No I wouldn't know because I don't have anything at legendary yet. I'm not going to rush it.
As you say, "PVE is brainded activity" so why should I rush it?
Don't see how that relates to my point about stretch611 stating people rush through levelling their artifacts too quickly that they sometimes aren't equipped to face PVE content. But, oh well.
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bioshrikeMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,729Arc User
Based of what you just said, it appears very clearly that you afford a luxury most of us cant afford.
Not all of us have the ability to play 9-12 hours everday to level up artifact, You said you use the slow but steady progress method, and getting an artifact to that level takes a **** amount of time.
Nothing personal but you are the type of players on here that are making things worst for everyone, how many time have you grinded LOL, Or the new tuern of shores skirmish? No matter how wrong things go we always have players like this who dont give a HAMSTER and they suck it up and will always get along with it just fine.
But you miss one valuable point - leveling up an artifact to legendary status *should* take a very long time. In fact, I'd go as far to say that the ability to achieve legendary status should be time-locked - in that you cannot get to legendary before X number of weeks or months. People race to get BiS gear, then complain that they have nothing to do - when it is their own fault that they didn't pace themselves.
I have 12 level 60 characters, some don't even have 2 pieces of an epic set, and the only artifact any of them have higher than blue is from the dragonborn pack. Sure, I can't steamroll all the content, but having that slim risk of being defeated means I have to try a bit harder. I don't have huge swaths of time to play, so I knock out a quests here or there to suit my schedule. I typically only have 3-5 spare enchants, pearls, or maybe a peridot or 2 to drop into refining an item, so the limitation is no big deal. I also have zero artifact weapons or items - again, only having time to fight the dragons once or twice a day, if that.
I really can't empathize with some of these complaints - not when there are people I'll help out that are still using green or blue gear, no weapon/armor enchants, and maybe a few R5's in other gear.
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I think the big problem here is two conflicting viewpoints in what constitutes the "Game" itself.
For me, that progression IS the Game. Once I have everything finished on a character, it is time for that character to retire and start a new one. The Game is over.
It would seem that for many of the folks (I.E. the very, very ANGRY folks) that this is the place where the Game BEGINS. All that stuff is just some series of pointless hoops that the Dev. Team makes you jump through for their own sadistic amusement.
And they have to make a Game that BOTH of us like.
Those who NEED EVERYTHING TO BE THE BEST RIGHT NOW OR I CAN'T PLAY THE GAME AT ALL AND EVERYTHING IS RUINED FOREVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And those who see the fact that we won't have our toons "Finished" for another three years of regular Gameplay as A GOOD THING.
The "Long Grind, but you can buy your way out of it if you really feel the need to" solution may not be the best, but it ain't the worst either.
'Wen considered the nature of time and understood that the universe is, instant by instant, recreated anew. Therefore, he understood, there is in truth no past, only a memory of the past. Blink your eyes, and the world you see next did not exist when you closed them. Therefore, he said, the only appropriate state of the mind is surprise. The only appropriate state of the heart is joy. The sky you see now, you have never seen before. The perfect moment is now. Be glad of it.' Terry Pratchet The Thief Of Time
People race to get BiS gear, then complain that they have nothing to do - when it is their own fault that they didn't pace themselves.]
No raiding. no tier 4 dungeons, no 10-man queuable content, no new PVP modes, no new PVP maps, no customizable housing, no guild integration, laughable foundry support, no farmable dungeons that payout....
Yeah...I think people have a right to complain whether they have 20k GS or 13k GS. Less to do with pace, more to do with lack of endgame content.
But you miss one valuable point - leveling up an artifact to legendary status *should* take a very long time. In fact, I'd go as far to say that the ability to achieve legendary status should be time-locked - in that you cannot get to legendary before X number of weeks or months.
Herein lies an interesting development conundrum. If it takes a long time to upgrade something that length of time may exceed the amount of time any given player will play Neverwinter for. Not everyone is in this for years. I have seven characters (one of each class), my highest level artifact is 60 and artifact weapon is 35, they only got that high because of the double RP weekend. I'm pretty confident I won't be playing Neverwinter long enough to ever get these to max level. Fortunately for me, I don't care in this case because it doesn't really matter but I imagine it could put people off.
It's one of the reasons I'm steering away from f2p games. I view the progression requirements to be increasing at the extremes of time or money to levels that exceed what I'm able or prepared to invest.
Interestingly for me I've played a game where a dev queried the player base regarding the length of time they play any one game for, I'd love to know what sort of answers he got.
Based of what you just said, it appears very clearly that you afford a luxury most of us cant afford.
Not all of us have the ability to play 9-12 hours everday to level up artifact, You said you use the slow but steady progress method, and getting an artifact to that level takes a **** amount of time.
Nothing personal but you are the type of players on here that are making things worst for everyone, how many time have you grinded LOL, Or the new tuern of shores skirmish? No matter how wrong things go we always have players like this who dont give a HAMSTER and they suck it up and will always get along with it just fine.
No no, when I say "level up an artifact" I mean to increase it by one single level (e.g. 71 to 72), not to increase it from Rare to Epic. Sorry for the confusion.
But you miss one valuable point - leveling up an artifact to legendary status *should* take a very long time. In fact, I'd go as far to say that the ability to achieve legendary status should be time-locked - in that you cannot get to legendary before X number of weeks or months. People race to get BiS gear, then complain that they have nothing to do - when it is their own fault that they didn't pace themselves.
I have 12 level 60 characters, some don't even have 2 pieces of an epic set, and the only artifact any of them have higher than blue is from the dragonborn pack. Sure, I can't steamroll all the content, but having that slim risk of being defeated means I have to try a bit harder. I don't have huge swaths of time to play, so I knock out a quests here or there to suit my schedule. I typically only have 3-5 spare enchants, pearls, or maybe a peridot or 2 to drop into refining an item, so the limitation is no big deal. I also have zero artifact weapons or items - again, only having time to fight the dragons once or twice a day, if that.
I really can't empathize with some of these complaints - not when there are people I'll help out that are still using green or blue gear, no weapon/armor enchants, and maybe a few R5's in other gear.
If you tried to level and arti weapon, just from drops, and were playing several hours a day. You would die of old age before you finished. It's just not possible. Once you get it to 40 or so it takes over a hundred thousand per level. There would be no legendaries ever. Well maybe if you handed down your toon generation to generation your grandchildren would one day inherit that legendary.
Ok ladies and gentleman, I was just wondering about a current issue. A new artifact or artifact weapon gets released. It is only usable on one character, you have to spend around 5 million worth of AD to get the RP able to refine it.
But wait! We can use equipment to refine these things. Oh wait, you spend hours farming CN to get a few purple items to drop in this artifact equipment and you are so pumped only to find out you get... 1200 rp? REALLY?
This is why you pick up greens. In a single CN run I can easily get from 10K to 20K RP just from greens alone! Of course this requires stopping a few times and refining them in to your piece of gear as your inventory will fill up multiple times, but it can and should be done.
Or, better yet, if you do not want to burden your group with your rolling on green stuff... Do foundries! That's right. On a level 60 a foundry will drop green and blue gear left and right. Its totally useless to a geared 60, but they can be dropped into any artifact piece of gear and you get a fun story line as well.
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No raiding. no tier 4 dungeons, no 10-man queuable content, no new PVP modes, no new PVP maps, no customizable housing, no guild integration, laughable foundry support, no farmable dungeons that payout....
Yeah...I think people have a right to complain whether they have 20k GS or 13k GS. Less to do with pace, more to do with lack of endgame content.
Oh people have every right to complain, just not about wanting orange pixels on an artifact weapon literally only days after they got it. It should take months to get that thing to orange/ legendary quality.
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...
Oh people have every right to complain, just not about wanting orange pixels on an artifact weapon literally only days after they got it. It should take months to get that thing to orange/ legendary quality.
It will unless you spend millions. I stopped leveling at epic because I realized buying an artifact belt off the AH and leveling it to epic costs less than leveling an epic weapon to legendary. It is truely a recockulous ammout of RP. Like many other items is is restricted to folks who have an awful lot of AD to throw around. Honestly if you have multis and don't play favorites several epic is cheaper than a legendary on your main.
Oh people have every right to complain, just not about wanting orange pixels on an artifact weapon literally only days after they got it. It should take months to get that thing to orange/ legendary quality.
They are complaining about the refinement system that is worse today than it was when this game launched
They are complaining about the refinement system that is worse today than it was when this game launched
Yep I compare the two systems but even when I make clear statements that show that it was better the old way, there's still someone saying that "oh but it's not supposed to be easy, stop asking for everything on a silver platter" completely missing the point that a new system is meant to be an improvement.
For the record, Before double RP weekend, I did not have more than 1 epic artifact on any toon. Actually until class artifacts were released in mod3, I only had 1 toon that had more than just the free artifact that you get with the level 21 artifact quest. I have been playing for over a year and yes, I have put a lot of hours into the game... but still I do not have anything "legendary." I have no perfect enchants, (I do have a few greaters at this point), and my toons have mostly rank 7s, a few rank 8s, and a rank 6 or two.
But here is the thing... You do not need more than what I have... with a t2 armor set, rank 7 enchants, a lesser weapon/armor enhancement, and just blue artifact(s), with a little skill, all the PvE content can be completed... in fact, the majority of the content is easy with this amount of gear (and can be done with less.) Legendaries, Rank 10s, and perfects make it overkill. Only PvP requires such major investments in gear, and that is only to match the gear of the people you will be fighting against. (and that is also why domination PvP is suicide for a fresh level 60.)
You do not need millions of ad to spend on getting rp to make legendaries, or farm for longer than the life expectancy of the game... you can do everything without them. As for getting the t2 gear, find a few friends or join a guild and run the dungeons until you get the gear you need. If you fail at first, try again the next night... as they say practice makes perfect, and I failed many, many times before I geared up.
It took time for me to get to the point I am at now, it does not need to happen overnight with everyone. If you want to get there quicker than I did, read a class guide and focus on one or two characters... you can get there even faster if you pay but you can only buy the gear, not the experience or skill that comes with taking your time.
Yep I compare the two systems but even when I make clear statements that show that it was better the old way, there's still someone saying that "oh but it's not supposed to be easy, stop asking for everything on a silver platter" completely missing the point that a new system is meant to be an improvement.
Good luck with that. The current refinement system was added in the same round of changes that brought us nerfed coal ward drops from the 7-day prayer boxes. Was some good and some bad. But so much anger over it. Many people hated the refining system. We told them then it was overly complicated. Others praised it saying it would lower the amount of bag space used up by enchants. They did scrap an AD cost off of it before it left preview. But ignored other complaints.
Its funny. I still recall someone saying the refinement system was just the beginning. They would use it for other things. That we would eventually have gear that we needed to feed other gear into to level up. Makes me wonder if that person still plays. Can almost hear the "I told you so". Now that we have artifact equipment.
Imo, the old system was simple. But I don't think we are going back to that. It just won't happen. So I think they need to simplify the current system. For starters get rid of the 5 slots for refining and let us drop stacks of refinement gems into items. Then reduce the amount of upgrade items for artifacts. One of the biggest selling points of the new refining system was less bag space. Adding in a completely different set of refining stones and multiple tiers of upgrade items negates that.
Good luck with that. The current refinement system was added in the same round of changes that brought us nerfed coal ward drops from the 7-day prayer boxes. Was some good and some bad. But so much anger over it. Many people hated the refining system. We told them then it was overly complicated. Others praised it saying it would lower the amount of bag space used up by enchants. They did scrap an AD cost off of it before it left preview. But ignored other complaints.
Its funny. I still recall someone saying the refinement system was just the beginning. They would use it for other things. That we would eventually have gear that we needed to feed other gear into to level up. Makes me wonder if that person still plays. Can almost hear the "I told you so". Now that we have artifact equipment.
Imo, the old system was simple. But I don't think we are going back to that. It just won't happen. So I think they need to simplify the current system. For starters get rid of the 5 slots for refining and let us drop stacks of refinement gems into items. Then reduce the amount of upgrade items for artifacts. One of the biggest selling points of the new refining system was less bag space. Adding in a completely different set of refining stones and multiple tiers of upgrade items negates that.
It still had some benefits like the reduced coal ward requirement that allowed people to see some benefit to it. Then of course they bound the hell out of them and nerfing the drop rate from coffers meaning that change was pretty much pointless apart from allowing them to charge the high cash shop price. It does however make it harder for people to get their first lesser enchants and of course the greater fey blessing/dragon hoard enchants would cost the same to make as making a normal version now as I've many times said here. I'm sure at the time I read that people supported the new system saying it was more cost efficient even with the ad upgrade cost. Having calculated ita while after that but still a while ago, I wonder how they came to that conclusion. Especially when bots were using an exploit to use the old way to make rank 5s.
That won't happen, and SHOULDN'T happen, because that would just REWARD BOTTERS.
I don't know why people don't get this.
So the logic is to have a bad system to punish botters? It's a game for people, you should have systems that are user friendly. The users come first, counter bots in less intrusive ways. Plus as mconosrep says, it's actually punishing players, not botters.
The system actually encourages people to buy stacks of enchants because the system is frankly rubbish.
So the logic is to have a bad system to punish botters? It's a game for people, you should have systems that are user friendly. The users come first, counter bots in less intrusive ways. Plus as mconosrep says, it's actually punishing players, not botters.
The system actually encourages people to buy stacks of enchants because the system is frankly rubbish.
The *large amount of RP necessary* to upgrade an artifact to necessary "encourages" people to buy stacks of enchants. (For the obsessive types who must must must have their artifacts to legendary right away, anyway.) The refining user interface, however, does NOT encourage people to buy stacks of enchants because there is only room for 5 items in the UI.
Is your issue with the large RP costs, or with the refining UI? I am not sure anymore.
Personally I like the refining UI as I can use it to refine items into my artifacts, and I don't have to lug around bags full of enchants and runes anymore. Now it could be improved upon, of course (removing the preservation ward from the UI after a failed attempt is kinda irritating, as you pointed out). But I would MUCH rather have the extra bag space instead of the old enchanting system. You would rather have the reverse. That is fine. But please don't just declare it to be "a bad system", in which all support of it is unreasonable and objectionable, when others may have legitimate opinions contrary to yours.
I don't mind (so much) the large RP costs for refining items because (a) legendary should REALLY MEAN "legendary", and (b) I don't feel pressured into upgrading everything right away to legendary. Sure I want to upgrade my primary artifact to legendary, that is a good idea. Sure I want to upgrade my artifact weapon to at least epic (and my artifact belt, if I ever get one). But the rest of it? It can wait. I am not in a big hurry. I wonder why there are so many people around here who ARE in such a big hurry. I sincerely don't get it.
Ok, I adjust my statement. It's a bad system for most players. If it works for you, great. I'm sure the vast majority would say that it's in poor design though. Pretty sure if they wanted to close the possibility of people getting legendaries right away that they wouldn't sell blood rubies in the zen store which kind of screams something we're not allowed to say.
A lot of my toons have many hundreds of very large chests, I'm neither going to carry on opening them filling my inventory full of junk and constantly sorting it out, or use the many stacks of rank 2s I get from them to refine my artifacts. I'm just going to vendor the hell out of them. Bad design.
New systems are often simpler and/or or more efficient. This is neither. It's a pain wasting time to upgrade artifacts with stacks of higher levelled rp, it is however a better choice than constantly maintaining your artifacts after enough drops where you get to the point where it practically gets you nowhere.
I don't really see the problem in using your earned AD to use the rp other people want to sell to refine your artifacts. Either way you've earned it. The belt and weapon in particular are kind of meh until epic. Legendary is obviously much better, but kind of has too much of an investment for most players.
Ok, I adjust my statement. It's a bad system for most players. If it works for you, great. I'm sure the vast majority would say that it's in poor design though. Pretty sure if they wanted to close the possibility of people getting legendaries right away that they wouldn't sell blood rubies in the zen store which kind of screams something we're not allowed to say.
I would say that it's a bad system for a few players with extreme methods. The vast majority is not concerned by your problems.
And if you used Blood rubies to get your artifacts to legendary, you wouldn't really bother about the 5 slots limitation.
Olaf, freelance guardian fighter.
Enorla, Oh so devoted cleric.
Is your issue with the large RP costs, or with the refining UI? I am not sure anymore.
My issue is with green and blue spam covering the screen after every fight on a dungeon run because they're scrambling for refinement points-I can't see what's in front of me. My issue is with anything that interrupts me playing the game and immersing myself in the experience, the lore, and yes even the music.
Yes, I know some people play with the sound completely off, and others have never read or never want to read the lore. I know people want to rush to the end of solo dungeons just to get to the rewards instead of enjoying the experience.
So 99 enchants at once? Bring it on, I can do a ton more foundries. Do away with gear as refinement points so i can enjoy dungeons again.
Venril Sathir- CW
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Lurch- GF
Mini Ven- DC
Ok ladies and gentleman, I was just wondering about a current issue. A new artifact or artifact weapon gets released. It is only usable on one character, you have to spend around 5 million worth of AD to get the RP able to refine it.
But wait! We can use equipment to refine these things. Oh wait, you spend hours farming CN to get a few purple items to drop in this artifact equipment and you are so pumped only to find out you get... 1200 rp? REALLY?
- If that is the direction the entire game is headed, to where I have to spend 5 million AD to max out any item I find, only for it to replaced/nerfed within a few weeks, then I think they really really drastically need to rethink their strategy.
Farming some of the hardest dungeons for less than 2k rp is... a joke guys. I just want to know if the community agrees or if they think this is a good idea?
Devs - please don't delete this, or move it, it is "discussing all things related to neverwinter"
My suggestion would be to increase the RP drastically. Everything is bind on pick up now, so maybe make those items worth more RP since we usually don't have much use for them and sometimes can't even sell them for 1 gold. I can't see why some of the best weapons shouldn't give 30-50k rp for the time spent.
I really like the game . There are way too many grinds though.
Easy to get to 60, then all the grinding starts. It's not just a few things, but most things are a big grind around here. Not sure how much time the game makers expect you to be doing certain tasks but they certainly want you to do it a loooooong time.
I wouldn't mind paying a bit if prices were more reasonable. In my opinion they are through the roof for digital items. Pay big or grind big the options it seems.
But here is the thing... You do not need more than what I have... with a t2 armor set, rank 7 enchants, a lesser weapon/armor enhancement, and just blue artifact(s), with a little skill, all the PvE content can be completed...
Only because they have failed in making new challenging PVE content which is why good players either take a long sabbatical from the game or switch to PVP
That won't happen, and SHOULDN'T happen, because that would just REWARD BOTTERS.
I don't know why people don't get this.
You can't keep from adding good stuff to the game just because some cheater might also benefit. They have to find a way to stop those people from the source. Without crippling their game to do it. If you take that route, you eventually wind up with something no one wants to play.
You miss the point, the system is there to punish the players feeding the botters (the ones buying 10s of 99's stacks in one time).
People / users, as you said, are mostly not affected.
Again, people are being overly simple about this. Not all the stacks of 99s in the AH are from bad stuff. I've said before that I wind up with multiple stacks of these things without cheating. I'm not some uber-player either, I'm sure plenty of others are in the same situation as me. Between leadership, dragon's hoard, lesser fey, events, and what actually just drops... I get stacks and stacks of stuff.
Most of the times I wind up using them myself. Sometimes though, if there is something I am needing I will sell them to get some AD. Its just annoying to use them. Sitting there forever dragging 5 at a time is a real pain. And again, if this is something they are doing to combat cheaters... then its dumb. You don't make your real customers frustrated just to weed out the bad ones. You have to find another way.
Comments
Don't see how that relates to my point about stretch611 stating people rush through levelling their artifacts too quickly that they sometimes aren't equipped to face PVE content. But, oh well.
But you miss one valuable point - leveling up an artifact to legendary status *should* take a very long time. In fact, I'd go as far to say that the ability to achieve legendary status should be time-locked - in that you cannot get to legendary before X number of weeks or months. People race to get BiS gear, then complain that they have nothing to do - when it is their own fault that they didn't pace themselves.
I have 12 level 60 characters, some don't even have 2 pieces of an epic set, and the only artifact any of them have higher than blue is from the dragonborn pack. Sure, I can't steamroll all the content, but having that slim risk of being defeated means I have to try a bit harder. I don't have huge swaths of time to play, so I knock out a quests here or there to suit my schedule. I typically only have 3-5 spare enchants, pearls, or maybe a peridot or 2 to drop into refining an item, so the limitation is no big deal. I also have zero artifact weapons or items - again, only having time to fight the dragons once or twice a day, if that.
I really can't empathize with some of these complaints - not when there are people I'll help out that are still using green or blue gear, no weapon/armor enchants, and maybe a few R5's in other gear.
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
For me, that progression IS the Game. Once I have everything finished on a character, it is time for that character to retire and start a new one. The Game is over.
It would seem that for many of the folks (I.E. the very, very ANGRY folks) that this is the place where the Game BEGINS. All that stuff is just some series of pointless hoops that the Dev. Team makes you jump through for their own sadistic amusement.
And they have to make a Game that BOTH of us like.
Those who NEED EVERYTHING TO BE THE BEST RIGHT NOW OR I CAN'T PLAY THE GAME AT ALL AND EVERYTHING IS RUINED FOREVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And those who see the fact that we won't have our toons "Finished" for another three years of regular Gameplay as A GOOD THING.
The "Long Grind, but you can buy your way out of it if you really feel the need to" solution may not be the best, but it ain't the worst either.
'Wen considered the nature of time and understood that the universe is, instant by instant, recreated anew. Therefore, he understood, there is in truth no past, only a memory of the past. Blink your eyes, and the world you see next did not exist when you closed them. Therefore, he said, the only appropriate state of the mind is surprise. The only appropriate state of the heart is joy. The sky you see now, you have never seen before. The perfect moment is now. Be glad of it.' Terry Pratchet The Thief Of Time
No raiding. no tier 4 dungeons, no 10-man queuable content, no new PVP modes, no new PVP maps, no customizable housing, no guild integration, laughable foundry support, no farmable dungeons that payout....
Yeah...I think people have a right to complain whether they have 20k GS or 13k GS. Less to do with pace, more to do with lack of endgame content.
Herein lies an interesting development conundrum. If it takes a long time to upgrade something that length of time may exceed the amount of time any given player will play Neverwinter for. Not everyone is in this for years. I have seven characters (one of each class), my highest level artifact is 60 and artifact weapon is 35, they only got that high because of the double RP weekend. I'm pretty confident I won't be playing Neverwinter long enough to ever get these to max level. Fortunately for me, I don't care in this case because it doesn't really matter but I imagine it could put people off.
It's one of the reasons I'm steering away from f2p games. I view the progression requirements to be increasing at the extremes of time or money to levels that exceed what I'm able or prepared to invest.
Interestingly for me I've played a game where a dev queried the player base regarding the length of time they play any one game for, I'd love to know what sort of answers he got.
This is so funny I can't stop laughing after reading this... LOL
No no, when I say "level up an artifact" I mean to increase it by one single level (e.g. 71 to 72), not to increase it from Rare to Epic. Sorry for the confusion.
If you tried to level and arti weapon, just from drops, and were playing several hours a day. You would die of old age before you finished. It's just not possible. Once you get it to 40 or so it takes over a hundred thousand per level. There would be no legendaries ever. Well maybe if you handed down your toon generation to generation your grandchildren would one day inherit that legendary.
This is why you pick up greens. In a single CN run I can easily get from 10K to 20K RP just from greens alone! Of course this requires stopping a few times and refining them in to your piece of gear as your inventory will fill up multiple times, but it can and should be done.
Or, better yet, if you do not want to burden your group with your rolling on green stuff... Do foundries! That's right. On a level 60 a foundry will drop green and blue gear left and right. Its totally useless to a geared 60, but they can be dropped into any artifact piece of gear and you get a fun story line as well.
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Oh people have every right to complain, just not about wanting orange pixels on an artifact weapon literally only days after they got it. It should take months to get that thing to orange/ legendary quality.
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It will unless you spend millions. I stopped leveling at epic because I realized buying an artifact belt off the AH and leveling it to epic costs less than leveling an epic weapon to legendary. It is truely a recockulous ammout of RP. Like many other items is is restricted to folks who have an awful lot of AD to throw around. Honestly if you have multis and don't play favorites several epic is cheaper than a legendary on your main.
They are complaining about the refinement system that is worse today than it was when this game launched
Yep I compare the two systems but even when I make clear statements that show that it was better the old way, there's still someone saying that "oh but it's not supposed to be easy, stop asking for everything on a silver platter" completely missing the point that a new system is meant to be an improvement.
But here is the thing... You do not need more than what I have... with a t2 armor set, rank 7 enchants, a lesser weapon/armor enhancement, and just blue artifact(s), with a little skill, all the PvE content can be completed... in fact, the majority of the content is easy with this amount of gear (and can be done with less.) Legendaries, Rank 10s, and perfects make it overkill. Only PvP requires such major investments in gear, and that is only to match the gear of the people you will be fighting against. (and that is also why domination PvP is suicide for a fresh level 60.)
You do not need millions of ad to spend on getting rp to make legendaries, or farm for longer than the life expectancy of the game... you can do everything without them. As for getting the t2 gear, find a few friends or join a guild and run the dungeons until you get the gear you need. If you fail at first, try again the next night... as they say practice makes perfect, and I failed many, many times before I geared up.
It took time for me to get to the point I am at now, it does not need to happen overnight with everyone. If you want to get there quicker than I did, read a class guide and focus on one or two characters... you can get there even faster if you pay but you can only buy the gear, not the experience or skill that comes with taking your time.
Murphster - SS CW | Jennsen Rahl - MoF CW
Taarna - GWF
Eowyn - Protector OP | Leela - Devoted OP
Mara Jade - TR
Leeloo - Tempt SW | Kahlan Amnell - Fury SW | Galadriel - Damnation SW
Sturm Nightblade - GF
Good luck with that. The current refinement system was added in the same round of changes that brought us nerfed coal ward drops from the 7-day prayer boxes. Was some good and some bad. But so much anger over it. Many people hated the refining system. We told them then it was overly complicated. Others praised it saying it would lower the amount of bag space used up by enchants. They did scrap an AD cost off of it before it left preview. But ignored other complaints.
Its funny. I still recall someone saying the refinement system was just the beginning. They would use it for other things. That we would eventually have gear that we needed to feed other gear into to level up. Makes me wonder if that person still plays. Can almost hear the "I told you so". Now that we have artifact equipment.
Imo, the old system was simple. But I don't think we are going back to that. It just won't happen. So I think they need to simplify the current system. For starters get rid of the 5 slots for refining and let us drop stacks of refinement gems into items. Then reduce the amount of upgrade items for artifacts. One of the biggest selling points of the new refining system was less bag space. Adding in a completely different set of refining stones and multiple tiers of upgrade items negates that.
It still had some benefits like the reduced coal ward requirement that allowed people to see some benefit to it. Then of course they bound the hell out of them and nerfing the drop rate from coffers meaning that change was pretty much pointless apart from allowing them to charge the high cash shop price. It does however make it harder for people to get their first lesser enchants and of course the greater fey blessing/dragon hoard enchants would cost the same to make as making a normal version now as I've many times said here. I'm sure at the time I read that people supported the new system saying it was more cost efficient even with the ad upgrade cost. Having calculated ita while after that but still a while ago, I wonder how they came to that conclusion. Especially when bots were using an exploit to use the old way to make rank 5s.
That won't happen, and SHOULDN'T happen, because that would just REWARD BOTTERS.
I don't know why people don't get this.
Because humans are so much better than bots at the current long-winded boring repetitive actions?
So the logic is to have a bad system to punish botters? It's a game for people, you should have systems that are user friendly. The users come first, counter bots in less intrusive ways. Plus as mconosrep says, it's actually punishing players, not botters.
The system actually encourages people to buy stacks of enchants because the system is frankly rubbish.
People / users, as you said, are mostly not affected.
Enorla, Oh so devoted cleric.
The *large amount of RP necessary* to upgrade an artifact to necessary "encourages" people to buy stacks of enchants. (For the obsessive types who must must must have their artifacts to legendary right away, anyway.) The refining user interface, however, does NOT encourage people to buy stacks of enchants because there is only room for 5 items in the UI.
Is your issue with the large RP costs, or with the refining UI? I am not sure anymore.
Personally I like the refining UI as I can use it to refine items into my artifacts, and I don't have to lug around bags full of enchants and runes anymore. Now it could be improved upon, of course (removing the preservation ward from the UI after a failed attempt is kinda irritating, as you pointed out). But I would MUCH rather have the extra bag space instead of the old enchanting system. You would rather have the reverse. That is fine. But please don't just declare it to be "a bad system", in which all support of it is unreasonable and objectionable, when others may have legitimate opinions contrary to yours.
I don't mind (so much) the large RP costs for refining items because (a) legendary should REALLY MEAN "legendary", and (b) I don't feel pressured into upgrading everything right away to legendary. Sure I want to upgrade my primary artifact to legendary, that is a good idea. Sure I want to upgrade my artifact weapon to at least epic (and my artifact belt, if I ever get one). But the rest of it? It can wait. I am not in a big hurry. I wonder why there are so many people around here who ARE in such a big hurry. I sincerely don't get it.
A lot of my toons have many hundreds of very large chests, I'm neither going to carry on opening them filling my inventory full of junk and constantly sorting it out, or use the many stacks of rank 2s I get from them to refine my artifacts. I'm just going to vendor the hell out of them. Bad design.
New systems are often simpler and/or or more efficient. This is neither. It's a pain wasting time to upgrade artifacts with stacks of higher levelled rp, it is however a better choice than constantly maintaining your artifacts after enough drops where you get to the point where it practically gets you nowhere.
I don't really see the problem in using your earned AD to use the rp other people want to sell to refine your artifacts. Either way you've earned it. The belt and weapon in particular are kind of meh until epic. Legendary is obviously much better, but kind of has too much of an investment for most players.
And if you used Blood rubies to get your artifacts to legendary, you wouldn't really bother about the 5 slots limitation.
Enorla, Oh so devoted cleric.
My issue is with green and blue spam covering the screen after every fight on a dungeon run because they're scrambling for refinement points-I can't see what's in front of me. My issue is with anything that interrupts me playing the game and immersing myself in the experience, the lore, and yes even the music.
Yes, I know some people play with the sound completely off, and others have never read or never want to read the lore. I know people want to rush to the end of solo dungeons just to get to the rewards instead of enjoying the experience.
So 99 enchants at once? Bring it on, I can do a ton more foundries. Do away with gear as refinement points so i can enjoy dungeons again.
Venril- SW
Lurch- GF
Mini Ven- DC
I really like the game . There are way too many grinds though.
Easy to get to 60, then all the grinding starts. It's not just a few things, but most things are a big grind around here. Not sure how much time the game makers expect you to be doing certain tasks but they certainly want you to do it a loooooong time.
I wouldn't mind paying a bit if prices were more reasonable. In my opinion they are through the roof for digital items. Pay big or grind big the options it seems.
Takes the "roleplaying" out of the MMORPG and makes it an ummmm, MMOG?
Venril- SW
Lurch- GF
Mini Ven- DC
Only because they have failed in making new challenging PVE content which is why good players either take a long sabbatical from the game or switch to PVP
You can't keep from adding good stuff to the game just because some cheater might also benefit. They have to find a way to stop those people from the source. Without crippling their game to do it. If you take that route, you eventually wind up with something no one wants to play.
Again, people are being overly simple about this. Not all the stacks of 99s in the AH are from bad stuff. I've said before that I wind up with multiple stacks of these things without cheating. I'm not some uber-player either, I'm sure plenty of others are in the same situation as me. Between leadership, dragon's hoard, lesser fey, events, and what actually just drops... I get stacks and stacks of stuff.
Most of the times I wind up using them myself. Sometimes though, if there is something I am needing I will sell them to get some AD. Its just annoying to use them. Sitting there forever dragging 5 at a time is a real pain. And again, if this is something they are doing to combat cheaters... then its dumb. You don't make your real customers frustrated just to weed out the bad ones. You have to find another way.