she suggested ). That would be much fitting of an encounter and it save everyone's headache trying to argue over a controversial topic such as which power to swap.
In case cast times remain in their currenty state (and only tooltips are updated in future), then magnitude on other at-wills is to be adjusted. If you look at the spreadsheet, you will observe that after Aimed Shot got buff, Rapid Shot and Rapid Strike become useless. My suggestion is to adjust the magnitude of Rapid Shot to combo = {56;56;98} avg = 70; that allows the same output as if tooltip was ok. Average magnitude of Rapid Strike should be 47, combo = {47;28;38;75}, same here, same output. Split Shot uncharged should have magnitude 40 to be more useful that Aimed Shot when dealing with 5 targets. Split Shot charged should have magnitude 76 to reward player with extra damage for sitting still. Clear the Ground could get adjustment as well to something like magnitude = 16.
Told u developer, by buffing only the magnitude on aim shot doesn't solve the problem. It only create another controversy between rapid shot and aim shot all over again like what happen back in mod 5. Its best to create special feature on one of the 2 at-will so it has their own uniqueness. Its either by what is suggested here by userutf8 or what is suggested on my past post in this thread. Also totally agree on splitshot should have a higher reward for charging its shot.
Guys, I have an issue right now. I have been a ranger for 4 years in this game between PC and console. got on the preview server after the patch yesterday, and there is almost no damage whatsoever from the ranger. My question is, Is this what you want from the ranger? right now the class seems unplayable on preview, which will make us the least wanted dps class in the game. Any response would be greatly appreciated.
Guys, I have an issue right now. I have been a ranger for 4 years in this game between PC and console. got on the preview server after the patch yesterday, and there is almost no damage whatsoever from the ranger. My question is, Is this what you want from the ranger? right now the class seems unplayable on preview, which will make us the least wanted dps class in the game. Any response would be greatly appreciated.
Yeah, the damage is hamster right now because several of the feats aren't proccing, features proccing incorrectly, and damage zeroes when you swap stances. I'm not the greatest supporter of our dev, but even I know this is not the intended state of Ranger.
The magnitudes for at wills is still not right. Rapid Shot still outperforms all other at-wills.
Rapid Shot: 100 to 175 MPS (mean 137.5) Split Shot: 25 to 16.7 MPS (yes, that seems to go down the longer you hold it). Electric Shot: 30 to 42 MPS Penetrating Arrows: 42.9 MPS Hunter's Teamwork: 71.4 MPS Aimed Shot: 121.2 MPS
The following feedback on At-Will Powers uses Rapid Shot as a baseline for comparison.
Split Shot is supposed to do more damage in exchange for higher risk with increased cast time and decreased number of targets in the path of the attack. Split Shot magnitude should be adjusted to match expected behavior.Split Shot is obviously replaced by Electric Shot for the Warden Path. Split Shot has a much higher cast time and does less damage per second than Electric Shot.
Electric Shot is fine as-is. Penetrating Arrows is fine as-is. Hunter's Teamwork is fine as-is.
Aimed Shot is still too weak. Hunters trade mobility for enhanced damage when using Aimed Shot. As the first Paragon Power (level 30), it should be the expected replacement for Rapid Shot, or at least a good alternative choice. Aimed Shot's magnitude per second should be equal to the maximum MPS of Rapid Shot to compensate for the lack of mobility while casting. Aimed Shot should have its magnitude changed to 288.75 or have its cast time changed to 1.14 seconds. As Aimed Shot sometimes has to be cancelled by dodging a heavy attack, there should be no worries about it being "too powerful" in comparison to other at-wills.
The magnitudes for at wills is still not right. Rapid Shot still outperforms all other at-wills.
Rapid Shot: 100 to 175 MPS (mean 137.5)
Rapid Shot = {40,40,70} combo with cast time according to tooltip = 0.4. So, you should really take into consideration average magnitude value which is (40 + 40 + 70)/3 = 50. And mps of it (according to tooltip) must be 125 (it's not 137.5).
Actual average cast time according to combat log (file) is 0.7. Real mps is 71,43 due to cast time being longer than one specified in the tooltip.
all at wills are too low for my taste. Relatively speaking, from M15 to M16p the clear the ground (which is my main) has gone down about half as powerful, now some of that is the blade flurry issue but overall assessment IMO is that at wills are about half as powerful as needed and so are the encounters. When i tested my OP justicar i was doing about 10 times the damage my tank could do in live ( i like that ) but that OP was 12k and my HR is 16k. HR needs some uppity loving,
The magnitudes for at wills is still not right. Rapid Shot still outperforms all other at-wills.
Rapid Shot: 100 to 175 MPS (mean 137.5)
Rapid Shot = {40,40,70} combo with cast time according to tooltip = 0.4. So, you should really take into consideration average magnitude value which is (40 + 40 + 70)/3 = 50. And mps of it (according to tooltip) must be 125 (it's not 137.5).
Actual average cast time according to combat log (file) is 0.7. Real mps is 71,43 due to cast time being longer than one specified in the tooltip.
I was basing my calculations on the tooltips as that is the specified magnitude/cast time, but thanks for the extra info on your average cast time from your log file. I'm not seeing where you have 40,40,70 from tooltip. Mine says "Magnitude: 40 - 70" or in other words, ranging between 40 and 70 inclusively, which would be 40+70/2 for the mean. The median might be higher or lower than the mean, but the log file shows damage and doesn't give any information about magnitude, so it's not easy to measure directly.
Please post the formula for calculating damage so we can verify magnitudes.
The magnitudes for at wills is still not right. Rapid Shot still outperforms all other at-wills.
Rapid Shot: 100 to 175 MPS (mean 137.5)
Rapid Shot = {40,40,70} combo with cast time according to tooltip = 0.4. So, you should really take into consideration average magnitude value which is (40 + 40 + 70)/3 = 50. And mps of it (according to tooltip) must be 125 (it's not 137.5).
Actual average cast time according to combat log (file) is 0.7. Real mps is 71,43 due to cast time being longer than one specified in the tooltip.
I was basing my calculations on the tooltips as that is the specified magnitude/cast time, but thanks for the extra info on your average cast time from your log file. I'm not seeing where you have 40,40,70 from tooltip. Mine says "Magnitude: 40 - 70" or in other words, ranging between 40 and 70 inclusively, which would be 40+70/2 for the mean. The median might be higher or lower than the mean, but the log file shows damage and doesn't give any information about magnitude, so it's not easy to measure directly.
Please post the formula for calculating damage so we can verify magnitudes.
1. Tooltips *mostly* report magnitude correctly. But they are not very informative when it comes to combo-type at-wills - they give you range (e.g. 40-70) but that range doesn't mean that some random value is picked from that range - it just specifies that each strike of combo is within range :-)
If you go naked with 100 dmg fixed weapons (which can be purchased in ToB for 5 gold each), you will notice that Rapid Shot is a combo of 3 hits: 1st hit *always* has magnitude 40, 2nd hit *always* has magnitude 40, 3rd hit *always* has magnitude 70.
Rapid Strike, Storm Strike, Clear the Ground, Electric Shot are all combos. Each hit of that combo has its fixed magnitude value.
2. Tooltips on HR at-wills do not report cast time correctly (which is either design bug or tooltip bug, which i reported above). Here's how actual cast time can be measured: if you check CombatLog file in Playtest logs folder (Neverwinter_en\Neverwinter\Playtest\logs\GameClient) you will notice that CombatLog files all have time precision of 0.1 second. By checking the average time passed between at-will hits (similar entries in CombatLog file) you can get real actual cast time. You can use ACT - it doesn't show milliseconds, but you can drilldown to power and it will show you a page that reports CombatLog entries. You can filter those entries on the page.
3. Why would you need damage formula to measure magnitude? All you need is fixed damage weapon and combatlog (do not forget to strip your toon of all gear and companions, reset all boons and feats, unslot passives that give damage boost).
un fortunately the few changes made were for the worst so preview really wont give us much to test because so much is bugged at the moment. I expect we will get some substantial changes in next few weeks and then I will breath a sigh of relief/
I know it has been said already, and theres already stats showing this but i have to mention this; even after last patch Aimed Shot still need more dmg to be a usefull power and match he's description the reason i can let this pass is that this is an amazing power that should be a signature for single target archers even being a at-will...
I know it has been said already, and theres already stats showing this but i have to mention this; even after last patch Aimed Shot still need more dmg to be a usefull power and match he's description the reason i can let this pass is that this is an amazing power that should be a signature for single target archers even being a at-will...
206-207 would be a better fit, yeah. :-)
For those interested, I tested cap on RoA and CoA. It's 5 targets for RoA and 15 targets for CoA.
Testing details:
Posting method, so anyone can repeat if he wants
level 100 weapons to prevent fast mob killing, lvl 80 Armor, Sigil of Oathbound and Stone of Health to prevent death
Instances: Ebon Downs and Icespire Peak (thanks to @thefabricant who suggested to test in Ebon Downs - it's great)
aggro zombies/goblins (as much as possible: 10-20 mobs), lure them to the corner, wall where you cannot be pushed back.
wait till mobs stop moving around you and cast RoA on all pack of em
analyze results in ACT
I did 9 tests on zombies in Ebon Downs and 1 test in Icespire Peak (goblins) to make sure that result doesn't somehow depend on mob types and sizes.
Here on the screen you can see that RoA actually hits only 5 mobs at a time (sequence of mobs IDs repeats all the time). (You can observe the same on mobs' healthbars. Only 5 healthbars are diminishing.)
Tested CoA (same method but only Ebon Downs, 5 tests)
Comments
Why should RoA be the sacrificial lamb? So far u give me 2 reason. First, its because u feel RoA is an inferior encounter which its radius isn't big enough for it to be effective? If u feel that way, u can simply prompt it as a feedback like I did. ( No hidden suggestion like u say. I'm merely giving a simple feedback based on what u and artifleur evaluate ). Swapping RoA with binding has no contribution towards solving RoA being a weak encounter as RoA doesn't get any better if it were to shifted to warden path. 2nd reason u gave is RoS is better suit for melee build warden. That isn't a reason either since RoS has always been accessible by warden. The problem with your suggestion is that hunter are no longer able to access RoA. So u have to give me a reason based on that
If u say Binding arrow should not be in a warden paragon path and its more suitable for hunter because of root mechanic, I totally agree with the feedback. But that still doesn't explain why must it be RoA does it?
They translate to mps as simple as other skills due to mechanics of charges cooldowns (fire 5 charges of volley and you will have to wait 5x cooldowns to get those 5 charges back) and due to the fact that HR encounter powers have no dots which last longer than encounter cooldown (encounter powers, not roots, not at-wills).
Charges are only good for burst.
Mps as stat doesn't recflect burst.
Volley capability to fire all 5 charges in 2 seconds is great, but it's a burst damage.
Mps reflects sustained damage.
Mps of volley is still rather high, though. If you read my suggestion again, you will see that I provide the short explanation why this will increase diversity on Hunter. Again, about which specialization we are talking?
Hunter can choose to specialize in roots. He can choose it regardless of the swap.
However, his output as specialist which has decided to specialize in roots will be higher if he gets this encounter.
Hunter can also choose to go all way ranged.
In this case he will get one more heavy hitting encounter which he can use to ditch nice single target damage.
He then has a choice, either to use Binding or to use Commanding Shot for buff.
He can select to play hybrid roots + ranged. And again he's not tied up to obvious choice of Hindering + Constricting + 3rd power. He can use Binding instead of Constricting in situations when it's better than Constricting.
Lots of divercity in fact.
About cookie cutter BiS clone builds: are you serious about that?
- people who care about the output will always look for the best build. Considering HR DPS on LIVE, there's exactly ONE build which provides the best output for all (except soloing dungeons, maybe). That build is good for whatever. And AoE vs single target on that build is switching one encounter for the other one.
- New mod looks like it can provide more variety. E.g. I see the possibility to use at least 4 viable builds that are applicable to different situations and which reach maximum potential in those situations.
- People who do not care about the output will always use *some* set of powers. I think it's obvious from my posts, but I do not care about the opinion of those people on output of the class which they do not care about. :-)
I didn't care about the sub-par damage of archery or trapper, I used to play them for having fun. When I needed DPS, I'd go combat and have a race with other DPS classes.
I don't care about having low damage or anything. The class I used to play was fun, probably one of the hardest classes to master also one of the funnest of them all.
Right now as of 23.03.2019 on preview, I could give up on my efforts since Module 2 of this game. This class is bullshet. Period. Not that it has bad DPS, not that it has bugs or anything. IT IS NOT FUN TO PLAY ANYMORE.
Please pleeease think simple. We want, archery, combat, and hybrid build. The most effective one of course should be the hybrid one since it would require mastering, and timing and etc. etc. You get the point.
Combat at-wills, utter shet. Besides rapid shot, ranged at-wills utter shet. Encounter placements across the paths, utter shet. Class features, utter shet. Seriously, you guys think that the beeeeeeeeeest class feature should be the one that increases a 5% buff by another 5% ?????? Really ? Who thought of that ? Are u completely careless, or out of idea?
This mod supposed to be a plain white paper right ? We need, combatters, archers and a hybrid build that is fun to play. I don't care about DPS, games are supposed to be fun right ? If you can't give us a hybrid build which is the creation idea of this class, at least give us combat and archery. Simple as that.
Last but not least, Flurry, dealing twice the damage of a magnitude of 15-40 for 3 seconds with less than half of normal weapon damaged weapon? Good job. Just erase the weapon damage on the blades, go with ranged damage all the time, you guys clearly can't handle a double weapon damaged class.
Finally, if this goes live, good bye community, it was a pleasure to meet you!
No one has said that rain of arrows shouldn't be buffed. We just wanted to give more access to the skills that are doing well and avoid pigeon holing people into specific builds. This change would not affect warden either way, but could improve the performance of Hunters and give them more options.
The proposal is to make Binding arrow accessible to both paths so Hunters can have another root ability and Wardens don't lose out, how would you suggest that be implemented instead? There would have to be some concession somewhere to fit the power in the core 5.
None of the other powers really fits into the stormy, lightning theme of the warden, however swapping out plant growth, hindering shot, constricting arrow won't fix the original problem of Hunter not having access to rooting powers. We are then left with rain of arrows and marauder's escape. Swapping with marauder's would then limit access to a utility power (with decent damage) that provides excellent range dictation that both paths can make use of. We are then left with rain of arrows which only has a damage part of the skill. Which is why people are suggesting that it be the target of the original swap.
Verified all at-wills cast times today via Combatlog file
All cast times stated in the tooltips are wrong with only exception being:
- Aimed Shot (cast time is indeed 1.65)
- Storm Strike (cast time is indeed 0,6)
So, the question pops up: are those values in tooltip intended values, so that actual values will be adjusted in future? Or vice versa are the tooltips wrong and will be updated?
Please, clarify
Example for CtG:
Tooltip says 0,3 s cast time, but in combatlog you can observe that it's 0,6 (average value):
In case cast times remain in their currenty state (and only tooltips are updated in future), then magnitude on other at-wills is to be adjusted.
If you look at the spreadsheet, you will observe that after Aimed Shot got buff, Rapid Shot and Rapid Strike become useless (due to inaccurate cast times that mismatch tooltips).
That requires either adjustment of cast times or adjustment of magnitude of certain powers:
In that case magnitude of Rapid Shot as combo should be {56;56;98} avg = 70;
that allows the same output as if tooltip was ok.
Average magnitude of Rapid Strike should be 47, combo = {47;28;38;75}, same here, same output.
Split Shot uncharged should have magnitude 40 to be more useful that Aimed Shot when dealing with 5 targets.
Split Shot charged should have magnitude 76 to reward player with extra damage for sitting still.
Clear the Ground could get adjustment as well to something like magnitude = 16.
Updated spreadsheet:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1r0LLxAKif3AUwYKyTaoIfB1clrP7u8fQpoCYMYuct6M/edit#gid=1536700439
Anyway, that's why I m suggesting instead of power swapping, why not have a rework on binding arrow by getting rid of the root mechanic and replace it with a stormy feature that suit the lightning theme of a warden. For example, instead proccing root, it shoot out chain of lightning that continuously spread across the mob like lightning enchantment ( as inspired by Athena, just not that OP as he/she suggested ). That would be much fitting of an encounter and it save everyone's headache trying to argue over a controversial topic such as which power to swap.
Aspect of Serpent only build and consume stacks(both melee and range) from at-wills
Rain of arrows still does not dmg when switching to melee form
Guild:
Dragon Server-Essence of Aggression
Drider Server- TheWolves
youtube channel
The cast times of the powers need to made to match the tooltip. We have enough long animations to deal with.
Rapid Shot: 100 to 175 MPS (mean 137.5)
Split Shot: 25 to 16.7 MPS (yes, that seems to go down the longer you hold it).
Electric Shot: 30 to 42 MPS
Penetrating Arrows: 42.9 MPS
Hunter's Teamwork: 71.4 MPS
Aimed Shot: 121.2 MPS
The following feedback on At-Will Powers uses Rapid Shot as a baseline for comparison.
Split Shot is supposed to do more damage in exchange for higher risk with increased cast time and decreased number of targets in the path of the attack. Split Shot magnitude should be adjusted to match expected behavior.Split Shot is obviously replaced by Electric Shot for the Warden Path. Split Shot has a much higher cast time and does less damage per second than Electric Shot.
Electric Shot is fine as-is.
Penetrating Arrows is fine as-is.
Hunter's Teamwork is fine as-is.
Aimed Shot is still too weak. Hunters trade mobility for enhanced damage when using Aimed Shot. As the first Paragon Power (level 30), it should be the expected replacement for Rapid Shot, or at least a good alternative choice. Aimed Shot's magnitude per second should be equal to the maximum MPS of Rapid Shot to compensate for the lack of mobility while casting. Aimed Shot should have its magnitude changed to 288.75 or have its cast time changed to 1.14 seconds. As Aimed Shot sometimes has to be cancelled by dodging a heavy attack, there should be no worries about it being "too powerful" in comparison to other at-wills.
So, you should really take into consideration average magnitude value which is (40 + 40 + 70)/3 = 50.
And mps of it (according to tooltip) must be 125 (it's not 137.5).
Actual average cast time according to combat log (file) is 0.7.
Real mps is 71,43 due to cast time being longer than one specified in the tooltip.
Most of the bugs might not be related to the last change, i do not see any problem retest when they'll be fixed.
Guild:
Dragon Server-Essence of Aggression
Drider Server- TheWolves
youtube channel
Please post the formula for calculating damage so we can verify magnitudes.
But they are not very informative when it comes to combo-type at-wills - they give you range (e.g. 40-70) but that range doesn't mean that some random value is picked from that range - it just specifies that each strike of combo is within range :-)
If you go naked with 100 dmg fixed weapons (which can be purchased in ToB for 5 gold each), you will notice that Rapid Shot is a combo of 3 hits: 1st hit *always* has magnitude 40, 2nd hit *always* has magnitude 40, 3rd hit *always* has magnitude 70.
Rapid Strike, Storm Strike, Clear the Ground, Electric Shot are all combos.
Each hit of that combo has its fixed magnitude value.
2. Tooltips on HR at-wills do not report cast time correctly (which is either design bug or tooltip bug, which i reported above).
Here's how actual cast time can be measured:
if you check CombatLog file in Playtest logs folder (Neverwinter_en\Neverwinter\Playtest\logs\GameClient)
you will notice that CombatLog files all have time precision of 0.1 second.
By checking the average time passed between at-will hits (similar entries in CombatLog file) you can get real actual cast time.
You can use ACT - it doesn't show milliseconds, but you can drilldown to power and it will show you a page that reports CombatLog entries. You can filter those entries on the page.
Here's my spreadsheet with results - cast times on at-wills I remeasured on Friday after patch. Cast times of encounters I never checked (they do not matter much, but i will check later)
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1r0LLxAKif3AUwYKyTaoIfB1clrP7u8fQpoCYMYuct6M/edit#gid=567463495
3. Why would you need damage formula to measure magnitude?
All you need is fixed damage weapon and combatlog (do not forget to strip your toon of all gear and companions, reset all boons and feats, unslot passives that give damage boost).
But here's the damage formula in case you need it :-)
https://jannenw.info/pages/mechanics16/formulas
For those interested, I tested cap on RoA and CoA.
It's 5 targets for RoA and 15 targets for CoA.
Testing details:
Posting method, so anyone can repeat if he wants
I did 9 tests on zombies in Ebon Downs and 1 test in Icespire Peak (goblins) to make sure that result doesn't somehow depend on mob types and sizes.
Here on the screen you can see that RoA actually hits only 5 mobs at a time (sequence of mobs IDs repeats all the time).
(You can observe the same on mobs' healthbars. Only 5 healthbars are diminishing.)
Tested CoA (same method but only Ebon Downs, 5 tests)