Feated ITC from scoundrel for Power buff, combined with Courage Breaker buff, puts you in immunity for 1-2 rounds of ultra strong DF. Kinda silly though because they can still teleport out of DF range. Works on GF/GWF, but be careful of Takedown. Needless to say, that still pales much in comparison to Whirlwind of Blades.
CB is a bit situational, and has a distinct "specialized" feel to it.
■ CB itself is medium level damage, although not too shabby when it crits.
■ In terms of functionality it is a bit less effective against CWs/HRs. CWs can teleport out of range and still attempt to CC you for the duration, as well as HRs can also keep doing timed dodges and constantly CC/interrupt you in betweem, which will make you waste precious 4~5 seconds out of 10.
■ Against TRs it does a lot better in two aspects: TRs have only two dodges with large stamina consumption and does not have any major CCs. Combine that with the fact that CB is actually very underrated and not common to see in PvP, and what happens is usually the TR hit with the CB panics a lil' bit and tries to dodge out, which can be easily followed. Since TRs don't have any major CCs outside Dazing Strike, you simply follow the TR's dodge with your dodge and keep bashing. Also, another useful feature is that CB leaves a darkened visual effect under the target's feet -- and this can be seen even if the target enters stealth -- so CB actually doubles as a stealth-detector for 10 seconds.
■ CB is of course, most effective against GFs and GWFs since they've got no dodge/teleport. A CB+Smoke Bomb combo will totally neutralize a GF for the next 4~5 seconds, and if in rare case you've slotted Dazing Strike along with Smoke Bomb, for as long as 8~10 seconds the GF is simply putty in your hands. Hit CB from stealth, GF is dazed and can't do anything and can't move. Easy full-hit target dummy for Duelist's Flurry, add in a Dazing Strike to extend the daze for next 4~5 secs, and another full-hit DF.
■ It's a bit trickier against GWFs since they can spam Threatening Rush, and also enter Unstoppable to negate your CC attempts as well as spam prones. But even still, a 90% damage debuff and a practical root-level slow is very helpful in all situations -- since it is prime target for DF, a target standing still. It is also particularly if you want to finish off runners or gank a major GWF player.
All in all, CB is one of those powers which have been overlooked and ignored so long because there was another power which was so OP that nobody thought using anything else made sense. I've been bringing up the usefulness of CB since way back, but it wasn't until Shoxecution got nerfed (...in the wrong way, IMO...) that people started looking for alternatives. Glad to see others taking interest in Courage Breaker.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
CB is the kind of daily that your party HAS TO KNOW you are using and what it is about. It's a death sentence in a group fight, as long as they know what to do to a person as soon as you lock him down in a near defenseless state. It's more than saying, "Hey Team I have SE charged bring that guy to half health and I'll finish him off." It's a "I will disable that GWF, focus on him in the next 10 seconds!" kind of thing. Pay note that this is the most powerful CC because it goes through all kinds of immunities. As long as it is used right, and in the right moment.
Unless they magically fixed it: Wicked Reminder does not stack in PvP and only debuffs a percentage of the defense stat rather than the Damage Reduction percentage as the tooltip says.
CB is the kind of daily that your party HAS TO KNOW you are using and what it is about. It's a death sentence in a group fight, as long as they know what to do to a person as soon as you lock him down in a near defenseless state. It's more than saying, "Hey Team I have SE charged bring that guy to half health and I'll finish him off." It's a "I will disable that GWF, focus on him in the next 10 seconds!" kind of thing. Pay note that this is the most powerful CC because it goes through all kinds of immunities. As long as it is used right, and in the right moment.
It's also a life-saver for CWs or HRs that got snagged by a GWF... except, in the exact way you've mentioned, many people in the party just don't know what happened... and its like this everytime: :P
* gets caught by GWF, life dangerously low *
[me] * Courage Breaker to GWF ** doesn't know what happened. Keeps on doing fancy shifts in front of GWF *
[me] "Run."* still standing 10ft away from GWF, puckers with Constricting.. Disrupting...*
[me] "Run."* goes into timely shifts, flings around Fox's Shift *
[me] "Run."* gets hit by FSL from a GWF that's just standing there *
[me] "For the love of God, run you idiot!"* CB is over. HR dead *
Heh. The PuG life.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
tankinatorfrMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 107Bounty Hunter
edited June 2014
little question :
Is it intentional for Biggrin to ignore stealth ?
He will always target you, even if you are far from him and stealthed.
I am not complaining, this is the only place in the all ID maps where I need potions... but it look strange to see this guy locking me when he can't see me.
I am not quite sure that "bait and switch" is not bugged. At least in the ice wind campaign there is something odd with it (perhaps the level of the monsters) in that it is often ignored by the enemy regardless of your proximity or how many times you run through/near/by your decoy. Even when you stealth after they don't always seem to attack it and I haven't quite been able to isolate exactly what the problem may be except possibly proximity based.
Seen this happen many times in IWD, seemed to me to happen more often if you got adds after initial start of a fight... like start fighting 2 giants and an undead skeleton with it's undead lackeys decide to join the fight or even just 2 yetis.
I've ran and stood on the decoy to pull the mob to it then popped stealth,then ran away from decoy[no attacks] and had the all the attackers follow me leaving the decoy alone???
Been looking forward to upgrading my Perfect Sarcasm font, but due to recent changes it seems I will need to grind the Nine Hells for my Pure Sarcasm font... ironic isn't it?
Seen this happen many times in IWD, seemed to me to happen more often if you got adds after initial start of a fight... like start fighting 2 giants and an undead skeleton with it's undead lackeys decide to join the fight or even just 2 yetis.
I've ran and stood on the decoy to pull the mob to it then popped stealth,then ran away from decoy[no attacks] and had the all the attackers follow me leaving the decoy alone???
Perhaps they've either newly introduced, or lowered, "chance to bait" -- depending on if such a thing did exist or not.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
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demonmongerMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,350Arc User
edited June 2014
I am mastering my TR one day at a time.
Wicked reminder is awesome!
Smoke bomb is awesome
Itc is awesome
Bait n switch is awesome
Shadow strike is awesome
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I hate paying taxes! Why must I pay thousands of dollars in taxes when everything I buy is taxed anyways!
trs cant even afford 2 offencive encounters.
only possible dps rotation would be itc,pob,lb
which makes no sence at all.
in 1v1 situation against strong opponent its impossible to mantain rotation.
if more pob doesnt deal no dmg
trs cant even afford 2 offencive encounters.
only possible dps rotation would be itc,pob,lb
which makes no sence at all.
in 1v1 situation against strong opponent its impossible to mantain rotation.
if more pob doesnt deal no dmg
I can entertain the idea that our damaging encounters have reduced cooldown! If buffed damage poses such an unthinkable option for the devs, low-cooldown-small-damage powers are fair enough. Something like a GWF feat that reduces cooldown by half, in place of one of our two incredibly useless capstone feats.
Right now the recharge on IS is not even affected by recovery!
Okay stealth is a bit buggy. I don't know if they altered aggro/hate tables or what the issue is. I have noticed and commented already that oftentimes a pack of mobs I have aggroed will continue to follow me around in stealth (when grouped, not when solo). They will "look" around and sometimes attack but more often they will use some of their abilities and not make melee attacks. If the rest of the group with me dies they will quit this and ignore me while stealthed.
Additionally I can sometimes cause a "mesmerize" effect on one or more mobs where they will ignore everyone else and focus on me exclusively while i am stealthed (sometimes they attack but more often they don't). When I come out of stealth they leave me alone and attack whoever else had the most aggro.
I don't know what causes this enough to be able to actually replicate it all the time, but more often than not I see it when I do a first aggro dive and path of the blades followed by stealth. Also I have the lightfoot thief and I did wonder if the dot from it had something to do with it but since I cannot accurately duplicate it I didn't bother to drop it to test with as I wanted to see if others are finding something similar as well.
When i go into stealth on Lurking with Invisible Infiltrator feat and my daily cap was charged with "Sigil of the Devoted" artefact, my stealth bar gets frozen sometimes, i can't be in stealth anymore after that and i need to switch char/re-enter to bring stealth back.
Whirlwind of Blades: Currently ignoring damage resistance.
Preview Tests: WoB on a GF with shield up (6350), WoB done on a GF with shield down (6254). GF shield on preview now adds mitigation instead of "blocking" the full damage. A similar issue has been reported in the bug forums. On arguing whether this is OP to ignore resistance, many TR powers now do negligible damage. Consider increasing base damage of WoB in attempting to balance what's broken in this daily.
Live Tests: the parenthesis number indicating damage dealt (damage before mitigation) in combat logs is missing. Full base damage is inflicted regardless of target's armor values.
I don't really give 2 ****s whether WoB ignores DR or not, an instant AoE skill should not be able to deal 20K+ damage.
Also
>dealing minor damage
In skill description.
Why? There are few mobs in PvE that will fall to WoB and the TR threatens no class in AE damage capability.
Also, the description was before the initial TR nerfs where their abilities used to actually do damage and before the other two dailies were reduced to be less than WoB and entirely useless for damage. This is realistically the only damage daily the TR has left and they are a striker after all -- one that falls consistently at the bottom of the damage charts.
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katbozejziemiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 856Arc User
Because being able to kill 5 people with 1 key press is not okay.
So you are saying any AE that can hit 5 targets is not okay? You do realize that any such AE could also kill 5 people in 1 key press since we are speaking of people with less than full health and bunched together.
Also, the description was before the initial TR nerfs where their abilities used to actually do damage and before the other two dailies were reduced to be less than WoB and entirely useless for damage.
20K was MINOR DAMAGE by comparison to 80K Shocking Executions, 100K Lashing Blades, and 30K Impact Shots. Oh, those days. Don't you just miss the old you.
Because being able to kill 5 people with 1 key press is not okay.
5 People: We are nuts, we want to all die at the same time.
ME: Everyone please bang your heads on the floor and stand around me when you have 30% health left, so that I can kill all five of you.
GWF: Uh, no. Just bunch together in a line in front of me, really tightly, and I will IBS you from full health.
I have been struggling with my TR in pvp. i have only been playing 2 months, but like other state i hate perma stealth but sadly 1v1 we just don't have the dmg. sitting in full grim and using bile now. might try vorpal again but didn't notice too much advantage.
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reagenlionel1Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
So you are saying any AE that can hit 5 targets is not okay? You do realize that any such AE could also kill 5 people in 1 key press since we are speaking of people with less than full health and bunched together.
You obviously missed the keyword "kill" in that quote. Not damage 5 people. Kill 5 people.
And yes this can happen at half health or higher up, quite close to full.
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katbozejziemiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 856Arc User
5 People: We are nuts, we want to all die at the same time.
ME: Everyone please bang your heads on the floor and stand around me when you have 30% health left, so that I can kill all five of you.
GWF: Uh, no. Just bunch together in a line in front of me, really tightly, and I will IBS you from full health.
Guess where the five nutcrackers will go.
So according to you everyone has 60K HP now and IBS has 30 feet range AND can hit for 20K at any amount of health.
Okay.
You obviously missed the keyword "kill" in that quote. Not damage 5 people. Kill 5 people.
And yes this can happen at half health or higher up, quite close to full.
I missed nothing (unlike you apparently), so before you try to correct me make sure you understand what was said.
Anything that can damage 5 people at once can potentially kill 5 people at once. This was his stipulation, not mine. He did not qualify any amount and simply gave a blanket statement that if an ability can kill 5 people with one key press it is not okay. It is not my responsibility to interpret beyond what he said and it sure as hell isn't any of your business to try and qualify his statement to fit your base rate bias situation and then judge me by your fallacy.
Comments
CB is a bit situational, and has a distinct "specialized" feel to it.
■ CB itself is medium level damage, although not too shabby when it crits.
■ In terms of functionality it is a bit less effective against CWs/HRs. CWs can teleport out of range and still attempt to CC you for the duration, as well as HRs can also keep doing timed dodges and constantly CC/interrupt you in betweem, which will make you waste precious 4~5 seconds out of 10.
■ Against TRs it does a lot better in two aspects: TRs have only two dodges with large stamina consumption and does not have any major CCs. Combine that with the fact that CB is actually very underrated and not common to see in PvP, and what happens is usually the TR hit with the CB panics a lil' bit and tries to dodge out, which can be easily followed. Since TRs don't have any major CCs outside Dazing Strike, you simply follow the TR's dodge with your dodge and keep bashing. Also, another useful feature is that CB leaves a darkened visual effect under the target's feet -- and this can be seen even if the target enters stealth -- so CB actually doubles as a stealth-detector for 10 seconds.
■ CB is of course, most effective against GFs and GWFs since they've got no dodge/teleport. A CB+Smoke Bomb combo will totally neutralize a GF for the next 4~5 seconds, and if in rare case you've slotted Dazing Strike along with Smoke Bomb, for as long as 8~10 seconds the GF is simply putty in your hands. Hit CB from stealth, GF is dazed and can't do anything and can't move. Easy full-hit target dummy for Duelist's Flurry, add in a Dazing Strike to extend the daze for next 4~5 secs, and another full-hit DF.
■ It's a bit trickier against GWFs since they can spam Threatening Rush, and also enter Unstoppable to negate your CC attempts as well as spam prones. But even still, a 90% damage debuff and a practical root-level slow is very helpful in all situations -- since it is prime target for DF, a target standing still. It is also particularly if you want to finish off runners or gank a major GWF player.
All in all, CB is one of those powers which have been overlooked and ignored so long because there was another power which was so OP that nobody thought using anything else made sense. I've been bringing up the usefulness of CB since way back, but it wasn't until Shoxecution got nerfed (...in the wrong way, IMO...) that people started looking for alternatives. Glad to see others taking interest in Courage Breaker.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
It's also a life-saver for CWs or HRs that got snagged by a GWF... except, in the exact way you've mentioned, many people in the party just don't know what happened... and its like this everytime: :P
Heh. The PuG life.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
LOL It's so true, it hurts xD
Is it intentional for Biggrin to ignore stealth ?
He will always target you, even if you are far from him and stealthed.
I am not complaining, this is the only place in the all ID maps where I need potions... but it look strange to see this guy locking me when he can't see me.
Asha-DC(Faithful-Anointed Champion)
Vilgefortz-CW(Thaumaturge-balance)
Seen this happen many times in IWD, seemed to me to happen more often if you got adds after initial start of a fight... like start fighting 2 giants and an undead skeleton with it's undead lackeys decide to join the fight or even just 2 yetis.
I've ran and stood on the decoy to pull the mob to it then popped stealth,then ran away from decoy[no attacks] and had the all the attackers follow me leaving the decoy alone???
Perhaps they've either newly introduced, or lowered, "chance to bait" -- depending on if such a thing did exist or not.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Wicked reminder is awesome!
Smoke bomb is awesome
Itc is awesome
Bait n switch is awesome
Shadow strike is awesome
only possible dps rotation would be itc,pob,lb
which makes no sence at all.
in 1v1 situation against strong opponent its impossible to mantain rotation.
if more pob doesnt deal no dmg
Yes monger, you showed me that AP regain trick in PvE against zombies, which literally blew my mind! On PvP however, WR could use some love.
- It doesn't stack on players (bug)
- It falls off too quickly
- Close range, emphasis on close... it can be sidestepped
In any case, it still remains one of the best PvE encounters in my book.
I can entertain the idea that our damaging encounters have reduced cooldown! If buffed damage poses such an unthinkable option for the devs, low-cooldown-small-damage powers are fair enough. Something like a GWF feat that reduces cooldown by half, in place of one of our two incredibly useless capstone feats.
Right now the recharge on IS is not even affected by recovery!
Additionally I can sometimes cause a "mesmerize" effect on one or more mobs where they will ignore everyone else and focus on me exclusively while i am stealthed (sometimes they attack but more often they don't). When I come out of stealth they leave me alone and attack whoever else had the most aggro.
I don't know what causes this enough to be able to actually replicate it all the time, but more often than not I see it when I do a first aggro dive and path of the blades followed by stealth. Also I have the lightfoot thief and I did wonder if the dot from it had something to do with it but since I cannot accurately duplicate it I didn't bother to drop it to test with as I wanted to see if others are finding something similar as well.
— (The unwritten rule)
Preview Tests: WoB on a GF with shield up (6350), WoB done on a GF with shield down (6254). GF shield on preview now adds mitigation instead of "blocking" the full damage. A similar issue has been reported in the bug forums. On arguing whether this is OP to ignore resistance, many TR powers now do negligible damage. Consider increasing base damage of WoB in attempting to balance what's broken in this daily.
Live Tests: the parenthesis number indicating damage dealt (damage before mitigation) in combat logs is missing. Full base damage is inflicted regardless of target's armor values.
Also
>dealing minor damage
In skill description.
Why? There are few mobs in PvE that will fall to WoB and the TR threatens no class in AE damage capability.
Also, the description was before the initial TR nerfs where their abilities used to actually do damage and before the other two dailies were reduced to be less than WoB and entirely useless for damage. This is realistically the only damage daily the TR has left and they are a striker after all -- one that falls consistently at the bottom of the damage charts.
So you are saying any AE that can hit 5 targets is not okay? You do realize that any such AE could also kill 5 people in 1 key press since we are speaking of people with less than full health and bunched together.
just 3 posts below there is a post that trs cant get triple kills
and that with perfect vorpal
hehe nice try tho
20K was MINOR DAMAGE by comparison to 80K Shocking Executions, 100K Lashing Blades, and 30K Impact Shots. Oh, those days. Don't you just miss the old you.
5 People: We are nuts, we want to all die at the same time.
ME: Everyone please bang your heads on the floor and stand around me when you have 30% health left, so that I can kill all five of you.
GWF: Uh, no. Just bunch together in a line in front of me, really tightly, and I will IBS you from full health.
Guess where the five nutcrackers will go.
You obviously missed the keyword "kill" in that quote. Not damage 5 people. Kill 5 people.
And yes this can happen at half health or higher up, quite close to full.
20K WoB crits are nothing out of the ordinary.
So according to you everyone has 60K HP now and IBS has 30 feet range AND can hit for 20K at any amount of health.
Okay.
its funny how people take best of perma,combat,deflect tr and put it in one build
like
yesterday tr kill me he had
35k hp
40%deflect
full perma
crazy burst 20k
bilethorn df
was halfling
with
human extra 3 pts
and throne with 110 speed
seriously if tr can crit 20k thats with pve feats,with no stealth,worst survival in the game class.
enough said.
Yeah, I'd suggest you stop posting as well.
I missed nothing (unlike you apparently), so before you try to correct me make sure you understand what was said.
Anything that can damage 5 people at once can potentially kill 5 people at once. This was his stipulation, not mine. He did not qualify any amount and simply gave a blanket statement that if an ability can kill 5 people with one key press it is not okay. It is not my responsibility to interpret beyond what he said and it sure as hell isn't any of your business to try and qualify his statement to fit your base rate bias situation and then judge me by your fallacy.