when you're playing monopoly, you start the game with a set amount of money. is it okay for you to slip yourself a few hundreds from the bank mid-game just because you want to? of course not. because it is against the written rules. even though some people may have alternate rules for monopoly, i'm pretty sure they're preferences and won't unbalance the game.
I don't actually understand the relevance of this attempted metaphor. Your initial bank balance in Monopoly doesn't seem to be a very accurate or precise representation of an initial stat roll in NW.
A better explanation would be going to your local bike store and picking a bicycle based on a "generally riding around" then about 6 months later discovering a great interest in a particualar cycle based sport, eg, cyclocross, time trial, etc and finding out that you simply can't excel at your chosen sport because the general purpose bike you chose is the only one you can use, ever. Rerolling stats would be like going back to the store and buying a bike specially suited for your activity.
What's that suppose to mean... that we can't have what exactly?
PvErs should STOP coming to PvP topics and give "suggestions". They don't understand PvP.
PvPers should stop going to PvE topics and give suggestions too. Wait. There are NO PvPers in PvE topics... cause they don't care, as it should be.
The game should be developed based on feedback from people that know what they are talking about.
Most people here in the forums never-ever played (or even watched I might say) a high end premade PvP match. They are oblivious to PvP issues.
Same goes for people that complain about dungeons yet they have 10K GS toons that never cleared the high end ones.
Complaining and feedback should come from responsible, knowledgeable people.
Anything else confuses the developers.
what you're referring to is elitism and it's not something we support here on the neverwinter forums. if the forums were limited to certain individuals that could answer certain questions about game play, then your point would be valid. however the forums cater to everyone that plays neverwinter.
it is possible to become designated as a well respected member of the neverwinter forum community, but that happens through being a constructive and productive individual that doesn't violate forum rules, contributes to the community and does not degrade it.
as for the developers being confused, i trust the developers take the information provided to them from all of their data sources and make changes. it's actually an assumption that forum complaints and feedback cause the rift between PvPers and PvEers. after all, all you can see is what is here in front of you: the forum feedback. but if a class is out of balance, it's out of balance. while feedback is important to PWE, i doubt that it is their sole source of input when it comes to making game changes.
I don't actually understand the relevance of this attempted metaphor. Your initial bank balance in Monopoly doesn't seem to be a very accurate or precise representation of an initial stat roll in NW.
A better explanation would be going to your local bike store and picking a bicycle based on a "generally riding around" then about 6 months later discovering a great interest in a particualar cycle based sport, eg, cyclocross, time trial, etc and finding out that you simply can't excel at your chosen sport because the general purpose bike you chose is the only one you can use, ever. Rerolling stats would be like going back to the store and buying a bike specially suited for your activity.
actually, my analogy was more leaning towards dungeon and dragon PnP rules where your stat rolls are actually a roll of the dice. once you agree on these stats, you can't go back and change them. only in extremely rare situations can this be done through game play.
in your analogy, you can easily go back and purchase a new bike just like you can re-roll a new character. the analogy doesn't specify that buying a new bike is analogous to allowing re-rolling initial ability stats.
Maybe it's just the EVE player in me speaking, but choices should have consequences. If you choose to make a character with terrible starting stats, the consequence for that is subpar performance and/or the need to compensate for those stats/roll a new character. Anyone who is "hardcore" enough at this - or any other - game to care significantly about starting stats should also be hardcore enough to read a little bit about what stats actually are and do (those tooltips in character creation are really not helpful to brand-new players, Cryptic) before making a character.
If you choose to focus your build on PvE or PvP to the point where you're unviable in one or the other (you must be extremely specialized if this is happening), the consequence of your choice is that you're a force to be reckoned with in your chosen aspect of the game, but unable to compete outside of your specialization.
If you choose to spend completely incredible amounts of real-world money on something because it's currently unbalanced in your favor to do so, the consequence of that choice is having your investment become worthless when that imbalance is inevitably fixed.
Choices and consequences. Actual decision-making. Meaningful gameplay. If you don't like it, maybe you're more of a "filthy casual" than you think you are.
0
arbitrarityMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 96Arc User
edited April 2014
D&D also has Point-Buy as an option. And y'know what? Usually when you make a new character, you start over at around the same level as the rest of the party, with appropriate wealth-by-level. Only realllllly old-school DMs would make you start at level 1, with starting wealth, because you'd be a complete liability for literally months of play.
what you're referring to is elitism and it's not something we support here on the neverwinter forums. if the forums were limited to certain individuals that could answer certain questions about game play, then your point would be valid. however the forums cater to everyone that plays neverwinter.
it is possible to become designated as a well respected member of the neverwinter forum community, but that happens through being a constructive and productive individual that doesn't violate forum rules, contributes to the community and does not degrade it.
as for the developers being confused, i trust the developers take the information provided to them from all of their data sources and make changes. it's actually an assumption that forum complaints and feedback cause the rift between PvPers and PvEers. after all, all you can see is what is here in front of you: the forum feedback. but if a class is out of balance, it's out of balance. while feedback is important to PWE, i doubt that it is their sole source of input when it comes to making game changes.
I am fully against elitism.
I am however fully in favor of knowledgeable, constructive feedback. I can recognize it from the start, as most people that come to speak about PvP here lack the slightest insight into what PvP in Neverwinter actually is. This is a sad situations, and many real PvP players I talked to in the game purely refuse to even speak up in the forums, because they will be trolled by unknowledgeable people, and when they respond back (usually in a less than civilized manner, after all the stupid trolling), the topics get locked or sent to Lower Depths.
As for the developers being confused, it was a mis-wording from my part; what I wanted to say is that:
- bad feedback from people not being informed is misleading the developers. Even as they have other info sources, because the forum qq is like a river that never stops flowing, as it is the case nowadays with perma TRs (even the fact that people call them perma should say how bad they are at PvP) and GWFs.
when you're playing monopoly, you start the game with a set amount of money. is it okay for you to slip yourself a few hundreds from the bank mid-game just because you want to? of course not. because it is against the written rules. even though some people may have alternate rules for monopoly, i'm pretty sure they're preferences and won't unbalance the game.
Moving stat points is a petty thing to fight against.
Moving stat points is a petty thing to fight against.
from my point of view, it's the equivalent of being able to slip yourself some extra cash from the bank mid-game. it's not an active fight, it's from the standpoint of overall game balance. why not just allow people that have already reached level 60 the option of buying a pre-leveled 60? because this is a game and to get from level 1 to level 60, you have to earn it no matter if you've bought zen or are a completely free player.
I am however fully in favor of knowledgeable, constructive feedback. I can recognize it from the start, as most people that come to speak about PvP here lack the slightest insight into what PvP in Neverwinter actually is. This is a sad situations, and many real PvP players I talked to in the game purely refuse to even speak up in the forums, because they will be trolled by unknowledgeable people, and when they respond back (usually in a less than civilized manner, after all the stupid trolling), the topics get locked or sent to Lower Depths.
As for the developers being confused, it was a mis-wording from my part; what I wanted to say is that:
- bad feedback from people not being informed is misleading the developers. Even as they have other info sources, because the forum qq is like a river that never stops flowing, as it is the case nowadays with perma TRs (even the fact that people call them perma should say how bad they are at PvP) and GWFs.
i can't prove it but i could assure you that the devs are not misled; they don't make spot decisions, they have many discussions about something before it is finalized. things are tested and retested internally. however with so many moving parts in this living breathing thing we call neverwinter, it's easy for things to happen and things not working as intended.
it's the nature of the beast. all MMOs are very similar in this fact.
when you're playing monopoly, you start the game with a set amount of money. is it okay for you to slip yourself a few hundreds from the bank mid-game just because you want to? of course not. because it is against the written rules. even though some people may have alternate rules for monopoly, i'm pretty sure they're preferences and won't unbalance the game.
no one is asking for extra "money", just the option to move it. As far as balance, no one is aksing for anything that was not an option at character creation, when a lot of people were clueless. It can just as easily be construed that PWI is taking advantage of people who have limited knowledge by forcing them to abandon a character to reroll another more desirable character once they gain sufficient knowledge.
At the core of the "Stat Re-roll" arguement is the fact that the tooltips provided at character creation are poorly done. They really should be reworked and made more descriptive. I realize some people are loath to read, especially at the beginning of a game, but if the information is there then they have no one to blame but themselves.
My personal take on the matter is that "Stat Re-rolls" should be allowed, but not something that can be bought in the Zen store. It should be something that is earned through a difficult and lengthy adventure.
no one is asking for extra "money", just the option to move it. As far as balance, no one is aksing for anything that was not an option at character creation, when a lot of people were clueless. It can just as easily be construed that PWI is taking advantage of people who have limited knowledge by forcing them to abandon a character to reroll another more desirable character once they gain sufficient knowledge.
when you start the game at level 1, you begin with a set amount of stats. that means that up until you wash up on the shores of neverwinter, your stats were XYZ.
if you're familiar with d&d then you understand what the stats are. if you're familiar with any MMORPG then you're familiar with stats in general and if you want to get the best out of your stats, there are many articles available on the internet that would allow you to either make an educated choice or to plug in cookie cutter settings. it may be only min/maxers that might be interested in this kind of knowledge but the knowledge is out there.
there are functional reasons why the information provided in the character creation process is limited and that is merely to simplify the process. this is the screen that every new player sees and if it's overly complicated, then that may steer away the exact target audience they're trying to attract. even if the explanation of the stats affected by initial ability rolls existed, it would not make any sense to new players since they lack the experience to effectively apply this information. it would require research to be effective.
however, the character creation process isn't broken. the primary and secondary stats of your class are provided to you as well as racial stat bonuses in correlation. if the majority of players can create a character and reach end game then these initial stats can't be a major hindrance.
when you start the game at level 1, you begin with a set amount of stats. that means that up until you wash up on the shores of neverwinter, your stats were XYZ.
if you're familiar with d&d then you understand what the stats are. if you're familiar with any MMORPG then you're familiar with stats in general and if you want to get the best out of your stats, there are many articles available on the internet that would allow you to either make an educated choice or to plug in cookie cutter settings. it may be only min/maxers that might be interested in this kind of knowledge but the knowledge is out there.
there are functional reasons why the information provided in the character creation process is limited and that is merely to simplify the process. this is the screen that every new player sees and if it's overly complicated, then that may steer away the exact target audience they're trying to attract. even if the explanation of the stats affected by initial ability rolls existed, it would not make any sense to new players since they lack the experience to effectively apply this information. it would require research to be effective.
however, the character creation process isn't broken. the primary and secondary stats of your class are provided to you as well as racial stat bonuses in correlation. if the majority of players can create a character and reach end game then these initial stats can't be a major hindrance.
your point is pretty much invalid since this game has changed so much during the last year. What is good and what is not good, the best build, setup for a charr etc, it basically changes every month.
its not too much of an ask and it would be very helpful if we could reroll our ability scores to keep up with all the changes.
your point is pretty much invalid since this game has changed so much during the last year. What is good and what is not good, the best build, setup for a charr etc, it basically changes every month.
its not too much of an ask and it would be very helpful if we could reroll our ability scores to keep up with all the changes.
you can take whatever you like from my opinions, but the fact still remains that initial ability stat re-rolls are still not an option regardless of how many times the topic has surfaced on these forums.
My personal take on the matter is that "Stat Re-rolls" should be allowed, but not something that can be bought in the Zen store. It should be something that is earned through a difficult and lengthy adventure.
if they were to be implemented, then i would like it to be through a difficult process rather than be a simple "do over". in d&d, it's a rare process that requires strong magic.
Case in point: wisdom as a primary stat for clerics, when the game is less about healing and more about mitigation, which doesn't benefit from wisdom at all. You end up being more effective going str happy (for crits) and cha happy (for recovery, so you can spam mitigation around more readily) than if you focus on wisdom. A cleric with 26 wis but str&cha at 17 is going to be less effective than one with 20 in all three stats.
Is this made obvious at the outset? Nope.
Add to this you CAN ALREADY respec all of your allocated stat points gained through levelling up, so I cannot see, in any sense whatsoever, how changing core stats to a more appropriate roll is fundamentally different from changing all of your skills, all of your feats and all the stats you gained from 1-60.
If you can come up with some sort of handwavy in-game justification for "paying diamonds to somehow forget everything you've ever known and then relearn something different" then it shouldn't be too hard to extend that to core stats too.
To be honest, the attempts to make things "lore-consistent" are fairly ludicrous anyway, when we have point-cap PvP, the ability to buy rideable demon horses, award-winning pigs and gelatinous cubes (<3), one-of-a-kind artifacts of immense power that everyone has like, two or three of, and so on. The game ain't realistic, and it's not even D&D-consistent.
however, the character creation process isn't broken. the primary and secondary stats of your class are provided to you as well as racial stat bonuses in correlation. if the majority of players can create a character and reach end game then these initial stats can't be a major hindrance.
When me and my husband made our first characters here in Neverwinter, there was no PvP scene. There was no info on the Internet either. Took a few good weeks (months?) for people to realize halflings were better than everything else.
In other games, the racials are somewhat equal. One race has crowd control resistance for example, and another increased damage, and that damage is enough to compensate.
Not in Neverwinter.
Here you cannot get better than halfling at PvP, it's immensely superior to anything else, in such a way that made us reroll.
Not to mention that the racial description is at best... incomplete. I won't enter details, as I don't want it to change...
What I'm trying to say is that there were numerous metas in PvP since the game's public release. The descriptions are incomplete and there's no proper detailed database as other games have.
I personally don't really care about these changes, since I already rerolled all I have as a halfling, but I can see how it would help others.
1. I could honestly do without Dual-Spec. If it were to become available I would welcome it. I see the Pros and Cons to both sides of this and I guess I am ultimately indifferent on this matter.
2. Strongly agree with this idea. Think about this matter like this : Initial ability scores are the third decision you make in the game. Like with any MMO, there will be hundreds if not thousands of decisions that you make that will make your character your own. It seems quite unfair that the THIRD decision you make when beginning to play a game has such a VITAL and PERMANENT effect on your character. Only making this matter worse is the fact that you can not only end up with points allocated in places you don't want them, but you can actually end up with less total ability points than other characters. Just seems like a severe disadvantage to place on people at such an early stage in the game.
The only legitimate arguments against this suggestion is that people support this idea of 're-rolling for perfection', which some MMOs feature as sort of a drawing point or replayability factor. That, and I'm sure Cryptic gets a good amount of income from people who re-roll.
As far as the lore argument, I don't really see how that could be considered legitimate when there is already the ability to retrain your powers, feats, leveling ability scores, and paragon path, rename your character, and even change your character's appearance. With all these things available it seems there is precedent to allow for initial ability score re-rolls.
3. I think this is really a matter of expanding the PvE content. One can only assume that Tier 3 Dungeons are coming and this is probably what will bring the long-time players back to grinding PvE.
--- Ranked matches need to be solo-queue only
Enforce rainbow parties in PvP ---- 10v10 PvP ----
paying zen to replace 2 stat points is only for the elitist and/or min-maxers. Nobody else gives a goblin's poopdeck. It won't make you a better player and those 2% crit dmg or whatever you're after won't make any difference either. I don't mind people being desperate to spend money on a game, but at least spend it on something useful.
1) Dual-spec: I believe this is absolutely paramount for the success of Neverwinter. Right now a player can choose a PVP spec, a PVE spec, or a hybrid. This, of course, is severely limiting, because it forces a player to be great at one or the other, or mediocre at both. Havin a dual-spec would let players fully enjoy both PVE and PVP content. This would encourage players to play more Neverwinter. It's only a win for Cryptic!
I don't think it will have too much of an effect in more players playing NW. If they play NW, they play NW. If they don't, this won't change their minds. This only affects the min-maxers, the most hardcore of hardcore and those same players are willing to remake toons anyway. Have you guys seen the endgame content? Any 13k GS player who doesn't have a completely awful build is able to finish the hardest dungeons. You think 4 more intelligence is going to decide whether they fail the dungeon or not?
Cryptic's reasoning might be it would artificially increase their content for players to keep making new toons. However, with more and more classes being released, this could be a problem since players will need/want to focus on more and more different classes in the future.
Now I have some compromises. Include rerolling of scores in the new more expensive tier Full Respec Token (ballpark 400zen). It gives cryptic some moneyback for your wrong choices, creates another small AD sink.
Another way is to indeed create a dualspec option. Now this will be more expensive than the Full Respec Token because it is almost like having a new character level up from 1-60 and then get all the boons/titles etc (ballpark 700zen)
Again, some people will complain about these prices, they are there not to primarily make cryptic money, but to give the hardcore players an option for a fee of course. The price shouldn't devalue the work of having to level a toon from 1-60 and getting all the boons but at the same time, be able to provide a feasible option for some players to be able to dualspec without doing days to weeks of recreating their toon.
Like someone said, complaining about not having +2 intelligence ruining your entire build is only for the elitist. But these elitists should be given the option without having to create a new character and spend 1 month regaining all their boons...for a price of course. If you do not have enough diamonds for the prices listed, then maybe you shouldn't be complaining about it and focus on getting better at the game and farming T1/T2 gear first
paying zen to replace 2 stat points is only for the elitist and/or min-maxers. Nobody else gives a goblin's poopdeck. It won't make you a better player and those 2% crit dmg or whatever you're after won't make any difference either. I don't mind people being desperate to spend money on a game, but at least spend it on something useful.
I am not a min/maxer or an elitist. I do give a goblin's poopdeck.
Strictly speaking, the 2% crit you are talking about will in fact make a difference : 2% Crit.
It might not be a lot, and might not make a huge difference, but your line of thought seems to support the idea of "Why strive for perfection when you can settle for being sufficient?" Not everyone agrees with that stance.
Your post seems to ignore the possibility that people who do not min/max could use these extra ability points to further balance their point allocation in lesser ability scores and not just further their "maxing".
I care about my character. It bothers me that within 5 minutes of playing this game, I chose a race, a class, and then made a critical and permanent mistake that has put my character at a disadvantage .
--- Ranked matches need to be solo-queue only
Enforce rainbow parties in PvP ---- 10v10 PvP ----
Saying you can't play the game without those 2 statpoints ...
claiming you don't want a disadvantage in any way is the same....
I did not say that or claim that. Please don't take what I say out of context or blatantly misquote me.
I support the idea of allowing initial ability scores to be re-rolled on the basis that many people end up with less points than other people. Please try to realize that this is very different from things like racial bonuses, where one race gets a certain type of advantage and another race gets a different type of advantage. This is pros and cons.
With ability scores, there is no pros and cons. Its just pros if you do it correctly and just cons if you do it incorrectly. Being the third decision in the game, I find it very unfair.
--- Ranked matches need to be solo-queue only
Enforce rainbow parties in PvP ---- 10v10 PvP ----
Hello,
I need to reset the basic abilities at my character. I have a lot of things on her bouded, and I can not imagine that I would have to do the campaign and look for all things back again, please help me What can I do? Plan creators add some token on this? thx
You might as well ask "can you play the game as a Con/Str/Dex-stacked wizard with feats and power picked entirely at random?
Well..yes, but why would you want to?
Given you can ALREADY just pay "arbitrary fee X" and reallocate all those levelling up points from con/dex/str into int and wis, and pick a decent set of powers and feats that suit your playstyle......then denying a reroll on those last few fundamental base points seems nonsensical.
Sure you could argue that anyone who stacked dex and str on a wizard is an idiot (and you'd be right), but it's a question of where you draw the line. Clearly the line is already drawn significantly on the side of 'respec virtually everything', so why not push it over to those last few stat points too?
Plus add to this that if you're coming to the game entirely fresh, you have no idea how the 'dice rolls' work.
If you're careful, it probably takes you all of three 'rolls' to establish that it's clearly not random, but you're unlikely to sit there long enough to establish exactly how few patterns there are, nor how they're weighted, nor what effects those patterns will have on your subsequent build, especially since the tooltips are vague and often downright misleading.
This is not a good way to present something that will fundamentally affect your character forever.
Comments
I don't actually understand the relevance of this attempted metaphor. Your initial bank balance in Monopoly doesn't seem to be a very accurate or precise representation of an initial stat roll in NW.
A better explanation would be going to your local bike store and picking a bicycle based on a "generally riding around" then about 6 months later discovering a great interest in a particualar cycle based sport, eg, cyclocross, time trial, etc and finding out that you simply can't excel at your chosen sport because the general purpose bike you chose is the only one you can use, ever. Rerolling stats would be like going back to the store and buying a bike specially suited for your activity.
what you're referring to is elitism and it's not something we support here on the neverwinter forums. if the forums were limited to certain individuals that could answer certain questions about game play, then your point would be valid. however the forums cater to everyone that plays neverwinter.
it is possible to become designated as a well respected member of the neverwinter forum community, but that happens through being a constructive and productive individual that doesn't violate forum rules, contributes to the community and does not degrade it.
as for the developers being confused, i trust the developers take the information provided to them from all of their data sources and make changes. it's actually an assumption that forum complaints and feedback cause the rift between PvPers and PvEers. after all, all you can see is what is here in front of you: the forum feedback. but if a class is out of balance, it's out of balance. while feedback is important to PWE, i doubt that it is their sole source of input when it comes to making game changes.
actually, my analogy was more leaning towards dungeon and dragon PnP rules where your stat rolls are actually a roll of the dice. once you agree on these stats, you can't go back and change them. only in extremely rare situations can this be done through game play.
in your analogy, you can easily go back and purchase a new bike just like you can re-roll a new character. the analogy doesn't specify that buying a new bike is analogous to allowing re-rolling initial ability stats.
If you choose to focus your build on PvE or PvP to the point where you're unviable in one or the other (you must be extremely specialized if this is happening), the consequence of your choice is that you're a force to be reckoned with in your chosen aspect of the game, but unable to compete outside of your specialization.
If you choose to spend completely incredible amounts of real-world money on something because it's currently unbalanced in your favor to do so, the consequence of that choice is having your investment become worthless when that imbalance is inevitably fixed.
Choices and consequences. Actual decision-making. Meaningful gameplay. If you don't like it, maybe you're more of a "filthy casual" than you think you are.
I am fully against elitism.
I am however fully in favor of knowledgeable, constructive feedback. I can recognize it from the start, as most people that come to speak about PvP here lack the slightest insight into what PvP in Neverwinter actually is. This is a sad situations, and many real PvP players I talked to in the game purely refuse to even speak up in the forums, because they will be trolled by unknowledgeable people, and when they respond back (usually in a less than civilized manner, after all the stupid trolling), the topics get locked or sent to Lower Depths.
As for the developers being confused, it was a mis-wording from my part; what I wanted to say is that:
- bad feedback from people not being informed is misleading the developers. Even as they have other info sources, because the forum qq is like a river that never stops flowing, as it is the case nowadays with perma TRs (even the fact that people call them perma should say how bad they are at PvP) and GWFs.
Moving stat points is a petty thing to fight against.
from my point of view, it's the equivalent of being able to slip yourself some extra cash from the bank mid-game. it's not an active fight, it's from the standpoint of overall game balance. why not just allow people that have already reached level 60 the option of buying a pre-leveled 60? because this is a game and to get from level 1 to level 60, you have to earn it no matter if you've bought zen or are a completely free player.
i can't prove it but i could assure you that the devs are not misled; they don't make spot decisions, they have many discussions about something before it is finalized. things are tested and retested internally. however with so many moving parts in this living breathing thing we call neverwinter, it's easy for things to happen and things not working as intended.
it's the nature of the beast. all MMOs are very similar in this fact.
no one is asking for extra "money", just the option to move it. As far as balance, no one is aksing for anything that was not an option at character creation, when a lot of people were clueless. It can just as easily be construed that PWI is taking advantage of people who have limited knowledge by forcing them to abandon a character to reroll another more desirable character once they gain sufficient knowledge.
My personal take on the matter is that "Stat Re-rolls" should be allowed, but not something that can be bought in the Zen store. It should be something that is earned through a difficult and lengthy adventure.
when you start the game at level 1, you begin with a set amount of stats. that means that up until you wash up on the shores of neverwinter, your stats were XYZ.
if you're familiar with d&d then you understand what the stats are. if you're familiar with any MMORPG then you're familiar with stats in general and if you want to get the best out of your stats, there are many articles available on the internet that would allow you to either make an educated choice or to plug in cookie cutter settings. it may be only min/maxers that might be interested in this kind of knowledge but the knowledge is out there.
there are functional reasons why the information provided in the character creation process is limited and that is merely to simplify the process. this is the screen that every new player sees and if it's overly complicated, then that may steer away the exact target audience they're trying to attract. even if the explanation of the stats affected by initial ability rolls existed, it would not make any sense to new players since they lack the experience to effectively apply this information. it would require research to be effective.
however, the character creation process isn't broken. the primary and secondary stats of your class are provided to you as well as racial stat bonuses in correlation. if the majority of players can create a character and reach end game then these initial stats can't be a major hindrance.
your point is pretty much invalid since this game has changed so much during the last year. What is good and what is not good, the best build, setup for a charr etc, it basically changes every month.
its not too much of an ask and it would be very helpful if we could reroll our ability scores to keep up with all the changes.
you can take whatever you like from my opinions, but the fact still remains that initial ability stat re-rolls are still not an option regardless of how many times the topic has surfaced on these forums.
if they were to be implemented, then i would like it to be through a difficult process rather than be a simple "do over". in d&d, it's a rare process that requires strong magic.
Is this made obvious at the outset? Nope.
Add to this you CAN ALREADY respec all of your allocated stat points gained through levelling up, so I cannot see, in any sense whatsoever, how changing core stats to a more appropriate roll is fundamentally different from changing all of your skills, all of your feats and all the stats you gained from 1-60.
If you can come up with some sort of handwavy in-game justification for "paying diamonds to somehow forget everything you've ever known and then relearn something different" then it shouldn't be too hard to extend that to core stats too.
To be honest, the attempts to make things "lore-consistent" are fairly ludicrous anyway, when we have point-cap PvP, the ability to buy rideable demon horses, award-winning pigs and gelatinous cubes (<3), one-of-a-kind artifacts of immense power that everyone has like, two or three of, and so on. The game ain't realistic, and it's not even D&D-consistent.
When me and my husband made our first characters here in Neverwinter, there was no PvP scene. There was no info on the Internet either. Took a few good weeks (months?) for people to realize halflings were better than everything else.
In other games, the racials are somewhat equal. One race has crowd control resistance for example, and another increased damage, and that damage is enough to compensate.
Not in Neverwinter.
Here you cannot get better than halfling at PvP, it's immensely superior to anything else, in such a way that made us reroll.
Not to mention that the racial description is at best... incomplete. I won't enter details, as I don't want it to change...
What I'm trying to say is that there were numerous metas in PvP since the game's public release. The descriptions are incomplete and there's no proper detailed database as other games have.
I personally don't really care about these changes, since I already rerolled all I have as a halfling, but I can see how it would help others.
Because I have a full-time job, a wife, and I run a guild. Starting a character from scratch is a bit of work.
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2. Strongly agree with this idea. Think about this matter like this : Initial ability scores are the third decision you make in the game. Like with any MMO, there will be hundreds if not thousands of decisions that you make that will make your character your own. It seems quite unfair that the THIRD decision you make when beginning to play a game has such a VITAL and PERMANENT effect on your character. Only making this matter worse is the fact that you can not only end up with points allocated in places you don't want them, but you can actually end up with less total ability points than other characters. Just seems like a severe disadvantage to place on people at such an early stage in the game.
The only legitimate arguments against this suggestion is that people support this idea of 're-rolling for perfection', which some MMOs feature as sort of a drawing point or replayability factor. That, and I'm sure Cryptic gets a good amount of income from people who re-roll.
As far as the lore argument, I don't really see how that could be considered legitimate when there is already the ability to retrain your powers, feats, leveling ability scores, and paragon path, rename your character, and even change your character's appearance. With all these things available it seems there is precedent to allow for initial ability score re-rolls.
3. I think this is really a matter of expanding the PvE content. One can only assume that Tier 3 Dungeons are coming and this is probably what will bring the long-time players back to grinding PvE.
Enforce rainbow parties in PvP ---- 10v10 PvP ----
Boom! /thread
yeah. respecing is a fun part of any game. in this one it simply costs to much. very annoying
I don't think it will have too much of an effect in more players playing NW. If they play NW, they play NW. If they don't, this won't change their minds. This only affects the min-maxers, the most hardcore of hardcore and those same players are willing to remake toons anyway. Have you guys seen the endgame content? Any 13k GS player who doesn't have a completely awful build is able to finish the hardest dungeons. You think 4 more intelligence is going to decide whether they fail the dungeon or not?
Cryptic's reasoning might be it would artificially increase their content for players to keep making new toons. However, with more and more classes being released, this could be a problem since players will need/want to focus on more and more different classes in the future.
Now I have some compromises. Include rerolling of scores in the new more expensive tier Full Respec Token (ballpark 400zen). It gives cryptic some moneyback for your wrong choices, creates another small AD sink.
Another way is to indeed create a dualspec option. Now this will be more expensive than the Full Respec Token because it is almost like having a new character level up from 1-60 and then get all the boons/titles etc (ballpark 700zen)
Again, some people will complain about these prices, they are there not to primarily make cryptic money, but to give the hardcore players an option for a fee of course. The price shouldn't devalue the work of having to level a toon from 1-60 and getting all the boons but at the same time, be able to provide a feasible option for some players to be able to dualspec without doing days to weeks of recreating their toon.
Like someone said, complaining about not having +2 intelligence ruining your entire build is only for the elitist. But these elitists should be given the option without having to create a new character and spend 1 month regaining all their boons...for a price of course. If you do not have enough diamonds for the prices listed, then maybe you shouldn't be complaining about it and focus on getting better at the game and farming T1/T2 gear first
I am not a min/maxer or an elitist. I do give a goblin's poopdeck.
Strictly speaking, the 2% crit you are talking about will in fact make a difference : 2% Crit.
It might not be a lot, and might not make a huge difference, but your line of thought seems to support the idea of "Why strive for perfection when you can settle for being sufficient?" Not everyone agrees with that stance.
Your post seems to ignore the possibility that people who do not min/max could use these extra ability points to further balance their point allocation in lesser ability scores and not just further their "maxing".
I care about my character. It bothers me that within 5 minutes of playing this game, I chose a race, a class, and then made a critical and permanent mistake that has put my character at a disadvantage .
Enforce rainbow parties in PvP ---- 10v10 PvP ----
I did not say that or claim that. Please don't take what I say out of context or blatantly misquote me.
I support the idea of allowing initial ability scores to be re-rolled on the basis that many people end up with less points than other people. Please try to realize that this is very different from things like racial bonuses, where one race gets a certain type of advantage and another race gets a different type of advantage. This is pros and cons.
With ability scores, there is no pros and cons. Its just pros if you do it correctly and just cons if you do it incorrectly. Being the third decision in the game, I find it very unfair.
Enforce rainbow parties in PvP ---- 10v10 PvP ----
I need to reset the basic abilities at my character. I have a lot of things on her bouded, and I can not imagine that I would have to do the campaign and look for all things back again, please help me
Well..yes, but why would you want to?
Given you can ALREADY just pay "arbitrary fee X" and reallocate all those levelling up points from con/dex/str into int and wis, and pick a decent set of powers and feats that suit your playstyle......then denying a reroll on those last few fundamental base points seems nonsensical.
Sure you could argue that anyone who stacked dex and str on a wizard is an idiot (and you'd be right), but it's a question of where you draw the line. Clearly the line is already drawn significantly on the side of 'respec virtually everything', so why not push it over to those last few stat points too?
Plus add to this that if you're coming to the game entirely fresh, you have no idea how the 'dice rolls' work.
If you're careful, it probably takes you all of three 'rolls' to establish that it's clearly not random, but you're unlikely to sit there long enough to establish exactly how few patterns there are, nor how they're weighted, nor what effects those patterns will have on your subsequent build, especially since the tooltips are vague and often downright misleading.
This is not a good way to present something that will fundamentally affect your character forever.