You must file for a refund through PWE? First of all I've done chargebacks in the past and I know full well the procedure is available only when you complete your dealing with the merchant's customer service. Only after the customer's complaints have been rejected and he still disagrees is he entitled to a chargeback procedure. Banning the account because of using such procedure seems like forcing the customers to waive their rights, which is against EU regulations.
Where is the information (on PWE's website) concerning buyer's remorse (cooling off)? Will you ban my account if I request my money back based on EU regulations on cooling off period?
Regards,
Kalantris
You are correct, yet it does not often occur that way.
Of course after dealing with customer support you are free to request a chargeback. I can't stop you from charging back I can only advise against it and direct you and others to the appropriate venues for requesting a refund.
Skipping these steps, as you hinted, can be considered fraudulent and causes all sorts of hassles for both the card companies and for the merchants, yet chargebacks in place of refunds is a common and unacceptable practice. Requesting a chargeback doesn't guarantee it will occur but to do so without first contacting support is more common than it was ever intended.
Like most consumer rights programs they are more often abused rather than used for the intended purpose. I work in retail and I promise you people wave these "rights" around as if they can get anything they want and they have the right to sue if mistakes occur.
I had a guy one time scream he was reporting me for accidentally not updating a price sign that was 20 cents lower than the new retail. He screamed his head off about it being fraud and that he was going to sue my company to no ends over a sign that was off by 20 cents. The real kicker is that this occurred after he got the lower price for bringing this discrepancy to our attention.
What happened? The BBB laughed at him.
Consumers falsely chargeback for goods all the time. They lie and say they have contacted support when they have not and claim the company is committing fraud when they are not. It might be true in their opinion but fraud in the opinion of a consumer who is unhappy with a purchase is completely different from the legal definition of fraud.
You are correct, yet it does not often occur that way.
If that's the case, then it's fraud, nothing more.
That's not the procedure behind this thread however, as we're regarding to the distant sales directive of the EC/EU, which doesn't have anything to do with chargebacks. It's not done through banks or credit card issuers, it's a simple procedure in which the customer contacts the producer and requests a refund simply because he wants one.
Skipping these steps, as you hinted, can be considered fraudulent and causes all sorts of hassles for both the card companies and for the merchants, yet chargebacks in place of refunds is a common and unacceptable practice. Requesting a chargeback doesn't guarantee it will occur but to do so without first contacting support is more common than it was ever intended.
That is why I can't imagine a bank would even forward a chargeback claim without a statement from the customer, that his dealings with customer support are concluded. I was always asked to send such a statement to the bank. Signed statement. They also informed me I may be held responsible for making a false statement etc.
I had a guy one time scream he was reporting me for accidentally not updating a price sign that was 20 cents off lower than the new retail. He screamed his head off about it being fraud and that he was going to sue my company to no ends over a sign that was off by 20 cents. The real kicker is that this occurred after he got the lower price for bringing this discrepancy to our attention.
What can I say...
The thing that interests me the most is the cooling off. I heaven't found any information on PWE's website concerning that, which means that any EU citizen can request his payment without any reason whatsoever up to 90 days after the purchase. That request would have to be sent to PWE ofcourse, not the bank.
I'm interested if using such a procedure would end up in my account being banned. Mind you I'm not planning to do it, since I'm not that dissatisfied with the service.
Regards,
Kalantris
0
silivrenaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 20Arc User
To those quoting the EULA and Terms of Service. I'm sorry to inform you that neither the ToS or EULA are usable in a court of law here within the European Union.
I can understand that many want to defend Perfect World and I'm not complaining about wipes or rollbacks. My account has already been banned as I have disputed the payments already and also contacted Perfect Worlds customer support. I'm here to inform people how to do things the legal and correct way if they wish to complain to an official governing body.
Remember that Europe has completely different laws which protect consumers here. If you are happy with what you've got, then please continue to enjoy the game and what it has to offer you, we aren't stopping you from enjoying that, but you are trying to stop people from wanting to legally complain with your trolling/flaming on a forum.
People are indeed entitled to their opinion, but you should do some research before making a post.
hmms...everybody is busy arguing over European law...didn't anyone pick up the user says he was banned? He probably wasn't banned for asking for a refund...if he was that would give him grounds with the law...He was probably banned for helping cause this mess with the exploit. Now he realizes he just shot his $200 out the window and is trying to scramble to get his money back...
I sent a mail to the billing department yesterday asking for a refund, got no respone yet.
I live in the EU and the ping/ms in the game make it unplayable for me, even with a decent internet connection. (this last week only my ping/ms have increased by a 150 so im up to a 450-550 with spikes that go to 800-1100.) I made a ticket regarding this issue and got a respone that i should contact my internet service provider and i did. There were nothing wrong with my connection or router. (Im playing BF3 with 50 ms and league of legends with 90 on the US servers). We have been told since start that there should be no issue for the EU players but that's just a plain lie..Also that the servers were spread out widely even doh they are pin pointed in california US. (And the EU proxy ain't making the ping any better).
Also iv'e contacted support for the FPS drops that occurs for me inside dungeons, the fps drop down to between 2-5 during fights.
They told me to tweak my settings and update my drivers. Iv'e done this but it's not helping and my rig manages to run crysis 3, guild wars 2, diablo 3 and BF 3 on ultra settings..so i find this wierd.
Also i feel that the goods i've bought in-game is no longer of value after the exploits, i've seen people with millions of AD even after the rollback so i don't think that the economy will be stable for quite some time.
And at last, i lost enchantments that i've used coalscent wards to upgrade (1k zen each ward.) Used 10 wards and after the rollback my enchantments and the wards are gone.
I'm not processing a chargeback before i hear from the billing department.
''Well, just as I suspected... I couldn't see it because it's invisible.''
0
ambisinisterrMember, Neverwinter ModeratorPosts: 10,462Community Moderator
edited May 2013
I am not sure about the cooling off period. I would have to look into that.
And I believe online sales might follow a different procedure. A quick search of "Friendly Fraud Chargebacks" should bring up just how common this is and how it's a major cost for online merchants.
In fact I once accidentally put through a chargeback through my bank against TigerDirect. Without going into specifics I had thought they had accidentally charged me twice and noticed it on my online bank statement. I called up my bank and had them cancel one of my charges under a "false" charge and all they did was ask me if I had already gone contacted their customer support about the issue.
All I had to do was respond yes. In the mean time I didn't realize what I was doing until about 40 minutes later and promptly called back dropping the claim. The error was completely done by my own eyes to begin with, but this should show you just how simple it was to make a false charge-back claim.
No Signatures. No berating about fraud claims. Nothing. Just a simple yes or no question.
As for the topic of the thread, no it isn't about chargebacks. I was responding to somebody who incorrectly heard people were being banned for requesting a refund hence why we are here discussing chargebacks and why they should be avoided.
The topic of this thread is to inform people of their rights which is fine on it's own short of the file complaints until they act as if problems can vanish overnight. The problem is these threads end negatively every single time and thus have been closed immediately. They fall in the same category as 'I Quit' threads, they just attract undue negativity between posters.
P.S. Please remove the meme so I don't have to, czeslawczad
For those of us lucky to live within the European Union, we have the tools and government agencies to take this matter further to file official complaints in regards to the way that Perfect World has treated us as customers. Many including myself are requesting a refund through the official channels, before we take further steps if we are denied by their customer support, which more than likely will be the case.
So I highly recommend that those of you who are really unhappy with the way you have been treated/cheated and lied too, that you go to the following website mentioned below:
Make sure to fill in the form or even directly contact them by telephone. We need to get our voices heard and we need to get Perfect World to feel the force of what happens when you disrespect paying customers (be it founders or Zen purchasers).
We are hoping that if enough complaints are filed or even if we are lucky to get our case forwarded directly to the European Consumers Rights group, we can get our concerns forward via the European Union courts where the European Consumer Laws will be reviewed in regards to the practices of Perfect World.
As they operate within Europe via their United Kingdom office, they can also be reviewed by the British Trading & Standards, so you Brits out there, make sure to also file a complaint directly with your government agencies.
So do you part! We can't allow companies like Perfect World to get away with what they have done and what they are still doing.
Thanks,
Doowie.
You got some wire crossed:D
You see this is officially a beta and this mean that we are not consumers but playtesters that are working for PWE to test their game, not to have fun, not only that but, we, by downloading a game in the beta state, have accepted any and all the risks inerent to a game that is in the beta. For example if installing Nevewinter would screw your computer into a useless scrap of metal you could only blame yourself and no association would take your defense because you knew what you are doing joining a beta that is a game in an unstable state. And don't begin with the usual "this is not a beta, this is a live game because legally this is a beta and they have warned you that it was so
You see this is officially a beta and this mean that we are not consumers but playtesters that are working for PWE to test their game, not to have fun, not only that but, we, by downloading a game in the beta state, have accepted any and all the risks inerent to a game that is in the beta. For example if installing Nevewinter would screw your computer into a useless scrap of metal you could only blame yourself and no association would take your defense because you knew what you are doing joining a beta that is a game in an unstable state. And don't begin with the usual "this is not a beta, this is a live game because legally this is a beta and they have warned you that it was so
Do you think a claim of this being beta voids any right the users have?
I think YOU might have your wired crossed.
Neverwinter Online Open Beta is an ongoing success
Also banning the account for using a legitimate procedure seems like blackmailing to me. I
Pretty much any company will block your account or access to their service if you dispute a PayPal payment. This is usually an automated process and the default reaction to disputes. Steam/Valve will even remove your access to all the games you have paid for if you dispute a PayPal transaction. A dispute with PayPal is nearly the equivalent of a credit card charge back.
The original poster neglects various important aspects, including the "beta" bit, and that this is software. The situation does not at all compare to the D3 case where people could not play at all. This is not applicable here. But occupation therapy is often beneficial and of course, every citizen is entitled to voice their complaints and receive an automated response from the EU. The one time I tried to get assistance (was a Blizzard situation and involved money), I never got any, just auto responses.
Skipping these steps, as you hinted, can be considered fraudulent and causes all sorts of hassles for both the card companies and for the merchants, yet chargebacks in place of refunds is a common and unacceptable practice. Requesting a chargeback doesn't guarantee it will occur but to do so without first contacting support is more common than it was ever intended.
I'm going to have to pull you up there. This is simply untrue. It is absolutely misleading to suggest ( again, you have done this a number of times ) that skipping a company's procedures for returns and going straight to your card issuer with your complaint can be considered fraud. It can be considered inconvenient. It does nothing to help a company's reputation with their merchant broker and banl. It may even be considered malicious but in no way is it fraud unless the actual chargeback made is intended to deceive and defraud a company of goods and or services. You are suggesting that people requesting chargebacks without what would appear a valid reason are committing fraud, an illegal act. That can be construed as malicious libel.
The process is simple and the bodies in place will determine the outcome. The worse that will happen for the customer is the request is refused.
Also yesterday you made a post where you indicated that people requesting chargebacks through Visa were committing fraud and that Visa would freeze your credit account for 120 days in that case. That again was misleading and untrue. I wrote to you privately hoping that you would correct that mistake but you have not so I'll have to bring that up in public too as people may take what you say at face value being a community moderator.
The 120 days that is mentioned in Visa's policy is the amount of time from receipt of goods to the final day on which you may make a chargeback.
You hold a position of authority in this community and i fully understand your wish to do damage control in this situation. but please do not give out misleading information.
For the record I do not condone anyone making a chargeback simply because they have buyers remorse. it is frivolous and likely to not succeed. However people have the right to have their consumer rights made clear to them in a clear and honest manner.
I am not sure about the cooling off period. I would have to look into that.
Cooling off period only applies to distant sales (which are phone sales, online sales and so on). Feel free to read the basics:
What does your "right to cancel" ('cooling off period') entail?
All products which you buy under a distance contract (i.e. online, by phone or mail) within the EU are subject to a right to cancel. This is a 'cooling off period' of at least 7 working days during which you are entitled to cancel the purchase. The only costs which the supplier may charge you in this regard are the costs for returning the product which you decide, on closer consideration, that you do not want.
In the case of goods, the cooling off period commences on the day you received the product(s) you had ordered, provided that you have received all obligatory information by that date.
In the case of services, the cooling off period commences on the day you conclude the contract, provided again that you have received all obligatory information by that date.
If the supplier has not complied fully with his obligation to provide information or has only partly complied with this obligation, the cooling off period is automatically extended to 3 months. If the supplier provides the obligatory information late, but within 3 months of the start of the contract, the cooling off period commences on the date on which you receive the information. If you exercise your right to cancel and you have already paid (or made part payment) for the product then the supplier must refund you the entire amount within 30 days. The supplier may only deduct the costs of sending the product back from this refund.
No Signatures. No berating about fraud claims. Nothing. Just a simple yes or no question.
It does seem to work differently here in Poland then. It's not that easy to file a chargeback complaint, banks require a lot of additional information, some of the documents have to be signed.
I sent a mail to the billing department yesterday asking for a refund, got no respone yet.
I live in the EU and the ping/ms in the game make it unplayable for me, even with a decent internet connection. (this last week only my ping/ms have increased by a 150 so im up to a 450-550 with spikes that go to 800-1100.) I made a ticket regarding this issue and got a respone that i should contact my internet service provider and i did. There were nothing wrong with my connection or router. (Im playing BF3 with 50 ms and league of legends with 90 on the US servers). We have been told since start that there should be no issue for the EU players but that's just a plain lie..Also that the servers were spread out widely even doh they are pin pointed in california US. (And the EU proxy ain't making the ping any better).
Also iv'e contacted support for the FPS drops that occurs for me inside dungeons, the fps drop down to between 2-5 during fights.
They told me to tweak my settings and update my drivers. Iv'e done this but it's not helping and my rig manages to run crysis 3, guild wars 2, diablo 3 and BF 3 on ultra settings..so i find this wierd.
Also i feel that the goods i've bought in-game is no longer of value after the exploits, i've seen people with millions of AD even after the rollback so i don't think that the economy will be stable for quite some time.
And at last, i lost enchantments that i've used coalscent wards to upgrade (1k zen each ward.) Used 10 wards and after the rollback my enchantments and the wards are gone.
I'm not processing a chargeback before i hear from the billing department.
u will get all zen u spend during time which was rolled back,and for fps drops u need to lower psychic debris option to min there wont be any difference and your game should work very good after this ,think something there bug it since i cant run it even on low in dungeons and city if is that option max but if i lower it game works great on everything maxed
A dispute with PayPal is nearly the equivalent of a credit card charge back.
As someone that have just done it I can say that it isn't.
A dispute is just that, a dispute - it's really no different than if you asked PW directly except if PW don't reply to the dispute a chargeback will happen.
Neverwinter Online Open Beta is an ongoing success
0
pressexpose1Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
You see this is officially a beta and this mean that we are not consumers but playtesters that are working for PWE to test their game, not to have fun, not only that but, we, by downloading a game in the beta state, have accepted any and all the risks inerent to a game that is in the beta. For example if installing Nevewinter would screw your computer into a useless scrap of metal you could only blame yourself and no association would take your defense because you knew what you are doing joining a beta that is a game in an unstable state. And don't begin with the usual "this is not a beta, this is a live game because legally this is a beta and they have warned you that it was so
none of what you say has any relevance. The moment monies change hands for goods or services a contract of sale has been entered into by both parties and consumer rights as laid out by law in the consumer's country of residence supercede all prior agreements.
(Yes its england, but most EU would follow same law)
I specifically quote : "If you don't get the information within three months or never get it
If you don't get the information within three months of receiving the goods or never get the information at all, the cooling-off period is three months and seven working days from the day you received your goods."
As was said earlier, and as far as i know. When you purchase from ZEN or packages, it doesn't specifically tell you the information. So if that is the case you are entitled to cooling-off for 3 months and 7 days from purchase.
0
ambisinisterrMember, Neverwinter ModeratorPosts: 10,462Community Moderator
edited May 2013
I did not notice the key bit of this thread being the cause of his account being banned for disputing the fees without contacting support.
That is enough for me to be forced to lock it up. It was an interesting discussion while it lasted and I hope some of you have walked away a bit more informed from the last few pages.
Again, chargebacks are a major hassle for both parties involved and are not the equivalent of requesting a refund.
Pretty much any company will block your account or access to their service if you dispute a PayPal payment. This is usually an automated process and the default reaction to disputes. Steam/Valve will even remove your access to all the games you have paid for if you dispute a PayPal transaction. A dispute with PayPal is nearly the equivalent of a credit card charge back..
For those who think this is unfair I can confirm every bit of information in this post is true. Don't chargeback without contacting support. It's bad for everybody involved!
Comments
You are correct, yet it does not often occur that way.
Of course after dealing with customer support you are free to request a chargeback. I can't stop you from charging back I can only advise against it and direct you and others to the appropriate venues for requesting a refund.
Skipping these steps, as you hinted, can be considered fraudulent and causes all sorts of hassles for both the card companies and for the merchants, yet chargebacks in place of refunds is a common and unacceptable practice. Requesting a chargeback doesn't guarantee it will occur but to do so without first contacting support is more common than it was ever intended.
Like most consumer rights programs they are more often abused rather than used for the intended purpose. I work in retail and I promise you people wave these "rights" around as if they can get anything they want and they have the right to sue if mistakes occur.
I had a guy one time scream he was reporting me for accidentally not updating a price sign that was 20 cents lower than the new retail. He screamed his head off about it being fraud and that he was going to sue my company to no ends over a sign that was off by 20 cents. The real kicker is that this occurred after he got the lower price for bringing this discrepancy to our attention.
What happened? The BBB laughed at him.
Consumers falsely chargeback for goods all the time. They lie and say they have contacted support when they have not and claim the company is committing fraud when they are not. It might be true in their opinion but fraud in the opinion of a consumer who is unhappy with a purchase is completely different from the legal definition of fraud.
If that's the case, then it's fraud, nothing more.
That's not the procedure behind this thread however, as we're regarding to the distant sales directive of the EC/EU, which doesn't have anything to do with chargebacks. It's not done through banks or credit card issuers, it's a simple procedure in which the customer contacts the producer and requests a refund simply because he wants one.
That is why I can't imagine a bank would even forward a chargeback claim without a statement from the customer, that his dealings with customer support are concluded. I was always asked to send such a statement to the bank. Signed statement. They also informed me I may be held responsible for making a false statement etc.
What can I say...
The thing that interests me the most is the cooling off. I heaven't found any information on PWE's website concerning that, which means that any EU citizen can request his payment without any reason whatsoever up to 90 days after the purchase. That request would have to be sent to PWE ofcourse, not the bank.
I'm interested if using such a procedure would end up in my account being banned. Mind you I'm not planning to do it, since I'm not that dissatisfied with the service.
Regards,
Kalantris
hmms...everybody is busy arguing over European law...didn't anyone pick up the user says he was banned? He probably wasn't banned for asking for a refund...if he was that would give him grounds with the law...He was probably banned for helping cause this mess with the exploit. Now he realizes he just shot his $200 out the window and is trying to scramble to get his money back...
I live in the EU and the ping/ms in the game make it unplayable for me, even with a decent internet connection. (this last week only my ping/ms have increased by a 150 so im up to a 450-550 with spikes that go to 800-1100.) I made a ticket regarding this issue and got a respone that i should contact my internet service provider and i did. There were nothing wrong with my connection or router. (Im playing BF3 with 50 ms and league of legends with 90 on the US servers). We have been told since start that there should be no issue for the EU players but that's just a plain lie..Also that the servers were spread out widely even doh they are pin pointed in california US. (And the EU proxy ain't making the ping any better).
Also iv'e contacted support for the FPS drops that occurs for me inside dungeons, the fps drop down to between 2-5 during fights.
They told me to tweak my settings and update my drivers. Iv'e done this but it's not helping and my rig manages to run crysis 3, guild wars 2, diablo 3 and BF 3 on ultra settings..so i find this wierd.
Also i feel that the goods i've bought in-game is no longer of value after the exploits, i've seen people with millions of AD even after the rollback so i don't think that the economy will be stable for quite some time.
And at last, i lost enchantments that i've used coalscent wards to upgrade (1k zen each ward.) Used 10 wards and after the rollback my enchantments and the wards are gone.
I'm not processing a chargeback before i hear from the billing department.
And I believe online sales might follow a different procedure. A quick search of "Friendly Fraud Chargebacks" should bring up just how common this is and how it's a major cost for online merchants.
In fact I once accidentally put through a chargeback through my bank against TigerDirect. Without going into specifics I had thought they had accidentally charged me twice and noticed it on my online bank statement. I called up my bank and had them cancel one of my charges under a "false" charge and all they did was ask me if I had already gone contacted their customer support about the issue.
All I had to do was respond yes. In the mean time I didn't realize what I was doing until about 40 minutes later and promptly called back dropping the claim. The error was completely done by my own eyes to begin with, but this should show you just how simple it was to make a false charge-back claim.
No Signatures. No berating about fraud claims. Nothing. Just a simple yes or no question.
As for the topic of the thread, no it isn't about chargebacks. I was responding to somebody who incorrectly heard people were being banned for requesting a refund hence why we are here discussing chargebacks and why they should be avoided.
The topic of this thread is to inform people of their rights which is fine on it's own short of the file complaints until they act as if problems can vanish overnight. The problem is these threads end negatively every single time and thus have been closed immediately. They fall in the same category as 'I Quit' threads, they just attract undue negativity between posters.
P.S. Please remove the meme so I don't have to, czeslawczad
You got some wire crossed:D
You see this is officially a beta and this mean that we are not consumers but playtesters that are working for PWE to test their game, not to have fun, not only that but, we, by downloading a game in the beta state, have accepted any and all the risks inerent to a game that is in the beta. For example if installing Nevewinter would screw your computer into a useless scrap of metal you could only blame yourself and no association would take your defense because you knew what you are doing joining a beta that is a game in an unstable state. And don't begin with the usual "this is not a beta, this is a live game because legally this is a beta and they have warned you that it was so
I think YOU might have your wired crossed.
Pretty much any company will block your account or access to their service if you dispute a PayPal payment. This is usually an automated process and the default reaction to disputes. Steam/Valve will even remove your access to all the games you have paid for if you dispute a PayPal transaction. A dispute with PayPal is nearly the equivalent of a credit card charge back.
The original poster neglects various important aspects, including the "beta" bit, and that this is software. The situation does not at all compare to the D3 case where people could not play at all. This is not applicable here. But occupation therapy is often beneficial and of course, every citizen is entitled to voice their complaints and receive an automated response from the EU. The one time I tried to get assistance (was a Blizzard situation and involved money), I never got any, just auto responses.
A bit excessive.. There is nothing with that meme
I'm going to have to pull you up there. This is simply untrue. It is absolutely misleading to suggest ( again, you have done this a number of times ) that skipping a company's procedures for returns and going straight to your card issuer with your complaint can be considered fraud. It can be considered inconvenient. It does nothing to help a company's reputation with their merchant broker and banl. It may even be considered malicious but in no way is it fraud unless the actual chargeback made is intended to deceive and defraud a company of goods and or services. You are suggesting that people requesting chargebacks without what would appear a valid reason are committing fraud, an illegal act. That can be construed as malicious libel.
The process is simple and the bodies in place will determine the outcome. The worse that will happen for the customer is the request is refused.
Also yesterday you made a post where you indicated that people requesting chargebacks through Visa were committing fraud and that Visa would freeze your credit account for 120 days in that case. That again was misleading and untrue. I wrote to you privately hoping that you would correct that mistake but you have not so I'll have to bring that up in public too as people may take what you say at face value being a community moderator.
The 120 days that is mentioned in Visa's policy is the amount of time from receipt of goods to the final day on which you may make a chargeback.
You hold a position of authority in this community and i fully understand your wish to do damage control in this situation. but please do not give out misleading information.
For the record I do not condone anyone making a chargeback simply because they have buyers remorse. it is frivolous and likely to not succeed. However people have the right to have their consumer rights made clear to them in a clear and honest manner.
Cooling off period only applies to distant sales (which are phone sales, online sales and so on). Feel free to read the basics:
SOURCE: http://www.eccnl.eu/page/en/themes/E-Commerce#par4
It does seem to work differently here in Poland then. It's not that easy to file a chargeback complaint, banks require a lot of additional information, some of the documents have to be signed.
Done
Regards,
Kalantris
u will get all zen u spend during time which was rolled back,and for fps drops u need to lower psychic debris option to min there wont be any difference and your game should work very good after this ,think something there bug it since i cant run it even on low in dungeons and city if is that option max but if i lower it game works great on everything maxed
A dispute is just that, a dispute - it's really no different than if you asked PW directly except if PW don't reply to the dispute a chargeback will happen.
none of what you say has any relevance. The moment monies change hands for goods or services a contract of sale has been entered into by both parties and consumer rights as laid out by law in the consumer's country of residence supercede all prior agreements.
Looking here: http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/consumer_e/consumer_different_ways_of_buying_e/consumer_buying_by_internet_mail_order_or_phone_e/consumer_cancelling_a_distance_sale_order_e/how_long_is_the_distance_sale_cooling_off_period_when_you_buy_goods.htm
(Yes its england, but most EU would follow same law)
I specifically quote : "If you don't get the information within three months or never get it
If you don't get the information within three months of receiving the goods or never get the information at all, the cooling-off period is three months and seven working days from the day you received your goods."
As was said earlier, and as far as i know. When you purchase from ZEN or packages, it doesn't specifically tell you the information. So if that is the case you are entitled to cooling-off for 3 months and 7 days from purchase.
That is enough for me to be forced to lock it up. It was an interesting discussion while it lasted and I hope some of you have walked away a bit more informed from the last few pages.
Again, chargebacks are a major hassle for both parties involved and are not the equivalent of requesting a refund.
For those who think this is unfair I can confirm every bit of information in this post is true. Don't chargeback without contacting support. It's bad for everybody involved!