500 000 as entry fee? for a new player for example? Mans you are complete lunatics here. So he must grind solo over many weeks to get this fee and dont have progress on his characters? This is true gamer nightmare you are supporting....
guilds with rank 9+ guildhall right now are not guilds that would invite a new player. btw really if 500k is a price that makes you be alarmed i hope you never see prices for guild structures boon and such at lv 3+
dont tell me your guildies will pay these prices.....
it will become common practise in few time in almost the totality of known guild
0
tassedethe13Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 806Arc User
Isn't it 7.4 million AD vs 597,000 influence? Meaning that you're essentially time capped by influence whereas with AD you have a 24,000 AD per character limit. With 50 active players you need 148,000 AD per player. That's basically 10 days worth of daily skirmishes+dungeons (with no alts, you can cut that time in half if everyone has one alt). Whereas influence will take about twice as long.
When boons lvl 3 need 80K influence and 3M AD, yes AD IS a hard cap. 70K influence is made in 2-3 days, but 3M AD isn't made in 2-3 days. And after you need lvl 4 boon ( 3M5 AD roughly), second boon from one to 4 ( at least 10M AD ), plus guild hall lvl 10 ( 3M5 roughly) and again.....
So why is it unfair to ask for a 500K entrance fee for a new guildie ? He gains avantages of old guildies works, can buy new stuff and gain like 5K stats by boons.....
Isn't it 7.4 million AD vs 597,000 influence? Meaning that you're essentially time capped by influence whereas with AD you have a 24,000 AD per character limit. With 50 active players you need 148,000 AD per player. That's basically 10 days worth of daily skirmishes+dungeons (with no alts, you can cut that time in half if everyone has one alt). Whereas influence will take about twice as long.
When boons lvl 3 need 80K influence and 3M AD, yes AD IS a hard cap. 70K influence is made in 2-3 days, but 3M AD isn't made in 2-3 days. And after you need lvl 4 boon ( 3M5 AD roughly), second boon from one to 4 ( at least 10M AD ), plus guild hall lvl 10 ( 3M5 roughly) and again.....
So why is it unfair to ask for a 500K entrance fee for a new guildie ? He gains avantages of old guildies works, can buy new stuff and gain like 5K stats by boons.....
It's not unfair per se, it's just that not all guilds are going to do it. Some of them will understand that having another active player over the course a few months is worth a lot more than 500k.
0
checkmatein3Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 525Arc User
In Myrmidons, we took a middle road to the possibility of Hit-and-Run players using the guild for access to Market 4 and the new sets.
First, since all sets require guild marks and with a cap at 30k, it is impossible for a player to come in on ONE CHARACTER and get all 4 pieces and then quickly leave. Therefore, we limit new recruits of any level and/or IL to only one character in the guild for a period of time (unspecified here). This prevents the desire for a quick hit-and-run tactic. Also, we limit recruiting to trusted members only, so that once in, you cannot send invites to yourself to add other characters that may have more guild marks. Hit-and-run players will not stay long in a guild.
Second, we decided against charging access, whether for short term (paying for the one-time use of Market 4) or long term. We are not elitist minded, nor do we think adding yet another 'AD sink' in the game is very encouraging. And, it may only invite the unscrupulous. So, we decided against it.
Third, it is not really a 'scam' if a character comes in with 30k guild marks and 50 fangs/fallen banners, as that player has earned those items from whatever previous play he or she has done. So, the market 4 in our guild would be open to the player based on what they have already accomplished. Of course, future guild mark earnings and fangs would come from staying in the guild and earning them. So, we believe time in the guild will build the friendship, as well as the open content of the market 4. Also, if a player stays in the guild to earn guild marks and fangs/fallen banners, gets all 4 sets and then leaves, then the guild received the time and energy of that person through the donation of items to the coffer and play. This is also not a scam. And, if our semi-casual guild culture did not appeal to him or her, we wish that player well on whatever guild is next. It is still a game.
Finally, we keep track of character handles of those who have come into the guild and leave quickly. This way, we can be on the look out for those who make a character, get marks and then come to our guild for market access, use the guild marks and then leave. It is a way to prevent someone from circumventing the ONE CHARACTER in the guild as a recruit.
Whereas we want to protect the growth that our guild has made through the hard work that the active participants have done, we do not want to be so closed off as to discourage new players from enjoying the same content, and then to be inspired by the guild to go still further.
Cheers to all! BLUNTFORCE TRAUMA Officer of Myrmidons
In Myrmidons, we took a middle road to the possibility of Hit-and-Run players using the guild for access to Market 4 and the new sets.
First, since all sets require guild marks and with a cap at 30k, it is impossible for a player to come in on ONE CHARACTER and get all 4 pieces and then quickly leave. Therefore, we limit new recruits of any level and/or IL to only one character in the guild for a period of time (unspecified here). This prevents the desire for a quick hit-and-run tactic. Also, we limit recruiting to trusted members only, so that once in, you cannot send invites to yourself to add other characters that may have more guild marks. Hit-and-run players will not stay long in a guild.
Second, we decided against charging access, whether for short term (paying for the one-time use of Market 4) or long term. We are not elitist minded, nor do we think adding yet another 'AD sink' in the game is very encouraging. And, it may only invite the unscrupulous. So, we decided against it.
Third, it is not really a 'scam' if a character comes in with 30k guild marks and 50 fangs/fallen banners, as that player has earned those items from whatever previous play he or she has done. So, the market 4 in our guild would be open to the player based on what they have already accomplished. Of course, future guild mark earnings and fangs would come from staying in the guild and earning them. So, we believe time in the guild will build the friendship, as well as the open content of the market 4. Also, if a player stays in the guild to earn guild marks and fangs/fallen banners, gets all 4 sets and then leaves, then the guild received the time and energy of that person through the donation of items to the coffer and play. This is also not a scam. And, if our semi-casual guild culture did not appeal to him or her, we wish that player well on whatever guild is next. It is still a game.
Finally, we keep track of character handles of those who have come into the guild and leave quickly. This way, we can be on the look out for those who make a character, get marks and then come to our guild for market access, use the guild marks and then leave. It is a way to prevent someone from circumventing the ONE CHARACTER in the guild as a recruit.
Whereas we want to protect the growth that our guild has made through the hard work that the active participants have done, we do not want to be so closed off as to discourage new players from enjoying the same content, and then to be inspired by the guild to go still further.
Cheers to all! BLUNTFORCE TRAUMA Officer of Myrmidons
No offense, but what level is your stronghold ?
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checkmatein3Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 525Arc User
... it is not really a 'scam' if a character comes in with 30k guild marks and 50 fangs/fallen banners, as that player has earned those items from whatever previous play he or she has done. So, the market 4 in our guild would be open to the player based on what they have already accomplished. Of course, future guild mark earnings and fangs would come from staying in the guild and earning them. So, we believe time in the guild will build the friendship, as well as the open content of the market 4. Also, if a player stays in the guild to earn guild marks and fangs/fallen banners, gets all 4 sets and then leaves, then the guild received the time and energy of that person through the donation of items to the coffer and play. This is also not a scam.
^This.
I think it was bad design call to put BiS behind some fairly high walls in the stronghold system, and am hoping for a small-guild workaround. I'm thinking they can allow folks to convert their guild marks into "bag of 1,000 guild marks" or some other currency that would allow them to buy the guild gear from a new vendor at PE at steeply inflated prices. The inflated price would be set such that it would be roughly comparable to the amount of time and work to what is necessary to build up to the proper stronghold market level the way it was designed.
it will become common practise in few time in almost the totality of known guild
No, it will only be so for a very short time. Only as the rush to be the first to get the boons. The first guilds to get those will be able to set what ever terms they like. And there will be people willing to pay anything asked, just to be one of the first.
But it will end quickly, once the newness wears off. Once more and more guilds catch up. People willing to pay entry fees will dry to nothing as more and more top ranked guild choices become available and commonplace.
When ScrubsRUS can offer the same guild perks as NamelessUberGuild. Why would anyone be willing to pay NamelessUberGuilds entry fee?
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tassedethe13Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 806Arc User
Because ScrubsRUS will make 2 years getting lvl 16 stronghold for example, while NamelessUberGuild will have it in (only) 1 year
do you want cryptic to force remove small guilds who will finish strongholds by the mod 15 at best
I see the opposite: players in smalls guild removing Neverwinter from their PC if nothing changes. I'm in a social-friendly guild and we will not moving to an anonymous big guild. Currently we're investigating to move not to a bigger guild, but to another game. New games will be realeasd in the next few months...
Pretty much this!
I just look around my friends and the trend is the one you have described, people can't be forced into soulless big guilds or boot camps.
The real honest man is honest from conviction of what is right, not from policy.
Robert E. Lee
I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself.
Winston Churchill
The human race is a herd. Here we are, unique, eternal aspects of consciousness with an infinity of potential, and we have allowed ourselves to become an unthinking, unquestioning blob of conformity and uniformity. A herd. Once we concede to the herd mentality, we can be controlled and directed by a tiny few. And we are.
David Icke
Really sad to see how 'big guilds' fell into souless with bootcamps category. If you have the power and numbers suddenly you're a tyrant? Having requirements by no means turns you into a heartless person, so when you're looking for a good mate to spend your life with and you like them at a certain height for example and won't settle for a short partner, that makes you horrible?
Big guilds =/= bunch of high geared stupid people with impossible requirements. Big guilds =/= P2W aholes. Big guilds =/= exploiters.
Time to get over that niche, sad how certain guilds make it look like the above is all there is.
Really sad to see how 'big guilds' fell into souless with bootcamps category. If you have the power and numbers suddenly you're a tyrant? Having requirements by no means turns you into a heartless person, so when you're looking for a good mate to spend your life with and you like them at a certain height for example and won't settle for a short partner, that makes you horrible?
Big guilds =/= bunch of high geared stupid people with impossible requirements. Big guilds =/= P2W aholes. Big guilds =/= exploiters.
Time to get over that niche, sad how certain guilds make it look like the above is all there is.
Just look at your req:
♚ The Holy Crusaders
English speaking 50+ members online on peak times. PVE/PVP, yet more PVE oriented. TS3 as voicechat (not required in general, required in large raids, speaking is not required.) International (no specific playtime, all time zones are welcome.) We consider ourselves competitive,
not too casual-friendly.
Level 70 players. 2.5k+ Item level required.
What if smal guild nativ language is not english? Not to talk about you cannot accept 20ppl cuz y dont have enugh space.
I liked the stronghold but with the new ad- system made for its impossible for smal guilds to grow up its impossible.
If noone will do somthing soon there will be max 10 big guild and some looser hou will never fit in those guilds.
What do you think lia hou can a newcomer get those req ?? And when your guild is filled up 100% what do you think ? You will even push up those req . After 200-250 days your guild will have rank 20 boons . You char will look like a monster Godzilla vs lvl 1 zombies .
What will we have w/o the newcomers? Privat server??
I think solving this issue (smaller guilds impossibility to level up SH) will decrease significantly the issue of ppl joining/buying gear/leaving stated.
0
icyphishMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,255Arc User
Different guilds has different policies and requirements, there is no need to to talk down someone's guild only because the requirement is too high for a 'new' or 'average' player.
Think about it as looking for a job, you do not complain to different companies because their requirement does not fit you or does not fit average job seekers. While their requierment might seem impossible for you (e.g. 15+years in Network engineering, minimum MCSE with at least 10 years experience with UNIX platform), but to the veterans, these requirement might sounds just about right.
Guilds on the other hand, are just like companies, they have what some people want (pay/skill/learnings...etc), but to be in the company, you need to have equivilent skillsets, what can you contribute to the company?
Different guilds has different policies and requirements, there is no need to to talk down someone's guild only because the requirement is too high for a 'new' or 'average' player.
Think about it as looking for a job, you do not complain to different companies because their requirement does not fit you or does not fit average job seekers. While their requierment might seem impossible for you (e.g. 15+years in Network engineering, minimum MCSE with at least 10 years experience with UNIX platform), but to the veterans, these requirement might sounds just about right.
Guilds on the other hand, are just like companies, they have what some people want (pay/skill/learnings...etc), but to be in the company, you need to have equivilent skillsets, what can you contribute to the company?
Different guilds has different policies and requirements, there is no need to to talk down someone's guild only because the requirement is too high for a 'new' or 'average' player.
Think about it as looking for a job, you do not complain to different companies because their requirement does not fit you or does not fit average job seekers. While their requierment might seem impossible for you (e.g. 15+years in Network engineering, minimum MCSE with at least 10 years experience with UNIX platform), but to the veterans, these requirement might sounds just about right.
Guilds on the other hand, are just like companies, they have what some people want (pay/skill/learnings...etc), but to be in the company, you need to have equivilent skillsets, what can you contribute to the company?
Smaller guild need to have his on place to.
We talked about reqcruting in our guild what shoud be our message?
LF semi active members no i.lvl req no languale req no ts3 req no play time req age is not matter. We are specific looking for Richi Rich hou can pay our stronghold We dont need you if you are bis cuz you will not buy zen.
Well since its not, and u dont care too much, why u want to be in bigger guild (in terms of structures)? Its not a job, barely a hobby, timesinker? So if its not so important, u also should not care that other guilds want some input from u, and just avoid them. Its not like u need to be the best here.
I, from other hand, put 100% into whatever im doing, i dont need to be the best, but i dont want jeopardize ppl who play with me. My point is, show u care, show u can give a part of yourself. If u would not care, u would not be here, whatever u say, u still being here says more...
New players have they stuff to do, they can join smaller guilds, but then, if they discover that they progress faster than they current guild, they may decide to get themself a better guild. But better guild is higher standards, they need to adjust to that. Better/biger guilds r not better/bigger (again in terms of structures) without reason.
Think about it as looking for a job, you do not complain to different companies because their requirement does not fit you or does not fit average job seekers. While their requierment might seem impossible for you (e.g. 15+years in Network engineering, minimum MCSE with at least 10 years experience with UNIX platform), but to the veterans, these requirement might sounds just about right.
15+years in Network engineering? They must be 35-45. Too old.
Think about it as looking for a job, you do not complain to different companies because their requirement does not fit you or does not fit average job seekers. While their requierment might seem impossible for you (e.g. 15+years in Network engineering, minimum MCSE with at least 10 years experience with UNIX platform), but to the veterans, these requirement might sounds just about right.
15+years in Network engineering? They must be 35-45. Too old.
Too old for what? Too old for elementary job or too old for senior job?
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
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tassedethe13Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 806Arc User
Hi again everybody,
For instance we stayed as we are, so we chose not to ask for any kind of contributions and we won't charge new guildies because they are new. We will probably see guild shoppers, but we still have a recruitment process with TS and a 1 month trial who will filter some of them.
I prefer having people contributing because they want to be part of the guild, and make things move rather than having players cashing just for joining and then not contributing.
I would like to thanks every one who posted on this thread because it helped me a lot about thinking what is important and remembered me that the guild spirit is what has made my guild cross the years.
And a special mention for the guy who seriously asked me to give up my guild lead
0
vinceent1Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,264Arc User
edited October 2015
any guild with Marketplace lvl 4 allow me to buy armor there? my guild is guildhall 6 a i am on cap with banners. i offer resources like a 75000glory, 100conqueror shards, heroic shards, labor fey vouchers etc.... pm please
The 140 iL set is just a bit stringer than the old 137 iL equipment. So I see no point in protecting the level 4 market.
The true power of a high level Guild are the Boons. And you loose the Boons again, if you leave the Guild.
So you don't need to protect yourself from jumpy players. They only make you stronger, because a few might stay or add some resources to the Box. And the only thing that you loose if the leave the guild is a helpful hand during the dragon fight.
0
tassedethe13Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 806Arc User
The 140 iL set is just a bit stringer than the old 137 iL equipment. So I see no point in protecting the level 4 market.
The true power of a high level Guild are the Boons. And you loose the Boons again, if you leave the Guild.
So you don't need to protect yourself from jumpy players. They only make you stronger, because a few might stay or add some resources to the Box. And the only thing that you loose if the leave the guild is a helpful hand during the dragon fight.
It's like the bad taste you get when you spend 30 min in TS for recruitment and the guy left the following day. You feel like you waste you time.
0
vinceent1Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,264Arc User
The 140 iL set is just a bit stringer than the old 137 iL equipment. So I see no point in protecting the level 4 market.
The true power of a high level Guild are the Boons. And you loose the Boons again, if you leave the Guild.
So you don't need to protect yourself from jumpy players. They only make you stronger, because a few might stay or add some resources to the Box. And the only thing that you loose if the leave the guild is a helpful hand during the dragon fight.
It's like the bad taste you get when you spend 30 min in TS for recruitment and the guy left the following day. You feel like you waste you time.
so dont hesitate help people buy gear in exchange for some mimic donations or other minor and they will tell you directly what they need and save your time. PVE guilds can get nice loads of conq shards or glory this way
they need over 120 banners for full set and limit to have is only 50. Many players dont want spend AD opening strongboxes, so they need to buy armor 3times. They dont want to scam you, because they will ask to join twice later....
Comments
So why is it unfair to ask for a 500K entrance fee for a new guildie ? He gains avantages of old guildies works, can buy new stuff and gain like 5K stats by boons.....
First, since all sets require guild marks and with a cap at 30k, it is impossible for a player to come in on ONE CHARACTER and get all 4 pieces and then quickly leave. Therefore, we limit new recruits of any level and/or IL to only one character in the guild for a period of time (unspecified here). This prevents the desire for a quick hit-and-run tactic. Also, we limit recruiting to trusted members only, so that once in, you cannot send invites to yourself to add other characters that may have more guild marks. Hit-and-run players will not stay long in a guild.
Second, we decided against charging access, whether for short term (paying for the one-time use of Market 4) or long term. We are not elitist minded, nor do we think adding yet another 'AD sink' in the game is very encouraging. And, it may only invite the unscrupulous. So, we decided against it.
Third, it is not really a 'scam' if a character comes in with 30k guild marks and 50 fangs/fallen banners, as that player has earned those items from whatever previous play he or she has done. So, the market 4 in our guild would be open to the player based on what they have already accomplished. Of course, future guild mark earnings and fangs would come from staying in the guild and earning them. So, we believe time in the guild will build the friendship, as well as the open content of the market 4. Also, if a player stays in the guild to earn guild marks and fangs/fallen banners, gets all 4 sets and then leaves, then the guild received the time and energy of that person through the donation of items to the coffer and play. This is also not a scam. And, if our semi-casual guild culture did not appeal to him or her, we wish that player well on whatever guild is next. It is still a game.
Finally, we keep track of character handles of those who have come into the guild and leave quickly. This way, we can be on the look out for those who make a character, get marks and then come to our guild for market access, use the guild marks and then leave. It is a way to prevent someone from circumventing the ONE CHARACTER in the guild as a recruit.
Whereas we want to protect the growth that our guild has made through the hard work that the active participants have done, we do not want to be so closed off as to discourage new players from enjoying the same content, and then to be inspired by the guild to go still further.
Cheers to all!
BLUNTFORCE TRAUMA
Officer of Myrmidons
Guild--And the Imaginary Friends
No offense, but what level is your stronghold ?
Guild--And the Imaginary Friends
I think it was bad design call to put BiS behind some fairly high walls in the stronghold system, and am hoping for a small-guild workaround. I'm thinking they can allow folks to convert their guild marks into "bag of 1,000 guild marks" or some other currency that would allow them to buy the guild gear from a new vendor at PE at steeply inflated prices. The inflated price would be set such that it would be roughly comparable to the amount of time and work to what is necessary to build up to the proper stronghold market level the way it was designed.
But it will end quickly, once the newness wears off. Once more and more guilds catch up. People willing to pay entry fees will dry to nothing as more and more top ranked guild choices become available and commonplace.
When ScrubsRUS can offer the same guild perks as NamelessUberGuild. Why would anyone be willing to pay NamelessUberGuilds entry fee?
I just look around my friends and the trend is the one you have described, people can't be forced into soulless big guilds or boot camps.
Robert E. Lee
I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself.
Winston Churchill
The human race is a herd. Here we are, unique, eternal aspects of consciousness with an infinity of potential, and we have allowed ourselves to become an unthinking, unquestioning blob of conformity and uniformity. A herd. Once we concede to the herd mentality, we can be controlled and directed by a tiny few. And we are.
David Icke
Romantic
pffff
Big guilds =/= bunch of high geared stupid people with impossible requirements.
Big guilds =/= P2W aholes.
Big guilds =/= exploiters.
Time to get over that niche, sad how certain guilds make it look like the above is all there is.
The Holy Crusaders guild leader ♚ Mod 10 PVE Destroyer GWF guide ♚ Founding member of the Relentless Alliance
♚ The Holy Crusaders
English speaking
50+ members online on peak times.
PVE/PVP, yet more PVE oriented.
TS3 as voicechat (not required in general, required in large raids, speaking is not required.)
International (no specific playtime, all time zones are welcome.)
We consider ourselves competitive,
not too casual-friendly.
Level 70 players.2.5k+ Item level required.
What if smal guild nativ language is not english?
Not to talk about you cannot accept 20ppl cuz y dont have enugh space.
I liked the stronghold but with the new ad- system made for its impossible for smal guilds to grow up its impossible.
If noone will do somthing soon there will be max 10 big guild and some looser hou will never fit in those guilds.
What do you think lia hou can a newcomer get those req ??
And when your guild is filled up 100% what do you think ?
You will even push up those req .
After 200-250 days your guild will have rank 20 boons .
You char will look like a monster Godzilla vs lvl 1 zombies .
What will we have w/o the newcomers? Privat server??
I think solving this issue (smaller guilds impossibility to level up SH) will decrease significantly the issue of ppl joining/buying gear/leaving stated.
Think about it as looking for a job, you do not complain to different companies because their requirement does not fit you or does not fit average job seekers. While their requierment might seem impossible for you (e.g. 15+years in Network engineering, minimum MCSE with at least 10 years experience with UNIX platform), but to the veterans, these requirement might sounds just about right.
Guilds on the other hand, are just like companies, they have what some people want (pay/skill/learnings...etc), but to be in the company, you need to have equivilent skillsets, what can you contribute to the company?
Author of GWF Speed Demon PvP Build (Mod 11) <- Click to reveal the Speedy Beast! >:)
We talked about reqcruting in our guild what shoud be our message?
LF semi active members no i.lvl req no languale req no ts3 req no play time req age is not matter.
We are specific looking for Richi Rich hou can pay our stronghold
We dont need you if you are bis cuz you will not buy zen.
I, from other hand, put 100% into whatever im doing, i dont need to be the best, but i dont want jeopardize ppl who play with me. My point is, show u care, show u can give a part of yourself. If u would not care, u would not be here, whatever u say, u still being here says more...
New players have they stuff to do, they can join smaller guilds, but then, if they discover that they progress faster than they current guild, they may decide to get themself a better guild. But better guild is higher standards, they need to adjust to that. Better/biger guilds r not better/bigger (again in terms of structures) without reason.
(Sin)cerely
Kain
— (The unwritten rule)
For instance we stayed as we are, so we chose not to ask for any kind of contributions and we won't charge new guildies because they are new. We will probably see guild shoppers, but we still have a recruitment process with TS and a 1 month trial who will filter some of them.
I prefer having people contributing because they want to be part of the guild, and make things move rather than having players cashing just for joining and then not contributing.
I would like to thanks every one who posted on this thread because it helped me a lot about thinking what is important and remembered me that the guild spirit is what has made my guild cross the years.
And a special mention for the guy who seriously asked me to give up my guild lead
done thanks
So I see no point in protecting the level 4 market.
The true power of a high level Guild are the Boons.
And you loose the Boons again, if you leave the Guild.
So you don't need to protect yourself from jumpy players.
They only make you stronger, because a few might stay or add some resources to the Box.
And the only thing that you loose if the leave the guild is a helpful hand during the dragon fight.
they need over 120 banners for full set and limit to have is only 50. Many players dont want spend AD opening strongboxes, so they need to buy armor 3times. They dont want to scam you, because they will ask to join twice later....