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OFFICIAL FEEDBACK THREAD: Professions Overhaul

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  • agilestoagilesto Member Posts: 516 Arc User
    My complain about Black Ice shaping is about the items you can create with the empowering system, these contribue to the collection. And the fact that you won't be able to craft them on Mod 15 remove some legacy gear, and I need to rush myself to finish this part of the collection before the Mod hits. And I don't like to be rushed :(
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  • asterdahlasterdahl Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 1,258 Cryptic Developer
    empalas said:

    although this doesn't apply to my current toons but if all of the other professions are going to rely on gathering and if you don't have leadership maxxed then how will that work?

    So say I'm at level 25 in tailoring now. In the new system, I will now be lvl 70 tailoring. If I haven't leveled leadership at all, will gathering be at 0/1?

    Because gathering is now an important part of all professions, and anyone would naturally have leveled gathering alongside their crafting profession in the new system, we will be granting everyone a gathering level equal to their maximum profession level.

    Also I would like to know what will happen with non-spent masterwork resource maps. I've missed the few last double profession events, and I'm not sure if I'll get to the next one. Is it possible to convert these maps in general to some advanced expedition order for professions that will gather specific rare masterwork resources? The gathering of these resources is very boring and mind blowing during double professions and it makes sense to gather them only during double professions. I have around 100 maps not spent :( .

    Masterwork materials are not changing, and masterwork recipes will largely require the same materials. At this time gathering will be unable to obtain masterwork materials, and the only way to obtain them will continue to be gathering them via explorer's charts.
    sjza80 said:

    Please either remove a gold cost or make it sufficiently small it can be gathered easily through natural play, eg a couple of dungeon runs or quests, and not require significant farming replacing one source of tedium with an arguably for more tedious and frustrating one.

    For leveling and simple endgame tasks we are aiming for costs that are quite low and seem reasonable given normal play. Particularly with leveling tasks, we'd like you to be able to max out gathering and a crafting profession without having to stop to farm gold. That said, compared to current play where you may completely ignore selling items for gold, it may be good to pay attention to those items that sell for gold.

    We based the cost for recipes around median income data from recently active players in each level bracket, but please provide feedback once the recipes are available on preview.
    chiatzou said:

    Will there be new viable gear introduced in the new professions? Will this system continually upgrade so we do not have the same problem we already have?

    The initial preview build will not have final item levels for recipes, however, item levels on certain recipes, including masterwork recipes will be adjusted; and as all recipes—including masterwork—will now have normal and high quality results, there should be a variety of viable new equipment depending on your current item level.

    In regards to new recipes in the future, we plan to continue adding new recipes at more regular intervals. The professions system has been reworked in such a way that adding new recipes is significantly easier than it was in the past. In addition, the introduction of statistical requirements for recipes means we can add recipes of increasing difficulty without increasing the level cap of the professions system.


    Where will Bag of Gems/Crystals/Jewels fall into the upgrading of professions now?

    Will 4 greens convert to the same as 1 blue for trade-in? Same question for 4 blues converting to 1 Epic? (seems upgrading assets/tools will be gone) … Just wondering if trade-in values for lesser tiers will be 25% of their next tier to keep values equal.

    Will there be any trade skills that provide character experience quests (not trade skill experience) like Leadership does now, to encourage trade skilling on alts to generate overflow experience rewards for power points? Or will it be a 'grind your way to overflow exp on alts you rarely play' transition?

    How will Mastercraft Maps be addressed (in inventory, shared bank, etc.)? As in, getting 1x, 2x, 4x drops per node depending on event and guild boon.

    Will multi-craft Legendary tools (aka. Crucible) be tradeable for multiple new tools via trade-in? (might as well crash the market now).

    Will there be any change to existing Artisan/Quartermaster trade skill boxes that will influence the new trade skill system?

    Bags of gems will be exchangeable for experience points manuals which boost XP gained by the task. A new slot is available on recipes for items called supplements which can be obtained via various methods, including being crafted by an alchemist. These supplements are optional items that will be consumed during the recipe.

    In regards to exactly how the tools will convert in the new system, it won't be as simple as 12:4:1, as the tools will no longer be distinguished by their rarity, and simply by their item level. Tools are also now crafted by other professions. Once the trade-in values become available on preview, please take a look.

    Regarding XP scrolls from leadership: we currently do not plan to provide a way for gathering to generate xp scrolls. In general, player experience far outpaces professions experience, so these are only valuable for earning power points. We will consider adjustments based on feedback.

    Legendary tools will convert 1:1 with a new tool of your choice which are all bound to a specific profession.
    arod7932 said:

    Any changes to Stronghold profession vendors? (Atelier, Tanner, etc.)

    The standard leveling materials that may be purchased via these structures will be adjusted. Masterwork specific materials will remain the same.

    asterdahl said:

    agilesto said:

    Little question: What will happen to the Black Ice profession? Will we still be able to empower old items like drow, dragonfligh or eleven stuff? Asking for collection, if I should rush it now or if it's still possible later.

    Black Ice Shaping will be removed from the game. Ultimately this was a feature that was built at a very specific time in Neverwinter history and the team that originally built it intended for it to be supported long term. However, it really holds no unique place in terms of the items it creates, as professions that create all sorts of equipment already exist.

    Instead, it simply creates items similar to what other professions create, with the added mechanic that you must keep the item charged with black ice, which is ultimately not something the current team would like to see persisted. For those who have black ice assets and tools, you will be able to turn those into assets and materials for other professions in cases where they no longer have a use.

    As for the materials and black ice equipment itself, a new contact will be available at the black ice forge in Caer-Konig who will be able to "craft" items for you out of the materials.

    I had to make 8x lvl5 black ice forges to upgrade all the gear back when elven and dragonflight armor could be improved with this profession.. there was no way around it.. if you wanted elemental gear you needed black ice forge

    this was a huge undertaking .. and now you are ripping it up and any of us that went thru this , survived the leadership ad nerf and stuck with game get this as a reward?

    will we be able to craft the overload enchants?
    this was the only saving grace for a system many were forced to upgrade to max ,only to watch it be come neglected and useless .. will the black ice overloads also be removed from the game?
    As mentioned, you'll be able to exchange your progress in black ice professions and your assets for other items. Black ice enchantments will continue to be available as will the other black ice equipment, through an NPC at the forge in Caer-Konig.

    How is donating Labor to the Stronghold Coffer going to work now? Are you still going to be able to donate individuals? Or is it mainly going to be something you make form the new Gathering tree like you can right now with Leadership?

    We are making some adjustments to how labor works in general. You will be able to donate more professions related items than you can in the current system, but will not be donating the new artisans. Existing artisans will convert into bills of labor that can be converted over to new professions assets or donated to strongholds as they currently may be.
  • mintmarkmintmark Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 481 Arc User
    agilesto said:

    My complain about Black Ice shaping is about the items you can create with the empowering system, these contribue to the collection. And the fact that you won't be able to craft them on Mod 15 remove some legacy gear, and I need to rush myself to finish this part of the collection before the Mod hits. And I don't like to be rushed :(

    I understand this comment because I was doing black ice to fill gaps in my collection pages too... but it was always low priority because it does take lots of resources and the equipment is obsolete. There's even a bug where you can salvage some of the gear you make and don't get any AD at all :)

    But the collection points don't earn us anything and maybe those items will just disappear like some previous black ice gear... at least the gaps in the collection will be gone!

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  • asterdahlasterdahl Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 1,258 Cryptic Developer


    Please allow (some) weapon/armor transmutes to be craftable.

    You’ve got a huge stock of designs from obsolete gear, many of which are pretty good, and your artists seem good at coming up with new things as well.

    Perhaps, instead of dropping transmutes at (rarely occurring) CTAs or Simril, drop “designs” that can unlock recipes to craft the transmutes.

    Taking this a step further, in the spirit of the mostly-defunct Foundry, you could allow the community to make and contribute designs.

    Every new recipe will have a unique appearance composed of a variety of classic visuals retooled and available in unique colors, so please take a look. We'll continue to introduce new styles in future updates.

    asterdahl said:



    RE: RNG: Because we are introducing the concept of a success rate when crafting an item, you could say that more randomness is indeed being introduced. However, for leveling recipes, as long as you keep your artisans equipped with new tools (which are now obtained via in game means by simply crafting the tools or purchasing them from other players off the auction house) you should have a high success rate when crafting items.

    Maybe I'm reading more into this than I should but your statement, "keep your artisans equipped with new tools," has me a bit concerned. Does this mean that tools will degrade as you use them? Or worse be one time use? Which I can't see.
    Tools do not have durability.

    How new system will connect with gameplay? I'd love to upgrade and do new professions because crafting was always my favourite part of any MMO. But I wonder if it will be connected in some way to content? Like "you need x asset that drop only in Tong" or similiar. It would be nice to have reason to run some content - even older one like msva.

    Will new system use RP in any way? RP value decreased over time so I wonder if it will be usable in any way (like upgrade your tool

    Any good AD sinks other than rushing tasks? For example every craft cost with set AD cost

    How big role guild marks will play in new system? Masterwork and normal. Now it's nicely connected with mw so people had reasons to donate to coffer.

    Though the new leveling recipes don't directly tie into gameplay in terms of materials obtained from combat, masterwork recipes will remain unchanged in this regard, and we will continue to include similar items in the future, such as those found on dungeon bosses.

    In regards to refinement, gems will now be used in jewelcrafting recipes. For instance, black pearls and aquamarines can be used to make jewelry, with higher value refinement gems being used for higher level recipes.

    asterdahl said:

    mailsmithing and platesmithing are being merged under a single umbrella "Armorsmithing."

    It sounds like Leatherworking and Tailoring should also be merged?
    Leatherworking and tailoring use entirely different techniques and materials. Merging mailsmithing and platesmithing into armorsmithing was not specifically with the intent of merging equipment for more classes under a single umbrella, but to reduce the massive redundancy in metalworking professions (of which we currently had three.) We are also moving to a world where more equipment is shared between classes in some cases.

    Let me start by saying, I am not "Chicken Little" about the changes, and am anxiously awaiting the preview server so I can see the changes. I am max level in all crafts including BI and all the event crafts, I am also Masterwork 5 in all. So far the new system sounds good, especially since I should still be master of all.

    So I have one questions which come to mind rather quickly and am a little panicky about it because of the significant investment of "Real World Currency".

    Black Ice Gauntlets were only available from the Zen Store for quite a while and very difficult to get as it was paying for a box and a random chance to get. You had to but a special box and usually got green one, if you got one at all. From that point you had to merge 4 green to 1 blue and then 4 blue to 1 purple. This was a very significant investment of ZEN which I spent a ton of time and money trying to get them. It took me forever just to get 2 of them only to see the support go away and now the whole craft is gone.

    Is there going to be any special consideration to the fact that while other crafts tools were relatively easy to get, Black ice was next to impossible and cost real life money? For example ZEN reimbursement, even if not at actual cost?

    Getting in game currency does not seem like a fair trade.

    I'm happy to hear you're looking forward to the changes. Although we're making changes designed to make engaging in professions less tedious and easier to get into, we're ultimately focused on providing a great experience for those who wish to deeply engage in the professions system.

    We actually don't necessarily want every player in the game engaged in professions, because then there's no market for anything anyone creates. In regards to your specific concerns about black ice tools. We'll be basing the trade in values largely on the current market value.

    We cannot base the trade in values based on the value of the item when it was first introduced. There are quite a few reasons for this, but ultimately, the value of most items decreases over time. Artificially inflating the value later for a few items would be opening a can of worms and soon everyone would want to receive the original value of their item. Additionally, it would create a huge speculation market leading up to the changes. There will be some of that unavoidably, but we'd like you to mostly be able to feel confident your investments will transfer over based on the current market.
  • gromovnipljesak#8234 gromovnipljesak Member Posts: 1,053 Arc User
    asterdahl said:


    Please allow (some) weapon/armor transmutes to be craftable.

    You’ve got a huge stock of designs from obsolete gear, many of which are pretty good, and your artists seem good at coming up with new things as well.

    Perhaps, instead of dropping transmutes at (rarely occurring) CTAs or Simril, drop “designs” that can unlock recipes to craft the transmutes.

    Taking this a step further, in the spirit of the mostly-defunct Foundry, you could allow the community to make and contribute designs.

    Every new recipe will have a unique appearance composed of a variety of classic visuals retooled and available in unique colors, so please take a look. We'll continue to introduce new styles in future updates.

    asterdahl said:



    RE: RNG: Because we are introducing the concept of a success rate when crafting an item, you could say that more randomness is indeed being introduced. However, for leveling recipes, as long as you keep your artisans equipped with new tools (which are now obtained via in game means by simply crafting the tools or purchasing them from other players off the auction house) you should have a high success rate when crafting items.

    Maybe I'm reading more into this than I should but your statement, "keep your artisans equipped with new tools," has me a bit concerned. Does this mean that tools will degrade as you use them? Or worse be one time use? Which I can't see.
    Tools do not have durability.

    How new system will connect with gameplay? I'd love to upgrade and do new professions because crafting was always my favourite part of any MMO. But I wonder if it will be connected in some way to content? Like "you need x asset that drop only in Tong" or similiar. It would be nice to have reason to run some content - even older one like msva.

    Will new system use RP in any way? RP value decreased over time so I wonder if it will be usable in any way (like upgrade your tool

    Any good AD sinks other than rushing tasks? For example every craft cost with set AD cost

    How big role guild marks will play in new system? Masterwork and normal. Now it's nicely connected with mw so people had reasons to donate to coffer.

    Though the new leveling recipes don't directly tie into gameplay in terms of materials obtained from combat, masterwork recipes will remain unchanged in this regard, and we will continue to include similar items in the future, such as those found on dungeon bosses.

    In regards to refinement, gems will now be used in jewelcrafting recipes. For instance, black pearls and aquamarines can be used to make jewelry, with higher value refinement gems being used for higher level recipes.

    asterdahl said:

    mailsmithing and platesmithing are being merged under a single umbrella "Armorsmithing."

    It sounds like Leatherworking and Tailoring should also be merged?
    Leatherworking and tailoring use entirely different techniques and materials. Merging mailsmithing and platesmithing into armorsmithing was not specifically with the intent of merging equipment for more classes under a single umbrella, but to reduce the massive redundancy in metalworking professions (of which we currently had three.) We are also moving to a world where more equipment is shared between classes in some cases.

    Let me start by saying, I am not "Chicken Little" about the changes, and am anxiously awaiting the preview server so I can see the changes. I am max level in all crafts including BI and all the event crafts, I am also Masterwork 5 in all. So far the new system sounds good, especially since I should still be master of all.

    So I have one questions which come to mind rather quickly and am a little panicky about it because of the significant investment of "Real World Currency".

    Black Ice Gauntlets were only available from the Zen Store for quite a while and very difficult to get as it was paying for a box and a random chance to get. You had to but a special box and usually got green one, if you got one at all. From that point you had to merge 4 green to 1 blue and then 4 blue to 1 purple. This was a very significant investment of ZEN which I spent a ton of time and money trying to get them. It took me forever just to get 2 of them only to see the support go away and now the whole craft is gone.

    Is there going to be any special consideration to the fact that while other crafts tools were relatively easy to get, Black ice was next to impossible and cost real life money? For example ZEN reimbursement, even if not at actual cost?

    Getting in game currency does not seem like a fair trade.

    I'm happy to hear you're looking forward to the changes. Although we're making changes designed to make engaging in professions less tedious and easier to get into, we're ultimately focused on providing a great experience for those who wish to deeply engage in the professions system.

    We actually don't necessarily want every player in the game engaged in professions, because then there's no market for anything anyone creates. In regards to your specific concerns about black ice tools. We'll be basing the trade in values largely on the current market value.

    We cannot base the trade in values based on the value of the item when it was first introduced. There are quite a few reasons for this, but ultimately, the value of most items decreases over time. Artificially inflating the value later for a few items would be opening a can of worms and soon everyone would want to receive the original value of their item. Additionally, it would create a huge speculation market leading up to the changes. There will be some of that unavoidably, but we'd like you to mostly be able to feel confident your investments will transfer over based on the current market.
    So from what I understood the hard part of getting masterwork will not be the resources due to RNG chance of failure, but getting resources in the 1st place, and getting the assets?

    The different tier of gear - will the difference be something like between Shadowstalker +4 and +5?

    I think it would also be better that if we salvage this gear (or any epic gear) we get seals of the brave instead of RP.
  • asterdahlasterdahl Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 1,258 Cryptic Developer
    adinosii said:

    Thanks for the answers to the earlier questions - however, some of those answers created a few more questions. Now, all the profession changes are of considerable interest to me. I have maximum rank of Masterwork in all professions on my main character, and 7 other alts with rank 25 in several professions each. It has annoyed me how useless most of the profession tasks are - I really hope that is about to change.

    asterdahl said:

    Masterwork will continue to be a part of professions. Though almost all of the standard recipes will be completely gutted and replaced, those recipes earned via recipe books, such as masterwork and Chultan recipes will remain largely similar to what they are now.

    That brings up another question...if the "standard recipes will be "gutted and replaced", how will you now obtain the initial masterwork recipes, as they currently require making some of the "standard" items?
    Those items required by masterwork professions quests will be adjusted. If you happen to be in the middle of that step on any of your professions, we advise you complete it before the changes, or wait for the changes to begin, as the items will change.
    adinosii said:


    asterdahl said:

    ...you will also now be able to create high-quality versions of those items with a higher item level and superior stats.

    That's great, but what about "future-proofing". What I mean is that previously, when "superior" items were able to be created, those items would typically become obsolete within a few months when the next module would be released. I am really hoping that all the changes being made will result in a system that remains viable a bit longer.
    There has been some discussion on various outlets about a desire for a more dynamic professions system that remain indefinitely useful without the addition of new recipes. Because in Neverwinter we continue to introduce stronger equipment and stronger challenges periodically, there is really no way to create a system that dynamically scales with newly introduced content in a sensible manner. Rules would still have to be defined for the output and input and new outputs and inputs would have to be made available.

    That said, creating recipes has been made significantly less cumbersome for our designers as part of the updates. This isn't necessarily something you can feel with the update as a player. However, with those changes as well as the ability to create more difficult recipes without needing to leverage awkward systems like a forcibly required tool or reward tiers that act as failures, we should be able to introduce new recipes more easily in the future.

    There will still be periods where professions are more or less useful depending on the other equipment available and you should never expect the value on any item to remain steady indefinitely.
    adinosii said:


    asterdahl said:

    You will now be able to convert those materials into most of the materials used in new non-masterwork recipes.

    Does this mean the number of different materials will drop significantly? I am asking because there are just too many different materials right now...I have completely maxed out the available storage space, and have to keep a number of items in the mail or on alts.
    We have received a lot of feedback about material space, so this is something we'll be looking at.
    adinosii said:


    asterdahl said:

    ... will cost a bit more morale ...

    Riight...about this "morale" thing. Is that essentially a new currency, so to speak, where we get a certain amout at the start of every day, and as we can replenish it via AD, it will be a bit of an AD sink as well. Correct?
    Morale functions as an intermediary currency for rushing, but you will get a certain amount for free every day. So in terms of an AD sink, if you're only rushing a few recipes every day, you should be spending less AD. That said, if you want to rush more, you can still spend AD. In addition, some artisans and supplements have a skill which has a chance to negate the duration of an order or the morale cost of a craft (rushed task.)
    adinosii said:


    asterdahl said:

    However, whatever gathering tasks you have assigned can be set to continue indefinitely so long as your delivery box does not fill up completely.

    Yay! (I think). However, I have a feeling that this is not the whole story, because this sounds like an invitation for people to set up alt armies for "gathering", and just check in on them every now and then to empty those "delivery boxes". I doubt that's the plan, so, what's the catch ?
    The "catch" as it were, is that no task can be assigned with absolutely zero investment. Previously, a task to gather raw materials would require absolutely nothing. As all tasks now require at least some copper, silver or gold, you will need to at least provide that base investment to all of your alts. If you can do that, and wish to have them all run tasks, nothing will stop you from doing so.
    adinosii said:


    asterdahl said:

    ...assign adventurers to gather raw materials and raw refinement stones,,,

    What's this about "raw refinement stones"? Don't tell us that we are going to have to gather something like "raw" peridots", then refine those into peridots to convert to RPs.
    That is the case, however, changing a raw stone into a refineable stone does not in and of itself require any refinement points. Jewelcrafters can now polish raw stones into usable refinement stones. Ultimately this gives jewelcrafters an additional purpose, and as gems are now used in some professions tasks, but are still stored in the normal inventory, you can store the raw gems in your professions materials bag and convert them as needed.

    The conversion cost won't be extreme, and if you're not interested in jewelcrafting, you can still sell the raw gems on the auction house. I understand that this will be a point of contention, but please check out the recipes and provide feedback.


  • empalasempalas Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 804 Arc User
    I didn't ask about "raw refinement" because my spidey sense knew the answer. Will have to see if its worth speed leveling jewelcrafting
  • asterdahlasterdahl Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 1,258 Cryptic Developer
    edited September 2018

    Some direct questions:

    I will be able to craft legendary tools? Or only i can drop them? If i have an adamantine mortar, whitn new system can i change to crucible? If yes, How many times?

    Thank you in advance.

    Andrea

    There won't be a legendary crucible anymore. But you will be able to trade any legendary tool for an equivalent high level tool for the single profession of your choice. You will be able to do this for every legendary tool you posses.

    Question about Masterwork. If we are only partly through the progression (in my case, I've unlocked Recipes III but have not done IV) does it make sense for me to try to advance any now? Are there any cases (such as the way mailsmithing and platesmithing are being combined) where it makes sense for us to not advance a masterwork profession before the new system kicks in?

    Aside from the first quest which requires materials and items that are pre-masterwork, nothing will change.

    Question about Leadership conversion: Will the current boxes from Leadership undergo any conversion? If we open one when the new mod is live, will the contents (or even the boxes themselves) get converted in some way?

    Nothing that you can open now will be converted differently whether you open it now or after the update. So if opening it now gave an item and that item can be exchanged after the update, opening it after the update will give the same item still able to be exchanged.

    Also, the exchange will be available indefinitely, so there's no rush. Your retainer in your workshop will handle exchanges.


    With assets changing, what will happen to assets on the auction house and in profession packs when the switch happens? Will it change quest rewards that give them? Will they automatically change to the currency? If so, will this currency transferrable between characters on the same account or sellable on the Auction House?

    No items will change from one item to another item, so nothing will happen to your item on the auction house. Some items will simple no longer have a purpose of their own, and will be exchangeable at your retainer for new goods. Or in a few cases the item my become a choice pack which you can open to pick another, new item.

    You will continue to be able to sell those items on the auction house if you don't care to exchange them yourself.
    meirami said:

    Question: Will armor reinforcements still be craftable (preferably without masterwork)?

    Yes.
    jganth said:

    Let's be clear here - this 'something from nothing' business mentioned previously is a red flag; we put our TIME into these profession tasks.

    When I say something from nothing, it is slightly hyperbolic, opening the professions window and clicking a few tasks is technically some amount of time. However, it's an incredibly small amount of time. If you have an army of alts, it may be a notable amount of time, however, it is exceptionally tedious and the tasks were never designed to be run on that scale, or balanced for that to not hurt the economy.

    Now, there's absolutely no excusing that, the original team that built those tasks should have realized the problem before releasing them, and we should have taken the time to address those issues sooner.

    I would like to clarify though, that we don't view a time investment as nothing. If you're out in the world farming drops, that's not creating something out of nothing. In this case, the copper, silver or gold cost provides the time investment of more than a few seconds of clicking a task and collecting the results every day. It's not necessary that you yourself are the one farming the copper, silver or gold however.

    We have provided a new item, a gold trade bar, which can be sold for gold to any vendor at the same rate as platinum bowls. So if you wish to, you can easily spend AD to buy gold from other players, craft recipes and earn AD from those sales, and reinvest a percentage into more gold to fuel your tasks. This is generally how crafting would work in an ideal situation.
    mirraidar said:

    Okay so someone at level 70 with level 25 of whatever profession, that one turns into level 70, I get that but what about lets say someone who are at level 13 mailsmithing? What level will that convert into?

    Here's a chart of how the levels will convert over. Some minor changes may occur, but this should largely be accurate once the update goes live.

    Old→→→New
    1→→→→→4
    2→→→→→6
    3→→→→→9
    4→→→→→12
    5→→→→→15
    6→→→→→18
    7→→→→→20
    8→→→→→23
    9→→→→→26
    10→→→→→29
    11→→→→→32
    12→→→→→34
    13→→→→→37
    14→→→→→40
    15→→→→→43
    16→→→→→46
    17→→→→→48
    18→→→→→51
    19→→→→→54
    20→→→→→57
    21→→→→→60
    22→→→→→62
    23→→→→→65
    24→→→→→68
    25→→→→→70
    huskerklg said:

    The more questions I read, the more it makes it look like this was just a way to kill the Leadership AD income players had, and add in a new AD cost to keep the new morale currency full to craft.

    The AD cost for refilling morale should not be notably different from the current rush cost of tasks. You will now simply be able to rush a number of tasks each day for free.

    You mentioned that gathering tasks will now cost gold so we can't make materials for nothing, but refining raw materials into useable ones already costs gold in the form of having to buy charcoal/solvent/brimstone etc. So are we getting a doubled-up gold sink for crafting or is the new system designed in a way that the overall gold cost is not increasing, just being frontloaded?

    All tasks will require gold (not just gathering tasks) but there will no longer be a wide array of items which must be purchased for gold. The gold sink will definitely be larger on professions than it is currently. However, the main goal is to prevent the prices on certain items from maintaining absolutely no value due to requiring no investment.
  • xvader99xvader99 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 13 Arc User
    Just answer to me short and clearly, How it better for us?
  • asterdahlasterdahl Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 1,258 Cryptic Developer

    I have a few concerns, mostly regarding Leadership, one on JewelCrafting.

    JewelCraft: Currently, some of the better items you can make from base (not mastercraft) Jewelcraft are character bound. So if I want the nifty neck, belt or ring piece - each of my characters has to level Jewelcraft to 25 in order to craft a couple pieces. Can items like this that you don't want 'on the open market' at least be made account bound? 1 Jewelcrafter per account is not unreasonable... every single player levelling Jewelcraft to 25 is.

    Leadership: Many concerns. First, atmosphere. This is a fantasy game. We all play heroic fantasy adventurers. The kind of folks who, when they have a need of gems, bash in a dungeon door, whack some dragon over the head, and teach him the value of sharing. I spent a *lot* of time training up a group of mini-adventurers, knights and armsmen who guard caravans, protect temples, ensure the safety of nobles families, and occasionally teach a dragon or bandit the meaning of good manners. I am unlikely to be impressed by turning my band of slavering mercenaries... er, 'noble knights', into a pack of herdsmen, farmers, and grubbers in the dirt.

    RE: Jewelcrafting: We have no plans for any current or future profession items to be bind on pickup. This runs counter to the entire goal of the professions, so we won't be having items like this any longer.

    RE: Leadership: Your adventurers will still be gathering things like drake horns or aberrant hides, so they won't just be catching bugs or harvesting herbs. (Though you will be able to send them to do that as well.) Additionally, as each of your adventurers will be an individual, you'll be able to hire eccentric characters like a retired knight or a grounded pirate who's saving for a new boat after his was lost in a mutiny.

    Question: how will the proffesions (especially the ones for armor and weapons) level up? As it is now, in the leveling process you can easily overlevel the zone in which you are questing. You get greens and blues, identify them and if they are better than what you have, you just got a new shiny piece of equipment! So, as of now on live there is not much of a reason to level up these proffesions (unless MW).

    Continuing with this thought, if the proffesions are supposed to give you the equipment (or most of it) now, maybe you could get rid of the greens and blues and just give RP instead. It's pretty lame to fight your way through FBI's hill and have a giant drop a green armor U_U

    Another question: if leadership/gathering will give RP, will it be in th form of pure RP (like the Bonus RP event) or some other form that allows to be put in AH, or at least share with your other characters?

    Because you will now have a number of free rushes per day, and because each task can have a different morale cost, you'll be able to rush more low level tasks, you should have a much easier time keeping professions lockstep with your character's levels. We'll continue to make XP adjustments even after the feature goes live to ensure that for the most part it's possible to keep professions leveled alongside your character. (That said, it will ultimately be dependent on how long your sessions are. If you level your character to the maximum level in a single sitting, you won't be able to keep your professions equal without replenishing morale with AD.)
    mintmark said:

    agilesto said:

    My complain about Black Ice shaping is about the items you can create with the empowering system, these contribue to the collection. And the fact that you won't be able to craft them on Mod 15 remove some legacy gear, and I need to rush myself to finish this part of the collection before the Mod hits. And I don't like to be rushed :(

    I understand this comment because I was doing black ice to fill gaps in my collection pages too... but it was always low priority because it does take lots of resources and the equipment is obsolete. There's even a bug where you can salvage some of the gear you make and don't get any AD at all :)

    But the collection points don't earn us anything and maybe those items will just disappear like some previous black ice gear... at least the gaps in the collection will be gone!

    As previously mentioned, black ice equipment will still be obtainable, it simply won't be crafted.
  • rifter1969rifter1969 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 516 Arc User
    @asterdahl I'm sorry to bring this up again, and my apologies to the community as well...
    But, can you give us a little more detail about how the Forgehammer of Gond is going to work in the new system?

    I never was lucky enough to acquire one through "free" means, and have been saving AD for a few months now to purchase one off the AH. So this is a HUGE investment on my part.
    I hope you can understand my concern about this, I don't want to spend 4million+ ADs on something that going to be more or less useless.
  • gildriadorgildriador Member Posts: 231 Arc User
    asterdahl said:



    meirami said:

    Question: Will armor reinforcements still be craftable (preferably without masterwork)?

    Yes.
    I would like to know if the components required to create Armor Kits: the Unified Elements and Aggregate Elements introduced with Elemental Evil module will continue to be in the Alchemy profession.

    Thank you for your work, it's been a long time I'm waiting for a rework of the profession system.
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  • spelldazerspelldazer Member Posts: 315 Arc User
    edited September 2018
    Would it be correct to say that ingredients for crafting black ice overloads will no longer drop or be needed and instead of making these overloads ourselves we will only have the option to buy these overloads from a vendor/crafter?

    Will drop rates for platinum plates be adjusted?

    Will we still be able to craft items to donate for guild marks like crates of diamonds?

    Am I infering correctly that some items will now require rarer and more expensive gems like rubies and diamonds?

    Also, how will you account for different platform's economies valuing items differently? Will xbox inherit the inflated costs of pc?
  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    @asterdahl Thanks for answering every question so far.

    How rare are going to be the legendary tools in this new mod? Very scarce as they are in the live server right now or are they going to be more common? Are we going to be able to craft them or are they going to be only rare drops from lockboxes?

    Also, considering that it is an overhaul of the whole crafting system, is there anything new but different compared to that we are already able to craft right now? I mean, we know that we are going to be able to craft armor pieces, weapons, reinforcement kits, jewelry, etc, but is there anything completely unexpected maybe companion items i.e?

    Finally, a quick one regarding to black ice: what will happen specifically to the epic pick that we bought from the zen market? Are we going to be able to trade it for another zen market tool that will come with the new module?
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  • arod7932arod7932 Member Posts: 93 Arc User
    Will Reinforcement kits still cost 100k AD?
  • c3rb3r3c3rb3r3 Member Posts: 277 Arc User

    Yes, the overload enchantments can be used but even those are pretty outdated.

    would love seeing those be permanent and not have this stupid 8:00:00 time until destruction tho

    may some dev have a talk about that ?
  • sundance777sundance777 Member Posts: 1,097 Arc User
    Don't take my black ice forge lol! So far am I liking the sound of this, the current professions are boring, this sounds more interesting for sure, and yes, I get it, if it costs too much gold that could be a pain point, but based on what I am reading, I am fairly comfortable that it will be fine.

    I am interested in the conversion rate of purple assets, such as people and tools, I don't have a PC account so if someone that gets to check that out, please post some thoughts or experiences on the value of conversion, it would be appreciated.
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  • rotgutwilly#1725 rotgutwilly Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited September 2018
    I'm still a bit confused regarding Leadership. If Leadership is being changed to Gathering, but Gathering will be leveled according to your highest level profession (and let us assume that one has an additional profession to Leadership already leveled to 25), what then happens to the time invested in Leadership? Is that just lost?

    Also, will we be able log our characters out in the Professions Shop for faster load times?
    asterdahl said:

    Your leadership level will convert directly to an equivalent level in gathering. Level 25 leadership for instance, will be converted to level 70 gathering (the maximum level.)

    asterdahl said:


    Because gathering is now an important part of all professions, and anyone would naturally have leveled gathering alongside their crafting profession in the new system, we will be granting everyone a gathering level equal to their maximum profession level.

  • gildriadorgildriador Member Posts: 231 Arc User
    I forgot one thing :
    water, earth, fire and air elemental required for aggregate elemental was a drop from a leadership coffer, would it be possible to get those component from profession?
    “He raised his staff. There was a roll of thunder. The sunlight was blotted out from the eastern windows; the whole hall became suddenly dark as night. The fire faded to sullen embers. Only Gandalf could be seen, standing white and tall before the blackened hearth.”
    ― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Two Towers
  • wylonuswylonus Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,376 Arc User
    too many vague answers and raised more questions that i see.

    just want to made basic questions that easy to be answer by devs/programmers, i am sure some mod may want to stay out from answering half-fill/half-empty posted replies.
    let me make outlines.
    My Apologies for terrible grammer, since i need to let you all to know, i am deaf, it is very hard to write, i did my best.

    1. common raw resources and the material tab.

    i know there is overflooded materials on Auction house, the more get on, the more zone laggy it get, i know there is some folks need some quick materials for some crafting tasks, see the problem with Mastercraft 1st stage tier task, need more than 250 units of common items. some dont have time for a week or more than 10 days of gatherings to reach 250 units.
    resource tab getting full, i tried to keep "fuels" and raws in seperate section in same tab.
    even those summer/winter festival materials can create mess, some items that i want to move to other slot spots but i cant, it been coded and not moveable to get organize into specific cluster groups.
    Black Ice, i dont want to see them go away, just need resource tab updated to almost like "champaign tab or event tab".
    keep Sharandar, Dread Ring, River District, and both Chult/Onu and add Barovia since these only have some unique designed materials in same tab, except for Icewind which it has most mateirals for craftings in new tab.

    2. Black Ice

    Speaking of Black Ices, some ice were needed for quests or upfitting the upkeep the gears, make Black Ice enchantments and overflow enchants, and we need them for Achievements for Icewind Dale and SKT. i would suggest merge Black Ice and Voninblood to same tab menu, and other black ice shards need to be "Universal" shards, designed to be less clutter, keep those old purple materials as original, base on what class players played and needed.
    it been in the game for 3 years, you guys made us work on gathering the ice and quest that we do, and you decided to rip it away? what? you are making players to abandoning Icewind Dale adventures? sound like it need complete overhaul on champaign without black ice, what about pets and artifact that do black ices?

    3. Resource Nodes and Overland Chests

    these need to go away if you are redoing professions, and some players has stacks of kits and seem waiting for improve gatherings, due to preventing "node bot farm" exploits, and 2x "hourly events" got pulled away and seriously nerf to pure garbages, just like that Queen Lich Valatina saying "You are Pitiful".

    just my opinion, these nodes and chests belong in dungeons, Give players reasons to go back and run again for better chances for high grade materials. i dont like them on Overland zones.

    Remember, redo some quest drops from "Challeneges of the Gods", i prefer original tokens, i dont like auto active quest that you need to gather 3-4 nodes in few minutes where some place are cleared or too far away before time expired.

    4. Challenges of the Gods.
    i beleive that event need a complete overhaul, other challenges that need you to be at 50% or less health, that seem almost impossible due to high skill recovery, and the boons we have. made those challenges worthless, and see one above regarding overland nodes, some drops start automatically if you pick up, i prefer collect as tokens, in original form and if you dont like it, discard them since it bound to players.

    5. Professions.

    We all know it was horrible gutted too hard and nerf nearly to death, and we all been waited for months since mod 6. last time it was updated with vouchers and refine tasks for leadership.
    'elite' rare craft timer is horrible, this was posted in my other topic that make me tracking hours after hours waiting for that recipe open up in "rare section", i hated it the most. waiting for to show up, that RNG is Pure evil, isnt nice to some players, in some cases, it come easy for other players that didnt wait long, seem popped in their favors while others waited for days or even weeks.
    random RNG for specific task to show up has to go away for good, most players dont mind some crafting challenges to make something they want as "random", if it fails, then they can try again without another wait, or extend crafting time like few days or a week for final results.
    Speaking for "gold sink"???? i dont like it, it would bleed us dry, changing the enchants get too expensive, restocking the fuel supplies cost alot,

    6. Auction House.

    back to first that i mentioned, i have seen a single player selling over 20 pages on same resources, but think about it, there is several hundred players who may have +10 pages of resources on market, creating overflooded items and undercut war begins.
    if i want to sell refined iron and would expect no more than 5 stacks of iron instead of having 20 pages of my iron, i can see why devs were looking for resolution to prevent massive gathering bots.
    also, i think those "vendor junks" shouldnt be on any market, it was meant as to sell to vendors to built up your gold coins.
    some players still didnt know it was vendor baits and thinking it was for quest or something else.

    I can still sell 5 stacks of leathers and sell 5 stacks of raw gem units as long it is not +10 pages long or more

    It is time to clean out Auction House of unwanted baits and excessive materials. some players only need some specific gears or need for quest updates, or get awesome upgrades they need.
    Another problem with Auction, some folks cant afford when they see stacks of 99 of dragon eggs when they need to buy 1 dragon egg which was cheaper for them to buy as 1 unit instead of unwanted large stacks, often some get sold before they were able to buy and only to see merged or increased resell "mark-ups", and get frustrated.

    okay, that it, please dont flame me for english grammer, i hope someone who has time and repost for everyone to understand.

    to Devs, these are my 6 outlines i listed that has problems.
  • sandukutupusandukutupu Member Posts: 2,285 Arc User
    edited September 2018
    @asterdahl I for one welcome the changes to professions. I stopped doing professions years ago, it was stale, flat, and lifeless. I hope your plans will breathe new life into one aspect of the game I have been ignoring for so long. To be honest the only reason I did Leadership back in the day was to get the Captain title for my sea Captain, Dirk Anvil Slade who lost his ship and crew on that beach. Recently I helped a guild out with Jewel crafting but again dropped the profession as I had no need for it once they achieved the goal.

    Also humans think better than machines in a virtual 3D environment, it is probably just a psychological need for us. As a player I like games that offer even the most basic faux 3D world. While as a teen I grew up on Mario and Centipede at the local arcades in the 80s, artificial 3D games keep the mind entertained. I remember being at the laundromat playing Q-bert and Crystal Castles over the old Ms. Pac-Man sitting right next to them. Basically the same maze and avoid monster games, but the 3D graphics were so awesome! lol

    Hope to play your new and improved content on the Preview shard soon. :grin:
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  • morgulknifemorgulknife Member Posts: 26 Arc User
    Please go into detail about the Forge Hammer....
  • jganthjganth Member Posts: 89 Arc User
    Thank you Asterdahl for answering as much as you could; truly impressive!
  • vorphiedvorphied Member Posts: 1,870 Arc User
    edited September 2018
    On one hand I can appreciate the apparent "clean slate" (or scorched earth, I suppose, if you're pessimistic) approach, but I admit to being a teeny tiny bit salty at the idea of everyone with, say, 25 Alchemy getting 25 Leadership/Gathering as a freebie if they never invested the time to level it.

    I suppose it's also true that many of us have already been enjoying the benefit of high-ranking Leadership for some time now, so I'm not nearly as salty as I otherwise could be. It's just a little bit off-putting when other players refuse to level Leadership because they complain about the time it takes before it starts doing anything of use and are now poised to get it in its new incarnation as a free, maximum-level profession.

    Players who have been in the process of leveling Leadership and are now around lvl 20 after 3 or so months probably have the real grievance since they just nursed that profession for a number of weeks for no benefit in the end.
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  • edited September 2018
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