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Tyranny of Dragons Preview Patch Notes NW.25.20140923a.5

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  • damnataanimusdamnataanimus Member Posts: 446 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    thedemien wrote: »
    I agree with you. Problem with CW kings will remain. Too much of control and damage at the same time.
    Except that you can still replace DC with temp SW. I still find my 14k-15k GS SW more useful in DD run then my 20k gs HR or any DC/TR/GWF. SW does enough damage to keep party alive in dungeons where burst heal is not required even without TT(did it couple of times since did not know about TT bug first) . But this is a bit of topic.

    Yep we can definately heal well no question of that - ive finished ALL campaigns on my SW (just got shar and ToD today actually) so ive got like 16% incoming heal bonus and along with 18% lifesteal and I have seen 72k heals fly off other people ebfore when I fiery bolt a pack of mobs xD

    However only problem is we cant buff mit though, so a lot of partys prefer that over the temp heals - esp newbie groups. Experienced groups hard to say but i think DC probably wins again bc they can buff damage too. Its def viable of course, and we do heal more than a dc does but exp group don't need heals as much as buffs overall. I do think though with incoming DC changes that probably wont true for long though either :p
    May the RNG Gods smile on you today!
    Adorable Temptress - 23.4k Temptation SW
    Mara Angelbane - 22k Thaum CW, Vaya Con Dios 15.2k Dragon CW.
    Mara Shadowskiss - 21.5k Destroyer GWF, Mara - 17.2k Sentinel GWF
    Mara Duskwalker - 15.4k Healing DC
    Mara Hawkeye -14.6k HR
    Mara Spiritforge - 16.9k Tanky GF
    Bad Religion - 14.7k Pew Pew DC
    Mara Shadowstouch,Maara - TR's
  • belerofonte9belerofonte9 Member Posts: 47 Arc User
    edited October 2014

    Remember that this is coming with the Cleric rework, which is a pretty major overhaul of how they perform.

    Sending my DC to the preview as we speak.

    "Waiting for testing" mode=ON.

    PS: Thx for the reply gentlemancrush.
  • tardstelamon01brtardstelamon01br Banned Users Posts: 24 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    zvieris wrote: »
    No, it does not. WMS has buff for encounter powers through feat, lowers damage resistance for at-wills, has no cooldown and does great damage. And on top of that you want marking!? Are you fragging serious here? There's a reason why Threatening Rush does such low damage and has such a long cooldown.

    WMS last few sec,mark lasts 20
    TR can close gap,WMS dont
    u cant miss with TR while WMS is hard to land
    mark feat also incrase dailys dmg by 15% while wms only encounters by 10%
    mark ignore 20% of target DR means IVs can run w,o arp

    or else they could buff Staying Power destroyer feat to deal 25% more dmg(all dmg not just encounters) to targets debuffed by wms and also incrase the buff duration b 2/4/6/8/10 seconds this would make SM our trully dps path.

    Note: 1 last thing that bothers me since m2 about iron vanguards why in the hell destroyer have feat for ferocious reaction passive which is defensive not offensive class feature?
  • packrat0packrat0 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 132 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Hey Crush, when you say that Dragon Glyphs don't proc on reflect damage, does that include SoS?
    (I ask because, as I understand it, reflect damage is damage whose output value is dependent upon the incoming damage value, and I don't believe SoS works that way. Would like to be corrected on any of this if it is wrong.)
  • damnataanimusdamnataanimus Member Posts: 446 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    WMS last few sec,mark lasts 20
    TR can close gap,WMS dont
    u cant miss with TR while WMS is hard to land
    mark feat also incrase dailys dmg by 15% while wms only encounters by 10%
    mark ignore 20% of target DR means IVs can run w,o arp

    or else they could buff Staying Power destroyer feat to deal 25% more dmg(all dmg not just encounters) to targets debuffed by wms and also incrase the buff duration b 1/2/3/4/5 seconds this would make SM our trully dps path.

    Note: 1 last thing that bothers me since m2 about iron vanguards why in the hell destroyer have feat for ferocious reaction passive which is defensive not offensive class feature?

    asking since crush seems to be active on forums nowdays:)

    You really shouldnt in/directly ask devs for a reply - its against forum ToS and our beloved forum mods might take offence :P

    And I am way off topic here and probably should quit posting while I am ahead :p
    May the RNG Gods smile on you today!
    Adorable Temptress - 23.4k Temptation SW
    Mara Angelbane - 22k Thaum CW, Vaya Con Dios 15.2k Dragon CW.
    Mara Shadowskiss - 21.5k Destroyer GWF, Mara - 17.2k Sentinel GWF
    Mara Duskwalker - 15.4k Healing DC
    Mara Hawkeye -14.6k HR
    Mara Spiritforge - 16.9k Tanky GF
    Bad Religion - 14.7k Pew Pew DC
    Mara Shadowstouch,Maara - TR's
  • throsbithrosbi Member Posts: 291 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Items and Economy
    •The Tyranny of Dragons vendors (both the one located in Protector's Enclave and the one available via the Campaigns window) now feature two new items. Give them a try!
    •Potion of Dragon Slaying
    •Scroll of Protection from Dragons

    I like this. Something to eat up the coins while farming the dragons instead of just throwing them in the trash. ;)
  • katbozejziemikatbozejziemi Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 856 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    The reason for the SoS change to prevent AP gain is that we don't wait dailies that act as persistent buffs allowing you to gain AP while they are active (Lurkers Assault is a great example here). If SoS is unviable given that change, then we probably need to buff it separately to make it feel more rewarding in a reflect scenario. Also, Armor Penetration should totally affect it now, if it is not, please let me know so we can get that fixed.

    Additionally, the Icy Rays change is to make it respect Orb of Imposition. With Orb equipped at R3 you will actually have a slightly longer base root (2.1875 seconds) that your foe can now resist correctly. This is one of the central reasons for the adjustment to the timing on a single target. Hitting two targets is even more beneficial for that control. This also means that Tenacity will properly act on it and make the difference between Wizards who use Orb of Imposition and Wizards who use two damage features feel more obvious and differentiated.

    Thank you all for your continued feedback!
    Chris "Gentleman Crush" Meyer
    Fun police never rests. Thanks for all your hard work.

    Guess I'm back to not playing my GF. Looking back I probably should've made 7 CWs instead of different classes.
  • izidiusizidius Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 40
    edited October 2014
    Fun police never rests. Thanks for all your hard work.

    Guess I'm back to not playing my GF. Looking back I probably should've made 7 CWs instead of different classes.

    Yeah you should've - too bad the 2x exp weekend passed already.
  • ayrouxayroux Member Posts: 4,271 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    The reason for the SoS change to prevent AP gain is that we don't wait dailies that act as persistent buffs allowing you to gain AP while they are active (Lurkers Assault is a great example here). If SoS is unviable given that change, then we probably need to buff it separately to make it feel more rewarding in a reflect scenario. Also, Armor Penetration should totally affect it now, if it is not, please let me know so we can get that fixed.

    Additionally, the Icy Rays change is to make it respect Orb of Imposition. With Orb equipped at R3 you will actually have a slightly longer base root (2.1875 seconds) that your foe can now resist correctly. This is one of the central reasons for the adjustment to the timing on a single target. Hitting two targets is even more beneficial for that control. This also means that Tenacity will properly act on it and make the difference between Wizards who use Orb of Imposition and Wizards who use two damage features feel more obvious and differentiated.

    Thank you all for your continued feedback!
    Chris "Gentleman Crush" Meyer

    Crush, ill tell you right now SOS will be garbage now. If you want to adjust it, what needs to happen is you need to enable it to crit now that it respects DR etc.

    Also I tried to test the damage from SOS and got a TON of varying results. Seems like damage has a minimum and maximum "cap" and what determines the damage inside that SMALL scale is damage incoming. Can we get some clarification in the tooltip or here exactly how SOS determines how much damage to spit back out?
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    WMS last few sec,mark lasts 20
    TR can close gap,WMS dont
    u cant miss with TR while WMS is hard to land
    mark feat also incrase dailys dmg by 15% while wms only encounters by 10%
    mark ignore 20% of target DR means IVs can run w,o arp

    or else they could buff Staying Power destroyer feat to deal 25% more dmg(all dmg not just encounters) to targets debuffed by wms and also incrase the buff duration b 2/4/6/8/10 seconds this would make SM our trully dps path.

    Note: 1 last thing that bothers me since m2 about iron vanguards why in the hell destroyer have feat for ferocious reaction passive which is defensive not offensive class feature?

    Neither path is pure tank or pure dps. In fact, SM can tank much better than IV due to Steely Defense passive. There could indeed be more ways to mark than just TR and Daring Shout but it definitely isn't going to be WMS. It's perfectly fine the way it is now.

    And your suggestion to buff destroyer path further is hillarious. It already does 2-3 times the damage a sentinel or instigator does.
  • kozi001kozi001 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 876 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    thedemien wrote: »
    Well Good.But Now you need to decrease CW pve damage. Make them finally controller or damages. Not both.
    And make HR finally worsy in pve.
    Just to note - last week I run on my newbaby temp SW with 14k GS. Done more damage then 20k GS HR from my guild -one of the best pve HR i have seen.
    Also later we run SP duo with 18k gs CW. easy mode really. Cause damage of TT from SW and Control+damage from CW is insane. You really don't need any other classes now. Maybe GF for KV and agro - that is it.

    I do understand that this are buff and nerf. So please make them pve wise and not make it pvp braker again. PvP may feel better after small glypth fixes but removing those entirely, like companions, would work way better in domination.

    A good HR is very worthy to PVE but unfortunatelly not many can play with it.
    Nerf wishing other classes won't change that!
  • tardstelamon01brtardstelamon01br Banned Users Posts: 24 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    zvieris wrote: »
    Neither path is pure tank or pure dps. In fact, SM can tank much better than IV due to Steely Defense passive. There could indeed be more ways to mark than just TR and Daring Shout but it definitely isn't going to be WMS. It's perfectly fine the way it is now.

    And your suggestion to buff destroyer path further is hillarious. It already does 2-3 times the damage a sentinel or instigator does.

    So what if it does more dmg than sent or inst its supposed to be dps path also we re getting outdpsed by dot based classes.
    Also its t2 feat so sent or inst could use it too, sm supposed to be dps path yet iv outperforms it in dmg.
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    So what if it does more dmg than sent or inst its supposed to be dps path also we re getting outdpsed by dot based classes.
    Also its t2 feat so sent or inst could use it too, sm supposed to be dps path yet iv outperforms it in dmg.
    But GWF even destroyer specced tanks better than DoT classes. If anything, ranged classes should get their damage toned down slightly. But widening the gap between GWF specializations is out of the question.

    If it was a change that would improve all 3 specializations (like at-will damage increase which was sugested many times over), then I'm all for it, but it's not.

    Like ninja editing, huh? Once again, SM is not dps path, nor is IV tank path. They have features that could make either build a tank or a dps machine. Face it. And your suggestion would drop the feat to at least tier 3. Too strong to be no. 2.
  • tardstelamon01brtardstelamon01br Banned Users Posts: 24 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    zvieris wrote: »
    But GWF even destroyer specced tanks better than DoT classes. If anything, ranged classes should get their damage toned down slightly. But widening the gap between GWF specializations is out of the question.

    If it was a change that would improve all 3 specializations (like at-will damage increase which was sugested many times over), then I'm all for it, but it's not.

    Like ninja editing, huh? Once again, SM is not dps path, nor is IV tank path. They have features that could make either build a tank or a dps machine. Face it.

    Its like arguing with wall im done with you.
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Its like arguing with wall im done with you.
    What you want is your path and your specific build buffed to an outrageus level. And what I'm telling you is the fact that it will never happen. And thanks for the compliment.
  • tardstelamon01brtardstelamon01br Banned Users Posts: 24 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    zvieris wrote: »
    What you want is your path and your specific build buffed to an outrageus level. And what I'm telling you is the fact that it will never happen.

    Outragerous lvl lmfao the TR with feat give u like 25% dmg due to CA bonus also mark ignore 20 % of enemy dr the change to wms feat would bring sm on par with iv
  • hefisdohefisdo Member Posts: 709 Bounty Hunter
    edited October 2014
    the Cleric rework, which is a pretty major overhaul of how they perform.

    If that means my bby is going to get buffed I'll kiss you.
    (´・ ω ・`)
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Outragerous lvl lmfao the TR with feat give u like 20% dmg due to ca bonus also mark ignore 20 % of enemy dr the change to wms feat would bring sm on par with iv

    I thought you're done with me? W well, you asked for it. I've got 3 words for you : Use Daring shout. Nuff said.

    IV doesn't deal more damage than SM. It's the other way around when you utilize daring shout + unstoppable + WMS spam + IBS or whatever offensive encounter you use. The only edge IV has is slightly better single target damage and extra gap closer. But SM beats IV in AoE dps by a lot.
  • tardstelamon01brtardstelamon01br Banned Users Posts: 24 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    zvieris wrote: »
    I thought you're done with me? Well, you asked for it. I've got 3 words for you : Use Daring shout. Nuff said.

    Iv doesnt have to waste encounter slot for useless skill.
  • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Iv doesnt have to waste encounter slot for useless skill.

    Daring Shout is an useless skill? This is the kind of GWF player that keeps QQing because the class is bad but doesn't even understand how to play it properly.
    fkze9t.jpg
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  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Iv doesnt have to waste encounter slot for useless skill.

    Useless? You know nothin' Jon Snow.
  • mrmauveforummrmauveforum Member Posts: 127 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    The reason for the SoS change to prevent AP gain is that we don't wait dailies that act as persistent buffs allowing you to gain AP while they are active (Lurkers Assault is a great example here). If SoS is unviable given that change, then we probably need to buff it separately to make it feel more rewarding in a reflect scenario. Also, Armor Penetration should totally affect it now, if it is not, please let me know so we can get that fixed.

    Chris "Gentleman Crush" Meyer

    Hey there Crush, PvE GF here. What is the AP gain going to look like on GF with KV now? I just bought and used a respec token to make my GF completely Conqueror because I realized the AP gain that KV gave me meant that I could tank with Steel Defense and life steal instead of going for a super-tanky (and therefore very inefficient stat-wise) GF build. I'm currently finishing up my dragon armor set so that I have a little of everything to avoid soft caps.

    My problem is, without my daily every eleven seconds (which is about what it seems to work out to in boss fights), I'll get incinerated by end-game bosses if I run Knight's Valor. I picked the Swordmaster path for Steel Defense, and that 5-second invulnerability, even with how buggy it is, is what I rely on to tank. The new bosses in epic SoT and LoL deal tons and tons of burst damage (easily my whole health pool if I don't block well), and if I can't tank that very often then I'm going to not be able to run Knight's Valor, and my contribution to the team is going to become nothing but ITF. As nice as ITF is, I want to play GF to tank for my teammates, not just to increase their DPS. If I just wanted that, I would have rolled a Cleric.

    Also, another PvE concern: what am I supposed to do about Heroic Encounters? I've finally figured out the method of consistently getting Great Success with my GF, and it consists of spamming dailies. Otherwise, it's impossible for my GF to get Great Success, and that's WITH me having Knight's Valor up for damage taken and WITH me on a Conqueror path and WITH more than 4k power. If that GF can't get Great Success anymore, I don't think any will be able to.

    Please don't leave us PvE folks in a lurch just because of PvP. It looks to me like just the SoS changes would be enough, honestly. Could you please reconsider changing our AP gain? Thanks! ^.^
  • beckylunaticbeckylunatic Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 14,231 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Also, another PvE concern: what am I supposed to do about Heroic Encounters? I've finally figured out the method of consistently getting Great Success with my GF, and it consists of spamming dailies. Otherwise, it's impossible for my GF to get Great Success, and that's WITH me having Knight's Valor up for damage taken and WITH me on a Conqueror path and WITH more than 4k power. If that GF can't get Great Success anymore, I don't think any will be able to.

    Please don't leave us PvE folks in a lurch just because of PvP. It looks to me like just the SoS changes would be enough, honestly. Could you please reconsider changing our AP gain? Thanks! ^.^

    Make the dragon face you, stand in the breath weapon, and block. I run an IV tactician GF who doesn't use KV *or* SoS (obvs) and scores great success on heroic encounters without an issue. Less than 4k power. Ok, yeah, he spams dailies (tact capstone)... Fighter's Recovery and Anvil keep him alive when there's no DC on the scene to do so.

    This technique is only unsuccessful when you can't peel aggro off some other idiot GF who insists on playing spin the dragon. Can still end up taking a lot of damage though due to not being able to get out of the way of the tail smacks.
    Guild Leader - The Lords of Light

    Neverwinter Census 2017

    All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
  • beckylunaticbeckylunatic Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 14,231 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    terramak wrote: »
      Items and Economy
      • The Tyranny of Dragons vendors (both the one located in Protector's Enclave and the one available via the Campaigns window) now feature two new items. Give them a try!
        • Potion of Dragon Slaying
        • Scroll of Protection from Dragons

      This is cool, the cost and duration seems very reasonable... now can we *please* get something similar to do with the scrip and scrolls from Dread Ring?
      Guild Leader - The Lords of Light

      Neverwinter Census 2017

      All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
    • ikapamkikapamk Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 294 Bounty Hunter
      edited October 2014
      freshour wrote: »
      - SOS was not broken. KV was not broken (the AP was but that is their fault). Guarded assault combined with KV and SOS and protector was a freaking AWESOME synergy. It worked, it reduced their damage a LOT, and it would barely do ANY damage lol, it was enough to make you a bit better than a meat shield. Combined Glyphs and you get a 300% increase in damage. From 1 million in an hour long pvp to 3 million total. Seriously, and your idea of a fix is the abilities?
      <snip>
      There has been zero logic if any of this. PVE players are getting severely punished for no reason. PVP players will figure out another way, but sometimes those other ways don't work in PVE and may end up with GF's no longer welcome in dungeons. I'm not sure what else there is to say, but those are the facts, take em or leave em.

      As a protector GF, that was a wonderful combo for controlling dungeons. Now, yes, I'm not a huge fan of KV as it has killed me on occasion (never use it on ToS), that combination actually allowed me to be somewhat contributive.

      I agree the AP generation was broken; that needed a change. The damage output, though? Well, it is reflected damage, so I wouldn't argue it needed to be redone, but when this mainly PvE took it to PvP for a change, seeing the amount of damage it did to players (because players deal much more damage), I fully understand the nerf in the context of PvP. PvE, though should have been left alone.

      Someone else was on to a good idea in suggesting that problematic feats and powers have different stats/effects in PvE and PvP.
      Carpe Jugulum
      Sharra Del'Armgo - SW Trapper Hybrid HR
      Ogghra Bar'Ghuzumn - MI Scoundrel TR
      Vænna Thrymskjöldr - IV Protector GF
    • eion311eion311 Member Posts: 338 Arc User
      edited October 2014

      Also a bug, also getting fixed soon :). As part of the Cleric Rework actually.

      I love how this is now all of a sudden "a bug" even though it's been the way the game has worked for all classes since day 1. So what you're saying is that no class will be able to gain AP while a daily is active?

      Edit: Now that I'm thinking about it this is also a nerf to the GF Tactician capstone.
    • lazaroth666lazaroth666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,332 Arc User
      edited October 2014
      Please fix the Ioun Dragon Stone in the SCA.
      fkze9t.jpg
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    • edited October 2014
      This content has been removed.
    • koalazebra1koalazebra1 Member Posts: 1,173 Bounty Hunter
      edited October 2014
      yummmyyy no more perma SoS by GFs
    • group5egroup5e Member Posts: 294 Arc User
      edited October 2014
      iambecks1 wrote: »
      The thing that really annoys me is that if this was the other way round they would probably do an emergency maintenance to fix it but because it is only affecting players they don't , it seriously needs to be fixed as a priority , to see you won an item worth literally millions of AD after days and days or even weeks of farming just to not get it made me feel like giving up completely.

      Fully agree here. I've "won" a belt as well from Whispering Caverns only to have it replaced by a +5 Pact of Smiting. The response I got from customer service was completely disgusting and worthless. I buy zen monthly and I think from now on I will forgo the zen. There is no point supporting a game that doesn't give actual support.

      This issue will not be addressed because it has nothing to do with the zen shop and it forces people to actually buy zen to get the items they want. It was so depressing "winning", submitting a ticket and knowing that this company will not do the right thing.
    This discussion has been closed.