biggest question i have based off the tokens or ad fee to reroll....... does useing a token or payin the ad fee to reroll eliminate the options that were availble that you are rerolling as to prevent those options from popin up again as to not wasre the ad on the reroll or the token jus to get the same rewards again. in other words if u get say a +1 ring of rising defense wen u open chest n pay or use a token to reroll... does that eliminate the +1 ring of rising defense from the roll or any of the other 3 rolls still abailble on that chest???
No, it is a complete reroll of the loot and the results are random. These are not tokens of increasing dungeon loot, they are simply to reroll the loot as if you just opened the chest again.
It is fun and exciting to receive a large amount of rewards for content.
This precisely is the problem with dungeon chests in Neverwinter. I don't even remember the last time I was excited about opening a chest in Neverwinter. 99.9% of the chest rewards are aweful and when you finally get something interesting you only really feel upset that it took so many tries before it happened.
A handful of reroll tokens won't make any difference when you would need a hundred tries or more to guarantee a good reward.
checkmatein3Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 525Arc User
I cannot comment on the proposed system, because it is unknown at this point 1) how much grind under the new system vs the old salvage system with RAD will it take to get to the max 100k AD per day, 2) will RNG for wanted items change (lessen) because dungeon chests can be rerolled. I will withhold judgment until it comes out on preview.
The only thing I will say is that the debate about random queues will only get worse if point #1 turns out to be more difficult under the new system.
kreatyveMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 10,545Community Moderator
Will the dungeon loot tables be changing? Will we still have a chance at getting epic mounts, companions, and artifacts?
My opinions are my own. I do not work for PWE or Cryptic. - Forum Rules - Protector's Enclave Discord - I play on Xbox Any of my comments not posted in orange are based on my own personal opinion and not official. Any messages written in orange are official moderation messages. Signature images are now fixed!
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putzboy78Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,950Arc User
edited September 2018
reroll tokens and rp (i have a balance of RP north of 7M) are worthless in this game. So your trading items of value to items of no value. This is a blatant nerf.
This is a blatant nerf to VIP and another poke in the eye to loyal long term players to encourage more transient traffic to play the game. You wanna know why the AD economy is off in this game:
1) Failure to resolve obvious unintended AD leaks in the game that has made some people monstrously rich. Instead of rectifying these issues directly, you continue to use passive aggressive nerfs to the AD economy directed to the general public and not those guilty of bad behaviors.
2) There is not enough incentive in this game to convert zen to AD. This has resulted in an unbalanced economy. Add an incentive to owning AD and you will find more balance. Your profit is not dictated by the ZEN store. You can make a profit by pushing demand for players to convert zen to AD as well. This can be seen in creating incentive for people to have AD to acquire RP (which the value of RP has crashed in game so its not currently functioning) or purchase master craft produced assets (which are currently not BIS so no one is exchanging zen for AD to acquire them).
3) Because of #2, ZEN is the premium currency in the game. The price ceiling on ZEN creates more demand. Any ECON101 student knows this. If you want to balance your game economy, hire someone who understands economies, have your developers work with them to create error traps that will send alerts should some unintended action impact the economy.
Every time you rework the AD balancing in this game, you are admitting a failure to correctly resolve the issue the last time. AD balancing should only require small tweaks, complete reworks is a sign of your FAILURE. Stop putting us through a continuous cycle of bandaids, take action as identified above and resolve the problem for good or just give up and create content that will work around the existing failed systems. Better yet just send me a check and buy out my account, that will help balance your economy cryptic.
My question is if seal gear is not salvageable, and seals are for catch up players what use will they be to those that don't need to catch up?
Is there a chance that refinement stones, pres wards will be purchasable for seals?
If not I guess I don't have to worry about guild marks anymore because the seal vendor gear will go straight into the coffer. Because I don't know what else I would need it for or as I see it now a useless seal vendor replacing my salvage anvil.
Though up looking at the leadership cache changes all it would take is a decrease in what dragonhoards/quarter masters give out and I would maybe need the rp.
Wouldn't happen to be any updates to enchantments coming this mod but change would there lol
By separating the RAD rewards from equipment rewards, it will allow us to continue to be able to make equipment -- to drop more regularly -- (There will still be rare chase items that are not easy to acquire).
Dagnabbit. There goes my hope for an increased chance of +5s.
Sadly you have just forced me to look for a new game. I've played D&D for 30 years and started playing NW because FR is my favorite realm. I had never played an MMO before.
Now you think this is a knee jerk reaction but sadly it is not. I make almost all of my AD by invoking and then salvaging for the VIP bonus. This is because my busy schedule does not allow me to actually play much. I'm lucky to actually play once a week and then only for an hour or two. And without salvage I will no longer have a method to make AD regularly.
And I was looking forward to the Profession changes. I should have known something just as bad for me as the good changes would be coming too.
what about malabog, valindra, lesser/greater demonic, mystic, arcane, dragon queen, kessels, runic, etc keys will still open those chests correct? sounds like I will have extra gold for professions since those chests will be mostly worthless for the cost of those keys
You are actually going to be getting astral diamonds for playing the game which I believe was the intent all along
If you read his post carefully, this depends on your playstyle. We already were making AD via salvaging through playing, but this might be less than before.
We aren’t trying to say this will be a boost for all players and that RAD will be overly abundant from these changes. For some play styles and AD generation methods, the amount of RAD generated will decrease and some play styles will inevitably change. We want to be straightforward about this and also wanted to give plenty of heads-up so that players can both salvage all of their saved up equipment before this goes live, and start figuring out what changes they will make to their play styles.
In fact, he says the exact opposite, "for some play styles and AD generation methods, the amount of RAD generated will decrease". There is no mention of an increase in AD.
Standard/Epic/Daily keys will be no more. Starting in M15, non-legendary end chests will be able to be opened for free... There are probably two questions that many of you have right now. The first is: What happens to all of your existing keys? Standard/Epic/Daily keys will be turned into reroll tokens upon logging in. Daily and Epic keys exchange at a 1 to 1 ratio. Standard keys transfer at 2 keys to 1 reroll token (if you have a left over single standard key in your inventory, that still gets turned into a reroll token). There will be a trade in within Protector’s Enclave for keys that are in mail, auction house, guild banks, and anywhere else where they don’t automatically convert.
EDIT: I need lessons in reading comprehension. I can accept rerolls on the chest. 5k is the cost of an epic key, so it balances.
Can we get a couple different options on trading in keys? As an example, on a somewhat-regularly-used alt, I have 312 epic dungeon keys.
I do not need 312 retraining tokens. Some would be nice, yes, but an alternative would be prefereable, so I could stock up on enough retraining tokens to last me quite some time, but then use the remaining on something that will actually get used....
I was initially confused by that too...but these aren't race reroll tokens...these are reroll tokens for the dungeon chests...so you will be able to use the reroll token or AD to try your RNG luck again(4 rerolls max per chest)
I think some of you are misinterpreting things....trading in your existing keys 1:1 gets you a dungeon chest re-roll token, NOT a retraining token for your powers, boons, etc. That is how I think it will work based on the developers comments.
reroll tokens and rp (i have a balance of RP north of 7M) are worthless in this game. So your trading items of value to items of no value. This is a blatant nerf.
This is a blatant nerf to VIP and another poke in the eye to loyal long term players to encourage more transient traffic to play the game. You wanna know why the AD economy is off in this game:
1) Failure to resolve obvious unintended AD leaks in the game that has made some people monstrously rich. Instead of rectifying these issues directly, you continue to use passive aggressive nerfs to the AD economy directed to the general public and not those guilty of bad behaviors.
2) There is not enough incentive in this game to convert zen to AD. This has resulted in an unbalanced economy. Add an incentive to owning AD and you will find more balance. Your profit is not dictated by the ZEN store. You can make a profit by pushing demand for players to convert zen to AD as well. This can be seen in creating incentive for people to have AD to acquire RP (which the value of RP has crashed in game so its not currently functioning) or purchase master craft produced assets (which are currently not BIS so no one is exchanging zen for AD to acquire them).
3) Because of #2, ZEN is the premium currency in the game. The price ceiling on ZEN creates more demand. Any ECON101 student knows this. If you want to balance your game economy, hire someone who understands economies, have your developers work with them to create error traps that will send alerts should some unintended action impact the economy.
Every time you rework the AD balancing in this game, you are admitting a failure to correctly resolve the issue the last time. AD balancing should only require small tweaks, complete reworks is a sign of your FAILURE. Stop putting us through a continuous cycle of bandaids, take action as identified above and resolve the problem for good or just give up and create content that will work around the existing failed systems. Better yet just send me a check and buy out my account, that will help balance your economy cryptic.
You're naming the problem everyone knows but not putting forth a solution. Do you expect them to go trough everyones inventory and delete AD manually from people who have too much?
Can we get a couple different options on trading in keys? As an example, on a somewhat-regularly-used alt, I have 312 epic dungeon keys.
I do not need 312 retraining tokens.
If you read the post carefully you can see that reroll tokens are seperate from retraining tokens. They will allow you to reroll the result of opening a chest up to 5 times per dungeon.
I go into valindra. get to the end. both chests are free.
seals are worthless unless I need gear. the gear is worth a very paltry amount of rp.
I go into CN. the first chest is free the second costs a legendary key (is the greater key we could make in campaign still alive? what about the t1 keys? do they make rerolls now or just disappear?)
I go into CODG first chest is free second chest costs a legendary key or chult key
those re-roll tokens should make grinding for UESs and blood rubies in Cradle interesting during a double event. I can forsee some serious AH impacts there.
those re-roll tokens should make grinding for UESs and blood rubies in Cradle interesting during a double event. I can forsee some serious AH impacts there.
Yep. Should also impact prices on things like the Shard of Orcus and the Fragmented Key.
As a solution for dungeon chests this could be fine IF the RAD reward is equivalent to what we would have gotten from salvaging a piece of armor/ring from the chest (In other words, around 2-3K for a tier 1 dungeon and more like 5-6K+ for a tier 3 or higher dungeon). I foresee 2 issues here though:
1) Unless the RAD rewards for the tougher dungeons are really good, this will just cause people to repeatedly speedrun things like Kessel's Retreat or Epic Temple of the Spider. As suddenly that's all people are queueing for that's also going to be what the randoms will draw most of the time and we will be back to a time before the randoms where only a few dungeons are ever run.
2) Hunts and dropped epic gear from Barovia has become a major source of their daily RAD income for many players (especially those unable to run the Random Advanced queue successfully). Replacing the salvage value of this gear with gold or RP is a major nerf.
> @thefiresidecat said: > so. > > I go into valindra. get to the end. both chests are free. > > seals are worthless unless I need gear. the gear is worth a very paltry amount of rp. > > I go into CN. the first chest is free the second costs a legendary key (is the greater key we could make in campaign still alive? what about the t1 keys? do they make rerolls now or just disappear?) > > I go into CODG first chest is free second chest costs a legendary key or chult key > > do I have this right?
No the Epic chest is free in both but the Dungeon Specific chest will still cost the campaign key or Dragon Key.
Granted this will also allow them to adjust drop rates in those chests to give a better drop rate. Which they should be for completing the campaign.
No. Anything that campaign key still takes campaign key. So Valindra will have 1 free chest and 1 campaign chest. CN will take 1 greater key and have 1 free chest. Cradle will have 1 free chest and 1 Omuan key chest.
Sad to say I think that in the long run this will help the economy but for those players like me with a very busy schedule it will make my limited time worthless in the game. Unless some change to VIP is implemented that will award something that I can use to make the AD I make now.
And I understand that right now I'm not technically playing the game as they want but I'm playing to the best of my abilities with the real life schedule that I have in the hopes of continuing to improve my character as best as possible until my schedule changes and I can once again spend more time on the game.
And to be honest I actually like the professions because I can see continual growth there where with my character most of the time I seem to be stagnant.
@noworries#8859 What will happen with [Legendary Dragon Key]?
Everything about them stays the same.
what do you mean by staying the same? legendary keys's purpose is to open any chest, and now that all chests can be opened keylessly, why would anyone buy those? i had 20 of these keys, are they becaming useless then?
what do you mean by staying the same? legendary keys's purpose is to open any chest, and now that all chests can be opened keylessly, why would anyone buy those? i had 20 of these keys, are they becaming useless then?
The only chest that they have said is changing to free is the one that required either daily/standard/epic key. The other chests will still require the same keys as before seems to be what he meant here.
As a solution for dungeon chests this could be fine IF the RAD reward is equivalent to what we would have gotten from salvaging a piece of armor/ring from the chest (In other words, around 2-3K for a tier 1 dungeon and more like 5-6K+ for a tier 3 or higher dungeon). I foresee 2 issues here though:
1) Unless the RAD rewards for the tougher dungeons are really good, this will just cause people to repeatedly speedrun things like Kessel's Retreat or Epic Temple of the Spider. As suddenly that's all people are queueing for that's also going to be what the randoms will draw most of the time and we will be back to a time before the randoms where only a few dungeons are ever run.
2) Hunts and dropped epic gear from Barovia has become a major source of their daily RAD income for many players (especially those unable to run the Random Advanced queue successfully). Replacing the salvage value of this gear with gold or RP is a major nerf.
that wouldn't be enough. you can expect at least two drops from bosses of salvage as well as chest. a dungeon should give about 15k salvage give or take on average.
Comments
A handful of reroll tokens won't make any difference when you would need a hundred tries or more to guarantee a good reward.
The only thing I will say is that the debate about random queues will only get worse if point #1 turns out to be more difficult under the new system.
Guild--And the Imaginary Friends
Any of my comments not posted in orange are based on my own personal opinion and not official.
Any messages written in orange are official moderation messages. Signature images are now fixed!
This is a blatant nerf to VIP and another poke in the eye to loyal long term players to encourage more transient traffic to play the game. You wanna know why the AD economy is off in this game:
1) Failure to resolve obvious unintended AD leaks in the game that has made some people monstrously rich. Instead of rectifying these issues directly, you continue to use passive aggressive nerfs to the AD economy directed to the general public and not those guilty of bad behaviors.
2) There is not enough incentive in this game to convert zen to AD. This has resulted in an unbalanced economy. Add an incentive to owning AD and you will find more balance. Your profit is not dictated by the ZEN store. You can make a profit by pushing demand for players to convert zen to AD as well. This can be seen in creating incentive for people to have AD to acquire RP (which the value of RP has crashed in game so its not currently functioning) or purchase master craft produced assets (which are currently not BIS so no one is exchanging zen for AD to acquire them).
3) Because of #2, ZEN is the premium currency in the game. The price ceiling on ZEN creates more demand. Any ECON101 student knows this. If you want to balance your game economy, hire someone who understands economies, have your developers work with them to create error traps that will send alerts should some unintended action impact the economy.
economics.fundamentalfinance.com/price-ceiling.php
Every time you rework the AD balancing in this game, you are admitting a failure to correctly resolve the issue the last time. AD balancing should only require small tweaks, complete reworks is a sign of your FAILURE. Stop putting us through a continuous cycle of bandaids, take action as identified above and resolve the problem for good or just give up and create content that will work around the existing failed systems. Better yet just send me a check and buy out my account, that will help balance your economy cryptic.
Is there a chance that refinement stones, pres wards will be purchasable for seals?
If not I guess I don't have to worry about guild marks anymore because the seal vendor gear will go straight into the coffer. Because I don't know what else I would need it for or as I see it now a useless seal vendor replacing my salvage anvil.
Though up looking at the leadership cache changes all it would take is a decrease in what dragonhoards/quarter masters give out and I would maybe need the rp.
Wouldn't happen to be any updates to enchantments coming this mod but change would there lol
Dagnabbit. There goes my hope for an increased chance of +5s.
Now you think this is a knee jerk reaction but sadly it is not. I make almost all of my AD by invoking and then salvaging for the VIP bonus. This is because my busy schedule does not allow me to actually play much. I'm lucky to actually play once a week and then only for an hour or two. And without salvage I will no longer have a method to make AD regularly.
And I was looking forward to the Profession changes. I should have known something just as bad for me as the good changes would be coming too.
Hahaha
Almost positive these will be CHEST REROLL tokens.
I go into valindra. get to the end. both chests are free.
seals are worthless unless I need gear. the gear is worth a very paltry amount of rp.
I go into CN. the first chest is free the second costs a legendary key (is the greater key we could make in campaign still alive? what about the t1 keys? do they make rerolls now or just disappear?)
I go into CODG first chest is free second chest costs a legendary key or chult key
do I have this right?
1) Unless the RAD rewards for the tougher dungeons are really good, this will just cause people to repeatedly speedrun things like Kessel's Retreat or Epic Temple of the Spider. As suddenly that's all people are queueing for that's also going to be what the randoms will draw most of the time and we will be back to a time before the randoms where only a few dungeons are ever run.
2) Hunts and dropped epic gear from Barovia has become a major source of their daily RAD income for many players (especially those unable to run the Random Advanced queue successfully). Replacing the salvage value of this gear with gold or RP is a major nerf.
> so.
>
> I go into valindra. get to the end. both chests are free.
>
> seals are worthless unless I need gear. the gear is worth a very paltry amount of rp.
>
> I go into CN. the first chest is free the second costs a legendary key (is the greater key we could make in campaign still alive? what about the t1 keys? do they make rerolls now or just disappear?)
>
> I go into CODG first chest is free second chest costs a legendary key or chult key
>
> do I have this right?
No the Epic chest is free in both but the Dungeon Specific chest will still cost the campaign key or Dragon Key.
Granted this will also allow them to adjust drop rates in those chests to give a better drop rate. Which they should be for completing the campaign.
And I understand that right now I'm not technically playing the game as they want but I'm playing to the best of my abilities with the real life schedule that I have in the hopes of continuing to improve my character as best as possible until my schedule changes and I can once again spend more time on the game.
And to be honest I actually like the professions because I can see continual growth there where with my character most of the time I seem to be stagnant.