Heal Paladins Rework (Suggestions)

damoc · March 2017

THe big problem is we heal like mad (in the range of full HP heal in 2 seconds flat) but the game is rife with one shots at hlvl. Nobody can heal the dead. Maybe if they reworked bulkwark or Light feat tree to make one of the capstones something like:

Your encounter powers do not heal anymore but generate a shield (blue HP) for 33% of the nominal heal cummulative to a max of 100% of the healed person HP. The heals provided by your at-wills and feats still heal.

Well obviously it's a rough idea that would need refining (most likely on the vlaues i randomly assigned) but with this we can keep people from dying to lags or whatnots and have a serioulsly decreased healing capacity. But hey it's not like they're going to rush to try and implement this ^^

armadeonx · March 2017

Healadins could definitely do with a power/feat that prevents one shotting.

damoc · March 2017

The other idea I had was:

Allies with this buff (don't know how it got there it's just a concept) prevent all damage done to them for the duration of the buff but instead get an DoT for the same total damage value but dealt over 10 seconds.

The aim is to 'force' us to heal and to get rid of the insane burst damage of HLvl monsters by forcibly changing it to dots (uncleansable of course no cheese allowed) For example if a 400k hit comes on the buff, it will instead deal aroud 40k per second for 10 seconds. If a second hit comes, while the buff is still here a second DoT appears alongside the first one. That's where we need our full potential for healing because we must at least pull more than 40k HPS to keep the wounded alive.

It would probably revitalize some healing clerics too.

oggycz · March 2017

damoc#3687 said:
The other idea I had was:

Allies with this buff (don't know how it got there it's just a concept) prevent all damage done to them for the duration of the buff but instead get an DoT for the same total damage value but dealt over 10 seconds.

The aim is to 'force' us to heal and to get rid of the insane burst damage of HLvl monsters by forcibly changing it to dots (uncleansable of course no cheese allowed) For example if a 400k hit comes on the buff, it will instead deal aroud 40k per second for 10 seconds. If a second hit comes, while the buff is still here a second DoT appears alongside the first one. That's where we need our full potential for healing because we must at least pull more than 40k HPS to keep the wounded alive.

It would probably revitalize some healing clerics too.

Sounds interesting. And maybe total DoT could be higher than initial hit.

isaintify1 · March 2017

oggycz#5356 said:

damoc#3687 said:
The other idea I had was:

Allies with this buff (don't know how it got there it's just a concept) prevent all damage done to them for the duration of the buff but instead get an DoT for the same total damage value but dealt over 10 seconds.

The aim is to 'force' us to heal and to get rid of the insane burst damage of HLvl monsters by forcibly changing it to dots (uncleansable of course no cheese allowed) For example if a 400k hit comes on the buff, it will instead deal aroud 40k per second for 10 seconds. If a second hit comes, while the buff is still here a second DoT appears alongside the first one. That's where we need our full potential for healing because we must at least pull more than 40k HPS to keep the wounded alive.

It would probably revitalize some healing clerics too.
Sounds interesting. And maybe total DoT could be higher than initial hit.

I can tell you why right now this is a VERY bad idea haha... So now what happens when Orcus whos punches are normally 200-600k, and his swings can reach about 1million and while he can do this attack every 10 seconds and his normal punches every 3 seconds. So lets say Cryptic adds this "buff" into the game, and the only way to balance this buff is give it a cooldown of 1-2minutes. You would also figure if its a flat buff, multiplicative, or additive. This will make tanky healadins such as myself have a much more difficult time tanking a boss for a group.
Now another reason why this would be bad is that it would wreck havoc in both pve and pvp, and make Heal pallys #1 in the damage board again. With high enough deflect and throw back damage to the attackers you would be doing immense amounts of damage to players and adds.

One more reason why this would be a very bad idea is it would basically make my paladin unkillable in both pvp and pve. (Depending of the internal cooldown of course) Changing that 400k hit that wouldve been a 1hit K0 into a small amount of damage like 40k over 10 seconds, is insane. Healing 40k Damage a second is childs play for a OP Healadin. Unless of course you get hit with a 1million and going by your logic that would be a 100k DOT on you and yeah still basically would be childs play to heal. but you must take in consider that you (depending on your initial health) would only have 20-80k health left, all the other adds + boss hitting you. For me I have 160k health so I would have 60k health left, and if orcus punches me + that 100kDOT its gonna suck.

oggycz · March 2017

isaintify1 said:

oggycz#5356 said:

damoc#3687 said:
The other idea I had was:

Allies with this buff (don't know how it got there it's just a concept) prevent all damage done to them for the duration of the buff but instead get an DoT for the same total damage value but dealt over 10 seconds.

The aim is to 'force' us to heal and to get rid of the insane burst damage of HLvl monsters by forcibly changing it to dots (uncleansable of course no cheese allowed) For example if a 400k hit comes on the buff, it will instead deal aroud 40k per second for 10 seconds. If a second hit comes, while the buff is still here a second DoT appears alongside the first one. That's where we need our full potential for healing because we must at least pull more than 40k HPS to keep the wounded alive.

It would probably revitalize some healing clerics too.
Sounds interesting. And maybe total DoT could be higher than initial hit.
I can tell you why right now this is a VERY bad idea haha... So now what happens when Orcus whos punches are normally 200-600k, and his swings can reach about 1million and while he can do this attack every 10 seconds and his normal punches every 3 seconds. So lets say Cryptic adds this "buff" into the game, and the only way to balance this buff is give it a cooldown of 1-2minutes. You would also figure if its a flat buff, multiplicative, or additive. This will make tanky healadins such as myself have a much more difficult time tanking a boss for a group.
Now another reason why this would be bad is that it would wreck havoc in both pve and pvp, and make Heal pallys #1 in the damage board again. With high enough deflect and throw back damage to the attackers you would be doing immense amounts of damage to players and adds.

One more reason why this would be a very bad idea is it would basically make my paladin unkillable in both pvp and pve. (Depending of the internal cooldown of course) Changing that 400k hit that wouldve been a 1hit K0 into a small amount of damage like 40k over 10 seconds, is insane. Healing 40k Damage a second is childs play for a OP Healadin. Unless of course you get hit with a 1million and going by your logic that would be a 100k DOT on you and yeah still basically would be childs play to heal. but you must take in consider that you (depending on your initial health) would only have 20-80k health left, all the other adds + boss hitting you. For me I have 160k health so I would have 60k health left, and if orcus punches me + that 100kDOT its gonna suck.

I just like the idea. And I wrote, that total DoT could be higher as penalty. And it can be for example over 2s +1s per level (4th level over 5s).

damoc · March 2017

isaintify1 said:
I can tell you why right now this is a VERY bad idea haha...
(...)

I don't follow your argument. Maybe I din't explain clearly what I envisionned but I find your answer strange. On one hand you say it would make you immortal and on the other hand it would make it harder for you to take the punches.

This effect wouldn't deprive you of your existing mitigation tools. Furthermore as I mentionned before every numeric value I gave was purely from the top of my head. Could be that instead of 100% of the incoming damage transformed in DoT, maybe only two thirds will become a DoT while you still take one third directly. and maybe you will get another hit on top of that that will add to the damage taken per second till the healer can not keep up but this proposition is here to give you the chance to heal through it where otherwise you would have kicked the bucket.
Last but not least, I envisonned this as the captsone of either light or bulkwark feat tree which means it wouldn't be the justice tree and so very low on DPS.

I won't say that what you say won't come to pass because everything I propose is purely theorical and without testing it it maybe riddled with unintended consequences but at the moment it doesn't seems to be that bad an idea as you describe it.

duskwood · March 2017

I want to see bond of virtue put as an aura, and our doodie abilities fixed.

Templars Wrath : needs way more temp HP, it gives like 1%

Healing Font : Should pulse temp hp or a shield as well as the heal.

Aura of divinity : should be bond of virtue. Exactly as it is. Stop taking up an encounter slot with a passive, PLEASE -_-

Absoltuion : Needs to be team wide.

Relentless Avenger : Should gran aoe temp hp or shield, NOT fling enemies to the freaking moon.

I just want more options than bond, vow, and bane on bosses.

majorcharvenak · March 2017

duskwood said:
I want to see bond of virtue put as an aura, and our doodie abilities fixed.

Templars Wrath : needs way more temp HP, it gives like 1%

Healing Font : Should pulse temp hp or a shield as well as the heal.

Aura of divinity : should be bond of virtue. Exactly as it is. Stop taking up an encounter slot with a passive, PLEASE -_-

Absoltuion : Needs to be team wide.

Relentless Avenger : Should gran aoe temp hp or shield, NOT fling enemies to the freaking moon.

I just want more options than bond, vow, and bane on bosses.

Templars Wrath : Agreed

Healing Font: I kinda like this one. Be a good compromise over my desire for it to prevent one shots...but the shield (unless the DR added is either 100%) would make shield of faith useless.

Aura of Divinity : I think I could live with that too

Absolution : HELL YEAH! And perhaps add a bit more HP to the shield

Relentless Avenger: I dunno. I think I'm a bit of a leper here with that (No offense intended for anyone suffering from actual leprosy), but I still prefer the ability to knock folks back when I (or another teammate other than the tank is getting swarmed by the mobs. Call it a holdover from when my main was a DC, and a timed Sunburst could provide an extra second to come up with a new plan. The thing is, folks just need to stop spamming it in the rotation, use it with care or swap it out depending on the circumstances. I'm not to keen on changing a power's mechanic just because folks tend to abuse it or don't think about how it effects party fight mechanics. Thems my two coppers.

Shia

isaintify1 · March 2017

@duskwood yes these are all very good ideas, and ideas that people have shared already very similar ideas. Basically everyone wants Bond of Virtue to be more class feature based than encounter based. Id also love to see templars wrath damage buffed cause its pretty low all things considered. What do you think of Burning Light? What would you change about that encounter.

majorcharvenak · August 2017

All,

I'm giving this thread from @isaintify1 a bump based off the recommendation of the moderater, due to part of the discussions covering this topic spilling over into another forum thread. I hope anyone and everyone who enjoys playing the devotion paladin, like I do, will look at it again and bring some great and workable ideas to its pages.

Heal Paladins Rework (Suggestions)

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