^^ Only this guy can water ski over a shark in style^^
Your guide is picking up a lot, Bane. My cleric keeps getting beaten up by stealthed up rogues. A build like this is what really makes a class interesting-it truly lives up to its name in this case.
@todesfaelle atm i have no guild and so no pvp t2 items + i hate pvp so much
sinister set 4/4 is okay when nobody kick the target away and max 3sec. out of stealth didn't kill you. last thing would happen sometimes. in bad random groups i have the problems to do my rotation and here are the 20% more stealth > 4/4 sinister set bonus.
i'm arround 3,4k crit (~39-40%), 3,2k power, 479 ap, 845 recovery without my companion, with sinister i think its better to use silvery enchants in all offense slots (using atm rank 5).
the crit would be stand around 34-35%, but the recovery goes up to 1,8k and hits with the set bonus 2,8k.
i don't know i should change to pvp t2 when i have the chance for 25% stealth and 5% +dmg or first i go to ice dagger (prefer over dagger set)+ the weapon slots and change the ring/neck/waist + epic shirt/pant. i have so much to do :eek:
I see. Well if you're in Mindflayer, we'd welcome another TR around. We don't get much TR's. Only 2 of us so far in the 60's in a 50-man guild. You'd have to wonder where the TR's are nowadays.
Also, you will definitely have problems using the Sinister Set as compared to using the PVP set. The Sinister Shade set is nice, but if you really wish to get the most out of your Stealth, I can't stress how important it is to have Battlefield Scavenger's 20% additional Stealth Meter bonus.
And yes, I really recommend the PVP T2 set. I'm currently trying to farm the Grym Coins for em and this should take me quite some time. Truly an end-game experience for us TR's, Gauntlgrym.
Thank you so much for this build todesfaelle, I was an Executioner before I specced to this build and I was bored of it pretty fast. This is such a fun build and I am enjoying pve so much more now.
Stabs boss to death and he didn't know what hit him.
Hello! I'm glad to hear that you are having a better time in the game using this build. Please feel free to ask if there are any clarifications needed, or if you discover something new in which you think the community of Stealth TR's will benefit from, please don't hesitate to contribute!
Who has two thumbs and stealth solo'd the Cleric of Asmodeus in Fardelver's Crypt after the rest of the party ragequit?
This guy.
Woah. BEAST. Serious? I TRIED soloing the Dwarf King's Crypt after my party rage quitted (no clerics around), but sadly the last boss can see me even in stealth. I managed to take it down by 10% though.
How did you do it? Is it able to see you from the Stealth mechanic? I haven't tried the Fardelvers Crypt yet so I'm afraid I'm not familiar with how it works.
^^ Only this guy can water ski over a shark in style^^
Your guide is picking up a lot, Bane. My cleric keeps getting beaten up by stealthed up rogues. A build like this is what really makes a class interesting-it truly lives up to its name in this case.
It's rare to find nice comments made by another class in the guide. More often than not I get abusive messages in PVP, or threats that they will report me for being a hacker. LOL. Nonetheless, thank you very much! It's always nice to find support from people of other classes.
Great guide, been using a few elements in my own Perma-Stealth build.
I've tried soloing Dread Vault btw, but the mobs in the end-boss room can see through stealth, so no dice.
And you need to use the GM report system to get out, which is annoying...
Using the PvP T2 set is pretty cool tho, the 5% dmg is rather nice and since the set has a ton of Apen you can focus your other items into recovery and other fun stuff.
hello todesfaelle i play human 60 lvl TR and i reset my skill for your stealth build.but i'm not sure about ability scores which one should i choose can u help me about it?And which body set and weapon do u suggest?the last thing is which shards do u prefer on items?thanks for helping mate
I'm really interested in how this new build works out for both todesfaelle and l0th4ri0. I hope you guys will post your experiences and findings with it.
Actually, I'd love to see a diary type thing (I know, I know I ask too much). But I hope you guys will keep experimenting and posting your findings. You're doing a huge service for the community and I can't thank you enough for all your effort.
Hi klixan, as I kinda very quickly hinted at, the sab build is working very very well for me right now, and has been since the start. This may have something to do with the fact that I am not new to the TR class anymore, but TBH I was not really stuck on getting the class to work for me since about level 2 on my first rogue character LOL. This class is very easy to drive compared to a CW or GWF, just really really nice job the devs did with the rogues. No-nonsense stuff, everything cut and dry.
I soloed the CT at level 20, which was kinda a high level for that, but to make up for it I did it three times in a row. I used maybe 6 potions the whole time I think, which is due to my regen gear I'm using on this char just like on my standard banelorne-style TR. I'm a big believer in using regen, and the TR class gets a lot of very sweet regen items as they level. Many of the blue gears you can buy with the seals are powerful regen items, and since we are soloing the dungeons frequently, we get a BUNCH of seals. The manticore seals you can get after about level 35ish don't have regen items, though the rest of the seals do. Notably, the pegasus seals can net you a nice pair of regen rings that have 409 regen on them each. I have one of them already on my first non-saboteur TR.
Okay, I'm getting sidetracked LOL... I skipped cragmire with the Sab because I didn't need any more lion seals, and I've done it already with my first TR. It's kinda not hard to solo - at all. The only real challenge you'll face is at the very end with Traven Blackdagger, and as long as you stay on top of his endless adds you'll burn him down easy enough. If you let the adds build up and just focus on Traven you'll get overwhelmed as a soloist, trust me. Just pop Lurkers when it comes up from having your BnS dummy wailed on, and tear the adds apart with impunity. Once they are all gone, you have about two full rotations of duelist's flurry you can put on Traven before more adds show up.
I'll post some more when I get to Lair of the Mad Dragon and have some feedback to offer.
EDIT:
I guess I should add that I'm using Dazing Strike/Lashing Blade/Bait and Switch as my encounters, and ofc have Lurker's Assault as my daily. Don't have Gloaming Cut yet, so I'm still using Sly Flourish, but as soon as I hit level 20 I replaced Cloud of Steel with Duelist's Flurry. I am following the feat chart exactly as it was laid out by todesfaelle earlier as you quoted, as he and I pretty much came to the same conclusion about this at the same time LOL. When I take on Idris later I'll temporarily switch out Lashing for Impossible to Catch, but that's still a ways off from where I'm at right now.
Remember that Dazing Strike is not just a stun... it's an AoE stun that can hit up to 5 targets if they are bunched together. Most of the time I'll hit at least 2 mobs with it, and then that's a couple of seconds that those two mobs can't do anything to fight back. It's also excellent as a time-filler on the elites when your stealth runs out and everything else is on CD. When the mobs are dazed, you get combat advantage on them just like you were in stealth.
My brilliant fighting strategy, consists of teleporting to the strongest monster, hitting 'Stealth', smacking them like crazy with 'Sly Florish' then using 'Dazing Strike' and 'Lashing Blade' as Stealth wears off.
For bosses, I throw a couple of 'Cloud of Steel' to get their attention, then I run like hell to lure them as far away from their starting area as possible (all of their adds seem to spawn in that starting area, so I've found that if I lure the boss away from it, the adds can't find me and I can go back and finish them off once I've delt with the boss. Makes for much fairer boss fights!).
Once I have the boss where I want him, I use my 'Lurker's Assault' daily, plus whatever skills I can as they come off cooldown. Seems to be working so far *touchwood*.
As for gear, I'm just using whatever I find for now. But once I hit 20 I'd like to buy a full set of 'el-cheapo' green gear from the AH, it sounds like Regen/Youth gear is the way to go.
Also, I'm ready to get my first companion. What do you recommend? Or would I be better off not using a companion at all?
Anyway, there's a Dungeon Delve in a couple of hours, so if I can hit 20 by then (and I'm feeling confident enough) I'll try to solo the Cloak Tower
It sounds like you are new to the TR as I was not too long ago, and you have discovered just how solid and easy to drive the class can be. You are making great progress, and since you asked, I'd like to give you one or two tips to keep things rolling smooth for when you enter the cloak tower and really challenge yourself.
Companions: you are better off without one. Trust me. When you are level 60 and can get an ioun stone or cat, that's okay because they don't draw aggro, but all the other companions are trouble, and will make your already challenging solo dungeon even harder.
Gear: Now you understand why I don't roll with a cleric companion like 99% of everybody else LOL. It's the regen, babay! Although I personally swear by regen and will not use gear that isn't regen, even to the point of using something that's like 15 levels too low for me, that does not mean that it is the absolute best for minmaxing damage/recharge/etc., but I feel that at the pre-level 50ish-60 areas that the stats on your gear besides regen can be largely meaningless, as getting 1000 more power is not a gamechanger, nor is getting a bunch more defense or what have you. Think of it this way: the regen gear does everything very slightly less effectively, but it is more than good enough to get the job done, while also adding something that no other type of gear can do. The exception to my regen rule is my daggers, which I keep up to date as I level, and will have various stats on them depending on what it was that I found during my adventuring.
The Cloak Tower: you're gonna need Bait and Switch for this, which I'm sure you've figured out already but just a reminder. I hope you've been practicing using it and have figured out that the BnS dummy draws aggro even when you are not in stealth and also gives you a very very nice AP boost. It can act as an extra "dodge" when you are not in stealth, pulling you back from the spot where you fired off the dummy at least as far as a dodge roll does. When in stealth, you just drop it and don't auto-dodge, but it refreshes your stealth meter -- that's when you immediately circle around and start backstabbing. Don't stay in the same spot as where you dropped your BnS dummy! LOL
Don't be shy about using Lurkers very often, especially in the cloak tower. The mobs there take a lot of punishment to go down, and you will be recharging your AP like crazy whether you like it or not. Might as well use what the bad guys give you, right?
Hey im new to neverwinter in general and ive been in the forums looking around for a really good pvp build im really interested in the trickester rogue and as a gamer who nose dives into games i pratically got lvl 45 (hopefully 60 by end of week) in like 1 week.......leveling in all honesty is a joke, anyways ive been lookin into great weapon fighters also ( stun locking, decent dps, good aoe tanky..ish.. have yet to start one though and might roll one once i max my TR ) sooo do you have any tips for how i should be focusing on stat wise because at the moment my priority goes arm pen > crit chance > power > recovery > and then the rest of the stats and how to maximize and efficiently get good damage in pvp but sticking to being in stealth for a good while not permanatly but enough as too not get murdered by stun locks and cc's Im sorry if i ask for too much but i like being knowledgable in every aspect.
P. S since i am new and my professions arent high does it matter a lot to get my leather working and leadership to 20 and also how do i get good gear i know their are dungeon runs for seals and also the pvp gear u get from ur glories is that how u get them? I really appreciate the time you might take to answer a fellow gamer.
I've just hit level 20 (updated my previous post) and I'm loving my new Regen gear. Unfortunately, I didn't make it in time for the Dungeon Delve event, but I did run the Cloak Tower at level 17 (with a group) just to see what it was like. Hmm I dunno if I can solo it, those beggars are tough.
Anyway, I grabbed a cleric companion (I didn't know what else to get and I figured you can't go wrong with a cleric). But if it's better not to use her, then I'll unsummon her.
As for Bait & Switch, I definitely need to practice with it. I used it to fight Rhazzard, but he destroyed it in one hit. Still, it did give me a chance to get away and down a potion and I managed to kill him without dying.
I do need to ask about Duelist's Flurry though, both you and todesfaelle seem to favor it, but I'm not that fond of it, I find it rather slow and awkward. Is there any particular reason to use it?
But I've just got to say, I'm having a blast with this character. Most fun class I've played to date. I haven't even died yet, which is a first for me. My little rogue is one tough cookie, she actually goes looking for fights instead of trying to avoid them. She's just decimating everything she sees .
I've just hit level 20 (updated my previous post) and I'm loving my new Regen gear. Unfortunately, I didn't make it in time for the Dungeon Delve event, but I did run the Cloak Tower at level 17 (with a group) just to see what it was like. Hmm I dunno if I can solo it, those beggars are tough.
Anyway, I grabbed a cleric companion (I didn't know what else to get and I figured you can't go wrong with a cleric). But if it's better not to use her, then I'll unsummon her.
As for Bait & Switch, I definitely need to practice with it. I used it to fight Rhazzard, but he destroyed it in one hit. Still, it did give me a chance to get away and down a potion and I managed to kill him without dying.
I do need to ask about Duelist's Flurry though, both you and todesfaelle seem to favor it, but I'm not that fond of it, I find it rather slow and awkward. Is there any particular reason to use it?
But I've just got to say, I'm having a blast with this character. Most fun class I've played to date. I haven't even died yet, which is a first for me. My little rogue is one tough cookie, she actually goes looking for fights instead of trying to avoid them. She's just decimating everything she sees .
Bait and switch for me was pretty simple to get a grasp of im having more problems getting used to shadow strike. yea i just use Bait and switch right before my stealth runs out and then use cloud of steel from a distance then they should be all dead ,if they are trash mobs, if not i go into shadow strike and finally into a lashing blade, still dont have smoke bomb yet soo.... need to test that out.
As for duelist flurry i too dont personally like it i should do some testing on it first though before i judge it because everyone in forums says it is slow but its dps is the best for TR's at wills so i have been trying to grow to like it, i keep it on my right mouse button and only use it for harder mobs ( only for pve though as for pvp cloud of steel is always my 2nd at will )
I've just hit level 20 (updated my previous post) and I'm loving my new Regen gear. Unfortunately, I didn't make it in time for the Dungeon Delve event, but I did run the Cloak Tower at level 17 (with a group) just to see what it was like. Hmm I dunno if I can solo it, those beggars are tough.
Anyway, I grabbed a cleric companion (I didn't know what else to get and I figured you can't go wrong with a cleric). But if it's better not to use her, then I'll unsummon her.
As for Bait & Switch, I definitely need to practice with it. I used it to fight Rhazzard, but he destroyed it in one hit. Still, it did give me a chance to get away and down a potion and I managed to kill him without dying.
I do need to ask about Duelist's Flurry though, both you and todesfaelle seem to favor it, but I'm not that fond of it, I find it rather slow and awkward. Is there any particular reason to use it?
But I've just got to say, I'm having a blast with this character. Most fun class I've played to date. I haven't even died yet, which is a first for me. My little rogue is one tough cookie, she actually goes looking for fights instead of trying to avoid them. She's just decimating everything she sees .
Glad that it's working for you, klixan! About duelist's flurry:
DF is for when you are facing down an elite mob or boss with lots of HP who isn't going to move, which happens quite frequently when you are popping stealth all the time and otherwise using Dazing Strike, BnS, etc. -- pretty much any encounter you can use to get combat advantage on an enemy should be on your bar. Trying to use DF on weaker mobs who are shifting away or are fast attackers is not a terribly efficient time to use it... that's what Sly Flourish, and after level 35, Gloaming Cut is for.
DF does a great deal of damage and also ticks off bleeds for even more damage, which means you can whack the boss or elite, roll away out of a red circle or whatever, and they are still getting hurt while you aren't actively attacking them. This makes SOOOOOO much of a difference in solo boss fights that it's not even up for debate. DF is the king of boss damage, period. In a solo 5-man dungeon run, you can treat the dozens of elite mobs as bosses for the purposes of whether or not to use DF on them, as they have so much health that they might as well all be bosses. For the crowds of trash mobs who are weak and plentiful, Sly Flourish and Gloaming Cut from stealth are far superior to DF, because DF is slower and more likely to stick you in one place for too long and you'll get hit too often by the five or more trash mobs pecking away at your health.
Addendum: unsummon your cleric companion. It's okay, trust me.
Another note about regen gear that I forgot to mention earlier:
As klixan discovered, lower level regen gear can be had on the auction house for very very cheap. One prayer's worth of AD can easily outfit you in all regen armor, rings, belt, necklace... but what you're looking for is the white common stuff, not the greens. Interestingly, the cheaper white gear has much higher regen ratings on it at the same level as the green stuff, at the cost of not getting slight bumps in crit or deflection or whatever. The common gear also has another interesting quality: it doesn't bind to your character.
This means that you can trade it out to other alts when you outgrow it and get better common stuff, or mail it to a friend who is a lower level than you, etc. At the very least, you can put it back on the AH after you're done with it and recoup the tiny investment of AD that you made to get it in the first place.
My Sab char is level 32 right now and has over 800 regen from using the common stuff, and I'm not even wearing chest armor. If I was, my regen would be well over 1000. As it is now, I am nigh unkillable in normal PVE unless I AFK or fall asleep at the wheel.
Just some food for thought... if anybody is playing on Mindflayer and wants to get my hand-me-down common regen gear after I'm done with it, PM me your ingame handle or just post it here in this thread. I'll be more than happy to mail you my old stuff when I'm done with it. Who knows, we might even get to meet up in game and run a dungeon together or something.
DF is for when you are facing down an elite mob or boss with lots of HP who isn't going to move, which happens quite frequently when you are popping stealth all the time and otherwise using Dazing Strike, BnS, etc. -- pretty much any encounter you can use to get combat advantage on an enemy should be on your bar. Trying to use DF on weaker mobs who are shifting away or are fast attackers is not a terribly efficient time to use it... that's what Sly Flourish, and after level 35, Gloaming Cut is for.
DF does a great deal of damage and also ticks off bleeds for even more damage, which means you can whack the boss or elite, roll away out of a red circle or whatever, and they are still getting hurt while you aren't actively attacking them. This makes SOOOOOO much of a difference in solo boss fights that it's not even up for debate. DF is the king of boss damage, period. In a solo 5-man dungeon run, you can treat the dozens of elite mobs as bosses for the purposes of whether or not to use DF on them, as they have so much health that they might as well all be bosses. For the crowds of trash mobs who are weak and plentiful, Sly Flourish and Gloaming Cut from stealth are far superior to DF, because DF is slower and more likely to stick you in one place for too long and you'll get hit too often by the five or more trash mobs pecking away at your health.
Aha! Now I understand. I was using it on trash mobs and I couldn't understand why people liked it better than Sly Flourish. Honestly, the information in this thread is priceless!
But what you're looking for is the white common stuff, not the greens. Interestingly, the cheaper white gear has much higher regen ratings on it at the same level as the green stuff, at the cost of not getting slight bumps in crit or deflection or whatever. The common gear also has another interesting quality: it doesn't bind to your character.
More priceless info! It never occurred to me to even look at white gear, I just assumed it was low quality vendor trash. Ha, we live and learn. Time to go shopping again
You horrible tease! But I do understand, I too feel the constant threat of the nerf bat hanging over my head. Heaven forbid people should be having fun!
@bliviousoblivion This build isn't really for PvP, it's designed to solo the PvE content. But I think Todesfaelle did say he's successfully PvP'd with it (don't quote me on that though, it's a long thread ). Anyway, you might have better luck looking at one of the guides that's more focused on PvP. Good luck.
It never occurred to me to even look at white gear, I just assumed it was low quality vendor trash. Ha, we live and learn. Time to go shopping again
LOL you should see me IRL when a common white "of youth" piece of gear drops... I'm fist-bumping my monitor and whatnot. hehehe but then again, I AM quite a silly person.
Hey, guys. Terribly sorry for the late reply again. I've been watching the developments, but just haven't got the time lately to post the replies. But I finally got the time now.
Great guide, been using a few elements in my own Perma-Stealth build.
I've tried soloing Dread Vault btw, but the mobs in the end-boss room can see through stealth, so no dice.
And you need to use the GM report system to get out, which is annoying...
Using the PvP T2 set is pretty cool tho, the 5% dmg is rather nice and since the set has a ton of Apen you can focus your other items into recovery and other fun stuff.
Hi, Gunman. Thank you for posting this info right here. I actually had the same problem when I tried soloing Dread Vault. The brain mobs that look like dogs seem to be able to detect us from Stealth. But I definitely am not giving up on that dungeon. And you actually can leave that dungeon without the need of contacting a GM. All you have to do is to "leave party" even though you are by yourself. It should work, if I recall correctly.
And you got that right. PVP T2 set is awesome. Has the ArPen and crit we need, and the set bonus is just beast. The extra boost in HP is also great. I've always liked equips that provide HP. Hence why I do not use the blue BiS belts that give ArPen and Crit and went for Grand Fugitive's Belt of Revolt. Once I get my T2 set, I'll be sure to pump in recovery as well.
Level 30 -- pwning very very hard. Extremely smooth sailing, looking forward to solo-shredding LotMD while underleveled and undergeared.
PS All my chars are on Mindflayer... my Sab is Dodger@l0th4ri0, I'm the pink tiefling with no armor -- you can't miss me LOL
I'll see if I can catch you online sometime, man. I've been reading your reports, and you're doing an awesome job laying down your experiences. Expect to see links to your posts later because I will be doing a massive editing spree today for the guide. I will try to resist playing the game today until I finish the edits. I tend to PVP my time away whenever I get a small amount of free time. Oh and thanks for answering the questions of other people as well btw, man. Can't tell you guys how much I appreciate the support!
I'm really interested in how this new build works out for both todesfaelle and l0th4ri0. I hope you guys will post your experiences and findings with it.
Actually, I'd love to see a diary type thing (I know, I know I ask too much). But I hope you guys will keep experimenting and posting your findings. You're doing a huge service for the community and I can't thank you enough for all your effort.
I actually have not started my sab char yet, but I should be able to do so later. l0th4ri0 seems to be having a blast with it and it's quite pleasing to hear that leveling the Sab is easy. I personally would like to know how the PVP experience is for the Sab Stealth TR. Thank you for laying down your experiences as a Sab TR as well. They're fun to read and very informative! And just as l0th4ri0 said, welcome to the family! I'm glad to have another Stealth TR around.
Hey im new to neverwinter in general and ive been in the forums looking around for a really good pvp build im really interested in the trickester rogue and as a gamer who nose dives into games i pratically got lvl 45 (hopefully 60 by end of week) in like 1 week.......leveling in all honesty is a joke, anyways ive been lookin into great weapon fighters also ( stun locking, decent dps, good aoe tanky..ish.. have yet to start one though and might roll one once i max my TR ) sooo do you have any tips for how i should be focusing on stat wise because at the moment my priority goes arm pen > crit chance > power > recovery > and then the rest of the stats and how to maximize and efficiently get good damage in pvp but sticking to being in stealth for a good while not permanatly but enough as too not get murdered by stun locks and cc's Im sorry if i ask for too much but i like being knowledgable in every aspect.
P. S since i am new and my professions arent high does it matter a lot to get my leather working and leadership to 20 and also how do i get good gear i know their are dungeon runs for seals and also the pvp gear u get from ur glories is that how u get them? I really appreciate the time you might take to answer a fellow gamer.
Hello, bliviousoblivion. Welcome to Neverwinter, and I'm sure you'll have a good experience in the game playing as a Stealth TR. Leveling is indeed really fast in this game. All you have to do is to spam quests even if your level requirement is 4 levels lower than the quest zone. It's easy so far but maybe they'll tweak it in the future (hopefully not, I like it easy).
As for the stat preference, you'll want to go for gear that gives you a good amount of Recovery. Factoring the bonuses of the Ioun Stone, your target will be the soft cap of 2.9k Recovery. Once you get that amount, you'll want to prioritize crit. Mine is currently 2.9k, but I'm pretty sure it can go higher as I'm using low level rank 5 - 6 enchants. Next would be ArPen, and your target will be 2.2K. That should net you 22% Armor Penetration which can be made better by Plague Fire Enchants due to its ability to reduce a target's Damage Mitigation which is separate from the ArPen effects you get. Power is the least of our priorities as we tend to not be able to get much out of Power, due to the fact that we don't use damage encounters that much and tend to go for the ones which prolong our stealth time.
Regarding the professions, it doesn't really matter which you prefer to take, really. You'll be able to benefit from Leatherworking since you can craft yourself the epic pants and shirts for free (provided you already have dragon eggs). But other than that, there's not much professions can give you. They can net you a good sum of AD's on the Auction House once you get good Profession Assets, but it definitely will not affect your game play as a Stealth TR. You'll want to get the PVP set from the Trade of Blades as soon as you get 60 to get a maximized stealth time increase of +40%.
If there are any need for further questions and clarifications please do not hesitate to ask! Our community of Stealth TR's may be small but I'm dang proud to say that ours is one of the most helpful and progressive. Always a fun time reading the replies of people in the thread.
hello todesfaelle i play human 60 lvl TR and i reset my skill for your stealth build.but i'm not sure about ability scores which one should i choose can u help me about it?And which body set and weapon do u suggest?the last thing is which shards do u prefer on items?thanks for helping mate
Hello, Cronian. For stats you'll definitely want to go for STR + DEX for maximized damage output. Since we're going to take the executioner path, we should make the most out of our crit abilities. DEX and STR help us achieve that goal. For the body gear, you'll definitely want to take the PVP set. I can't stress enough how important it is for our rotations to have that or the PVP T2 set we can get in Gauntlgrym. And lastly, for enchants you'll want Silvery Enchantments on them due to the fact that they take the most points before we can reach the soft cap. We should always factor the stats Ioun Stones give us however.
If there are further need for clarifications please don't hesitate to ask!
I thought your username was familiar. You're Svetlana Anejska, if I'm not mistaken, so I'm pretty sure I have an idea about what this secret message should contain.
I took a screenie of the message you sent me in the game so I wouldn't forget you just in case I run into you in the forum. Now I know I made a good choice taking the screenie! Good to know that you're an active forum user as well. I would have wanted to have a decent and mature conversation with you but apparently you put me in your ignore list before I can even ask you what you meant by your message. But since you're already here please do take the time to read this.
First and foremost I do not think I'm good in PVP. I really don't. I believe I'm mediocre at best and I tend to PVP to test strategies as to how I can make my build viable for PVP as well. Second, I attack the opponent's tower to attract my opponents to fight me and make them stay there for a variety of reasons.
1. To give my allies some breathing room in tower 2.
2. To staunch the opponent's point gain and possibly capture their tower.
3. To annoy my opponents and make them want to kill me.
I "try" to not spawn camp losing opponents, but you can't really blame me for giving into temptation sometime. Nowadays I just call for 1 vs. 1's to pass the time whenever I'm fighting 3 vs 5 matches. And please do not be mistaken, I also help in tower 2 and I do it a lot. But when I see the opportunity to attack the opposing tower, I take it, and there are a lot of those opportunities. I'm sorry if you do not agree with how I play but from my experience so far it has been effective and little by little I have been able to polish the viability of this build in PVP.
I do hope that we can put the past misunderstandings aside and just be the adults we are supposed to be; mature, understanding and level-headed. Thank you for taking the time to read this, lichlament.
You horrible tease! But I do understand, I too feel the constant threat of the nerf bat hanging over my head. Heaven forbid people should be having fun!
@bliviousoblivion This build isn't really for PvP, it's designed to solo the PvE content. But I think Todesfaelle did say he's successfully PvP'd with it (don't quote me on that though, it's a long thread ). Anyway, you might have better luck looking at one of the guides that's more focused on PvP. Good luck.
Lol, I posted on how to defeat this build on every engagement, but this is Bane's thread and I dont want to seem like the sour apple, that's not my style.
I thought your username was familiar. You're Svetlana Anejska, if I'm not mistaken, so I'm pretty sure I have an idea about what this secret message should contain.
I took a screenie of the message you sent me in the game so I wouldn't forget you just in case I run into you in the forum. Now I know I made a good choice taking the screenie! Good to know that you're an active forum user as well. I would have wanted to have a decent and mature conversation with you but apparently you put me in your ignore list before I can even ask you what you meant by your message. But since you're already here please do take the time to read this.
First and foremost I do not think I'm good in PVP. I really don't. I believe I'm mediocre at best and I tend to PVP to test strategies as to how I can make my build viable for PVP as well. Second, I attack the opponent's tower to attract my opponents to fight me and make them stay there for a variety of reasons.
1. To give my allies some breathing room in tower 2.
2. To staunch the opponent's point gain and possibly capture their tower.
3. To annoy my opponents and make them want to kill me.
I "try" to not spawn camp losing opponents, but you can't really blame me for giving into temptation sometime. Nowadays I just call for 1 vs. 1's to pass the time whenever I'm fighting 3 vs 5 matches. And please do not be mistaken, I also help in tower 2 and I do it a lot. But when I see the opportunity to attack the opposing tower, I take it, and there are a lot of those opportunities. I'm sorry if you do not agree with how I play but from my experience so far it has been effective and little by little I have been able to polish the viability of this build in PVP.
I do hope that we can put the past misunderstandings aside and just be the adults we are supposed to be; mature, understanding and level-headed. Thank you for taking the time to read this, lichlament.
Yes Bane, I am Svetlana, and I just checked my ignore and your not on it ... you ignored me maybe ? Dont know.
Yes, I raged on you in one match because my team completely ignored a back capping rogue and you had a CW who was Ray of Enfeeblement happy on me while I was attempting to engage you.
(side note: Ray of Enfeeblement really sucks )
We have fought on the same teams and against each other, just recently we fought together on my CW, Si`nafey...
One thing I can take credit against you is I kill you more often than not and the strat I use works pretty good as long as it is just me and you at that back cap and no involvement, but this is PvP and C'est la vie, other people will get involved.
The issue I raised in that screencap is about how you play in regards to your team.... I was already frustrated at your team and my team that match so I had a moment of rage, lol, don't we all.
I haven't once seen you rescue team mates and stand idly by in the shadows while your team dies.
I Have seen this while playing on your team.
It is what it is. It plays into the whole rogue backstory, so whatever, I'm past it. I know in the future to not expect much if I am 2v1 or more and see you standing off to the side.
It's your account, play your way.
In regards to playing against you. There is a way to defeat this build 9 times out of 10 and I have used it with success against you / this build.
against this build you have to accept you are going to die at least once. After that first death, you know how to fight against this rogue and you make changes to modify your powers to engage it.
It also helps to have a build leaning more toward DPS ( not completely )...
I have posted my build only one time to a guild mate who was looking to maximize DPS but also have versatility.
That's the keyword, Versatility...
You have to look at what you are given by the dev's... and the options we have are.
1. Stealth
2. DPS
3. Versatility / Utility.
I have taken a twist on the DPS / versatility that gives me very above average damage , leaves me stealth capability and rounds out my utility and versatility.
I have no ill will toward you Bane, you play a good rogue and you have a tester's patience. As a former game tester myself in Everquest, I only have respect for those that put forth the effort.
It is good to see you sharing with the community so maybe my first impressions were off about you.
We'll talk again about mechanics again in the future I am sure.
Hello, Cronian. For stats you'll definitely want to go for STR + DEX for maximized damage output. Since we're going to take the executioner path, we should make the most out of our crit abilities. DEX and STR help us achieve that goal. For the body gear, you'll definitely want to take the PVP set. I can't stress enough how important it is for our rotations to have that or the PVP T2 set we can get in Gauntlgrym. And lastly, for enchants you'll want Silvery Enchantments on them due to the fact that they take the most points before we can reach the soft cap. We should always factor the stats Ioun Stones give us however.
If there are further need for clarifications please don't hesitate to ask!
so you suggest me silver enchantments for all gears?okay i'm going to but battle t1 set for extra %20 stealth shouldn't i use radiant enchantments for all gears except armor?
Hello, Cronian. For stats you'll definitely want to go for STR + DEX for maximized damage output. Since we're going to take the executioner path, we should make the most out of our crit abilities. DEX and STR help us achieve that goal. For the body gear, you'll definitely want to take the PVP set. I can't stress enough how important it is for our rotations to have that or the PVP T2 set we can get in Gauntlgrym. And lastly, for enchants you'll want Silvery Enchantments on them due to the fact that they take the most points before we can reach the soft cap. We should always factor the stats Ioun Stones give us however.
If there are further need for clarifications please don't hesitate to ask!
so you suggest me silver enchantments for all gears?okay i'm going to but battle t1 set for extra %20 stealth shouldn't i use radiant enchantments for all gears except armor?
Status: lets call it a "tie" for now. The mobs could not stop me from reaching the end, but I could not close the deal and kill Chartilifax at my current level (34). I honestly think that I could do it in the very near future if I had a couple of more tools at my disposal; namely, gloaming with 5 feats in sneaky... so, level 39.
The problem with Chartilifax is not the dragon itself, although if you get caught in his breath attack you are in for a good 4000 damage... but what really gets you in this battle is the neverending stream of imps, who would not be even as much of a problem if they didn't outrun you by a factor of 5 and slow you down to a crawl after they hit you. The imps are a special CC/debuffing kind of imp I've never seen anywhere else, and thankfully so. Talk about a royal pain in the --
So, yes... gloaming would probably get me to a place where I could take down the imp waves and have enough time to put some hurt on the boss in between having to deal with summoned magi, and apparently, a pit fiend at some point after the dragon is injured enough. Although I did manage to keep going for a while with ITC slotted to escape the imp slows, they just overwhelm you because there's no way to break line of sight, no way to use a corner to bunch them up, and they zip across the map faster than a horse. If there was some kind of break in the terrain maybe I could be tricky and pull it off at my low level, but it's just a big round cave with nothing.
I don't feel bad for wiping, though... afterwards, I read up on the encounter from some posts and blogs, and it seems that this battle is famous for wiping full 5-man crews unless they are overleveled. LOL
Yes Bane, I am Svetlana, and I just checked my ignore and your not on it ... you ignored me maybe ? Dont know. Yes, I raged on you in one match because my team completely ignored a back capping rogue and you had a CW who was Ray of Enfeeblement happy on me while I was attempting to engage you. (side note: Ray of Enfeeblement really sucks )
We have fought on the same teams and against each other, just recently we fought together on my CW, Si`nafey... One thing I can take credit against you is I kill you more often than not and the strat I use works pretty good as long as it is just me and you at that back cap and no involvement, but this is PvP and C'est la vie, other people will get involved.
The issue I raised in that screencap is about how you play in regards to your team.... I was already frustrated at your team and my team that match so I had a moment of rage, lol, don't we all. I haven't once seen you rescue team mates and stand idly by in the shadows while your team dies. I Have seen this while playing on your team.
It is what it is. It plays into the whole rogue backstory, so whatever, I'm past it. I know in the future to not expect much if I am 2v1 or more and see you standing off to the side. It's your account, play your way. In regards to playing against you. There is a way to defeat this build 9 times out of 10 and I have used it with success against you / this build. against this build you have to accept you are going to die at least once. After that first death, you know how to fight against this rogue and you make changes to modify your powers to engage it. It also helps to have a build leaning more toward DPS ( not completely )...
I have posted my build only one time to a guild mate who was looking to maximize DPS but also have versatility.
That's the keyword, Versatility...
You have to look at what you are given by the dev's... and the options we have are.
1. Stealth
2. DPS
3. Versatility / Utility.
I have taken a twist on the DPS / versatility that gives me very above average damage , leaves me stealth capability and rounds out my utility and versatility. I have no ill will toward you Bane, you play a good rogue and you have a tester's patience. As a former game tester myself in Everquest, I only have respect for those that put forth the effort. It is good to see you sharing with the community so maybe my first impressions were off about you.
We'll talk again about mechanics again in the future I am sure.
Hello once more, Lichlament, and I'm really happy that we've managed to go past those misunderstandings and resolve them! I appreciate your understanding and input regarding this build and my play style as it will help further develop the build into one that does better in PVP, as this is mainly a PVE build.
If you have any other suggestions regarding changes for the PVP skill setups and/or strategies, please feel free to contribute. It's always a welcome experience to have a veteran player such as yourself to add in his 2 cents. It'll be a contribution to the community in my opinion.
Also, you shouldn't have edited the post regarding how to beat my build in PVP for 90% of the time. I'm pretty sure I have an idea about how this works since I've encountered several players in the game who just downright screws up my rotations in PVP. But the other non-stealth TR players would be able to benefit from such an informative post. I personally would link your post on the PVP Section of this guide so players from all over who are curious as to how to beat us (as a TR or another class) can beat us in 1 vs. 1 scenarios.
And since our last few matches together, I believe I've also been able to polish the build to a competitive level. I managed to get rid of the DPS problem as well, but majority of my kills come from killing CW's, TR's and DC's. GWF's and GF's tend to be a problem in 1 vs. 1 scenarios specially if they're as skilled as tanks like jtype from our own server. But I did get my Head Hunter title some weeks (I think 2 weeks) back, and now I'm shooting towards Bloodthirsty. I collect screenshots of the matches I do (wins and losses) to take note of the setups I used which helped me achieve success and the ones which didn't turn out well. I believe I managed to get a working setup for PVP. Allow me to test it against you when we play against (or with) each other and tell me what you think, Lichlament!
If anyone wants to see the PVP screenies I think I'll upload them to photobucket or something and make a folder out of em. The edits regarding the PVP strategies will come soon, and I'll also be editing some stuff on the front page today like adding screenies of the up-to-date version of the skills and feat list.
so you suggest me silver enchantments for all gears?okay i'm going to but battle t1 set for extra %20 stealth shouldn't i use radiant enchantments for all gears except armor?
Yes! For all the offense slots, it would be best if you punched in some silvery enchants on em, a minimum of rank 6 on each slot. For defense slots, I usually use radiant enchants to get higher HP. Better HP pool means better means of survival. For utility, nothing beats Dark Enchants. Radiant Enchants aren't so good for Offense Slots due to the fact that we do not benefit much from getting higher power. We don't use damage-dealing powers much unless you spec for them. I like using Lashing Blade in dungeon runs, but that's basically it. Nothing beats Bait and Switch for AP Regen, Shadow Strike for instant Stealth Refill, ITC for 5 seconds of invulnerability and Smoke Bomb for CC in the dungeon. Provided you are with a group that is.
Status: lets call it a "tie" for now. The mobs could not stop me from reaching the end, but I could not close the deal and kill Chartilifax at my current level (34). I honestly think that I could do it in the very near future if I had a couple of more tools at my disposal; namely, gloaming with 5 feats in sneaky... so, level 39.
The problem with Chartilifax is not the dragon itself, although if you get caught in his breath attack you are in for a good 4000 damage... but what really gets you in this battle is the neverending stream of imps, who would not be even as much of a problem if they didn't outrun you by a factor of 5 and slow you down to a crawl after they hit you. The imps are a special CC/debuffing kind of imp I've never seen anywhere else, and thankfully so. Talk about a royal pain in the --
So, yes... gloaming would probably get me to a place where I could take down the imp waves and have enough time to put some hurt on the boss in between having to deal with summoned magi, and apparently, a pit fiend at some point after the dragon is injured enough. Although I did manage to keep going for a while with ITC slotted to escape the imp slows, they just overwhelm you because there's no way to break line of sight, no way to use a corner to bunch them up, and they zip across the map faster than a horse. If there was some kind of break in the terrain maybe I could be tricky and pull it off at my low level, but it's just a big round cave with nothing.
I don't feel bad for wiping, though... afterwards, I read up on the encounter from some posts and blogs, and it seems that this battle is famous for wiping full 5-man crews unless they are overleveled. LOL
That's true. The Imps tend to be problematic due to their special mechanic. I personally would like to see how you'll do in this dungeon once you reach level 39, bro. Keep it up with the updates!
I personally think that Lair of the Mad Dragon is much harder than the other higher leveled dungeons due to this particular boss room. Endless amount of Imps, Erineyes, etc. Just a horrible experience.
Comments
Oh....my...god....it's THE FONZE!!
^^ Only this guy can water ski over a shark in style^^
Your guide is picking up a lot, Bane. My cleric keeps getting beaten up by stealthed up rogues. A build like this is what really makes a class interesting-it truly lives up to its name in this case.
I see. Well if you're in Mindflayer, we'd welcome another TR around. We don't get much TR's. Only 2 of us so far in the 60's in a 50-man guild. You'd have to wonder where the TR's are nowadays.
Also, you will definitely have problems using the Sinister Set as compared to using the PVP set. The Sinister Shade set is nice, but if you really wish to get the most out of your Stealth, I can't stress how important it is to have Battlefield Scavenger's 20% additional Stealth Meter bonus.
And yes, I really recommend the PVP T2 set. I'm currently trying to farm the Grym Coins for em and this should take me quite some time. Truly an end-game experience for us TR's, Gauntlgrym.
Hello! I'm glad to hear that you are having a better time in the game using this build. Please feel free to ask if there are any clarifications needed, or if you discover something new in which you think the community of Stealth TR's will benefit from, please don't hesitate to contribute!
Woah. BEAST. Serious? I TRIED soloing the Dwarf King's Crypt after my party rage quitted (no clerics around), but sadly the last boss can see me even in stealth.
How did you do it? Is it able to see you from the Stealth mechanic? I haven't tried the Fardelvers Crypt yet so I'm afraid I'm not familiar with how it works.
It's rare to find nice comments made by another class in the guide. More often than not I get abusive messages in PVP, or threats that they will report me for being a hacker. LOL. Nonetheless, thank you very much! It's always nice to find support from people of other classes.
I've tried soloing Dread Vault btw, but the mobs in the end-boss room can see through stealth, so no dice.
And you need to use the GM report system to get out, which is annoying...
Using the PvP T2 set is pretty cool tho, the 5% dmg is rather nice and since the set has a ton of Apen you can focus your other items into recovery and other fun stuff.
Level 30 -- pwning very very hard. Extremely smooth sailing, looking forward to solo-shredding LotMD while underleveled and undergeared.
PS All my chars are on Mindflayer... my Sab is Dodger@l0th4ri0, I'm the pink tiefling with no armor -- you can't miss me LOL
I'm really interested in how this new build works out for both todesfaelle and l0th4ri0. I hope you guys will post your experiences and findings with it.
Actually, I'd love to see a diary type thing (I know, I know I ask too much). But I hope you guys will keep experimenting and posting your findings. You're doing a huge service for the community and I can't thank you enough for all your effort.
I soloed the CT at level 20, which was kinda a high level for that, but to make up for it I did it three times in a row. I used maybe 6 potions the whole time I think, which is due to my regen gear I'm using on this char just like on my standard banelorne-style TR. I'm a big believer in using regen, and the TR class gets a lot of very sweet regen items as they level. Many of the blue gears you can buy with the seals are powerful regen items, and since we are soloing the dungeons frequently, we get a BUNCH of seals. The manticore seals you can get after about level 35ish don't have regen items, though the rest of the seals do. Notably, the pegasus seals can net you a nice pair of regen rings that have 409 regen on them each. I have one of them already on my first non-saboteur TR.
Okay, I'm getting sidetracked LOL... I skipped cragmire with the Sab because I didn't need any more lion seals, and I've done it already with my first TR. It's kinda not hard to solo - at all. The only real challenge you'll face is at the very end with Traven Blackdagger, and as long as you stay on top of his endless adds you'll burn him down easy enough. If you let the adds build up and just focus on Traven you'll get overwhelmed as a soloist, trust me. Just pop Lurkers when it comes up from having your BnS dummy wailed on, and tear the adds apart with impunity. Once they are all gone, you have about two full rotations of duelist's flurry you can put on Traven before more adds show up.
I'll post some more when I get to Lair of the Mad Dragon and have some feedback to offer.
EDIT:
I guess I should add that I'm using Dazing Strike/Lashing Blade/Bait and Switch as my encounters, and ofc have Lurker's Assault as my daily. Don't have Gloaming Cut yet, so I'm still using Sly Flourish, but as soon as I hit level 20 I replaced Cloud of Steel with Duelist's Flurry. I am following the feat chart exactly as it was laid out by todesfaelle earlier as you quoted, as he and I pretty much came to the same conclusion about this at the same time LOL. When I take on Idris later I'll temporarily switch out Lashing for Impossible to Catch, but that's still a ways off from where I'm at right now.
Remember that Dazing Strike is not just a stun... it's an AoE stun that can hit up to 5 targets if they are bunched together. Most of the time I'll hit at least 2 mobs with it, and then that's a couple of seconds that those two mobs can't do anything to fight back. It's also excellent as a time-filler on the elites when your stealth runs out and everything else is on CD. When the mobs are dazed, you get combat advantage on them just like you were in stealth.
I've rolled a human with the following stats:
15 Str, 12 Int
11 Con, 10 Wis
15 Dex, 15 Cha
I'm only going to add to Str and Cha as I level, which should give me 21 Str, 21 Cha and 17 Dex at level 26.
So far, I'm blazing through the levels. Things that tossed my poor Cleric around like a rag doll are giving me no trouble at all as a Rogue.
Anyway, this is how I've spent my points so far:
Level 5. Deft Strike 1/3
Level 6: Sly Flourish 2/3
Level 7: Lashing Blade 1/3
Level 8: Dazing Strike 2/3
Level 9: Lashing Blade 2/3
Level 10: Lurker's Assualt 1/3: Action Advantage 2/5 (human bonus point)
Level 11: Deft Strike 2/3: Action Advantage 3/5
Level 12: Lurker's Assualt 2/3: Action Advantage 4/5
Level 13: Cloud Of Steel 2/3: Action Advantage 5/5
Level 14: Sneak Attack 2/3: Swift Footwork 1/5
Level 15: Bait & Switch 1/3: Swift Footwork 3/5 (human bonus point)
Level 16: Bait & Switch 2/3: Swift Footwork 4/5
Level 17: Tenacious Concealment 1/3: Swift Footwork 5/5
Level 18: Tenacious Concealment 2/3: Twilight Adept 1/5
Level 19: Bloodbath 2/3: Twilight Adept 2/5
Level 20: Duelist's Flurry 1/3: Twilight Adept 4/5 (human bonus point)
Level 21: Sly Flourish 3/3: Twilight Adept 5/5
Level 22: Dazing Strike 3/3: Improved Cunning Sneak 1/5
Level 23: Duelist's Flurry 2/3: Improved Cunning Sneak 2/5
Level 24: Lurker's Assault 3/3: Improved Cunning Sneak 3/5
Level 25: Lashing Blade 3/3: Improved Cunning Sneak 4/5
Level 26: Bait & Switch 3/3: Improved Cunning Sneak 5/5
Level 27: Duelist's Flurry 3/3: Scoundrel Training 1/3
Level 28: Tenacious Concealment 3/3: Scoundrel Training 2/3
Level 29: Tactics 1/3: Scoundrel Training 3/3
Level 30: Tactics 2/3: Cunning Stalker 1/5
Level 31: Tactics 3/3: Cunning Stalker 2/5
Level 32: Impossible to Catch 1/3: Cunning Stalker 3/5
Level 33: Impossible to Catch 2/3: Cunning Stalker 4/5
Level 34: Impossible to Catch 3/3: Cunning Stalker 5/5
Level 35: Gloaming Cut 1/3: Sneaky Stabber 1/5
Level 36: Gloaming Cut 2/3: Sneaky Stabber 2/5
Level 37: Gloaming Cut 3/3: Sneaky Stabber 3/5
My brilliant fighting strategy, consists of teleporting to the strongest monster, hitting 'Stealth', smacking them like crazy with 'Sly Florish' then using 'Dazing Strike' and 'Lashing Blade' as Stealth wears off.
For bosses, I throw a couple of 'Cloud of Steel' to get their attention, then I run like hell to lure them as far away from their starting area as possible (all of their adds seem to spawn in that starting area, so I've found that if I lure the boss away from it, the adds can't find me and I can go back and finish them off once I've delt with the boss. Makes for much fairer boss fights!).
Once I have the boss where I want him, I use my 'Lurker's Assault' daily, plus whatever skills I can as they come off cooldown. Seems to be working so far *touchwood*.
As for gear, I'm just using whatever I find for now. But once I hit 20 I'd like to buy a full set of 'el-cheapo' green gear from the AH, it sounds like Regen/Youth gear is the way to go.
Also, I'm ready to get my first companion. What do you recommend? Or would I be better off not using a companion at all?
Anyway, there's a Dungeon Delve in a couple of hours, so if I can hit 20 by then (and I'm feeling confident enough) I'll try to solo the Cloak Tower
It sounds like you are new to the TR as I was not too long ago, and you have discovered just how solid and easy to drive the class can be. You are making great progress, and since you asked, I'd like to give you one or two tips to keep things rolling smooth for when you enter the cloak tower and really challenge yourself.
Companions: you are better off without one. Trust me. When you are level 60 and can get an ioun stone or cat, that's okay because they don't draw aggro, but all the other companions are trouble, and will make your already challenging solo dungeon even harder.
Gear: Now you understand why I don't roll with a cleric companion like 99% of everybody else LOL. It's the regen, babay!
The Cloak Tower: you're gonna need Bait and Switch for this, which I'm sure you've figured out already but just a reminder. I hope you've been practicing using it and have figured out that the BnS dummy draws aggro even when you are not in stealth and also gives you a very very nice AP boost. It can act as an extra "dodge" when you are not in stealth, pulling you back from the spot where you fired off the dummy at least as far as a dodge roll does. When in stealth, you just drop it and don't auto-dodge, but it refreshes your stealth meter -- that's when you immediately circle around and start backstabbing. Don't stay in the same spot as where you dropped your BnS dummy! LOL
Don't be shy about using Lurkers very often, especially in the cloak tower. The mobs there take a lot of punishment to go down, and you will be recharging your AP like crazy whether you like it or not. Might as well use what the bad guys give you, right?
P. S since i am new and my professions arent high does it matter a lot to get my leather working and leadership to 20 and also how do i get good gear i know their are dungeon runs for seals and also the pvp gear u get from ur glories is that how u get them? I really appreciate the time you might take to answer a fellow gamer.
Anyway, I grabbed a cleric companion (I didn't know what else to get and I figured you can't go wrong with a cleric). But if it's better not to use her, then I'll unsummon her.
As for Bait & Switch, I definitely need to practice with it. I used it to fight Rhazzard, but he destroyed it in one hit. Still, it did give me a chance to get away and down a potion and I managed to kill him without dying.
I do need to ask about Duelist's Flurry though, both you and todesfaelle seem to favor it, but I'm not that fond of it, I find it rather slow and awkward. Is there any particular reason to use it?
But I've just got to say, I'm having a blast with this character. Most fun class I've played to date. I haven't even died yet, which is a first for me. My little rogue is one tough cookie, she actually goes looking for fights instead of trying to avoid them. She's just decimating everything she sees
Bait and switch for me was pretty simple to get a grasp of im having more problems getting used to shadow strike. yea i just use Bait and switch right before my stealth runs out and then use cloud of steel from a distance then they should be all dead ,if they are trash mobs, if not i go into shadow strike and finally into a lashing blade, still dont have smoke bomb yet soo.... need to test that out.
As for duelist flurry i too dont personally like it i should do some testing on it first though before i judge it because everyone in forums says it is slow but its dps is the best for TR's at wills so i have been trying to grow to like it, i keep it on my right mouse button and only use it for harder mobs ( only for pve though as for pvp cloud of steel is always my 2nd at will )
Glad that it's working for you, klixan! About duelist's flurry:
DF is for when you are facing down an elite mob or boss with lots of HP who isn't going to move, which happens quite frequently when you are popping stealth all the time and otherwise using Dazing Strike, BnS, etc. -- pretty much any encounter you can use to get combat advantage on an enemy should be on your bar. Trying to use DF on weaker mobs who are shifting away or are fast attackers is not a terribly efficient time to use it... that's what Sly Flourish, and after level 35, Gloaming Cut is for.
DF does a great deal of damage and also ticks off bleeds for even more damage, which means you can whack the boss or elite, roll away out of a red circle or whatever, and they are still getting hurt while you aren't actively attacking them. This makes SOOOOOO much of a difference in solo boss fights that it's not even up for debate. DF is the king of boss damage, period. In a solo 5-man dungeon run, you can treat the dozens of elite mobs as bosses for the purposes of whether or not to use DF on them, as they have so much health that they might as well all be bosses. For the crowds of trash mobs who are weak and plentiful, Sly Flourish and Gloaming Cut from stealth are far superior to DF, because DF is slower and more likely to stick you in one place for too long and you'll get hit too often by the five or more trash mobs pecking away at your health.
Addendum: unsummon your cleric companion. It's okay, trust me.
As klixan discovered, lower level regen gear can be had on the auction house for very very cheap. One prayer's worth of AD can easily outfit you in all regen armor, rings, belt, necklace... but what you're looking for is the white common stuff, not the greens. Interestingly, the cheaper white gear has much higher regen ratings on it at the same level as the green stuff, at the cost of not getting slight bumps in crit or deflection or whatever. The common gear also has another interesting quality: it doesn't bind to your character.
This means that you can trade it out to other alts when you outgrow it and get better common stuff, or mail it to a friend who is a lower level than you, etc. At the very least, you can put it back on the AH after you're done with it and recoup the tiny investment of AD that you made to get it in the first place.
My Sab char is level 32 right now and has over 800 regen from using the common stuff, and I'm not even wearing chest armor. If I was, my regen would be well over 1000. As it is now, I am nigh unkillable in normal PVE unless I AFK or fall asleep at the wheel.
Just some food for thought... if anybody is playing on Mindflayer and wants to get my hand-me-down common regen gear after I'm done with it, PM me your ingame handle or just post it here in this thread. I'll be more than happy to mail you my old stuff when I'm done with it. Who knows, we might even get to meet up in game and run a dungeon together or something.
Aha! Now I understand. I was using it on trash mobs and I couldn't understand why people liked it better than Sly Flourish. Honestly, the information in this thread is priceless!
More priceless info! It never occurred to me to even look at white gear, I just assumed it was low quality vendor trash. Ha, we live and learn. Time to go shopping again
You horrible tease! But I do understand, I too feel the constant threat of the nerf bat hanging over my head. Heaven forbid people should be having fun!
@bliviousoblivion This build isn't really for PvP, it's designed to solo the PvE content. But I think Todesfaelle did say he's successfully PvP'd with it (don't quote me on that though, it's a long thread
LOL you should see me IRL when a common white "of youth" piece of gear drops... I'm fist-bumping my monitor and whatnot. hehehe but then again, I AM quite a silly person.
When greens drop, I'm "meh... sell it." LOL
Hi, Gunman. Thank you for posting this info right here. I actually had the same problem when I tried soloing Dread Vault. The brain mobs that look like dogs seem to be able to detect us from Stealth. But I definitely am not giving up on that dungeon. And you actually can leave that dungeon without the need of contacting a GM. All you have to do is to "leave party" even though you are by yourself. It should work, if I recall correctly.
And you got that right. PVP T2 set is awesome. Has the ArPen and crit we need, and the set bonus is just beast. The extra boost in HP is also great. I've always liked equips that provide HP. Hence why I do not use the blue BiS belts that give ArPen and Crit and went for Grand Fugitive's Belt of Revolt. Once I get my T2 set, I'll be sure to pump in recovery as well.
I'll see if I can catch you online sometime, man. I've been reading your reports, and you're doing an awesome job laying down your experiences. Expect to see links to your posts later because I will be doing a massive editing spree today for the guide. I will try to resist playing the game today until I finish the edits. I tend to PVP my time away whenever I get a small amount of free time. Oh and thanks for answering the questions of other people as well btw, man. Can't tell you guys how much I appreciate the support!
I actually have not started my sab char yet, but I should be able to do so later. l0th4ri0 seems to be having a blast with it and it's quite pleasing to hear that leveling the Sab is easy. I personally would like to know how the PVP experience is for the Sab Stealth TR. Thank you for laying down your experiences as a Sab TR as well. They're fun to read and very informative! And just as l0th4ri0 said, welcome to the family! I'm glad to have another Stealth TR around.
Hello, bliviousoblivion. Welcome to Neverwinter, and I'm sure you'll have a good experience in the game playing as a Stealth TR. Leveling is indeed really fast in this game. All you have to do is to spam quests even if your level requirement is 4 levels lower than the quest zone. It's easy so far but maybe they'll tweak it in the future (hopefully not, I like it easy).
As for the stat preference, you'll want to go for gear that gives you a good amount of Recovery. Factoring the bonuses of the Ioun Stone, your target will be the soft cap of 2.9k Recovery. Once you get that amount, you'll want to prioritize crit. Mine is currently 2.9k, but I'm pretty sure it can go higher as I'm using low level rank 5 - 6 enchants. Next would be ArPen, and your target will be 2.2K. That should net you 22% Armor Penetration which can be made better by Plague Fire Enchants due to its ability to reduce a target's Damage Mitigation which is separate from the ArPen effects you get. Power is the least of our priorities as we tend to not be able to get much out of Power, due to the fact that we don't use damage encounters that much and tend to go for the ones which prolong our stealth time.
Regarding the professions, it doesn't really matter which you prefer to take, really. You'll be able to benefit from Leatherworking since you can craft yourself the epic pants and shirts for free (provided you already have dragon eggs). But other than that, there's not much professions can give you. They can net you a good sum of AD's on the Auction House once you get good Profession Assets, but it definitely will not affect your game play as a Stealth TR. You'll want to get the PVP set from the Trade of Blades as soon as you get 60 to get a maximized stealth time increase of +40%.
If there are any need for further questions and clarifications please do not hesitate to ask! Our community of Stealth TR's may be small but I'm dang proud to say that ours is one of the most helpful and progressive. Always a fun time reading the replies of people in the thread.
Hello, Cronian. For stats you'll definitely want to go for STR + DEX for maximized damage output. Since we're going to take the executioner path, we should make the most out of our crit abilities. DEX and STR help us achieve that goal. For the body gear, you'll definitely want to take the PVP set. I can't stress enough how important it is for our rotations to have that or the PVP T2 set we can get in Gauntlgrym. And lastly, for enchants you'll want Silvery Enchantments on them due to the fact that they take the most points before we can reach the soft cap. We should always factor the stats Ioun Stones give us however.
If there are further need for clarifications please don't hesitate to ask!
I thought your username was familiar. You're Svetlana Anejska, if I'm not mistaken, so I'm pretty sure I have an idea about what this secret message should contain.
I took a screenie of the message you sent me in the game so I wouldn't forget you just in case I run into you in the forum. Now I know I made a good choice taking the screenie!
First and foremost I do not think I'm good in PVP. I really don't. I believe I'm mediocre at best and I tend to PVP to test strategies as to how I can make my build viable for PVP as well. Second, I attack the opponent's tower to attract my opponents to fight me and make them stay there for a variety of reasons.
1. To give my allies some breathing room in tower 2.
2. To staunch the opponent's point gain and possibly capture their tower.
3. To annoy my opponents and make them want to kill me.
I "try" to not spawn camp losing opponents, but you can't really blame me for giving into temptation sometime. Nowadays I just call for 1 vs. 1's to pass the time whenever I'm fighting 3 vs 5 matches. And please do not be mistaken, I also help in tower 2 and I do it a lot. But when I see the opportunity to attack the opposing tower, I take it, and there are a lot of those opportunities. I'm sorry if you do not agree with how I play but from my experience so far it has been effective and little by little I have been able to polish the viability of this build in PVP.
I do hope that we can put the past misunderstandings aside and just be the adults we are supposed to be; mature, understanding and level-headed. Thank you for taking the time to read this, lichlament.
Lol, I posted on how to defeat this build on every engagement, but this is Bane's thread and I dont want to seem like the sour apple, that's not my style.
Yes Bane, I am Svetlana, and I just checked my ignore and your not on it ... you ignored me maybe ? Dont know.
Yes, I raged on you in one match because my team completely ignored a back capping rogue and you had a CW who was Ray of Enfeeblement happy on me while I was attempting to engage you.
(side note: Ray of Enfeeblement really sucks )
We have fought on the same teams and against each other, just recently we fought together on my CW, Si`nafey...
One thing I can take credit against you is I kill you more often than not and the strat I use works pretty good as long as it is just me and you at that back cap and no involvement, but this is PvP and C'est la vie, other people will get involved.
The issue I raised in that screencap is about how you play in regards to your team.... I was already frustrated at your team and my team that match so I had a moment of rage, lol, don't we all.
I haven't once seen you rescue team mates and stand idly by in the shadows while your team dies.
I Have seen this while playing on your team.
It is what it is. It plays into the whole rogue backstory, so whatever, I'm past it. I know in the future to not expect much if I am 2v1 or more and see you standing off to the side.
It's your account, play your way.
In regards to playing against you. There is a way to defeat this build 9 times out of 10 and I have used it with success against you / this build.
against this build you have to accept you are going to die at least once. After that first death, you know how to fight against this rogue and you make changes to modify your powers to engage it.
It also helps to have a build leaning more toward DPS ( not completely )...
I have posted my build only one time to a guild mate who was looking to maximize DPS but also have versatility.
That's the keyword, Versatility...
You have to look at what you are given by the dev's... and the options we have are.
1. Stealth
2. DPS
3. Versatility / Utility.
I have taken a twist on the DPS / versatility that gives me very above average damage , leaves me stealth capability and rounds out my utility and versatility.
I have no ill will toward you Bane, you play a good rogue and you have a tester's patience. As a former game tester myself in Everquest, I only have respect for those that put forth the effort.
It is good to see you sharing with the community so maybe my first impressions were off about you.
We'll talk again about mechanics again in the future I am sure.
so you suggest me silver enchantments for all gears?okay i'm going to but battle t1 set for extra %20 stealth
Status: lets call it a "tie" for now. The mobs could not stop me from reaching the end, but I could not close the deal and kill Chartilifax at my current level (34). I honestly think that I could do it in the very near future if I had a couple of more tools at my disposal; namely, gloaming with 5 feats in sneaky... so, level 39.
The problem with Chartilifax is not the dragon itself, although if you get caught in his breath attack you are in for a good 4000 damage... but what really gets you in this battle is the neverending stream of imps, who would not be even as much of a problem if they didn't outrun you by a factor of 5 and slow you down to a crawl after they hit you. The imps are a special CC/debuffing kind of imp I've never seen anywhere else, and thankfully so. Talk about a royal pain in the --
So, yes... gloaming would probably get me to a place where I could take down the imp waves and have enough time to put some hurt on the boss in between having to deal with summoned magi, and apparently, a pit fiend at some point after the dragon is injured enough. Although I did manage to keep going for a while with ITC slotted to escape the imp slows, they just overwhelm you because there's no way to break line of sight, no way to use a corner to bunch them up, and they zip across the map faster than a horse. If there was some kind of break in the terrain maybe I could be tricky and pull it off at my low level, but it's just a big round cave with nothing.
I don't feel bad for wiping, though... afterwards, I read up on the encounter from some posts and blogs, and it seems that this battle is famous for wiping full 5-man crews unless they are overleveled. LOL
Hello once more, Lichlament, and I'm really happy that we've managed to go past those misunderstandings and resolve them! I appreciate your understanding and input regarding this build and my play style as it will help further develop the build into one that does better in PVP, as this is mainly a PVE build.
If you have any other suggestions regarding changes for the PVP skill setups and/or strategies, please feel free to contribute. It's always a welcome experience to have a veteran player such as yourself to add in his 2 cents. It'll be a contribution to the community in my opinion.
Also, you shouldn't have edited the post regarding how to beat my build in PVP for 90% of the time. I'm pretty sure I have an idea about how this works since I've encountered several players in the game who just downright screws up my rotations in PVP. But the other non-stealth TR players would be able to benefit from such an informative post. I personally would link your post on the PVP Section of this guide so players from all over who are curious as to how to beat us (as a TR or another class) can beat us in 1 vs. 1 scenarios.
And since our last few matches together, I believe I've also been able to polish the build to a competitive level. I managed to get rid of the DPS problem as well, but majority of my kills come from killing CW's, TR's and DC's. GWF's and GF's tend to be a problem in 1 vs. 1 scenarios specially if they're as skilled as tanks like jtype from our own server. But I did get my Head Hunter title some weeks (I think 2 weeks) back, and now I'm shooting towards Bloodthirsty. I collect screenshots of the matches I do (wins and losses) to take note of the setups I used which helped me achieve success and the ones which didn't turn out well. I believe I managed to get a working setup for PVP. Allow me to test it against you when we play against (or with) each other and tell me what you think, Lichlament!
If anyone wants to see the PVP screenies I think I'll upload them to photobucket or something and make a folder out of em. The edits regarding the PVP strategies will come soon, and I'll also be editing some stuff on the front page today like adding screenies of the up-to-date version of the skills and feat list.
Yes! For all the offense slots, it would be best if you punched in some silvery enchants on em, a minimum of rank 6 on each slot. For defense slots, I usually use radiant enchants to get higher HP. Better HP pool means better means of survival. For utility, nothing beats Dark Enchants. Radiant Enchants aren't so good for Offense Slots due to the fact that we do not benefit much from getting higher power. We don't use damage-dealing powers much unless you spec for them. I like using Lashing Blade in dungeon runs, but that's basically it. Nothing beats Bait and Switch for AP Regen, Shadow Strike for instant Stealth Refill, ITC for 5 seconds of invulnerability and Smoke Bomb for CC in the dungeon. Provided you are with a group that is.
That's true. The Imps tend to be problematic due to their special mechanic. I personally would like to see how you'll do in this dungeon once you reach level 39, bro. Keep it up with the updates!
I personally think that Lair of the Mad Dragon is much harder than the other higher leveled dungeons due to this particular boss room. Endless amount of Imps, Erineyes, etc. Just a horrible experience.
yes i'm a little bit sad that i bought the sinister set, for the same price you can become the t2 pvp set...