Hey, Crybabies, you should also request nerf of the stealth of the TR, its too over powered. Why not buff other class instead of Nerfing TR so much? Some of the players invested real money and time already, try to think of it.
For all I care, you could have paid a million euro or dollars or whatever you pay with, you still should be brought down to be balanced with other classes and I'm not alking 1v1 here, but overall performance. TR overperformed, it was glass cannon power in adamantium armor with stealth being just a cherry on top of it.
If you want OP class that never gets nerfed or rebalanced go play single player RPGs.
Picking the most challenging class (GF/GWF) gets rewarded, go figure?
Picking the easyest *smash head on keyboard* (TR) gets nerfed, go figure?
I could have never predicted this
So becouse its easier to play it should be the weakest? makes much sense..
TRs werent that overpowered to warrent this kind of nerf. the only skill that should have been brought down by maybe 20% was SE, but so should Ice Knife.
TR is, once again, the only DPS class and are supposed to be way ahead on DPS numbers in dungeons. (CW, your roll is to controll. not dps. GWF, your roll is to take care of adds, not ST kill the boss)
TRs cannot tank bosses, its just bad mechanics on bosses that they dont have any normal attacks but just big red circle attacks on floor that you can dodge out of, which fyi even a CW could do. Add up Astral Shield on that and every class can "tank".
The nerf to Astral Shield on test has made Rogues die like flies from oneshots.
Why would you bring a TR, when you get more dps, more armor and more utility from GWF, GF and CW?
Revert the DF changes to how it is on live, and nerf SE by 20%.
Make Rogues a bit squishier for all i care, but nerfing TR PvE dps by 40% is not the way to go. Its a D.P.S class.
Whats even worse is that other classes will say TR is fine now becouse:
1. They cant kill their class in PvP
2. They cant outdps their class in PvE
This same f-king thing happens in every MMO by whining a-holes that dont know how they play their classes and think their class should be the best at everything. Learn your roll instead.
Picking the most challenging class (GF/GWF) gets rewarded, go figure?
Picking the easyest *smash head on keyboard* (TR) gets nerfed, go figure?
I could have never predicted this
so how do you go about maximizing your bleed on a fight? TR isn't exactly faceroll when played well. GWF is about mashing the keyboard and sprint cancelling to dps. GF you literally just mash the keyboard...
On the test server our bleed is currently bugged; which by the looks of their customer support will go live. I have waited over a month on multiple tickets that weren't just flat out cancelled and they are still open with no response. This game will die out because they honestly don't give 2 ****s about their customers. Anyways; the bleed goes to 10 stacks bleeds for 6 or so seconds and then stops doing damage and the stacks remain. You have to let them fall off again. It should have taken someone 20s to find this bug as a QA...how the hell did someone honestly not go smack something and stack bleed before looking to see if the nerf was warranted and how much of a dps decrease it was?
Oh and as far as SE; I don't pvp much because it's not really fair with my GS and most people are pvping for fresh 60 gear. so I honestly don't care what they do the ability; it's rarely useful for pve and they can delete the skill all together for all i care.
So becouse its easier to play it should be the weakest? makes much sense..
TRs werent that overpowered to warrent this kind of nerf. the only skill that should have been brought down by maybe 20% was SE, but so should Ice Knife.
TR is, once again, the only DPS class and are supposed to be way ahead on DPS numbers in dungeons. (CW, your roll is to controll. not dps. GWF, your roll is to take care of adds, not ST kill the boss)
TRs cannot tank bosses, its just bad mechanics on bosses that they dont have any normal attacks but just big red circle attacks on floor that you can dodge out of, which fyi even a CW could do. Add up Astral Shield on that and every class can "tank".
The nerf to Astral Shield on test has made Rogues die like flies from oneshots.
Why would you bring a TR, when you get more dps, more armor and more utility from GWF, GF and CW?
Revert the DF changes to how it is on live, and nerf SE by 20%.
Make Rogues a bit squishier for all i care, but nerfing TR PvE dps by 40% is not the way to go. Its a D.P.S class.
Whats even worse is that other classes will say TR is fine now becouse:
1. They cant kill their class in PvP
2. They cant outdps their class in PvE
This same f-king thing happens in every MMO by whining a-holes that dont know how they play their classes and think their class should be the best at everything. Learn your roll instead.
The only reason ice knife does the dmg it does is because of ray of enfeeblement which they both fixed and nerfed. Ice knife without RoE is good dmg but no where near what it is now.
As a CW I WISH they nerfed Ice Knife and left RoE alone. Rogues should be happy all they did was nerf your daily. You do realize there is a line that buffed the impact of Power for rogues right? I mean what other nerfs was there? The bleed stacking? Only maters in PvE in PvP no one survives 10 stacks anyway.
"Encounter and Daily powers now benefit more from the Power stat."
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senseijohnMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 90
Hello little crying, whining TR b**es, I came from the interwebz with a messege for you: THE GAME DOES NOT RESOLVE AROUND YOU, WE WILL STILL BE ABLE TO DO EVERYRTING FINE EVEN WITHOUT YOU, YOU ARE NOT CLERICS OR CONTROL WIZARDS THEREFORE YOU ARE NOT MANDATORY
Any that is precisely why you are wrong. You just stated it perfectly. You can't do a dungeon without a cleric. OBVIOUSLY, they are COMPLETELY OP. I mean... heck my GWF nor my CW can heal NEARLY as much (well, they don't heal at all), so it's so BLATANT that clerics are completely OP. We need to nerf them and take away healing until they are on par with what all other classes can heal.
Same thing with CW. OBVIOUSLY, they do CC MUCH better than GF or TR's, which is completely unfair. We need to nerf them until their CC abilities are on par with TR's.
I mean... that's only fair right? I mean, reduce TR's damage to match other classes... so reduce THEIR abilities to match TR's.
That way, we can all be equally lame.
But again... the fact that you say certain classes are required and certain classes aren't, just proves that they aren't balanced.
So get over yourself.
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senseijohnMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 90
The only reason ice knife does the dmg it does is because of ray of enfeeblement which they both fixed and nerfed. Ice knife without RoE is good dmg but no where near what it is now.
As a CW I WISH they nerfed Ice Knife and left RoE alone. Rogues should be happy all they did was nerf your daily. You do realize there is a line that buffed the impact of Power for rogues right? I mean what other nerfs was there? The bleed stacking? Only maters in PvE in PvP no one survives 10 stacks anyway.
"Encounter and Daily powers now benefit more from the Power stat."
Um... you obviously don't know anything about the TR changes. The daily is the LEAST of the nerfs. Look at DF and bleed. THAT is the big nerf.
Execution only really affects PVP, since most TRs don't use it in PVE.
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senseijohnMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 90
so how do you go about maximizing your bleed on a fight? TR isn't exactly faceroll when played well. GWF is about mashing the keyboard and sprint cancelling to dps. GF you literally just mash the keyboard...
On the test server our bleed is currently bugged; which by the looks of their customer support will go live. I have waited over a month on multiple tickets that weren't just flat out cancelled and they are still open with no response. This game will die out because they honestly don't give 2 ****s about their customers. Anyways; the bleed goes to 10 stacks bleeds for 6 or so seconds and then stops doing damage and the stacks remain. You have to let them fall off again. It should have taken someone 20s to find this bug as a QA...how the hell did someone honestly not go smack something and stack bleed before looking to see if the nerf was warranted and how much of a dps decrease it was?
Oh and as far as SE; I don't pvp much because it's not really fair with my GS and most people are pvping for fresh 60 gear. so I honestly don't care what they do the ability; it's rarely useful for pve and they can delete the skill all together for all i care.
You are talking about them as if they are a real development team. They are not. They have NO play testers (or the suck) - WE ARE THEIR PLAY TESTERS.
Their development cycle (aptly named the Monkey Cycle) is:
U sir and ppl like you are hella annoying. Stop defending the TR class pronto! No class, i repeat, NO CLASS can dish out the same single target DPS that TR can. Unless u are one of those who yet hasnt discovered Duelists Flurry and r still wearing lvl 30 gear at lvl 60, than u should know this. Stop whining and stop *****ing, TR's has combat advantage damage 90% of the time if u play ur class right, TR has with duelists flurry MORE crit severty than GWF can ever have, TR also gets more crit than ANY other class and can further up that damage using lurker's assault. So u claiming that GWF has competitive damage is just plain BS. TR also has useful utility to bring to the table that mitigates damage from mobs, something which GWF's dont (smoke bomb, dazing strike)
In short, GWF CANT touch TR's single target DPS by a longshot, OR their utility, or b AS useful in dungeons.. Devs made pretty **** well sure of that. And now i will ask u a question. As someone who plays both GWF and TR classes. You tell me, how it is justified that my TR in full pvp gear, having 1.55k power, PvP weapons doing 1.2k damage per hit, whereas my GWF in T2 armor set, Castle Never weapon set (908 - 984) weapon damage (Highest damage on any weapon in the game btw) and 4k power hits for 550 on Live server. 750ish on Preview Shard. Just how is that justified? Its not.. GWF's at-wills are weaker than priests. Its complete BS, underwhelming damage to the bone. Even with the change they made to it on Preview Shard its still sad and insulting.
And ill add this as well. That despite my GWF having 40% damage mitigation 34AC (Sentinel Defensive Paragon Path) i still eat flying knives from rogues whos geared in the same endgame <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> as i am doing 800-1k damage per knife IN STEALTH.. Do the maths, thats a lot of damage for a duration of a time theyre invisible. Balanced? HELL NO!
A GWF is a fighter, its an offense specced defender not a striker.
A Rogue is supposed to be a striker with low survivabilety.
If they change anything more i hope its more hp or defence for the fighter or less hp or defence for the rogue.
And not buff up GWF damage or nerf TR damage.
A GWF is a fighter, its an offense specced defender not a striker.
A Rogue is supposed to be a striker with low survivabilety.
If they change anything more i hope its more hp or defence for the fighter or less hp or defence for the rogue.
And not buff up GWF damage or nerf TR damage.
Meanwhile we have offensive fighter that deals LESS damage then defensive one and rogue who hits like a cannon and got much more survivability then cleric. How is that balanced again?
Its always been the same in every MMO i have played :
Patch 1-Class A is nerfed
-Class B is buffed
Patch 2-Class A is buffed
-Class B is nerfed
i know it sucks to be playing the class that took more hits from a patch Nerf-Hammer, but its not the final work your class will see,
Adapt to the changes if you really like the class, reroll another class if you want to try other views on the game...
Or not, its your choice...
To me this patch will be like every other patch on any MMO, its not a miracle patch, its not something that will please everyone...
Its impossible to do that with one patch, its impossible to balance a game in one patch, today you are underpowered, tomorrow you are overpowered and vice-versa...
there will be another patches...
Meanwhile we have offensive fighter that deals LESS damage then defensive one and rogue who hits like a cannon and got much more survivability then cleric. How is that balanced again?
Its not, i just dont want them to take the easy way and buff gwf's damage so its thesame as rogues.
Then gwf will stop complaining but its not how it should be then.
Heh, the TR is still too good at tanking. I hope the developers consider lowering the TR health pool by around -25-40%. TR have the same hp as a tank which is in fact a huge no-go. What you would like is a Tank with massive dps and constant stealth + survivability and guess what, this is exactly what the TR is. So since 1+1=2, expect more nerfs to this OP class in the future. Prepare some tissues.
TR could also use a constant debuff for their damage, similar to the DC's righteousness. If the TR is not in stealth it should not deal full damage at any time. -30 maybe -40% damage would be awesome. This is not a fighter type of class. In a 1on1 situation with a fighter (no stealth) the TR should not be able to take on a fighter AT ALL.
Peace.
So, you want the TR to have 10k hps? Really? I'm in all t2's (Swash Set) and my hps are sitting at just above 20k. You are an idiot if you think dropping it that low is ok. And the hps of a tank? You must have some really crappy tanks in your group.
And who says a rogue shouldn't be able to take a fighter 1on1? Your opinion? Let's take a look at the classes.
Fighter = Slow due to heavy armor, large weapon that swings slowly due to weight, and no dodge skills (Again, heavy armor = too slow)
Rogue = Fast, because it has the balls not to rely on a tin can. Two fast, 2.5 foot long blades. Not one...two. And excellent dodge skills.
I'd vote on the Rogue any day of the week. You are just the type of unskilled player who won't be happy till your class has everything. Highest mitigations, hps, and damage. You have no clue what balance even means. The nerfs you propose to the TR are nothing short of insane. How about..we reduce ALL the damage a GF does by 40% because he's a tank. And remove all the armor a GWF wears and reduce all damage he does by 40% to single targets. Sounds fair right? No? But that's exactly the moronic <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> you are asking for the TR right?
Every time I read one of your posts it reminds me of how stupid people really are....
Meanwhile we have offensive fighter that deals LESS damage then defensive one and rogue who hits like a cannon and got much more survivability then cleric. How is that balanced again?
More survivability than a cleric? What the hell game are you playing? Have you even played a TR past 30? I see clerics standing in the middle of 3 mindflayers and just facerolling. Meanwhile, I'm getting killed by 2 because they cone stun and hit for 6k. They do NOT have that kind of survivability. I think every poster that claims that is just shooting wild and has never even tried a TR.
What is a Rogue? A guy wearing a Pyjama, running around using 2 kitchen knives trying to compete with the fighters... This is one thing that Aion did right, their Rogues are actually Rogues. Only lethal if in stealth while attacking from behind, aka. the way it should be.
Peace.
What is a fighter? An idiot in a tin can that moves too slow and carries an large weapon that clearly overcompensates for something. You can't compete with the Rogues...and that makes you hate the class.
Hello little crying, whining TR b**es, I came from the interwebz with a messege for you: THE GAME DOES NOT RESOLVE AROUND YOU, WE WILL STILL BE ABLE TO DO EVERYRTING FINE EVEN WITHOUT YOU, YOU ARE NOT CLERICS OR CONTROL WIZARDS THEREFORE YOU ARE NOT MANDATORY
Again, proof that idiots are still wanting every class but the one they play nerfed to the ground. And good luck on rogues not being 'mandatory' in t2's or higher. I'm on the test shard, and we STILL do the highest and most efficient single target damage. You want that boss dead? Go ahead and try to put any other class on it and see how long that takes....
U sir and ppl like you are hella annoying. Stop defending the TR class pronto! No class, i repeat, NO CLASS can dish out the same single target DPS that TR can. Unless u are one of those who yet hasnt discovered Duelists Flurry and r still wearing lvl 30 gear at lvl 60, than u should know this. Stop whining and stop *****ing, TR's has combat advantage damage 90% of the time if u play ur class right, TR has with duelists flurry MORE crit severty than GWF can ever have, TR also gets more crit than ANY other class and can further up that damage using lurker's assault. So u claiming that GWF has competitive damage is just plain BS. TR also has useful utility to bring to the table that mitigates damage from mobs, something which GWF's dont (smoke bomb, dazing strike)
In short, GWF CANT touch TR's single target DPS by a longshot, OR their utility, or b AS useful in dungeons.. Devs made pretty **** well sure of that. And now i will ask u a question. As someone who plays both GWF and TR classes. You tell me, how it is justified that my TR in full pvp gear, having 1.55k power, PvP weapons doing 1.2k damage per hit, whereas my GWF in T2 armor set, Castle Never weapon set (908 - 984) weapon damage (Highest damage on any weapon in the game btw) and 4k power hits for 550 on Live server. 750ish on Preview Shard. Just how is that justified? Its not.. GWF's at-wills are weaker than priests. Its complete BS, underwhelming damage to the bone. Even with the change they made to it on Preview Shard its still sad and insulting.
And ill add this as well. That despite my GWF having 40% damage mitigation 34AC (Sentinel Defensive Paragon Path) i still eat flying knives from rogues whos geared in the same endgame <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> as i am doing 800-1k damage per knife IN STEALTH.. Do the maths, thats a lot of damage for a duration of a time theyre invisible. Balanced? HELL NO!
I love how people keep saying that rogues should only do top damage in stealth/ca, yet when we do top damage from stealth/ca people ***** that it's too much. Wtf? So by your post, you want the rogues to do the LEAST amount of damage no matter what position they are in?
good. cause 95% of them are absolutely terrible anyway.
Exactly the same can be said for GWFs or CWs. Hell, my CW is far easier to play in t2s than my TR. I hardly ever have to move. I just stand there and pop Singularity and destroy mobs. Out of all the classes I play (GWF, TR, DC, CW) the TR was the hardest to play out of all of them come t2's. I had to move so often because of the excessive amount of 'red floor'. My GWF just face tanks it, which is fine because that's his job, my DC never moves from his AS, and my CW.....last night running two t2's I watched Warehouse 13 with my wife WHILE getting #2 on dps....
So no, TR's are not the easiest class to play...not even close.
I love how people keep saying that rogues should only do top damage in stealth/ca, yet when we do top damage from stealth/ca people ***** that it's too much. Wtf? So by your post, you want the rogues to do the LEAST amount of damage no matter what position they are in?
TR's single target damage is uncontested irregardless being in or out of stealth. As well as i play GWF i also play TR and i laugh at each and every single one of u who says "TR is ruined now.. TR is useless now" it far from is NOT. Ppl whos trying to imply that GWF now stands side by side with TR in terms of damage, NONE OF EM has played a GWF. NONE. So please, u all just need to pull out ur calculators and do some maths, maybe first THEN you'll realize just how superior TR's singe target damage really is.
Heres some numbers for u just for the hell of it.
My GWF :
GS 11.4k
Castle Never Greatsword Damage : 905-984
Power : 3.9k
At-will Sure Strike Rank 3 (Single target attack) : 493-578 damage on live server (634-744 on test shard)
At-will Weapon Masters Strike Rank 3 (AoE) : 477-560 damage
My gf's Cleric (Pure healing spec btw) :
Forgot to ask what weapon
10.1k gs
3.7k power
At-will Lance of Faith (Rank 2!!!) 737-854 damage
U should learn 2 things from this.
1. GWF's At-will damage numbers are highly underwhelming. High power, highest damage weapon in the game and look at those numbers my GWF's at-wills strikes for.
2. TR's single target damage is hella superior, as intended and it still is after the changes. U can add these things to the numbers ive listed from my not as greatly geared TR.
TR Gets Highest Base Damage, Highest Crit, Highest Crit multiplier that goes all the way to 75%, Combat Advantage Damage bonus nearly 100% of the time, has a heavy damaging bleed effect. Add those modifiers to the 977-1161 damage my not as well geared TR does and compare! U see how far apart my superior geared GWF and TR r yet in terms of single target damage IRREGARDLESS if TR is in stealth or not? Cause i didnt mention in-stealth bonuses in my explanation.
On the flipside, the GWF gets 15% Crit Severity, a crappy DoT dealing 15% of our power in damage over 5 secs (which with 4k power that makes a whopping 60 damage per tick) And we also dont get combat advantage damage unless we go off the path and spec into Charisma which wont really benefit us at all.
Now do u still think u TR's does ****ty damage compared to GWF? Or craptastic damage at all? Or that GWF after the changes can compete with u? Quit making a fool outta urselves.
To be honest, as a frequent pvpier (And a TR) This TR Nerf seems like a fix to Perma stealth TR's - which I think was never intended to happen. and the other non affecting debuff's aren't really that bad
At-wills draining stealth will effectively make it illogical to go with a perma stealth build because the recovery required to keep stealth up indefinitely won't be achievable, or if it is, will screw up your damage anyways.
B dropping the cloud of steel from 12 to 8 will make the perma stealth rogue -if he can even do that anymore- have a lot less damage
C - Dropping lurkers from 60 to 20 will make the Perma Stealth rogues innate quality of being able to 1 shot people even though they don't have a lot of damage cease to exist therefore fixing the Perma Stealth issue altogether
Damage Based rogues won't be nearly as bad, and as I've heard, rogues are also getting a crit damage increase -Idk if this is true- which will mean using rogue -as it was intended- will probably be the smarter path from now on
This all being said, I believe they should look towards debuffing a Lot of the fighter type classes
Primarily a DEF spec Gwf
40k+ health
50% Deflection
50% Armor Resistance
Teneborus enhacnment
Truley UN-Killable 1v1
**** I've seen them 1v3 with ease
DAMAGE Spec GF
Almost Infinite Seeming amount of Knockdowns
Almost infinite Seeming amount of Distance breakers
6000+ damage per hit
oh and they still have a shield...
the only thing I believe that can kill that thing 1v1 would be the gwf listed above
Feel Free to Troll, Correct, or Insult this posting, truly don't care that much~
C - Dropping lurkers from 60 to 20 will make the Perma Stealth rogues innate quality of being able to 1 shot people even though they don't have a lot of damage cease to exist therefore fixing the Perma Stealth issue altogether
Damage Based rogues won't be nearly as bad, and as I've heard, rogues are also getting a crit damage increase -Idk if this is true- which will mean using rogue -as it was intended- will probably be the smarter path from now on
LA on live gives 60% damage boost when it's active. LA on preview gives a 15% critseverity. That's quite a nerf.
Seeing how stealth is being gimped and made only useful to get in or out of situations, I expect a lot more TR's to maximize their burst dps and spec for the insta-gib strikes.
Result: More one-shots, more crying, more nerfing.
I'm not saying adjustments weren't needed, I'm saying this is not an adjustment. Nerfing core-mechanics which tie in to most feats and powers is just the wrong way to do it. They could just as easily buffed the other characters (or mobs) to deal with stealth better. Some effects or AoE ripping stealth for instance, as some already do (CW's Conduit of Ice).
It's just too much, that's why most folks are complaining. And you should worry too, because if your class is deemed OP, and trust me, it will, whatever class you have, the Devs will apply the same line of reasoning they have for the past patches, and gimp the living snot out of your class.
Well, to be honest, whenever I play with TR I have a standard rule of thumbs.
Get them under 30% health in 10 seconds or leave
Due to lack of defense, any drawn out battle typically leads to A) More enemy backup coming or the enemy your facing will probably get the better hand over you, simply because TR in this game ISNT Burst DPS with short cool downs, Its 3 big hit's and wait.
So yea. if they nerf over all damage as well, my only response to that would be to hang out on the sidelines till I see someone with low health then steal a kill. pretty lively life style if you ask me.
My gf's Cleric (Pure healing spec btw) :
Forgot to ask what weapon
10.1k gs
3.7k power
At-will Lance of Faith (Rank 2!!!) 737-854 damage
U should learn 2 things from this.
I learned only 1 things from it. You have no clue of this game. Otherwhise you had already realized that damage number in tooltips are worthless to calculate the dps. Lets try to math.
Character A does 1000 damage but requires 2 secs. Character B does 500 damage but does it in 0,5 secs. Which Character does more DPS?
Character A does 1000 damage on a single mob in 1 sec. Character B does 500 damage in 1 secs up to 5 mobs. Which character has the higher dps potential?
While I agree that TR does the most single damage, GWFs, GFs and CWs can do alot of damage, too. TRs only rule in boss fights. And in contrast to a GWF or GF that simply can take the damage, TR cannot but need to dodge. This reduce DPS again.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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ambisinisterrMember, Neverwinter ModeratorPosts: 10,462Community Moderator
edited August 2013
Thread closed for necromancy.
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Comments
For all I care, you could have paid a million euro or dollars or whatever you pay with, you still should be brought down to be balanced with other classes and I'm not alking 1v1 here, but overall performance. TR overperformed, it was glass cannon power in adamantium armor with stealth being just a cherry on top of it.
If you want OP class that never gets nerfed or rebalanced go play single player RPGs.
Picking the easyest *smash head on keyboard* (TR) gets nerfed, go figure?
I could have never predicted this
So becouse its easier to play it should be the weakest? makes much sense..
TRs werent that overpowered to warrent this kind of nerf. the only skill that should have been brought down by maybe 20% was SE, but so should Ice Knife.
TR is, once again, the only DPS class and are supposed to be way ahead on DPS numbers in dungeons. (CW, your roll is to controll. not dps. GWF, your roll is to take care of adds, not ST kill the boss)
TRs cannot tank bosses, its just bad mechanics on bosses that they dont have any normal attacks but just big red circle attacks on floor that you can dodge out of, which fyi even a CW could do. Add up Astral Shield on that and every class can "tank".
The nerf to Astral Shield on test has made Rogues die like flies from oneshots.
Why would you bring a TR, when you get more dps, more armor and more utility from GWF, GF and CW?
Revert the DF changes to how it is on live, and nerf SE by 20%.
Make Rogues a bit squishier for all i care, but nerfing TR PvE dps by 40% is not the way to go. Its a D.P.S class.
Whats even worse is that other classes will say TR is fine now becouse:
1. They cant kill their class in PvP
2. They cant outdps their class in PvE
This same f-king thing happens in every MMO by whining a-holes that dont know how they play their classes and think their class should be the best at everything. Learn your roll instead.
so how do you go about maximizing your bleed on a fight? TR isn't exactly faceroll when played well. GWF is about mashing the keyboard and sprint cancelling to dps. GF you literally just mash the keyboard...
On the test server our bleed is currently bugged; which by the looks of their customer support will go live. I have waited over a month on multiple tickets that weren't just flat out cancelled and they are still open with no response. This game will die out because they honestly don't give 2 ****s about their customers. Anyways; the bleed goes to 10 stacks bleeds for 6 or so seconds and then stops doing damage and the stacks remain. You have to let them fall off again. It should have taken someone 20s to find this bug as a QA...how the hell did someone honestly not go smack something and stack bleed before looking to see if the nerf was warranted and how much of a dps decrease it was?
Oh and as far as SE; I don't pvp much because it's not really fair with my GS and most people are pvping for fresh 60 gear. so I honestly don't care what they do the ability; it's rarely useful for pve and they can delete the skill all together for all i care.
The only reason ice knife does the dmg it does is because of ray of enfeeblement which they both fixed and nerfed. Ice knife without RoE is good dmg but no where near what it is now.
As a CW I WISH they nerfed Ice Knife and left RoE alone. Rogues should be happy all they did was nerf your daily. You do realize there is a line that buffed the impact of Power for rogues right? I mean what other nerfs was there? The bleed stacking? Only maters in PvE in PvP no one survives 10 stacks anyway.
"Encounter and Daily powers now benefit more from the Power stat."
Any that is precisely why you are wrong. You just stated it perfectly. You can't do a dungeon without a cleric. OBVIOUSLY, they are COMPLETELY OP. I mean... heck my GWF nor my CW can heal NEARLY as much (well, they don't heal at all), so it's so BLATANT that clerics are completely OP. We need to nerf them and take away healing until they are on par with what all other classes can heal.
Same thing with CW. OBVIOUSLY, they do CC MUCH better than GF or TR's, which is completely unfair. We need to nerf them until their CC abilities are on par with TR's.
I mean... that's only fair right? I mean, reduce TR's damage to match other classes... so reduce THEIR abilities to match TR's.
That way, we can all be equally lame.
But again... the fact that you say certain classes are required and certain classes aren't, just proves that they aren't balanced.
So get over yourself.
Um... you obviously don't know anything about the TR changes. The daily is the LEAST of the nerfs. Look at DF and bleed. THAT is the big nerf.
Execution only really affects PVP, since most TRs don't use it in PVE.
You are talking about them as if they are a real development team. They are not. They have NO play testers (or the suck) - WE ARE THEIR PLAY TESTERS.
Their development cycle (aptly named the Monkey Cycle) is:
1) Throw poo
2) See what sticks
3) Go to 1
In short, GWF CANT touch TR's single target DPS by a longshot, OR their utility, or b AS useful in dungeons.. Devs made pretty **** well sure of that. And now i will ask u a question. As someone who plays both GWF and TR classes. You tell me, how it is justified that my TR in full pvp gear, having 1.55k power, PvP weapons doing 1.2k damage per hit, whereas my GWF in T2 armor set, Castle Never weapon set (908 - 984) weapon damage (Highest damage on any weapon in the game btw) and 4k power hits for 550 on Live server. 750ish on Preview Shard. Just how is that justified? Its not.. GWF's at-wills are weaker than priests. Its complete BS, underwhelming damage to the bone. Even with the change they made to it on Preview Shard its still sad and insulting.
And ill add this as well. That despite my GWF having 40% damage mitigation 34AC (Sentinel Defensive Paragon Path) i still eat flying knives from rogues whos geared in the same endgame <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> as i am doing 800-1k damage per knife IN STEALTH.. Do the maths, thats a lot of damage for a duration of a time theyre invisible. Balanced? HELL NO!
A GWF is a fighter, its an offense specced defender not a striker.
A Rogue is supposed to be a striker with low survivabilety.
If they change anything more i hope its more hp or defence for the fighter or less hp or defence for the rogue.
And not buff up GWF damage or nerf TR damage.
Meanwhile we have offensive fighter that deals LESS damage then defensive one and rogue who hits like a cannon and got much more survivability then cleric. How is that balanced again?
Patch 1-Class A is nerfed
-Class B is buffed
Patch 2-Class A is buffed
-Class B is nerfed
i know it sucks to be playing the class that took more hits from a patch Nerf-Hammer, but its not the final work your class will see,
Adapt to the changes if you really like the class, reroll another class if you want to try other views on the game...
Or not, its your choice...
To me this patch will be like every other patch on any MMO, its not a miracle patch, its not something that will please everyone...
Its impossible to do that with one patch, its impossible to balance a game in one patch, today you are underpowered, tomorrow you are overpowered and vice-versa...
there will be another patches...
Its not, i just dont want them to take the easy way and buff gwf's damage so its thesame as rogues.
Then gwf will stop complaining but its not how it should be then.
So, you want the TR to have 10k hps? Really? I'm in all t2's (Swash Set) and my hps are sitting at just above 20k. You are an idiot if you think dropping it that low is ok. And the hps of a tank? You must have some really crappy tanks in your group.
And who says a rogue shouldn't be able to take a fighter 1on1? Your opinion? Let's take a look at the classes.
Fighter = Slow due to heavy armor, large weapon that swings slowly due to weight, and no dodge skills (Again, heavy armor = too slow)
Rogue = Fast, because it has the balls not to rely on a tin can. Two fast, 2.5 foot long blades. Not one...two. And excellent dodge skills.
I'd vote on the Rogue any day of the week. You are just the type of unskilled player who won't be happy till your class has everything. Highest mitigations, hps, and damage. You have no clue what balance even means. The nerfs you propose to the TR are nothing short of insane. How about..we reduce ALL the damage a GF does by 40% because he's a tank. And remove all the armor a GWF wears and reduce all damage he does by 40% to single targets. Sounds fair right? No? But that's exactly the moronic <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> you are asking for the TR right?
Every time I read one of your posts it reminds me of how stupid people really are....
More survivability than a cleric? What the hell game are you playing? Have you even played a TR past 30? I see clerics standing in the middle of 3 mindflayers and just facerolling. Meanwhile, I'm getting killed by 2 because they cone stun and hit for 6k. They do NOT have that kind of survivability. I think every poster that claims that is just shooting wild and has never even tried a TR.
What is a fighter? An idiot in a tin can that moves too slow and carries an large weapon that clearly overcompensates for something. You can't compete with the Rogues...and that makes you hate the class.
Fixed for you.
Peace.
Again, proof that idiots are still wanting every class but the one they play nerfed to the ground. And good luck on rogues not being 'mandatory' in t2's or higher. I'm on the test shard, and we STILL do the highest and most efficient single target damage. You want that boss dead? Go ahead and try to put any other class on it and see how long that takes....
I love how people keep saying that rogues should only do top damage in stealth/ca, yet when we do top damage from stealth/ca people ***** that it's too much. Wtf? So by your post, you want the rogues to do the LEAST amount of damage no matter what position they are in?
good. cause 95% of them are absolutely terrible anyway.
Exactly the same can be said for GWFs or CWs. Hell, my CW is far easier to play in t2s than my TR. I hardly ever have to move. I just stand there and pop Singularity and destroy mobs. Out of all the classes I play (GWF, TR, DC, CW) the TR was the hardest to play out of all of them come t2's. I had to move so often because of the excessive amount of 'red floor'. My GWF just face tanks it, which is fine because that's his job, my DC never moves from his AS, and my CW.....last night running two t2's I watched Warehouse 13 with my wife WHILE getting #2 on dps....
So no, TR's are not the easiest class to play...not even close.
TR's single target damage is uncontested irregardless being in or out of stealth. As well as i play GWF i also play TR and i laugh at each and every single one of u who says "TR is ruined now.. TR is useless now" it far from is NOT. Ppl whos trying to imply that GWF now stands side by side with TR in terms of damage, NONE OF EM has played a GWF. NONE. So please, u all just need to pull out ur calculators and do some maths, maybe first THEN you'll realize just how superior TR's singe target damage really is.
Heres some numbers for u just for the hell of it.
My GWF :
GS 11.4k
Castle Never Greatsword Damage : 905-984
Power : 3.9k
At-will Sure Strike Rank 3 (Single target attack) : 493-578 damage on live server (634-744 on test shard)
At-will Weapon Masters Strike Rank 3 (AoE) : 477-560 damage
My TR :
PvP Weapons : 376-459 damage
GS : 9.4k
Power : 1.55k
At-will Sly Flourish Rank 3 : 977-1161 damage
At-will Duelists Flurry Rank 3 : 977-1161 damge
My gf's Cleric (Pure healing spec btw) :
Forgot to ask what weapon
10.1k gs
3.7k power
At-will Lance of Faith (Rank 2!!!) 737-854 damage
U should learn 2 things from this.
1. GWF's At-will damage numbers are highly underwhelming. High power, highest damage weapon in the game and look at those numbers my GWF's at-wills strikes for.
2. TR's single target damage is hella superior, as intended and it still is after the changes. U can add these things to the numbers ive listed from my not as greatly geared TR.
TR Gets Highest Base Damage, Highest Crit, Highest Crit multiplier that goes all the way to 75%, Combat Advantage Damage bonus nearly 100% of the time, has a heavy damaging bleed effect. Add those modifiers to the 977-1161 damage my not as well geared TR does and compare! U see how far apart my superior geared GWF and TR r yet in terms of single target damage IRREGARDLESS if TR is in stealth or not? Cause i didnt mention in-stealth bonuses in my explanation.
On the flipside, the GWF gets 15% Crit Severity, a crappy DoT dealing 15% of our power in damage over 5 secs (which with 4k power that makes a whopping 60 damage per tick) And we also dont get combat advantage damage unless we go off the path and spec into Charisma which wont really benefit us at all.
Now do u still think u TR's does ****ty damage compared to GWF? Or craptastic damage at all? Or that GWF after the changes can compete with u? Quit making a fool outta urselves.
Tyvm and good night.
At-wills draining stealth will effectively make it illogical to go with a perma stealth build because the recovery required to keep stealth up indefinitely won't be achievable, or if it is, will screw up your damage anyways.
B dropping the cloud of steel from 12 to 8 will make the perma stealth rogue -if he can even do that anymore- have a lot less damage
C - Dropping lurkers from 60 to 20 will make the Perma Stealth rogues innate quality of being able to 1 shot people even though they don't have a lot of damage cease to exist therefore fixing the Perma Stealth issue altogether
Damage Based rogues won't be nearly as bad, and as I've heard, rogues are also getting a crit damage increase -Idk if this is true- which will mean using rogue -as it was intended- will probably be the smarter path from now on
This all being said, I believe they should look towards debuffing a Lot of the fighter type classes
Primarily a DEF spec Gwf
40k+ health
50% Deflection
50% Armor Resistance
Teneborus enhacnment
Truley UN-Killable 1v1
**** I've seen them 1v3 with ease
DAMAGE Spec GF
Almost Infinite Seeming amount of Knockdowns
Almost infinite Seeming amount of Distance breakers
6000+ damage per hit
oh and they still have a shield...
the only thing I believe that can kill that thing 1v1 would be the gwf listed above
Feel Free to Troll, Correct, or Insult this posting, truly don't care that much~
LA on live gives 60% damage boost when it's active. LA on preview gives a 15% critseverity. That's quite a nerf.
Seeing how stealth is being gimped and made only useful to get in or out of situations, I expect a lot more TR's to maximize their burst dps and spec for the insta-gib strikes.
Result: More one-shots, more crying, more nerfing.
I'm not saying adjustments weren't needed, I'm saying this is not an adjustment. Nerfing core-mechanics which tie in to most feats and powers is just the wrong way to do it. They could just as easily buffed the other characters (or mobs) to deal with stealth better. Some effects or AoE ripping stealth for instance, as some already do (CW's Conduit of Ice).
It's just too much, that's why most folks are complaining. And you should worry too, because if your class is deemed OP, and trust me, it will, whatever class you have, the Devs will apply the same line of reasoning they have for the past patches, and gimp the living snot out of your class.
Get them under 30% health in 10 seconds or leave
Due to lack of defense, any drawn out battle typically leads to A) More enemy backup coming or
So yea. if they nerf over all damage as well, my only response to that would be to hang out on the sidelines till I see someone with low health then steal a kill. pretty lively life style if you ask me.
Which would of been a good thing trust me
There are a ton of people that will leave if they dont nerf TR's guess they screwed which ever way
I learned only 1 things from it. You have no clue of this game. Otherwhise you had already realized that damage number in tooltips are worthless to calculate the dps. Lets try to math.
Character A does 1000 damage but requires 2 secs. Character B does 500 damage but does it in 0,5 secs. Which Character does more DPS?
Character A does 1000 damage on a single mob in 1 sec. Character B does 500 damage in 1 secs up to 5 mobs. Which character has the higher dps potential?
While I agree that TR does the most single damage, GWFs, GFs and CWs can do alot of damage, too. TRs only rule in boss fights. And in contrast to a GWF or GF that simply can take the damage, TR cannot but need to dodge. This reduce DPS again.
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