The BEST way to do "loot" for future modules : DETAILED

ayroux

I think we can ALL agree the loot system in this game has not been all that great since OB. The BEST I think its ever been is upon release when dungeon runs for BIS gear and CN runs for BIS weapons were the norm. When zone was full of "LFG" and there was alot of reward to run dungeons with a group.

Each module has presented something VASTLY different with loot style.

Module 1:
- failed because the MC GEAR was purchased with currency (NOT a drop), and each classes MAIN hand was crafted (not a drop) via professions - materials dropped but were BOE, with each classes OFF hand dropping from different bosses.

This made it VERY hard as say a GWF trying to find a group that didnt JUST want to do the first two bosses (because all other classes had a chance at their own drops prior to a VERY long boss fight)

Module 2:
Valindra's Tower was 15 minutes TOPs, an easy dungeon with a weapon set that could be obtained by a chest. Of all the modules, this may have been the best "loot" system but the dungeon was poor design.

Module 3:
This is basically PURE RNG/Grind fest. BIS gear had NO correlation to running dungeons, sorry - epic skirmish, and was a PURE function of luck and MASSIVE grinding heroic encounters with many players STILL not having the items they wanted.

Module 4:
Again frustrating because Draconic gear is worthless (worse than BI gear for most) and the best weapon is RNG from a final tier boon with a cooldown on it. Talk about a LAME way to get gear. THEN it must be leveled and NOT from PLAYING content but actually PAYING to level it.


PROPOSED LOOT SYSTEM:
What NEEDS to happen is this.
1) Create a NEW dungeon (or make harder versions of old ones) in which bosses drop the SAME item for EACH class.

Boss 1) has a chance to drop EVERY classes boots. Guaranteed SOMEONES boots will drop.
Boss 2) Gloves. 100% chance to drop A pair of gloves, again BOP.
ETC ETC

FINAL BOSS) Drops A weapon piece (much like CN) - could be off hand, could be main hand. But its a guaranteed drop of SOME sorts.

CHEST: Drops RP stones. GOOD ones, maybe some other HAMSTER like potions or crapy T1 items for RP.


MARKS: Some type of currency ALSO drops off each boss. That with enough farming you can PURCHASE ANY item from the loot tables.

What this means is something LIKE each boss drops a "Loot Crystal". So a full run grants you like 5 of these. Then allow GEAR to be purchased (liek MC gear) for these Crystals. Basically, if you DONT get it RNG, you can slowly work towards BUYING it.

THIS is the best system BECAUSE:
1) Gives incentive to run DUNGEONS again
2) Allows players TWO methods of getting gear: RNG, Currency
3) Awards RP for artifacts upon completion (I am thinking here the epic ones for 50k RP each)

NOW you will have ALOT of people FARMING dungeons again.

Implement a ROLL system where: NEED = BOP. GREED = BOE. So it allows farm teams to farm and SELL gear on the AH, it allows people who NEED items to get the item if they want or need it but its BOP.

This brings life back into the community again!!!!!


Ideally youd have multiple dungeons and just liek T1/T2s each one had only the FINAL boss drop a set piece item. OR you can take a dungeon like CN - make it a 10 man dungeon and implement a strategy LIKE this on a "raid" schedule say once per week. Just a few ideas.

ikapamk

Honestly, I love this idea. I completely gave up on trying to farm BI and Drac gear because it was worthless for my build and, unlike T1/2 gear, didn't spread its stats across the set, but left them in a hodge-podge of numbers and assignments. To add insult to injury, the RNG/HE system was a little frustrating.

It would be nice to return to DD runs for gear myself, rather than for just new guildies or kicks.

izidius

ayroux wrote: »

I think we can ALL agree the loot system in this game has not been all that great since OB. The BEST I think its ever been is upon release when dungeon runs for BIS gear and CN runs for BIS weapons were the norm. When zone was full of "LFG" and there was alot of reward to run dungeons with a group.

Each module has presented something VASTLY different with loot style.

Module 1:
- failed because the MC GEAR was purchased with currency (NOT a drop), and each classes MAIN hand was crafted (not a drop) via professions - materials dropped but were BOE, with each classes OFF hand dropping from different bosses.

This made it VERY hard as say a GWF trying to find a group that didnt JUST want to do the first two bosses (because all other classes had a chance at their own drops prior to a VERY long boss fight)

Module 2:
Valindra's Tower was 15 minutes TOPs, an easy dungeon with a weapon set that could be obtained by a chest. Of all the modules, this may have been the best "loot" system but the dungeon was poor design.

Module 3:
This is basically PURE RNG/Grind fest. BIS gear had NO correlation to running dungeons, sorry - epic skirmish, and was a PURE function of luck and MASSIVE grinding heroic encounters with many players STILL not having the items they wanted.

Module 4:
Again frustrating because Draconic gear is worthless (worse than BI gear for most) and the best weapon is RNG from a final tier boon with a cooldown on it. Talk about a LAME way to get gear. THEN it must be leveled and NOT from PLAYING content but actually PAYING to level it.


PROPOSED LOOT SYSTEM:
What NEEDS to happen is this.
1) Create a NEW dungeon (or make harder versions of old ones) in which bosses drop the SAME item for EACH class.

Boss 1) has a chance to drop EVERY classes boots. Guaranteed SOMEONES boots will drop.
Boss 2) Gloves. 100% chance to drop A pair of gloves, again BOP.
ETC ETC

FINAL BOSS) Drops A weapon piece (much like CN) - could be off hand, could be main hand. But its a guaranteed drop of SOME sorts.

CHEST: Drops RP stones. GOOD ones, maybe some other HAMSTER like potions or crapy T1 items for RP.


MARKS: Some type of currency ALSO drops off each boss. That with enough farming you can PURCHASE ANY item from the loot tables.

What this means is something LIKE each boss drops a "Loot Crystal". So a full run grants you like 5 of these. Then allow GEAR to be purchased (liek MC gear) for these Crystals. Basically, if you DONT get it RNG, you can slowly work towards BUYING it.

THIS is the best system BECAUSE:
1) Gives incentive to run DUNGEONS again
2) Allows players TWO methods of getting gear: RNG, Currency
3) Awards RP for artifacts upon completion (I am thinking here the epic ones for 50k RP each)

NOW you will have ALOT of people FARMING dungeons again.

Implement a ROLL system where: NEED = BOP. GREED = BOE. So it allows farm teams to farm and SELL gear on the AH, it allows people who NEED items to get the item if they want or need it but its BOP.

This brings life back into the community again!!!!!


Ideally youd have multiple dungeons and just liek T1/T2s each one had only the FINAL boss drop a set piece item. OR you can take a dungeon like CN - make it a 10 man dungeon and implement a strategy LIKE this on a "raid" schedule say once per week. Just a few ideas.

Someone hire this guy!

query523

ayroux wrote: »

PROPOSED LOOT SYSTEM:
What NEEDS to happen is this.
1) Create a NEW dungeon (or make harder versions of old ones) in which bosses drop the SAME item for EACH class.

Boss 1) has a chance to drop EVERY classes boots. Guaranteed SOMEONES boots will drop.
Boss 2) Gloves. 100% chance to drop A pair of gloves, again BOP.
ETC ETC

FINAL BOSS) Drops A weapon piece (much like CN) - could be off hand, could be main hand. But its a guaranteed drop of SOME sorts

The only problem I see is in this part. 5 players could run the content a dozen times and be done as far as the new equipment goes. That's what I would do. Grab 4 friends and just repeat grind it until we were all geared.

sprawlfx

I'd not complain if they did this. There is probably a better way, but this would sure be better than what's been happening.. or not happening, as the case may be.

bioshrike

Personally, I'd like to see the selection of items the Unicorn and Drake seal vendors have for sale get expanded. In the case of Drake seal items, (which are kind of like T1.5 items), how about adding a unique T1 set (with 2-piece and full set bonuses)? Add more rings, belts, some alternative main and offhand items, etc. Also add some refining items (BtA) and maybe even preservation and coalescent wards, (for something like 250 and 1000 seals, respectively - also BtA).

geeq5

Really good idead!

But with the way things have gone, first artifacts, then artifacts weapons, and belts, it appears what we might get next are artifacts rings.

No disrespect but i dont think this game is ever going to be back in the state it was in around Mod 1, the Glory days.
Hate to say this but it appears that from now on all we will be getting are RNG, and time consuming based items from the game. for example Artifacts weapons, and belts. pain to get and an even bigger pain to upgrade them.

zshikara

I personally love this idea. Only thing I don't agree with is that you think VT was badly designed. I actually like the way that dungeon is.

Everything else I agree with! Make this change to loot!

rashylewizz

ayroux wrote: »

Ideally youd have multiple dungeons and just liek T1/T2s each one had only the FINAL boss drop a set piece item. OR you can take a dungeon like CN - make it a 10 man dungeon and implement a strategy LIKE this on a "raid" schedule say once per week. Just a few ideas.

Please make this happen.

God knows this game needs some challenging endgame PVE content

juttetsu

+1 I like/agree everything you said here. I think you hit on some great things and the ideas would make some positive changes.

godhric

Need = BoP/BoC, Greed = BoE
I love that idea!

Also, the ability to "work towards" getting any gear for that dungeon by using the currency seriously reduce getting RNG wrath for any player! Genius!

ayroux

query523 wrote: »

The only problem I see is in this part. 5 players could run the content a dozen times and be done as far as the new equipment goes. That's what I would do. Grab 4 friends and just repeat grind it until we were all geared.

Yeah I thought about this as well. So I thought you could just create a "daily quest" to run these dungeons, so they can only be run once per day. Almost like the solo-dungeons were for module 1 or module 2.

That way it cant be farmed as fast, and creates a HUGE desire to run the dungeon each day when possible because players CANT farm it constantly.

veshorok

ayroux wrote: »

So I thought you could just create a "daily quest" to run these dungeons, so they can only be run once per day. Almost like the solo-dungeons were for module 1 or module 2.

That way it cant be farmed as fast, and creates a HUGE desire to run the dungeon each day when possible because players CANT farm it constantly.

a good idea gives place to a better one.
i do really wish they could hire you.
tho my prediction is not that rosy. somehow we're stuck in a RNG universe..that's really sad. the idea of another CN-like dungeon was disclaimed many times in the forum and still..sigh

urterror

ayroux wrote: »

...
THIS is the best system BECAUSE:
1) Gives incentive to run DUNGEONS again
2) Allows players TWO methods of getting gear: RNG, Currency
3) Awards RP for artifacts upon completion (I am thinking here the epic ones for 50k RP each)

NOW you will have ALOT of people FARMING dungeons again.

Implement a ROLL system where: NEED = BOP. GREED = BOE. So it allows farm teams to farm and SELL gear on the AH, it allows people who NEED items to get the item if they want or need it but its BOP.

This brings life back into the community again!!!!!


Ideally youd have multiple dungeons and just liek T1/T2s each one had only the FINAL boss drop a set piece item. OR you can take a dungeon like CN - make it a 10 man dungeon and implement a strategy LIKE this on a "raid" schedule say once per week. Just a few ideas.

group5e

query523 wrote: »

The only problem I see is in this part. 5 players could run the content a dozen times and be done as far as the new equipment goes. That's what I would do. Grab 4 friends and just repeat grind it until we were all geared.

Implement a 20 minute cooldown on each dungeon so you can't spam the dungeon 100x per day.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

jasonbhoy7

I still don't have black ice gaunts on gf, hr, tr, dc or gwf only one I got lucky with was my pvp cw, which I got on very first day at very first remo.

kolatmaster

Seems like a solid idea to me...

belerofonte9

ayroux wrote: »

Yeah I thought about this as well. So I thought you could just create a "daily quest" to run these dungeons, so they can only be run once per day. Almost like the solo-dungeons were for module 1 or module 2.

That way it cant be farmed as fast, and creates a HUGE desire to run the dungeon each day when possible because players CANT farm it constantly.

With this i buy your idea.

RNG and/or Currency for All Gear + New conditions for Need/Greed = A dream come true.

I hope someone reads all this and use it.

thefabricant

ayroux wrote: »

I think we can ALL agree the loot system in this game has not been all that great since OB. The BEST I think its ever been is upon release when dungeon runs for BIS gear and CN runs for BIS weapons were the norm. When zone was full of "LFG" and there was alot of reward to run dungeons with a group.

Each module has presented something VASTLY different with loot style.

Module 1:
- failed because the MC GEAR was purchased with currency (NOT a drop), and each classes MAIN hand was crafted (not a drop) via professions - materials dropped but were BOE, with each classes OFF hand dropping from different bosses.

This made it VERY hard as say a GWF trying to find a group that didnt JUST want to do the first two bosses (because all other classes had a chance at their own drops prior to a VERY long boss fight)

Module 2:
Valindra's Tower was 15 minutes TOPs, an easy dungeon with a weapon set that could be obtained by a chest. Of all the modules, this may have been the best "loot" system but the dungeon was poor design.

Module 3:
This is basically PURE RNG/Grind fest. BIS gear had NO correlation to running dungeons, sorry - epic skirmish, and was a PURE function of luck and MASSIVE grinding heroic encounters with many players STILL not having the items they wanted.

Module 4:
Again frustrating because Draconic gear is worthless (worse than BI gear for most) and the best weapon is RNG from a final tier boon with a cooldown on it. Talk about a LAME way to get gear. THEN it must be leveled and NOT from PLAYING content but actually PAYING to level it.


PROPOSED LOOT SYSTEM:
What NEEDS to happen is this.
1) Create a NEW dungeon (or make harder versions of old ones) in which bosses drop the SAME item for EACH class.

Boss 1) has a chance to drop EVERY classes boots. Guaranteed SOMEONES boots will drop.
Boss 2) Gloves. 100% chance to drop A pair of gloves, again BOP.
ETC ETC

FINAL BOSS) Drops A weapon piece (much like CN) - could be off hand, could be main hand. But its a guaranteed drop of SOME sorts.

CHEST: Drops RP stones. GOOD ones, maybe some other HAMSTER like potions or crapy T1 items for RP.


MARKS: Some type of currency ALSO drops off each boss. That with enough farming you can PURCHASE ANY item from the loot tables.

What this means is something LIKE each boss drops a "Loot Crystal". So a full run grants you like 5 of these. Then allow GEAR to be purchased (liek MC gear) for these Crystals. Basically, if you DONT get it RNG, you can slowly work towards BUYING it.

THIS is the best system BECAUSE:
1) Gives incentive to run DUNGEONS again
2) Allows players TWO methods of getting gear: RNG, Currency
3) Awards RP for artifacts upon completion (I am thinking here the epic ones for 50k RP each)

NOW you will have ALOT of people FARMING dungeons again.

Implement a ROLL system where: NEED = BOP. GREED = BOE. So it allows farm teams to farm and SELL gear on the AH, it allows people who NEED items to get the item if they want or need it but its BOP.

This brings life back into the community again!!!!!


Ideally youd have multiple dungeons and just liek T1/T2s each one had only the FINAL boss drop a set piece item. OR you can take a dungeon like CN - make it a 10 man dungeon and implement a strategy LIKE this on a "raid" schedule say once per week. Just a few ideas.

Agreed. Also, with dungeons like this, if you make them challenging and have 5 bosses you can potentially make them longer then CN was originally intended to be, with a few extra optional bosses for other items as well for people who wanted to be super grindy. If you look at CN, even though its a relatively easy dungeon and even though all the gear is BoE, a lot of its pieces still hold significant value. This shows that even if a dungeon is grind able, if it well designed then the loot within it will still hold value. Alternatively, if the dungeon was designed like spellplague, with kill x mobs and destroy y spawning pits, then it would force people to slow down their runs and the items in the dungeon would retain their value for longer because people are lazy.

mc2messiah

+1 for the need/greed system !

oldbaldyone

+100

Nobody likes running a dungeon a billion times to get a piece of gear, so making progress (even if it is small programs via seals) is better than simply beating your head against a proverbial wall.

I'd also add, replace chests with automatically assigned quests that award a bag with the rewards (if a selection of three items is required, pretty sure the UI can handle that). The moment the last boss dies (regardless of where you end up being when that happens) you can turn in the quest to get the rewards. This would completely eliminate the Boss Dies, Player Kicked, Can't Grab Chest problem.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

geeq5

magenubbie wrote: »

Except for the fact that this community (in general) will rather kick you than allow you to need on anything even if it becomes BoP (which doesn't matter if you need the piece).

How is this relevant in this thread?
Also players that joined a greed run, and then end up needing deserve to get kicked out, if you dont want to greed then dont join a greed party.

I dont give a **** if the item is BoP, if we agreed on a greed run, then it is a greed run, need and you will get kicked out. it that simple!

diogene0

Guaranteed drop won't work, unless it's a weekly dungeon or something. Cryptic has forgotten how to make challenging content, and if they remember it there will be people farming it 15h a day making these loots worthless. We need the boe stuff though, ust in reasonable amounts if it's BiS. I miss having BoE junk loot i can trade to alts. That's the cool part of T2s. So either time gating content with a weekly quest to run it so that parts keep some value, or add junk loot. Purple junk. Blue sucks.

schweifer1982

ayroux wrote: »

I think we can ALL agree the loot system in this game has not been all that great since OB. The BEST I think its ever been is upon release when dungeon runs for BIS gear and CN runs for BIS weapons were the norm. When zone was full of "LFG" and there was alot of reward to run dungeons with a group.

Each module has presented something VASTLY different with loot style.

Module 1:
- failed because the MC GEAR was purchased with currency (NOT a drop), and each classes MAIN hand was crafted (not a drop) via professions - materials dropped but were BOE, with each classes OFF hand dropping from different bosses.

This made it VERY hard as say a GWF trying to find a group that didnt JUST want to do the first two bosses (because all other classes had a chance at their own drops prior to a VERY long boss fight)

Module 2:
Valindra's Tower was 15 minutes TOPs, an easy dungeon with a weapon set that could be obtained by a chest. Of all the modules, this may have been the best "loot" system but the dungeon was poor design.

Module 3:
This is basically PURE RNG/Grind fest. BIS gear had NO correlation to running dungeons, sorry - epic skirmish, and was a PURE function of luck and MASSIVE grinding heroic encounters with many players STILL not having the items they wanted.



Module 4:
Again frustrating because Draconic gear is worthless (worse than BI gear for most) and the best weapon is RNG from a final tier boon with a cooldown on it. Talk about a LAME way to get gear. THEN it must be leveled and NOT from PLAYING content but actually PAYING to level it.


PROPOSED LOOT SYSTEM:
What NEEDS to happen is this.
1) Create a NEW dungeon (or make harder versions of old ones) in which bosses drop the SAME item for EACH class.

Boss 1) has a chance to drop EVERY classes boots. Guaranteed SOMEONES boots will drop.
Boss 2) Gloves. 100% chance to drop A pair of gloves, again BOP.
ETC ETC

FINAL BOSS) Drops A weapon piece (much like CN) - could be off hand, could be main hand. But its a guaranteed drop of SOME sorts.

CHEST: Drops RP stones. GOOD ones, maybe some other HAMSTER like potions or crapy T1 items for RP.


MARKS: Some type of currency ALSO drops off each boss. That with enough farming you can PURCHASE ANY item from the loot tables.

What this means is something LIKE each boss drops a "Loot Crystal". So a full run grants you like 5 of these. Then allow GEAR to be purchased (liek MC gear) for these Crystals. Basically, if you DONT get it RNG, you can slowly work towards BUYING it.

THIS is the best system BECAUSE:
1) Gives incentive to run DUNGEONS again
2) Allows players TWO methods of getting gear: RNG, Currency
3) Awards RP for artifacts upon completion (I am thinking here the epic ones for 50k RP each)

NOW you will have ALOT of people FARMING dungeons again.

Implement a ROLL system where: NEED = BOP. GREED = BOE. So it allows farm teams to farm and SELL gear on the AH, it allows people who NEED items to get the item if they want or need it but its BOP.

This brings life back into the community again!!!!!


Ideally youd have multiple dungeons and just liek T1/T2s each one had only the FINAL boss drop a set piece item. OR you can take a dungeon like CN - make it a 10 man dungeon and implement a strategy LIKE this on a "raid" schedule say once per week. Just a few ideas.

Awesome suggestion .
I only hope they see this too.

rashylewizz

Devs are you reading this?

No more daily-oriented modules, more endgame oriented modules.

asmodeus451

I"m Commander Shepard, and this is my favorite thread on the forums.

abecassis

ayroux wrote: »

Everything that was said is awesome

They should have hired you a long time ago. I see your suggestions on this site always and they are awesome and everyone agrees with you.

nezraal

ayroux wrote: »

I think we can ALL agree the loot system in this game has not been all that great since OB. The BEST I think its ever been is upon release when dungeon runs for BIS gear and CN runs for BIS weapons were the norm. When zone was full of "LFG" and there was alot of reward to run dungeons with a group.

Each module has presented something VASTLY different with loot style.

Module 1:
- failed because the MC GEAR was purchased with currency (NOT a drop), and each classes MAIN hand was crafted (not a drop) via professions - materials dropped but were BOE, with each classes OFF hand dropping from different bosses.

This made it VERY hard as say a GWF trying to find a group that didnt JUST want to do the first two bosses (because all other classes had a chance at their own drops prior to a VERY long boss fight)

Module 2:
Valindra's Tower was 15 minutes TOPs, an easy dungeon with a weapon set that could be obtained by a chest. Of all the modules, this may have been the best "loot" system but the dungeon was poor design.

Module 3:
This is basically PURE RNG/Grind fest. BIS gear had NO correlation to running dungeons, sorry - epic skirmish, and was a PURE function of luck and MASSIVE grinding heroic encounters with many players STILL not having the items they wanted.

Module 4:
Again frustrating because Draconic gear is worthless (worse than BI gear for most) and the best weapon is RNG from a final tier boon with a cooldown on it. Talk about a LAME way to get gear. THEN it must be leveled and NOT from PLAYING content but actually PAYING to level it.


PROPOSED LOOT SYSTEM:
What NEEDS to happen is this.
1) Create a NEW dungeon (or make harder versions of old ones) in which bosses drop the SAME item for EACH class.

Boss 1) has a chance to drop EVERY classes boots. Guaranteed SOMEONES boots will drop.
Boss 2) Gloves. 100% chance to drop A pair of gloves, again BOP.
ETC ETC

FINAL BOSS) Drops A weapon piece (much like CN) - could be off hand, could be main hand. But its a guaranteed drop of SOME sorts.

CHEST: Drops RP stones. GOOD ones, maybe some other HAMSTER like potions or crapy T1 items for RP.


MARKS: Some type of currency ALSO drops off each boss. That with enough farming you can PURCHASE ANY item from the loot tables.

What this means is something LIKE each boss drops a "Loot Crystal". So a full run grants you like 5 of these. Then allow GEAR to be purchased (liek MC gear) for these Crystals. Basically, if you DONT get it RNG, you can slowly work towards BUYING it.

THIS is the best system BECAUSE:
1) Gives incentive to run DUNGEONS again
2) Allows players TWO methods of getting gear: RNG, Currency
3) Awards RP for artifacts upon completion (I am thinking here the epic ones for 50k RP each)

NOW you will have ALOT of people FARMING dungeons again.

Implement a ROLL system where: NEED = BOP. GREED = BOE. So it allows farm teams to farm and SELL gear on the AH, it allows people who NEED items to get the item if they want or need it but its BOP.

This brings life back into the community again!!!!!


Ideally youd have multiple dungeons and just liek T1/T2s each one had only the FINAL boss drop a set piece item. OR you can take a dungeon like CN - make it a 10 man dungeon and implement a strategy LIKE this on a "raid" schedule say once per week. Just a few ideas.

Excellent!

abecassis

Seriously Cryptic employees. Im starting to feel sorry for the community still sticking by your game. They most certainly are because they spent a lot of money or they feel they spent too much time with the characters to just leave. Please consider this mans suggestions as they are awesome and should definitely be how loot is given in other games, decent games.