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OFFICIAL FEEDBACK THREAD: Professions Overhaul

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  • alphastreamalphastream Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 209 Arc User
    edited September 2018
    Question about Leadership conversion: Will the current boxes from Leadership undergo any conversion? If we open one when the new mod is live, will the contents (or even the boxes themselves) get converted in some way?
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  • grogthemagnifgrogthemagnif Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,651 Arc User
    adinosii said:

    Thanks for the answers to the earlier questions - however, some of those answers created a few more questions. Now, all the profession changes are of considerable interest to me. I have maximum rank of Masterwork in all professions on my main character, and 7 other alts with rank 25 in several professions each. It has annoyed me how useless most of the profession tasks are - I really hope that is about to change.

    asterdahl said:

    Masterwork will continue to be a part of professions. Though almost all of the standard recipes will be completely gutted and replaced, those recipes earned via recipe books, such as masterwork and Chultan recipes will remain largely similar to what they are now.

    That brings up another question...if the "standard recipes will be "gutted and replaced", how will you now obtain the initial masterwork recipes, as they currently require making some of the "standard" items?

    If the devs are smart, they will make 'chain sprays' where you start a project at level 1 or 2, advance a step at levels 5-6, 9-10, 13-14, 21-22 where you can branch off (the spray) to 3 different finished projects at level 24-25 (rare or Epic level) and or you could branch off to a single rare end product at levels 8, 12 and 16.

    asterdahl said:

    ...you will also now be able to create high-quality versions of those items with a higher item level and superior stats.

    That's great, but what about "future-proofing". What I mean is that previously, when "superior" items were able to be created, those items would typically become obsolete within a few months when the next module would be released. I am really hoping that all the changes being made will result in a system that remains viable a bit longer.
    asterdahl said:

    Your leadership level will convert directly to an equivalent level in gathering. Level 25 leadership for instance, will be converted to level 70 gathering (the maximum level.)

    Now, here is my concern. I think my use of leasdership is similar to that of many others. On my main character, I am constantly doing leadership tasks in 8 of 9 slots (the 9th is usually busy with some Masterwork task). This is solely to make boxes and crates, which I then open during 2xEnchant events, in order to obtain the RP I need to rank up enchants and other items. Will this "Gathering" profession allow me to "gather" a similar amount of RPs? I saw the reply about "you'll have to invest some gold, silver or copper" regarding RPs, so, is the idea basically to only allow people to make RP through gold? I'm confused.
    asterdahl said:

    You will now be able to convert those materials into most of the materials used in new non-masterwork recipes.

    Does this mean the number of different materials will drop significantly? I am asking because there are just too many different materials right now...I have completely maxed out the available storage space, and have to keep a number of items in the mail or on alts.
    asterdahl said:

    In regards to the Forgehammer and legendary tools, those will be exempt from the standard conversion process, and instead convert 1:1 into an equally valuable tool of your choice in the new system.

    I have a potential concern regarding this. The forgehammer can now be used in every profession. Are you saying I will have to convert it into a tool for only a single profession? Edit: I saw the "You'll still be able to use this tool for whatever profession you'd like."comment, so not worried about this.
    asterdahl said:

    ... will cost a bit more morale ...

    Riight...about this "morale" thing. Is that essentially a new currency, so to speak, where we get a certain amout at the start of every day, and as we can replenish it via AD, it will be a bit of an AD sink as well. Correct?
    asterdahl said:

    However, whatever gathering tasks you have assigned can be set to continue indefinitely so long as your delivery box does not fill up completely.

    Yay! (I think). However, I have a feeling that this is not the whole story, because this sounds like an invitation for people to set up alt armies for "gathering", and just check in on them every now and then to empty those "delivery boxes". I doubt that's the plan, so, what's the catch ?

    From time to time, is 'as often as you chaeck your cell phone, not once every 8-10 hours.

    asterdahl said:

    ...assign adventurers to gather raw materials and raw refinement stones,,,

    What's this about "raw refinement stones"? Don't tell us that we are going to have to gather something like "raw" peridots", then refine those into peridots to convert to RPs.
    asterdahl said:

    ... as long as you keep your artisans equipped with new tools...

    Keep them equipped? Does that mean the tools wear out and I have to continually replace them ?
    Will reinforcements and equipment jewels remain largely as they are today?

    Will we be able to craft transmutes?

    Will we be able to craft anything for companions?
  • grogthemagnifgrogthemagnif Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,651 Arc User
    As long as you are doing an overhaul of professions, look into how Guilds actually operated.

    The Guild Master Craftsmen and the Guild Officers set the prices annually, set wages annually, and kept prices stable.

    If a "lowballer Guild Member" decided to charge way less than the set standard, he could do so for a very short time 'fair time', harvest festival, Protector's Jubilee, etc. You could adjust your prices below the 80% of cost level, but again for only a few days.

    After that the Guild seized your goods as shoddy and and you received the shoddy goods rate of 1 AD/item. Treasure can be sold for what the market will bear (it's junk anyway). Also an 'Announcement of Shame' was posted that 'named names and was kept posted locally for 30 days and peer pressure would take care of the miscreant. If the merchant (player) insists hat he has the (Man-Made) Right to sell [and any of his [foolishly ]loyal friends will have the Spell of Shoddiness cast on their goods for 2 months. And a sign will be posted reading:

    I don't sell shoddy goods, All of my goods are guaranteed to last at least 2 years (unless really badly abused) and will replace them (or give you 3 times your money back) in that 2 years.

    The Devs can contact me about the affects of the (level 12) Spell of Shoddiness if needed.
  • edited September 2018
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  • auron#6793 auron Member Posts: 396 Arc User
    can you make the workshop accessable from the map? there is already alot of lag and freezing in the enclave and having it on the map would make it much easier to access
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  • muramune99#1335 muramune99 Member Posts: 39 Arc User
    This is very concerning to many players because the vagueness and the answers not strictly being full disclosure about the new system and changes. I have a few concerns myself, which may have already been asked, but not answered yet.

    1. I'm lv 3 mastercrafting, not the full 5. I haven't started any tasks in lv 3 yet, but I had accepted the quests to start. Where would I fall on this new system? Will mastercrafting change for its requirements? What about the tasks where you exchange items to gain recipes (like gold ingots for the lv 3 recipes in jewelcrafting)? Will they be changed?

    2. Asset currency was mentioned as a trade-in system. Does this mean players will be able to trade in tools to get better tools? Like trading in so many epic tools to eventually get legendary ones? Or will legendary tools be an exception cutoff for this? I know I would love a legendary tier tool, but they've always been way too expensive and I've been way too unlucky to get one. Will white professions have a conversion included?

    3. How will tasks currently in process function with the switch? Will they end as complete, end with failure, continue, or refund? Will the items change from this switch?

    4. With assets changing, what will happen to assets on the auction house and in profession packs when the switch happens? Will it change quest rewards that give them? Will they automatically change to the currency? If so, will this currency transferrable between characters on the same account or sellable on the Auction House?

    5. How will this work with labor in guilds? Will labor vouchers and labor crates be the only way to fulfill this now? Will guild requirements change for the amount of labor needed for upgrades and building?

    6. How will guild temporary structures that sell profession materials change, if at all?

    7. What is the cooldown for the tasks and how much morale is needed to do tasks versus recharge. Is the recharge an instant full or a gradual fill over time? Will there be an option to partially fill? Is there a formula for the partial fill or just a flat rate for the AD cost to fill?

    8. Will tools still be in the asset tab or will they be moved? If moved, how will it function with the Forgehammer of Gond artifact?

    9. Several items are made in the Black Ice profession tasks. What will happen to those, like the Black Ice Overload enchantments, that some players make and use on a regular basis? Will they be moved to another task? Will they be moved to a vendor?

    10. What will happen to profession nodes, skill kits, and scrolls? Will they still be used? Will they still be purchased? If changed, what will happen to these items in players' inventories?


    I'm hoping these get answered soon, but I know many other people have questions of their own and the developers are probably busy rolling this out and testing it on preview. I will patiently wait for a thorough response.
  • alphastreamalphastream Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 209 Arc User
    Question about Explorer's Scrolls: I have a bunch of these I bought recently. What will happen to the scrolls... will they still be used in the new system? (I assume MW ingredients coming from the nodes revealed by the scrolls are converted, but what about the scrolls themselves?)
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  • minotaur2857minotaur2857 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,141 Arc User
    edited September 2018

    What will happen to the Icewind Dale campaign?

    And will the Profession Vendor continue to exist as is? Even in VIP? I think many would prefer to have an universal seal vendor instead. :3

    Nope, my inventory fills up and I like to be able to sell stuff in an instance without leaving. Would need to do that too.

    A question asked by somebody in guild, the lab is in PE, does that mean we have to go there to craft ? since this is 10+ minutes and a crash for her most of the time.

  • rafaeldarafaelda Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 666 Arc User
    when this will be aviable for test in preview server ???

    cant say a thing before seing what is planned for real...
  • caldochaud#4880 caldochaud Member Posts: 213 Arc User
    Removing Black Ice crafting... That's unfortunate as I was looking forward to experimenting with Black Ice. Too bad you couldn't find a way to make Black Ice relevant to the game... even if it is only to give a temporary Black Ice buff to weapons and armor...

    Dang it! That's just a smelly old gnoll-butt! :angry:

    What about all of those folks who actually bought ZEN to purchase specific crafting packs like the Black Ice pack, will they receive a refund in the form of ZEN, or could it be possible to convert Black Ice assets to something of equal value?

    For example: Go to the Protector's Enclave and speak with the Professions NPC to trade in a Master Ice Wright for a Master of another profession... Essentially turn all existing Black Ice crafting assets into a currency.
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  • gromovnipljesak#8234 gromovnipljesak Member Posts: 1,053 Arc User
    rafaelda said:

    when this will be aviable for test in preview server ???

    cant say a thing before seing what is planned for real...

    When everything else comes - tomorrow probably.
  • meiramimeirami Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 423 Arc User
    Question: Will armor reinforcements still be craftable (preferably without masterwork)?
  • empalasempalas Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 802 Arc User

    Is there any consideration to having a web portal or mobile app to interact with the workshop? I know there used to be something and it was severely abused. But with the new system of being able to set artisans for repeating tasks we may not have the same problem. Maybe set it so you can only direct artisans, check status, etc., but not collect their items. Even a phone app with notifications of things that occur would be sweet.

    Oh you mean like maybe a.....Gateway....I'm laughing way too hard at this. Oh how I miss the Gateway.

    And no I'm not laughing at the OP...this is just the insane, maniacal kind that finds glee in utter madness
  • chrisb#7185 chrisb Member Posts: 12 Arc User
    Great to have communication in this format from the Devs. Please keep this up, it really makes a positive difference.

    While I am here, will the asset conversion currency be bound to a character or to the account or unbound?

    Keep up the good work
  • frozenfirevrfrozenfirevr Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,475 Community Moderator

    What will happen to the Icewind Dale campaign?

    And will the Profession Vendor continue to exist as is? Even in VIP? I think many would prefer to have an universal seal vendor instead. :3

    Nope, my inventory fills up and I like to be able to sell stuff in an instance without leaving. Would need to do that too.

    A question asked by somebody in guild, the lab is in PE, does that mean we have to go there to craft ? since this is 10+ minutes and a crash for her most of the time.

    Why shouldn't the seal vendor buy your stuff? :|
    FrozenFire
  • jganthjganth Member Posts: 89 Arc User
    Leadership has been so long overdue that any change at this point is better. Cryptic never reimplemented the AD gathering tasks after Gateway was sent packing, effectively punishing legitimate players twice. The current Leadership tasks, especially the Epic ones, make no sense/value as the AD components were simply removed, leaving gaps. This is evident in tasks that require more TIME and offer less rewards, and Leadership is the only profession that inhibits more than 3 of any task.
    I sympathize with many of the concerns but overhaul is the only remedy to the hot mess Leadership is.

    Let's be clear here - this 'something from nothing' business mentioned previously is a red flag; we put our TIME into these profession tasks. That's OUR currency we provide, one that does not get even so much as a mention. It takes days/weeks/months of OUR TIME to generate and manage the rewards from these tasks.
    Try not to loose sight of that; during your overhauls; build bridges and break barriers and all that pro-positive stuff, eh?
  • jganthjganth Member Posts: 89 Arc User
    A suggestion would be to provide a chart or diagram that demonstrates the changes and some common scenarios of what a profession as is/to be (based of course on your metrics of what the common % tasks are) - this will clarify your changes to many who might interpret text in different contexts.

    Perhaps one of the staff e.g. the one hired to make the Chult Posters (??) is available for some diagrams for these upcoming changes?

    Another suggestion would be to use a bug tracking tool such as GitHub or Jira for submitting; I assume once promoted to production we the player are doing the QA? Can't wait...
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  • mirraidarmirraidar Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 8 Arc User
    Okay so someone at level 70 with level 25 of whatever profession, that one turns into level 70, I get that but what about lets say someone who are at level 13 mailsmithing? What level will that convert into?
  • frozenfirevrfrozenfirevr Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,475 Community Moderator
    mirraidar said:

    Okay so someone at level 70 with level 25 of whatever profession, that one turns into level 70, I get that but what about lets say someone who are at level 13 mailsmithing? What level will that convert into?

    It's unlikely they'll give you an entire list, atleast for now. You're expected to have a proportional conversion.
    FrozenFire
  • huskerklghuskerklg Member Posts: 12 Arc User
    The more questions I read, the more it makes it look like this was just a way to kill the Leadership AD income players had, and add in a new AD cost to keep the new morale currency full to craft.
  • rainer#8575 rainer Member Posts: 280 Arc User
    mirraidar said:

    Okay so someone at level 70 with level 25 of whatever profession, that one turns into level 70, I get that but what about lets say someone who are at level 13 mailsmithing? What level will that convert into?

    your level / 25 * 70 = ~ new level I suppose - if it is linear

    So approximately 13/25*70 = 36
  • dominious12dominious12 Member Posts: 92 Arc User
    You mentioned that gathering tasks will now cost gold so we can't make materials for nothing, but refining raw materials into useable ones already costs gold in the form of having to buy charcoal/solvent/brimstone etc. So are we getting a doubled-up gold sink for crafting or is the new system designed in a way that the overall gold cost is not increasing, just being frontloaded?
  • tchefi#6735 tchefi Member Posts: 417 Arc User
    asterdahl said:

    Across the board, professions—including gathering—will now be more about investing an initial cost and adding value to it, as opposed to creating something out of nothing. We also aim to severely reduce the tedium of engaging in the system, no longer requiring you to open the window multiple times a session to reassign artisans. In the end, you'll still be able to generate refinement through professions, but you'll have to invest some gold, silver or copper to pay the commission cost for your adventurer to complete the task. Some artisans will have lower commission costs or higher gathering rates, so you'll be able to choose adventurers and artisans based on your goals.

    2 Questions
    As we will need to invest some gold, silver or copper for the gathering tasks :
    - is the others jobs/artisans, for exemple the armorsmith, will need to be paid with gold/silver/copper too ?
    - Will the selling price (gold/silver/copper) to a PNJ of the "endline final product" be at least equal to what you had invested to create it ? I WON'T pay people more than what i can earn by selling what they are producing. If producing an armor costs me 3po of gathering, 5po of crafting, i expect to be able to sell the final product for more than 8po...
  • tribbulatertribbulater Member Posts: 194 Arc User
    edited September 2018
    I have a few concerns, mostly regarding Leadership, one on JewelCrafting.

    JewelCraft: Currently, some of the better items you can make from base (not mastercraft) Jewelcraft are character bound. So if I want the nifty neck, belt or ring piece - each of my characters has to level Jewelcraft to 25 in order to craft a couple pieces. Can items like this that you don't want 'on the open market' at least be made account bound? 1 Jewelcrafter per account is not unreasonable... every single player levelling Jewelcraft to 25 is.

    Leadership: Many concerns. First, atmosphere. This is a fantasy game. We all play heroic fantasy adventurers. The kind of folks who, when they have a need of gems, bash in a dungeon door, whack some dragon over the head, and teach him the value of sharing. I spent a *lot* of time training up a group of mini-adventurers, knights and armsmen who guard caravans, protect temples, ensure the safety of nobles families, and occasionally teach a dragon or bandit the meaning of good manners. I am unlikely to be impressed by turning my band of slavering mercenaries... er, 'noble knights', into a pack of herdsmen, farmers, and grubbers in the dirt.

    Second, convenience. Currently I can log in morning and night, and send my leaders on 9 separate missions. By using rare Adventurers I can even run 2 sets of 12-hour missions a day (without requiring perfect log-in timing). Since we will now have 'far fewer craftsmen', how is my one/few Leader craftsman going to manage running 18, 12/8/4 hour events per day?

    More convenience: There is a conversion process from current assets to new. I will check this on Preview, but concern is - is this process going to be something that occurs out of our control, during a patch (convenient, but zero control), or will we be triggering the conversion process ourselves after the system drops? (Lots of clicking and time = inconvenient, but at least we can control what goes where and who gets how many points)

    Advance Notice: Will you be telling us in advance that "Crafting patch is dropping next Thursday", or is this going to happen on some random Tuesday morning patch that isn't even scheduled. I think most of us have put enough time and effort into our professions that we deserve as much info on the details and timing as possible.

    Thanks for reading.
    Post edited by tribbulater on
  • mintmarkmintmark Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 477 Arc User



    Second, convenience. Currently I can log in morning and night, and send my leaders on 9 separate missions. By using rare Adventurers I can even run 2 sets of 12-hour missions a day (without requiring perfect log-in timing). Since we will now have 'far fewer craftsmen', how is my one/few Leader craftsman going to manage running 18, 12/8/4 hour events per day?

    This is a good point. If you want to reduce tedium then being able to queue up tasks in a way that fits our schedules would be good.

    I have a similar question... will there still be progressions of tasks where we make an item, then have to use it to make a +1 item, +2 item, +4 item and elemental item (for example)? Will we be able to automate that process?

    Thanks.
  • emuriannemuriann Member Posts: 14 Arc User
    I am sorry that I am to lazy to read all 5 pages if this has been mentioned.

    I am a mastercrafter myself, have all recipes up to 5 aside 2. Have 5 characters with gond hammers. One of them is MW 4+, others are all MW 3 crafters.

    The main thing I would like to see is that you guys make some of the old ingredients legit again that drop in the tier 3 dungeons. Think manticore mane / hide, fartouched residuum. The prices of these ingredients have dropped to insane low points. In the past people used to be far more willing to run those dungeons as there was an item dropping in it that would fetch them a 200-500k AD item with some luck. With the lack of those components needed for MW 4 and 5 the prices crashed, ppl no longer are as interested to run said dungeons.

    Thus my plea is to insert those ingredients once again in future recipes. This would give people a reason to vary with their endgame content rather then running solely CotDG for UES. (tong is ok but takes 2x as long, and most of the ppl I meet are avoiding CR like the plague once they obtained the piece they wanted, the dungeon just costs to much in scrolls vs the loot you get in the end, im luckily a OP protector player so I only use 0-3 scrolls a run but it feels bad seeing my team mates die constantly in the final fight and needing to pop 10+ scrolls just to finish the run for. . a shard of prominence 20k AD?.)
  • ladypeanut66ladypeanut66 Member Posts: 78 Arc User
    edited September 2018
    Question: how will the proffesions (especially the ones for armor and weapons) level up? As it is now, in the leveling process you can easily overlevel the zone in which you are questing. You get greens and blues, identify them and if they are better than what you have, you just got a new shiny piece of equipment! So, as of now on live there is not much of a reason to level up these proffesions (unless MW).

    Continuing with this thought, if the proffesions are supposed to give you the equipment (or most of it) now, maybe you could get rid of the greens and blues and just give RP instead. It's pretty lame to fight your way through FBI's hill and have a giant drop a green armor U_U

    Another question: if leadership/gathering will give RP, will it be in th form of pure RP (like the Bonus RP event) or some other form that allows to be put in AH, or at least share with your other characters?
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