I guess that makes a CW's Ice Knife a cheesy instant-win button that even the most talentless player can implement without waiting for someone's health to dip. On more than one occasion Ice Knife one shot killed me with full health. Do I want it nerfed? No.
Nah, it doesn't really compare, and the reasons why were already explained quite a few times.
- IK can be dodged, deflected, mitigated by armored classes
- doesn't get through SF
Other than these things, I do believe that IK is a cheese-move itself, and I'm a CW. Should crit for what it hits normally on PvP. Fewer cheese-moves, longer and nicer matches.
Other than these things, I do believe that IK is a cheese-move itself, and I'm a CW. Should crit for what it hits normally on PvP. Fewer cheese-moves, longer and nicer matches.
So true... I fall in despair when I fail the timing... Whether it is PvP or PvE...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] "With the force of Wind and Ice , I shall rise..."
Speaking as a GWF - When I am on a point and I start getting ranged and path of blades....and there is NOTHING I can do....I run away. Add Tenes and I don't even get that. I get to die or develop ESP in order to PREDICT where the TR MIGHT be standing. The one thing we as GWF can do is fire off our wonderful daily skill that tickles the TR for 300 HP in the hopes of uncovering them.
What king said. You run towards the stealth TR. Ive found TRs hate being in melee range unless they have their dailies. Even then a GWF (especially a sentinel) will survive their initial burst, then you pop off your encounters/dailies (just make sure they used ITC). A BIS geared (perfect vorpal/enchant 8-10) this could be suicide but you don't run into them toooo often.
I guess that makes a CW's Ice Knife a cheesy instant-win button that even the most talentless player can implement without waiting for someone's health to dip. On more than one occasion Ice Knife one shot killed me with full health. Do I want it nerfed? No.
Are you trying so hard to be clever that you conveniently forgot how Ice Knife works, or did you honestly not know?
What about those?
(copy/paste from my previous post)
Would a twitch of stealth be bad? Like exiting stealth when hitting or receiving damage as many people said? But this of course will not stay as it is. Right next to this "nerf", it can be added the advantage e.g. which side of the character you attack you get a bonus.
For example:
- Attack from the back: Increased damage, stun/prone with a 100% rate or increased critical rate .
- Attack on the side: Less increased damage than the backstab, debuffs mentioned above applied with a lesser rate.
The bonuses are interesting and might be good but a few things you may not know.
1. Stealth is depleted when a TR takes damage already. The TR has to cast Lurker's Assault or bait&switch or Shadow Strike to refill stealth quickly. Shadow strike does very little damage and bait&switch does no damage. Lurker's Assault has already been nerfed 60%.
2. A TR casting an encounter like Impact Shot or Lashing Blade is knocked out of stealth unless Lurker's Assault is active.
3. Stealthed TRs are limited to At-Will powers if they want to stay in stealth. Gloaming Cut, Cloud of Steel, Sly Flourish, and Duelists Fury.
4. Stealth does not make TRs immune to damage. Impossibly to Catch + Stealth is immunity for a few seconds.
5. Players will complain about the bonuses you suggested because some will complain about anything.
6. Players tend to exaggerate stealth and make it seem it is active 100% of the time on its own without the stealthed player doing anything. Some players even claim it gives 100% immunity to damage all the time.
Every class has advantages and disadvantages. Learn the disadvantages of you class to overcome them. Learn the advantages of your class and the disadvatages of other classes to use them in pvp to win.
There is no point to whine for nerfs because you win some and loose some. Crying just makes a player look like a crier and no one, especially the devs, should take them seriously. Have a nice day!:)
Well, people are not the same and there will always be differences considering their opinions so a company cannot keep everyone satisfied. We had quite a nice discussion here. I guess that is all for tonight.I have to wake up early tomorrow and I am already late. If someone wants, add me in game. I hate to play alone.
Good night.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] "With the force of Wind and Ice , I shall rise..."
I will never use a perma-stealth build, and I never use the shocking execution daily skill.
To me, shocking execution is just a cheap way to play in PvP. The majority of perma stealth TRs that I have fought will do their stealth stuff, throw their knives, do damage that isn't significant with my regen, and then they'll rely on shocking execution to finish the job. Who would want to rely on their daily power to even get a single kill? Not me.
Also, in Rivenscar, if you're on one of the side points, a lot of perma stealth TRs will actually hide in the corner when they're stealth meter runs out.
Shocking Execution has been massively nerfed. It used to be a go-to skill for most rogues, particularly in PvE. Not anymore. As for relying on a daily power for a single kill, when it is against a GF with maxed HP and almost 50% mitigation it was so worth it.
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
0
kingculexMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Other than these things, I do believe that IK is a cheese-move itself, and I'm a CW. Should crit for what it hits normally on PvP. Fewer cheese-moves, longer and nicer matches.
Thanks for agreeing it is a cheese-move itself. SE can be dodged but it takes precise timing just like IK. SE does not hit hard unless the other player is already injured by a significant amount or Greater Tenebrous is involved or vorpal is involved.
Shocking Execution
-Dodgeable requires timing. <- This has been gone over extensively already.
-Target being significantly injured.
-Vorpal or Tenebrous
-Lucky Crit
The nerf to Shocking Execution that is reasonable since its damage has been nerfed by 60% is that it does not go through SF. It might be a glitch with SF. Shocking Execution can be dodged and only takes timing to do it.
Every class has advantages and disadvantages. Learn the disadvantages of you class to overcome them. Learn the advantages of your class and the disadvatages of other classes to use them in pvp to win.
There is no point to whine for nerfs because you win some and loose some. Crying just makes a player look like a crier and no one, especially the devs, should take them seriously. Have a nice day!:)
6. Players tend to exaggerate stealth and make it seem it is active 100% of the time on its own without the stealthed player doing anything. Some players even claim it gives 100% immunity to damage all the time.
Or they have encountered some of the cheaters, which was far from limited to TR's.
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
0
pers3phoneBanned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited October 2013
A nice addition to this topic, it's not about PvP, but still in the cheese category.
Basically, ran a hugely boring CN today with a TR that completely soloed 1st and 3rd bosses, skipped the 2nd for expediency. I was still needed to repel adds, yey, I like being useful.
Pure balance, I'd say Guess what set of gear was the TR using and what spec?
I mean, people constantly complained because HV CWs were so good at cheesing bosses, but at least we never could solo them and we needed to be 2-3.
Well guess what, a single permastealth TR (without great gear, btw) can solo-farm CNs first 3 bosses.
0
beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
Like exiting stealth when hitting or receiving damage as many people said?
They do. This is why AoE attacks, like your Icy Terrain, or the example given of a DC's divine Sunburst, will hurt a stealthed rogue and probably break them out of their stealth. There is one passive power TRs can slot that greatly reduces stealth loss from incoming damage, but guess what? Slotting that power reduces the player's ability to dish out damage of their own.
I already explained that the vast majority of a TR's encounter abilities will break their stealth immediately.
What king said. You run towards the stealth TR. Ive found TRs hate being in melee range unless they have their dailies. Even then a GWF (especially a sentinel) will survive their initial burst, then you pop off your encounters/dailies (just make sure they used ITC). A BIS geared (perfect vorpal/enchant 8-10) this could be suicide but you don't run into them toooo often.
I take it you guys have never played a GWF in premade v premade. You don't simply run at a good tr when you don't know where he hit from. A well played TR is devastating unless you have the proper skills to deal with said TR. Mechanics of this game dictate your strengths and weaknesses. We can only control so much as a player.
I would rather they gave us poor ole GWFs some sort of detection other than slotting slam which is the weakest pvp daily. The tr can already use itc/dodge/stealth/range...it is time to give some counter.
Shocking Execution has been massively nerfed. It used to be a go-to skill for most rogues, particularly in PvE. Not anymore. As for relying on a daily power for a single kill, when it is against a GF with maxed HP and almost 50% mitigation it was so worth it.
I'm aware of the nerf. But it's still widely used in PvP.
Also, in Rivenscar, if you're on one of the side points, a lot of perma stealth TRs will actually hide in the corner when they're stealth meter runs out.
This. This creates the illusion that permastealth TR's are always in Stealth. They're not. At some point they will come out of stealth and before that happens, they should be hidden. Squishies can't be picky with how they achieve their goals, which is to win the match. Most specially not in a game where the first guy who starts the stun-lock/one-shot is most usually the winner.
Added info for players, in Hotenow Domination, you can also find TR's hiding by the stairs leading to the overpass on top of the middle tower. People usually miss this hiding spot.
Well, people are not the same and there will always be differences considering their opinions so a company cannot keep everyone satisfied. We had quite a nice discussion here. I guess that is all for tonight.I have to wake up early tomorrow and I am already late. If someone wants, add me in game. I hate to play alone.
Good night.
If you're fine with playing with someone like me, feel free to add me up in the game. I usually play alone as well due to my time constraints. And PVP is the one activity in this game that doesn't take too long to do, unlike dungeons.
The only thing that cannot be countered in the whole PvP game is TR's Shocking Execution - an undodgeable, huge range daily that goes through everything and since it is also based on missing HP is the perfect finisher and IWIN button.
um i dont know if it's been said but GF's can def use their block to counter shocking.
an on top of the stealth thing is the immunity. a stealthing tr picking my dc and the only chance when i see him and i want to use the little crappy cc i have to slow him will result in immunity!
i don't even have words to express how broken the tr in pvp is. obviously devs have never played a real first person mmo before otherwise they would have never come up with such a mechanic.
Dragon had both the highest player population and the strongest perma TRs (one of the Lemonade Stand TRs practically popularized a PoB/Regen/G.Tene build entirely himself months before non-beta players even knew of it). Once you face one of those monsters, who is also highly skilled, it is not surprising the build become more popular on Dragon first.
It has not become "more common" after the merge, you are just meeting more of them.
In addition, the fact you did not even meet perma TR's on your own shard shows just how little experience you have of fighting them.
Oh Parme was from Dragon... if I remember correctly...
Parme was not from Mindflayer and we have our share of Perma's..the one Parme went against as a matter of fact is Mindflayer ( and one of the game's ) leading stealth rogues, and has done alot to help players in this game. He is a forum mod here, @todesfaelle
an on top of the stealth thing is the immunity. a stealthing tr picking my dc and the only chance when i see him and i want to use the little crappy cc i have to slow him will result in immunity!
i don't even have words to express how broken the tr in pvp is. obviously devs have never played a real first person mmo before otherwise they would have never come up with such a mechanic.
The immunity is from the Impossible to Catch encounter power. It gives between 3-5 seconds of immunity. If you hit a TR and get the "immune" message, use your move skill to stay out of the way and count down - then hit the TR with everything. A well-played DC will outlast most TR's, particularly since PvP is a team sport and your team shouldn't be idle when someone is beating on the DC.
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
The immunity is from the Impossible to Catch encounter power. It gives between 3-5 seconds of immunity. If you hit a TR and get the "immune" message, use your move skill to stay out of the way and count down - then hit the TR with everything. A well-played DC will outlast most TR's, particularly since PvP is a team sport and your team shouldn't be idle when someone is beating on the DC.
Yeah right, the problem here is if the TR is geared enough NOTHING will save his victim in those 5 seconds.
Yeah right, the problem here is if the TR is geared enough NOTHING will save his victim in those 5 seconds.
If the other player doesn't act, then they're dead. That's the case when they're targeted by a CW using control powers, the famous GF bounce-to-beatdown, or the GWF slamdance. That's not about the TR, it's about playing intelligently and well. The TR is immune, you move and set things up to take them down because once their immunity is over so are they.
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
0
pers3phoneBanned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Yeah right, the problem here is if the TR is geared enough NOTHING will save his victim in those 5 seconds.
You have no idea how many times I took down TRs after their ITC and IS ended (and I was basically barely alive). At least if you're a CW, don't panic seeing your HP go down like crazy, try to dodge at least an IS, and wait, maybe even count for ITC to go away. When the TR is again normal color instead of smoky black... it's time for fun! CC, debuff, CC, Icy Rays of Doom... and he should be panicking and trying to get away at this stage. If you had some regen, then your health would already start to return slowly.
Of course, don't expect to be able to do this to really geared TRs, and don't expect to survive chained Perfect Vorpal crits, so it's a matter of luck involved as well, but hey, there's hope
Sure enough, the permastealth variety is another thing.
Of course, don't expect to be able to do this to really geared TRs, and don't expect to survive chained Perfect Vorpal crits, so it's a matter of luck involved as well, but hey, there's hope
Sure enough, the permastealth variety is another thing.
Exactly! And aforementioned rogues are increasingly common even in PuG PvP since shard merge. Zen market has blown up, competetive people are gearing up like crazies and there is no way for non-melee to compete.
0
faiteaccompliiMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 2
The immunity is from the Impossible to Catch encounter power. It gives between 3-5 seconds of immunity. If you hit a TR and get the "immune" message, use your move skill to stay out of the way and count down - then hit the TR with everything. A well-played DC will outlast most TR's, particularly since PvP is a team sport and your team shouldn't be idle when someone is beating on the DC.
Thank you, you must actually know how to play. Admitted it is my own fault as I am usually in PUG hell rather than a good pvp guild (I dont have teamspeak/vent/skype so hard to get good pvp guild) and I find that most people who pvp do not realize how important it is to keep people off the DC. In fact I have people who run by me getting beat on by a TR and while I am well geared and play well sometimes some TR's or some GF or some GWF (etc. ) can end up just being too much especially when they bring the whole team to take me down because they could not.
My silly teams run around willy nilly as the whole team gangs up on me lol.
I am glad that at least I know that is not the norm for good pvp'ers!! And I do run with one guild sometimes who is excellent and I am then in heaven but I am talking day to day basis when I pvp randomly.
On the subject of perma stealth or rogues you can't see. As someone said just wait it out and you can do fine but don't just stand there....(which I see a lot of people do too)
0
kingculexMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I take it you guys have never played a GWF in premade v premade. You don't simply run at a good tr when you don't know where he hit from. A well played TR is devastating unless you have the proper skills to deal with said TR. Mechanics of this game dictate your strengths and weaknesses. We can only control so much as a player.
I would rather they gave us poor ole GWFs some sort of detection other than slotting slam which is the weakest pvp daily. The tr can already use itc/dodge/stealth/range...it is time to give some counter.
No one mentioned fighting in premades at all. I personally use PUGs when I fight in PVP. You have counters like unstoppable already..... Sure give GWFs some sort of detection ability and give TRs an ability like Unstoppable to make it fair.
It is a shame players forget PVP is team based and if you have difficulty ask for help.
Every class has advantages and disadvantages. Learn the disadvantages of you class to overcome them. Learn the advantages of your class and the disadvatages of other classes to use them in pvp to win.
There is no point to whine for nerfs because you win some and loose some. Crying just makes a player look like a crier and no one, especially the devs, should take them seriously. Have a nice day!:)
No one mentioned fighting in premades at all. I personally use PUGs when I fight in PVP. You have counters like unstoppable already..... Sure give GWFs some sort of detection ability and give TRs an ability like Unstoppable to make it fair.
It is a shame players forget PVP is team based and if you have difficulty ask for help.
Man some of you people take pvp to personally and bash it out on the forums.
Someone made mention that TR is OP when you factor in all the skills as well as a perma stealth build. TRs pour out of the wood work to mention that they died one time to this (insert class) using (insert skills) and they are in fact not OP.
You are ALREADY in stealth. You are ALREADY damaging someone who can't see you. You can dodge...you can ITC and you can hit for a metric ton but you, good sir, don't seem to think anyone should have a hard counter to TRs. Anyways back to your scheduled TRs are not OP and other classes don't need a hard counter.
P.S. Unstoppable doesn't mean much when the TR is sporting 20+% ArP.
Man some of you people take pvp to personally and bash it out on the forums.
Someone made mention that TR is OP when you factor in all the skills as well as a perma stealth build. TRs pour out of the wood work to mention that they died one time to this (insert class) using (insert skills) and they are in fact not OP.
You are ALREADY in stealth. You are ALREADY damaging someone who can't see you. You can dodge...you can ITC and you can hit for a metric ton but you, good sir, don't seem to think anyone should have a hard counter to TRs. Anyways back to your scheduled TRs are not OP and other classes don't need a hard counter.
P.S. Unstoppable doesn't mean much when the TR is sporting 20+% ArP.
The TR's 20% ArP doesn't mean anything when I have 96% DR in unstoppable haha. Caps at 80% but b/c it's above cap that ArP only drops it 76% and then on a deflect I take 12% damage... I have been lashing bladed from stealth by a TR with greater vorpal for 3k, that's < 2 regen ticks lol.
Many of the people that "come out of the woodwork" to defend TR do so because they know the game is currently balanaced. I almost never play my TR anymore and from the standpoint of every other class I still think it's balanced.
Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
Comments
Nah, it doesn't really compare, and the reasons why were already explained quite a few times.
- IK can be dodged, deflected, mitigated by armored classes
- doesn't get through SF
Doesn't hit so hard without:
- debuff (HV, ROE etc.)
- vorpal
- EotS proc or lucky crit
Other than these things, I do believe that IK is a cheese-move itself, and I'm a CW. Should crit for what it hits normally on PvP. Fewer cheese-moves, longer and nicer matches.
So true... I fall in despair when I fail the timing... Whether it is PvP or PvE...
"With the force of Wind and Ice , I shall rise..."
What king said. You run towards the stealth TR. Ive found TRs hate being in melee range unless they have their dailies. Even then a GWF (especially a sentinel) will survive their initial burst, then you pop off your encounters/dailies (just make sure they used ITC). A BIS geared (perfect vorpal/enchant 8-10) this could be suicide but you don't run into them toooo often.
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
Are you trying so hard to be clever that you conveniently forgot how Ice Knife works, or did you honestly not know?
Contagion - Cleric
Testament - Wizard
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The bonuses are interesting and might be good but a few things you may not know.
1. Stealth is depleted when a TR takes damage already. The TR has to cast Lurker's Assault or bait&switch or Shadow Strike to refill stealth quickly. Shadow strike does very little damage and bait&switch does no damage. Lurker's Assault has already been nerfed 60%.
2. A TR casting an encounter like Impact Shot or Lashing Blade is knocked out of stealth unless Lurker's Assault is active.
3. Stealthed TRs are limited to At-Will powers if they want to stay in stealth. Gloaming Cut, Cloud of Steel, Sly Flourish, and Duelists Fury.
4. Stealth does not make TRs immune to damage. Impossibly to Catch + Stealth is immunity for a few seconds.
5. Players will complain about the bonuses you suggested because some will complain about anything.
6. Players tend to exaggerate stealth and make it seem it is active 100% of the time on its own without the stealthed player doing anything. Some players even claim it gives 100% immunity to damage all the time.
There is no point to whine for nerfs because you win some and loose some. Crying just makes a player look like a crier and no one, especially the devs, should take them seriously. Have a nice day!:)
Good night.
"With the force of Wind and Ice , I shall rise..."
Shocking Execution has been massively nerfed. It used to be a go-to skill for most rogues, particularly in PvE. Not anymore. As for relying on a daily power for a single kill, when it is against a GF with maxed HP and almost 50% mitigation it was so worth it.
Thanks for agreeing it is a cheese-move itself. SE can be dodged but it takes precise timing just like IK. SE does not hit hard unless the other player is already injured by a significant amount or Greater Tenebrous is involved or vorpal is involved.
Ice Knife
- Dodgeable requires timing.
- debuff (HV, ROE etc.)
- vorpal
- EotS proc or lucky crit
Shocking Execution
-Dodgeable requires timing. <- This has been gone over extensively already.
-Target being significantly injured.
-Vorpal or Tenebrous
-Lucky Crit
The nerf to Shocking Execution that is reasonable since its damage has been nerfed by 60% is that it does not go through SF. It might be a glitch with SF. Shocking Execution can be dodged and only takes timing to do it.
There is no point to whine for nerfs because you win some and loose some. Crying just makes a player look like a crier and no one, especially the devs, should take them seriously. Have a nice day!:)
Or they have encountered some of the cheaters, which was far from limited to TR's.
Basically, ran a hugely boring CN today with a TR that completely soloed 1st and 3rd bosses, skipped the 2nd for expediency. I was still needed to repel adds, yey, I like being useful.
Pure balance, I'd say
I mean, people constantly complained because HV CWs were so good at cheesing bosses, but at least we never could solo them and we needed to be 2-3.
Well guess what, a single permastealth TR (without great gear, btw) can solo-farm CNs first 3 bosses.
They do. This is why AoE attacks, like your Icy Terrain, or the example given of a DC's divine Sunburst, will hurt a stealthed rogue and probably break them out of their stealth. There is one passive power TRs can slot that greatly reduces stealth loss from incoming damage, but guess what? Slotting that power reduces the player's ability to dish out damage of their own.
I already explained that the vast majority of a TR's encounter abilities will break their stealth immediately.
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I take it you guys have never played a GWF in premade v premade. You don't simply run at a good tr when you don't know where he hit from. A well played TR is devastating unless you have the proper skills to deal with said TR. Mechanics of this game dictate your strengths and weaknesses. We can only control so much as a player.
I would rather they gave us poor ole GWFs some sort of detection other than slotting slam which is the weakest pvp daily. The tr can already use itc/dodge/stealth/range...it is time to give some counter.
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
I'm aware of the nerf. But it's still widely used in PvP.
Hyenas@zokir - Essence of Aggression
This. This creates the illusion that permastealth TR's are always in Stealth. They're not. At some point they will come out of stealth and before that happens, they should be hidden. Squishies can't be picky with how they achieve their goals, which is to win the match. Most specially not in a game where the first guy who starts the stun-lock/one-shot is most usually the winner.
Added info for players, in Hotenow Domination, you can also find TR's hiding by the stairs leading to the overpass on top of the middle tower. People usually miss this hiding spot.
If you're fine with playing with someone like me, feel free to add me up in the game. I usually play alone as well due to my time constraints. And PVP is the one activity in this game that doesn't take too long to do, unlike dungeons.
Of course it is, it is an execute and can deal some serious damage - almost as much as an Ice Knife.
um i dont know if it's been said but GF's can def use their block to counter shocking.
i don't even have words to express how broken the tr in pvp is. obviously devs have never played a real first person mmo before otherwise they would have never come up with such a mechanic.
- kitty, lemonade stand
Oh Parme was from Dragon... if I remember correctly...
Parme was not from Mindflayer and we have our share of Perma's..the one Parme went against as a matter of fact is Mindflayer ( and one of the game's ) leading stealth rogues, and has done alot to help players in this game. He is a forum mod here, @todesfaelle
-Svet
"With the force of Wind and Ice , I shall rise..."
The immunity is from the Impossible to Catch encounter power. It gives between 3-5 seconds of immunity. If you hit a TR and get the "immune" message, use your move skill to stay out of the way and count down - then hit the TR with everything. A well-played DC will outlast most TR's, particularly since PvP is a team sport and your team shouldn't be idle when someone is beating on the DC.
Yeah right, the problem here is if the TR is geared enough NOTHING will save his victim in those 5 seconds.
If the other player doesn't act, then they're dead. That's the case when they're targeted by a CW using control powers, the famous GF bounce-to-beatdown, or the GWF slamdance. That's not about the TR, it's about playing intelligently and well. The TR is immune, you move and set things up to take them down because once their immunity is over so are they.
You have no idea how many times I took down TRs after their ITC and IS ended (and I was basically barely alive). At least if you're a CW, don't panic seeing your HP go down like crazy, try to dodge at least an IS, and wait, maybe even count for ITC to go away. When the TR is again normal color instead of smoky black... it's time for fun! CC, debuff, CC, Icy Rays of Doom... and he should be panicking and trying to get away at this stage. If you had some regen, then your health would already start to return slowly.
Of course, don't expect to be able to do this to really geared TRs, and don't expect to survive chained Perfect Vorpal crits, so it's a matter of luck involved as well, but hey, there's hope
Sure enough, the permastealth variety is another thing.
Exactly! And aforementioned rogues are increasingly common even in PuG PvP since shard merge. Zen market has blown up, competetive people are gearing up like crazies and there is no way for non-melee to compete.
Thank you, you must actually know how to play. Admitted it is my own fault as I am usually in PUG hell rather than a good pvp guild (I dont have teamspeak/vent/skype so hard to get good pvp guild) and I find that most people who pvp do not realize how important it is to keep people off the DC. In fact I have people who run by me getting beat on by a TR and while I am well geared and play well sometimes some TR's or some GF or some GWF (etc. ) can end up just being too much especially when they bring the whole team to take me down because they could not.
My silly teams run around willy nilly as the whole team gangs up on me lol.
I am glad that at least I know that is not the norm for good pvp'ers!!
On the subject of perma stealth or rogues you can't see. As someone said just wait it out and you can do fine but don't just stand there....(which I see a lot of people do too)
No one mentioned fighting in premades at all. I personally use PUGs when I fight in PVP. You have counters like unstoppable already..... Sure give GWFs some sort of detection ability and give TRs an ability like Unstoppable to make it fair.
It is a shame players forget PVP is team based and if you have difficulty ask for help.
There is no point to whine for nerfs because you win some and loose some. Crying just makes a player look like a crier and no one, especially the devs, should take them seriously. Have a nice day!:)
Man some of you people take pvp to personally and bash it out on the forums.
Someone made mention that TR is OP when you factor in all the skills as well as a perma stealth build. TRs pour out of the wood work to mention that they died one time to this (insert class) using (insert skills) and they are in fact not OP.
You are ALREADY in stealth. You are ALREADY damaging someone who can't see you. You can dodge...you can ITC and you can hit for a metric ton but you, good sir, don't seem to think anyone should have a hard counter to TRs. Anyways back to your scheduled TRs are not OP and other classes don't need a hard counter.
P.S. Unstoppable doesn't mean much when the TR is sporting 20+% ArP.
The TR's 20% ArP doesn't mean anything when I have 96% DR in unstoppable haha. Caps at 80% but b/c it's above cap that ArP only drops it 76% and then on a deflect I take 12% damage... I have been lashing bladed from stealth by a TR with greater vorpal for 3k, that's < 2 regen ticks lol.
Many of the people that "come out of the woodwork" to defend TR do so because they know the game is currently balanaced. I almost never play my TR anymore and from the standpoint of every other class I still think it's balanced.
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.