RP rewards and DM intervention

bracer2

Everything else aside, rules, classes, balance, builds,..ect. I honestly believe this would allow everyone to enjoy this game on there own terms.

XP for RP. Simple, nothing has to change as far as the mechanics.
DM events. Unique items only attainable through exceptional Role Play.

The implementation of this could offer an alternate form of progression to constant combat and speed runs. The DnD folks could enjoy this game as they will create a world within a world. And the wow gen can do there shoot um style with hair on fire. Everyone wins!

Is there any chance at all? any hope of this kind of thing being implemented?

nick1stern

Wait you want to get XP for standing around bad acting talking about playing the game....
Rather then actually playing.. Really

bracer2

nick1stern wrote: »

Wait you want to get XP for standing around bad acting talking about playing the game....
Rather then actually playing.. Really

Absolutely, its difficult to RP. And should be rewarded, I cant see a downside. Many, many players don't want to run about at 150 mph. Its not fun for them. This is an legitimate option for a large part of the Neverwinter community.

atompenguin

Er... as much as I like RP, there shouldn't be any rewards for it.

nick1stern

No nothing legit at all getting rewards for bad acting.
Want rewards RP while playing do all quests and dungeons in character like real RPers.

sasheria

bracer2 wrote: »

Everything else aside, rules, classes, balance, builds,..ect. I honestly believe this would allow everyone to enjoy this game on there own terms.

XP for RP. Simple, nothing has to change as far as the mechanics.
DM events. Unique items only attainable through exceptional Role Play.

The implementation of this could offer an alternate form of progression to constant combat and speed runs. The DnD folks could enjoy this game as they will create a world within a world. And the wow gen can do there shoot um style with hair on fire. Everyone wins!

Is there any chance at all? any hope of this kind of thing being implemented?

how would you gauge how much XP for "bad acting"? I mean what would prevent even MORE bots doing this?

You can gain exp without playing via gateway (you play for first 10 level and then gateway) I got one of my character level 20 now via gateway.

I think getting xp standing around and chatting (that is how the system would see it) is silly.

As for DM event? sure that would be nice, but for Role-play it is on the eye of the beholder (pun intended) so if a GM doesn't like you but you are exceptional role-player and get nothing, how fair is that?

IF they can get a DM to do this. We barely have enough DM/GM as it is to prevent the flooding of bots and spammers. Cryptic has to rely on players spam reporting and auto-ban vs manual ban.

I don't see this happening anytime soon.

khatzhas

Until it is possibly to have the creator or player running of a foundry actively control aspects of it in real-time while a group is playing through it, it is impossible I think.
Even if there was, the potential for abuse would be too high I think. RP is a pretty subjective thing: there is no way for it to be "scored" by a program.

nick1stern wrote: »

Wait you want to get XP for standing around bad acting talking about playing the game....
Rather then actually playing.. Really

Roleplaying is a way of playing the game, just like PvP, exploration, lore-collecting, questing, etc.
If you don't personally care for it, we won't look down on you any more than someone who isn't interested in PvP.
The point of the question I think was to give people incentive to use good acting rather than bad acting.

bracer2

nick1stern wrote: »

No nothing legit at all getting rewards for bad acting.
Want rewards RP while playing do all quests and dungeons in character like real RPers.

I cant understand how swinging your weapon over and over is RP. If this one thing could be implemented I have no doubt that it would open up the game for more players. Action isn't fun all the time. Its just not. Its boring and repetitive. RP must have some kind of significance. Progression through button pushing is fine for some. Progression through RP could turn this game around into something that allows more players to get the experience they are looking for. If you hate RP run dungeons. Its not hampering that. Give the DnD community something more then button pushing.

nick1stern

khatzhas wrote: »

.

Roleplaying is a way of playing the game, just like PvP, exploration, lore-collecting, questing, etc.
If you don't personally care for it, we won't look down on you any more than someone who isn't interested in PvP.
The point of the question I think was to give people incentive to use good acting rather than bad acting.

Oh I like RP partake rugularly in it in other MMO's properly set up for it Like LOTRO.
But we rp all the time in character in dungeons questing all other activities and events on our RP toons.
We do not expect to get rewards XP and Gear for our Acting good bad or otherwise.
Be a real RPer RP all the time as you play the game if you want in game rewards.
Do not expect to get the same rewards for less effort.

sasheria

khatzhas wrote: »

Until it is possibly to have the creator or player running of a foundry actively control aspects of it in real-time while a group is playing through it, it is impossible I think.
Even if there was, the potential for abuse would be too high I think. RP is a pretty subjective thing: there is no way for it to be "scored" by a program.

Roleplaying is a way of playing the game, just like PvP, exploration, lore-collecting, questing, etc.
If you don't personally care for it, we won't look down on you any more than someone who isn't interested in PvP.
The point of the question I think was to give people incentive to use good acting rather than bad acting.

Who is to judge what is good and bad acting? Here is something a friend of mine sent to me. Interesting read
http://music.yahoo.com/blogs/reality-rocks/imagine-no-coaches-john-lennon-auditions-voice-234748010.html

If he couldn't make it in MODERN judging of music, what right do we (as players) can judge is it a good RP or bad RP?

bracer2

khatzhas wrote: »

Until it is possibly to have the creator or player running of a foundry actively control aspects of it in real-time while a group is playing through it, it is impossible I think.
Even if there was, the potential for abuse would be too high I think. RP is a pretty subjective thing: there is no way for it to be "scored" by a program.

Roleplaying is a way of playing the game, just like PvP, exploration, lore-collecting, questing, etc.
If you don't personally care for it, we won't look down on you any more than someone who isn't interested in PvP.
The point of the question I think was to give people incentive to use good acting rather than bad acting.

Of course, good acting yields better reward and progression. Not possible? hard to believe. I cant believe its not possible. The foundry would be a great place to do it...... What something like this would offer... it just opens up the entire game and is desperately needed imo.

bracer2

sasheria wrote: »

Who is to judge what is good and bad acting? Here is something a friend of mine sent to me. Interesting read
http://music.yahoo.com/blogs/reality-rocks/imagine-no-coaches-john-lennon-auditions-voice-234748010.html

If he couldn't make it in MODERN judging of music, what right do we (as players) can judge is it a good RP or bad RP?

The real time DM is the judge of course.

nick1stern

bracer2 wrote: »

I cant understand how swinging your weapon over and over is RP. If this one thing could be implemented I have no doubt that it would open up the game for more players. Action isn't fun all the time. Its just not. Its boring and repetitive. RP must have some kind of significance. Progression through button pushing is fine for some. Progression through RP could turn this game around into something that allows more players to get the experience they are looking for. If you hate RP run dungeons. Its not hampering that. Give the DnD community something more then button pushing.

You clearly not getting or not a true RPer.
RP all the time stay in character make sure group/Party chat is always in character while qusting.
Instructions given in character Lemant the loss of a trusted ally the last time you were in the
dungeon give advice based on that in charater.
In other words RP to your hearts content but do not expect XP and rewards for doing nothing
but standing around in a safe place.

sasheria

bracer2 wrote: »

The real time DM is the judge of course.

Yea. So Cryptic is going to try to hire DM to judge RP? cause I can assure you not everyone can be a good judge (or a GM) I have done many table top games and come across some AWESOME!!! GM and some really bad GM even at competition level.

druidofdisaster

sasheria wrote: »

I mean what would prevent even MORE bots doing this?

Yes, next thing you know the people ruining the economy with bots will implement chat bots like Cleverbot to earn XP while AFK.

bracer2

nick1stern wrote: »

Oh I like RP partake rugularly in it in other MMO's properly set up for it Like LOTRO.
But we rp all the time in character in dungeons questing all other activities and events on our RP toons.
We do not expect to get rewards XP and Gear for our Acting good bad or otherwise.
Be a real RPer RP all the time as you play the game if you want in game rewards.
Do not expect to get the same rewards for less effort.

What im saying is there must be an alternate form of progression then just hack n slash shoot um up style. That can still exist. I just really think it would allow for a larger player pool and some much needed diversity.

bracer2

sasheria wrote: »

Yea. So Cryptic is going to try to hire DM to judge RP? cause I can assure you not everyone can be a good judge (or a GM) I have done many table top games and come across some AWESOME!!! GM and some really bad GM even at competition level.

That's ok, its the trickle down effect and what it opens up for players who like circle RP and like creating something on there own. In short people who like DnD. DMs are just people but the idea they are on at all makes me want to RP more, and log on more.

melodywhr

while there are some people that like RP and do it here, there is no mechanic to really set that in motion other than to have some live "judge" make that determination in order to hand out points or rewards. i just don't see that happening.

sasheria

bracer2 wrote: »

What im saying is there must be an alternate form of progression then just hack n slash shoot um up style. That can still exist. I just really think it would allow for a larger player pool and some much needed diversity.

RP is nice. I do love me some MUD (great for RP place or MUSH) but in Action setting like Neverwinter. not so much. Statistically, there isn't as much RPer in Action RPG so it wouldn't benefit them. If you are looking forward to RP in 4th ed, best bet would be WoTC gateway/tabletop version (digital) I can't see Action RPG dedicate time and resources to code xp gain for RP.

That aside, you can still RP (to certain extent) of your character when in group but still hack and slash. It would be quite difficult with current tech to really assess RP in a game. Now if we have holodeck level and super AI to judge, then I'm game!

bracer2

druidofdisaster wrote: »

Yes, next thing you know the people ruining the economy with bots will implement chat bots like Cleverbot to earn XP while AFK.

Well there's already bots everywhere and a decrepit economy, so that is of no consequence. Cant break something that's already destroyed right?

nick1stern

bracer2 wrote: »

What im saying is there must be an alternate form of progression then just hack n slash shoot um up style. That can still exist. I just really think it would allow for a larger player pool and some much needed diversity.

There are multiple progression paths try playing rather then standing around talking about playing.
A diverse pool from RP lol yeah ok......
True RP is few and far between loss of real pen and paper is when true RP started to die out.
Your idea of RP is not real RP real RPers RP all the time they play the game get the rewards the way intended in character.

thebriman

I think I see your point bracer2, and as long as the rewards were purely vanity items that enhanced the RP aspects of the game, I'd have no problem with it. OTOH, I would be vehemently opposed to a system which rewarded actual gear upgrades for role playing. Even in pen and paper D&D, I don't think there are many DMs who are going to give you a vorpal sword just because you played your character particularly well. You still have to go into the dungeon and kill/sneak past/outsmart bad guys to get the powerful loot, at least in any of the campaigns I've played in.

Also, as others have noted, I really don't see how a system could be implemented that wouldn't either be prohibitively manpower intensive or open to massive exploiting.

bioshrike

Can someone explain to me how your character would grow more powerful from sitting around the tavern and discussing D&D politics/relationships/history? How does one become more powerful from talking about their backstory or prior exploits, even if told in an extremely believable and entertaining way?

If nothing else, I could see them adding a sort of research & development profession that, perhaps, created magic scrolls or something, but just "acting" in-character? How do you get better at casting magic or swinging a sword through that?

sasheria

bracer2 wrote: »

Well there's already bots everywhere and a decrepit economy, so that is of no consequence. Cant break something that's already destroyed right?

Sure you can. The thing is that you want to make stuff better not make it worst. I'm sure Cryptic is trying to figure out a way to fix all the broken stuff in short of a total wipe (which I still think they should after a major patch and go to launch but that is here nor there)

I don't think it is destroyed. It is recoverable. STO recover after a couple of "disaster" and now going strong.

sasheria

bioshrike wrote: »

Can someone explain to me how your character would grow more powerful from sitting around the tavern and discussing D&D politics/relationships/history? How does one become more powerful from talking about their backstory or prior exploits, even if told in an extremely believable and entertaining way?

If nothing else, I could see them adding a sort of research & development profession that, perhaps, created magic scrolls or something, but just "acting" in-character? How do you get better at casting magic or swinging a sword through that?

In a rare mix environment (RP and combat) it is possible when you are group with a session of people for YEARS. Our group sometimes go into straight RP once or twice. It usually involve some problem solving with some gambling or reward from a questgiver (but not a vorpal sword) but something nice. Generally we use this method to "catch up" when we haven't play in a while and get some little reward to get us fire up for the next campaign those were the days.

But even RP on PnP, it is VERY rare to go from 1 to max level purely RP. You can't even quite do that in LARP (which I play VLARP personally) and I had some combat/interaction other than pure RP.

bracer2

All I know, is that ive seen thread after thread of players asking, in fact begging for some kind of DnD aspects to be implemented in this game. For months now, since CB even. Im for anything DnD. I think this would not change the game mechanics as sooo many other ideas ive read about would. Something has to be done, the DnD community is fed up with this action, action, action, go, go, go at all times.

The foundry would be a great place to test this and possibly open up this world to real diversity. Maybe its an awful idea.. in that case, what then?

nick1stern

thebriman wrote: »

I think I see your point bracer2, and as long as the rewards were purely vanity items that enhanced the RP aspects of the game, I'd have no problem with it. OTOH, I would be vehemently opposed to a system which rewarded actual gear upgrades for role playing. Even in pen and paper D&D, I don't think there are many DMs who are going to give you a vorpal sword just because you played your character particularly well. You still have to go into the dungeon and kill/sneak past/outsmart bad guys to get the powerful loot, at least in any of the campaigns I've played in.

Also, as others have noted, I really don't see how a system could be implemented that wouldn't either be prohibitively manpower intensive or open to massive exploiting.

^ THIS
Well said

bracer2

sasheria wrote: »

In a rare mix environment (RP and combat) it is possible when you are group with a session of people for YEARS. Our group sometimes go into straight RP once or twice. It usually involve some problem solving with some gambling or reward from a questgiver (but not a vorpal sword) but something nice. Generally we use this method to "catch up" when we haven't play in a while and get some little reward to get us fire up for the next campaign those were the days.

But even RP on PnP, it is VERY rare to go from 1 to max level purely RP. You can't even quite do that in LARP (which I play VLARP personally) and I had some combat/interaction other than pure RP.

There doesn't have to be extremes just some kind of benefit for RP. In my old PnP sessions and constantly in NWN2 my toons would absolutely progress through RP. In PnP we may have combat maybe once twice a month. From my experience in DnD more XP comes from RP then combat. Im not suggesting that should be the case here. But something needs to be done IMO to keep the DnD community long term.

jstar2

Nick. There is no such thing as "true RP" as you call it. RP is whatever you make of it. some like to gather around in the inn to swap stories, some like to go out and fight as they share jests and commands, and some like to do other things. You're not the end all, be all judge of what is and isn't RP. Only the players who're RPing decide if what they're doing is RP or not. Not you. So quite with your arrogant attacks on others who like to RP in a fashion different from yours. It's childish.

bracer2

thebriman wrote: »

I think I see your point bracer2, and as long as the rewards were purely vanity items that enhanced the RP aspects of the game, I'd have no problem with it. OTOH, I would be vehemently opposed to a system which rewarded actual gear upgrades for role playing. Even in pen and paper D&D, I don't think there are many DMs who are going to give you a vorpal sword just because you played your character particularly well. You still have to go into the dungeon and kill/sneak past/outsmart bad guys to get the powerful loot, at least in any of the campaigns I've played in.

Also, as others have noted, I really don't see how a system could be implemented that wouldn't either be prohibitively manpower intensive or open to massive exploiting.

Vanity items would be a giant step towards a more diverse DnD environment. It could grow from that over time, and in the short-
term that would satisfy me.

sasheria

bracer2 wrote: »

There doesn't have to be extremes just some kind of benefit for RP. In my old PnP sessions and constantly in NWN2 my toons would absolutely progress through RP. In PnP we have have combat maybe once twice a month. From my experience in DnD more XP comes from RP then combat. Im not suggesting that should be the case here. But something needs to be done IMO to keep the DnD community long term.

It is great idea for small group of PnP, but implement on MMO level is hard especially if you want character progression (gaining level even without equipment gain) Now if you just want pure RP without xp gain (which doesn't seem to be the case) you can use the foundry to create RP style game with no combat and get a chest at the end. LOTS AND LOTS of stories written and choices BUT you may get a "low score" or "not qualify" for daily reward because people will "blow" through the stories and choose answer randomly.