Dock District - Will it ever be introduced?

almondum

Hello everyone,

I'm not sure how many of you played Neverwinter Nights 2, but I remember the city of Neverwinter having a Dock District.
Will we ever see Dock District rebuilt?

This has nothing to do with 4Edition of D&D, this is a Neverwinter Lore question.

Thank you for your attention,
Have fun,

Almondum.

str8slayer

Technically speaking, Protector's Enclave encompasses the entire western-most portion of the city, including the docks on both sides of the river. The rest of the city is simply beyond repair, for the foreseeable future (especially with war between Thay and Netheril looming).

hustin1

The OP raises a good point, though: the docks are the lifeblood of the city, so it would make sense to be able to go there. I'd also like to see Upper Blacklake opened up. Maybe there are some hidden secrets under where the Academy used to be before it burned down under very mysterious circumstances...

reiwulf

I wish they added docks to PE (or make a separate map accesible through a teleport in PE) where you can travel to other maps like Icewind Dale or other areas near the coast.

eldarth

+1. A dock district and expansion of Blacklake would both be great.
I hate having to send a foundry quest on a "boat trip" by leaving through the lighthouse. Or an Eastern gate. It's just lame.

ryugasirius

I suspect docks will show up in some piracy or sea expedition themed module... :P

benja32gonsales

almondum wrote: »

Hello everyone,

I'm not sure how many of you played Neverwinter Nights 2, but I remember the city of Neverwinter having a Dock District.
Will we ever see Dock District rebuilt?

This has nothing to do with 4Edition of D&D, this is a Neverwinter Lore question.

Thank you for your attention,
Have fun,

Almondum.

No, I remember it from NWN1



Good old days

reiwulf

benja32gonsales wrote: »

No, I remember it from NWN1



Good old days

Now I want to make the docks district with the foundry, too bad it Will still have the ****ty 5 person limit.

iandarksword

almondum wrote: »

Hello everyone,

I'm not sure how many of you played Neverwinter Nights 2, but I remember the city of Neverwinter having a Dock District.
Will we ever see Dock District rebuilt?

This has nothing to do with 4Edition of D&D, this is a Neverwinter Lore question.

Thank you for your attention,
Have fun,

Almondum.

The city of Neverwinter was essentially hit with a pyroclastic flow from Mt. Hotenow when it erupted. The Docks District (which I always loved in NWN and NWN 2) was likely a casualty of that eruption as molten rock seeks the lowest path of resistance. In truth, you COULD have it buried beneath hundreds of feet of volcanic rock like Pompeii, or even have an underground dock area that opens to the sea via caves and is still used by less than genuine clientele.

reiwulf

I've always wondered how does NW relate to NWN1 and NWN2, chronollogically speaking is there a specific order?

ryugasirius

reiwulf wrote: »

I've always wondered how does NW relate to NWN1 and NWN2, chronollogically speaking is there a specific order?

NW events (spellplague, occupation and rebuilding of NW) happen several decades after NWN events IIRC

eldarth

Neverwinter Wiki Grimoire of Time is a good place to start.

dtz

reiwulf wrote: »

I've always wondered how does NW relate to NWN1 and NWN2, chronollogically speaking is there a specific order?

This game takes place about a hundred years or so after the Neverwinter Nights games.

reiwulf

thanks for the replies and links, everyone!

mutantdemocracy

eldarth wrote: »

expansion of Blacklake would both be great.

As it turns out, there is a large chunk of Blacklake that's blocked off behind invisible walls. If you know where to look, then you can find a hole that'll let you outside.

There are lot of cool houses and an open square towards the left of the entrance gate that looks like they were originally intended to be used. There's also a large area beyond Blacklake's exit gate that includes yet another place that looks like it was supposed to be more of the main quest(lots of little details like torches, fences, altars, and shop decorations).

I imagine that Blacklake was supposed to be around double the size that it currently is, but ended up being cut out due to something like time constraints. Since a lot of the assets are already there, it'd be cool if they revisited the area in the next module.

zebular

eldarth wrote: »

Neverwinter Wiki Grimoire of Time is a good place to start.

Thanks for the plug. I still need to finish the deities. With D&D Next just released though, I'm sort-of wanting to wait to see if Neverwinter Online advances into the Timeline as the Gods will change up quite a bit when/if it does.

As for the Timeline, I do have an accurate flow in relation to the PC Games just above the Sundering Entries.
http://neverwinter.gamepedia.com/Grimoire_of_Time#Timeline_of_Neverwinter

As for the original Docks District, that area of what is now Protector's Enclave simply no longer exists and is instead a sheer cliff down to the sea where the new Docks hug what is left of that area up to the Western Walls of Protector's Enclave. You can see this best when looking out to the West from the Moonstone Mask or its bridge area. The Original Docks area was rebuilt once but was destroyed again. Now it lingers as remnants of floating earthmotes that were once connected by rope bridges (akin to Pirates Skyhold's earthmotes).

The new Docks area now rests outside the City Walls to the West, both South and North of the Riverway. So if it were to be incorporated into Neverwinter Online, it would not be in Protector's Enclave. It would be a new Zone. (see my post below, I included some images to help illustrate this)

Black-market trade does flow in from the Sea and some brave adventurers do still use the old earth-mote access ways. However, most of these black-market routes are underground routes that come in through access-ways in the side of the western cliff and usually travel through the sewers or other caverns and tunnels made during the Spellplague, Mt. Hotenow eruption, and beyond. Legal trade in the City, as I said above, mostly flows in from the High Road through the main city Gates and from the Docks District into Protector's Enclave through the South City Gate by the Seven Suns Coster Market.

4e Neverwinter Campaign Setting, Excerpts wrote:

Neverwinter Docks
Much of Never winter's original wealth and influence came from its position as one of the few deep ports on the Sword Coast. The Neverwinter docks were the commercial heart of the city, though in some ways that heart was infected with darkness and corruption. The Spellplague went some way toward purging that corruption-chunks of land broke away and rose into the sky, forming earthmotes that hovered overhead. The surviving residents of the city adapted, connecting the low-floating motes to the shore with ropes, chains, and bridges. However, the cataclysm later destroyed the foundations of these bridges, and the changed currents swamped whole areas of the port with tidal waves. Neverwinter's already diminished trade dried up entirely, leaving the docks a rotting ghost town. Only a few fishers and the occasional pirate ship made port here.

Lord Neverember made rebuilding this center of trade a top priority. As part of his first initiatives, he sent engineers and loggers to the Upland Rise, a forested hill outside the city that once served as a park for the city's residents. The crews stripped the hill of all salvageable timber, leaving the Upland Rise a sparse echo of its former beauty, and used it to rebuild the docks.

For all his flaws as a political leader, Neverember is a brilliant merchant prince, and his efforts have restored trade to the city. Today, supplies and coin flow into Neverwinter through the docks, along with repatriated refugees. The Lord Protector takes a keen interest in anyone entering the city in this manner, and charges steep tariffs on deals consummated at the docks.

Shadier player characters-such as the Dead Rat deserter, the scion of shadow, and the Harper agent might find themselves particularly at home at the docks, where coin is king and morality plays second fiddle. Adventurers can buy whatever they need (within reason) at the docks, whether the deals take place on or under the table.

hustin1

mutantdemocracy wrote: »

As it turns out, there is a large chunk of Blacklake that's blocked off behind invisible walls. If you know where to look, then you can find a hole that'll let you outside.

There are lot of cool houses and an open square towards the left of the entrance gate that looks like they were originally intended to be used. There's also a large area beyond Blacklake's exit gate that includes yet another place that looks like it was supposed to be more of the main quest(lots of little details like torches, fences, altars, and shop decorations).

I imagine that Blacklake was supposed to be around double the size that it currently is, but ended up being cut out due to something like time constraints. Since a lot of the assets are already there, it'd be cool if they revisited the area in the next module.

I've built an Upper Blacklake Foundry that fills in a large empty area of Blacklake, but I've been struggling to come up with a suitable quest. I wish I could post the map for others to work on.

eldarth

zebular wrote: »

4e Neverwinter Campaign Setting, Excerpts wrote:

The Spellplague went some way toward purging that corruption-chunks ofland broke away and rose into the sky, forming earthmotes that hovered overhead. The surviving residents of the city adapted, connecting the low-floating motes to the shore with ropes, chains, and bridges. However, the cataclysm later destroyed the foundations of these bridges, and the changed currents swamped whole areas of the port with tidal waves. Neverwinter's already diminished trade dried up entirely, leaving the docks a rotting ghost town. Only a few fishers and the occasional pirate ship made port here.

Ooooh... I feel a foundry coming on... "Something Rotten in the Old Docks"

zebular

To help illustrate:

Here is the old area that would have been the Docks area in Neverwinter Nights Series (in green), that was destroyed by the Mt. Hotenow eruption and then later washed away by the sea. From green to the current coast would have been land and the docks district in the NWN series.:



The latest rebuilding of the docks area in Neverwinter Online and 4th Edition, is depicted here in Red.



Which is clearly outside the walls of Protector's Enclave, as shown here:

almondum

To help illustrate:

Here is the old area that would have been the Docks area in Neverwinter Nights Series (in green), that was destroyed by the Mt. Hotenow eruption and then later washed away by the sea. From green to the current coast would have been land and the docks district in the NWN series.:

This is awesome, that means the area can still be rebuilt!
Even outside the city walls, it is very close. I don't mind it being a different zone.

zebular

almondum wrote: »

This is awesome, that means the area can still be rebuilt!
Even outside the city walls, it is very close. I don't mind it being a different zone.

It is already rebuilt, that third image is a current timeline map, circa 1479 DR. It just hasn't been made in Neverwinter Online yet as a playable zone. My excerpt is also current lore in my prior post.

zebular

Here's some in game screen shots. The areas in the green borders would be where the southern half (south of the river) Docks District is. In Neverwinter Online, it is apparent that they didn't plan on incorporating the docks as part of the PE Zone, as it is all unbuilt land still and very crude, sharp edges. This suggests to me that they decided to not put the Docks in game, either at all yet, or plan to have it be a later addition as a new Zone in Neverwinter City.

Remember, this is just the southern half of the Docks District, so with that in mind, that even furthers the reasoning it would need to be a new Zone all-together as the Protectors Enclave District doesn't even touch the northern half of the Docks District.

zebular

magenubbie wrote: »

Not sure if it will ever be rebuild in NWO, but I remember a prison being there. You go there at the start of NWN2. It would make a nice intro for a short campaign or event. Prisoners (Luskans? Nashers?) running wild in all the maps within town, people rounding them up like with the spies on idk what map it was. Maybe hunt the mastermind behind the escape/revolt.. Seems fun. Just a thought.

Almost that entire area would be water now. The only part of the old Docks area that remains is anywhere from 75 feet to 150 feet from the Western City Walls, down a steep cliff to the sea. The cliff itself is about half that distance, leaving just enough room for a road and wooden docks jutting into the see, with a few larger building in the areas that are just large enough for them.

eldarth

magenubbie wrote: »

Now that I took a closer look at your pics, looks like you're right. Not trying to hijack the topic, but would you know where the new prison is located? Is there even a new prison or is the only one left the one in the northern part of Blacklake?

is that "island" (old prison?) supposed to be the new docks? I thought the "new" docks were "north" of the city.
That island looks like it's on the southern side of the river mouth.

zebular

eldarth wrote: »

is that "island" (old prison?) supposed to be the new docks? I thought the "new" docks were "north" of the city.
That island looks like it's on the southern side of the river mouth.

The "Island" in the bay of the river is the Moonstone Mask, a floating earthmote. The new docks spans the coast both north and south of the river. The island South-West of the city is not the Peninsula District, as the Peninsula District was West of Castle Never in the "City Core," which is north of the River.

magenubbie wrote: »

Now that I took a closer look at your pics, looks like you're right. Not trying to hijack the topic, but would you know where the new prison is located? Is there even a new prison or is the only one left the one in the northern part of Blacklake?

As far as I can tell, the Peninsula District is no more, which is where the jail was. From the 4e Maps of Neverwinter City, the Peninsula District would now be open water in the river's bay. Along this coast is now where the northern half of the new Docks District is.

Here, I put an overlay of the Peninsula District's approximate size and location in relation to Castle Never, which is to it's East.

reiwulf

Well in the current NW map you can actually see the new docks, so there could eventually be a docks disctrict.
Until then I'll make one as a rp map, with a tavern and maybe some hidden black market.

zebular

For those interested, here's my best piecing together of Neverwinter City, circa 1479 DR: (click to see bigger)


The black line is part I had to lower to get to line up, as there should be another guard tower on that inner wall just left of Castle Never that is missing. Also, if I push it up, the rest of the buildings don't line up.

My original file is almost 4.5 gigs in size, so I had to reduce it drastically to post.

The fourth marker on the ruler at the bottom is 100 feet, the second is 200 feet. In order, those markers read, from left to right: 0, 25, 50, 100, 200, 500, 1000.

As you can tell from this map, our current Neverwinter differes slightly in some areas. For example, our Protector's Enclave is only about One-Half the size it is on the map above. So, in approximation, if you where to take a line and draw a wall continuing north off the tower from the wall that goes straight north to the right of the southern most gate and angle it up to around where the middle bridge across the river is, that left section would be the PE we have now.

After fact checking all of this, I am leaning to believe that we are currently before Lord Neverembers second re-building of the new Docks District that exist on the map above. It would appear that due to the sheer cliffs and unworked terrain currently in game, that he has yet to start the repair efforts that brings us to what we see above.

almondum

Thanks alot for all the info, this is very interesting and exciting to know!

reiwulf

I'm already working on the Docks district map, it's obviously not the same as a real area, but it's better than nothing.
I wish we had foundry contests where the winner entry gets added to the game as a real map. (even if it is small things like tavern interiors or whatever)