Someone probably mentioned this before, but its due to unstoppable giving tons of DR. GWF also get superior defensive passives and encounters (not that gwf even need use daring shout). GF skills are generally lackluster.
GF tab skill needs to be buffed alot, give GF DR when the mark is on or something on par with the rest.
The reality today is that some heavily geared Senties equipped with either P.Vorpal or a G.Plaguefire have massive crit chance ( Weapon Master ), massive deflect ( weapon master/bravery/ + another feat ), super run speed ( Bravery/sprint), massive HP, defence capped, more than enought ArmPen and to top it off 4000-5000 power which might seem low but if you count in the frequent Vorpal enhanced crits and the armpen leads to great sustained damage and makes them almost as fearsome in PVP as they used to be.
I've been a proponent that IV/Sent is still very good in PVP and just as viable as Destroyer, despite their damage being nerfed by 20-40% depending on crit change/enchant. But there are other reasons that people go Destroyer even though it isn't necessarily better, at the top of the list most likely being that Sentinel is no longer good in PVE.
Sentinel is better at point holding, backcapping, and contesting than Destroyer. It is just as good as Destroyer is now.
The thing is, Destroyer got buffed, Sentinel got nerfed. GWFs now have two viable PVP specs that are equally as good as each other. Of course, look around the forums, even a bunch of GFs claiming that GWFs got buffed in mod 3. It's illusionary, it's false.
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guille23mxMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 340Arc User
edited June 2014
Only I have to say is this:
CRYPTIC I KNOW YOU HATE GF'S BUT WILL ASK THIS ONCE MORE:
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME RUNNNING SPEED AS THE GWF....
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME TAB ABILITY AS THE GWF...CC INMUNNE AND GOD EASY MODE HEALING UNSTOPABLE
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME WEAPON DAMAGE AS THE GWF 1000 (NOT 600)
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME HITTING SPEED AS THE GWF (EVEN WITH THE LITTLE SPEED BUFF IN UNSTOPABLE U GAVE TO GWF)
-GIVE MY GF A GOD **** REAL SHIELD , NOT A TISSUE PAPER LIKE UR GIVEN US. ONE THAT CAN SUSTAIN 100 HITS GOD DAMMIT!
-GIVE MY GF A INSTANT RAISE SHIELD, NOT A .5 SEC AFTER LIKE WE ARE NOW. INSTANT !!
AND YEAH AFTER ALL THAT.
WHEN U ARE ROLLING YOUR DEVS EXCURSIONS AND OPEN WORLD PVP ...U SHOULD PROBABLY RUN FROM US... AS PROBABLY
YOU ALWAYS USE YOUR VERY MUCH LOVED AND PREFERED CLASES... HR, TR, CW, GWF
AS THINGS ARE NOW... U DONT HAVE THE BALLS WE DO TO RUN A GF IN DWARVEN VALLEY.
ENOUGH SAID
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guille23mxMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 340Arc User
edited June 2014
Ohh... And 1 last comment:
Probably that last nerfed on the gf was probably about some good gf thrashing some dev... So he traumatized and go and punish the whole class!! For life apparently!! Would love some devs to run some pvp on a gf vs a high end premade guild ... Lol
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katbozejziemiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 856Arc User
edited June 2014
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME WEAPON DAMAGE AS THE GWF 1000 (NOT 600)
Why should a longsword have the same damage as a greatsword? Are you high?
By the way, you had a year to make a new main. And I somehow don't remember there being this many whiners back when GWF was "bad". I wonder why.
AND YEAH AFTER ALL THAT.
WHEN U ARE ROLLING YOUR DEVS EXCURSIONS AND OPEN WORLD PVP ...U SHOULD PROBABLY RUN FROM US... AS PROBABLY
YOU ALWAYS USE YOUR VERY MUCH LOVED AND PREFERED CLASES... HR, TR, CW, GWF
AS THINGS ARE NOW... U DONT HAVE THE BALLS WE DO TO RUN A GF IN DWARVEN VALLEY.
ENOUGH SAID
Before any mod put a ban or however:Consider and think:Does th Op telling lies?have we ever saw a dev video of playing a GF?hell no.
GWFs/Hrs sometimes Cws and Dcs all the way.
guille is frustrated and angry:
if you were a Gf and not a 16k gs GWF ,you would be the same.
Seeing your class getting no love from devs for nearly a year.Instead nerfs nerfs and new nerfs.
0
guille23mxMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 340Arc User
Why should a longsword have the same damage as a greatsword? Are you high?
By the way, you had a year to make a new main. And I somehow don't remember there being this many whiners back when GWF was "bad". I wonder why.
This guy thinks hes smart by deviating the Subject and trying to invalidate my Others Points.
Am I High? Maybe u should try a GF buddy and ill wait for u here in the forums to come and QQ with me . Pff
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katbozejziemiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 856Arc User
edited June 2014
I have and have played with every class, including GF with around 14,5K GS, since I don't play that much and am focusing on one character for IWD.
And by the way my GF has 33% deflect chance, please tell me again how hard it is to get deflect as a GF.
guille is frustrated and angry:
if you were a Gf and not a 16k gs GWF ,you would be the same.
Seeing your class getting no love from devs for nearly a year.Instead nerfs nerfs and new nerfs.
I can see that, and I am not saying he should be content with where GFs are currently. They definitely need some love from the Devs, which the Devs have said they will be looking into.
Seeing your class getting no love from devs for nearly a year.Instead nerfs nerfs and new nerfs.
Once again, not disagreeing that they need some love...
My point is such posts, as the one in question, do nothing for the class in general. Patience, no matter how frustrating, and mature communication will go so much farther! :cool:
GWF wasn't even bad in beta for what PvP concerns, heck the most broken build involved them. Assuming you could afford the PSF, GPF and Greater Tenebrous enchants.
Although enchants being the most OP factor actually made PvP more balanced in a ways. Again, if you could afford it.
And beta isn't relevant, really. What matters is the now, the current state of the game.
Exactly yet they have received the MOST attention and are now the most powerful class in the game whilst GF sit in his room waiting to be picked to play for a team.
Shieldbash60 GF ~ Iron Vanguard19.0k Overpowered60 CW~ Thaumaturge14.5k ==========================================
~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
...
And by the way my GF has 33% deflect chance, please tell me again how hard it is to get deflect as a GF.
...
And this: nobody has denied.
But others and I said that a Guardian Fighter has to focus too one-sidedly on good defensive or offensive stats and has to sacrifice too much of the opposite side (compared to the Great Weapon Fighter); but even with good stats the powers of a GF have their own performance limits which prevents this class from integrating into groups as smooth as other classes right now.
Anyway, 30% Deflection Chance is something which a GWF can easily reach without losing as much damage as a GF does (although, compared to other GWFs the damage will decrease remarkably).
0
lazaroth666Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,332Arc User
CRYPTIC I KNOW YOU HATE GF'S BUT WILL ASK THIS ONCE MORE:
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME RUNNNING SPEED AS THE GWF....
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME TAB ABILITY AS THE GWF...CC INMUNNE AND GOD EASY MODE HEALING UNSTOPABLE
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME WEAPON DAMAGE AS THE GWF 1000 (NOT 600)
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME HITTING SPEED AS THE GWF (EVEN WITH THE LITTLE SPEED BUFF IN UNSTOPABLE U GAVE TO GWF)
-GIVE MY GF A GOD **** REAL SHIELD , NOT A TISSUE PAPER LIKE UR GIVEN US. ONE THAT CAN SUSTAIN 100 HITS GOD DAMMIT!
-GIVE MY GF A INSTANT RAISE SHIELD, NOT A .5 SEC AFTER LIKE WE ARE NOW. INSTANT !!
AND YEAH AFTER ALL THAT.
WHEN U ARE ROLLING YOUR DEVS EXCURSIONS AND OPEN WORLD PVP ...U SHOULD PROBABLY RUN FROM US... AS PROBABLY
YOU ALWAYS USE YOUR VERY MUCH LOVED AND PREFERED CLASES... HR, TR, CW, GWF
AS THINGS ARE NOW... U DONT HAVE THE BALLS WE DO TO RUN A GF IN DWARVEN VALLEY.
ENOUGH SAID
Asking for the same doesn't make sense, so the only difference between a GWF and a GF would be one of them using 2 handed sword and the other Sword/Shield? You, as GF, should aim for something that makes your class unique.
Lately, the devs love playing with stacks, why don't make something like the more dmg the GF receive or the lower his guard is, more damage he will be able to do, in that way a GF would go crazy in a dungeon taking aggro of every single add just to increase his damage/power/etc, the more enemies attack him, stronger he becomes (1 add/player can only add a max number of stacks or power), receiving damage build stacks of "whatever" up to 40% i.e which will reach 0% once the guard gauge is full again. This would be awesome.
I've always say a GF need a skill like the Arcane Singularity, marking all the adds in a whole area, a very strong forced taunt which would move them all towards him, it would be like if he's the center of his own AS, also this will allow the CW use another daily in the dungeons.
I've always say a GF need a skill like the Arcane Singularity, marking all the adds in a whole area, a very strong forced taunt which would move them all towards him, it would be like if he's the center of his own AS, also this will allow the CW use another daily in the dungeons.
I think that would be pretty dang awesome honestly...
There's already an encounter like that, but you'd know being a GWF, it's called "Come and Get It." What you are suggesting is a slower version of that, but I don't see how would giving it to GF make them any more unique.
Fact is the GWF and GF, as they are, are way too similar and they should have been made into the same class to begin with. We just wound up with one that got the cool insanely overpowered kit while the other got the short end of the stick..
0
lazaroth666Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,332Arc User
There's already an encounter like that, but you'd know being a GWF, it's called "Come and Get It." What you are suggesting is a slower version of that, but I don't see how would giving it to GF make them any more unique.
Fact is the GWF and GF, as they are, are way too similar and they should have been made into the same class to begin with. We just wound up with one that got the cool insanely overpowered kit while the other got the short end of the stick..
There are similarities but the whole idea is completely different. Come and get it pulls 5 targets and give you a damage buff, which doesn't even pull them properly. For a GF it would be a hard taunt that will pull every mob in the area towards him and keep them marked or at least will generate a lot of aggro, maybe working as a daily, this could be unique feature for a GF. Some kind of aggro based -astral singularity or vacuum effect- centered in the GF.
There are similarities but the whole idea is completely different. Come and get it pulls 5 targets and give you a damage buff, which doesn't even pull them properly. For a GF it would be a hard taunt that will pull every mob in the area towards him and keep them marked or at least will generate a lot of aggro, maybe working as a daily, this could be unique feature for a GF. Some kind of aggro based -astral singularity or vacuum effect- centered in the GF.
That would help them a lot. Also in PVP.
Only problem would be can a GF deal with all the potential damage in PVE? Once shield is down, he's toast.
And this: nobody has denied.
But others and I said that a Guardian Fighter has to focus too one-sidedly on good defensive or offensive stats and has to sacrifice too much of the opposite side (compared to the Great Weapon Fighter); but even with good stats the powers of a GF have their own performance limits which prevents this class from integrating into groups as smooth as other classes right now.
Anyway, 30% Deflection Chance is something which a GWF can easily reach without losing as much damage as a GF does (although, compared to other GWFs the damage will decrease remarkably).
Mr 33% Deflect doesnt get it, Mr Duck knows his stuff
Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
Asking for the same doesn't make sense, so the only difference between a GWF and a GF would be one of them using 2 handed sword and the other Sword/Shield? You, as GF, should aim for something that makes your class unique.
Lately, the devs love playing with stacks, why don't make something like the more dmg the GF receive or the lower his guard is, more damage he will be able to do, in that way a GF would go crazy in a dungeon taking aggro of every single add just to increase his damage/power/etc, the more enemies attack him, stronger he becomes (1 add/player can only add a max number of stacks or power), receiving damage build stacks of "whatever" up to 40% i.e which will reach 0% once the guard gauge is full again. This would be awesome.
I've always say a GF need a skill like the Arcane Singularity, marking all the adds in a whole area, a very strong forced taunt which would move them all towards him, it would be like if he's the center of his own AS, also this will allow the CW use another daily in the dungeons.
Power doubled at full Guard and Power tripled at empty Guard. Also instant cast Knight's Challenge + Mark as a Tab ability ( working on a single target at a time ) - thats offensively
Defensively - Highest inherent HP of all classes. My Destro GWF has the same HP as my GF and can hit much harder for much longer. Highest inherent DR and deflect of all classes.
Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
Agreed with the above having played 2 of each class. But much of the difference in survivality comes with how awesome Unstoppable is.
.
I'd struggle to try and solo the trash pulls in Dwarf King dungeon on the Guardian, whereas my Great Faceroller can do multipulls(3-4) on his own with no issues. Heck, the GWF can even solo the boss(and adds) with no trouble.
0
guille23mxMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 340Arc User
Comments
GF tab skill needs to be buffed alot, give GF DR when the mark is on or something on par with the rest.
and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
I've been a proponent that IV/Sent is still very good in PVP and just as viable as Destroyer, despite their damage being nerfed by 20-40% depending on crit change/enchant. But there are other reasons that people go Destroyer even though it isn't necessarily better, at the top of the list most likely being that Sentinel is no longer good in PVE.
Sentinel is better at point holding, backcapping, and contesting than Destroyer. It is just as good as Destroyer is now.
The thing is, Destroyer got buffed, Sentinel got nerfed. GWFs now have two viable PVP specs that are equally as good as each other. Of course, look around the forums, even a bunch of GFs claiming that GWFs got buffed in mod 3. It's illusionary, it's false.
CRYPTIC I KNOW YOU HATE GF'S BUT WILL ASK THIS ONCE MORE:
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME RUNNNING SPEED AS THE GWF....
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME TAB ABILITY AS THE GWF...CC INMUNNE AND GOD EASY MODE HEALING UNSTOPABLE
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME WEAPON DAMAGE AS THE GWF 1000 (NOT 600)
-GIVE MY GF THE SAME HITTING SPEED AS THE GWF (EVEN WITH THE LITTLE SPEED BUFF IN UNSTOPABLE U GAVE TO GWF)
-GIVE MY GF A GOD **** REAL SHIELD , NOT A TISSUE PAPER LIKE UR GIVEN US. ONE THAT CAN SUSTAIN 100 HITS GOD DAMMIT!
-GIVE MY GF A INSTANT RAISE SHIELD, NOT A .5 SEC AFTER LIKE WE ARE NOW. INSTANT !!
AND YEAH AFTER ALL THAT.
WHEN U ARE ROLLING YOUR DEVS EXCURSIONS AND OPEN WORLD PVP ...U SHOULD PROBABLY RUN FROM US... AS PROBABLY
YOU ALWAYS USE YOUR VERY MUCH LOVED AND PREFERED CLASES... HR, TR, CW, GWF
AS THINGS ARE NOW... U DONT HAVE THE BALLS WE DO TO RUN A GF IN DWARVEN VALLEY.
ENOUGH SAID
Probably that last nerfed on the gf was probably about some good gf thrashing some dev... So he traumatized and go and punish the whole class!! For life apparently!! Would love some devs to run some pvp on a gf vs a high end premade guild ... Lol
By the way, you had a year to make a new main. And I somehow don't remember there being this many whiners back when GWF was "bad". I wonder why.
And he really was bad, no need for qutation marks. I wish GWF and GF were just two paths of the same class.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
Before any mod put a ban or however:Consider and think:Does th Op telling lies?have we ever saw a dev video of playing a GF?hell no.
GWFs/Hrs sometimes Cws and Dcs all the way.
lol :cool: lol
PS - I bolded and italicized mine, does that make them better?!?!
if you were a Gf and not a 16k gs GWF ,you would be the same.
Seeing your class getting no love from devs for nearly a year.Instead nerfs nerfs and new nerfs.
This guy thinks hes smart by deviating the Subject and trying to invalidate my Others Points.
Am I High? Maybe u should try a GF buddy and ill wait for u here in the forums to come and QQ with me . Pff
And by the way my GF has 33% deflect chance, please tell me again how hard it is to get deflect as a GF.
How about you list all those supposed nerfs.
Once again, not disagreeing that they need some love...
My point is such posts, as the one in question, do nothing for the class in general. Patience, no matter how frustrating, and mature communication will go so much farther! :cool:
Although enchants being the most OP factor actually made PvP more balanced in a ways. Again, if you could afford it.
And beta isn't relevant, really. What matters is the now, the current state of the game.
Overpowered 60 CW ~ Thaumaturge 14.5k
==========================================
~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
And this: nobody has denied.
But others and I said that a Guardian Fighter has to focus too one-sidedly on good defensive or offensive stats and has to sacrifice too much of the opposite side (compared to the Great Weapon Fighter); but even with good stats the powers of a GF have their own performance limits which prevents this class from integrating into groups as smooth as other classes right now.
Anyway, 30% Deflection Chance is something which a GWF can easily reach without losing as much damage as a GF does (although, compared to other GWFs the damage will decrease remarkably).
Asking for the same doesn't make sense, so the only difference between a GWF and a GF would be one of them using 2 handed sword and the other Sword/Shield? You, as GF, should aim for something that makes your class unique.
Lately, the devs love playing with stacks, why don't make something like the more dmg the GF receive or the lower his guard is, more damage he will be able to do, in that way a GF would go crazy in a dungeon taking aggro of every single add just to increase his damage/power/etc, the more enemies attack him, stronger he becomes (1 add/player can only add a max number of stacks or power), receiving damage build stacks of "whatever" up to 40% i.e which will reach 0% once the guard gauge is full again. This would be awesome.
I've always say a GF need a skill like the Arcane Singularity, marking all the adds in a whole area, a very strong forced taunt which would move them all towards him, it would be like if he's the center of his own AS, also this will allow the CW use another daily in the dungeons.
Fact is the GWF and GF, as they are, are way too similar and they should have been made into the same class to begin with. We just wound up with one that got the cool insanely overpowered kit while the other got the short end of the stick..
There are similarities but the whole idea is completely different. Come and get it pulls 5 targets and give you a damage buff, which doesn't even pull them properly. For a GF it would be a hard taunt that will pull every mob in the area towards him and keep them marked or at least will generate a lot of aggro, maybe working as a daily, this could be unique feature for a GF. Some kind of aggro based -astral singularity or vacuum effect- centered in the GF.
That would help them a lot. Also in PVP.
Only problem would be can a GF deal with all the potential damage in PVE? Once shield is down, he's toast.
Mr 33% Deflect doesnt get it, Mr Duck knows his stuff
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
Power doubled at full Guard and Power tripled at empty Guard. Also instant cast Knight's Challenge + Mark as a Tab ability ( working on a single target at a time ) - thats offensively
Defensively - Highest inherent HP of all classes. My Destro GWF has the same HP as my GF and can hit much harder for much longer. Highest inherent DR and deflect of all classes.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
.
I'd struggle to try and solo the trash pulls in Dwarf King dungeon on the Guardian, whereas my Great Faceroller can do multipulls(3-4) on his own with no issues. Heck, the GWF can even solo the boss(and adds) with no trouble.
Keltz0r said that also!!So yup!!